dealers

[Spike60]

OK, I'll bite. Guys, he tried to goad me into this beef on the phone the other night, and I declined, I will now respond with the "spice" that he was tryin to stir up.

Your one of the smartest dudes I know, but not actually being in the business, (and neither am I anymore!), your analytical inclination to draw conclusions from incomplete information sometimes gets the best of you. (How's that for an opener?)

Husky seems LESS interested in selling lawnmowers judging by the cancelation of their entire walk mower lineup two years ago. They are also thinning out the tractor category, and I wouldn't be surprised if that unprofitable segment joins the push mowers soon. IMO, they should really dump the snowblowers, or learn how to build one. They are awful. :( Lot of factors there. There was an entire factory that made nothing but walk mowers, but when they gave up making the Craftsman mowers, the factory was no longer profitable without all of the private label dolars.

The Willand program we talked about the other night is clearly an indication that focus on the core saw business is increasing, not declining.

In fact, it is Stihl that is moving in the lawnmower direction. This year they are beginning to sell re-branded Ferris zero turns. (they don't look bad in Stihl colors either) Minimum order is 18 units. See if your buddies at CNY are going to put them on the floor. I stopped in a local Stihl dealer the other day just for a Holiday visit, and noticed a Stihl battery mower on the floor for $749.

You've got a pebble in your shoe over the fact that the Husky common service tool is being replaced by a new service interface that requires a small subscription fee. You are likely not aware that Stihl charges a 1% fee on EVERY dealer invoice for marketing/advertising. Ask your CNY guy what that adds up to every year. lol

The one point on which we agree is that unfortunately, most dealers share the attitude of your friends at CNY in that it's all about the big equipment. This is frustrating for all of us here that have an interest in chainsaws, and especially for the pros in logging and tree service businesses that absolutely need good parts and service support on the saw side. The reality is that Husky, Stihl and Echo/Shindaiwa have all the support available that any dealer could need to do a bang up job in the saw biz. The sad fact is that so few dealers take advantage of those resources. They don't stock parts, or even feel it's necessary to have a good 2-stroke tech in the house. So, whose really guilty of dropping the ball here? The sorry situation on competent saw support is more the fault of the dealers than the manufacturers.

I'm sure your about ready to launch into 40 year old analogies from other industries you've been in, but I've been in this industry for close to 40 years, so there's no need to talk about motorcycles and software companies. (see how I pre-empted your next move by knowing my opponent? lol ). It's beyond sad to me that my list above includes just 3 remaining saw OEM's. Husky, Stihl and Echo are all that's left. Too many good brands have gone away. But let's take a quick look at what the saw biz used to be back when you were in the motorcycle world. For the most part saws, especially on the pro side, were sold in saw shops. Husky and Stihl had nothing else in the catelog besides saws. Mower shops would likely carry traditional brands like Homelite and McCulloch, but the lack of focus on saws vs the big equipment was evident even then. But even the domestic brands were sold in saw only shops any place where there was enough business to support them. When I was on the road prior to my own store, I called on so many of dealers who may have mixed in wheeled goods, but were primarily saw oriented businesses. Quite a bit different now, and those 3 remaining OEMs have little to no interest in being in stores like that. The explosion in the landscaper equipment market is often overlooked when talking about saws. The gigantic numbers of trimmers and blowers dwarf the saw numbers in some markets. Especially for Echo. Initially, Husky and Stihl didn't even make their own trimmers, having them private labled from Japanese companies. (Maruyama for Husky, not sure for Stihl)

Bringing this to a merciful conclusion, I get that these companies want to be in big stores that can sell several different categories of equipment, rather than small family sized dealers. But poor customer support is the fault of dealers, large or small, on taking care of the saw customers. Don't see how anyone can pin the blame on the OEM's. It's not their fault that some dealers take 2-3 months to fix a chainsaw.

No need to send a tuition check, just have the coffee pot on when i come up in the next week or so.

[SwampDonkey]

Around here the manual fallers are all on private land. They've been shoved out the door off crown land for years. One exception is some small native crews cutting a few trees with skidder, logs mostly but firewood to. It's small potatoes volume wise.

