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Author Topic: I'm stumped, Carolina Buckthorn, but no..  (Read 439 times)

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Online Old Greenhorn

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I'm stumped, Carolina Buckthorn, but no..
« on: September 26, 2021, 11:02:21 AM »
OK, I am stumped. I have about 6 or 7 or these in ages from saplings to semi-mature trees. They have a beech-like leaf.



 

The bark is deeply grooved and is a lighter color than most local trees, almost light  tan.


 

Some of the branches grow out and down before they go up, which is either an environmental anomaly or just weird.



 

The tree drops a LOT of small blue berries this time of year and I can't say that the critters are too interested. These have a small dot on the bottom rather than the star you would see on a Blueberry, also they seem just a tad less round than a Blueberry.



 

The only ID I can come up with is Carolina Buckthorn, but that just can't be right as we are WAY north of the range for this tree. 
 Anybody have any ideas? I am thinking these are junk trees and I would like to this them out and let the birches grow up better. But I don't like cutting anything I can't identify. This area is overgrown and choices need to be made.
Tom Lindtveit, Woodsman Forest Products
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OK, maybe I am the woodcutter now.
I can work with wood, but I am NOT a Woodworker, yet.

Offline Texas Ranger

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Re: I'm stumped, Carolina Buckthorn, but no..
« Reply #1 on: September 26, 2021, 12:44:29 PM »
Black tupelo
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Online Old Greenhorn

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Re: I'm stumped, Carolina Buckthorn, but no..
« Reply #2 on: September 26, 2021, 05:17:37 PM »
Well TR, you could very well be correct and probably are but two little things are bothering me. First, the leaves on my trees do not get that shiny dark green color on them (with and oil like finish) and second I am at the very tip top hairy edge of that tree's range. I counted the stalks and I have 8 of them in a 20 foot span, so yeah, they could have been planted for fence row, but I don't know. You ID is spot on except that color thing is digging at me. If you are correct, I am not sure what I could do with them, but for sure I have to thin out the small ones. Nothing good can come from that density.
Tom Lindtveit, Woodsman Forest Products
Oscar 328 Band Mill, Husky 450, 372 (Clone), Mule 3010, and too many hand tools. :) Retired and trying to make a living to stay that way. NYLT Certified.
OK, maybe I am the woodcutter now.
I can work with wood, but I am NOT a Woodworker, yet.

Offline WDH

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Re: I'm stumped, Carolina Buckthorn, but no..
« Reply #3 on: September 26, 2021, 07:00:19 PM »
Yes, blackgum.  Those fruits are not berries at all, but are drupes which have a pit like an olive or cherry.  Bite down on one and check it out.  
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Re: I'm stumped, Carolina Buckthorn, but no..
« Reply #4 on: September 26, 2021, 08:16:21 PM »
Are the berries from a black gum edible? 
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Online Old Greenhorn

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Re: I'm stumped, Carolina Buckthorn, but no..
« Reply #5 on: September 26, 2021, 08:19:15 PM »
Not really. Very acidic with a big seed nut.
 I have tons on the ground, the critters are not very fond of them either.
Tom Lindtveit, Woodsman Forest Products
Oscar 328 Band Mill, Husky 450, 372 (Clone), Mule 3010, and too many hand tools. :) Retired and trying to make a living to stay that way. NYLT Certified.
OK, maybe I am the woodcutter now.
I can work with wood, but I am NOT a Woodworker, yet.

Offline Don P

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Re: I'm stumped, Carolina Buckthorn, but no..
« Reply #6 on: September 27, 2021, 07:27:35 AM »
Another giveaway on blackgum is when you look at the branches you'll see 45 degree odd angles pretty much all over the place. Which seems about right, the tree flips back and forth about that amount laying down crossgrained interlocked wood. The bipolar tree  :D. I need to take down 3 or 4 in the back yard. It will be high waste but I'll probably saw full or better sized 2x6 and 8, borate and dry. firewood my way through that and keep what makes it for timberframe splines that will not split. That is my niche for using that unique property of an otherwise pallet wood. I imagine in a machine room an end block floor of it would work well... its finding those uses. I'm good, don't need any more, I have a several lifetime supply of splines  :D.
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Online Old Greenhorn

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Re: I'm stumped, Carolina Buckthorn, but no..
« Reply #7 on: September 27, 2021, 08:56:45 AM »
Anybody know the scientific name for this tree? I found it in one of my field guides, but not the other.
Tom Lindtveit, Woodsman Forest Products
Oscar 328 Band Mill, Husky 450, 372 (Clone), Mule 3010, and too many hand tools. :) Retired and trying to make a living to stay that way. NYLT Certified.
OK, maybe I am the woodcutter now.
I can work with wood, but I am NOT a Woodworker, yet.

Online Old Greenhorn

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Re: I'm stumped, Carolina Buckthorn, but no..
« Reply #8 on: September 27, 2021, 09:02:09 AM »
Found it: Nyssa sylvatica
Tom Lindtveit, Woodsman Forest Products
Oscar 328 Band Mill, Husky 450, 372 (Clone), Mule 3010, and too many hand tools. :) Retired and trying to make a living to stay that way. NYLT Certified.
OK, maybe I am the woodcutter now.
I can work with wood, but I am NOT a Woodworker, yet.

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Re: I'm stumped, Carolina Buckthorn, but no..
« Reply #9 on: September 27, 2021, 03:55:35 PM »
The drupes from blackgum and water tupelo are an important food source for wood ducks. 
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Re: I'm stumped, Carolina Buckthorn, but no..
« Reply #10 on: September 27, 2021, 07:39:27 PM »
At times the squirrels will party down on the fruits too, seems they usually discard the outer layer and eat the seed. 

Also the hollow trunks make important refuges for all manner of animals. Pileated woodpeckers, bats and all sorts of terrestrials. Seems a good burn in early age will promote a hollow gum which can persist for many, many years.


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Re: I'm stumped, Carolina Buckthorn, but no..
« Reply #11 on: September 28, 2021, 04:16:05 PM »
Or the old bee gum. The country honeybee hive.
I used it for a workbench top in the shop, it isn't a particularly handsome wood but it is tough.
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Offline ajsawyer

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Re: I'm stumped, Carolina Buckthorn, but no..
« Reply #12 on: September 30, 2021, 03:16:59 PM »
Another giveaway on blackgum is when you look at the branches you'll see 45 degree odd angles pretty much all over the place. Which seems about right, the tree flips back and forth about that amount laying down crossgrained interlocked wood. The bipolar tree  :D. I need to take down 3 or 4 in the back yard. It will be high waste but I'll probably saw full or better sized 2x6 and 8, borate and dry. firewood my way through that and keep what makes it for timberframe splines that will not split. That is my niche for using that unique property of an otherwise pallet wood. I imagine in a machine room an end block floor of it would work well... its finding those uses. I'm good, don't need any more, I have a several lifetime supply of splines  :D.
Might want to check out the wood carving forums, they like tupelo wood.
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