I got my mill back in October and got it set up and running well enough to cut some lumber and build a shed to hold the tools overwinter. (Thanks again to @nybhh (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=38169) for the roof sheathing boards just before the snow came which allowed me to finish enough to close it in. It still needs battens. Details on that debacle can be found elsewhere on the forum.) anyway, my first effort was at best, a 'slap-dash get it done' kind of thing.
So now I have spent the winter reading and learning here on the forum and feeling very much the greenhorn. I am trying to start fresh. Tonight I just had a little time after work so I went down and uncovered the mill, it fired on the third pull with the old gas in it. :) I rolled the blade for a little bit then let it idle for a while to run in a bit. Then I rolled a log I left cued up back in January and never worked on. It's 12" on one end and 11" but a little odd shaped on the other. The pith is about an inch off center at the small end. Centering the pith on a manual mill with no hydraulics or a helper is pretty tough, but I did it. Then I ran out of time and had to head up for dinner. Tomorrow I hope to start cutting. My hope is to get a 5 1/2' timber from this with the pith centered and use whatever is around it for 4/4 boards. I need two of these timbers to match the existing 6" PT posts I have under most of the mill bed. I didn't see the point in buying two more when I can make my own. Part of my plan to make the mill bed more stable, which is an issue.
So, at this point if I had a question it would be this: Any of you fine folks with a manual mill and no hydraulics figure out an easy way to center the pith for your first cut? Maybe I should ask "An EASIER way".
Quote from: Old Greenhorn on May 06, 2019, 08:10:34 PM
So, at this point if I had a question it would be this: Any of you fine folks with a manual mill and no hydraulics figure out an easy way to center the pith for your first cut? Maybe I should ask "An EASIER way".
When I bought my manual mill in 2007 I also ordered an option called "toeboards". Mine are hydraulic using a manual jack. They are used to raise the log for doing just what you are trying to accomplish. I ordered two so that I could always have at least three points of a log or cant touching the bed (one end on the mill and the middle and other end on toeboards). Another way is to use a scissor jack under one end of the log or cant.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/16714/Toeboard.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1557189307)
I bang a felling wedge under the log on the furthest out bunk on the small end. I've found one inch normally gets me pretty close but I have an old scissor jack in the barn that works pretty well too.
X2 on the toeboards. First you need to level the pith - that's what the toe boards are for. I just use a scissor jack or small trolley jack. Anything to adjust the level of the pith at one end to match the other end.
For sawing 6x6's, etc. I just use a sharpie to make tic marks on all four sides of the pith that defines the timber I'm sawing. I have some gauge blocks for each size, but you can just use a tape measure. If there's side lumber to take, I'll set the saw blade to the top tic mark, then index up the number of boards to come off and then saw down to the top tic mark. Same thing on the second side. Sides 3 and 4, I usually run the head down to the finish level for the timber, measuring off the bunk, then index up for the side lumber and saw down to the finish cut.
Don't forget to readjust your toe board for the second side!! Don't forget to remove or lower the toeboards for sides 3 and 4!! (Nobody has EVER forgotten this step. :D)
It's actually a lot faster than writing this. It's not elegant or tricky, but it works well for me. We'll see what others are doing. This must sound pretty archaic to the setworks crowd, but that's the deal. It really is easy and fast after you get a flow going.
By the way - you'll need to oversize a little to allow for shrinkage during drying. How much depends on the species and the target size of the timber you're sawing. Maybe an 1/8 to 3/16 over for a 6x6, depending.
@John Bartley (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=6714) that toe board is slicker than deer guts on a door knob! Not sure if it would fit my mill, they don't have enough detail on their site and I note that they have no US outlets. None the less your suggestion of a screw jack, as well as the others after you make me feel stupid. I should have thought of that. I wonder how many of those I have scrapped over the years.
NYBHH the felling wedge is also a great idea, I had one ten feet away and never thought of it this evening. I did grab a wedge of filtch and used that. Gotta go scrounge in the shop for that nice screw scissor jack I saw laying around a few months ago.
You guys are great.
Quote from: btulloh on May 06, 2019, 08:56:58 PM
Don't forget to readjust your toe board for the second side!! Don't forget to remove or lower the toeboards for sides 3 and 4!! (Nobody has EVER forgotten this step. :D)
OK so now you have me. My thinking (I have not done this yet) is that you set the toe board for the first cut to get the pith level, then you flip the log 180° and rest on the first cut, this makes two parallel sides. Now you will have to set the toe board on the third side, then remove for the forth. Is that right? As I type this I realize that you probably set and cut side one, the roll 90° and set the toe board to center the pitch again, then remove the toe board for 3 and 4 sides.
So did I understand you correctly? Just trying to work this out in my thick head.
Hey OG,
If you are thinking of getting ambitious and building a set of toeboards, I'd be happy to post up a bunch of photos for detail for you. Lemme know.
cheers eh?
Quote from: Old Greenhorn on May 06, 2019, 09:12:28 PM
Quote from: btulloh on May 06, 2019, 08:56:58 PM
Don't forget to readjust your toe board for the second side!! Don't forget to remove or lower the toeboards for sides 3 and 4!! (Nobody has EVER forgotten this step. :D)
OK so now you have me. My thinking (I have not done this yet) is that you set the toe board for the first cut to get the pith level, then you flip the log 180° and rest on the first cut, this makes two parallel sides. Now you will have to set the toe board on the third side, then remove for the forth. Is that right? As I type this I realize that you probably set and cut side one, the roll 90° and set the toe board to center the pitch again, then remove the toe board for 3 and 4 sides.
So did I understand you correctly? Just trying to work this out in my thick head.
Either way works and yes, you have it correctly.
Quote from: John Bartley on May 06, 2019, 09:14:20 PM
Hey OG,
If you are thinking of getting ambitious and building a set of toeboards, I'd be happy to post up a bunch of photos for detail for you. Lemme know.
cheers eh?
My time for milling is precious and short. My time for fabricating is even less, but important stuff, I make the time for. I am trying to thread the needle between 'quick and dirty' and being elegant and thorough. I'd love to see some photos, but don't want to make a project for you. Just something to give me an idea of what your approach is. Thanks for offering.
The scissor jack will work fine until you have some spare time to fabricate. I find spare time can be kinda sparce, so I'm still using the scissor and trolley jacks. It gets easier the more you do it, so doin' it is the most important thing.
Quote from: btulloh on May 06, 2019, 10:01:12 PMIt gets easier the more you do it, so doin' it is the most important thing.
This is good advice for a LOT of things, which reminds me, it's high time I picked up my mandolin again.
One member put a roller on top of the scissor jack.
Centering the pith is "nice to do" especially cutting timbers, its usually not needed. Keep a couple of various thickness pieces of sticking handy, pry up one end of the log with a peavey or bar and slide the sticking under. Frank C.
Quote from: John Bartley on May 06, 2019, 09:14:20 PM
Hey OG,
If you are thinking of getting ambitious and building a set of toeboards, I'd be happy to post up a bunch of photos for detail for you. Lemme know.
cheers eh?
I'd like to see them. I like making stuff! I did welding and fabrication for 6 years, and like to keep up my skills, I am rounding up stuff for, trailers, log arch, and siding jig. One more project would be great!
The WM LT 15 has a cool way, I've used it. They sell a little metal wedge that slips over the bed rails and I used a cant hook as a lever and simply lever the log up a few inches and slide it in.
I also welded a rail under mine and used a car jack for a while, it works fine. Since the car jack has rollers under it, it will move back and forth on the rail.
There are lots of ways to make some toe boards and there are many examples on here scattered through various threads. Do a search and see what you come up with. There are probably quite a few examples in in the SAWMILL MODS thread.
If you've got room to put a rail underneath like YH is talking about, the little trolley jack solution works well without a lot of fab work. I have a couple of the really small trolley jacks and find them to be really handy, both around the mill and everywhere else. They show up on sale all the time at HF, Northern, etc. for 25-30$.
Although I have a Lucas swing mill, I saved this photo just because I thought it was a good idea.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/11185/toe_boardi.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1261940891)
Yup, definitely gonna do something about toe boards one way or the other.
Got down there tonight for a short bit, worked until dark, we had 1/2 of rain in an hour just before I went down. So there was about 30 gallons of water in the tarp. Anyway, still getting my sea legs back I got a stupid mistake out of the way and forgot to tension the blade. Popped it off the wheels 8" into the cut. 10 minutes lost resetting the blade and back to work. First slab went off easy and quick. Second 1" slab easy also. 3rd slab was now getting close to 12" wide and the mill started shaking from the load (common problem for me), but I got it off, nice board, pretty maple and very clean, 1 small knot.
When I flipped the cant 180 (and remembered to remove the toe wedge) I noticed there was a huge bow in the bottom face that I had just cut. Perhaps over an inch in the middle. This log is 12'6". I stopped at this point because it was dark enough that I couldn't read the scale. I wanted to think on what I saw before proceeding. I also wanted to see if it would relax in 24 hours, I left all clamps off.
Today's questions:
1) Are logs known to 'relieve themselves' i.e. 'bend' in the direction of the first side that is slabbed?
2) If you cut on the opposite side and take a couple of slabs will it lay back flat? I took one thin opening cut.
3) I have no idea how I could pull this flat on this mill. Before you ask, I cannot confirm, at this point if the cut itself was bowed. Not sure how I would prove that since I rolled the log already. (That's not a question, but I would like to hear thoughts.)
4) I need this timber to put under the mill track. I would have to do some finer measurements, but it could be that I can cut this in half now and mill each one separately to get what I need. I was going to cut two pieces after it was milled. Any thoughts on that? I still have to measure to see if I could do this.
5) I realize that my bed may be at least part of the problem if it has moved over the winter. These beds aren't very stiff and subject to the supports they have. It's just angle iron. I will check (again) that too as soon as I can. (not a question, just a detail.)
6) Is it reasonable to think I am never going to be able to mill anything square and straight over 6' long? (Please tell me that isn't the case.)
I think I have already asked too many questions. That's enough for tonight.
Hey OG. If the bed is arched or swooped, then I believe the center of the slab produced after flipping should be thicker or thinner than the ends. Prob. need a long level and or straight edge, or even a piece of string to check for bed flatness along the length. mine will shake or vibrate if not supported by all 6 jacks. I know that branches (as opposed to trunks) will come with tension or compression wood. I would stack flat and see how it turns out when dry. slight deformity can be milled out with joiner/planer or back on the mill to flatten. As requested, I will tell you that "you will mill straight and square over 6 feet!!!" 8) 8) 8) count-em, 6 feet.
ps the part about a "log relieving themselves" I am not touching with a... ten foot pole! :D :D :D
pss, I guess even if the bed is swayed or if their is spring in the wood, it depends on if it is contacting the mill bed
Well today was a long day for an old man. I got up before 5 and was on the road by 6, drove out an hour to see my favorite GOL instructor before he started his class today. I had some questions that have been burning for a while and he helped me out. Also ran in to @nybhh (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=38169) who was taking the class. Worth the trip. Then after another stop I was back home by 9am and tried to get the lawn tractor started ( the grass is 12" high in some spots and the rain does not stop!), no joy there, back on the charger.
Anyway, I headed down to the mill, the goal is to get it square and true and cut a flat square cant. This is what I found:
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2471.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1557614246)
In case you can't tell this tarp covers the work area and is normally about 20' in the air. It picked up about 200 gallons of water in the down burst we got last night.
It took me over an hour to get the 200 gallons out without tearing the tarp, cut a new support pole (the previous one was a 20' hemlock stalk that snapped off from the weight. I finally got it to look like this:
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2475.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1557614289)
SO then I could finally get to the task at hand, true up the mill. First I had to make 2 6"x6" x 6' timbers to put under the bed and finish the length off (I ran short last fall). So I did that, set the blocks underneath and got them lined up pretty close. I drill some hole through the frame to lag it down securely but I will need more lag screws. I hope this will cut down on the wobble. Then I stretched some lines from end to end to see where it sat. Turns out, one side is pretty good, but the other side has a long swoop in it. I milled some long wedge boards to use as opposed jack planes against each other for fine adjustment. I've got the big swoop coming up and flattening out, now I have to drop the far end, and there we will be going back and forth for a few hours.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2478.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1557614315)
I ran out of steam at around 3:30. The leveling work is something I can do in the early hours without disturbing neighbors. So I came up and this time got the tractor started, so I spent about two hours mowing. It looks terrible, but it's a start. Maybe I can go over it again tomorrow.
But now, it's beer-thirty.
Yea, GOL class was very good. Thanks for the recommendation/suggestion. Definitely some different techniques to get used to and some bad habits to break but I think these methods lend themselves to a lot more control than what I was doing before. He taught me a cool technique (plunge down the center of the face cut splitting the hinge in half, and clipping side sapwood) to stop the ash trees from splitting and screwing up the but log. I've had that happen a couple of times on nice trees. I ask him about that after one of the other students had an ash split splinter up 4-5 feet because his hinge was a little too thick but it was not off by much and I've honestly had that happen several times on ash. Its good insurance that's gonna save some butt logs for sure.
I use that same technique on smaller trees where there is little room for wedges. I often forget to split the hinge on those bigger trees because they are very dead and I worry more about bad spots.
Sometimes learning a small trick can make the whole day worth while. I hope you got a few. Bill is pretty sharp. My 2 questions were worth the drive for me.
Looks like the forecast has changed and today is another rain out. Hope my tarp isn't trashed again.
Well Sunday was truly a washout, with steady rain, off and on quite heavy, we got 1.3 " through the day. I was up early again (see timestamp, previous post) and finally went down around 9am. Not too much water damage to the tarp this time. I spent a little time trimming it up, but will have to kill a few hours on a dryer day fixing things a little better so it can survive when I am not around to tend it.
Anyway, I figured out why that first log had the swoop in it. It seems that the log was stiff and couldn't been or relax, but the was a swoop in the bed on one side, so when the carriage passed over that section, it dropped a bit and the blade followed. It makes sense and all the evidence fits. I tried working back and forth to get things true to the string line, but it was slow going on my hands and knees digging in the mud, rain coming down, tarp dumping down on my back from time to time. I made some progress on the rough leveling, but it was hard to get the finer stuff done considering the conditions. So I switched back to drilling lag bolt holes which is tough on the back, so I spread it out. I got a handful more holes in and set 3 bolts, now I need to get some more to finish it off. But after just an hour and a half I was soaked, depressed, and a little disgusted with the weather. I was also getting cold, it was 40° and we even had some sleet in the rain. I called it a day, came up to the house and did other stuff then took a 3 hour nap, which I apparently needed because I don't nap and if I do, it's 20 minutes max. I took the wife out for a Mother's Day dinner in the evening.
So progress is slow but I keep pushing forward. I know there is no point putting logs up when the bed is not right. I also know life will be better and I can really start making lumber when the bed is straight and secure (until the next thing pops up, right?). A friend of mine and long time cabinet maker who I worked with in a machine shop for 18 years gave me some good advice the other night. He said "You have to stop thinking with the precision of a machinist and start thinking with the accuracy of a woodworker." There is a big difference to be sure. (But "straight" is still "Straight".)
Also on the previous toe board issue: I had an 'accidental wedge' I made sometime last fall laying around in the duff at the mill. It's about 16" long and it turned out to make a perfect wedge to lift the log. Works like a charm!
We are supposed to have rainy weather all week and temps in the 40's and low 50's until Friday. I have an intense week at work with auditors coming in and running rampant, so I don't look to be getting much done at the mill, but I am really hoping to have another log up by Saturday afternoon at the latest. The learning process continues.
Tough weather for what you're working on, but you're getting it done. Looks like you've found and fixed some issues. True about woodworking accuracy vs. machinist accuracy, but straight and level is straight and level. Just like woodworking, choosing the right degree of accuracy for a given thing makes all the difference in the outcome. Roy Underhill said once "Work accurately. The funk will come in on it's own." I thought that was a wise statement.
Good luck with the auditors (ughhh) and the weather. The funk will come in on it's own. :D
Oh my gosh this rain is killing me! Poured again last night and we had a surprise visitor from Texas for the night. All I got done was to trim the tarp again, and get a chestful of ice cold water down the inside of my jacket. Great night.
Only rained for the second half of the day today, so I went down after work and finished all the lag bolts before dinner. I started clearing the ground so its easier to do the fine leveling working on my knees, maybe tomorrow. It should be dry all day without the rain starting until an hour before I leave work. ;D >:( Anyway, the bolting up seemed to straighten things a little more. Tomorrow night I hope to get more of the wedge leveling done, maybe done. I gotta get a log up because it's pretty close. This chinking away a tiny bit each day is killing me. I might get sick on Friday because it's my birthday. ;D (but of course, it's supposed to rain.)
Quote from: Old Greenhorn on May 14, 2019, 09:00:59 PM
It should be dry all day without the rain starting until an hour before I leave work.
I was thinking,there about time, dry for a day,than I got to the hour before I leave for work part. :(
I have been getting rain here too,as in the weather thread. I had 2,yes,2 days of dry weather. 8)
We had one, Saturday. I need to take half a day and lower that tarp and hem it up, then add some more lines. I just don't have enough daylight in the evenings to get it done. This weekend I only get one day to work, the other is tied up. I am getting frustrated. Frustration leads to haste, and haste makes waste. Beautiful morning here now, and I am off to work. ARRGGGHH!
Are you cutting hardwood or softwood @Old Greenhorn (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=42103) ?