Used to be a lot more clearing saw sales a few years ago, but numbers are dwindling. A lot of guys bought saws every spring, even though the old one was good for at least 7 seasons. But get a 2200 tax form from the boss man and you got the cash for a new one next April. :D

[weimedog]

 Husqvarna changing how they interface with their dealers with Common service tool isn't a frustration. Actually all I see is opportunity to that end the NEXT series of video's from me are about life with the 500's with no CST or dealer support for a regular NON industry guy. Junk pile builds on 550's, 562's, and now 572's, saw tweaks and mods etc. on used Autotune saws, also life with a non Autotune 585. We've beat the 372 thing to death already. Totally agree the service is on the dealers large and small. Also realize the Husqvarna support for their dealers from afar should be more than adequate for a dealer actively wanting to grow with Husqvarna. The tools are there. And to my back ground in "past" industries, I WAS BOTH that field and "Home Office" guy for a couple of companies in TWO completely different industries, CAD/CAM and in motorsports in the form of a Motorcycle company. Also have been in out side software sales to end users, inside sales to companies trying to build end user products as well and a traveling sales "rep" to sell motorcycles to dealers. The multiple industry experience just shows me that it's the same play different stage.  It's always about people.

SO after all that pontification, please tell me how many new Husqvarna dealers with the ability to service saws have appeared to fill the hole left by those having retired or simply left the saw business in my and now your area within New York? What has been the OEM's response? Because to most in the Husqvarna world THAT is an issue that matters, not the back ground of keyboard pounders in cyber space. Where can they go for parts & service? How do they interact with their chosen brand? DO they NEED to look to other brands based on the changing dealer support landscape? In my area Stihl has been quite aggressive in growing dealers & helping dealers "promote" the brand, see their factory program every year at CNY's sales promotion event. Husqvarna? We did have a Taylor" rental company pick up the brand around here. Wish they were more active around here as regardless of theory or back ground in a "stagnant" market, one company grows, another shrinks and usually the reasons are centered around the same things People & Relationships. That "Willand" program you outlined seems like a nice opportunity to start a small saw shop....what is the brand again they are selling? Actually the dealers who sell OEM on places like eBay have done a LOT to mitigate the parts situation.  Fortunately for all of us there are places like HLSupply, Fix-My-Toys, Dukes, and others who will sell OE parts online.  That's both a blessing and a curse as it competes with those dealers trying to make a stand.

FORTUNATELY for me,  I still have CNY who regardless of their "main" focus are still an active dealer and a source for OEM parts & on the way to the north country I frequently pass Sully's in Gouverneur who also is an active dealer with a good support program. And to Spike60 Maybe with your decades inside industry experience you could help those who are interested navigate their actual landscape as they pursue their chosen brand.

Me? My focus will be to those who still favor the pumpkins and no longer have an active dealer locally knowledgeable in the art of 500 series Autotunes.

[weimedog]

Around here the manual fallers are all on private land. They've been shoved out the door off crown land for years. One exception is some small native crews cutting a few trees with skidder, logs mostly but firewood to. It's small potatoes volume wise.

Used to be a lot more clearing saw sales a few years ago, but numbers are dwindling. A lot of guys bought saws every spring, even though the old one was good for at least 7 seasons. But get a 2200 tax form from the boss man and you got the cash for a new one next April. :D

Same, here most soft wood is done mechanically, and the "Big guys" have gone the mechanical route. it's the smaller outfits who still run saws, these are the folks who I have dealt with. Fewer of them as it's hard work, hard on the body and hard to make good money. On the "up" side there is a growing community of "enthusiast's" and along with the small logger types, farmers, and land owners like myself; saws are a part of life. So there is a market, prolly not a growth market. Have to say it does get harder to justify a very expensive machine ( over $1000 ) if it's a hard thing to get support or do it your self. So the discussion begins on how best to select a saw when sticker shock happens.  Dealer and support in general has to be a part of that equation.

