Hydrogen/Brown's gas

[Bum1561]

hey everyone. I just discovered this brown gas thing and I'm amazed! Here's the deal. I drive about about 3200 miles a
month and these gas prices are killing my overhead.  I drive a 95 buick regal with about 150,000 miles. I'm figuring I have nothing to lose. Thing is, I have no mechanical skills. I barely open the hood. All this stuff is great, but please advise on the way a mechanically challenged guy can do this. Oh, one question is how do you keep from this stuff freezing in the winter?
thanks

[Don_Papenburg]

DangerDan,    What is this bubbler you speak of? How is it differant from other Hydrogenerators?   Did Bob Boyce ever say what kind of milage improvement he got from his setup on the 6V92?   I have a 3 53 planed for my Diamond T pickup And would like to use a system like you have spoken of . Any pictures?  I can not open PDF files because my computer on dialup at 37decabits per minutes is too slow to down load the reader.  Can I get a reader on a disk someplace to install in the tower?

[Larry]

Don, you can buy a USB zip drive at Walmart for maybe $20 or less.  Take the zip drive to a library and download the mega files there on DSL.

[StorminN]

Don,

I believe the bubbler Dave is speaking of is just a vessel to bubble the gas through, so ignition can never flash back into the electrolyzer.

So a hose would go from electrolyzer to the bottom of the liquid (water?) in the bubbler, the gas makes bubbles that rise to the top of the bubbler, hose off the top of the bubbler goes to engine air intake.

[DangerousDave]

Norm has the right idea 'cept add a one way check valve between the Electrolyzer and the bubbler so a flashback won't blow the bubbler water back into or blow up the e'lyzer.
A bubbler is a lot cheaper to replace/repair !
An easy one is to use a piece of clear hose and plastic barbed fittings and NO Clamps that way worst case it blows the hose off the fittings and dumps your water. Quick easy fix.


Bum1561;
I will get back to ya


Dave

[Ron Wenrich]

Here's the one I put on my 2005 4 cyl 4WD Toyota Tacoma:



I've been running it for a month and I went from 22 miles per gallon to 25 miles per gallon.  These have all been run through my scan guage.

What I am noticing is that my trips to town are much better than my trips on the highway.  The best I've done on highway is 26 mpg.  The best for a trip into town has been 32 mpg.  I haven't really gone on any road trip.  Hills will drive the milage down, but taking off from a stop sign or red light, or just trying to get up to speed on the interstate will kill the milage.

One thing I don't understand is how milage will vary from one day to the next.  I run the same route to work, and back.  I have only 1 red light, and I can often hit it green.  Mornings my mpg is a lot lower, but that may be due to colder air.  Afternoons I run through town, and that brings my milage factor up.

But, sometimes I will get as much as a 5-10% difference on the same leg, even though weather conditions are essentially the same.  Computer?

[Fla._Deadheader]

 From what I've learned, there is a small circuit that gets installed, that feeds voltage to the O2 sensors. This is miniscule voltage. O2 sensors work on .01-1 volt range. That circuit feeds enough voltage to let the computer think it's setting the best fuel mix, but, it really allows the HHO to help the engine perform optimally.

  I would bet the cool mornings are where your mileage varies.
I will post some links to forums that can help you immensely, once I get them all gathered back on my computer.  Firefox deletes URL's if you don't access them often, from the address bar  : :

  http://waterfuelcell.org/phpBB2/index.php?sid=37635664b32387cae793670d 609ecc10]this link

  http://www.ionizationx.com

  http://www.oupower.com

Sorry. Forgot how to rename the URL  : :

[Tom]

DanGit Deadheader.  You big dummy!!

Code Select Expand

[url][/url]  this is what the icon prints

Then you have to fill it in.

[url=www.ionizationx.com]What I want to call it[/url]

It's that icon of the world... a globe. 

Jeez, louise!!    :D :D

[Fla._Deadheader]

This Link

  Hot *DanG. Only took 3 tries, this time.  : : :D :D :D :D

  Gracias Tomas, MUUUchas Gracias  ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D

[slowzuki]

Just want to add that despite what is said it their lit, VERY little fuel goes out the exhaust valve of a modern engine.  The cat convertor is mostly working on NOx these days but will catch CO and HC when they are emitted usually during open loop driving (pedal mashed).

Everyone should understand that a person that gets 25 mpg in a given car can generally get it up over 30 mpg by slightly adjusting driving technique.  Some "hypermilers" can double the EPA listed mileage.

