mismatched bar/chain?

[rmack]

Hi, I just bought a new ms660 with a 36" bar. I decided to lop a couple of 4' pieces off a 30" douglas fir for stickers. about half way through the first cut the saw started bogging down and hanging up. once I got through the cut there was blue smoke coming off the chain/bar. same thing again on the second cut.

once the saw has been running for 30 seconds or so, it seems like the saw is struggling just to pull the chain around the bar.

the chain is very tight and it is difficult to force the chain to sit down in the bar, the chain is 404 pitch.

is it possible the bar has a narrower slot than the chain requires?

I cannot see any oil coming off the end of the bar regardless of how the oiler is adjusted, but after two cuts there is already a substantial pile of oil/metal filings on the back side of the sprocket cover.

[beenthere]

At least need to get the oiler fixed.
And the bar should be stamped with its size to see if it matches the chain.

Get it from a reputable dealer?

[JohnG28]

Sounds like wrong gauge chain for the bar. Might be an .050 bar and .063 chain. Did the dealer you bought the saw from set it up for you?

[sawguy21]

If the bar groove is too narrow for the chain, the chain not be able to be installed. Check the bar, the gauge should be stamped into the metal. You say it is .404 chain, the MS660 comes out of the box with a 3/8 sprocket. Was the sprocket changed or was somebody at the dealership not paying attention?

[thecfarm]

Take it right back!!!! I spend money and I expect it right and to be able to use it as soon as I get home.

[joe_indi]

......I cannot see any oil coming off the end of the bar regardless of how the oiler is adjusted, but after two cuts there is already a substantial pile of oil/metal filings on the back side of the sprocket cover.

It could be that the nose sprocket has jammed since it was running without replenished lubrication from the oil pump.
Check the nose sprocket for free rotation.

Joe

[Al_Smith]

Although it would seem unlikely to get a chain/bar missmatch it might be possible .Generally speaking just about all .404 chain sold in the last 20 years is .063 gauge. At one time it was made in both .050 and .058.

FWIW I was given a 32" Windser/McCulloch bar with a .404 tip on a .050 bar and only assume it to be from the west coast .That size gauge in large .404 was never used in this part of the country and I've never seen a .050 by .404 chain in my life time .I do however have several long loops of .404 in .058 and a small roll of bulk chain NOS .

My assumption on the use of .050 in .404 might be for use on the west coast Douglas firs using mid size saws because of the larger teeth that would tend to hold a larger chip load .That is only a guess though .

[rmack]

I decided to just keep using it and see what happened, and it seems to have loosened up a bit.

I guess it was just tight being new.

thanks for the replies. 

[ST Ranch]

rmack -just wondering, was the D-fir log you were cutting from a dry log or a recently cut [logged] green log? I have had similair experiences when cutting DRY, big diameter D-fir and Larch logs.

I am only guessinig, but to me it appears that fine sawdust is created when cuttiing these hard dry butt logs and this sawdust appears to collect in the grove of the saw bar. It does not seem to matter what kind of chain oil [I use Shell super sticky processor oil], or how tight the chain may be.

My solution to this is when I feel saw start to bog a bit, I stop cutting, remove the saw from log and "free wheel" the saw till the sawdust clears from the bar and the saw blade groove gets well lubed. My oiler is always working OK when this happens and I clean the bar groove regularily, especially when cutting green D-fir in the spring.

It is almost like htting a pitch pocket when milling an older d-fir butt log, the pitch and fine sawdust build up on the saw bar and bind the chain.

Tom

[Bigredfaller]

sounds like your running a .063 chain in an .058 bar.... it will be tight to the point of barely fitting at first and as the drivers and bar wear it will start to fit better, untill it wears the bar out prematurely and your cuts start wandering all over the place!
At no time should you ever see metal filings in your side cover! To check your oiler for operation remove the bar and chain and rev the saw with the clutch exposed... you will see oil running out of the oiler hole, if not then you have a problem.
I would recommend returning to the dealer and having him replace with the right bar and chain....   