[SwampDonkey]

I thought the neighor was just cutting wood next door until today. He said he is clearing ground for a hay field. Skidder and chain saw work. It will be 10 acres of ground, but will link up with 10+ acres already cleared. Got all winter to cut, no snow much yet and not real cold.

Up here you have to pay $1000 for one that has a magnesium case and not a bunch of plastic. I've got the 555 Husqvarna. I only use a 16" bar because I'm in young wood, some can be 20" in fir and popple, most not.  I'm thinning and cutting the poor formed ones and using that for firewood. I burn anything here in the furnace.

[Spike60]

SO after all that pontification, please tell me how many new Husqvarna dealers with the ability to service saws have appeared to fill the hole left by those having retired or simply left the saw business in my and now your area within New York? What has been the OEM's response?

Well, therein lies the real problem. There are few, if any, new dealers opening up for Husqvarna, or any other brand in this industry. Sadly, it's an industry that's fading away. Most here can chime regarding the amount of shops in their own areas now vs 10 and 20 years ago. Bet there won't be anyone saying there are more today than in the past. When we opened up 30 years ago, we were one of about 10 dealers/shops in a 30 mile run up route 28. Up til last week, we were the last one. "The lamps are going out all over.." (Sir Edward Grey, 1914) OK, that's an overly dramatic quote, but unfortunately it fits. 
Power Equipment Trade magazine did a survey this year and compared data from 2022 to 2012. In just 10 years, the number of dealers over 60 jumped from 29% to 64%. In just 10 years. The industry is aging out, (just like me  ), and there is little interest out there for anyone picking up the ball and running with it. And the trend is gonna continue, sorry to say. I know a lotta dealers, and many of them are planning their own exits from the business. 
So, how does Husky, or any other OEM respond to that reality? Let's look at another brand to illustrate the problem and leave Husky out of it for a moment. A year ago, there was an Exmark dealer in each of 3 counties here, of which we were one. Now there's none. Along with us, another one retired, and the 3rd booted out Exmark when the store which was also a Kubota dealer, was bought by a multi-store Kubota group. BIG hole in the market. Rep can hardly find a door to knock on. The few remaining dealers in these markets simply have no need for another line. That was my attitude when the Stihl shop that was 1/4 away closed about 5 years ago. If they want to leave town, let 'em go.    
The point that really, honestly, sticks in my craw about the Cortland market, is that CNY, like most dealers, including me, chooses who they want to get behind. Some favor Stihl over Husky, and some go the other way. You passed on to me a fair amount of bad and inaccurate info to that those guys are feeding the public about Husky up there that turned out to be baloney. It's clear what their favorite flavor of Kool-Aid is. And I'll gladly admit that I have my favorite flavor also. Truthfully, those guys ought to drop Husky if they prefer Stihl. Should that occur, you might consider picking up the torch up there yourself. I'll just load up the 2 parts cabinets in the truck and give them to you for Christmas.  :laugh:
Looks like the real serious problem here is that with my retirement, I have way too much time to write, don't I? 

[SwampDonkey]

We've had two dealers here in recent years who turned them over to new blood. The tractor dealers run a display section for Stihl but not much for service except for a couple that aren't bad. John Deere ain't one. :D The little small shops on back country farm roads in small hamlets are gone, except for one I know about, and long before they aged. One poor fella succumbed to a logging accident, the other drives school bus. The one I mentioned as the exception drives school bus. The business has slowed way down. Still a few farmers around cutting there own wood, but the big corporate farmers aren't, they have enough going on to keep the farm rolling. My dad cut and sold his own wood off the farm. I cut mine to, but I don't sell wood at give away prices, I burn it. :D

[barbender]

That firewood makes you feel that much warmer when you burn it, SD, knowing that you're sticking it to the man in some small way. Not that the man will notice much, but still🤷‍♂️😊

[SwampDonkey]

I see no need to sell wood for $800 that I can burn and save $2000, versus buying it, after expense and depreciation are taken into account. It doesn't cost me $3000 to make 10 cords of firewood. A chain, a file, 2 jugs of bar oil, 2 gallons of mixed gas and 5 gallons of straight gas for the buggy. A reliable chainsaw depreciated out 15 years and a buggy depreciated out for 20 years. The science of wood marketing. :D