I only cut hardwood -Ash, Walnut, Cherry, Honey locust, Osage, and a little oak. I cut a lot of beams up to 25 feet on a manual mill (LT15). I don't use a toe board. Most logs 16 feet and under I use my 60" cant hook as a lever against the mill rail and under the front of the log to lift and shove wedges under the first cross bar. I do have the toothed wedge that Yellowhammer described, but I've used home made wood wedges too. Logs too heavy to lever by hand, I use my forklift to lift the front end of the log to put the wedge or wood blocking under. Additionally, as I learned on the forum, putting the small end (top of the tree) at the start of the mill makes life easier most of the time.
How do I measure to center the pith? My cross bars sit above the side rails 1". So I have a board that is 1" thick that can span from rail to rail. Since the end of the log is typically hanging between two cross bars, I stick the board at the front of the log and use that to measure the height to the pith. Then you take the board and go to the butt end of the log and do the same thing. Look at the difference in height, and adjust the front end with wedges as needed to get them to the same height.
Example. If the front end measure 8 inches, and the back end measures 9 inches. That's one inch difference. So theoretically you'd raise the front one inch. Logs have taper though, and the pivot point (your last cross bar) could be at the very end of the log, or it could be 2 feet from the end. So what you'll find is that the amount you need to raise the front end is less than 1 inch, depending on the amount of taper and where the pivot point is. Likely in this situation, the correct amount will be between 5/8" and 7/8". After doing this a bunch, you will get a good feel for it and be able to nail it most of the time on the first go. If your pith is off center 1/8" or 1/4" when you're trying to center it on a fair sized log, it's not going to be a big deal.
What if your pith is way off center at each end? And maybe not in the same direction at each end? Then you do what you feel is right. If I'm making a beam and some jacket boards and the pith is 2 inches up at one end and an inch and a half down and and inch and a half over at the other...Then I have to consider what I'm making. If my goal is a beam, I might decide to ignore the pith, and center the diameters approximately on each end. I use the same board to measure the dia at both ends, or approximate if they are not round, find the center height and level the log to those measured centers. After a lot of practice, you can eyeball how much shim you need on the front end and get pretty close. You may still need some wedge to adjust it a little more. For example, I may start with a 2x4 block under the front end or a 3/4" or 1/2"?
So the beam in that scenario may remain fairly stable as it dries if it's Walnut, or may check and move in one or more directions if it's oak. In those cases you may want to cut it a little bigger so that later after it has dried and moved some, you can remill it back to the size you want. I have a mill beam planer that I use for that job too. The jacket boards you get off that log may or may not stay flat as they dry, depending on species and internal stress and if you have weight on them as they air dry.
I've become very fast with my tape measure and dividing and figuring how far I need to move the small end, to level the pith or the diameter.
To your other question- to rotate your log 90 degrees after the first cut or 180? I started out rotating 90, which seems logical at first, but I learned from the other guys here that 180 was the way to go. The reason is keep the weight of the log symmetric to make it easier to handle rotating it and clamping it. Additionally, one you have two parallel sides, and then rotate it up to do the first of the other parallel sides, and have to center the pith or the dia, it's much easier to measure not just the ends, but to see if you're going to get wane in the middle and need to adjust your center (which you'll base your initial cut on) to not have wane even if it means a slightly off center pith. I hope that's clear?
I take half the taper off each side. If the taper is 1 inch use the wedge or toeboard to raise the log 1/2 inch. Lower toeboard or remove wedge turn log 180 degrees and make second cut. Then do the same for the other 2 sides.
Thanks gents, Learning here everyday. Brad, yes you were quite clear, in fact as I was reading I was nodding my head because it all made sense and matches what I have slowly figured out for myself. You confirmed everything I had figured would work best and how the geometry works out when leveling.I had even, just the other day decided that the 180 flip was, for me, the way to go. Doing that was how I found my swoop problem, which forced me to figure that out before I move on. It's very good to get confirmation that I am on the right track and not taking a wrong turn. I did have a scissor jack in my watch list on fleabay for the leveling, but didn't order it yet because the wood wedges are working well. My only issue there is lifting an 800# or more log to start the wedge. Only hand tools here, and even with a cant hook it can be hard to lift and hold the log while reaching in to set the wedge. So I may still get that jack but I am focused on the process and how I do things right now, I can streamline once I have improved my understanding. At this point I really believe it is possible for me to get out a timber of decent length and have it straight when it comes off the mill. I have 24' of bed and I would like to use it for something besides a tool rack. :) The sun is shining bright as I sit in my office and it is killing me right now. ARRGHH!
Sounds like all you need is a little spare time and some cooperation from the weather.
Those little scissor jacks are only $15 brand spankin' new and the little trolley jacks run about 25-30$ when their on sale.
Brad, I forgot to answer your basic question. Up till now I have done hardwoods, ash, white oak, and maple, with maybe a little red oak. I will be working on hemlock in a month or so and I have a couple of rotten pine logs of good size that I am going to open up because I think there are some timbers hiding in there that I can use for some short creek bridges for the UTV trails. Maybe get the planks out of them too. If they are junk, they just go over the bank, which is where they would have gone in the first place. I might get some posts out of them for drying racks. Never hurts to take a look and one of them is about 18' long, so it would be a good test of how flat that bed really is. If I mess it up, it is a small loss. If I don't mess up, I may wind up with a 12x12x18' that I have to find a use for.
Yes btulloh, I know those jacks are cheap, but I am holding up long enough to see if I really need/want one. Sawmills have a way of collecting tools and I am only trying to get what I need and use. Otherwise that mill shed I built will be full up with stuff I am not using. As it is, every time I am up at the shop I see stuff and say 'maybe I should bring that down to the mill in case I need it.' I will wind up with a duplicate set of tools there at some point, but I am trying to avoid clutter. Also, I am cheap, so I wait a week and see. I don't have side access the operate that jack under the mill, it's on timbers. SO I might actually be wanting something different. I won't buy until I have figured out the right solution for the issue. Slow and steady. Heck, it took me a year to decide on which chainsaw pants I wanted to buy, and now that I have ordered them, even before they arrive, I am second guessing myself. Sometimes I hate me. ;D
Well I managed to get a whole hour and a half at the mill tonight and got the bed as straight as I could. I cut the short log I had on the bed and it is straight as I could check it. I am using a 4 foot level as a straight edge and it now comes down to the imperfections in the edge of the level. I think It's time I dropped the machinist mindset and went to the woodworkers mind set. Maybe it will show up clearer on a longer log, but I had no time for that tonight.
Next issue is squareness. My logs clamps don't really seem to hold the log square. i am not sure if they are damaged (bent) from use or if it's something else. I haven't really worried about it too much because of the bigger issues, now it's time to figure this out next. I have to check if the clamp bars are square to the bed first. If they are, I'm not sure what to do next. It's one thing if board edges are a little out of square, but on a 6x6 it's a real problem. I really don't like these clamps at all and immediately had to start coming up with work arounds to get them tight. I have to put shim boards under the clamp side to get them to hold a board flat against the clamp. They are fine on logs for the first and second side, after that, not so much. No pictures just yet to explain. I didn't have a camera tonight. I'll just keep poking along on one issue at a time.
Anyway, i wound up with a bunch of random boards from what was on the mill and what I had started last weekend. I am trying to clear the decks, clean up the area, nail down my handling process, get a stump dug up that is really in the way on the side of the mill and make things more workable. I think I may take a vacation day Friday and just enjoy my birthday working on these issues. At my age birthdays are just a reminder that I am getting old, so I might as well get some enjoyment out of it, especially after the week I've had.
Here's an old photo from my gallery that may give an idea of the clamp design.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2017.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1544380209)
Sometimes I sits and thinks, and sometimes I just sits. My Dad used to say that. The point was that sometimes you have to stop, sit down, and look or think things over. That was my goal tonight.
I had to teach this afternoon, so I got home late and there was little time to get into anything so I figured I would go and figure out what I want to do tomorrow, what I will need, make a list and think things through. But aww, when I got down there I saw the wind today had broken one of the ropes on the tarp and the whole thing is flipped over the ridge. Sometimes I feel like I can't even win at losing. Didn't feel like getting to work on it now, that can be an early morning task, not a big deal, just wasted time...again. I made a list of stuff to haul down, call it spring supplies. I have a recycled ikea desk that will become an outdoor workbench, I want to bring the camp stove and supplies to make coffee (no coffee, no workie) and some other odds and ends. Then I went and checked out some short logs I want to skid up and mill tomorrow. The goal is to do my first 'paying job' for a co-worker. He needs enough siding to build a smoker. 5 foot long 3/4 boards of random widths from ash. I have some dead logs I took down last June that should do the trick and if they don't I have other better stuff I would rather not use on this job. The price is the cost of a saw blade. These are logs I would have made into firewood otherwise.
I am fairly happy with how last night's work turned out so I want to do this run and see if things go well. Then decide whats next.
I also have a lot of cleaning up and organizing to do around the mill just to make me happy and make it easier to work. (LOTS of trip hazards.) When I got the mill I never guessed how much work there would be in just making a usable work area. Lumber stacking is another issue I am still wrapping my brain around with all the random lengths and sizes I am producing as I learn. I knew there would be a lot of details and I knew i would miss a lot in my plans, but I am surprised at just how much there is to do. It's only mid-May, but I feel like I am behind already. Tomorrow is Norwegian Constitution Day and I plan to celebrate it down at the mill doing what I want.
well happy Norwegian const. day. and happy birthday as well. hope you get your 3 day weekend
Well, its been a long day. I did not fly the flag today as it was going to rain, and it did, oh boy! I got down to the mill at a reasonable hour and brought down some of the necessary comforts I had been looking to add, like a workbench to lay tools on and such. Also brought a camp stove, coffee pot, some fresh water (forgot the coffee). I had to first get the tarp back up and this time I put more effort into trimming it off so it drains better. Having all in order, I got to work.
The tarp is back up.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2479.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1558132930)
The Employee break room is prepared.
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So first order of business was to cut the promised order for my co-worker. I wanted to get that done before I started playing with fun stuff. I plain milled a 6' ash log and centered the pith over a 2" slab that was left on the first log. I noted that the mill is much more rigid, totally different from when I first started. All these little tweaks are paying off. It is much more rigid, I hardly get any shake on the wide boards now. I should have checked my thickness consistency, but i didn't. It looks good on 3/4 boards. I had to keep an eye on the clock, my daughter was taking me out to lunch for my birthday. Around 11 it started raining, I couldn't hear it with the mill running, but working near the edge of the tarp at times, I felt it. Then as I was resetting clamps, the tarp decided to dump about 2 gallons of pretty cool water in the middle of my back. I was soaked. I finished off that log, came up, got a dry shirt and went for a lovely lunch with my daughter. It rained hard for a couple of hours. I got back to the mill around 2 and took that 2" slab and made a quick outdoor fire-pit cocktail table for my neighbor, he needs one. I forgot to take a photo, it took about 20 minutes. I ran the table up to his yard and on the way down found a red oak stump that I cut a 20" diameter by 18" long round off of to use for a table pedestal down at the mill. That's my little coffee table now, with the rest of the 2" slab on it. Didn't take a photo of that either, its ugly and functional. Then I hooked up the arch, headed down to get another ash log because the rain was done. I brought that up and this one went quicker as I learn the mill and what I can and cannot get away with to make time. Then I edged all the boards. Pretty quick math says I made about 80 board feet. Not very much, but it does go out to a 'customer', so that is a first.
Stack on the left will get loaded Sunday night to deliver Monday morning. All ash. The stuff on the right is all maple and I have no idea what I am doing with that..... Yet.
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The weekend office.
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The view from the office.
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Tomorrow I am going to focus on purely fun stuff. I have no idea what that will be yet. :)
Happy birthday OGH. Sorry you had to spend it in the rain, but it looks like you made the best of it. You're getting the creature comforts dialed in as well as the mill. Good deal. I bet you won't forget the coffee tomorrow.
You probably oughta sticker that lumber in the morning rather than leaving it dead stacked til Monday. It'll probably be a nice shade of green by then.
Good progress. Take the rest of the day off. 😁🥃
I apologize if you've already covered this, but are you planning to build a shed over the mill right away?
OG,
Happy birthday and Happy Noggie Constitution Day. Did you wear your fancy outfit with the silver buckle shoes and the little knife on your belt? I remember working in Kristiansand in 2007-2009 and found the fancy embroidered aprons the women wore indicated their village and maybe some family associations. My wife took a year LOA from teaching and joined me there and we had a real good time.
Keep plugging on that mill and you will learn something new every day and will every log. Remember - some lessons are cheap, some are costly. As long as you or nobody else gets hurt and you learn it was worthwhile.
Quote from: btulloh on May 17, 2019, 08:18:51 PM
Happy birthday OGH. Sorry you had to spend it in the rain, but it looks like you made the best of it. You're getting the creature comforts dialed in as well as the mill. Good deal. I bet you won't forget the coffee tomorrow.
You probably oughta sticker that lumber in the morning rather than leaving it dead stacked til Monday. It'll probably be a nice shade of green by then.
Good progress. Take the rest of the day off. 😁🥃
I didn't really 'forget' the coffee, I didn't plan on making any. By the time I had it all set up after doing more important stuff it was mid-afternoon. Every thing is good to go for tomorrow though. :)
I don't think that lumber is gonna move a bit except for the slab that already split right after I cut it. That tree was dead for 15 years before I took it down last June and had been laying in 6 foot logs for a year. It is what it is, and he gets what he gets. I figure he got a days labor out of me so he can be happy with what I deliver for the cost of a blade. ;D
As for a shed cover on the mill, I had just begun to think about it, but that would take a huge toll on the time I have available if I were to cover the whole mill and bed. I have been considering using my cast off lumber to build a little garage for the mill itself with double swinging doors on both ends. Right now I tarp it every night and all winter long and it is staying clean and healthy, but garage would be nicer. I am not sure where I am going with this in the long run or even how long I will hold onto the mill or be able to use it. The big summer project may be to build a stage for my neighbor so he can host house concerts in the warmer months. That will require a lot of work for setting up a firm deck to build off of because it is marshy where the stage will go. Maybe in the fall I will work on that garage to have in time for next winter.
Now that I am getting my process more refined and understood I seem to be getting faster. I only did about 100 BF today, but I didn't kill myself doing it and I did a bunch of other stuff besides with a 2 hour lunch.
Quote from: WV Sawmiller on May 17, 2019, 09:02:31 PM
OG,
Happy birthday and Happy Noggie Constitution Day. Did you wear your fancy outfit with the silver buckle shoes and the little knife on your belt? I remember working in Kristiansand in 2007-2009 and found the fancy embroidered aprons the women wore indicated their village and maybe some family associations. My wife took a year LOA from teaching and joined me there and we had a real good time.
Keep plugging on that mill and you will learn something new every day and will every log. Remember - some lessons are cheap, some are costly. As long as you or nobody else gets hurt and you learn it was worthwhile.
Actually WV, its called a 'Bunad' and the traditional clothing varies for both men and women from commune to commune (County to county) very much, not just the aprons. I was in Mandal in '93 and caught the parade they had to celebrate the bunads. There was group from every county in the country and the variations were amazing. No, I lack the funding to have my own bunad and it would not look good covered in sawdust and mud anyway. ;D :D :) I do, however, have the knife. That beautiful knife that you have seen is traditionally given to a young man at the time of his confirmation. The one I have was given to my grandfather around 1878 or so. He gave it to my father when he shipped out to the south pacific during WWII. My Dad made a harness that would allow the knife to hang on is back between his shoulder blades under his shirt. His thinking was that this would be the only weapon he might be left with if he was captured. He wore it anytime they were on patrol. I have that knife on the shelf in front of me as I type this. It means a lot to me. This one has an ivory sheath and silver finish work.
Yes, I think that's why I enjoy the mill, constant learning. Came close to hitting the clamps a few times today, but I am getting better and no sad stories to tell from the day. It was a good way for an old guy to spend his birthday, out of sight and out of mind just doing simple work.
Thanks for the history lesson especially more about the knife. I know that is a real treasure to you especially with the family history related to it. :P
BTW - I'm sorry I did not learn much Norwegian but I did learn that the hospital was the Sykhus (Sick house) and the Radhus (Red House) was typically the equivalent of our local courthouse. ;D
What Norsk I knew from my whirlwind visit in '93 has been largely forgotten save a few expressions and greetings. I do recall when I was there one of my cousins was helping me expand my tiny vocabulary and taught me the word for Mustache, which is something like 'snorebracken'. Literally translated, this means 'snot break' in English. That one I don't think I can ever forget, the visual is too vivid. I think he was pulling my leg, but I will likely never know.
Happy Birthday OG
Brent
SO in yesterdays post I said I would focus on fun stuff today. I have some crotch logs I wanted to open up and perhaps make table slabs out of. That never happened. I got to the mill fairly early and made my first pot of coffee, then sat at my desk and contemplated what I wanted to do first.
My desk:
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2497.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1558235091)
The first thing I noticed was a stump I right on the side of the mill rail that I have tripped on 100 times and interferes with rolling logs up on the bed. It's a real pain, so I thought I would get it out of the way. That took a while, but it makes things so much nicer and easier, and safer.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2499.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1558235025)
Then I looked at the mess of filches and junk scraps so I loaded up a few piles to bring up to the neighbors fire pit. I did some other general waste cleanup.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2500.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1558235115)
Then I took a break to think and realized I really needed to make a proper air drying skid. I hated to use good lumber on it (I am thrifty) but I needed to get it done, so I built a 5' x 12' skid and bolted it all together. Then I stacked the little bit of good lumber I have on it and put a loose cover on it. I will work more on the cover in the evenings. Shortly after that, my 3 grandsons showed up to teach me how to properly celebrate a birthday.
