Shop air

[metalspinner]

Interesting you brought up the pressure relief valve, doc. 
One of mine needs to be replace as it begins to leak at a certain low pressure. My guy said that someone probably used it to release tank pressure. He said to never pull the ring to hand release the pressure. This will weaken the spring loaded mechanism. 
So I'm going to replace all four pressure relief valves. 2 @70psi, 1 @ 200psi, and 1 @250psi. 

And I just ordered all the tubing and hardware for the rapidair line system. Their website has a cool CAD tool to help design your system. You can draw your building, add your compressor size, and draw the loop with drops and accessories anywhere you want. The program will suggest the best line diameter then generate a shopping list. 

And FYI, if you take that shopping list to Amazon and buy it all there, you will find the components about 20% less expensive. Some of that savings came from buying several kits and filling in the blanks with missing pieces. 

[doc henderson]

can you post your CAD drawing for us and explain the need for the number and different pressures on the relief valves. :P

[metalspinner]

Doc, the relief valves are on different components of the compressor. Each of the pistons have a valve (70psi) the very top of the pump has a valve (250psi) and the pressure switch has a valve (200psi). 

I need to log into their website to see if I saved the drawing. I did print it, but the quality might not be very good??

[metalspinner]

Well, Thier website doesn't save the drawing, but I was able to make it again pretty quick. On the design page you can toggle betwen 2D and 3D images. I didnt draw internal walls. But the loop follows the wall around.



 

 

[doc henderson]

thanks.  I still am not sure of the pressure relief setup.  if the cylinders pop off at 70, how can you get more than that total.  usually a 2 stage has a large and small cylinder, I think.  

[metalspinner]

The compressor guy explained it to me, but I cant explain it back to you. Ill take a closeup picture tomorrow of the pump and piston.

[Walnut Beast]

I am not sure if any compressor is intended to have 100% duty cycle.

My Champion as some others have a 100% duty cycle.  I doubt they are intended to be run this way.

My compressor sits outside under the shop shed.  When I wired it up I installed a relay next to it with a remote toggle switch inside to turn it off and on.  While doing that, I also put a light next to the switch by the door so I know when its on.  The light reminds me to turn the compressor off when I leave the shop.

Mine and other compressors have a valve for continuous use.     For heavy use applications such as sandblasting, the continuous run feature is available. This feature keeps main
feed line open to eliminate numerous motor starts/stops and to help cool pump.

[Old Greenhorn]

Metalspinner, just want to raise  point. The system design you showed is made for water plumbing, not air. In a properly design air system all the air drops should come off the TOP of the pipe, not the side and especially not the bottom. AT the end of each long run should be a drip leg with a bleeder valve on the end. The long run should be sloped slightly toward this drip leg. All of this minimizes the amount of condensate that can make it to the point of use. Water does get into lines and it is heavier than air, so it lays on the bottom of the pipe and providing an outlet for it, other than into your tools, is a good way to design. I understand you have a drier in the design, but nothing is perfect and I just wanted to point out this detail for others.
 I have laid out and setup several large shops over my career and it kills me to see shops with an air systems that are essentially designed to get the most water to their tools and machine as possible. Bottom and side drops are just poor design. Certainly at the very least, put drip legs at the ends of you runs. Just my 2 centavos.

[doc henderson]

if you put a T to the regulator and run some pipe on down with a valve, you can drain it.  mine never has any water in the Ts and now I rarely open the valves.  my loop is in the basement so my runs go up as described by @Old Greenhorn but I have these drains in the basement by the sump pump.  I get water in the tank with the compressor, but no where else.  I can drain the water filter at the regulators.  moisture, but no water per se.

[Al_Smith]

In extremely large compressed air systems the compressors run all the time and exhaust the air when the pressure is reached. For example where I retired from it was 2 million 600 thousand square feet with 8" main air lines at 85-90 PSI air .It's all rotary compressors now but at one time it was huge Worthington piston machines with 600 HP synchronous electric motors .16" to 24"  cylinders at about 400 RPM .You could hear the system change between pump up and idle ,noisy .
As far as a small system I'd think you could use a check valve and either a solenoid valve with a pressure switch or   just a mechanical relief valve .It should work just like the unloader valve on a small compressor which I did with a solenoid and a timer for start up .Kind of a Rube Goldberg but it worked .  8)

[metalspinner]

Old greenhorn,

This compressor has an automatic "spitter" installed on the bottom of the tank. Then that air is going through a filter/regulator on its way into the refriderated dryer before going into the piping. The entire loop will be canted for water flow at 2 opposing corners. Each drop leg has a water release valve on it. At the spray booth, I have a large dessicant cartridge filter and each spray gun has its own water filter behind the quick connect. Any piece of machinery with an pneumatic connection will have its own water filter/pressure guage.

