iDRY Vacuum Kilns

Sponsors:

Being a parent and adult children.......

Started by Sedgehammer, October 12, 2021, 02:26:47 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Sedgehammer

Went to my mom's celebration of life last July. Was planned to run from noon to 4, then to the cemetery 10 minutes away. Ended up running past 5. Around 3:30 or so didn't see my 2 eldest. Didn't think much of it, as I wasn't really looking for them. Just figured they were in the crowd somewhere. 

We left for the cemetery. We were the lead car. Got there and just looked around to see who all came. I noticed my eldest daughter and eldest son not there. I also noticed my youngest brother not at the cemetery, but he was at the celebration the entire time. 

Grave side services were just getting done when he showed up just in time for pictures and a few minuets after he arrived, my 2 showed up. Pictures done and people mingling around my daughter walks up to us and I asked where she was. She said they went to the bar (theres a bar just down the street from where we rented the hall) and then she goes "no judgments".

What response should I have had in this situation ? 

I'll fill in more details after I get several opines.
Necessity is the engine of drive

sawguy21

Sad that they don't have any more respect for her memory  but they are adults and entitled to make their own decisions. Each of us grieves in our own way.
old age and treachery will always overcome youth and enthusiasm

beenthere

Brother and sister meeting at a bar prolly (could have) and "could mean" they have a good relationship and bonded better than being with the crowd. Good that they made the pictures for lasting memory.

Have several times raised a drink to toast the many good memories of past loved ones and friends. 

I'd suggest not judging them, as your daughter said. They have their own path in life to walk on now. 
south central Wisconsin
It may be that my sole purpose in life is simply to serve as a warning to others

florida

It means they have a different way of dealing with death and a whole different set of memories than you do. I've skipped a few funerals for those reasons so I agree with your daughter. However, funerals are mostly for the living and I would have had my feelings hurt just like you did.
General contractor and carpenter for 50 years.
Retired now!

mike_belben

its hard to say, you have a lifetime of experience with all the parties involved and we have a paragraph so theres no way any of us can give you a great perspective.  except to say that theyre youre family.  find ways to love them while you can.  satan loves breaking up families. 
Praise The Lord

Wudman

I've always believed that you honor a person during life.  You can't do a thing for them once gone.  I will frequently go to family night to pay respects and acknowledge the family, but not attend the actual funeral.  I have told my wife that I did not want a funeral.......the last thing I want is somebody walking by my casket and saying "Doesn't he look good?"  I've raised a glass to friends that have passed on......he would have wanted it that way and I am sure he was there in spirit.  

Wud
"You may tear down statues and burn buildings but you can't kill the spirit of patriots and when they've had enough this madness will end."
Charlie Daniels
July 4, 2020 (2 days before his death)

Tom King

I remember when I was about 17, at my best friend's (still is) Mother's funeral, and I was dating his Sister at the time, I didn't go over to talk to either of them.  I don't know why.  They were really a little put out, sometime later, that I hadn't come up to them at the funeral.  I still don't know why I didn't, but I still remember that day like it was last week, when it was really in 1967.

Sedgehammer

I'll add this for @sawguy21, @beenthere, @florida

The daughter had been up for the celebration of life for a full week and had been out with the eldest brother several times. She stayed at his house. If the whole family went to the bar to share a drink in remembrance, I can under stand that

@mike_belben I agree on what satan loves doing. He works that several ways
Necessity is the engine of drive

Roxie

I once got asked by my sister why my son wasn't at her Christmas party. My reply was that she would have to ask him, I didn't run his schedule since he's a grown man. 

Did you want them there for you or did you want them to do as you'd do?  They have their own pain to deal with in their own way. 

The goal of raising children is to make them independent and responsible for their own decisions and actions.  So congratulations on raising them to think for themselves and not just conforming to others expectations. 

Say when

Sedgehammer

Quote from: Roxie on October 12, 2021, 06:32:32 PM
I once got asked by my sister why my son wasn't at her Christmas party. My reply was that she would have to ask him, I didn't run his schedule since he's a grown man.

Did you want them there for you or did you want them to do as you'd do?  They have their own pain to deal with in their own way.

The goal of raising children is to make them independent and responsible for their own decisions and actions.  So congratulations on raising them to think for themselves and not just conforming to others expectations.
I wood have given the same answer and do give it

Not there for me. I am not personally bothered by anything they do

I agree with your statement about being independent and responsible for there own actions 100%
Necessity is the engine of drive

Roxie

Say when

Erik A

I don't know your family, so just thinking in very broad terms.

They can do what they want, they could raise a glass at any time, they can never be there for the part they missed, you can't make it up or do it later!

They were not there to help you or the other family members, which is sad!

Young adults today get "stressed" over the smallest things. They think there life is coming to an end when they don't have internet access, etc.!