They are 3,4, and 5. They helped me clean up for the day before they let me take them for a ride in the mule.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2502.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1558235176)
They, of course had to take some time to make sawdust drawings and such.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2507.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1558235189)
Then we went up to the house for Pizza and cake. When they headed home we went over to the neighbors for a campfire and some adult beverages. I got up at 5, now it's 11:30 and I am pooped and headed off to bed. Tomorrow I will at best get a half day to work, then have a family commitment. The weekend went fast, but I am already planning next weekend. I am really happy with how the mill is working and I can now throw up a log and cut out what I need fairly quickly. This is good. I am looking forward to putting up some larger and much longer logs to see how they cut and how flat and square they come out.
good god man! is the middle child with the red hair a little OG or what. looks like you had the best kind of BD. congrats. glad things are going good. sometimes you need a little down time to get more productive time later. I am also sure that it will not be a 1,000 bf day of production that the grandkids look back on and fondly recall someday after you are gone. God Bless. Wish I lived closer and you had another chair and coffee cup there, I would join you! looks very peaceful.
Quote from: doc henderson on May 19, 2019, 12:06:52 AM
good god man! is the middle child with the red hair a little OG or what. looks like you had the best kind of BD. congrats. glad things are going good. sometimes you need a little down time to get more productive time later. I am also sure that it will not be a 1,000 bf day of production that the grandkids look back on and fondly recall someday after you are gone. God Bless. Wish I lived closer and you had another chair and coffee cup there, I would join you! looks very peaceful.
The middle one in the photo is the oldest and the one I call the thoughtful sensitive one. (left to right they are Dylan, Ben, and Reilly.) They are all great kids and all very different.
Yeah, these visits are always fun. Lots of questions.
The main design criteria for the mill has always to be create a place to relax through productive simple work and healthy exercise. That has been achieved all along the way. Having some upsets along the way is part of the game and I never expected anything different. I just deal with it and move on.
I do have another chair, but you are correct, I do need another coffee cup. I take mine black, so I guess I should get some powdered creamer and sugar to have handy. I do have to say, I was worried about over cooking that first pot, but it came out prefect, Drank it all day.
Full overcast this morning and we have this big dinner at Church in the early afternoon. Looks like some rain headed in. I will just go down and bring up that load to put in my truck for tomorrow's delivery. I'll try to get the grass cut and some other domestic chores. Then sit and figure out what I am doing next. For me that is the fun part.
I ran into some of the same frustrations last year when I got my mill up and running. All I wanted to do was mill logs but soon realized that unless I had a good base to stack the lumber and a good place to store it while it air dried than there wasn't much point in milling it.
So I spent most of my free time at the mill site cutting up junky cottonwood logs and making lumber pallets and grading the land for a 24x40x12 open sided carport and framing a 12' wide lean-to roof on one side. Every time I'd think it was time to start milling the good logs I'd realize something else I should do first. It got a little frustrating at times.
Keep plugging away and you'll soon be there
Alan
I learned to put cream in my coffee while I lived in Albany, NY. So like sweet tea in the south, everyone seems to put cream in coffee (pronounced "coo-off-eee") so if I come to visit, might need a cow on standby!!! 8)
Doc:
Both I and my sister got our black coffee habit from my Dad. When he would hunt in Maine and Newfoundland in rough camps he hated to inconvenience of having to bring milk and sugar, keep the milk cold, fight the ants for the sugar, etc. SO he just stopped using it. I picked up the habit because it made sense to me. Dad said "If the coffee is any good, why ruin it with all that other stuff?" I don't want to tell you what he said about folks that drink instant coffee, its a family site here. ;D
I tolerate the milk and sugar folks to a point. WHen I am host, I will supply powdered stuff and sugar, but that's my limit. Sorry. So when you visit, bring your own cow. :D >:( ;D :) (OK, maybe I can arrange for some milk.)
Alan:
I don't see them so much as 'frustrations', just another part of the job. If i want things to go easy and proper I have to put the prep work in. Yes, it delays things, quite a bit, but I am on no timeline here. If it doesn't get done this weekend, it will be done next weekend. The joy is in the work, that's been my approach for several years now after many years of getting frustrated trying to get things done in a finite period of time. It's more of a zen-like approach, and better for the soul, I think.
my grandpa Howard drank it black, but you could not brew it strong enough. He was the first truck driver Boogarts grocery chain ever had, and went on to be the head of trucking. He would stir in sanka with flavor crystals to reg. coffee to make it strong enough. they had a little plaque hanging in the kitchen that said Howards strong coffee that boasted a spoon that had been distress by a welder of some kind. good memories. My favorite Prof. at KU always offered us "a cup of mud" that was his strong coffee. I even wrote a song about it. did plant research with him for 1.5 years. Dr. Craig Martin.
I'm enjoying your journey OG! I've started a couple of posts here but for one reason or another have not posted.
It takes time to get things like you want them, it takes experience to know what you want. You get experience by doing stuff. Sometimes (most times for me) it takes some "piddling around" to start to do something. Often experience has its painful moments.
I'm thinking some things are hard to watch when the solution "seems" so clear to those watching.....like your tarp. It is just painful to watch you struggle with it and the water etc. But it's like I said before I retired, "If those in charge want things different, things would be different."
In your case, I'm sure there's going to be interesting changes coming, eventually! :D
Doc: my Dad's coffee always tasted like mud to me. I thought that was normal. Then I met my wife and things changed. When we got our first house Dad came out to help me do a roof and had a cup of coffee with us in the morning before we started. He not only remarked but was amazed at how much he enjoyed that coffee and asked how we made it. Turned out, we would use 4 scoops of coffee for a 12 cup pot. He had always use 10 scoops for 12 cups. Mystery solved and even though my Dad was set in his ways, he changed his brewing formula. His coffee was still mud to us, but he liked it and it was cheaper to make. Go figger. Anyway, that pot I made yesterday at the mill was probably the best pot I have tasted in many years. I just got lucky.
Ted: Yes, that tarp seems like it is more trouble than it is worth. But I know that as the season works through I will tweak it and it will be pretty reliable. It is not intended to allow me to work in down pours or anything like that. The purpose is to keep the ground in the mill are relatively dry and mud free. It also allows me to work there doing 'other stuff' even when it is raining heavy and I can park the Mule under it keeping the pile of tools and saws in the bed relatively dry. It's hard to see, but that tarp covers a lot of ground, even though I have it hemmed back (trees in the way) it covers 20' x 40'. Yes it leaks, I have punched holes in to let it drain in critical areas, but it allows me to continue doing something when it rains. If I built a mill shed to cover the whole unit, it would still not cover the area I have now. I don't do this for a living, just fun. SO I have to draw the line somewhere. Each time I fix it, it gets better. The rain we had Friday required no intervention on my part and the tarp shed the rain just fine. I am getting close.
So today I lost most of the working hours.I got in about 4 hours working on stumps and loading out that order to deliver tomorrow at work. Also got the lawn mowed again. We went over to the church to celebrate a mass for the parish priest who is 80 and retiring in July. There was a big party after the mass with about 300 folks, food, drinks, etc. I was at the bar getting a beer and noticed that it was an 8 quarter slab, live edge, about 8" long and asked the bartender where they got their slabs. (No legs, just a slab across the tops of two win barrels.) She didn't know but said she would ask the boss. I just remarked that they have left odd pieces of bark in random places and some was breaking free. It seemed kind of sloppy for something used for food service. The slabs were planed and finished nicely, but the odd chunks of unstable bark bothered me.
About an hour later, the head chef comes and finds me, she is the boss. She asks what I know about such things and I was quite frank and told her 'not much' but I have a bunch of slabs and was honest and told her I am just a 'hobbyist' but have a lot of slab wood I wind up making firewood out of. I don't see any use for a 24" length of 8 quarter slab wood. She said that was what she has been looking for and a local supplier of long and short slabs to use for serving boards, accents, and center pieces. She doesn't want fancy finished, just safe and clean. She also does not want to pay NYC or amazon prices for off coast stuff, and I assured her my goal was to make money for blades, gas, and some improvements. she was very clear she would be calling me and wanted to know if she could visit to look at wood and talk about whats possible. From what I gather she is looking for very simple stuff and mostly small, which is usually burn pile fodder for me. It could be a win-win, who knows? The irony is that I didn't even want to go to this event, I hate crowds and small talk, I am not even Catholic (my wife is), but I do like the Father a lot and this is an important milestone for him and I thought the community should come together to help him celebrate. So I made myself go (also that 'happy wife, happy life' thing plays pretty heavy here).
After work when I head down the to the mill and look things over, those logs I have laying there might look a little different. When I consider that I might have a little side income to offset all the out of pocket expenses I have been shelling out to 'have some fun' selling a few things on the side sounds pretty good.
It's hard to beat a "church related" celebration that has a bar! Its a thing not heard of here in the South! Then you get to sell some slabs! Priceless! :D
Quote from: SawyerTed on May 19, 2019, 09:20:08 PM
It's hard to beat a "church related" celebration that has a bar! Its a thing not heard of here in the South! Then you get to sell some slabs! Priceless! :D
Yeah well, it's a Catholic thing I guess, I am Lutheran and the priest tolerates my 'transgressions' I guess. Small town thing also, I guess. Selling some wood was a surprise and certainly not my intent. We will see where it goes, if anywhere at all. It was just kind of fun to see that there was an interest.
Today was a good day for me, a very good day. I only had about an hour and a half of light available after work and I wanted to accomplish something. SO I went down and skidded this EWP log up to the mill and loaded it on. It has a lot of rot, and I really didn't save the log for lumber because I figured when I opened it up I would find more junk and pithy stuff and throw it over the bank. I kept it because it was a large and long log and I thought I could use it to see how straight the mill would cut. If I screwed it up and have more adjustments to do, I wouldn't lose good wood in the process. It was heavy, and keep in mind I have no help and no hydraulics, no grapple. Every thing is hand power except for the Mule.
Here is the beast at 14 and a half feet and average diameter around 18" or so:
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2512.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1558401566)
I got the first two sides cut (0 and 90°) and had to run up in time for dinner. Momma don't like it if I am late. Then I came back down and was anxious to see when I did the third side if the second side would lay flat. It did! There are two bunks that the log is not flat on, but only by 1/16", so I have some finer tweaking to do, but it is really close for a log that long. I was pretty happy. Then I finished the forth side, realized there was a heavy pith quadrant that made the beam useless, I so I took a 3" slab off and the resulting beam is 6x9x14'6". Not a big deal in the milling world, I know, but it is straight and square. That made me really happy. The mill is so much more stable now, I ran down that log almost too fast (jammed the blade with packed sawdust once) and I had NO shake in the head. This was my first pine log and it's a huge difference for me. The slabs that came off are less than worthless, but they are so heavy I will have to hack them up before I can throw them over the bank. There was one pretty slab I might edge on one side, cut in half and bookmark for a workbench at the mill. It will rot away in a few years, but look pretty in the mean time.
This photo shows the two usable pieces in the middle, the junk slabs on the left and way off on the right you can see that slab I was talking about.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2517.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1558401573)
Now my next problem is how do I get that beam off the mill bed and onto the drying skid? ;D I have no idea what I am going to do with it. I might use it for beams for short bridges across the narrow waterways here or perhaps to make another drying skid. Not sure yet, I need time to think on it.
But I will say, and I know a lot of folks reading this have already been there at least once and will think I am marking myself as a greenhorn, but it feels really good to cut a straight square beam that long. Really, really good. I think you called it right a while back @doc henderson (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=41041) , but at the time I had some serious doubts that this manual mill could cut that kind of wood. I guess sweating the details and some persistence pays off. Now I have to figure out what's next? But I will do that tomorrow. Right now I am too busy smiling like an idiot. :) :D 8)
Good report. Your smile is well deserved. Seems to me your journey is right on track. Every log you saw gets you further down the road.
I don't know any good way to handle beams and heavy slabs without machinery though. Maybe a tractor or skid steer is in your future. Other than that you can slide one end at a time onto the bed of the mule perhaps. Heavy stuff is . . . heavy.
Congratulations on your progress.
glad to see and hear about your success. can you put dunnage on the ground perpendicular to the mill so you can roll the cant off the mill and onto the drying rack? a mini skid steer would be nice but I have moved some big stuff with a 2 wheel cart and or pallet jack. could get a couple of wheels and make an axle to go under a load and pull with mule, like a log arch but under the load of lumber or cant. I am sure you will figure it out. congrats! 8)
A small log arch behind the Mule would be a way to move those beams.
Looks like progress! Good going!
Yeah I will have to make something, which is good because I really needed something else to do. ;D
I have a skidding arch but I need to make a heavy dolly for the back end. I was thinking of something like @nybhh (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=38169) made last year, but darned if I can't find that thread today. That will kill another 100 bucks and a half a day. Wish I could find a teenager that wanted some side work, he or she might learn something too.
For this particular beam I will just let it sit until I have to move it to cut more stuff. By that time I may know what I am doing with it and can cut it to size. I am thinking pallet bunks would be a good use. The other big log I have from this tree will likely become bridge planks on the ATV trails if the wood is half decent.
Tonight I have to clean up the mess I made last night and get rid of the slabs (firewood stack dunnage, I think). The little bit of light and time I get in the evening goes by really quickly. It gets dark down in the woods before the sun is down. I may need to add some area lighting (but I will just keep that on the list for a little longer) because I can't read the scale on the saw head. I keep trying to add to the organization process so that each time I go through it, it becomes more automatic and easier and quicker. For instance, when I started last fall, it took me up to a half hour get a log up, get it on the mill and start the first slab if it was a relatively small log. Last night I did all that and more in about ten minutes without breathing heavy. If I can keep trimming my process things will always get better and I can focus more on the important stuff. I have learned so much from reading here that it is almost a full time job to find ways to apply what I have learned and understand what the possibilities are. Everyday I try something new I read here. I read just about every post and don't comment on many of the threads I follow. I try to keep quiet when the big boys are talking so I can learn. ;D :D
Oh and here's a question: I am looking for one or two of those magnetic scale tapes that are marked in 4/4, 5/4/ 6/4, 8/4, etc. My mill has a permanent scale I can't move. I know Woodmizer supplies them with their machines, but I can't find it in their parts listings. Cook's has them, but I didn't quite like the options/combinations they had. I will likely end up buying theirs, but will need a bunch to cover my needs and at 20 bucks a pop, I will just order one every once in a while as need arises. Before I do that, does anybody else know who might sell these in different configurations? Being able to set the scale at my first cut would really speed things up and prevent some mistakes, for sure.
I just called WM and the part number you seek is 016275. It's probably about 36" long so I'm confused at why you would need more than 1 though.
Anyway, I've been meaning to purchase another log clamp from them so I just did and added it to my order. Happy Birthday! I'll let you know when shows up and we can meet up for a beer at Arrowood or something. smiley_beertoast
Why thank you Brandon, that was sweet. I am not sure what scales Woodmizer puts on theirs ( I think they have them all on one tape?) but the cooks only has 2 scales per strip, so they have a series of 3 or 4 tapes to cover all the different scales.
You didn't need to do that, but I thank you very much. Yeah, I continue to do needed maintenance on my mill before stuff breaks. I ordered a new belt and will likely order a new idler belt for the other wheel soon, I see it flopping under load. I figure these things will break fairly soon and replacing now might make it run batter. I should do an oil change this weekend too now that I have run it in a bit. All this little stuff adds up, as you well know. But I like to have my equipment in good shape and I am not so sure the previous owner was quite the same, given all the water in the oil and fuel tank. (It was REALLY REALLY hard to start!).
As a rhetorical question: why does the spell check here on the FF want to correct the word "Woodmizer" to "Womanizer"? Is there something they didn't tell me when I joined? ;D :D Did I miss a memo or something?
check out the norwood scale the one on my lm29 is simple and is a all in one configuration
@Old Greenhorn (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=42103) , prob. just your new york accent!!! :) smiley_beertoast
Quote from: doc henderson on May 21, 2019, 02:42:07 PM
@Old Greenhorn (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=42103) , prob. just your new york accent!!! :) smiley_beertoast
What, now I tawk funny? :D
You might consider buying a used billboard tarp to replace you tarp. Lot more rigid and durable. Could construct a semi permanent structure using that for roof. Stretch a cable, string it up with some supports, I have seen them last several years even with some snow load. Have enjoyed reading your saga .
Thanks @nopoint (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=35601) , I am not sure why I put it up here except that I am enjoying the trek along a new road. I am old enough to know that the unforeseen (to me) will occur and cause me issues, but others have already been there and might offer advice. It has helped me a lot and saved me a good deal of time and effort already. Plus, putting things in writing is something I have enjoyed off and on for years. I have had a few blogs in years past, did a bunch of writing for the family genealogy, and have written a few things that were published here and there. It's also nice to have a marker in time to re-read years down the road and remember where you started something.
As for that tarp, it is one of those things I know I will have to do better on, but I keep ignoring because there is other stuff more urgent and it works well enough for now. I threw that up in haste last fall to allow me to work through the light rain and snow to get the mill setup and the shed built. I took it down in December, put it back up a couple of weeks ago. It's working fine now and I really want to be doing the working improvements and other stuff first. Building a shed roof would require a lot of bigger lumber, a lot of time, some extra hands, and something that could dig some holes for post footings. All of these are big challenges for me in this particular situation, so i put it off until I have it figured out. The tarp is fine for me now and frankly I am not sure how long I will be doing this mill thing, so I want to wait and see where it goes. I may wind up moving that mill to a better, flatter spot (if I can find or make one), so I don't want to get too settled in here where the terrain is terrible for a mill.
