The Forestry Forum

General Forestry => Sawmills and Milling => Topic started by: Engineer on July 13, 2016, 08:50:51 AM

Title: Keep or sell pine logs?
Post by: Engineer on July 13, 2016, 08:50:51 AM
This kind of crosses multiple topics so bear with me....  :-\

My dad has been trying to get rid of a couple dozen large white pines on his property for a few years.  Says they are 'obstructing his view' and would like them gone.  He does not have the equipment to remove them himself, nor does he want to, but he has offered them to me if I will take them down and remove them. Some of the trees have multiple trunks so in total, there are about 35 trunks, ranging from about 10" to over 36" diameter.  I burn wood and have an outdoor wood boiler, so I can utilize everything including the small branches, and we would chip the rest for landscape mulch.  Some of these trees are huge and while I can cut them down, handling and moving them will be a lot of work.

Now, last week he contacted a logger who was logging a piece of land nearby.  The logger offered him $50 per cord for the trees, and said that there was about 50 cords of wood.  I'm guessing that the logger probably won't take anything under 7-8" in diameter (pulp and/or firewood) so there's still the matter of another couple dozen cords of small diameter stuff that I could use.  So for $2500 in his pocket, he gets rid of the trees and has some firewood for me.  Fair deal, except....

I also have a need for about 4000 board feet of pine, to side my new garage and also do interior wall finish (T&G or shiplap).  I am estimating, based on figures I've obtained on this forum and in other locations, that I can get 500 board feet of lumber out of a cord of pine.  That means that dad may have 25,000 board feet of lumber, more or less - plus all the tops and etc. for firewood.  I have not yet bought a sawmill, but I intend to get a new Woodland Mills HM126 or HM130 as soon as finances allow (probably this fall).  Now, I can either buy the mill and use that pine to make my own siding and trim, or I can skip the mill, buy 4000 BF of pine at a buck per BF, and let him sell it all.  Keeping in mind, of course, that the process of milling and processing it all myself will be labor-intensive.  I can deal with that - I have a decent tractor with forks and I can bring the mill to the wood.

You may ask - why not just scale and set aside 4000-5000 bf of the best logs and sell the rest (roughly 10-12 cords worth)?  Dad claims the logger won't do it.  He doesn't want just the junk, he wants it all, although he did say that any good sawlogs he would sell and there would be more money in it for my dad.  Somehow I'm not placing a lot of faith in that statement.

Anyway, dad says he won't do anything until I think about it and have a chance to cruise the timber for myself, find out if there is actually enough good logs to get what I need.  He said he doesn't need the money, just wants to get rid of the trees, and is perfectly willing to let me have them if I can deal with them.  At least 1500 board feet will have to be 14' - 16' logs, so I will have to try to scale the straightest ones on the tree and see if I can get enough.  Everything else can be 8-10' stuff.

The other thought is to try to hire the logger simply to cut the trees down and skid/pile the logs.  I could give the guy a cut list and see if he would take the pulp/firewood quality logs as payment for his work?  Would most loggers be willing to do that?  That way I get what I want, he gets paid for his work, and I can justify buying my mill.  And I still get slabs and branches for firewood.

So what should I do here? 
Title: Re: Keep or sell pine logs?
Post by: Czech_Made on July 13, 2016, 09:10:22 AM
I say have the logger - any logger - cut the trees down, get a mill and do the rest yourself.
Title: Re: Keep or sell pine logs?
Post by: GAB on July 13, 2016, 09:21:07 AM
Just might be a chance for you and your dad to get in some quality time.
You will have to put the value on that.
Gerald
Title: Re: Keep or sell pine logs?
Post by: Magicman on July 13, 2016, 10:44:47 AM
Logs are heavy and logging carries a certain amount of danger.  Skidders have their purpose.