There are things in life we do even when we don't want to for the others around us, my nephews treat my mom with no respect and it frustrates the *$:*$& out of me.

If it were me, I would use the no judgments line for about the next ten years when ever they wanted something!

Sedgehammer

@Erik A True on many accounts

I should add that she and my eldest son are extremely hard workers and have risen very well in their fields where they work. They aren't the triggered type at all. Which makes this even more frustrating 
Necessity is the engine of drive

snobdds

I wouldn't worry about it, life is too short.  I am familiar with expectations bestowed upon from the parential units. I have also seen how those same expectations have driven away people as they don't want the expectations to live up to. 

It's a fine line and I would error upon letting adults make their own decisions and not judging. 

Don't loose a kid over this...

Southside

I have been the black sheep of my family for 30 years or more.  Honestly I don't know why.  Yup I moved away and chased my dreams.  Not like I haven't worked hard and had some measure of success as a result, never been in trouble, wife had a successful career, etc.  Was at an uncles funeral a few years back and this girl asked me how I knew the deceased.  Told her he was my uncle, she asked who my dad was and when I told her she was shocked.  Said she worked with my sister, had been to my folks house for meals, "and I never..." then she got really, really, quiet.  About that time my sister came up to her, whispered in her hear and she was gone.  I laughed about it because I knew how she felt.  

Maybe somewhere along the way decades ago I did something that caused the reaction you had the other day, and they never got over it. Don't know.  

My dad passed away in August, had to fly from Richmond to Atlanta to Detroit to Providence to rent a car and drive the rest of the way as a hurricane had messed things up.  Needless to say it was a long, exhausting, trip.  Got about four hours sleep and walk into my folks house, was there two minutes and started getting torn apart about my dammed jacket pocket being wrinkled, almost walked right back out the door and headed for home, two more seconds and I would have been gone.  

Let it go, otherwise it will fester and grow into something ugly and nobody will know why.  
Franklin buncher and skidder
JD Processor
Woodmizer LT Super 70 and LT35 sawmill, KD250 kiln, BMS 250 sharpener and setter
Riehl Edger
Woodmaster 725 and 4000 planner and moulder
Enough cows to ensure there is no spare time.
White Oak Meadows

Sedgehammer

@snobdds not worried. Reason I posted this is to see how'd ya'll wood've handled it. I'm not losing a kid. My kid is losing her pa

@Southside sorry for your loss. I to am the black sheep of my family, save my parents and I dunno why either. Oh well, their loss. Oh, it doesn't bother me. I refuse to let things bother me that I cannot control. I've seen too many people ruin their lives over worry. 

With that all said, my wife instantly agreed how I handled it. A friend of mine though excoriated me over it, so I thought I'd get some other view points on it

Necessity is the engine of drive

sawguy21

I have been through it too. My sister and I were adopted separately and have never been close. Five years ago she told me I am not family, we haven't spoken since but it doesn't bother me. I am tired of trying to mend fences, tired of the drama. I ran into her son this spring while on a walk, he lives a short distance away. Neither of us knew the other was here so are getting reacquainted. My dad once told me he didn't feel he needed to be friends just because he was related which is quite true.
old age and treachery will always overcome youth and enthusiasm

snobdds

Quote from: Sedgehammer on October 13, 2021, 02:43:57 PM
 I'm not losing a kid. My kid is losing her pa

I hope you reconsider.  It will end up hurting you more than them...

mike_belben

im sorry to hear that sawguy.  thats pretty cold of her. 
Praise The Lord

newoodguy78

One thing I've learned through the years is accept people for who they are trying to get them to conform is a no win situation. I'm definitely the free range chicken of my family it's caused some problems throughout the years but oh well. I try to be a good person to those around me.
I've also been the guy in the parking lot with limited others while there was a funeral going on. Having a beer and telling stories about the person. Sometimes depending on who it is it just seems like a more appropriate way to send someone off.

SawyerTed

I've gotten into trouble a time or two expecting my siblings or my children to act in a way that conforms to my values.  Recognizing that they have different values helps explain a lot.  Doesn't mean we have to agree but it helps bring peace to a relationship.  Knowing up front there are differences in values helps avoid misunderstandings.  My children choose to do things differently than my wife and I did, they aren't wrong they are just different.  Sometimes I don't like it but I'd rather have my children than alienate them.  They ultimately have to live with their choices.  It isn't necessary for me to pass judgement, life, karma or their conscience will catch up to them. 