Last night I got nothing done but a little thinking. I cleared the slabs from that pine log out and made a spot to stack the other slabs after they are cut to firewood length. This will give me a rotation: Slabs come off the mill and get dropped in a stack between 2 trees. Periodically I cut those slabs into 16" lengths and stack them in a cord between 2 other trees and on top of the long slabs I leveled off for that purpose. I am hoping this allows me to easily keep the area clear of too many slabs building up like it did last year. I still have a pile of junk I am whittling down a little bit each time and a stack of hemlock poles to deal with from clearing the site last summer.
I also looked at that 2" flat slab I cast off the pine and am pretty sure I will make a quick and dirty outdoor workbench out of it. I searched and found some white oak odd-ball pieces I can use for underneath and I can cut some of those hemlock poles for legs. That other table I have is too light duty. I need something I can hammer on and bolt a vise to.
I'll just keep picking away at all these little things and it will begin to come around eventually. The goal is to just make some progress, any progress, every day and it should add up. Thanks for reading along as I babble endlessly.
Quote from: Old Greenhorn on May 16, 2019, 09:25:46 PM
Lumber stacking is another issue I am still wrapping my brain around with all the random lengths and sizes I am producing as I learn.
Dealing with random length and width is a real pain. Best to try to cut logs to pre-set lengths so that all the boards in a stack will be one of the pre-set lengths. I saw hardwood at 8'6", 9'6" or 10'4". These are my standards. If I have to saw logs that are shorter, I make them half these lengths so that on a sticker layer, I can put two short ones end to end so that they net the same length as a single long one to keep all layers in the stack the same length.
Quote from: WDH on May 22, 2019, 07:40:43 AM
Quote from: Old Greenhorn on May 16, 2019, 09:25:46 PM
Lumber stacking is another issue I am still wrapping my brain around with all the random lengths and sizes I am producing as I learn.
Dealing with random length and width is a real pain. Best to try to cut logs to pre-set lengths so that all the boards in a stack will be one of the pre-set lengths. I saw hardwood at 8'6", 9'6" or 10'4". These are my standards. If I have to saw logs that are shorter, I make them half these lengths so that on a sticker layer, I can put two short ones end to end so that they net the same length as a single long one to keep all layers in the stack the same length.
Very nice tip. I had kind of figured that out when I was milling logs that I had originally cut for firewood last fall, but I was mostly building with it as I milled, or within a week, none the less I recognized the issue. Every tree I drop now I evaluate the stem and figure how to break up the logs, but I restrict myself to even numbers. 12'6" is preferred, then 10' 6", then 8' 6". 6' and less go on a different pile and I save them for the odd ball needs like skid cross ties and mill them for immediate use. I like the half length idea and will incorporate that too now. I note that longer skids allow for more variety in end to end laying, so at some point wanted to make an 18' skid to take the odd stuff.
Thanks for that.
Every time I walk past that beam, I smile.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2521.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1558658403)
I haven't gotten much done in the short evenings this week, but a tiny bit each night. Split that 3x9 to make a middle board for the bench and did two edges on the slabs to bookmark them with the plank in the middle. I did a little more picking on a larger stump and pulled two of the major roots off. More hacking to come as the weekend progresses.
I know this is hokey but it's a temporary cover on the drying skid. I can't do everything at once, so I try to do incremental stuff to get through until I can make a permanent solution.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2520.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1558658419)
I wish I could take a couple days off each week to work at the mill, there is so much to do.
I don't have any concrete projects lined up, I am trying to get a work area that functions. When the project solidifies, the direction and requirements will become clear and I can get to work and set up the right stuff for the job. A little more tweaking to come this weekend on the mill. probably doing maintenance (belts, wheel belt, and oil change) in the evenings next week. This weekend, I hope to build that bench and run some more logs. Maybe I'll start doing the battens on the mill shed. Maybe I'll start working on post holes to build a more permanent drying rack that is elevated about 2' off the ground. Maybe I will begin that doghouse I need for the generator, the design floats in my head and I'll just 'wing it' as I go.
That's a lot of maybes. Too much to do. I'll just keep plugging along.
One of the joys of running the mill in the woods off grid is the peace and quiet, and the occasional visitor that shows up is more sincerely appreciated. I had the mill running a few minutes before I noticed this gal, my music was playing, tools were flying around. She didn't care, neither would she let me get closer than 6 feet.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2530.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1558742374)
I am now convinced these deer know me and that I am not a threat. When I am working they will browse around the mill area for 45 minutes or more. The mill or chainsaws don't even startle them. I try to warn them before I fire them up. I talk to them a lot. I have footage from my game cam last evening, it shows me heading down toward the mill, just a few minutes later it caught a doe jogging toward the mill area and looking in that direction. I know my music was playing and I was banging around. I never did see the doe last night, but I did hear something. There is one buck that hates me, he makes a fuss when we meet, stomps, snorts and challenges me, then he herds off the does. I must be a threat to him. Maybe it's my ruggedly handsome looks. ;D It's kind of cool to make new friends, however I prefer not to get too chummy with the black bear that is showing up on the game cam and I heard walk through a couple of nights ago.
Tomorrow is a real work day, unless the landowner keeps me up late.
Down at the mill before 7am to start a perfect day. Didn't even turn on my tunes, the birds sounded better as did the peace and quiet as I did little maintenance things.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2532.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1558822603)
Then I whipped off another 6x6x14' beam which was cut into legs for a workbench at the mill I needed. I will never get tired of making beam like this and so easily.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2536.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1558822545)
I put in some time whacking off pieces to put the bench together and got some of it lagged up. I had the leg arches done, the stringers for the top and got the stuff over to where it is going to live. But I had to knock off at 10 am to watch the grandsons. I brought them down to the mill and together we figured out a good use for the 6x9x14' beam I made the other night.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2540.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1558822617)
They left around 2pm and I got back to work on the bench and finished it off. It's not pretty but it is functional. I didn't take photos because the landowner and his GF showed up just as I was finishing and they brought COLD adult beverages. We discussed and debated whether to play pool tonight or sit around a campfire as I closed up the mill, put the tools away and washed out the coffee pot. My choice of the campfire won out and I grabbed some firewood into the back of the mule on my way up for dinner. Work bench photos in the next post.
Nice day.
Besides having a sawmill now, you have a sanctuary
Quote from: btulloh on May 25, 2019, 06:48:01 PM
Nice day.
Besides having a sawmill now, you have a sanctuary
Yes, indeed, that was the whole point. It's funny you say that though, because my neighbor was sitting there as i worked on cleaning and closeup and remarked, 'You know, I don't get down there too often, this is pretty comfortable, I should come down more". But if course my sarcasm got the best of me and I said something about if he came down it would be really nice to have somebody help with the work, :D and his GF jumped on the boat and remarked that work was apparently not his strong suit. ;D All in good fun of course. He got me back a few mnutes later with a remark about how my chainsaw pants looked kind of kinky and wondered out loud what was really going on here.
I do what I do because I love the work and what becomes of it. I don't expect anybody else to understand that, nor do I expect them to jump in. Yes, it's a sanctuary for me, that's a perfect description. A place I can get away from 'the world' and just work in peace for the joy of working. Nothing more and nothing less.
We were out late last night enjoying a nice campfire so i wasn't really motivated today and went to some yard sales with the wife before heading down. First, the promised pictures of the bench. It is big, heavy, very ugly, but solid and functional.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2548.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1558903643)
I offset the legs so that I could use c-clamps around one end to hold things down without interference. Maybe it's a stupid idea, but we shall see.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2547.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1558903588)
I used whatever I had laying around, so this is truly a scrap table for sure.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2546.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1558903573)
The is 8/4 pine, the legs are 6x6 pine, the stringers are white oak about 3x3 but tapered and out of square, and the diagonals are hemlock 3/4 board.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2545.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1558903512)
SO today I attacked that ash crotch I wanted to open up. Probably shouldn't have because it was really hot and my brain wasn't working so good. But I did. a Little tricky to fit up on the mill and get both blade guides to pass without hitting the log.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2551.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1558904361)
But I managed it and did get it slabbed up.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2558.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1558904405)
What I thought was a crack turned out to be the separation between the two stems as they grew together. If you look close you can see the two heartwood areas.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2557.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1558904326)
I am getting better at leveling and centering the pith. Still a little off, but not too bad. It tougher when there are two sections of heartwood.
.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2559.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1558904434)
Tomorrow is another day.
OK. now that is a table. looks a little like torture table in "a princess bride". you are going to love that table over the years and will want to fix it rather than throw it away. I see some wood to level it under the legs. can you put a little white oak on the ground to make a barrier between the wet leafy ground and your pine legs. i want a cup a coffee in the am but might want to slam a stein or two down on that table in the eve. Just so you know, you are having more fun than anyone else!!! Regards. have fun storming the castle!
if it wiggles end to end, you can add a triangulation on the long side, or strap it to one of those trees.
Quote from: doc henderson on May 26, 2019, 05:23:41 PM
if it wiggles end to end, you can add a triangulation on the long side, or strap it to one of those trees.
Good point on some shims under the other legs. As it tuns out the ones you see are white oak.
The one thing this bench doesn't do is wiggle. ;D I have two 6"long lags going down into each leg. the front and back stringers are likewise lagged into the legs. Everything is screwed together except the diagonals. I will probably add a shelf across he stringers at some point when I make more scrap. :)
just do not want it to fall over and kill you !!! :D :D :D massive and cool. be prepared buddy. 8)
Not much going on at the mill this week. Monday I had plans, but when I got down there I realized I had a lot more housekeeping to do. SO I worked on the pile of hemlock tree stems I made when I cleared out the area. Probably 35 trees, mostly around 4" diameter and 15-25' long. a handful were 8'diameter and I saved those for milling into 4x4's or something. The rest i cut into shorter pieces and stacked them out of the way to use for legs, or stakes, or something. The stack was where I want to build the next drying rack. Then I did some other cleaning up and assessment work (what do I need next?).
I resolved to make some benches, which means I need legs and a way to fit them up to a slab or cookie. So I ordered a tenon cutter and forstner bit.
Tuesday it rained pretty hard in the afternoon, nothing accomplished. Wednesday again it rained hard in the afternoon so I sharpened one of my saws and did a few other things at the shop.
Tonight was mostly clear so I grabbed some of the tolls I need down there and tried out the new bench. I clamped some 3" hemlock to it and stripped the bark and shaved up a handful of lengths to use for legs. The bench is solid as a rock. :) Tomorrow the tenon cutter should arrive but I don't trust USPS and they say the bit is due Saturday, but I really doubt that. Whatever, it will happen eventually. I moved a heavy 1/2 drill down there and need to get the genset going again.
Tomorrow I am hoping for a couple of good hours, but on Saturday I have a Logger Rescue class about an hour and change from here. It will be a long day, but I get to meet Bargemonkey and see his shop after the class. Always nice to meet another FF member. Looking forward to checking out his store too, I plan to have breakfast there at least. Sunday will be the only full day I get this week. Sometimes progress is slow, but it is still progress. I am chomping at the bit to make something useful.
Well, the tenon cutter arrived today, but no forstner bit. I head down and it should be easy to test something like this, but first I had to drag the generator out because I hadn't used it since January. Got that set up, got a little log clamped to the bench, setup the tool, tested the drill fired up the generator and was ready to have my arm torn off given all that I had read. Boy, I was a bit surprised, it cut pretty easy. no grabbing at all. I do wish I could slow the drill down, but it's not variable. I made up 4 legs but didn't go further because I was being eaten by skeeters and didn't have the drill to test how they would fit. No sense burning up a bunch of stock. I want to do one junk table before I really start working on anything I am putting some real time into. Maybe a coffee table for the mill. I have a short slab lay there on a stump now, might as well put legs on it.
SO I cleaned everything up and then sat and listened to the woods for a bit. Then I came up and loaded my saws and gear in the truck for tomorrows class. I have to be up around 4:45, so an easy evening tonight.
More on Sunday I guess. Tomorrow will be a long day.
be careful at your class. makes us all take a deep breath reading your journal of working in the woods. the cutters are nice on wet or green wood. a square chunk of dry oak will make you cringe a little. if shavings come off like an apple peeler you are good.
I only tried it out on dry wood Doc. I have a stave of hemlock I had stripped at the beginning of the winter, cut last year. It cleaned up pretty good. It is tricky to center the tool on the stock, have to work on that. I also will do a little tweaking to get the two blades balanced better, I think it is cutting a little choppy. I clamped those sticks to the new bench and I have to tell you, it didn't move at all. :) It's funny, but I bought it on fleabay from a guy in CA and he listed it as 'new'. Sure enough, it was new in the box but covered in fine shop dust. There was a hand written note in the box, it said "I hope it works for you." I still wonder what he meant by that? Maybe the bit will be here when I get home tonight.
The class should be fine, ore worried about getting rained on. After well over a thousand hours of training time in the fire service doing all kinds of high risk stuff like swiftwater rescue training, drills, and actual rescues, FAST team training, etc, this will be a walk in the park. Training is supposed to prevent accidents, right? But yes, I know as an instructor myself, that 'things happen' (Just not in MY class). ;D :D Maybe I've been lucky, only hurt twice. Once was a back injury at a car accident (patient handling) that messed me up for a few months, and the other wasn't really an injury just a BSI exposure that required a lot of testing and paperwork. Anyway, even though I am no longer in 'the service' it is hard to get out out the training mode. I still miss that part. Knowledge is power, but there is no skill without practice.
Anyway, it should be a fun class and fun to meet Barge. I was up at 4 so I would have some wake up time before the long drive over the mountain and into the hills. It's pretty country where Barge lives. I'll try to remember to grab some photos.
send a pic of that tenon cutter when you have time. green wood cuts smoother. I know they are expensive, but that is why I have 6 to step down as I go. I use a lot of square stock for legs and if I plan to rout a round over on the edges, I do that first to dull the corners to center the bit. On a log, you could carve a taper with a chains saw to get the bit started. I of course will trim legs to final length after the bench is built. the other trick is getting the bit in line with the axis of the leg, harder in rough branches/logs. At assembly, I sometimes have to rotate the leg to get the correct splay on the legs so the bench does not look "cross eyed"
OK DOc. The forstner bit arrived today, but I spent my day a few hills from home with @BargeMonkey (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=24634) and am pooped. He is, in fact skidding logs as I type this. I am going to take a shower and the evening off to sit by a campfire or something. Tomorrow, back to work.
This is how we spent our day, more on that later too.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2601.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1559420662)
Well between the long day on Saturday and the late night down at the camp fire I was a bit groggy Sunday and not very motivated to make noise and move around. I did however get down there and tried the Forstner bit and the junk slab and learned myself some things. Then I glued up some legs but because of the lousy holes I made while learning, not everything glued up well. Letting that sit until tonight when I will finish off the gluing. I also discovered that the slab had a previous un-noticed crack down the middle so a grabbed some beam clamps to bring down tonight and will try gluing up the crack. It's just a test table and if it holds a coffee cup without breaking, it will be a winner.
So mostly yesterday was just messing around with the process and thinking things through. I also got the lawn mowed and found a large deposit of bear dropping on my front lawn. Really? I thought they went in the woods? ;D
Last evening I was contacted by a friend who asked if I could mill up some top boards for his dump truck. 2-3/4 x 10 x 15'. Wants white oak, not sure if he has a log to drop off. I happen to have a tree marked for felling. Dead standing and should do the job. I was asking $1.50 a BF. Does that seem fair? It's for his business truck and even though he is a friend, I don't want to give up 2 or 3 evenings of my time for free, and that lumber could go for other things. I am not in this for the money, don't even advertise, but I will do small things that fall in my wheelhouse to help folks out. Any money just goes towards the mill and tools. (Feeding my habit, so to speak.)
He seems in a hurry, maybe there is an issue, so I will take a look at that tree tonight to make sure. It's a double stump and on an outcrop about 20' above grade, so it will be an interesting felling job. I hope it doesn't break or kick, because it's a small ledge I will be working on and not much room to run with a sheer wall at my back. I love a challenge. I may try to setup a camera (so the rescue squad can figure out what happened :D ;D).
to make rustic look nice, it takes some practice. if making for other people, you have to gauge their expectations. everyone has their own definition of rustic. i forgot to ask, why do they have you laying under that log? :) :) :). i assume the dimension of the board is x 2 (each side of the dump bed) so if my math is correct, that is 75 bdf. or about $112.50. assuming that 2.75 rounds up to 3.
That's not me Doc, it is Annie, the Plastic American that was helping out with the class. :D
The 2-3/4 is the exact size he needs, I came up with 68.75 BF and $103. which doesn't seem like much for the time I will put in to drop the tree, buck it, skid and mill it.
