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Skid steers

Started by Redhorseshoe, October 21, 2021, 11:09:38 PM

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Redhorseshoe

My tractor with loader I've been using around the mill is no end to handy but just doesn't have enough muscle for lifting packs of lumber.  As such I'm looking for a skid steer but don't know how big of one to get.   My tractor has a working limit of about 1,200 lbs on the forks.  I know one guy who uses an 80hp terex around his mill but don't know if I need one quite that big.  I know bigger is always better but what's big enough to get the job done? 

barbender

I have a Case 1845c, it is around 6500 pounds I believe. It is very handy, 60 hp I think. I can lift packages of 100 finished dimension pine 2x4x8 without any issue. 16' of the same will stand it on it's nose unless I have the over the tire tracks on, which give a lot of counterweight.
Too many irons in the fire

Crossroads

I believe my 65hp Gehl weighs about 7800. The working capacity is 2700 and the light in the tail end is 4200. It's been a while since I've read the specs so forgive me if I'm off on anything, but I think I'm close. It's a track machine and is a bit hard on the ground, but I like the stability. It's not a fair comparison to judge it against my 18hp Kubota, but there's really no comparison. For log handling and lumber handling the 65hp is plenty, but when it comes to moving dirt, I wish I had more power. 
With the right fulcrum and enough leverage, you can move the world!

2017 LT40 wide, BMS250 and BMT250,036 stihl, 2001 Dodge 3500 5.9 Cummins, l8000 Ford dump truck, hr16 Terex excavator, Valley je 2x24 edger, Gehl ctl65 skid steer, JD350c dozer

ladylake



 You cant beat a Volvo or JCB with the side door around the mill. No getting out under the arms which is dangerous . My Volvo mct125c will lift a 870bf green stack of WO , and have picked up a log over 5000#.  Steve
Timberking B20  18000  hours +  Case75xt grapple + forks+8" snow bucket + dirt bucket   770 Oliver   Lots(too many) of chainsaws, Like the Echo saws and the Stihl and Husky     W5  Case loader   1  trailers  Wright sharpener     Suffolk  setter Volvo MCT125c skid loader

SawyerTed

It's overkill at 99 hp for just around the sawmill yard but because I use it for so many other things the Cat 299D works well here.  It's a heavy machine at + or - 11,000 pounds.  But it handles big white oak logs without groaning. 
Woodmizer LT50, WM BMS 250, WM BMT 250, Kubota MX5100, IH McCormick Farmall 140, Husqvarna 372XP, Husqvarna 455 Rancher

stanmillnc

I've got a 68hp Bobcat T550 and it's perfectly sized for my operation. Can pick up about any log that I would want to have on my mill. Moving around stacks of lumber are not a problem. Also the T550 is a radial path lift machine, which I prefer to the vertical lift loaders. The radial lift path allows for greater reach, which is beneficial when loading and unloading logs from the mill. And they have greater pushing power. The vertical lift machines are more common as they are better for reaching high as opposed to outwards (loading dump trucks, dumpsters, etc.). You can quickly observe the difference in machines by looking at how the arms are setup - there is pivot joint linkage in the vertical lift machines.

My previous loader was 49hp and it was a little undersized. Had to make smaller lumber stacks than I wanted and couldn't load some logs without help of the hydraulic loader arms on my mill. I would think 80hp or greater would be overkill for most small sawmill operations.

nativewolf

Also a track vs no track question , debated to death on lots of forums but basically cost of tracks and wear parts vs the options a track system gives (lift more, bad ground advantages, etc).  Not wanting to go down that rabbit hole but something you should consider.
Liking Walnut

YellowHammer

I'm actively looking also, more at a Compact Track Loader (CTL).  I've decided that the more hp the better considering every single time I try to buy a piece of equipment, I keep trading up until I get to the top limit.  

That would be my piece of advice to the OP, go big, and pay for it once.  It has happened to me with sawmills, tractors, trucks, etc.  So I'm focused on the 100 hp class.

Dealer proximity and practice is a major issue.  For example, I looked at the JCB side entry and they are nice.  However, the nearest JCB/Volvo dealer is in Chatanooga, more than a couple hours away, and after in depth discussions with him, even a warranty call is $500 for mileage (they charge both ways) and $500 for labor for the mechanic team to travel to service the machine here in Alabama, as his dealer warranty doesn't cover mileage, nor does it pay for the mechanics time while he is driving.  ?????????  The warranty only covers the cost of the warranty while he is on site and on the clock.  Ain't that a kick in the pants??  So if my $100 doo dad on my brand new $90K machine fails under warranty, they will gladly fix it and I'm out a grand anyway. Nope, not me.  That's a non starter. 

On the other hand, my New Holland dealer, who only sells Kubota CTL's, (tells something about NH machines) doesn't charge a dime for labor or transport on warranty calls but they are only a few miles away.