Hate the sin, love the sinner.  I'm fortunate my own parents did as much for me!
Woodmizer LT50, WM BMS 250, WM BMT 250, Kubota MX5100, IH McCormick Farmall 140, Husqvarna 372XP, Husqvarna 455 Rancher

sawguy21

Quote from: mike_belben on October 13, 2021, 05:19:34 PM
im sorry to hear that sawguy.  thats pretty cold of her.
It is. Her son tells me she has pretty much destroyed most of her relationships, he doesn't like her either,  but at 70 she is not going to change
old age and treachery will always overcome youth and enthusiasm

Sedgehammer

Quote from: SawyerTed on October 13, 2021, 08:08:54 PM
I've gotten into trouble a time or two expecting my siblings or my children to act in a way that conforms to my values.  Recognizing that they have different values helps explain a lot.  Doesn't mean we have to agree but it helps bring peace to a relationship.  Knowing up front there are differences in values helps avoid misunderstandings.  My children choose to do things differently than my wife and I did, they aren't wrong they are just different.  Sometimes I don't like it but I'd rather have my children than alienate them.  They ultimately have to live with their choices.  It isn't necessary for me to pass judgement, life, karma or their conscience will catch up to them.

Hate the sin, love the sinner.  I'm fortunate my own parents did as much for me!
I have a friend who is a farmer. They've done well. Kid's had a good life growing up. He and his wife is/went through that exact same thing. He and his wife are conservative. They raised thier kid's in a conservative home. They are a Christian. They raised their kid's in a Christian home. His daughter was conservative and a Christian before heading off to college. After college she acted like they (her parents) were so stupid, even though both her parents are brilliant. More recently she wood tell him how terrible he was since he's white and a male. Etc, etc

He tried to accommodate her over the years, so she'd keep a relationship with them. Not talking politics. Nothing. It got to the point where they'd have to refer to their grandson as gender neutral and that they wood have to put away the boy toys when they visited, as their grandson wood go straight to those toys when he was there

This 'relationship' was extremely tiring, as the 'rules' were always changing. My friend and his wife finally reached their breaking point and told her that they weren't changing their life to accommodate her any longer. They loved her, but If she wanted to still have a 'relationship' with them, then it was as they were and how she was raised

They miss her, but never felt better. The pressure to act a certain way was crushing. Depressive even

If one gives up who they are to 'please' someone, then there isn't any real relationship

I nor my wife will give up 'who' we are for our kids or anyone else. All I told her was 'yes, judgment'. She was utterly and totally wrong and she knew it. That's why she got mad. She was called out. I, nor my wife will condone that disrespectfulness to their elders. Will this mean that 1 or more of my kids won't come around at times. Probably, but the stress of being someone else when someone else is around is worse.
Necessity is the engine of drive

barbender

I'm not much of an accomadator, at least not in that scenario that you just described with your friends, Sedge. I've let it be known that this is our home, you know what we believe and how you were raised. You are free to believe and live as you please, but there are consequences in your relationships due to that. We love our kids dearly but I won't tolerate someone trying to turn our world upside down. 
  How would I have handled your situation? I don't know, it's hard to say without being there. But for the most part, if people were hurt and disrespected by their absence, they would've heard about it from me. If they were to emotionally distressed to be there it would be completely different, but if they just didn't feel like being there or some other shallow reason, I would be peeved!
Too many irons in the fire

Ianab

Tough call.

I'm not for burning bridges, but I'm also not really close to my extended family either.  Not that we are estranged, just it might be months between catching up. 

I'm also not big on ceremony and tradition either. "We do this because we have always done this..." Why? 
 
An overly religious ceremony unsettles me, because I'm there, and expected to participate in something I have no connection to. I can sit quietly through a church funeral or wedding out of respect, but after 3 or 4  hours I'd be looking for a break too. 

I can see being disappointed that they bailed, but i wouldn't burn bridges over it. You don't know how they felt about the ceremony. It's not worth bearing a grudge over. 
Weekend warrior, Peterson JP test pilot, Dolmar 7900 and Stihl MS310 saws and  the usual collection of power tools :)

Bruno of NH

I'm the black Rhino on my family. When someone needs help I'm the first one to help.
Some get togethers I don't get invited,  I'm not Coco butter enough.
Sheilas family gets upset when I can't make a family thing.
I have always had a hard time with the funeral thing.
I was raised Catholic and a funeral is a big deal.
Lt 40 wide with 38hp gas and command controls , F350 4x4 dump and lot of contracting tools

Roxie

Sedgehammer saying that she is losing her dad, puts the blame on her but the reality is that your unforgiving heart is to blame. This is your choice. 

I thought Christians were told to forgive. This hypocrisy is what turns people off to Christianity itself. 