[Al_Smith]

Everybody has a different take on this subject .I've been at this for decades and have been pointed out I'm not a glorious west coast faller .On that I just consider the source .
I don't buy new saws when there is a abundance of used ones .I've bought two new saws in my entire life and they were Poulans .I do however buy parts and those are for Stihl which even considering the internet usually dealer prices are in line .
There are no strictly "saw dealers " in this area nor has there ever been .For anything other than Stihl parts are where you find them .

[Real1shepherd]

"....and have been pointed out I'm not a glorious west coast faller .On that I just consider the source."



And on that note, I would consider the source of someone who would try to start something and hide behind the moderators.

Kevin

[ehp]

We are loosing husky dealers pretty fast here . I have 1 dealers left close to me but stihl is everywhere here with alot of dealers and now John deere carries stihl as well means even more dealers .  Its going to be a problem here to get stuff fixed cause most dealers here really have not much of a clue on running the software in the programs . I get lots of calls from dealers to come over and show us how this works but even then lots have no idea on what the numbers are that the machine tells them .  Very few young people here getting into fixing anything not just chainsaw stuff .  The wages are going to have to pretty much double yo get new blood into the system 

[SwampDonkey]

The few local ones I go to here are guys in their 30's at the counter. A couple fellas in their 50's along with them. John Deere might carry Stihl, but you'll get no service, ones around here don't. And we have 2. Never see a guy at the counters. Last time I was in one, no one to be found but I said as I left the place, 'I'll never be back, since there is no service'. They are only interested in tractors and implements. As far as service, it's like buying a saw at Canadian Tire. It's there on the shelf, buy it, you're on your own. :D

[lxskllr]

Pretty much all Stihl here, and a fair show of echo. I know exactly one Husky dealer I could drive to. I also only know one real sawshop, and that's where I go, even though it's ~30 miles away. I pass many Stihl dealers on the trip.

[Al_Smith]

You can't always judge things by who is behind the counter .I know the part number I need before I ever walk into the one Stihl dealer I buy from .
Once all I wanted was a 14" loop of rapid pico super  for the Stihl 200T .The lady at the counter tried to sell me carbide chain .The owner was in the store room and over heard the conversation and came out laughing . I was kind to her .
Darn good dealer orders  parts three days a week from the jobber in Cincinnati  .I seldom have to wait more than three days for parts .In all those years the only two new tools I've bought were a Stihl weed wacker and a $6,000 Toro zero turn .They both do a very good job .That said I've landed a ton of rebuilders which is what I do .
 

[Al_Smith]

This is Stihl country ,no Echo the closest Husqvarna dealer is 45 miles away and they say doesn't carry much inventory .So as such any new part I need for Husky comes out of North Carolina .
That said it's network so to speak .No matter what it is I can make some phone calls and usually find what I need .Some times it might take a long time but so far I've always found them .Restoration is not for everybody .I have no desire to learn a thing nor own these new designed computer operated devices .

[rusticretreater]

I can pretty much anything of Echo, Husqvarna but its a drive of 30+ miles in one of three directions.  The local Ace Hardware has Stihl products and a helpful parts desk.

Yeah, I have had the same encounter with a woman who works the parts desk at the co-op that is a Husq dealer.  I always try to find out the part number and availability before I get there.

What always frizzles me is when I walk in with the part number, say I called on the phone earlier and they haven't pulled the part and ask me what model I have etc.  That usually gets you on my "option of last resort list."

The place I really like is the fella who has a shed on his property stuffed floor to ceiling with parts.  Really knowledgeable and likes helping people.  The kind of person I want to give my money to.

If its not pressing, I just order online from a certified dealer and have the stuff shipped to me.  Most of the time I have so much to do that a day or two extra doesn't cause too many issues.  And of course, delivered to my door.