Yeah, on the benches, I am just playing until I figure it out. I hope each one will get better. More glue tonight, then I work on sanding and finishing. More stuff that I am lousy at. ;D The more stuff I try, the more I can see what I like or don't and work on the plan for the next one. Have to borrow my son's flush cut saw to trim the tenon tops. Have you ever put wedges in the tops of the legs? Was thinking of trying that just to learn why I wouldn't want to do that.:)
yes, you want the force of the wedge going end to end and not across the grain or it will split. i have made some tenons to loose, and for outside benches i usually do not go through the bench to keep water from getting in the joint. I have done careful measured wedges in tenons that go into a blind (not all the way through) mortises. so the end of the hole holds the wedge as you drive in the leg tenon, and the tenon then expands inside the mortise. Not to be done late at night or after spending time at the fire pit. When I saw the composite toed white tennis shoes, i was just sure that must be you. maybe they are just composite toes!! 8) 8) 8) :D :D :D ;D ;D ;D :) :) :). if you are happy with a hundo I think that is fine. some will round up but if you ask for 103 or 112 but tell him you would take a hundred, he might be back sooner rather than later. up to you. best wishes.
@Old Greenhorn (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=42103) so which one is you in the pic, or are you behind the camera. looks like your goatee in the foreground.
I am behind the camera in my photos, it's easier that way. ;D If you go to This Thread (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?topic=106581.0) and look at BargeMonkey's photos: I am in the first 3 wearing a plaid shirt, and in the 4th and 5th I have a bright green t-shirt (took the long sleeves off after lunch).
Yeah, I thought about the blind wedges, but I will wait until I really need them. :D
Greenhorn,
$1.50 per bf for white oak is below the market down here for white oak thick trailer decking from what I have seen.
Probably true, but I am not about the profit and it is for a friend. A little extra cash will just help the mill project out. It is for his business and I know he is doing OK, so I don't mind charging, just wanted to be fair. He never made a comment about my price and it's a small point here. He's helped out in a bind or two. What goes around comes around. We have more white oak around here I think, or at least I thought. It turns out those WO that I THOUGHT I had, turned into Ash since the last time I looked ;D at them. Then I cruised the whole woodlot looking for a WO that would fit the bill and found none I was willing to take down. Actually I only found two, both beauties. I thought we had much more. Somehow most of them turned into Maple. Actually every one of them turned into maple. I guess my bark identification skills need work, because my mental marks were from the winter time when its easier to see the tops. :D So my friend is checking his piles. I had a really nice fresh Maple log queued up by the mill, but it's 6" short. I don't think he will take maple anyway. We'll see if he finds a log. I had already scheduled tomorrow afternoon off work to take the trees, but they are in a bad spot and after checking tonight, I'd really like to have a spotter for this one. Kind of precarious location and those ash need to come down anyway, but a good part of it is firewood, with just a couple of saw logs. They are worse than I recalled. One of them is pretty DanG tall and the stump is 20' above grade.
BTW, WDH what is your going rate down that way? I hope your hand is doing better.
if these are to top the bed sides of a dump trailer, not sure it has to be WO as it should not be in contact with wet organic material constantly. most poor shmucks without a friend with a sawmill go to lowes and buy a 2 x 10 pine or fir board and replace every 5 years. see what you can find, and most any hard wood will out last almost any softwood. I have a cottonwood slab 2 inches thick sitting out in the weather on top of a pallet crate for 5 years with no finish and no rot at all. ash would be ok if not rotten or too beetle eaten.
Well I have tried talking him into maple, we will see how that goes. But I rarely cut my logs at 16', so I am not sure if I have one. There is one I have yet to check. He also logs a bit and has some piles. Could be I'll come home one night and find a log in the driveway. Yes, they are top boards for a big dump.
if he provides the log, I think your price is great. if you trade favors, could also barter. up to you my friend.
if you did drop a tree, you would have wood left over to off set the time you spent if you could sell the extra wood.
Yup, it is what it will be. One way or the other it will work out even. Small town, we work together.
He will take the maple if I have it. :) Now I just have to check and see if I have it, OR a tree I am willing to take. I know I have a few that are on the list, but have to check and see if they will yield what we need, one is highly stressed with a big lean. I get out at noon today, so I have some daylight to work with today. Lower winds too.
2" thick white oak trailer decking $2.50/bf.
good to know WDH, I will keep that in mind at the final negotiation. However, this fella has a lot of heavy equipment and I really could use some excavator work around the mill. ;D
I had the afternoon off and was in the woods by 12:30 cruising for trees. I found a maple that would JUST make the requirements, if I don't screw it up. It was 15" DBH but a bit oblong which would help make the board width. I dropped it easy, then bucked it up keeping the butt log at 16'. Then I winched out the butt log to where I could grab it with the arch. As I was doing so I realized I screwed up. I cut the other logs from this tree at 12'6". If I had just left them and I screwed up the butt log I could have gotten another 2-3/4X10x16' out of another log. Now I was committed.
I got the log to the mill without issue, but try as I might, I could not get this beast up the ramps into the bed. The wood calculators will tell you this log is around 1,200 pound, I felt that it was more like 1,800. No way I could roll it up. One side would slip back on the ramp, I would chock it, then the other would slip. It took me ten minutes to realize I was wasting my time and was going to get hurt.
Plan 'B' was to make a parbuckle with a Z rig. This photo shows the rig. The line starts on the lower right, goes around the bottom of the log and back over the top to a snatch block chained between two trees, from there it goes to another snatch block out of frame to the left, then to the back of the Mule. It took a lot of force, but it went up easy.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2619.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1559691678)
Leveling the pitch was another small challenge with this heavy log (for me). But you guys taught me how to do that, so it wasn't too bad. I had to use a pair of wedges to get enough lift.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2620.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1559691929)
This log was set further out on the mill bed than I have been before and I noticed I still have some refinements to do in bed leveling, but it's hardwood and held well to it's own flat. The log measures 1/8" thinner one one end than the other. I am thinking over 16' this isn't too bad, considering where I was a few weeks ago. I can work on that.
Right now I have it as a 6" slab and I just ran out of steam.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2625.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1559692301)
I mean, I am pooped, cutting the tree, winching, skidding, loading, milling, etc. all in a few hours has me shot. I am getting old and tonight I feel it. The wood was hard, I should have 4 degree blades, not the 10 degrees that I have, the mill was complaining, shaking and bucking, and I had to go slow. There were a few hard knots that I thought might be something 'harder'. This log really pushed the mill and showed me where i can improve things for the next log. Tomorrow night I will flip it up, level the pith again and HOPE tha I get that 10" I need t make these two planks. I did get a couple of nice 5/4 boards off as I was working down to the width I needed. Not sure what they might become. One end has a little spalting that was starting up. It might finish up pretty.
As I was closing up, this little guy came by to say hello.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2610.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1559692965)
Always nice to have a neighbor drop by and brighten your day, right?
Man, I gotta say, I am not sore or hurt, but I am plum tired out tonight. The muscles in my hands hurt just a little when I squeeze them, and I am having a hard time keeping my eyes open. Getting old sucks, but it does beat the alternative, and Magicman, don't you say nothin'! I could never keep up with you and I wouldn't try, unless hydraulics were involved. ;D :D
But with me hydraulics is what keeps me going. You worked much harder than I ever do which makes you the "hero for the day". smiley_roller
Well I can tell you when I got up this morning the muscles on the backs of my thighs were feeling pretty twerky and still do. Everything else seems fine. Might have pushed a little too hard rolling that cant. I was almost glad to come to the regular job today to get some rest. ;D
Twerking? is that what girl Miley Cyrus used to do? electricuted-smiley do you have a rope swing? yikes_smiley Waking up a little stiff and sore lets you know you are still alive and getting things done! 8) :) :) :)
I should have guessed you would go down that road Doc. ;D My thighs haven't hurt like that in quite a while, so it was a surprise. I wonder what adjective you would have selected to reflect the minor aching and spasming I had? Nope, no rope swings. I got no crick to hang them over.
I guess going from a standing tree to most of a 16' long cant in 5 hours with 90% manual labor is more than I am used to. I usually spread that stuff out and take my time, but yesterday I just plowed through it trying to get the job done. I mighta coulda finished it up last night, but I was just shot and didn't want to risk a mistake on a special log. Centering the pith in the other axis is my next concern.
Sorry @Old Greenhorn (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=42103) but you conjured up a visual that i cannot un-seeeeeeee. you always do a great job, smiley_safety_glasses smiley_curtain_peek smiley_beertoast
Which begs the question: What is the correct medical term for 'twerky'?
Interesting evening today. I rushed home from work, put on my 'play clothes' and headed down to try and finish these boards tonight. Now that I understand leveling the pith and am getting competent at it (I think), I had to do the last side sides and didn't have a lot of wiggle room to get out the width I needed. I thought I would end up with a touch of live edge here and there if I did it right. If I blew it, the log would be junk for what was required. The customer is OK with a few small spots. No pressure. I took on the "measure 5 times, cut once' mentality. Got it up on edge, leveled the pith, checked it several times, thought of making adjustments, realized I was second guessing my math, had a hard discussion with myself about trusting in what I had learned and going with what I had.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2626.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1559780600)
I took the first cut and let it go with a little live edge because of my measurements, then I flipped it (none of which is easy with a cant this size) and brought in the 10" width. I had a touch of live edge on each of the outside corners which told me that I did a good job of splitting the difference and got the center of the log pretty well. However, when I laid the cant down to split it into two planks, I missed. It was 6" think and I need two boards each 2-3/4" thick and no more. I thought one would come out at 2-3/4 and I would trim the other. Nope, they both came out at 2-7/8". >:(
I flopped one board off the mill and flipped the other. I figured if I had to take some off, it might as well be on the side with the live edge to thin it out. I wound up with 1/8" taper from one end to the other over 16'. He is going to have to live with that. I will work on trimming the mill up going forward.
A little live edge on this side about 2-3' in.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2629.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1559780628)
And more on this side.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2627.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1559780584)
I ran out of usable daylight because it was cloudy and I am down in a hole, it gets dark early. Besides I was soaked in sweat and dinner was waiting. Tomorrow night I have to take 3/16 off that other plank and I am done, except for getting them up to the road. Dang, but these things are heavy (and long) to handle by hand.
I learned something about working with a customer. Next time I tell him what I can do and get tolerances that I can work within or let the job go. I also learned something about the tolerances I can work within. :)
If he comes to pick them up and cuts them in half to fit them in his truck I will shoot him on the spot. ;D
Quote from: Old Greenhorn on June 05, 2019, 02:49:06 PM
Which begs the question: What is the correct medical term for 'twerky'?
i think the medical term for which you seek, is called... Elderly!!! 8) 8) 8) :D :D :D
Twerking (/ˈtwɜːrkɪŋ/ (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Help:IPA/English)) is a type of dance (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dancing)
originating as part of the bounce music (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bounce_music)
scene of New Orleans (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Orleans)
in the late 1980s. Individually-performed, chiefly but not exclusively by women,[1] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Twerking#cite_note-1)[2] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Twerking#cite_note-2) dancers move by throwing or thrusting their hips (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pelvic_thrusting)
back or shaking their buttocks (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Buttocks)
, often in a low squatting stance (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Partial_squat)
.[3] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Twerking#cite_note-3) Twerking is part of a larger set of characteristic moves unique to the New Orleans style of hip-hop known as "Bounce (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bounce_music)
".[4] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Twerking#cite_note-4) Moves include "mixing", "exercising", the "bend over", the "shoulder hustle", "clapping", "booty clapping", and "the wild wood"—all recognized as "booty shaking" or "bounce".[5] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Twerking#cite_note-5)[6] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Twerking#cite_note-6) Twerking is but one choreographic gesture within bounce. Twerking traces its origins to the West African dance called Mapouka (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mapouka)
, which has existed for centuries.
That lumber is looking good, if it is oversized a bit you can tell him will shrink to the perfect size when it is dry. :) :) :)
Quote from: doc henderson on June 05, 2019, 10:54:10 PM
Twerking (/ˈtwɜːrkɪŋ/ (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Help:IPA/English)) is a type of dance (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dancing) originating as part of the bounce music (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bounce_music) scene of New Orleans (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Orleans) in the late 1980s. Individually-performed, chiefly but not exclusively by women
OK, so noted. Let the record show that I will avoid the use of that word in the future. I shall also not use the medical term you suggested and instead use the term "Twitchy" for the overloaded muscle condition so as to avoid any confusion. Today it is still twitchy, but it got another workout last night. Tonight I hope to finish it off.
Quote from: doc henderson on June 05, 2019, 10:55:53 PM
That lumber is looking good, if it is oversized a bit you can tell him will shrink to the perfect size when it is dry. :) :) :)
One of the few criteria he gave me was 'not oversize on the thickness' so it will fit in the pocket. I think he spec'ed the size too close and should have asked for 2-1/2 instead of 2-3/4 . I should have steered him that way, my bad. I just hope he remembers the purpose and doesn't complain abut the little bit of live edge. This was the tree I had available and was not taking a fully healthy 70' tree just for some top boards. I am pretty pleased that I managed to work down the center line and balance the live edge on all corners of the cant at different places along 16', meaning I got the most I could out of it. I hope he is happy with it, if not, there are plenty of other mills around. In fact I just noticed a WM trailer in the driveway 2 lots down the other night. Not sure who owns it. I couldn't read the model number through the trees and it was set up. The more the merrier. ;D
I think it turned out great. If it is not what he wants he can use it till the perfect one comes along, and or furnish his own log. great practice. Looking forward to that cup-o-coffee someday soon! ;) :) @Old Greenhorn (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=42103) . can always put them back on the mill and shave another "hair" off if needed!!! Your place looks so peaceful. enjoy your sliver of heaven and solitude.
I he's not happy with the thickness he can chainsaw plane it down. The highway dept does this at the pocket site's cause I saw them to 3" thick ;D.
Quote from: Ed_K on June 06, 2019, 09:01:06 AM
I he's not happy with the thickness he can chainsaw plane it down. The highway dept does this at the pocket site's cause I saw them to 3" thick ;D.
If he's not happy with the thickness, he can......
Oh the possible ways to end this sentence are endless. ;D ;D :D
;D ;D ;D ;)
Well, that's done! Finished the other other one tonight, exactly 2-3/4 end to end with one small section a sixteenth under. It was a bear getting them up to the house. Not the prettiest thing I have ever done, but it got the job done, sort of.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2631.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1559867378)
I strapped a slab to the bottom to use as a sled. It lasted for half the drag or about 500' of skid road and onto the black top. Both straps cut through at that point and I just finished it. I had a little scoring on the bottom of one board about 6 inches long, but these are a foot longer than he ordered, so I am not worried. I set them on the side of the driveway, easy for him to pull in with his trailer and load.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2632.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1559867369)
AT 140 pounds each, these were not easy to handle. I pushed myself so much that I actually had a headache when I was done. I learned a lot on this one. He had better be happy. ;D :D
Now I can get back to fun stuff.
looks like you need a second wee little axle. looks like you are having a great time. no more twerking, just torquing and tweaking (sorry that is meth.) cannot use any slang these days. :) looks great good job.
ps i prefer a french roast with a bit of cream!!! God bless America, 75 years D-day, WWII
Yeah, I need one just like @nybhh (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=38169) , but I didn't have time to throw in another project. That's why I cut them a foot longer, knowing I would sacrifice some at some point.
I still have a headache, even after the hot tub and 2 beers. But my thighs have stopped TWITCHING.
75 years ago today, my Dad was the CPO on a sub chaser patrolling the pacific in the Philippines. We can never thank them enough for their service.
Doc, they have french roast and all kinds of fancy add-ins over at that Hippy place in Woodstock, just 10 minutes away. Stop by when you are done there. I have black coffee, colombian, might dig up some powdered white stuff, could be sawdust though, or powdered grits.
By the way, followed this on my way home a couple of days ago. Weird, right?
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2586_28229.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1559870985)
If it came on like a thunder clap might be a subarachnoid bleed. If it was gradual and later and feels good to massage, might just be a tension headache. I have been to Woodstock NY! I don't like fake creamer additives either, I like the beans that have been roasted more. At Philmont we had the little instant packets but still had star bucks French roast. hope you get to feeling better.
OH yeah, it was gone this morning and never really bad at any time. But I don't get headaches unless something is wrong. I may have overdone it with the lifting of both planks. I thought I might have popped something, but there was no explosion, so I took some advil and a couple more beers. Spent some time in the hot tub for a first since February. This time last year I was in it every night. These days, I don't really feel the need. I thought about doing vitals but didn't feel like getting out the kit. I figured if it was a bleed, nature would take it's course. All bleeding stops eventually. ;D It was gone this morning, then came back a little while ago as a mild discomfort between the eyes. I have to see the chiro this afternoon, maybe he can fix that. :)
This evening I will do more thoughtful stuff and I have a lot to clean up with all the slabs. Trying to set myself up for a productive day tomorrow. The customer SHOULD come by and get his RUSH job this evening.
I could not take the instant at Philmont, sorry. We brought our own stuff and used various methods to get our fix each day, depending on how much time we had in the morning. After Philmont, I got a JetBoil with a coffee press for backwoods use, that was NICE!
Catching up. You gotta make hay when the sun shines, so I've been spending my time on projects and chores, like many here.
I had my monthly with my Chiro and he asked if he was doing me any good overall. I told him of my day to day life 12 months ago compared to today. Yeah, life is much better with Dr. Marc. He fixed my headache too and told me I was in perfect shape for a man my age and I should change nothing, not even quit drinking. 8)
So Friday i went down and started cleaning up the mess from those two planks. I added some finish on that test table. Saturday I put it on the mill and cut the legs. OH I learned a bunch there. Broke the glue joint on two legs. Obviously (now) I have to support those legs a lot better when I cut them. I re-glued them, re-sanded, re-finished, etc. The rest of that table story is over in the woodworking forum. I no longer have the table.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2644.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1560053722)
I spent the rest of the day cleaning up a lot of the other stuff that had been accumulating here and there since last fall. We did a barbecue/campfire thing that night.