You are making the mistake of a lifetime. You are showing her that your love is conditional. Is Gods? 
Say when

Sedgehammer

@barbender There was no distress. It was a good time. She was clearly enjoying herself. No one there was crying or being emotional. People were laughing and talking about this and that

@Ianab There was no ceremony. This was a celebration of life with a dinner, with beer (it was in Wisconsin, you drink beer with everything). Just hanging out talking with family, going through old pictures and related

@Bruno of NH Me to. Black sheeped. I am the first to help and have helped with 100's of thousands of dollars. Go figure

@Roxie You miss understand. As a Christian doesn't mean one rolls over when someone did something very disrespectful. The Lord doesn't forgive us unless we repent and ask for forgiveness. Yes, she is losing us. I still love her. That has not changed. But that love does not mean that if you do something wrong, that you will not be corrected for it. If that happened with your kid at her grand ma's celebration of life you wouldn't have said something? I didn't tell her she cannot call or come over until she apologizes. I just said what she did was wrong. That's it  

I will add this. As a parent of adult children, for me what changes is there no longer a punishment for wrong doings followed with an explanation why they were punished and then told they are loved and if they understand why they were punished. There's just 'that was wrong', 'you know better', etc. 
Necessity is the engine of drive

SawyerTed

Quote from: Sedgehammer on October 13, 2021, 10:21:14 PM
Quote from: SawyerTed on October 13, 2021, 08:08:54 PM
I've gotten into trouble a time or two expecting my siblings or my children to act in a way that conforms to my values.  Recognizing that they have different values helps explain a lot.  Doesn't mean we have to agree but it helps bring peace to a relationship.  Knowing up front there are differences in values helps avoid misunderstandings.  My children choose to do things differently than my wife and I did, they aren't wrong they are just different.  Sometimes I don't like it but I'd rather have my children than alienate them.  They ultimately have to live with their choices.  It isn't necessary for me to pass judgement, life, karma or their conscience will catch up to them.

Hate the sin, love the sinner.  I'm fortunate my own parents did as much for me!
I have a friend who is a farmer. They've done well. Kid's had a good life growing up. He and his wife is/went through that exact same thing. He and his wife are conservative. They raised thier kid's in a conservative home. They are a Christian. They raised their kid's in a Christian home. His daughter was conservative and a Christian before heading off to college. After college she acted like they (her parents) were so stupid, even though both her parents are brilliant. More recently she wood tell him how terrible he was since he's white and a male. Etc, etc

He tried to accommodate her over the years, so she'd keep a relationship with them. Not talking politics. Nothing. It got to the point where they'd have to refer to their grandson as gender neutral and that they wood have to put away the boy toys when they visited, as their grandson wood go straight to those toys when he was there

This 'relationship' was extremely tiring, as the 'rules' were always changing. My friend and his wife finally reached their breaking point and told her that they weren't changing their life to accommodate her any longer. They loved her, but If she wanted to still have a 'relationship' with them, then it was as they were and how she was raised

They miss her, but never felt better. The pressure to act a certain way was crushing. Depressive even

If one gives up who they are to 'please' someone, then there isn't any real relationship

I nor my wife will give up 'who' we are for our kids or anyone else. All I told her was 'yes, judgment'. She was utterly and totally wrong and she knew it. That's why she got mad. She was called out. I, nor my wife will condone that disrespectfulness to their elders. Will this mean that 1 or more of my kids won't come around at times. Probably, but the stress of being someone else when someone else is around is worse.
What an absurd story.  Nobody said give up who you are or what you believe.

I'll pray that wisdom and love prevail and your relationships are restored. 
Woodmizer LT50, WM BMS 250, WM BMT 250, Kubota MX5100, IH McCormick Farmall 140, Husqvarna 372XP, Husqvarna 455 Rancher

low_48

Sorry for your loss Sledgehammer. That's a tough one. I have my own weight to bare over my Mother's death in 2018. My Mom lived about 40 miles away. I handled all my Mother's affairs, mowed her yard, brought her groceries every week, found a nice assisted living place, cleaned out her home, moved her, on and on...... None of the Grandchildren ever came to visit her after she was moved from home. Said they couldn't handle her dementia, "It's just not Grandma anymore". Well it was still her, but with a melted brain. It was a time when she really needed family to bolster her  up. She left my brother and myself out of her will, said we both had plenty of money, and gave it to all the grandkids. Death can brings lots of hurt, in many ways!

Sedgehammer

@SawyerTed what's absurd?

If you wood, what wood you have done/said if your daughter walked up to you like mine did ? 

@low_48 thanks

That wood be hard. I know you didn't do all of that because you were expecting a payout, but the fact they threw her under the dirt and yet they were rewarded 
Necessity is the engine of drive

Tacotodd

SH, on that last line of your last post, YOU SPEAK THE TRUTH!!!
Trying harder everyday.

SawyerTed

What's absurd?  The story of the terribly naïve daughter and the whole idea that toys have some gender specificity which will be detrimental to the child.  And the whole notion that the parents had to give up being who they are.  Pride and "being right" have consequences as does being overprotective of a child. 

Sedge, you have to know your situation hits close to home for me.  I am 59 years old, I've raised both girls and a boy to adulthood, they are 32, 31 and 28.  From time to time they have disappointed me as I have disappointed them on occasion.  It happens, we are all flawed to some degree.  I only know One who walked this earth was not.