Since your Dad initially wanted to give you the logs, you can give him the opportunity to buy you himself a sawmill, and you can be on the lookout for some logs.   ;D 
Title: Re: Keep or sell pine logs?
Post by: fishfighter on July 13, 2016, 11:57:21 AM
$2500 in one hand, nothing in the other, it would be a no brainer for me. More so than I wouldn't have to lift a finger. :D
Title: Re: Keep or sell pine logs?
Post by: Bruno of NH on July 13, 2016, 01:17:42 PM
No logger in their right mind would work for pine pulp as payment right now . Jm2cts .
Title: Re: Keep or sell pine logs?
Post by: ozarkgem on July 13, 2016, 06:40:44 PM
if you are going to buy a mill anyway you will still have to get logs. Free logs are good. Course they are not totally free. Maybe you can hire a feller and have him cut them down if you have a way to move them. White pine goes bad pretty quick from what few I get around here. You have to get your lumber from somewhere sounds like to me. Why not mill it your self. Figure the cost difference and it will probably go a long way on the purchase price of your mill. You could hire a portable mill. I bet MM would take on the job. ;)
Title: Re: Keep or sell pine logs?
Post by: Kbeitz on July 13, 2016, 07:30:04 PM
It would be nice to know where your lumber came from.
Puts a smile on your face everytime you look at your building.
Title: Re: Keep or sell pine logs?
Post by: WV Sawmiller on July 13, 2016, 09:32:38 PM
Engineer,

   How are you fixed for lumber storage space?

   If that is not a limiting factor you night also check into having a qualified logger cut and skid the logs to a landing and hire an experienced sawyer to come cut the good logs into lumber. Save the best lumber for your needs and sell the rest and split it ot give the profits to your dad or better yet use it for some joint bonding type project.. Use the tops and limbs in your heater.
Title: Re: Keep or sell pine logs?
Post by: thecfarm on July 14, 2016, 07:38:31 AM
Sounds like the trees are out in the woods? I suppose no way for you to cut the trees as needed?  Which does take more time.
I burn a lot of white pine in my Heatmor. I used it for a couple winters. It really should be dry. I did not notice much of a diffeance in burning hardwood compared to softwood. Some of mine had been cut for years. It was cutoffs left over when I had my land logged.
Title: Re: Keep or sell pine logs?
Post by: barbender on July 14, 2016, 09:39:48 PM
     The logger has to make money, and most of the time firewood and pulp are kind of a break even proposition. You should be able to work out a deal for him to put the wood in a pile, sorted, and you just pay him a per cord price to do it. Around here, it would probably be $40-$50 per cord.
Title: Re: Keep or sell pine logs?
Post by: Engineer on July 22, 2016, 10:57:07 AM
Dad had a conversation with the logger earlier this week.  He's going to cut, buck and skid the logs to a landing and I get to take what I want, limited to approximately 4000-5000 bf of scaled logs.  He agreed without reservation to take the remaining logs for pulp and firewood as payment for the cutting and skidding.  Dad gets his view back, but no money changes hands.  I get to buy a new sawmill.   ;D
Title: Re: Keep or sell pine logs?
Post by: tnaz on July 22, 2016, 11:46:42 AM
Win, Win: Good deal. :D  New  Mill 8) 8)
Title: Re: Keep or sell pine logs?
Post by: Magicman on July 22, 2016, 01:04:31 PM
Thanks for sharing that great news.  It's nice when things work out.   ;D
Title: Re: Keep or sell pine logs?
Post by: OffGrid973 on July 22, 2016, 11:17:32 PM
I think dad should get a new custom outhouse so he can "as we younger folks say" "kick it old school"...free is never free unless your conscience is clear from all deals by ensuring a smile on everyone's face.  If an outhouse is too difficult, look up Pumpkin Chunkin which we have down in Delaware here on the east coast.  One pull of a trebuchet brings a smile to everyone ;)

Title: Re: Keep or sell pine logs?
Post by: thecfarm on July 23, 2016, 06:52:22 AM
Good luck with the search of a sawmill. I looked for about 20 years before I bought one.  :)
Title: Re: Keep or sell pine logs?
Post by: Engineer on July 25, 2016, 09:55:53 AM
Going to be ordering a new Woodland Mills HM126 with one extension, later on this week.  Can't wait to get to milling again.  The logger started cutting today.

Will document new mill in new thread with photos!
Title: Re: Keep or sell pine logs?
Post by: tnaz on July 25, 2016, 11:35:42 AM
Someone said; if no pictures it really didn't happen??? :D