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The right nail

Started by DonW, February 16, 2021, 12:12:16 PM

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DonW

Does anyone use regularly cut nails? What are the (non boutique and so serious  ) sources?
Hjartum yxa, nothing less than breitbeil/bandhacke combo.

Don P

Just regular masonry cut nails I get at the building supply. Gotta admit I haven't gone looking since tapcons hit the market.

doc henderson

I got a 5# box at lowes years ago.  i admittedly do not use them often and prob. did not need the 5#box.  I also use horse shoe nails as décor on squirrel feeders and such.   like a cross,  "cowboy chic".
Timber king 2000, 277c track loader, PJ 32 foot gooseneck, 1976 F700 state dump truck, JD 850 tractor.  2007 Chevy 3500HD dually, home built log splitter 18 horse 28 gpm with 5 inch cylinder and 32 inch split range with conveyor powered by a 12 volt tarp motor

dgdrls

I've used them on survey projects in the past.

Lowes show's them at $6.98/Lb (32 3/1/2" nails)  Hillman brand

D

DonW

Would either of you know if these lowes nails are made from soft iron you can use for clinching? Normal nail material likes to rebound a bit making them harder to sink. 

Tapcons? Never heard of it. I guess you cannot clinch with the masonry version. 
Hjartum yxa, nothing less than breitbeil/bandhacke combo.

doc henderson

what is the project for which you seek these nails?
Timber king 2000, 277c track loader, PJ 32 foot gooseneck, 1976 F700 state dump truck, JD 850 tractor.  2007 Chevy 3500HD dually, home built log splitter 18 horse 28 gpm with 5 inch cylinder and 32 inch split range with conveyor powered by a 12 volt tarp motor

DonW

I hope I get this terminology right, it's a guess but, clamped doors. You know, only planks nailed to battens the nails clinched. 
Hjartum yxa, nothing less than breitbeil/bandhacke combo.

doc henderson

so like the classic "cabin door"?
Timber king 2000, 277c track loader, PJ 32 foot gooseneck, 1976 F700 state dump truck, JD 850 tractor.  2007 Chevy 3500HD dually, home built log splitter 18 horse 28 gpm with 5 inch cylinder and 32 inch split range with conveyor powered by a 12 volt tarp motor

doc henderson

lots of clenching/clinching nails on e-bay.
Timber king 2000, 277c track loader, PJ 32 foot gooseneck, 1976 F700 state dump truck, JD 850 tractor.  2007 Chevy 3500HD dually, home built log splitter 18 horse 28 gpm with 5 inch cylinder and 32 inch split range with conveyor powered by a 12 volt tarp motor

scsmith42

Tremont Nails makes an excellent product right here in the USA. The company dates back around 200 years.

They have lots of options, so be sure to check out the main company website.
Peterson 10" WPF with 65' of track
Smith - Gallagher dedicated slabber
Tom's 3638D Baker band mill
and a mix of log handling heavy equipment.

DonW

Quote from: doc henderson on February 17, 2021, 02:44:44 AM
so like the classic "cabin door"?
Yes, but any sized door from barn size to shutters to Cabinets, plus all the other uses for nails.
Quote from: scsmith42 on February 17, 2021, 04:33:29 AM
Tremont Nails makes an excellent product right here in the USA. The company dates back around 200 years.

They have lots of options, so be sure to check out the main company website.


This Looks promising for what I had in mind and where I'll check into. Any experience with this company?
Hjartum yxa, nothing less than breitbeil/bandhacke combo.

Tom King

Tremont is a good company.  They are all machine made, and don't really look like hand forged nails.

If you can't find what you want, I may have some.  I have some 50 pound boxes, of various sizes, that were found in the 1970's, out of a store that closed its doors in the 1930's.

I also have quite a collection of wrought iron, hand forged nails, but not many long enough for what you need.

There used to be a guy on ebay selling them, from some big building he tore down.  I think they were like 3-1/2 to 4" long.  I bought some from him.  They were cut nails, rather than wrought iron, hand forged, but were from the mid 19th Century, and irregular enough to look authentic.  I did use them for making a clinched nail door, like you're talking about making, for some mid 19th Century outbuildings.

The ones sold in box stores today are Terrible.  The wedge shape is way too tapered, and the heads ridiculously wide.