I lived something similar in January when my mother died and my dad had a major health crisis in the middle of mom's hospice care.  I prefer to keep details of my situation mostly private but it involved my two daughters and a conflict among us.  We all were grieving the coming loss of my mother and their grandmother and I dealing with a stressful health situation with Dad.  It wasn't easy dealing with the immediate issues and dealing with my children and their grief.  On top of that my siblings were being difficult as well.  

The whole situation made us all do things out of character.  Grief and a health crisis have a funny way of making people do unusual things that others don't expect, even things that are weird or disappointing to others.  There are so many raw feelings at times like that and it takes so very little to aggravate them.

The conflict with my daughters was over something that was relatively unimportant.  But it was an ugly big blowout of an argument.  My wife reminded me, in her gentle buy very to the point way, that my role as a husband, father and family leader was to find some way to reach healing of our relationships.  

After some prayerful consideration, I went to each of my daughters and we talked about it.  They had to understand my position and I and theirs.  Doesn't mean we agreed, it means we understand where the others were coming from.  We all accepted our parts in the conflict, forgave the others and now we have moved on as a family.  We are better for it.  

I have lived what you are going through.  Our adult children are exactly that, adults.  I've had to learn, that as much as I want them to have the values I have, they and their significant others are their own men and women.  That means they will disappoint us from time to time.  Doesn't mean we have to agree with them, but if we want them in our lives, it means we have to forgive them when they disappoint us, tolerate the differences and recognize we can be as disappointing to them at times.  Doesn't mean we have to give up who we are or what we believe.  

But if we lead by example and deed, our adult children will reciprocate the tolerance, forgiveness and understand there's a way to disagree without being disagreeable.

I imagine your daughter is hurting over the conflict as much as you seem to be.  I also suspect that she clearly knows she was disrespectful in her actions. You told her as much as you should have.  

Again, I pray for you and your family that wisdom and love will give you some restoration of a relationship with your children.  
Woodmizer LT50, WM BMS 250, WM BMT 250, Kubota MX5100, IH McCormick Farmall 140, Husqvarna 372XP, Husqvarna 455 Rancher

Sedgehammer

@SawyerTed Sorry for your loss

Thanks for the very heart felt explanation and pointed thoughts 
Necessity is the engine of drive

SawyerTed

Thank you. I too am sorry for your loss. 

It is one thing to lose the dying and something else completely to lose the living. 

I apologize if I am too "preachy".   The thought of losing my living girls scared me pretty badly.
Woodmizer LT50, WM BMS 250, WM BMT 250, Kubota MX5100, IH McCormick Farmall 140, Husqvarna 372XP, Husqvarna 455 Rancher

Corley5

Adult children are adults.  My father and I haven't spoken a 1/2 dozen words in a dozen years because of his control issues.
Burnt Gunpowder is the Smell Of Freedom

moodnacreek

Quote from: sawguy21 on October 13, 2021, 03:00:06 PM
I have been through it too. My sister and I were adopted separately and have never been close. Five years ago she told me I am not family, we haven't spoken since but it doesn't bother me. I am tired of trying to mend fences, tired of the drama. I ran into her son this spring while on a walk, he lives a short distance away. Neither of us knew the other was here so are getting reacquainted. My dad once told me he didn't feel he needed to be friends just because he was related which is quite true.
Man you and I could talk . [but this is not about us]

beenthere

Quote from: Corley5 on October 15, 2021, 07:34:34 PM
Adult children are adults.  My father and I haven't spoken a 1/2 dozen words in a dozen years because of his control issues.
Your comment reminded me of a summer I worked with fellow employee (Jim) and was invited to his home a few miles from our work site. Mother and father were German, and after dinner a big argument broke out between Jim and his father about father telling Jim how to do something. 
Jim was a 4 year veteran in the Navy and now going to college. Well into the argument, Jim who was remaining calm (not shouting and not agreeing) but not happy said to his Dad "When are you going to quit being my father, and be my friend"?
Jim and I left, but Jim said that after that he and his father enjoyed each others' company and friendship until Dad passed. 
Apparently father realized that he was the one needing to change from "father" to be his son's friend. 
Good thing to think about. It was a lesson for me and have tried my best to practice just that. All four of my adult children in their 50's are great friends with each other and with their parents. 
south central Wisconsin
It may be that my sole purpose in life is simply to serve as a warning to others

Sedgehammer

Quote from: SawyerTed on October 15, 2021, 01:41:07 PM
Thank you. I too am sorry for your loss.

It is one thing to lose the dying and something else completely to lose the living.

I apologize if I am too "preachy".   The thought of losing my living girls scared me pretty badly.

