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Author Topic: Huber Norman Lumber, Marietta, GA  (Read 5825 times)

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Offline Don P

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Re: Huber Norman Lumber, Marietta, GA
« Reply #40 on: August 03, 2021, 07:00:40 PM »
We've started laying up stone on top of the 12" block wall and figured I'd show how I do it.
I attached scrap plywood to the block wall with tapcons and shimmed the 2x12 sill to a full 12" wide then deck screwed the ply to that, then a few studs on the basement side to keep it flat. I lay up the rock with mortar and every 6" or so of wall height I pour concrete between the stonework and the plywood. You can see a blockout for the mid girder under the first floor.



 

You can also see the new treated 8x8 replacement sill, then a 2x8 planed to 1-1/4 (9-1/4 x 8 total build height there... 2x10 joists will be sistered to the existing sagged joists. Then a 2x12 sill for on top of the block and to support the new joist ends. Allthread runs through the sills into the stone and is lapped and tied to rebar from the footing in block cells that are grouted. I can't prove it but I think it makes a fairly stout wall.
The future is a foreign country, they will do things differently there - Simon Winchester

Offline mike_belben

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Re: Huber Norman Lumber, Marietta, GA
« Reply #41 on: August 03, 2021, 11:38:17 PM »
Nice work, your persistence is impressive. 

Is that hydraulic thumb or whatever it was working out?  I cant remember what it was or where the thread is. Hyd Breaker?
Revelation 13:11-18

Offline Don P

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Re: Huber Norman Lumber, Marietta, GA
« Reply #42 on: August 04, 2021, 07:26:50 AM »
Well, the short answer is, we scared the hard out of it  :D. When I turned under kitchen wing the ground got softer, didn't need it. There is one more corner of digging to go but it looks soft,,, oooh boy thats how to jinx it  :D.

After looking at the pic above it stirred a thought so I googled opus incertum, yup, I didn't invent a thing, that is a roman wall building technique from around 200 bc, oh well, missed my calling again  :).

Whenever we get ahead enough for me to play for a week I'll bring the bobcat home and rent the breaker hammer, I've got some whopper rocks in wrong places around here.
The future is a foreign country, they will do things differently there - Simon Winchester

Offline mike_belben

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Re: Huber Norman Lumber, Marietta, GA
« Reply #43 on: August 04, 2021, 09:13:28 AM »
I will bet those mortared walls go up a heck of a lot faster, flatter and stronger than my junky irregular shaped drystacks have. The limestone one has been a 2 year tetris match that i can only stand a little of now and then. Never again.  Free isnt cheap enough! 








Revelation 13:11-18

Offline Don P

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Re: Huber Norman Lumber, Marietta, GA
« Reply #44 on: August 05, 2021, 08:08:12 AM »
Nice fitting! I try for tightish joints but every time I step back from my work I'm not real happy with my wide joints. You got rocks with a face, sweet. A whole lot of the rocks we pulled out aren't going back in the wall. I'll use the original rock on the most seen faces and I have some pretty typical sandstone on a hillside here that will probably work on the back if needed. All that rock we dug out is softer than I want to use. I think they raided the creek and floodplain, which is frowned on now. Sand and mortar aren't that expensive, it is a good sweat equity method of building if you got rocks. Well, man has been building with what is at hand since time began  :D.
The future is a foreign country, they will do things differently there - Simon Winchester

Offline mike_belben

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Re: Huber Norman Lumber, Marietta, GA
« Reply #45 on: August 05, 2021, 08:55:48 AM »
Thanks don.  Its funny how im not really happy with mine either! 

The limestones came in loads of fill that i picked out.  Theyre very irregular and require the labor of 10 sandstone walls to make 1 limestone wall after all the flipping and spinning and fitting.  Id say doing that one little wall alone wrecked my elbows.  I bet tennis elbow was the standard cause of death in pharoahs day!  

The sandstones are really junky by "crab orchard stone" standards but they were strewn about and im not one to let free junk go unused.  If i had someone elses money and was laying up nice clean-snapped mortared quarry rock from a pallet onto a cinder block backer.  Oh baby thatd go fast.   I may get into it someday but i need the kids to be a bit older and a few more things crossed off the list. 
Revelation 13:11-18

Offline Don P

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Re: Huber Norman Lumber, Marietta, GA
« Reply #46 on: December 08, 2021, 08:09:29 AM »
Well, how about that, I started this thread right at a year ago. So it takes 2 old farts about a year to chip out a basement  :D. It's certainly not the last rock in the wall but we have the main structure on its new foundation. The weather has been very cooperative, never thought we would get this far before it got too cold. I'm not super happy, I was moving on trying to beat winter so its rocks in a sea of mortar but the overall effect is "stone wall" so its all good. The 2 big bumps in the rock on the back are a bath fan and dryer vent I'll stick down there, hopefully they will kind of disappear behind a shrub or something.