[sparky]

I am still confused, but now I am confused at a much higher level!

[sparky]

The following mention was made in one post:

"The only issue being, the whole intake tract from turbo to manifold
will be charged with compressed explosive gases."

This is a common misconception. As it turns out, the small amount of
hydroxy gas from a booster, in comparison to the much larger amount
of intake air, dilutes the hydroxy gas to well below the flammability
limits for hydrogen. Thus, no explosion can occur. This is also why
waste spark has no effect on boosted engines, while it can be
detrimental to engine running on hydroxy gas alone."

In my previous life (before retirement), I was involved with industrial processes that used bulk hydrogen. The lower flamibility level (LFL) for hydrogen is 4%. This means that a 4% concentration will ignite. I am curious as to the hydrogen concentration in the airstream feeding into the turbo?

[Fla._Deadheader]

The boosters are mixed Hydrogen-oxygen gasses. If run through the turbo, the water vapor will eat away the turbo blades and cause a catastrophic failure. Best to vent the gasses in the manifold.

  I have straight Hydrogen info for engine amounts per cylinder, straight gas, no other fuel. There is much speculation on exact amount needed for mixed gas-Hydroxy. .

[Fla._Deadheader]

Any updates on satisfaction, MPG increase on that Yota, Ron ??

[Ron Wenrich]

I"m fairly satisfied with my hydrogen boost.  I'm getting a solid 25 mpg for my normal driving.  Today, I had a long drive.  On the way to my destination I only got 22 mpg.  On the way back I got 27 mpg.  It was mainly open highway driving in rolling hillside. 

I'm mainly impressed with my town driving.  My milage is better around town than it is on the interstate.  I've already hit 32 mpg on a trip to town.  The best highway miles was today at 27.  Normally its between 22 and 23 mpg to work, which is mostly interstate driving.  My milage increases as I slow down.

I think the reason is that a booster will put out a set amount of hydroxy gas per minute.  But, your car/truck is burning fuel at a different rates dependent on speed and load.  As a result, your higher speeds actually have less hydroxy for a given amount of fuel as does your lower speeds.  In other words, there's no way to throttle hydroxy production.   

What is now the newest development is where you actually tie into your Map/Maf sensor.  These use a very low voltage and regulate the amount of air/fuel mixture.  Using a pensiometer, they are now regulating that voltage and trying to fool the computer.  The drawback is if you get it too lean, you can burn a piston. 

[Fla._Deadheader]

Sounds like it's maybe working ??  Have you changed the way you drive, as in, not as heavy a foot, and less jackrabbit starts, that may be contributing to the better MPG ???

  Have you messed any at all with retarding the timing a little ???  Hydrogen burns so fast, it really doesn't do much good at firing way before TDC.

  On diesels, the timing is actually retarded to AT TDC or a little later yet ???

  Have you tried to see what the output is from the booster, in Liters per minute ???

  Are you running a 4 cyl. or 6 cyl engine ???

[Ron Wenrich]

I'm running a 4 cyl Tacoma.  I haven't done any jack rabbit starts in a long time.  Mainly because I haven't had a cool muscle car in a long time.   :D

We haven't messed with the timing.  Would that be necessary since its not just hydrogen being produced?  Production is rated at 2 liters/min, but I haven't really measured it. 

[ronwood]

Ron,

Could you put a second unit in that would kick in at the higher speeds to give you some added boost?

Ron P.

[Don P]

Assuming a 2 liter engine running at 2000 rpm = 4000 liter/min.
You're burning hydrogen at a blend of 1 part in 2000  ???

[Fla._Deadheader]

No Don, 2 liters a min is total output. Divide that up by the engine size, and, it doesn't take much hydrogen to help a bit.  8)

Ron, it won't hurt to try a LITTLE retarding. That will help the engine get a complete burn of the gasoline. Hydrogen flashes faster than gasoline and burns MUCH faster AND 3 times hotter. An adjustable circuit, might help the engine at higher speed, also. Did any of y'all go to any of the sites I provided links to ???

[rowerwet]

when it is burning Hydrogen will eat metal. My dad worked on the space shuttle engine compressor disks. they have liquid Hydrogen running up the inside of the disk (which is a pump) and burning hydrogen on the out side of the disk. The burning hydrogen would remove metal from the disk until they coated them with Gold. Obviously your engine is at a lower temp burning , but the long term effect will be the same. And the space shuttle engines are only rated for a few hours of use over thier life.