cutting trees down

JMG · May 05, 2019, 07:20:03 AM

what to look for in a good felling
wedge? .Metal or plastic?good place to order from?

Skeans1 · May 05, 2019, 07:39:18 AM

Plastic, I normally order from Madsens out in Washington State.

thecfarm · May 05, 2019, 08:12:29 AM

I just use the plastic ones. I only cut for firewood wood. I do make the tree go where I want it to go. Don't need to hit the wedges hard either. Yes,they will break,but I would rather see some orange chips come out than sparks.

JMG · May 05, 2019, 09:50:12 AM

kinda green on wedge knowledge but don't wanna throw money away.what sizes would be good to keep on hand and slick or barbed wedge.possibly downing tree from 12"to 20"

doc henderson · May 05, 2019, 10:06:54 AM

I started with only 2 that I bought at the stihl dealer. you can make some wooden ones for free. If you hit a metal one with a saw chain in the middle of felling a tree, not good. The nubs that help retain them in the tree are nice. you mentioned cost, so you can start with a couple of cheap ones, or make some. If you chew one up with a chainsaw, you may feel better if they were cheap or free. save good ones for when that is unlikely. I really do not need mine often. used to back a band out of a cut on the saw mill. Most trees have enough lean to not need them. occ. with bucking a tree. I have a dozen or so, from 5 to 12 inches. good to have at least 4 to leap frog back in a cut on the sawmill. on smaller trees, you want shorter wedge with a steep pitch so there is room for the saw bar and chain in the cut without hitting them. welcome to the forum

Skeans1 · May 05, 2019, 10:12:37 AM

Normally in my wedge pouch I carry 6 10-12" normally 2 10's, 4 12's plus a 15" for pounding wedges and the optional large tree that needs beat on.
For the size you're going to be in probably 8" would do all the lifting you want especially in a double taper.
Here's a catalog with some good information in there as well as on their site.http://www.madsens1.com/PDF/18catwebsummer.pdf?

doc henderson · May 05, 2019, 12:36:33 PM

They make a felling tool that is a handle on a flat bar used to lever a tree over. the prob. you may have with, as an example, s 12 " tree, is after a feeling notch of 3 to 4 inches and a back cut, there will be little room to put a wedge behind the 4 inches or so of bar. That is why a custom short fat wedge may help and since there is less room, no big loss if it gets cut up. Or can use cable or rope to help pull over, or a skid steer bucket against the back side.

barbender · May 05, 2019, 01:10:28 PM

The euros make an angled back cut on smaller trees so they can get their felling levers in. Say you make your hinge, and normally you make your back cut horizontal- instead bore cut it at about 45°. Slide your lever in, and then nip the holding wood. Then lever away👍 I've never tried it but it sure seems like a swell idea!😁

lxskllr · May 05, 2019, 03:43:46 PM

I use my 8"s most of all. I also have a couple 5.5"ers I use for bucking, just to stuff in the kerf as insurance. I already had them, and that's as good a use as any, but a homemade wood wedge would work equally as well, and free. You're not pounding them, so they don't have to be durable or slippery.

@Skeans1 I was looking in the Madsens catalog you posted, and saw the rifled wedges. Seems like a good idea. I've had mine splay apart, and that looks like it would solve the issue, but I don't fall enough trees to worry about it. What's your professional opinion of the design?

doc henderson · May 05, 2019, 03:51:02 PM

I have a 4 ton porta power hydraulic unit with a scissor type attachment that could really pry apart a cut if needed. just more ideas

Magicman · May 05, 2019, 04:53:06 PM

I have plenty of 5" & 8" plastic wedges that do the majority of the work, but I do have two 8" rifled wedges that mate together when that odd situation comes along that needs additional lift.

The wedges are sorta disposable due to the chain occasionally nipping the tip or the hatchet knocking a corner off of the back when I get a bit heavy handed. I always slip a wedge in behind the chainsaw bar when felling and usually use two when bucking. Just makes life simpler when something turns/twist as it gives way or you misjudge a load.

Skeans1 · May 05, 2019, 05:31:43 PM

Quote from: lxskllr on May 05, 2019, 03:43:46 PM
I use my 8"s most of all. I also have a couple 5.5"ers I use for bucking, just to stuff in the kerf as insurance. I already had them, and that's as good a use as any, but a homemade wood wedge would work equally as well, and free. You're not pounding them, so they don't have to be durable or slippery.

@Skeans1 I was looking in the Madsens catalog you posted, and saw the rifled wedges. Seems like a good idea. I've had mine splay apart, and that looks like it would solve the issue, but I don't fall enough trees to worry about it. What's your professional opinion of the design?

I've had a set of the rifled wedges and hated them the only thing they're good for is stacking. When I'm stacking wedges I'll put some dirt a little spit something in there to help keep them together and alternate between the upper and lower wedge.
To bucking with wedges never had to buck using a wedge you should start the compression side then to the tension side you will lessen the likelihood of pulling wood as well as getting pinched. The day where you do get pinched you'll be wishing for a 10 or 12 with a big 15" or an axe to pound with.