Today I was a bit 'groggy', but I took a run out to @nybhh (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=38169) 's place and see the pretty cherry he is milling up and look at his project progress. He has a lot of stuff going on and I wish I had his focus. He had a birthday present for me, a woodmizer magnetic scale tape. My mill does not have a movable tape, this is a big help for me. I was going to take a shot at running a slab thru his planer, but it turned out to be to wide and on a re-think, I realized planing it was not the best way to go. No big deal.
Plan B was to sand the slab, so I threw it up on sawhorses by the shop and did all the rough work. I am still not certain how long this will be, if, or where I will cut it off. I am going to try prepping some maple for legs on this one, but what I have has a ton of knots and bumps. I think the maple will finish up better looking and be stronger. It will take a lot more work though and I have to work on my patience and focus. (A life long fight.)
WHen I was cleaning up Friday evening, one of the cuts I made on those planks resulted in a 16' long piece about 1/8 thick. What can you do with something like that? It occurred to me that it was like cardboard. SO I cut a piece off and made a sign for the mill, as if anybody will ever see it beyond maybe 5 people.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2638.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1560119651)
Next chance I will start working on the legs.
cannot quite read the second line. looks like in memory of...
It says "In memory of Rudy, we miss you man."
Rudy was the previous landowner and a good friend and neighbor who built the house there, blasted and cut in the skid roads and made the property accessible. He would I think, have gotten a kick out of having the sawmill there.
Not a dang thing accomplished tonight. Raining steady when I got home, so I went down and rigged the tarp to shed water better. a 40' tarp can manage to hold a lot of water in strange places and I didn't rig it up yesterday. It wasn't too bad, just about 30 gallons was held up. I should figure out a way to grab that water to use for blade lube, right now I am filling jugs in the swamp and it's tough when the water gets low. In the process I discovered my rain jacket was shot and half the back was torn open. I got soaked. Checked to other stuff, looked over some scraps I might make legs out of and set them on the mill to 'dry' a bit. As I type this it is coming down in sheets out there. Hoping I get something done tomorrow night. I use the down time to think about 'whats next' and how am I going to get there. Tonight I am thinking I am going to cut that 6' slab I am working on down by 2' and make two tables out of it. I came back to the house, took a hot shower and ordered a new rain jacket. ;D
Yes sir, that is nice. We take a lot less for granted as we get older.
Mixed bag today. I started over on the bench legs. Dragged up a fresh maple log and milled off 2 12' long 2-7/8 square posts. They were supposed to be 2-1/2 but I will figure out where I went wrong later. It took only an hour, skidding included, my time is improving.
I cut the posts into 16" slugs (mistake again, should have just cut a few, instead of all). Then we had dinner and I set up a drill press in my shed to clamp the slugs and run the tenon cutter down over them, that's when it got ugly. Cutter wouldn't cut right, lots of chatter and dust. I took the test slug out to the stump and whacked the corners off with a hand ax. Helped a little, then I messed around with different settings on the blades, some improvements. Lots of shaking and chatter, the slug kept slipping off center. Not happy at all. finally gave up, sat and thought about it. The maple is hard, 12% MC. I will have to take the bulk off the outside. The sander is down until I get belts (next week). I might try my little 3" drum. I really need to make a way to cut these legs easier. Right now, I am not enjoying this, so I have to find a way. I forgot my camera, so no pictures. Not much worth showing anyway. 1 step forward, 1/2 step back. arrrghhh! >:(
How big is your cutter. is it curved or more the shape of a funnel. I plane my legs square then hit the edges with a 1/2 inch round over bit, then tenon cut the legs. for bigger legs I may go through a sequence of gradually smaller tenon cutters. what you did is fine, and wetter wood will cut better. send pics when you gottum. if you really round the end of the leg and get a purchase to hold the cutter, it goes better as well. You in theory can get them started on a lathe if you only got the one size. and yes for a 18 inch tall bench it takes a little scrap so I leave them a bit long. as well, if there is a knot in the leg stock, it will bend there so I find myself cutting out the clear wood between the knots. Finest regards sir.
Well, last night was a little better. I only went down to the mill to check(drain) the tarp, fill my blade lube bottles with rainwater, and collect my 1/2" drill. I worked in the shed and shop.
I had my zen working a little better last night. I gave up on the drill press setup for now, trying to mix up the variables and track down my issues. First thing, I resurrected an old barrel sander to sand the corners of the legs off. That didn't work too well, the abrasive barrels I had were not coarse enough to take a healthy cut. Then I found a couple of old/new belts for my belt sander and managed to get a little done with that. I put a leg up in the bench vise, nice and solid and tried my battery drill. No Go, but I expected that, just wanted to try it. Hooked up the 1/2" drill and it cut but holy heck it was quite a ride. Grabbing, jumping, chattering, locking up. But now I had something that cut so I started working in on what the real issue with this tool is and what I am not understanding... yet. The tenon is UGLY and undersized. The blades on this tool do not stay where I set them, they keep pushing back, which makes the cut more aggressive and allows the tool to dance around on the tenon. Several tries at making the cutters stay showed no improvement. I re-read the instructions for the tool, no help there. I had tried different settings on the blades to help learn how the cut varies with different settings. I should mention that cutting tool geometry has been part of my working life for over 40 years, I have done cutter grinding, design, and troubleshooting as part of my living for a very long time. I have brand new hi-tech cutting tools go through my hands every work day of the week. Hence my frustrations at not being able to make this tool cut sweet. Still I am evaluating as I go and thinking it through. Why the blades are slipping is a mystery. I have figured out why the drill press idea has not worked out (yet), and I can do things to fix that to a point. The small shank on this tool cannot possibly hold this tool rigid in a machine setup, it needs other things to be right. Using it in a hand tool works better because the human body can compensate for micro-shocks and bumps better than a rigid machine.
Still the slipping blades are a show stopper going forward, I have to resolve that before I can make progress. I cut two very ugly legs, sat down and thought for a bit and then called it a night. When I got in the house I thought to check the Lumberjack Tools website and sure enough, they have a help section which has a specific link for those with slipping blades on the home shop version of this tool (which is what I have, 1-1/2"). Turns out, the paint finish on the tool body has a very slick clear coat that causes the slippage. The fix is to sand it down. Duh. >:( I wish they had included that information with the tool. SO tonight I will fix that and see how it goes.
It does seem that my process of whacking off the leg corners with a hand ax are helping quite a bit and my skills in that area are coming back quickly, I can 'round off' a leg in about 1/2 a minute or less. Of course my hand muscles have to grow back a bit, but that won't hurt me much. ;D It gives me a chance to work with the hand ax I was given for my 14th birthday again. It still cuts like a dream.
(oh, and I should put a caveat here: These Lumberjack tools appear to be good tools of good quality. Nothing I wrote here should detract from that. You will note that my effort and frustration is directed at trying to learn and deploy the tool properly. I evaluate cutting tools against a very high professional standard because it's my job and time is money. These tools are not that. They are designed for home shops. I am NOT knocking this tool, I will get it to work for me, no doubt. The problems are with me, not the tool. Don't let me dissuade you from a purchase if that is your intent. I am having fun as I learn and eventually it will all be good. My Dad always said "A poor workman always finds fault in his tools." I am not blaming the tool at all here. (You hear that Dad?)) I am however beginning to understand the handwritten note that came with the tool from the seller. "Good Luck with this, I hope you can get it to work for you." It was sold as new, but looking at the blades, I can see that it was used, just a little bit.
You may want to add a drawknife to your arsenal. Good way to knock those corners down. A sharp hatchet is handy also. Together, they make a good team.
Yup, I have both. I might like to get a shorter one for legs. I am getting better with the draw knife, right now I mostly use it for stripping bark.
Hah! I did some more research at lunch time and found this video. This fella has the same tool and size as mine and had the exact same problem. Jump to the 8 minute mark. He did what I will do tonight and it worked for him, I expect it will work for me.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nesNdjuKU3s (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nesNdjuKU3s)
OldGreenhorn, I cannot go to the spot you mentioned in the video due to listening to an extremely long ethics video while reading the FF (required for a board on which I serve). I mention this in case the video instructs you to do what I am going to suggest.
On the aluminum, where the cutter seats, you may try scuffing it up a bit with coarse sandpaper so that the cutter will not slide quite as easy. Also, a sharp draw knife will help you rough out your tenon so the cutter does not have as much material to remove. I try to make my tenon as round as possible and just a tad oversized of the drill mounted tenon cutter.
I have made bench legs out of oak, cedar and Ipe. I try to avoid cutting tenons on knots. Cedar cuts easily. The oak cuts relatively easy when it is green and is a little more challenging as it dries. The Ipe, which is very hard wood, is tough on tools. I bent one of my draw knives roughing out an Ipe leg.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/22883/image~282.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1490134152)
The ones pictured are oak. The shavings on the floor are from the drawknife and the tenon cutter.
Holy cow that's a lotta legs! Yes. sanding the cutter seat is supposed to be the answer. I will know in an hour or so. ;D
How long does it take you to do the draw knife work on a leg? I am doing maple, and it is around 12-15% MC, kind of tough going.
OGH, on and ERC leg, it takes me about two minutes or less to rough out a tenon with a drawknife. Oak or Maple could be a tad longer depending on the grain. I try to select grain for legs that works in my favor. A leg blank with funky grain works just fine in the stove. A shave horse makes life much better for this kind of work. I don't know how long it might take me if I had to use a vise or a clamp.
I never saw a piece ipe with grain that looked cooperative. Ipe would make a great leg, but I don't fool with it much.
It looks like caveman has sawed of the corners of those legs to create an octagon. From there, you can get to a round leg real quick with the drawknife. It makes for a good look - after all it's a rustic thing.
With as much practice as caveman gets with all those legs, I bet he can beat my time by a mile. :D :D
Cutting the corners off on the table saw to create octagon shaped legs shortens the time a bit. I have not timed the drawknife process but if I recall, I did all of the legs pictured in one evening. They started out as 3"x3"s and I cut 2" tenons on them. I need to make a shaving horse before we make another batch of benches but the woodworker's vice served well and allowed me to stand.
A good, sharp hatchet and a stump could also serve well to remove excess material from the end of the leg prior to cutting the tenon. Also, you may want to clean the tenon cutter and blades with acetone, lacquer thinner or some other solvent to ensure all of the oil has been removed.
Another tip: Use your forstner bit to bore a hole in a piece of wood that is the same thickness as your bench tops will be. Ensure your tenons fit as snug as you want, mark the tenon cutter, remove the knives (cutters), apply a drop of non-permanent lock tite to the threads and reinstall the cutters to the mark. You could even make a spacer to set the knives prior to removal after you get them producing adequate tenons then apply the lock tite.
Poston, now PostonWidehead, answered most of my questions when we started setting up to make benches. I still have the picture of his tenon cutting table/jig but have not built one yet.
@Old Greenhorn (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=42103) you can try to soak a tenon in water a bit if you get a dry ol tough oak. I do oak, maple walnut, pine and ERC. do yourself a favor. grab a live limb just bigger than you cutter, and see how it is supposed to work. the shaving will come off like gandma peelin taters for mashin for chicken( @Southside (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=24297) @YellowHammer (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=11488) ) noodles for her favorite grandson. long big shavings. do that for fun and to see how well it works in green wood. then see if you may want to soak a tenon. Your experience is also why I have graduated sizes so it is not taking such a big bite and it is already round and smooth. I think the hatchet and drawknife will work too. I have wet some tenon wood and the trick is not to soak over night , but too try to get enough to soften fibers just deep enough. In the video you can see the forstner bit angle moving and this will make a crooked and poss bigger hole. so use drill press if able. the other trick in tenon cutting other than getting the tenon in line with the length of the leg, is to center on the tenon, so in flat stock you do not end up with a flat side. You are on the same learning curve I experienced, and about half way up!!! :D :D :D 8) 8) 8)
OK, that zen focus and all the OOHMMING you heard coming from my shed must be paying off. Sanding the cutter seats worked as intended. The cutters stay put. I 'rounded' off a bunch of legs with the hand ax and went at them. I did about 7 and the blades did not move. I rechecked the MC on these and they are about 30%, so not dry. but man, that tool took a toll on my shoulders.
Here is a lousy shot of where I have the cutters set.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2658.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1560564298)
This is the pile of ugly legs. Yes, I will be 'refining' my technique. Now that I have the tool cutting I can work on improving.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2659.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1560564299)
I sanded most of them to remove MOST of the saw marks but I left some light lines to provide a rustic accent of sorts. I also smoothed out the remaining ax marks. I was nearly done when my son showed up to work on his truck. I borrowed this fancy planer he has to try it out. HOLY COW! I am in love. One pass and the wood is dead flat and smooth. It throws chip like crazy. So I re-did all the legs except 4 so that I can compare when finished. I think I am going to get me one of these. It cuts 3" wide and I did 4 sides of about 20' linear feet of 3x3's and the battery still had some in the tank. What a handy tool. It really takes a cut, also miters corners.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2660.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1560564346)
So I finished off the evening smiling and covered in man glitter. :) I had no idea it was past 10 when I came in. thought it was around 8:30, I must have been lost in the moment and becoming one with the wood. Now I need to clean up the shed, I have a couple of buckets of chips and dust. But tomorrow I will be back down to the mill and trim the top, cut it into two tables, blend the edges, and get the legs on. Progress is being made. ;D
Thanks again for all the help and advice so far. Next time I cut legs, they will be 2" square instead of 3". ;D
I see a little "barber pole" so wonder if they are set a little proud, or if you are going over them several times. I try to go as far as I need one time and done unless I go to a smaller size. Some of the savings on the floor look like granny was peelin apples to make a pie for her favorite grandson, and that is good. also I do not know how much $ these are, but if you also had a 2 inch, it would give you some latitude to start at 2 and go to 1.5, or stay at 2 inch for a larger 2.5 to 3 inch leg. I have corded hand power planers and they work good for slabs and such. Mine has a groove on the bottom so you can trim a corner at 45 °, or make a square leg into an octagon. this would also help by making the leg more round. Are the tenons too small for your 1.5 " hole? if so then you need to back off a little on the blade depth. Lastly, mine are designed with a set screw and an adjustment screw, if you study the pic and you are a machinist, it might be something you could fab. or start making your own. My blades are sharpened using a 2 inch drum sander.
ps I was the oldest grandson and my grandma always made 6 or 8 pies for holidays. at age 14 I could eat 2 pies in a sitting even after two full plates of food. so she always designated 2 or 3 pies as being mine!!! good memories.
Kinda pricey to buy a dozen. but on amazon they have a company video, and they really seem to work well. prob soft wood with a company trained professional.
I enjoyed catching up on your exploits this morning! That video was helpful for me to wrap my head around what your up against but its pretty cool and seems like its starting to come together.
I'm sort of half joking but you should give some thought to starting your own YouTube channel. Knowing your personality, how many different things your into, your tenacity, coupled with the tarp adventures... a video version of this thread would be a lot of fun. I could even be your camera man ;)
Your thread also makes me want to move my mill back into the woods. Thinking back on it, I'm not really sure why I set it up where I did and if I fully comprehended the amount of waste wood they produce, I'm sure I would have. Hmmmm, new project next year perhaps?
Yeah Doc, the pro-versions do have a lot of advantages in the adjustment department and I could maybe modify mine if I had my Bridgeport up and running. But if I had that running I would also have my lather running and I could just turn these and hold size within .001" :D.
So I will work with these and enter the next steps of learning today. I have the cutters set deep because they seem less aggressive, backing them out increases the size, but also makes a more aggressive cut. At the price, I would have to think really hard about getting a larger one just for roughing because in the long run I am not sure how many of these I will be making. It's a fun thing, but there are other things too. Time will tell.
I figure there was a reason probably from back in childhood (Freud enters from stage left) about this 'pie thing' that keeps coming up. Some folks have a chicken thing, some Grits, you have pies. Good to know. There are worse vices. :)
@nybhh (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=38169) I don't know about the video thing. I mean if somebody wanted to follow me around, I guess it's a free country, but it sure would be boring. I don't move that fast. ;D I am not doing anything that hundreds of other folks here haven't already done and are MUCH better at than I and have better equipment and resources, not to mention the 'knowledge thing', which is very handy. I am just stumbling along. OTOH, yu are the second guy to say this to me in the past month. Weird.
As for moving into the woods, remember I am there because that is the only place room is available. I can't get to it when the snow i over a foot deep and I have no power down there unless I run the screaming generator. To be sure, it is peaceful and I get almost no human visitors so I could work nekked if I wanted to (no thank you, I do not want to, nobody wants to see that, not even me ;D). The solitude allows me to think through the issues, try stupid ideas without anybody knowing, and also think about other stuff. I can focus on the music I have playing which I really enjoy, all the work of friends and musicians I know. So there is all that. Now that we have some radios, the boss can call me if I lose track of time or there is some other issue. Yes it is nice to have a little ravine I am trying to fill with junk slabs and rotten stuff right next to the mill, but it does look ugly until the color fades. It works for me, but think about some of these things before your start loading up the tractor. Now if I could get just 1 20amp 110v circuit down there, I would build a little mill office/shack/shop with a covered porch on that high spot, put in a bunk or two, a little kitchenette, a wood stove and be set. But funding for power is problematic, and solar also costs. The landowner doesn't seem to have much interest, and it is his place after all. Maybe when I build his stage he will throw in a few bucks.