I have also found there is a difference on the details of the warranty and also the extended warranty.  Some have extended warranty coverage on the DPF systems, some have a reduce warranty, or some don't warrant some critical parts at all (like the EGR valve). 

So another piece of advice:  do the research.     
YellowHammerisms:

Take steps to save steps.

If it won't roll, its not a log; it's still a tree.  Sawmills cut logs, not trees.

Kiln drying wood: When the cookies are burned, they're burned, and you can't fix them.

Sawing is fun for the first couple million boards.

Be smarter than the sawdust

Patrick NC

I use a cat259d ctl  almost every day at work. Great machines and will lift a lot. Only complaint that I have is getting in and out. I'm a fairly big guy (6'3, 260lbs) and if I'm in and out a lot during the day it can get tiresome. I've used the same machine around the mill and it will pick up way more than it should.  Visibility can be a little tough sometimes if you have a large log or stack of lumber on the forks. 
Norwood HD36, Husky 372xp xtorq, 550xp mk2 , 460 rancher, Kubota l2501, Case 1845 skid steer,

Satamax

Guys, just one question, over here in the french mountains; huge tractors are unsellable.

Stuff in the 120/200 hp range, nobody wants these.

Are these cheap where you are? I guess in the great plains, they're not. But in more hilly places?
French CD4 sawmill. Latil TL 73. Self moving hydraulic crane. Iveco daily 4x4 lwb dead as of 06/2020. Replaced by a Brimont TL80 CSA.

Tom the Sawyer

Other than my personal car, dealer warranties have never been a consideration for any of my equipment (all bought used).

When looking for something to move things around the mill, my first criteria was the capacity of my mill.  It was manufacturer-rated for logs up to 36" diameter and loads not to exceed 5000 pounds.  I figured that anything I bought should be able to manage those parameters.  Anything more would be overkill, and even those at the limits weren't that common.  I figured that if a client brought me a log that was within my capacities (for practical purposes I have limited that to 30" and 4000 pounds), that I better be able to handle it. 

I ended up with a piggyback forklift (Princeton Teledyne D-5000), lifts up to 5000 pounds, flotation tires, turn on a dime, great visibility, and doesn't tear up my gravel lot.  I also have a skid steer to back up the forklift (Bobcat S250).  It has a tipping load of 5750 pounds but I hardly ever use it for logs.  It has a heated cab but the door limits your ability to get out if the load is more than a few inches off the ground, it tears up the ground, and the visibility is horrible.  Other than doing some grading or moving the mill out from under cover for mobile jobs, it gets no use.
07 TK B-20, Custom log arch, 20' trailer w/log loading arch, F350 flatbed dually dump.  Piggy-back forklift.  LS tractor w/FEL, Bobcat S250 w/grapple, Stihl 025C 16", Husky 372XP 24/30" bars, Grizzly 20" planer, Nyle L200M DH kiln.
If you call and my wife says, "He's sawin logs", I ain't snoring.

scsmith42

I have a John Deere 270 skid steer.  It weighs 8500 lbs, has 82 gross hp and an operating load rating of 2,800 lbs.  I would not want anything with a lower lifting capacity (but I work with a lot of large diameter logs).

If I was in the market for a new CTL today, my top two choices would be a large Kubota or Takeuchi.  The JCB's with the side door would be worth looking into as well, but the Takeuchi and Kubota both have a great reputation for quality and have some very powerful machines.
Peterson 10" WPF with 65' of track
Smith - Gallagher dedicated slabber
Tom's 3638D Baker band mill
and a mix of log handling heavy equipment.

YellowHammer

Quote from: Satamax on October 22, 2021, 11:04:53 AM
Guys, just one question, over here in the french mountains; huge tractors are unsellable.
Are these cheap where you are? I guess in the great plains, they're not. But in more hilly places?
Not that I've seen, they are are bank breakers, big payments here in Alabama.
YellowHammerisms:

Take steps to save steps.

If it won't roll, its not a log; it's still a tree.  Sawmills cut logs, not trees.

Kiln drying wood: When the cookies are burned, they're burned, and you can't fix them.

Sawing is fun for the first couple million boards.

Be smarter than the sawdust

boonesyard

We have a Kubota slv95, big machine, but never have an issue moving anything around the yard, wonderful rig. What I also like about the Kubota is they are still pilot controls. Very smooth and not jumpy like our other fly-by-wire machines which most newer machines have gone to.
LT50 wide
Riehl Steel Edger
iDRY Standard kiln
BMS 250/BMT 250
JD 4520 w/FEL
Cat TH255 Telehandler
lots of support equipment and not enough time

"I ain't here for a long time, I'm here for a good time"

barbender

Stan, I think you are mistaken regarding part of the comparison regarding vertical vs radial lift. Iirc, there may be a point in the lifting arc of a radial machine where it reaches farther- but at just that point. The whole vertical part of the vertical lift machine refers to the fact the the bucket pivot point travels up in a vertical plane. The radial machine's pivot point follows an arc, so it reaches the farthest horizontally from the pivot of the loader arms. On the ground, I can say from personal experience that vertical lift machines reach both higher, and farther out. The drawback is all of the extra linkages and such. 
Too many irons in the fire

YellowHammer

I'm currently looking at the Kubota SLV97-2 (Big entry door, not a ton of legroom and near 100 hp and the Deere 333G (more cab room, smaller door, more hp, reversing fan, better lifting).

