Small Circular Sawmill Build

[Bullheaded]

Good morning all,
New to the forum but I have used it as a resource in the past. I am located in the Western U.P. I have quite a bit of time on a Woodmiser LT-15 in both softwood and hardwood.

I recently bought an old ice saw with an 18T 30" blade with No.3 style bits and holders.  I am intrigued with the idea of building a small circular sawmill. I will start by saying that I DO know how limited this is in regards to log size. My intent is up to hobby saw up to 6-12" softwood logs 8-10' long....mostly red pine. I am a retired machinist/engineer(hence the Bullheaded handle) so machining and fabbing is not an issue as much as budget is. I hope to design the mill basics with input from the knowledge base on this forum.

Horsepower and blade speed "range" req'd for this blade?

Anyone have a smaller 2 headblock carriage for sale or trade in my area?

Suggestions on arbor/flange design parameters?

Do I want to design a hand push carriage?

[fluidpowerpro]

Welcome to the forum.

[thecfarm]

Welcome to the forum.
No big deal to push a carriage. Kinda like pushing a bicycle, it's easy. I push mine.
Make it long!!! As I always say ;)   This allows you to get the head out of the way. 
I can cut a 20-foot log on mine. Gives me lots of room when I put a 16-foot log on it.

[Bullheaded]

The blade I hope to use as the heart of my little mill.

 

[Bullheaded]

Reviewing CIRCULAR SAWMILLS by Lunstrum, and using the 8-9K fpm for hardwoods and 10-11k fpm for softwoods, is it logical to use the 10K figure for the bulk of my sawing? This would result in running my 30" blade at a calculated 1273rpm. Sound reasonable?

[Bullheaded]

I cleaned up my blade today to see if there were any markings. There were. I assume the 51703 is the date of manufacture? And, 23843C the serial number? Can anyone tell me any more regarding the numbers and letters? Any guesses on manufacturer? What is the 57 on the shank?

 

 

   

[moodnacreek]

It will be the same amount of work as building a full size sawmill. For a machinist rebuilding an old hand set mill would be easy. There are many out there and they are not worth much. A miniature sawmill would be cute and fun for a while but so limited, just my opinion.  Just the same I am glad you are interested in a circle mill.

[moodnacreek]

My 30" top saw runs around 1000 rpm. The 5 7 on the shanks I don't understand but there where [and still are] shops that made shanks other than the well known saw makers. Looks like the saw is a 9 ga. That would be common. The shanks should also be 9ga and the bits 17/64 or 9/32  most of the time.

[Bullheaded]

Thank you for the input! The shanks are Simonds. Why the step up on the shanks? Blade at the pocket is .183", shanks are .185" and then step up to .247". Teeth are swedged to around .360" but vary all over the place.

[moodnacreek]

Shanks hold the teeth [bits] in but they are also the gullet. Gullet shape whether insert tooth of solid saw [or band saw] is not a one size fits all deal. One of the issues is sawdust spilling before the loaded gullet comes out of the kerf. At some point in history the shank was the thickness of the plate. Next they made 'swedged shanks to help hold the sawdust. These raised sections are thicker than the plate. After that and currently the whole shank is thicker for the same reason . There are also winter or frost shanks for frozen sawdust and chrome shanks for long wear and cooler running. Your bits may have been filed and swedged by eye.

[Bullheaded]

So, with new bits of 17/64 or 9/32", would my shanks work?

[moodnacreek]

So, with new bits of 17/64 or 9/32", would my shanks work?

Certainly. You could even use 1/4" or 5/16" if you had to. 7ga. bits should also fit [in 8 ga.saw]  as well as 9 ga. [8/9 ga.] is how they come. If the bits fit loose you can hammer the shanks to expand the crescent.

[Ventryjr]

I have a few Belsaw carriages and feed mechanisms if your are interested.   Message me on here.  Also if we do make a deal THE FORESTRY FORUM WILL GET THEIR CUT. 

[Bullheaded]

I started on the mandrel today. I was given a very nice set of 2" pillow blocks and a 1 15/16" diameter mandrel. I had to turn down a section of the mandrel, press on a thinwall tube (1/16" wall) and then finish turn to 2.000" between centers. I am waiting for the 3-groove Browning sheave to get here so I can mill the keyway and then start designing the saw frame.

 

  

[moodnacreek]

The bearing next to the saw should be like new inside so it does not warm the saw. I assume you checked the collars for run out and taper as per the book. These are 2 of the most important things on a circle rig that many skip over. After that it is mostly just common sense.  Are you building a setworks?

[Bullheaded]

The fast collar is machined with a taper to match the arbor. It is almost but not quite a locking taper. It showed about .002" when between centers on the lathe. I plan on making a spacer "bushing" to hold the fast collar in place with the arbor nut to face and relieve/taper it between centers tightened onto the arbor. 

The original plan was to make a push feed sliding carriage as my main intent was to lightly parallel flat 8-10" cabin logs. I have several friends looking for a Belsaw setworks and will wait a bit to see what turns up locally before making a sliding table.

[moodnacreek]

The Bellsaw setworks is the worst, trust me. If you use or copy that and are a machinist come up with a back set ratchet and pawl [2 ratchet wheels] and a bell crank [twist the reach rod] to work the pawls.   

[Nebraska]

 

[Don P]

If you make an improved setworks for a Belsaw carriage, sell me one to help pay for yours. I've got a spare carriage if you strike out but there's got to be one in the weeds closer.

[Bullheaded]

I built the husk frame yesterday from 6x8 timbers. Arbor will get mounted on a steel plate with adjusters for the pillow blocks.  There is room to accommodate a 44" blade

 

 

[Bullheaded]

I made the sliding engine ways this morning. Ways are made from UHMW bolted to white ash. Engine slides snug but freely. I have a plow adjustment crescent that I will use to tighten the belts via sliding the engine. Waiting on the correct driver sheave and belts. Next is the steel base for the arbor and its pillow block adjusters. 

 

 

[Bullheaded]

Way details

 

[moodnacreek]

Man I wish you close. I have parts of old sawmills and 2 Wisconsin's with clutches no one wants.

[Bullheaded]

Moodnacreek,
My luck! Ive been looking for a local clutch for ages now. It sure would make a clean installation. Any of the clutched Wisconsins have a unique crankshaft and bearing retainer plate. As far as I can tell the PTO end of the crank is just the standard crankshaft shortened. Are your Wisconsins VE4 or VF4's?

[moodnacreek]

I think one each. The newer one is seized the older one is a good runner, hand crank with mag. 20 hp small bore. Both have clutch. The clutch motors have a different crank end.  What you really need is the small size Lane set works and slides [newer and lighter style] I have.  Have the pinions and one rack. You could make the other from #80 chain and use 10 tooth #80 sprocket.  Set shaft is 1 7/16"   I have seen small hand set [and automatic] mills made as narrow as 24" and 8' long for small eastern cedar or ash bolt sawing.  At auction they are a hard sell because they are too small for most work.