My back up's backups have backups. ;D

I understand the Tee pointing vertically for waterflow. This system does not have an affordable option to make that U-turn back down. If condensation proves to be an issue , I will have to bite the bullet and put a U-turn at the top. After the pipe is delivered, i will experiment with its bending capabilities. Maybe I can make the turn with the pipe alone and no additional fitings??

[metalspinner]

Here is an interesting fitting from their webpage...




 


I also just read in their FAQ's the 3/4" pipe has a 6" bend radius.

[kantuckid]

I use a far less costly but effective, TP style moisture controller, augmented by a piped moisture drop with a gate valve pointed into a shop vacant spot behind a tool box. 
I also use spray gun small plastic throwaway moisture filters on jobs requiring special attention. When I sprayed a hay wagon running gear I didn't bother much as not a fussy paint job.
 
My air compressor is a 60 gallon tank C-H from Walmart and seems to have 9 lives since 1990's other than maybe 3 pressure switches and couple of heat resistant seals on the hot pipe off the pump. Cheap and enough to run my air tools.  

[Al_Smith]

There's all kinds of tricks .I've laid out 100 feet of line then teed in  a 20 gallon tank and spray painted with it .I have a trap on the gun (Binks ) plus an inline ahead of it . The 3 HP will keep up with it on painting or running an air nailer but it runs nearly all the time . That old Binks will really lay down the paint .

[doc henderson]

I have used an air bubble as a reserve when using a concreter hammer a distance away.  there is always a lag in flow/pressure with a long distance of hose.  I got a single to triple tap I think at HF

[Al_Smith]

As far as demolition work I have a Hilti TE 80 hammer drill to use on smaller stuff .Larger I just rent a compressor with a 90 pound hammer  no more than I need one .
The neatest little compressor I 've ever seen was a special unit with a small four cylinder Ford engine that ran on two cylinders and used the other two to compress ..Not a new idea because decades ago they used a Model A engine to do the same thing .BTW Ford also used a 460 V8 on larger compressors .After working 29 years where that V8 was built I've seen at least a dozen or more variations of that engine too numerous to mention . 

[doc henderson]

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 


random 
 

random compressor and tank and adapters to use on the air bubble pics to follow up on the prev. comments I have made.  i went camping this weekend and just back.

[metalspinner]

I started with the install of the air piping last night. Four kits had enough hardware to get me most of what I needed. This was all supplemented with a few extras. I will have lots of leftover pipe.

This coiled pipe is a pain to deal with. I watched plenty of YouTube videos on straightening it. Long lengths just need to be fought with until they are "straight enough" or you just submit and give up.





 

 

All the hardware unpacked and the outlets preassembled



 

Each connection is taped and sealed with pipe sealant.



 

My system will be a loop. It starts here at the refrigerated air dryer then shoots up to the ceiling



 

The beginning and end of the loop is here at this tee fitting.



 

And here is the first drop to a multi outlet. This spot will be for the sand blaster.



 

Here is the multi-outlet. It has 4 ports. I only used two. This safety coupler is nice in that when the pressure is released, your fitting won't shoot out. It has a catch in it.



 

And this is where I left off last night. I'm a bit sore his morning from wrestling with the coiled pipe. It is really stiff and will hold its shape. That's both good and bad. :

[doc henderson]

is it pex?  may help to warm it and pull it out straight if you have the area.  also a tank after the cooler could improve flow if the dehumidifier restricts flow.  looks like a great system.  congratulations on going to the next level.

[btulloh]

Rapidaire piping and fittings. They make integrated air systems in 1/2" and 3/4".



Good job getting that pipe straight. I hear that's the hard part of using Rapidaire piping. 

I guess you found the kits to be more cost effective than buying ala carte fittings?

[metalspinner]

Much more cost effective than ala cart. Still needed more stuff just because I'm putting in about 15 drops. 😆

Doc,
This is the Rapid Air system. The plastic pipe has an aluminum core between layers of PE. 

 



 



  

Here is something I cobbled together this morning. And it seems to help quite a bit. It controls the coil and I use the tires of the trailer to flex the pipe straight. Both the top and sides of the tires are helpful in managing the bends. 

[Crusarius]

I highly recommend you turn the fittings so they point up, or at least flat. the way you have them, they will be a water catch.

[metalspinner]

The first corner curve. 



 



 

And the curve around each truss. The conduit clamps are needed to really hold the curvy areas. 




 

And the end of the line for today. The loop will continue above the garage then around the shop. But as you can see, I don't have the rest of the wood up yet. 



 

 Crusarious
I know, I know.  lol

To make that I turn will cost me $35 in fittings for each drop. Each outlet does have a drain valve at the bottom. I will have to just manage that manually. 



 

[Walnut Beast]

Looks nice but on where the tee is that's where I face it up and have a riser then come back down when I do copper. It keeps moisture low going to a drain point

[Walnut Beast]

They will also tell you that your air dryer should be placed farther away from the compressor. Looking good 👍