Thanks. Not too preachy. You were telling it just how you felt it.

she's been in and out of our lives so to speak in the past. didn't need me so didn't call me for several long spells till she needed me. I hate it anytime my kids want to be 'lost' from me, but i'll not beg or pander
Necessity is the engine of drive

Sedgehammer

Quote from: Corley5 on October 15, 2021, 07:34:34 PM
Adult children are adults.  My father and I haven't spoken a 1/2 dozen words in a dozen years because of his control issues.
Yes they are and like all good friends should be, they will tell you when you screwed up. It's even Biblical 
Necessity is the engine of drive

beenthere

QuoteI hate it anytime my kids want to be 'lost' from me, but i'll not beg or pander

Sorry to question you but if this is true, then I do not understand your original post in this thread.  ??

Hopefully you figure out what your problem is with your kids. 
south central Wisconsin
It may be that my sole purpose in life is simply to serve as a warning to others

Corley5

Don't be judgmental.  Especially with other adults. 
Burnt Gunpowder is the Smell Of Freedom

mike_belben

Quote from: Corley5 on October 15, 2021, 07:34:34 PM
Adult children are adults.  My father and I haven't spoken a 1/2 dozen words in a dozen years because of his control issues.
I am going to have a difficult time loosening the reins in the future but i know it will need to be done.  Its tough when you live in a farmers market of dope and have seen the happy baby pictures of the current hopeless addicts.  
Praise The Lord

Sedgehammer

Quote from: beenthere on October 16, 2021, 02:37:43 AM
QuoteI hate it anytime my kids want to be 'lost' from me, but i'll not beg or pander

Sorry to question you but if this is true, then I do not understand your original post in this thread.  ??

Hopefully you figure out what your problem is with your kids.
My daughter dated an atheist/socialist for 5 years. He almost switched her over. He didn't like coming to our house as we were too 'preachy', as we pray before most meals. I won't change who we are for anyone.  
Necessity is the engine of drive

Sedgehammer

Quote from: Corley5 on October 16, 2021, 06:35:36 AM
Don't be judgmental.  Especially with other adults.
So you woodn't have had any reaction if your daughter did this ? You wood've just smiled and ignored what happened ? Or how about when a friend calls up for advice and you wooldn't tell him he messed up ? You woodn't tell your son/daughter that they shouldn't live together before marriage ? What if you had a son that was marriad and only wanted to play video games all day and not work. Wood you not tell him this is wrong ? Do you have rules at your home ? Meaning a shirt on for eating at the table ? Hats off ? Nearly anything you deem wrong is a type of judgement on another person.  

My daughter in question moved in with the ashiest/socialist we told her it was wrong and the why's. Now every time we spoke to her while she was in this relationship we didn't bring it up. Now if I was beating her over the head about it every time we talked, yeah, that'd be wrong
Necessity is the engine of drive

Corley5

Burnt Gunpowder is the Smell Of Freedom

Corley5

It's called minding your own business.  Adults make decisions everyday and live with the consequences. 
Burnt Gunpowder is the Smell Of Freedom

barbender

I don't think that's right, Corley. I don't think it's being judgemental to point out to someone that the choices they are making are going to clash and cause issues in your relationship. I've been through this before- you're an adult make your own choices, but there are consequences. For instance, if my daughter wants to date a fool, don't expect me to treat him like a for real guy🤷‍♂️ The closer you are to me in my relationships, the higher my expectations are. They are free to date someone that may have wildly different beliefs than sun but it us more than likely going to create some distance. We all have expectations of each other...I don't suppose they'd be so keen on the "no judgement" if you went and cheated on their Mom, to use an extreme example. Don't you think that would create a bit of a rift? But then there is this notion that we are supposed to accept whatever they do, no matter what🤷‍♂️
Too many irons in the fire

Sedgehammer

Quote from: Corley5 on October 16, 2021, 01:35:48 PM
You're being judgmental.
Quote from: Corley5 on October 16, 2021, 02:03:05 PM
It's called minding your own business.  Adults make decisions everyday and live with the consequences.

Corely, you are judging me to say I'm being judgemental.....

I don't walk around telling people they are wrong or just go ask people why they are doing this or that

This is about a father/daughter relationship. Family

I've asked you several times and yet you've not responded on how you wood've reacted  to your daughter's disrespectfulness to not only her grandmother, but the entire family as a whole

@barbender to the point and how. I'm sure there'd be a whole lot of judging going on if one stepped out on mom.....
Necessity is the engine of drive

Corley5

  Adults make decisions.   Giving advice and telling another adult how they should live their life are two different  things.
  I'm  looking at this from the Adult Child perspective.  You're trying to control and interfere based upon on your judgements of the situation.  That's my option. 
  I don't have a daughter and you asked for the advice.
Burnt Gunpowder is the Smell Of Freedom

Roxie

You asked our opinion. You say you want to know what we'd say and then get ticked off when we tell you. 

What I would have said, absolutely nothing. No advice from me unless they ask. When you stop being hateful and critical you'd be amazed at how often they do ask. 