I will need to find a 6" dia rock before spring, We'll collapse the pipe thru the wall and mortar in a rock. We hooked up the pipe and barrel stove down there yesterday and got it up to 60, well, 60 right by the stove  :D.



 


The future is a foreign country, they will do things differently there - Simon Winchester

Offline mike_belben

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Re: Huber Norman Lumber, Marietta, GA
« Reply #47 on: December 08, 2021, 08:21:44 AM »
i would never part with a stove that could thaw frozen pipes.  even if i was an old fart.  ;D
Revelation 13:11-18

Offline Don P

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Re: Huber Norman Lumber, Marietta, GA
« Reply #48 on: December 13, 2021, 09:57:15 PM »
I brought home the skidsteer to weld up a crack between the arms and dig for a leak in the lift/tilt valve plumbing... that is turning into a nightmare. Once we have it tightened back up I'll put the diggers on the fork rak and get the basement floor down to grade. Then chisel in subfloor drains to a sump. The chimney will take a 12" thick footing 6" larger than the chimney on all sides, then post piers for the floor girders. When all that is in we'll spread gravel, plastic and work our way out digging the footings for the last section of wall across the entrance ramp... and then we can pour the floor. Sometime next spring we'll build stone walls and stairs down the ramp into the basement. whew, talking through it I'm all bummed out again  :D.

Other stuff is happening on the farm. They have been donated a 3 sided planer and shingle mill and would like to find and set up a period early century sawmill. If anyone has layout or building ideas, pics of old farm scale setups, etc, I'd appreciate any input there.

This is a pic of the planer. Infeed, top head, outfeed which pushes through the 2 side heads. This was the original planer that set up Dixon Lumber Company. At one time if you bought an oak floor in this country, there was about a 1 in 4 chance it came from Dixon, anyway, it all started on that little planer.


 
I'm guessing it and the shingle mill would be in a separate shed from the sawmill... and I'm not really sure of the hp requirements on the planer... I've got a '35 Dodge flathead that might be the ticket turning a lineshaft that drops belts to both planer and shingle mill.

I've been told this 5 hp "Famous" engine ran the shingle mill and a gristmill that was also donated, but I think we'll use it to power the gristmill shed.


The future is a foreign country, they will do things differently there - Simon Winchester

Offline Don P

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Re: Huber Norman Lumber, Marietta, GA
« Reply #49 on: May 10, 2022, 06:06:57 PM »
I've been working on the kitchen wing of the old farmhouse. The kitchen is behind the tyvek covered part of the wall. I jacked and rebuilt the walls and diagonal sheathed that last week before rain so slapped that up fast. I did the remaining 10' entry/bath over the weekend. If you notice the roof edge and slope in relation to the windows on the main house in the pics above and in this one, I picked up this end of the roof 11" and the far end about 5 to get everything straightened back out, then built new walls under it, saving the panelled ceilings. Side bonus is I was framing in the dry all weekend.



 

Then we pulled the metal and saved it for outbuildings. You can see some of my temporary bracing in the attic. It had been remuddled and chopped by someone who was working way outside of his learning. DB is removing some of the novelty siding, the original boads of the board and batten siding are behind that. We'll try to pull them and stick them in the kiln for a bake and reuse inside somewhere. That'll give access to the house frame and we can tweak and treat it with borate while its open.


  

Just another day of destruction. Cleanup in the morning and hump 24' 2x12's up there after lunch. The 2x4 rafters were mostly chestnut so we'll pull them for later. This part also had a 4/4x8 raising plate with a heavy birdsmouth on the rafters. Like the main house the raising plate is in line with the building line rather than setting out to form the soffit. The porch rafters were scabbed onto that projecting rafter tail, which was essentially a 2x2 in chestnut, not much!  The chestnut was sawn from live trees, not wormy. I disconnected the porch roof, swung it down below us and tied it to the wall for temporary cover of our basement stair stonework, you should be able to see that difference in the first 2 pics.


The future is a foreign country, they will do things differently there - Simon Winchester

Offline Don P

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Re: Huber Norman Lumber, Marietta, GA
« Reply #50 on: May 10, 2022, 06:31:21 PM »
These images are from google book's "Building Age and National Builder", 1919. The images are generally close to the framing types in this old house.