Actually I'm looking at all of them, and I'm big on buying new, with full warranty and dealer service ("Come get this thing, it ain't running") and versatility away from the mill, on the farm or property, for use as mulching, road and fence maintenance etc.

I have found that one of the biggest obstacle to sitting in one is actually getting to sit in one.  Most dealers are out of stock.  
YellowHammerisms:

Take steps to save steps.

If it won't roll, its not a log; it's still a tree.  Sawmills cut logs, not trees.

Kiln drying wood: When the cookies are burned, they're burned, and you can't fix them.

Sawing is fun for the first couple million boards.

Be smarter than the sawdust

Bruno of NH

Lots of guys in my area run ASV and like them alot.
The cabs look very small to me.
Guys on u tube like the Takeuchi machines. 
I looked at a wacker/newson it had a lot I liked about it.
My friend runs one of their compact wheel loaders for the highway department and likes it.
Lt 40 wide with 38hp gas and command controls , F350 4x4 dump and lot of contracting tools

mike_belben

Go big.  Bobcat s300, cat 299, kubota 95, case 90XT, new holland LS190 etc.  If you are a holder-onner id go with rubber tires and OTT tracks as needed.  


Long term track frame ownership gets spendy.  Someone just mentioned only getting 200hrs from an $1800 track. Then theres frames, idlers, tensioners, final drives, rollers..  Forget all that. The skid steer was invented to GET AWAY FROM undercarriage expenses.  4 tires is under a grand and lasts for years if youve got a plug kit. 
Praise The Lord

Bruno of NH

Case has some giant skid loader coming out this fall
Lt 40 wide with 38hp gas and command controls , F350 4x4 dump and lot of contracting tools

mike_belben

DL550B?   Ive been waiting to hear about those.  That and the kobelco bladerunner are some real impressive crossovers.
Praise The Lord

230Dforme

Good evening
In response to your post, you mentioned only lifting
of material. Skid steers have many other uses 
obviously 
From a previous business, I have a Gradall 524
forklift, 6000#, extendable boom, 4WD
It is extremely useful across the board
I would like to have a skid steer too, but the
prices asked for used are steep, and they are tough
to maintain / repair
I am a bit surprised that rough terrain fork lifts
are not mentioned more on the forum 
I bought mine used 30 years ago and still going 
strong 
I have a number of very good pieces of heavy equipment that have been purchased for less
than than I can buy a skid steer of questionable 
value and condition for
Just my observations 




.

btulloh

Yes, rough terrain forklifts are great. You give up some versatility but get a better functioning forklift. Around here I don't see them for a reasonable price for a decent used one. I keep looking though.

What type is yours?
HM126

Walnut Beast

Quote from: Bruno of NH on October 22, 2021, 05:43:21 PM
Case has some giant skid loader coming out this fall
It's a TV 620B it's weight is 16k and only 114 hp. Way under powered and will sink like a rock in soft ground. Bobcat has a big T96 coming out. But the King of the hill ASV 135 Forestry will be Released in December it's weight will be 12990k and 132 hp with the MAX cab 

Larry

A couple of guys that I saw for have CTL's.  One is a Bobcat T650 and the other is a new, but little smaller Kubota.  I really like the AC and stereo on the Bobcat!  Both max out between 500 and 600 board foot.  The guy with the Bobcat hires a helper to stick and stack as I saw.  With 600 board foot of 8 or 10' lumber on the forks the driver is completely blind.  A second person must walk alongside to guide the driver.  By the end of the second day the work site is either a dust bowl or a mud pit.  The Bobcat is really loud with high flow on, one must crank the stereo a couple more notches.

I have a 6,000 pound lift Moffett truck mounted forklift.  It can get off road but not as good as a 4 wheel drive pickup.  Side shift and the forks extend.  It can do most of the work around a sawmill except for two things.  No grapple to pick logs out of trailers with sides, and sometimes its tricky dumping slabs.  Oh, and no stereo!  I got my lift about 10 years ago for $7,500 and haven't put a penny in it for repairs.  My friends are both in the skid steers for close to 50 grand.
Larry, making useful and beautiful things out of the most environmental friendly material on the planet.

We need to insure our customers understand the importance of our craft.

btulloh

7500 is a great price for a moffet like that. Nice.  If I could find one for $10k around here I'd be all over it. Not finding one though. 
HM126

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