As I said in the email, I will have to try the overlapping passes with that planer. If that works, I will order one tonight, if not, I may just have to be happy borrowing my son's. ;D
Enough typing. Time to get to work.
OK, so take 2. I moved everything down to the mill workbench. Put a starting coat of tung oil on the bottoms and sides of the two benches I am trying now, after I cut the one bench into two and re-sanded a little. Then I drill the holes in the long bench and fitted the legs. I call them 'bottle jack legs' now because that is what they look like to me. They were loose and looked too stocky. I was a little disgusted with myself. SO I threw up some planks on the mill and cut 2 12' 2x2' and cut off longer legs. Went back up to the house, put the tenons on, planed and mitered corners on them. Came back down and tried those. They look better.
Like this:
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2667.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1560631734)
They fit 'LITTLE BETTER' and I glued them up with some leakage. Then I took the bottle jacks and drilled the short slab and put those in it. It looks ugly, but what the heck, it's part of the learning experience, right? ;D The glue ran out all over, then I had an idea (uh oh). SO I got a bucket of sawdust off the mill and started stuffing it down in the crack and added a little ore glue. Looks like it sealed up. I will let it dry, then flip the bench and I can fill glue from the bottom without it leaking through. I did some touch up on the first bench, but it didn't need much.
Ugly bench legs:
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2669.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1560631759)
I could probably park a truck on that one.
When I was cleaning up, I got more visitors.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2675.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1560631826)
Actually 3 of them, we had a short chat. I might post the video. Then I went up to the neighbors house to close up his garage and ran into this guy. Geez, I hate when they surprise me.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2678.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1560631844)
Now to change clothes and head out to the diner for an easy meal. More tomorrow, but as usual, I don't know what yet. Rain is coming.
i think the benches look great and they will get better and better. did you have to change your clothes so you could go out to eat, or because you were surprised by the snake, or both! :D :D :D :o :o :o :) :) :)
Quote from: doc henderson on June 15, 2019, 06:07:16 PM
i think the benches look great and they will get better and better. did you have to change your clothes so you could go out to eat, or because you were surprised by the snake, or both! :D :D :D :o :o :o :) :) :)
Well, they can't get too much worse Doc, so I guess there is only one way to go. ;D
No I changed because A) I was covered in man glitter, and 2) my pants were not suitable for public consumption. (They need some patches in critical areas, but make fine work pants in the woods.) :-[
hey what is the brand of the chainsaw pants you like?
The ones I just got are Elvex, summer weight. That's not what I was wearing today. I do look quite snappy in those.
just so you know not all my crap smells like roses, the skid steer has been needing jumped lately, and hard to jump as well. so i thought it would be the battery since after started it would run for hours. i do not like having a piece of equipment that is not dependable, and especially one that may be needed in an emergency with heavy logs and such. so my son and i set out to get to the battery so we could get a new one, or check fluid ect. it is a remote batt. under the cab so we raised that up, but it was 12 .4 V. so we cleaned all the muck that was there and shined up the connections and put it all back together. the ground stud was corroded enough it was hard to get the nut off even with some blaster. it started fine. blew out air filter to engine and air for the cab. glad it worked, i hate to spend hours doing something and have it not help out. We all have our struggles, and some are followed by little victories.
Anytime you run the kind of tools and equipment we do, you have to put in the time to keep it in good running shape. My Mule has been making some warning sounds these last 2 weeks and I have been ignoring it. I need to fix that before it becomes a problem. It's all part of the price we pay to play with the really fun stuff. Rarely does anyone come around when these tasks need to be done as they are not pleasant, but you are lucky to have a partner learning some good solid troubleshooting skills as he works with you. He is a lucky kid (even if he doesn't feel like it right now). These things will pay off for him ten-fold down the line. Old Scouters know this well.
Rain coming tomorrow, it might be a good time to service the Mule now that you mention it. :D ;D :)
BTW, what prompted the question about the chainsaw pants? Because if you are looking, there are better pants, just not in my price range. Also, mine are summer weight, maybe you want another season?
just looking. what do you recommend. I have chaps I rarely wear. I use double knee carharts, but they wont stop a chain.
There are a couple of good threads on here that discuss the pros and cons of such pants. If I had a more robust bank account I would have gotten the Cloggers like @nybhh (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=38169) has and likes. (see his threads) The Elvex are comfortable for this time of year and spring. However. I am not sure how they will be in cold weather. The backs are very thin breathable material and you almost feel like you are wearing chaps with no pants on. They are still warm, but bearable. I have no problem wearing them all day, but only do that when I am working with the saw most of it. For short jobs around the mill, I throw on the chaps, but I get them off as soon as I can.
Quote from: Old Greenhorn on June 16, 2019, 08:44:09 AM
you almost feel like you are wearing chaps with no pants on.
:o :o :o .... ::) ::) ::).... I am from Kansas, I have never tried that...conjured a bit of a visual that I can never unsee... but I did ask. :) :) :) Thanks for the info. I think you are right, I would put these on for a day of cutting, and was wanting something as comfy as a pair of jeans to wear on those days. thanks @Old Greenhorn (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=42103)
Quote from: doc henderson on June 16, 2019, 10:05:42 AM...conjured a bit of a visual that I can never unsee... but I did ask. :) :) :)
Yeah, thats the image I was going for. Think Midnight cowboy.
Here's the video of those doe that came by yesterday.
DSCF2671 - YouTube (https://youtu.be/MENqU_d-LQU)
Man, I didn't accomplish squat yesterday. The kids both wanted to do 'something for me' and I spent half the day waiting for them to decide what that was. :) Finally got down to the mill for an hour and tried doing more glue touch-up work on the benches. SO humid it was that nothing was drying at all. I made a shopping list for he coming week. I had a funny encounter with the same Doe from the previous day. she was browsing in, I was sitting in a chair, each of us shielded from the others view by the mill head. No music playing, just the sound of rain falling, very very peaceful. I must have shifted my legs, she was about 20' from me and she let out one heck of a long snort and took off running, for about 50', then stopped, turned, and looked at me. I talked to her a little, she stared for a bit, then went back to munching and started browsing in my directions again. All was forgiven, I guess.
Tonight it was not raining so I hustled home and went a few houses down the road to one of the weekenders homes where they had some big trees just dropped and didn't know what to do with them. I asked if I could take a few of the logs and they were very pleased. I told them when I could fit it in, I would. Well this past weekend they hinted that I could start pulling logs whenever I wanted. As it turns out, my SIL indicated they have a project and need some lumber, so I offered to cut to their list (which I still await the arrival of) but I knew I would need some logs. SO down I went to start the process of untangling, cutting out, yanking and removing these logs from the tangle that was left. I chose the toughest one first and cut a 10'6" x 18" DBH log that was in the middle to start. It came out like a dream, but MAN! It was Heavy! Turns out it is clean fresh Red Oak. This log is veneer quality, easy. I had a hard time getting it off the ground into the skidding arch. I am guessing it is around 1800 pounds minimum. Slow going up their driveway, , making the 140° turn onto the road, down 1/4 mile, then another 120° turn to get into my skid roads. It went easy though. Tomorrow I will do more of the same and stage them near the mill. I really don't have a log pile because I can't lift them and would need another pair of hands to peavy them up. I just leave them on the side of the trail in groups. They don't lay very long, and if they do, I roll them from time to time.
Oh, and the doe I keep seeing, she was laying in the swamp area in front of the mill tonight when I went down to get the arch (at a high rate of speed for a skid road). I hollered 'hello' when I saw her, she watched, but didn't move. She was there for all of my subsequent 'passes' with and without a log in tow. She never moved, just watched. On my last trip up, I stopped at the top of the trail and took a couple of photos while we (I) chatted.
Can you see her in this photo? She is between the trees just a bit to the upper right of the very center of the photo.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2679.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1560820364)
Maybe this is a little better?
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2680.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1560820424)
And here is what I could see, she never took her eyes off me, but never looked concerned, just curious in a bored sort of way. All women treat me like that. ;D Look at her eyes, she is clearly thinking "Are you done talking yet?" I have seen this look SO many times.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2682.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1560820401)
SO I think I have a couple of evenings of grunt work just skidding logs to make the new neighbor happy, Then I should make him a bench or something they could use as a thank you. It is VERY nice oak, after all, and they are nice folks.:) :D
OG,
Been missing out on this site a while. Doing a running battle with my provider for internet services and sometimes TV lately. Anyway, I had an old doe like that last year that raised her fawn on a rock bar at the fenceline with my neighbor a coupe hundred yards away but sometimes she'd come down and bed down 30 yards away with me sawing. She'd get nervous if the dogs came by but did not mind me running the mill. I rode my atv withing 5 yards of her and her grown fawn at my upper gate the last day of antlerless season on my way to my shooting house and just did not have the heart to shoot them. I wanted another big doe for the freezer but could not take her.
Back on your benches I'd sure trim those ends down with a draw knife or table saw. Might rig them on the table saw then take off the excess with a dk. My tenon cutter leaves a 60 degree shoulder while yours seems to cut pretty flush. You've been to Doc's thread where we discussed making them. http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?topic=105007.0 (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?topic=105007.0) I cut the excess off the top with a Japanese pull saw. I liked your "bottle jack" legs btw.
Yeah WV, I am starting to get better at it as I work through all the wrong things to do first. ;D I ordered a 1-3/8 Forstner bit today thinking I could still salvage those legs that fit way too loose in a 1-1/2" hole, just sand off the high spots and I bet they will tap in.
Rain all week here so I might trim off some leg tops tonight if the last glue is dried well enough, but it depends on how hard it is raining. I should just skid logs for the next few evenings to get that a little cleaned up. I texted that neighbor last night to let him know I was at his place and started. He said he saw me on his internet cam but couldn't make out details too well. I asked if he needed any lumber. He said he didn't want to take away anything from my pile that I worked hard to put up, but perhaps maybe a small bench for his fire pit area. I laughed, yeah, I will make him something, maybe a few things. I have all these bottle jacks laying around. ;D ;D This Oak will need at least 6 months in slab form before I can work it.
I don't think I could take one of those does, they are neighbors and they are the only company I have at the mill. There is one fat buck that hates me and sees me as a threat to his does, him I could eat, no problem. :D :)
Not much today, it did stop raining before I left work, that's a change. I skidded up a few more logs, one went to the firewood pile. It's a tangle, so getting them out takes longer than moving them. I met the fella 3 houses down with the LT35. It has hydros and I am jealous. Say he just got it. He was milling up some kiln dried untreated kiln dried phone poles. Clean stuff, easy cutting. Says he has been on the FF but I didn't ask his username. That makes 3 mills on our road now. The weather shows rain every day until Friday, so I guess I'll just try to get logs moved in the evenings and start cutting on the weekend, if I can just ignore the distractions of meeting neighbors and other things. :) There is a bunch of wood in the pile, but it is a tangle to sort out.
More skidding last night, well, most yanking logs from a swamp tangle and a little skdding. I visited with Don for a few minutes (the new LT35 owner) and between runs I dropped him a RO log about 12" x 5' for a test log to play with. I have some more if he wants them. He is cranking out 3/4 siding for his place up north from those poles, but has yet to work on a tree yet. Practice logs are good.
I think I will hack the smaller stuff in this pile for firewood right where it sits and bring the splitter over and work with the owner to make his first firewood pile. Otherwise I will spend many evenings dragging shorts and small pieces. Better for him to have a pile.
Then there is one big WO in there I have to get out, about 20"DBH with a 40-50' stem. Straight as a phone pole but I have zero maneuvering room. That should kill a couple of evenings. All grunt work this week with nothing to show for it but logs laying everywhere down by the mill. The same for tonight I think, unless I start working on the cut list for the kids.
Well back to work tonight. I got tired of skidding logs and wanted to get a jump on the wood for my daughter. I rolled up a nice log, one of the smaller of the ones that made it to the mill in the last 3 nights. 17" at the big end, 10'6" long.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2684.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1561078484)
I am getting really good at leveling the pith and boy is that satisfying to get a nice even slab off on the first cut. Never get tired of that!
Never get tired of this view either:
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2685.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1561078543)
It was a little rough working because the sun was over the hill, I am down in a hemlock thicket, so there isn't much light on a bright day under the tarp. I need a solution for that, but for now I was trying to tough through it. I took the top slab off, then a 5/4 board. That Woodmizer tape that @nybhh (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=38169) gifted me with is working perfect. I set it where my first cut is, then move on. Seems to be spot on. Next cut I needed a 4" slab to make 4x4's and 2x4's. Had a hard time seeing the scale, even with my glasses on. It was getting too dark. I have this neat flashlight in the Mule and I tired that, it has a magnet on the back end and either a flood or front beam. Worked like a charm.
This is a flash photo so you can see it all, the light is just to the right of the recoil starter in the photo.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2691.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1561078581)
Here is a shot with no flash:
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2692.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1561078597)
I move it up high to read the scale, then low to watch my cut. Wish I had an alternator on this engine so it could power a headlight. I need it.
Just as I was setting the 4" cut, the sky opened up with a line of thunder showers coming through. It was coming down in buckets. So I spent 15 minutes dumping water and adjusting the tarp. My shirt and t-shirt got soaked pretty well. I grabbed a dry BDU shirt out of the mill shed, it's heavier. That got soaked too. I do collect the rainwater to use for the blade lube, so I filled up any empty jugs I had with ease. It was raining too hard to mill because the mill is on the edge of the tarp and at spots it will pour down my back, which is distracting. I went over to the work bench (different tarp) and busied myself trimming off legs tops on benches. Eventually it died down enough to finish that 4" slab, which I did, but MAN! that thing was heavy. I only need 8 footers, so I may cut 2' off this to make a table before I cut the dimensional stuff I need. That red oak cut really nice and smelled good too. This was a good test at how all my truing and stabilization efforts have worked on the mill. I was pretty pleased with that. 2 months ago that cut would have been really tough, but tonight it went pretty easy. I got that slab off (not sure how I am going to get it back up there ;D) and flipped the log per my log layout plan, covered everything up and called it a night. I drove back to the house with the headlights on.
Tomorrow I get off work at noon and the weather is supposed to clear by then. Hopefully I can finish the order up and deliver it Saturday morning, then move my splitter over to the neighbors and help him (or rather show him how to) cut, split, and stack firewood so I can get at that big white oak that is laying in the swamp tangle at his place, more very nice logs.
Quote from: bandmiller2 on May 07, 2019, 06:45:20 AM
Centering the pith is "nice to do" especially cutting timbers, its usually not needed. Keep a couple of various thickness pieces of sticking handy, pry up one end of the log with a peavey or bar and slide the sticking under. Frank C.
That's what I do. But then my logs aren't very big or heavy.
The point of leveling the pith, for me, is that my first slab comes off relatively even in relation to the log, but more importantly I get the most out of the log. If i don't level it, I take a very tapered slab off the top and usually have to take a couple of subsequent cuts to get a decent working width. When I flip the log, I lose even more on the other side. If I level the pith, I take an even amount off of both sides and it is a minimum amount giving me the most usable amount of wood to make lumber. Think about it a bit. It's a basic concept of getting value out of the log, at least with hardwoods that tend to have more taper than pines for instance. Some of my logs go from 20" to 16" in 12'. That's 4 " of loss off the first side before you clean off the length of the log, then another 2" before you have a decent width for the 12" log, so you have lost 6" (on the first side) before you start making boards. You will have the same or worse on the second side. Leveling the pith cuts that loss in half or more. The log I did tonight was about 1,500 pounds, so it takes a little effort, you can't easily pry up one end. but with some felling wedges it isn't really hard. Took me about 2 minutes.
Also, it those first slabs come off reasonably uniform in thickness, I can use them for other things besides firewood (like planter boxes, mill benches, firepit benches. or something else). All I can say is, it works for me, its worth the effort, and makes me happy. That's all I need. :) :D I have spent my life making a living, feeding my family, raising my kids, and now I am trying to make some joy for my soul. YMMV ;D (It's a Zen thing.)
Well I had a half day off today so I got home ready to roll, changed and headed dwon. This was our day to watch the 3 grandsons, so I had to come up and take them on a mandatory 'Mule ride' which required a stop at the mill of course. I apparently didn't have anything 'interesting' for them to do (I forgot that was my job), but there was a pile of sawdust that fit the bill for them.
I had only cut one slab off and was chomping to move forward and get the job done tonight, but I sunk into grandpa mode and just sat down and watched them play.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2697.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1561159538)
Anyway, when they got bored and I brought them back to Grandma but first we had to do a loop of the skid roads. I found a dead doe off in the bushes on the side of the lower road. Not sure what killed her, but I didn't want to stop with the boys. We decided she was resting and we shouldn't disturb her. I will have to deal with that tomorrow. Checked later, no idea what did her in. Her belly is green already.
Anyway I manged to cut the order and got it all out of one log. Pretty pleased with that, because the foks here have taught me how to plan out a log for the cut and I got the maximum out with only 1/2" to spare. (would have needed another log if I hadn't leveled the pith. ;D)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2700.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1561159463)
SO having done that and reached my goal for the day I brought it up to the hosue and loaded it on the trailer (10' is too long for my truck bed). while I was doing that one of my grandsons (4 YO) backed his John Deere tractor and trailer up to my trailer and hooked up. He asked if we could put a ball on his little trailer that would fit. :)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2702.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1561159540)
The he tried to move the trailer, cute (lots of grunting and 'OOOFFing'). I said "OK, if you got this, just haul it on up to Aunt Becki's and drop it off". He looked at me and said "HUH?". I guess I can dream, but some day...
joy for my soul. I like that
Quote from: gdaddy01 on June 21, 2019, 08:16:12 PM
joy for my soul. I like that
There's more to that than you might guess. Lets just say I am giving myself a self-help healing program. We all go through things in life that are tough and hopefully we find ways to work through or deal with them. I have seen and done some things I would not wish on my worst enemy (if I had one) and I am trying to replace them in my mind with positive things. 4 years in 'the program' now and I am starting to see some progress. Small joys on a regular basis make a difference.