Skeans1 · May 05, 2019, 05:34:55 PM

Quote from: barbender on May 05, 2019, 01:10:28 PM
The euros make an angled back cut on smaller trees so they can get their felling levers in. Say you make your hinge, and normally you make your back cut horizontal- instead bore cut it at about 45°. Slide your lever in, and then nip the holding wood. Then lever away👍 I've never tried it but it sure seems like a swell idea!😁

Euros also dance around the stump but in all reality that's a good way to loose a tree fast a sloping back cut has less fiber holding the wood you'll pop on off a stump quick. If you don't believe try sliding one off the stump sideways sometimes you slope the cut to slip the butt over or even backwards off the stump.

Skeans1 · May 05, 2019, 05:37:16 PM

Quote from: doc henderson on May 05, 2019, 03:51:02 PM
I have a 4 ton porta power hydraulic unit with a scissor type attachment that could really pry apart a cut if needed. just more ideas

Watch doing that you don't pop that out at yourself, a falling jack like most of us use have a base that can move in a lot of directions plus the smallest ones I've ever seen are 28 tons think of the forces a tree can put out.

doc henderson · May 05, 2019, 06:08:39 PM

thanks for the word of caution. . I have not and prob. never will use it for that. it is the little red hand pump ones in 4 or 10 ton. Just a thought. I tend to use the skid steer for the wishy washy stubborn stuff.

Skeans1 · May 05, 2019, 06:24:24 PM

@doc henderson
This is my old set of falling jacks dual rams at 45 tons each

mills · May 05, 2019, 07:20:07 PM

There was a recent thread on here that covered basically the question you asked. My rule of thumb is little trees little wedges, big trees big wedges. 8" and 6" is about all I ever use. I keep a thick steel wedge in the truck for special occasions like Magicman talked about. I have a couple of new 10" wedges that are several years old. Don't think I'll ever need them, and we cut some big hardwoods. I use the red heads that I get from Baileys, but was planning on checking sponsors for this site before I buy anymore.

btulloh · May 05, 2019, 07:25:34 PM

Wedges. Get a few plastic wedges of different sizes. Use them and you'll develop your own preferences. Some will chip but those are still useful at times. You can't have too many. Zero is the only quantity that's wrong.

John Mc · May 05, 2019, 08:34:29 PM

All I ever carry with me are two 12" wedges. For smaller trees, there are some felling techniques that allow you to use them without bottoming out against the back of the hinge. I never stack the wedges. for a tree with strong back lean where I might need more than one wedge, I pound in one, stick a +/-3/4" cookie in the gap created by the wedge, and pound my second wedge on top of the cookie. There is much less chance of the wedge getting spit out when it's driven on top of the wooden cookie than when stacked with another wedge. If wedge + cookie still isn't enough, pounding that 2nd one in over the cookie has freed up the first one: slip in a thicker cookie, and pound the wedge in over that.

If I were felling some of the huge trees out in the Pacific Northwest, I'd probably carry more than 2 wedges, but there are rarely cases that I need more than two cutting in the northeast.

Pine Ridge · May 05, 2019, 08:57:32 PM

Metal wedges are hard on saw chain, and they will also pop out of the cut if you try to drive them like plastic wedges.

JMG · May 05, 2019, 10:11:14 PM

thanks fellows for the school lesson went and bought two 8" plastic wedges Gona cut a few out of scrap pecan hardest thing I got on hand.thanks again

Ed_K · May 07, 2019, 10:12:33 AM

For 12" trees cut your front hinge, bore cut and leave a strap on the back, insert a wedge in from both sides, cut the strap. A 1" wedge will move a tree top 6', over that you'll need to stack them.

Blackcanyon · May 07, 2019, 07:43:31 PM

I use plastic wedges and buy the longer ones 8" maybe? Nothing worse than burying a short wedge and having a tree just hanging out. I also will sometimes lay a wedge in one side of my notch cut if there is a large leader that I am worried about hitting and splitting. This breaks the hing on the wedge side and gives the tree a slight roll when laying down.

Skeans1 · May 07, 2019, 11:07:57 PM

@Blackcanyon
You might try a Dutchman on that side it'll do the same thing or take part of the face cut slip it into that side to swing it.

@Ed_K
Have you ever put the back cut in first? It can be a pretty common practice when jacking or playing in smaller timber allowing you to wedge before the face in put in then finish the back cut.

Ianab · May 07, 2019, 11:50:05 PM

Another method with small trees is a split level back cut.

See page 32 of this manual.
https://safetree.nz/wp-content/uploads/2015/02/Tree-Felling.pdf

Cut your notch normally, make 1/2 of the back-cut from one side, and insert a wedge. Then make the 2nd 1/2 of the back-cut at a slightly different height / angle, so you don't hit the wedge. The pictures in that PDF probably explain it better.