I'm beginning to understand how your daughter feels.  This has all been said in concern for you and all your doing is twisting it. 
Say when

sawguy21

You have to accept that you no longer control your kids thinking and actions, they are adults and free to make their own decisions. I sense you have lost their respect because you insist on micromanaging them and trying to enforce your values which to them are no longer relevant. It sounds like they have some growing up to do but that is now out of your hands, they need to learn the hard way. Please understand I am not trying to be critical, just suggesting you need to let go, treat them with courtesy and respect and allow them to return it.
old age and treachery will always overcome youth and enthusiasm

Sedgehammer

Quote from: Corley5 on October 16, 2021, 03:33:11 PM
 Adults make decisions.   Giving advice and telling another adult how they should live their life are two different  things.
 I'm  looking at this from the Adult Child perspective.  You're trying to control and interfere based upon on your judgements of the situation.  That's my option.
 I don't have a daughter and you asked for the advice.
Yes they do, both directions. Thank you for opining on how you'd have handled it
Quote from: Roxie on October 16, 2021, 04:27:32 PM
You asked our opinion. You say you want to know what we'd say and then get ticked off when we tell you.

What I would have said, absolutely nothing. No advice from me unless they ask. When you stop being hateful and critical you'd be amazed at how often they do ask.

I'm beginning to understand how your daughter feels.  This has all been said in concern for you and all your doing is twisting it.

No, not ticked. Corely never gave what he wood've done
No twisting. I was asking what each wood've have done. Instead I got a lot of judgment from those that said judging is wrong
Thank you for what you wood've done. That's what I was looking for
Quote from: sawguy21 on October 16, 2021, 05:23:14 PM
You have to accept that you no longer control your kids thinking and actions, they are adults and free to make their own decisions. I sense you have lost their respect because you insist on micromanaging them and trying to enforce your values which to them are no longer relevant. It sounds like they have some growing up to do but that is now out of your hands, they need to learn the hard way. Please understand I am not trying to be critical, just suggesting you need to let go, treat them with courtesy and respect and allow them to return it.

No problem on your point of view. I don't micromanage. Leastwise I've never been accused of it. I pretty much leave them alone. If she hadn't come up to me and said something, I've never wood've said what I said. 3 of my older ones call me weekly or more asking my opine on certain things or just to say hi. Trying to button hole me over this is a little unfair, as it's only with my eldest daughter. But I do appreciate your inputs
Necessity is the engine of drive

mike_belben

This is one of those times when that old generic useless answer really does ring true and will work as good as any.  

"Just do the best you can."

If you want her in your life, forgive her outloud and apologize even if she was wrong and you werent.  I dont know what id have done since im not there yet with kids age wise, but i understand the disappointment. 


Praise The Lord

Sedgehammer

Quote from: mike_belben on October 19, 2021, 07:48:11 AM
This is one of those times when that old generic useless answer really does ring true and will work as good as any.  

"Just do the best you can."

If you want her in your life, forgive her outloud and apologize even if she was wrong and you werent.  I dont know what id have done since im not there yet with kids age wise, but i understand the disappointment.
That goes against everything that's in me and everything that's wrong with the world. wrong is wrong. boy isn't girl, girl isn't boy. etc
thanks though
Necessity is the engine of drive

snobdds

I don't think you should die on this hill.  Abandon the trenches...

The more you try to make your kids the shadow of you, the more they push away.  It's been a parent/kid fact for generations.  

As long as they don't end up in jail, are responsible for their bills, and function in society in a responsible manner...you have to let them live their life on their terms, not yours. 

Again, don't you be the catalyst or the reason for your kids to detach...

mike_belben

Quote from: Sedgehammer on October 20, 2021, 10:32:36 AM
Quote from: mike_belben on October 19, 2021, 07:48:11 AM
This is one of those times when that old generic useless answer really does ring true and will work as good as any.  

"Just do the best you can."

If you want her in your life, forgive her outloud and apologize even if she was wrong and you werent.  I dont know what id have done since im not there yet with kids age wise, but i understand the disappointment.
That goes against everything that's in me and everything that's wrong with the world. wrong is wrong. boy isn't girl, girl isn't boy. etc
thanks though
oh i am 100,000% in agreement.  but god says its mikes job to forgive evil, and christs job to execute judgement on evil.  the outcome is always better when i stay in my appointed lane.
Praise The Lord

Sedgehammer

@snobdds agree w/ your statement. but, (isn't there always one) if my daughter will abandoned her family over such a simple statement that she brought up by the way, then i'm not sure i'm the one dying in the trenches

@mike_belben agreed
Necessity is the engine of drive

beenthere

Sedgehammer
QuoteWhat response should I have had in this situation ? 
I'll fill in more details after I get several opines.

You asked the Forum to be your analyst.. but you don't want to hear the answer. 
But your daughter is reacting to years gone by and she isn't the problem, IMO.