[Al_Smith]

Stihl by policy will not direct ship parts .You can order them by telephone but they must be picked up at the dealer .i have a Stihl dealer two miles from my home but use one 14 miles away .

[Spike60]

Rustic, you'd be really surprised how many people "screw up" their own "look up" on parts. Guy like you that knows what he's doing would first have to establish some credibility before I'd stop pestering him with questions. Then offer him a job.

Model year variations and parts supersitions are often what trip people up. 3rd party IPL's on some parts sites are notoriously full of mistakes and void of updates.

[John Mc]

I don't know what is going on at Husqvarna, but they better figure it out soon. We lost a wave of dealers who did full service 10+ years ago - a bunch of old-timers wo were probably not loking forward to learning about the computer controlled carbs anyway, and when Husqvarna started selling to the big box stores, these guys just decided to retire.

We did have a couple left: one was a JD dealer who was pretty good at saw service. I never got the impression that they were uninterested in me because I wasn't talking tractors. They switched to Stihl a few years back when JD corporate forced them to. They were not happy about the switch, since the New Holland/Kubota dealer 2 miles down the road was a VERY established, full line, top level Stihl dealer with great service.

I only know of three remaining shops within a reasonable drive:

• One is  logging and heavy equipment repair guy who got in to selling & servicing Husqvarna chainsaws at the request of his logging customers. I see he does not come up when I click on the Husqvarna dealer finder, so I'll have to touch base to see what's up.
• The other is a reasonable drive and listed on the Husqvarna Dealer finder as "Servicing Locations – Service for repair and warranty work" but the business's web site does not even mention Husqvarna.
• The third is listed as Husqvarna Crown dealer, but is an hour's drive away, and reportedly does not carry much of the Husqvarna line. I've never been there, but plan to stop in and check the place out if I'm in the area.

In the 20+ years I've lived here, we went from 4 GOOD servicing dealers within an easy drive (15 - 25 minutes) to none that I consider a solid, convenient source.

Husqvarna used to dominate sales among the pros in our area, but that is changing.

My mom is a full blooded Swede. I have relatives (not close relatives - 2nd or 3rd cousins, but we stay in touch) in Sweden who are pro loggers. I might be disowned if I make the switch to some other brand.

[Al_Smith]

This is what happened in this area a long time ago .This info came from a long time dealer who carried many brands over the years .Husqvarna made a power play saying the dealers would either drop Stihl or they would drop the dealer ,they could not sell both brands .
The dealers basically told them  to stick it where the sun doesn't shine but Husqvarna would not buy back their inventory .That is why there are no stocking Husky dealers in this area .You can find the consumer grade saws at places like Lowes or TSC but no pro grade saws nor repair parts .Those who buy them unless they are knowledgeable are up the creek without a paddle if they ever need repairs or parts .

[Al_Smith]

As an example of the above late last summer I repaired two Husqvarna consumer grade saws for my nieces live in .Nice guy but not very mechanically inclined .Actually for small saws they did pretty good once I tweaked them .I think it might have just been the carbs needed rebuilt and one had a funky fuel line .He could not find anybody willing to work on them .Good old uncle Al to the rescue once again. Otherwise they never would run again.
 

[SwampDonkey]

I go in to the couple reliable shops, which are basically the same business owner here, for spark plugs, blades chains, maybe a bar once in awhile, air filters, gas line filter that kind of thing all stocked. If I need a handle bar or a blade guard, will have it in 2 or 3 days, not something that they would sell much of. Can't even order anything at local John Deere. The guys down river that run Stihl's go to a old guy in another town down there. I'm 10 miles from the Stihl shop here, they are an Ag centre and sell orange tractors. I actually bought my Stihl off the shelf at different orange tractor place when others said they were not available. No trouble at all. :D

[Seachaser]

My Stihl dealer sold Husqvarna until a year or so ago. Told me they buy their Husqvarnas everywhere else and expect him to warranty them. He couldn't compete with the big box stores.  

[ehp]

Another dealer is on its way out here. This time it's a husky and stihl dealer and one of the better shops around .  If this keeps up were not going to have any good saw shops left in my area