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T&G Knifes

Started by Ljohnsaw, May 09, 2024, 12:30:43 AM

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Ljohnsaw

I picked up an MP200 two sided planer for my cabin project. I need to make T&G for my floors, roof and walls. The floors and roof will be out of 2x pine stock an the walls out of 1x incense cedar.

I'm thinking of having one set of knives made with a double T&G. Full height for the 2x and drop down for the 1x.

Is there folly in this plan?
John Sawicky

Just North-East of Sacramento...

SkyTrak 9038, Ford 545D FEL, Davis Little Monster backhoe, Case 16+4 Trencher, Home Built 42" capacity/36" cut Bandmill up to 54' long - using it all to build a timber frame cabin.

Don P

I couldn't find 2x T&G knives a few years ago and ground a pair for a friend to do his on a shaper. It surprised me that it is not a stock pattern available somewhere. The only thing I can think of that might be an issue is think about the chamfer and the projecting "wing" that is cutting it, and then stacking the next pattern above that. You need enough meat on that wing that it isn't liable to break if it hits a knot wrong.

Southside

The tongue on my 2" T+G knives is significantly larger than the 1".  I don't see how you could fit both onto a pattern and have it work.  On your machine I believe the knives are secured with pins so you don't have the option of shifting the knife up or down either. 
Franklin buncher and skidder
JD Processor
Woodmizer LT Super 70 and LT35 sawmill, KD250 kiln, BMS 250 sharpener and setter
Riehl Edger
Woodmaster 725 and 4000 planner and moulder
Enough cows to ensure there is no spare time.
White Oak Meadows

maineshops

Can you put 2 1 in ping and grove on the 3 in bd?
Phil:4, 13

Ljohnsaw

I tried but can't figure it out.  I got a PDF attachment from MoldingKnives.com on the proposed design.  It is a single blade with a double profile.  It gets mounted in the holder that fits on the spindle.  You add or remove spacers above/below to adjust the height.

The tongue/groove is 0.313" deep by 0.313" tall.  The only flaw I see in the proposed set is they both are designed to cut with the face up.  I'd think you would need one up/one down so the wide knive can plane both sides of the board.
John Sawicky

Just North-East of Sacramento...

SkyTrak 9038, Ford 545D FEL, Davis Little Monster backhoe, Case 16+4 Trencher, Home Built 42" capacity/36" cut Bandmill up to 54' long - using it all to build a timber frame cabin.

Dewey

Contact W.M. Moore Profiles
They build knives per my Drawings..
Great company to deal with

scsmith42

Quote from: Ljohnsaw on May 09, 2024, 12:30:43 AMI picked up an MP200 two sided planer for my cabin project. I need to make T&G for my floors, roof and walls. The floors and roof will be out of 2x pine stock an the walls out of 1x incense cedar.

I'm thinking of having one set of knives made with a double T&G. Full height for the 2x and drop down for the 1x.

Is there folly in this plan?
I have some sets of knives like this (made by W. Moore profiles recommended by Dewey above).  In my instance I'm using them as side spindles in a 6 head moulder. 

But I'm baffled as to how you would mould a T&G profile with a 2 sided planer.  Wouldn't you need a 3 sided planer as a minimum to put a groove on one edge of the board?  I get how a tongue could be profiled using top and bottom heads, but how do you profile a groove?
Peterson 10" WPF with 65' of track
Smith - Gallagher dedicated slabber
Tom's 3638D Baker band mill
and a mix of log handling heavy equipment.

Ljohnsaw

So a flat knife is on the top. Spindle on the left. First pass does the tongue and top surface. Run all the stock through.

Swap spindle knife for groove, flip all stock over and "bottom" gets planed along with the other edge.

It would be cool to add a second side spindle to get three sides done in one pass...
John Sawicky

Just North-East of Sacramento...

SkyTrak 9038, Ford 545D FEL, Davis Little Monster backhoe, Case 16+4 Trencher, Home Built 42" capacity/36" cut Bandmill up to 54' long - using it all to build a timber frame cabin.

Ljohnsaw

So I called and talked to them. My idea won't work directly. Their method would be to have the groove be on the top for both passes and only the top surface would be planed. You rotate the stock keeping the top up. That insures a perfect match . If I want the backside planed, that would be a third pass. Nope

If I flip one knife so the V is on the bottom, that would work. You roll the stock. Top up for the tongue , top down for the groove. However, you can't lower the 2" knife enough to make 1" stock with the V groove on top. That's with my custom knifes.

So, I'm just going to get two sets. One for 1" and one for 2".
John Sawicky

Just North-East of Sacramento...

SkyTrak 9038, Ford 545D FEL, Davis Little Monster backhoe, Case 16+4 Trencher, Home Built 42" capacity/36" cut Bandmill up to 54' long - using it all to build a timber frame cabin.

Ljohnsaw

So a question for an expert, @YellowHammer !

I'll be planing 12-16' 2"x8"s. This planer comes with a whopping 17.5" infeed table 🫤.  There is an optional 48" table that can be used for infeed or outfeed. Not cheap at $415 each. I have several portable roller tables but past comments say a flat table is preferred over rollers, at least on the infeed, IIRC. Yes? If these would be good for both in and out, I'll probably buy one and fab the other. It has some special linkages to keep it level and supported as you raise and lower the table. I have materials to make a copy.
John Sawicky

Just North-East of Sacramento...

SkyTrak 9038, Ford 545D FEL, Davis Little Monster backhoe, Case 16+4 Trencher, Home Built 42" capacity/36" cut Bandmill up to 54' long - using it all to build a timber frame cabin.

Southside

My moulder and planer each have a 14' infeed and 14' outfeed table, skate rollers for 10' and pipe rollers for 4' closest to the machine.  Life is a whole lot easier when you can drop a 16' piece of lumber on the infeed and walk away. 
Franklin buncher and skidder
JD Processor
Woodmizer LT Super 70 and LT35 sawmill, KD250 kiln, BMS 250 sharpener and setter
Riehl Edger
Woodmaster 725 and 4000 planner and moulder
Enough cows to ensure there is no spare time.
White Oak Meadows

Ljohnsaw

Almost have the knives ordered. Should finalize tomorrow.

On to the next question. Chip removal. The manual calls for 2,000 m³/hr (1,177 CFM). A neighbor just gave me his Delta AP300. It 3/4 hp at 610 CFM rated. I have an AP400 that is 1 HP at 750 CFM rated. Both units have a 4" input. I plan to run venting out into the open.

The MP200 has a 4" side port and a 5" top port. I would run a collector on each port. I was thinking of picking up a Wen DC3401 or DC3474 (3/4 and 1 HP respectively) to use instead of my AP400.

Enough? Thoughts?
John Sawicky

Just North-East of Sacramento...

SkyTrak 9038, Ford 545D FEL, Davis Little Monster backhoe, Case 16+4 Trencher, Home Built 42" capacity/36" cut Bandmill up to 54' long - using it all to build a timber frame cabin.

customsawyer

I'm not familiar with those blowers so can't offer much advice on them. I know that CFMs are like horse power on equipment and more is better.
On the tables for my planer I use about a 3' pipe roller for the infeed and 10' for the outfeed. I set the infeed table at a little bet of a angle to help feed the board towards the fence. Here is a video I made of running some V-Groove paneling.

https://youtu.be/55sCFEhQES4
Two LT70s, Nyle L200 kiln, 4 head Pinheiro planer, 30" double surface Cantek planer, Lucas dedicated slabber, Slabmizer, and enough rolling stock and chainsaws to keep it all running.
www.thecustomsawyer.com

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