... the trench will continue to get deeper.. and now may be the time to get out for your own good.



south central Wisconsin
It may be that my sole purpose in life is simply to serve as a warning to others

SawyerTed

There is no moral high ground in withholding forgiveness.

I'll leave this here - Matthew 18: 21-22
Woodmizer LT50, WM BMS 250, WM BMT 250, Kubota MX5100, IH McCormick Farmall 140, Husqvarna 372XP, Husqvarna 455 Rancher

Sedgehammer

Quote from: beenthere on October 20, 2021, 02:52:06 PM
Sedgehammer
QuoteWhat response should I have had in this situation ?
I'll fill in more details after I get several opines.

You asked the Forum to be your analyst.. but you don't want to hear the answer.
But your daughter is reacting to years gone by and she isn't the problem, IMO.

... the trench will continue to get deeper.. and now may be the time to get out for your own good.
I didn't ask anyone to judge me on what I did. I asked what each of you wood've done. I also never said I'll do what the majority of you said you'd have done

As to your analysis. There's background that's not been mentioned that wood prolly influence one's opine differently, but that's something I'm not going to get into. I will say though that she has had this off and on relationship with all her siblings also.

I should've added this sooner. I raised her and her 2 brothers since they were 4, 5 and 6. Their mother was and still is a bar fly. Practically lives there still. She encourages them to join her life.

I will not encourage that behavior, nor condone it, no matter the cost

I appreciate everyone's input
Necessity is the engine of drive

Sedgehammer

Quote from: SawyerTed on October 20, 2021, 03:58:51 PM
There is no moral high ground in withholding forgiveness.

I'll leave this here - Matthew 18: 21-22
Your right, but I'm not withholding it. If she called me today I'd not even mention it
Necessity is the engine of drive

mike_belben

Praise The Lord

Bradm

I went back and reread the first post again, and one thing that I think some here have missed is when Sedge's daughter said "Went to the bar ... no judgments", without Sedge having actually made a comment (according to the post as only Sedge and his daughter were present for the conversation).  These kinds of statements are a passive agressive method to attempt to shift where fault and blame lie - especially when one's conscience is heavy.  She knew exactly what she was saying, and why she was saying it, when she said it; I will even go so far as to assume that she knew what Sedge's response would be before she said it.

Sedge, had she not said "no judgements", would your reaction have been different?  It saddens me that your daughter appears to have taken the path that she has, but never stop praying and never give up hope that she will find her way back.

I'm an adult child of a parent, and I know that I would've said very much the same as Sedge and possibly more (especially when they say "no judgments"). 

Sedgehammer

Quote from: Bradm on October 20, 2021, 06:11:36 PM
I went back and reread the first post again, and one thing that I think some here have missed is when Sedge's daughter said "Went to the bar ... no judgments", without Sedge having actually made a comment (according to the post as only Sedge and his daughter were present for the conversation).  These kinds of statements are a passive agressive method to attempt to shift where fault and blame lie - especially when one's conscience is heavy.  She knew exactly what she was saying, and why she was saying it, when she said it; I will even go so far as to assume that she knew what Sedge's response would be before she said it.

Sedge, had she not said "no judgements", would your reaction have been different?  It saddens me that your daughter appears to have taken the path that she has, but never stop praying and never give up hope that she will find her way back.

I'm an adult child of a parent, and I know that I would've said very much the same as Sedge and possibly more (especially when they say "no judgments").
My wife, 2 little kids, my mother in law and my sister in law were all present. She walked up and I said "where were you, we didn't see you"? Wasn't snarky at all, as I had no idea where she was at that time. Just asked a simple question I had thought.

Definitely woodnt've have said what I said. She threw it in my face and your right, she knew where I'd be with that comment with all the family around. I raised her. If she hadn't said that, I prolly wood've said "hmm, that's nice" with it being snarky.

I don't control my adult kid's lives. Typically I don't say anything unless asked, although I have said something when I saw something very destructive.
Necessity is the engine of drive

Percy

Been following this thread for days......this song really hits home for me in situations such as this....hope it helps anyone who need it.


The Living Years (2005 Remaster) - YouTube
GOLDEN RULE : The guy with the gold, makes the rules.

Tacotodd

Beautiful song. The biggest hit they had in my mind. Every time I hear it, reminds me of my father and our circumstances. It brings tears to my eyes because it's EXTREMELY similar!
Trying harder everyday.

Gere Flewelling

Thanks Percy! What an appropriate song to go with this thread.  :'(
Old 🚒 Fireman and Snow Cat Repairman (retired)
Matthew 6:3-4

JJ

Thanks Percy, I needed a reset in my perspective..
I have been also following this thread as am unhappily dealing with sibling about my dad's remains.

Wish she would come off her high horse, as what she plans leaves the majority of the family out including his widow.

        JJ

Thank You Sponsors!