Just search on ebay for:  "old cut nails"




scsmith42

Quote from: DonW on February 17, 2021, 12:05:55 PM
Quote from: doc henderson on February 17, 2021, 02:44:44 AM
so like the classic "cabin door"?
Yes, but any sized door from barn size to shutters to Cabinets, plus all the other uses for nails.
Quote from: scsmith42 on February 17, 2021, 04:33:29 AM
Tremont Nails makes an excellent product right here in the USA. The company dates back around 200 years.

They have lots of options, so be sure to check out the main company website.


This Looks promising for what I had in mind and where I'll check into. Any experience with this company?
As Tom King said, Tremont is a good company.  I've bought a lot of Maze nails from one of their sister divisions.
Peterson 10" WPF with 65' of track
Smith - Gallagher dedicated slabber
Tom's 3638D Baker band mill
and a mix of log handling heavy equipment.

DonW

These maze nails are used for siding and shingle work as far as I can see. Is that right? I've found similar in Sweden which I like a lot. 

Tom I am envious of these photos you're posting with your excellent work. Having limited acces to a good computer I cannot do the same but maybe this link will work instead https://shinglemaker.wordpress.com/2019/01/07/a-goat-has-destroyed-its-old-door-a-new-door-has-replaced-that-one/
Of a door I recently made of this type based on an old Dutch model. 
Hjartum yxa, nothing less than breitbeil/bandhacke combo.

scsmith42

Quote from: DonW on February 18, 2021, 10:14:57 AM
These maze nails are used for siding and shingle work as far as I can see. Is that right? I've found similar in Sweden which I like a lot.
Maze makes a lot of different products. I've used a lot of their 3.5" ring shank nails in my framing nailers.
Peterson 10" WPF with 65' of track
Smith - Gallagher dedicated slabber
Tom's 3638D Baker band mill
and a mix of log handling heavy equipment.

Skip

Used to be cut nail plant in Wheeling WV, Labelle (WHG PITT) Dated back before the civil war , the still used most of the same machinery, Buddy's BIL,s worked there. Finger factory, gut busting, back breakin plant . Believe it was largest in the US. Used to get 50lb boxes for free to use for weight in the trunk or back of truck ;) in the winter .Love to have them now ::).
  Once they in some wood they were IN.

Brad_bb

I built a MASH style tent door that way from white pine and masonry cut nails.  I clenched them over.  It worked 90 percent of the time.  10 percent of the time they broke (too brittle).



 
Anything someone can design, I can sure figure out how to fix!
If I say it\\\\\\\'s going to take so long, multiply that by at least 3!

DonW

Sinking nails at the back and minimizing blowout there is taxing enough with soft iron, I cannot imagine it with hardened steel. 
Hjartum yxa, nothing less than breitbeil/bandhacke combo.

Tom King

If you can't find the head shape you want, it's really not That much trouble to reshape, or "rehead" some of the old ones.  

There are a couple of blacksmiths selling "nail headers" on ebay.  It's just a piece of metal, with a handle, and a square hole that lets a cut nail only go down so far, leaving enough sticking up to form the head.

Heat the head of the right nail red hot with a Mapp gas torch, put it in the header with a pair of pliers, and shape like you want it with a hammer.

The old, wrought iron nails don't have much, if any carbon in them, so they stay soft enough to work.

Cut nails sold in stores today are hardened to drive into masonry.

DonW

Some small cut nails I've used before are topped in a neutral way and allow for customization while driving because of the mailable material, faceted 4or5, rounded and so on and so on.... Not only that but iron nails are readily customized in length as well and therefore when needed you do it instead of avoid doing it, ( not that trimming nails is ever fun ).
Hjartum yxa, nothing less than breitbeil/bandhacke combo.

kantuckid

Quote from: scsmith42 on February 17, 2021, 04:33:29 AM
Tremont Nails makes an excellent product right here in the USA. The company dates back around 200 years.

They have lots of options, so be sure to check out the main company website.
Tremont is who I used in 1980 when I made all the cabin style interior doors for our house using there nails. I think mine are all called "roseheads". 7 doors in total. I used my T&G EWP paneling for my door stock-doors are still going strong. I still have a sampler they sent me years ago, along with a couple boxes of nails. In some woods they can be difficult to use in certain applications-best do a trial run with cut nails. 
My original kit cabinet doors were also cut nails as I had no time to do them in panels so did battens but now I've re-done in better form using the chestnut from the original doors.  
Kan=Kansas;tuck=Kentucky;kid=what I'm not

bannerd

The house I'm building we've been using a lot of cut nails for flooring.  Since the wood is green and will have shrinkage they should hold very well.

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