[beenthere]

I decided to just keep using it and see what happened,

Good luck. But with what you said in the OP, 

the saw started bogging down and hanging up. once I got through the cut there was blue smoke coming off the chain/bar. same thing again on the second cut.

this decision to just keep using the saw doesn't seem to be prudent.

Apparently you cannot take it back to the dealer?

Regardless, wish you well but I think it is going to cost you.

[JohnG28]

You really should take it back to the dealer. If they set it up they should fix it. If you're running it with a mismatch setup you will put stress on the bar, chain, clutch, and engine. Also, when one fails you may not have a leg to stand on with the dealer because you knowingly ran it when there was an issue. For over a saw over $1000 I'd want it right from the get go. JMO of course, do as you will. But you may be really unhappy when something else goes wrong and you aren't covered.

[rmack]

The saw was over $1400.00, but who's counting...

If it turns out there is an issue, the dealer can cover whatever the costs are.

It does seem to be working better now, but with that 36" bar, I think the saw will need to be steered in the right direction no matter what.

sounds like your running a .063 chain in an .058 bar.... it will be tight to the point of barely fitting at first and as the drivers and bar wear it will start to fit better, untill it wears the bar out prematurely and your cuts start wandering all over the place!
At no time should you ever see metal filings in your side cover! To check your oiler for operation remove the bar and chain and rev the saw with the clutch exposed... you will see oil running out of the oiler hole, if not then you have a problem.
I would recommend returning to the dealer and having him replace with the right bar and chain....   

How would I determine that? are the chains marked? the bar has .404 stamped on it.

rmack -just wondering, was the D-fir log you were cutting from a dry log or a recently cut [logged] green log? I have had similair experiences when cutting DRY, big diameter D-fir and Larch logs.

I am only guessinig, but to me it appears that fine sawdust is created when cuttiing these hard dry butt logs and this sawdust appears to collect in the grove of the saw bar. It does not seem to matter what kind of chain oil [I use Shell super sticky processor oil], or how tight the chain may be.

My solution to this is when I feel saw start to bog a bit, I stop cutting, remove the saw from log and "free wheel" the saw till the sawdust clears from the bar and the saw blade groove gets well lubed. My oiler is always working OK when this happens and I clean the bar groove regularily, especially when cutting green D-fir in the spring.

It is almost like htting a pitch pocket when milling an older d-fir butt log, the pitch and fine sawdust build up on the saw bar and bind the chain.

Tom

It is dry douglas fir, but I have found that the thing to do is not to allow the chain to slow down too much. I just take smaller bites before evening out the cut and am careful when pulling back on the saw to take that close bite.

[Bigredfaller]

Not sure what air of chain your running, Oregon or stihl? The bar should have the gauge, #of drive links and 404 or 3/8ths.
The Oregon chain I run has 75 stamped on the driver and is 3/8ths... Not many guys run 404 up here any more since they came out with the 3/8ths .063 gauge.

If your chain is filed properly you shouldn't have to steer it at all... In fact if you are steering it you are wearing one side of the bar more than the other as your chain is pulling to hard on one side and causing it to wander in the first place. 

[rmack]

took another look at the bar and it does have .063 stamped on it as well as .404

it has started pulling a bit to the right, but there is a lot of dirt/gravel in the bark of this stuff, I'm guessing that's the cause.

[SawTroll]

The saw was over $1400.00, but who's counting...

If it turns out there is an issue, the dealer can cover whatever the costs are.

.....   .

Don't count on that - if you continued to run it, after notising something was wrong. ;)

[deerslayer]

took another look at the bar and it does have .063 stamped on it as well as .404

it has started pulling a bit to the right, but there is a lot of dirt/gravel in the bark of this stuff, I'm guessing that's the cause.

You need to sharpen the chain.