The main house is braced frame, which is the right half of this sketch, the left is balloon frame, notice studs go through the floor.


 

The later kitchen wing is a blend of notions, where the original house was built by good carpenters. It shows that things were changing in between the 2 parts of the building. It has elements of what they were at the time calling a combination frame. It has almost become our platform frame at this point. Rim joists, subfloor, sole plate, then studs. One less unobstructed mouse and fire run.




By the time balloon framing with its long slender framing came in they realized bracing had to change. You stop seeing heavy posted corners and header posts with low diagonal bracing mortised or more often spiked. The thin 2x4 would simply bend if a brace handed it a side load. Use the entire wall as the brace and diagonally sheath it.
The future is a foreign country, they will do things differently there - Simon Winchester

Offline JRWoodchuck

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Re: Huber Norman Lumber, Marietta, GA
« Reply #51 on: May 10, 2022, 06:47:00 PM »
Awesome Don! Really really awesome! Thanks for taking the time to share. 
Home built bandsaw mill still trying find the owners manual!

Offline Don P

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Re: Huber Norman Lumber, Marietta, GA
« Reply #52 on: May 14, 2022, 05:08:04 PM »
I got some rafters and plastic on before the rain yesterday but still took some water on. I saw what seems to happen to every low brace I've ever encountered, they funnel water, rotting the brace and usually the area around it.


 

When I left today it was pretty well covered. I think that was about 45 sticks of what one visitor called "two by heavy" :D. You can see how I temporarily cantilevered it out 8' over the porch area. The overall span of that is 32' at 4/12 pitch. There will be kneewalls running on top of load bearing walls below and under the rafters basically starting from each corner of the tyvek and running back to the house. I've got plastic over the top and hoping the wind stays down till midnight when we should clear out.


 

This was getting me damp at the end and I hit a good shower on the way home. I'll plane some 18' pine boards tomorrow, no joints in a row so it should board up solid in no time. We'll cover it Monday, then detail it out. and take a few days, this was about day 14 of running for the roof.



The future is a foreign country, they will do things differently there - Simon Winchester

Offline Don P

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Re: Huber Norman Lumber, Marietta, GA
« Reply #53 on: May 17, 2022, 10:38:15 PM »
We had the well guy there retrofitting a pitless on the well, and while he had his little hoe there I asked him to run along the power conduit that was shallow at the house until it was deeper and rebury the entrance.

Well, it never got deeper and I can't turn a blind eye to that  :D. We've run all kinds of stuff over this, I've had the forks in the dirt more than once. I'm amazed we haven't hurt it.  I'll ride the jackhammer and shovel for awhile tomorrow. "Never time to do it right, always time to do it twice".



 

I took about 700bf of pine for the roof sheathing and had 2 sticks left. Didn't make out so well on the titanium, covered the back and front except I was that top row short in my leftover stash. Happily DB has a little leftover so they've made out well on the roof thus far. We're going to see what metal cost has done I'm sure.
The future is a foreign country, they will do things differently there - Simon Winchester

Offline Don P

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Re: Huber Norman Lumber, Marietta, GA
« Reply #54 on: June 03, 2022, 10:14:53 PM »
The day after I took that last pic of the open trench. The trench bisected the property from the old farmhouse to the pavilion with bathrooms, the path to the chickens and pigs, springhouse, garden. Yup I had a big mess open but theoretically a window to get it done in. I jackhammered the last rocks, laid the cable in the trench and am politely raking clean dirt on top till it's well covered before hopping on the machine and finishing the fill. Or that was the plan. I'm down in the trench a good 10 or 15' into doing it nice and I see the short bus pull in, an unplanned visit. I whistle at Mark to go help them and hop on the machine. He gives them a thorough donkey and cow tour and through the shops and breaks out the freeze pops till I pop around the corner that the coast is clear, just another day of fun  :D.

Anyway, we've got the roof framed and I'll probably have it detailed out tomorrow. We got the old roof out from under it now that the new roof will keep the diggings dry. The temporary posts are under the porch beam and then the roof continues down to cover the stone steps into the root cellar. There's still a lot of rocks to go. A pair of mini splits will tuck under the porch.



The future is a foreign country, they will do things differently there - Simon Winchester

Offline Don P

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Re: Huber Norman Lumber, Marietta, GA
« Reply #55 on: June 06, 2022, 07:27:53 PM »
I was getting ready to climb up to work this morning, till we looked up. A big rat snake was sliding around my new porch ceiling joists.  Our fearless director rescued the snake and relocated it and I was off to the races. After lunch, I'm back out on the scaffold and a second one comes sliding over my new work. I relocated it but I believe it was beyond rescue, and I needed to remove the siding from that wall anyway.

