Toeboard travel?

[Satamax]

Hi everybody. 

Guys, just a simple question.  I need to make myself some toeboards for my mill. How much should i make these travel? Six? Eight inches? Less? I know I know i need at least 3 between the very bottom position where the log rests onto the dog bars. And the top position, where cants rest 1/2" under the top of the dogs. Blade travels about 1/2" above the dogs. So there cannot be interference. But when opening a log parallel to the bark, i might need to clamp only one end in the dogs, and raise the other more.  What would sound sensible to you? That's for short logs, 10' to 20' If i do any longer, i'll get back to the old method of using wood blocks! :D 

[Magicman]

I doubt that mine raise more than 3"-4" above the sawmill bed.  When I need more I slide one or two 2X8's between the toe board and log as necessary.  Not a problem.

[Joe Hillmann]

I don't have toe boards on mine but I don't know if I have ever used anything thicker than 3 1/3 inches thick as a wedge to raise one end of the log.  I would think for 99% of sawing you would be fine with 3 to 4 inches of travel above the log bunks.

[ladylake]

 I'd make them rise at least 6".  Steve

[Satamax]

Thanks a lot guys.


Now, the question is. I have big 5x5" square profile for the moment on the bed. Which i flip up or down, to act as a rest. On which i lay the cants when up. I would like to reuse those. 

What do i make? Scissor type, like scissor car lifts. Pantograph type? Or just two rams under those square profile? 

[Satamax]

What i have in my head! :D 

https://www.leroymerlin.fr/produits/outillage/machine-atelier/treuil-cric-et-palan/palan/palan-a-chaine/pont-elevateur-a-ciseaux-3-t-hauteur-de-levage-960-mm-3x380v-mw-tools-sl300-89126549.html

[Old Greenhorn]

Get what you can out of the drive system for your toe boards. Nothing nicer than having a weird log and having the stroke to make it work.
 I tried cutting this log from 180° form the shown position, but the toe boards would not reach high enough. So I opened it up in this position.


 

[Crusarius]

I asked this question years ago and the majority of the responses said 4". I would prefer 6. one thing I have thought of for my sawmill was to use a scissor jack on a platform next to a bunk. can use a drill to raise and lower easily. ebay has 1000 pound scissor jacks for very reasonable and have a long stroke on them.

I know 1000 pounds seems low but your only lifting one end of the log.

[fluidpowerpro]

My dogs are hydraulic so when I need to raise one end of the log, I lower the dog, go under the log, raise it up with the dog, then put a shim under the log. I've never shimmed more than 4" but would still build with at least 6. Even though I can do it with my dogs, I'm still considering someday adding roller toe boards that have the rollers powered. That way I can adjust the log position length wise on the mill.

[Satamax]

My dogs are hydraulic so when I need to raise one end of the log, I lower the dog, go under the log, raise it up with the dog, then put a shim under the log. I've never shimmed more than 4" but would still build with at least 6. Even though I can do it with my dogs, I'm still considering someday adding roller toe boards that have the rollers powered. That way I can adjust the log position length wise on the mill.

Thanks a lot for your replies guys. What i was showing in the previous post.  A scissor car lift. I will try to find one cheap. And if i manage well, i could also use it for log turning. 
Fluidpowerpro, Do you often need to adjust? I have 47 feet of bed.  And place pretty much where i want with the crane. Mind you, it's slooooooooooow! 

[thecfarm]

If I was making one, I would give it twice the length I think I would need. Don't need it all, don't raise it all the way.  ;)
Some have put a roller on the top too. I have never used one, I just use a hyd jack on my manual mill, but the roller sounds like a good idea.

[GAB]

Satamax:
Your statement about 47' of bed should have been stated earlier.
I was in agreement with 3 to 4", however with that length of bed I'd suggest 6 to 8".
If you attempt to saw a 40+ footer down the middle depending on the log taper you may need 6 to 8".
GAB

[Magicman]

Not only is the length of the bed going to affect the height of the toe board, you very well may need additional support to keep it from sagging.  When sawing long stuff, I will raise the top end toe board to the proper height and then gently raise the other enough to support some weight to prevent sag.

I doubt that I need over my sawmill's toe board height more than 3-4 times a year and during those time, a spacer is all that is needed and it drops away when I lower the toe board.  Those times are almost always sawing an odd shaped log.

Remember that you are only raising the top end ½ of the diameter difference between the butt and top end.

[fluidpowerpro]

Fluidpowerpro, Do you often need to adjust? I have 47 feet of bed.  And place pretty much where i want with the crane. Mind you, it's slooooooooooow!

Not very often but there are times, especially when it still has bark on it where it would be nice to be able to position the log so it rests on the bunks a certain way. Once it's a cant you can slide it easier.

[jpassardi]

I use an old rugged scissor jack that works well, powering it with a cordless drill makes it easier.

[Crusarius]

make sure it is a drill and not an impact driver. the threads do not hold up to the impact.

[Satamax]

I use an old rugged scissor jack that works well, powering it with a cordless drill makes it easier.

Ok. I was looking at modding something like this with a small hydraulic cylinder.  
Guys, thanks a lot for your replies! 

[Sawmill Man]

A little extra height is nice when trying to put your forks under a big timber that you are trying to off load.

[customsawyer]

I have cut more than my fair share of 40' timbers. All I had was the regular toe board roller that comes on WM. I've never actually measured how high they lift but it was enough. At that length you also need to make sure you have the strength to lift those big guys. They get heavy.

[Satamax]

Well, found à pair of air jacks from Hunter engineering. In france, weird! Will see how handy this is. In a few weeks, when they reach my door. 



 

 

[Crusarius]

those are designed to pickups semi's and busses. I think they may be minor overkill

[fluidpowerpro]

Because that is a pneumatic lift, I would expect it may bounce a little and not hold your log in an exact position. Each time you remove a flitch, the weight will change and it will raise. This is all because air is compressible. You could run low pressure oil in the system and it will be much better. Just dont exceed the pressure rating of the air bags.

[Satamax]

Because that is a pneumatic lift, I would expect it may bounce a little and not hold your log in an exact position. Each time you remove a flitch, the weight will change and it will raise. This is all because air is compressible. You could run low pressure oil in the system and it will be much better. Just dont exceed the pressure rating of the air bags.

Dogs will do the holding. This is just to raise or lower the logs. And if it doesn't work, hydraulic it goes! :D Now, there is no going back, they've been paid for! Weight wise, i should be all right. I can lift a piece of larch 34 ft long, and 32 inches in diameter. 

[Crusarius]

those will work great for lifting trucks for service. But doubt they will work for sawmill.

[customsawyer]

Give them a try. As long as they aren't holding the weight they might be fine.

[jpassardi]

We had those on the alignment rack where I used to work. They have mechanical detent locks about every 3/4" as I recall. Hunter Engineering makes top end equipment.

[Satamax]

We had those on the alignment rack where I used to work. They have mechanical detent locks about every 3/4" as I recall. Hunter Engineering makes top end equipment.

That's good to know. 
Thanks. 

[Satamax]

We had those on the alignment rack where I used to work. They have mechanical detent locks about every 3/4" as I recall. Hunter Engineering makes top end equipment.

I checked today on mine. First detent is 5cm or 2 inches, second one 2 inches above too, and third one is 6.5 cm or about 2.5 inches above. That's latched on the metal stops, with air removed. So 6.5 total travel. 
@Fluidpowerpro, since those are metal on metal detents or latches, i might not have too much bouncing problems.  ;D