I got a few inside details of the roof framing. I spent Saturday on my knees in the attic.
This is a kneewall under the rafters to the left side. That wall is over the kitchen/entry wall below and over a wall and then footing in the basement, follow your load paths to ground. You've got to think it through from the top down but you have to build it in from the bottom up. Down towards the heel the ceiling joists span ~10' and lap onto the 22' long ceiling joists that span 14' over the kitchen. When things cross over bearing points those members should be blocked. Look under the kneewall, the lap calls for a certain number of nails for tension continuity across the rafter feet and then they are blocked over the bearing wall and the blocking is also nailed to the bottom plate of the kneewall. In the end I'll rip the ply and cover the kneewalls then board the floor with pine flooring we recovered from below. I'm building this wing as stiff as possible and then will run some rods through the second floor of the main house and cinch it to this rigid wing.





Those 22' joists that span 14' over the kitchen cross over that exterior kitchen wall and extend out 8' more to form the porch ceiling and the lower heeljoint of the rafters on that side of the roof. I'm still over blocking under this wall but the top is different. There are 2x8 rafter extensions sistered onto the main 2x12's. So one cripple is under the 2x12 rafter and one extends up to support the 2x8. The load goes down the exterior frame wall to the basement block wall below.




From the kitchen/porch door, looking under the ceiling joists, porch carry beam (which is really hanging from the cantilevered joists at this point). From there the 2x8 rafters and ceiling which will be exposed on the underside, continues on out to cover the stairs to the basement. The strips and plastic are to hopefully keep roof water out of the stair pit for the time being. You can see nice "show" blocking out on those exposed rafters over that furthest beam. Inboard of that, that cluster over the porch carry beam,,, uhh yeah, that's gonna have to wait till there's a porch floor and I'm comfy. The load path for those 2 beams will be posts on roughly 5' centers down to 16+" thick stair sidewalls that launch off of 2' wide footings. I'll use the bigger rocks from the original foundation that were too large for the basement walls.



 

I got one more downstairs of an uncluttered corner showing the poplar framing and board sheathing. I jacked the ceiling up a bay at a time and shot the ceiling boards to my new ceiling joists above.


 
Hmm, relatively uncluttered, you can't see the other corners  :D.
The future is a foreign country, they will do things differently there - Simon Winchester

Offline Don P

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Re: Huber Norman Lumber, Marietta, GA
« Reply #56 on: June 18, 2022, 11:08:20 PM »
The BO came out to inspect this past week and asked for some details for the file. I just sent them and a narrative but I hate to waste that many hours on one file in a folder somewhere, so here's the pics of the grandkids :D. It might help with what the photos don't show above.

He asked for a flashing/WRB detail and about the girder attachment.


 



and a section of what I was rambling about with stairs and rocks and porches :D.."send me a section view ::)"


The future is a foreign country, they will do things differently there - Simon Winchester

Offline taylorsmissbeehaven

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Re: Huber Norman Lumber, Marietta, GA
« Reply #57 on: June 22, 2022, 06:53:43 AM »
Thats quite a project Don! Good looking work, done right to last. A lot to be said for thinking things through. I find so many corners folks cut before me on remodels it kinda scares me. Be safe and watch out for those snakes!! :D Brian
Opportunity is missed by most because it shows up wearing bib overalls and looks like work.

Offline Don P

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Re: Huber Norman Lumber, Marietta, GA
« Reply #58 on: June 22, 2022, 07:33:26 AM »
Thanks, I appreciate all the attaboys I can get. Now for the egg on my face :D. In the narrative I turned in with those drawings I mentioned that I was waiting to hear back from Simpson on that porch hanger detail. I suspected they might not be happy with attaching through my diagonal board sheathing. They were not. My options are to remove pockets through the sheathing and attach the hanger to the 8x8 sill, or, posts to footings at grade and forget the hanger. We're going to clean off the basement wall footings and see if that is an option, if so setting the girders on posts with a tie from girder to sill for lateral support would do it and keep the flashing simple. Sizing beams is simple, failures are usually in those connection details.

Yeah, the patches and remuddling we have removed were downright scary. The roof over the kitchen had been chopped without understanding and was hanging by the nails in the sheathing boards. Termites holding hands  :D
The future is a foreign country, they will do things differently there - Simon Winchester

Offline moodnacreek

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Re: Huber Norman Lumber, Marietta, GA
« Reply #59 on: June 22, 2022, 08:17:17 AM »
If I had to guess where above photos where taken I would say upstate New York. Beautiful work.


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