OG, you are not alone. luv ya buddy!!!
Yeah Doc, I am sure you have a little bit of that going on too. My cup overfilled and i am trying, with some success, to make some room. I know you get it as few can. Life IS getting better. Looking forward to getting up tomorrow and hitting it hard. There were a bunch of years I would never say that, so I figure it's getting better. :)
Well, yesterday was a bit of a mixed bag of chores. I ran the lumber up to my daughter's place and as I was only 5 minutes from @nybhh (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=38169) I stopped in for a ten minute visit to see the demo work preceding his next project. Its a big job, but moving along well. Then I headed home, put on the chainsaw pants, fetched to splutter from down in the woods and dragged it over to the neighbor who is giving me those logs. I cut up the branches, shorts, and smalls, then showed him how to run the splitter. He split while I cut and together we split him up a face cord. He seemed happy and had fun running the splitter. He is learning about wood and burning and stacking, etc. But he is learning fast. So we had fun. Now I can get into that big WO and work on pulling that out, then cut some more wood for him. Eventually it will all be cleaned up and he will have wood, I will have logs. win-win. I had time to sharpen both saws while he was splitting the last of it. They were overdue.
When I left to bring the splitter back to the wood lot, I ran into these cute little twins. They watched me unhook the splitter.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2707.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1561295796)
Its the second or 3rd time I have seen them, but no Momma around. I hope they are OK. They sure are cute. They watched me for 10 minutes then layed down in the grass. When I left, they were moving about again, but hung in the same area. Maybe waiting for somebody to come back?
Anyway, we had dinner, I closed up the mill and put tools away, then we headed over across the road for some music and a campfire. We all bagged it around 11pm.
Aside from listening to another neighbor punish his chainsaw for 9 hours, it was a very nice day.
Today I am a little slow getting going, but I think I will work on the benches a little more. I also MUST cut the grass today, it shot up with all the rain we had this week and is ugly. Also have to do some household chores to keep the boss happy.
Time to get to it, lets see what the day brings.
Well as I said, slow start today. Another mixed bag today. When I went down I ran into the twins again. No mamma. I think I have figured out what the deal is with them and I am keeping an eye on them. More on that in another post, or another thread.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2709.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1561332769)
I try to make 1 small improvement to the mill area every weekend. I had been getting tired of having to clean the break-room table before I could make coffee. SO I hung a sloped tarp to cover it. Hopefully I have enough side slope to shed the rain.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2712.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1561332734)
Then I finished trimming the leg stubs and the two table/benches I have on the work bench. They didn't come out too bad.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2716.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1561332798)
I re-sanded everything flush and applied another coat of tung oil to the tops. These are ash, I had hoped the tung oil would bring out the grain. It seems to.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2718.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1561332919)
While that was drying i started to think about the next bench. I still have some bottle jack legs with the boogered up tenons and it occurred to me that I could sand the tenons smooth and and mek them fit in a smaller hole better. I ordered a 1-3/8" forstner bit earlier in the week and it arrived Friday, so I knocked a hole in a piece of scrap (which I produce like a pro) and used that for a gauge. I went up to the shop and with some new belts on the big belt sander took them down to fit in the hole pretty easily. Back down to the mill and I had to find something for the bench itself. I have some slabs laying around and there is a need for firepit benches all over the neighborhood. :) So I grabbed a 4' slab of maple, but the bark is still tight. I thought it would be a bear to get that bark off with a draw knife, but what the heck. You don't learn by sitting an thinking, you learn by doing, so I threw it up on the bench (I need a bigger bench already) and gave it a shot. Not only did it cut nicely with the draw knife, it came out DARN nice! Surely, it took some effort, but well worth it and fairly quick.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2720.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1561332855)
It finished up pretty clean and smooth. No need for further finishing here.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2723.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1561332921)
Then I turned my attention to the face. Turns out I grabbed a slab with a mis-cut in it and there was a 1/4" step that had to be smoothed out. (No photo of that, sorry, I should have). Well I have this battery planer i borrowed from my son and last week @nybhh (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=38169) and I were emailing back and forth about whether it could do wide surfaces. I did some tests that were inconclusive but my summation was that it would be a lot of work with questionable results. For surfaces 3" or less, this tool is a killer. It also miters corners. So here i was with a lot of wood to remove to flatten this thing out. This was a real test, because if I screwed it up, it would go in next weeks campfire. I ran back to the shop and got a couple of batteries and had at it. I tried different techniques, different depths of cut, different step overs and patterns. Here is one. I will say, this tool cuts.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2724.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1561333767)
You can also do some free-handing with it and I chamfered the top end edges. I also did the ends and it came out like glass.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2726.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1561333037)
When I was 'done' there were small step lines I just could not get out, try as I might.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2729~0.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1561333790)
It was getting late and I still had the lawn to mow, so I packed it in, but brought the slab up to the house with the sander. I rough sanded to get the lines out, that took around 15 minutes. Then I cut the grass and let the sander cool. I went back after the lawn with a 120 belt and finished it off and I thin it looks good. At this point i am always leaving in just a small area where the bandsaw cut are slightly evident as a reminder of how it was made. It's a fire pit bench after all.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2734.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1561333033)
The steps are all gone. It feels nice.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2736.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1561333068)
It was hot today (around 80) so I jumped between tasks a lot to mix it up. I am tired, but got a few things moved along. No idea what is on the list for the evenings this coming week, but I will try to get at least those first two benches finished up.
the twins look great. I have done benches (with a hand power planer) and the hard thing is if there is a twist. then you start high and end up low and the other side is the opposite. if you thin it (the cut depth) down a bit, just like with a hand plane, you can start doing 45° angles across the step offs and that will sometimes help. but i agree, there is only so much wood there. they look good!!!
8) 8) 8)
Quote from: Old Greenhorn on June 20, 2019, 10:54:24 PM
The point of leveling the pith, for me, is that my first slab comes off relatively even in relation to the log, but more importantly I get the most out of the log. If i don't level it, I take a very tapered slab off the top and usually have to take a couple of subsequent cuts to get a decent working width. When I flip the log, I lose even more on the other side. If I level the pith, I take an even amount off of both sides and it is a minimum amount giving me the most usable amount of wood to make lumber. Think about it a bit. It's a basic concept of getting value out of the log, at least with hardwoods that tend to have more taper than pines for instance. Some of my logs go from 20" to 16" in 12'. That's 4 " of loss off the first side before you clean off the length of the log, then another 2" before you have a decent width for the 12" log, so you have lost 6" (on the first side) before you start making boards. You will have the same or worse on the second side. Leveling the pith cuts that loss in half or more. The log I did tonight was about 1,500 pounds, so it takes a little effort, you can't easily pry up one end. but with some felling wedges it isn't really hard. Took me about 2 minutes.
Also, it those first slabs come off reasonably uniform in thickness, I can use them for other things besides firewood (like planter boxes, mill benches, firepit benches. or something else). All I can say is, it works for me, its worth the effort, and makes me happy. That's all I need. :) :D I have spent my life making a living, feeding my family, raising my kids, and now I am trying to make some joy for my soul. YMMV ;D (It's a Zen thing.)
Excellent post !
Well, the weather is changing again and the temp keeps going up, as well as the humidity. I only have about 2 hours a night after work during the week to get any work done and this last week the mosquitoes have been extremely friendly around sunset down at the mill. It's hard to focus. Last night I was gluing legs on another bench and it was hard not to slap at them with glue all over my hands. The only way I can get some relief is to smoke a cigarette, they hate the smoke, it confuses them and they leave me alone. I had 3 in 45 minutes last night. Barely got an hour in before I surrendered. I loaded up the other two benches in the mule and brought them up with me.
I can't work in the shop still because my son's truck is still going through the second engine swap of the year. Hopefully that will be out soon. But I did a little cleaning in my shed over the weekend and I had room in there. SO I figured out how to clamp some supports on those legs so I can cut them off even in the mill. Got both benches rigged and back in the Mule for tomorrow night. The last cutting adventure was not so good, hopefully this one will be better. Working on the process.
One of the new neighbors asked if I could perhaps make benches for their back yard wedding in September. Not sure what they have in mind, but that could be more work than I can handle. I don't exactly have a stock pile of slabs. Hopefully they just want a few for the fire pit area. That I can do.
SO I think I will be transitioning away from working at the mill in the evenings and do what I can in the shop or shed. It's getting kind of hot. I started thinking about this time last year and realized I was pretty much 'done' because of the heat, and my firewood was finished. I didn't have the mill, so I let the woods take care of themselves during the main heat season. Now I have to figure out how to work through that. I think I will slow up on the posts here also, because I sense too much drivel and not enough content of any interest. No photos from last night, I was just trying to get it done and think it through. I will get pictures of the leg cutting so I can remember how I did it. (assuming it works.)
I also have to get back on what WAS going to be my first project of the spring: Building a doghouse shed for the generator. I want the lid to lift off and the two sides to fold down giving it room to breath. I got side tracked and didn't have any solid ideas on how I wanted it. I began sketching last night and think I have something workable now. I could start cutting the bill of materials this weekend and build it in the shed in the evenings next week if I have the right stock sizes available. More news when I have something.
the wedding benches could be slabs you have cut off cants. and just stumps for legs, spaced down the slab. the neat thing if the neighbor does not want them all, is they can be rented or loaned, and then made into other things. i had made four about 8 feet long for a chapel service in BSA, and now they are all made into other things.
Well, as I just wrote to Jeff in another post, sometimes you get lucky. We decided I would go down before dinner tonight and get setup while my wife cooked, then I would come up to eat, go back down and cut the legs on the two benches/ I have been fretting over this, the last time I cut legs it was pretty iffy and a bit ugly.
SO I went down and it went pretty well. I already has the benches braced up when I took them down. The first bench dropped right in between the bunks perfect! It was, of course, an accident but I'll take it. It cut OK, but I was so tensed up trying to go very gently so it wouldn't grab.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2747.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1561596395)
The second one was longer, so I cut the 2 fronts legs, then re-clamped so the back legs were right over a bunk and cut those. Again, like a charm, but I was tensed up the whole time.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2749.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1561596473)
I got them done so fast that i had time to clean up and load them in the Mule to bring up to the shed for finishing. Then went in for dinner. As we were eating, the skies opened up with a severe line of thunderstorms. It came down in buckets. I am SO glad I didn't have everything spread out and opened up at the mill, which was the plan originally. SO we ate, I waited until the line passed, went out to the shed, dressed off the bottom of the legs, flipped them, and put on the first coat of verathane. It looks a little streaky, but lets see how it dries.
Bench #1:
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2754.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1561596459)
Bench #2:
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2755.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1561596497)
These are not the works of art I see from others here, but I am learning and messing around. I am not getting too invested in them until I know what I am doing a little better. Still, not too bad for a first attempt. Tomorrow a light sand and another coat. :)
Quote from: doc henderson on June 26, 2019, 08:57:41 PM
the wedding benches could be slabs you have cut off cants. and just stumps for legs, spaced down the slab. the neat thing if the neighbor does not want them all, is they can be rented or loaned, and then made into other things. i had made four about 8 feet long for a chapel service in BSA, and now they are all made into other things.
Good idea Doc. I would have to find a way to attach them and make them secure. I don't think I can come up with enough dry slabs in time. Also, I am not sure what level of sophistication they have in mind. She is a NYC radio personality, and he work on Wall St.. I need just a little more detail, like how many people, how many benches, how fancy, etc. If they come up this weekend, we can talk.
i can tell you most of the young docs are doing rustic for even fancy weddings. "It is all the rage" as they say. It does not have to be dry dry, just surface dry. make some 1.5 to 2 inch slabs out of those short 6 foot logs you have talked about. flat on both sides with live edge. and just firewood logs cut on the mill to be all the same height and parallel and they will not need to be fastened if the log diam. is wide enough relative to the length (height). you might take a 1/2 inch round over bit and soften the top edges. can even angle the joint at a log support and make a half circle, or two rows with an isle down the center. can make kneeling benches, and archway, a cross. email me a photo of the couple and i will engrave it on some maple for you. when is this wedding, you got a lot of work to do. i have two docs to make cookies and engrave their names on and people will sign the wood instead of a guest book.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/51041/6D6CF4ED-B88E-472C-B2B6-1E1020C27835.jpeg?easyrotate_cache=1549490751)
walnut center pieces with danish oil finish.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/51041/3F88CDA5-3422-4A51-9B6D-E4E0EF45BEF5.jpeg?easyrotate_cache=1559250604)
OB/GYN and Pediatrician, and their kids on their wedding day.
Thanks Doc. Let me talk to them and see what they have in mind before I go over the edge. my wife might kill me if I spend my summer making stuff for somebodies wedding, but I would like to help them out. Lets see what they have in mind.
What? not go over the edge! might make some nice stair treds when they are done with them.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/51041/74C455D4-17FB-4F12-985C-237422700036.jpeg?easyrotate_cache=1561601600)
getting dark but this is a 10 foot bench out by my campfire/burn barrel. not much to it.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/51041/F4B03D26-9473-4E51-84BE-C190D3E7E599.jpeg?easyrotate_cache=1561601598)
tea lights using your already purchased forstner bits.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/51041/B6AA9F67-B4D3-47C0-83BE-73085B2F2499.jpeg?easyrotate_cache=1561601809)
maple coasters and wine glass holder, engraved names on the glasses
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/51041/FE3EA09A-F6F4-4F5B-9FBD-ACF3C0908489.jpeg?easyrotate_cache=1561601798)
the 2 blond twins that i took care of in our NICU in hays, Ks 22 years ago. wt 1 and 1.7 Kg. The smaller one, Jordan getting married (was the 2.2 pound one and is still smaller). their mom and family remain part of our family. It is good to participate in the lives of others. they were delivered early since one stopped growing and the other was getting all the nutrition. I think they turned out OK. i was asked to say the opening prayer at the wedding reception.
I think the benches are great. I have wanted to make some thru tenon legs but never seem to do it. Also Doc how thick are those walnut cookies and how quickly were they oiled after cutting?
3/4" by 10 to 12 inch. the larger diameters will put more stress on the sap wood and crack. i.e. 24 inches will crack. soaked for a few hours in denatured alcohol, then air dried a bit and then staggered in boxes for a week or two. opened daily and rearranged. this slowed the drying. 5 gal denatured etoh at menards for 32 bucks a can. then a run through a drum sander (planer will tear them apart with end grain), then danish oil and done. I made fifty, and after friends and family took some, i got about 30 back.
Quote from: doc henderson on June 23, 2019, 09:27:36 PM
I have done benches (with a hand power planer) and the hard thing is if there is a twist. then you start high and end up low and the other side is the opposite. if you thin it (the cut depth) down a bit, just like with a hand plane, you can start doing 45° angles across the step offs and that will sometimes help.
Man Doc, you hit this one right on the head. I glued legs on that slab last night and when I stood it up I could see a smooth twist going right down the length. DanG! Well, it's a junky little bench anyway and nobody could notice when their butt is on it, so I will let it go. More education.
I ran out at lunch time today to make my monthly Lowes donation and picked up one of those planers for myself. They had a deal with the battery, so I jumped in. Was picking out finishes in the paint dept and muttered something under my breath, the guy standing next to me agreed and the next thing you know, we were talking about furniture repair, tulip wood, and sawmills for the next 25 minutes. There went my lunch hour.
OK, so I am SO done with the tables. It was a learning experience, but now it is time to move on. I put the last cost on at 5:30 this morning before work. I will deliver them tomorrow when it is fully cured. The came out 'OK' and I learned a lot. I still have them same issues I had as a 14 year old wherein I have no patience for applying finishes and waiting. I hate that, I always will.
Anyway, these aren't too bad and the new owner will be happy. He knows the history of the wood and the tables will sit within 100' of where the tree grew. This particular tree nearly killed me when I took it down through a freak occurrence, but that is another story.
This is the long one for under the owners picture window in the pool room.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2770.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1561767749)
I put the live edge down on this one, not sure why.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2771.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1561767742)
The Tung Oil did bring ut the grain as I had hoped. Both tables are ash.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2769.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1561767675)
This short one is to go between two chairs in a sitting section of the pool room.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2767.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1561767612)
You can see on this edge that the EAB damage is apparent. I figure years into the future, the owner can use this to explain why these beautiful trees are no more in our mountains.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2761.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1561767607)
SO now it's time to move on. I have a maple bench in the works now but it has a twist and I used up the bottle jack legs on it, It will be an ugly step child at best. I will knock it out and give it to a neighbor for a fire pit bench.
I have to get that doghouse built for the generator, so I best get it started. I will lose most of tomorrow to birthday parties and family celebrations, then maybe Sunday I can get something started. There seems to be no end to the work of improving the work area at the mill, sometimes it uses more time than the projects. OK, most times. I think I am feeling pressure over this wedding bench thing. Gotta get that figured out.
I put the live edge down cause it looks like that is how it is supposed to be (to me). more surface area. I soften the edge that can be sharp with a router. 1/8th to 1/2 inch radius. I think those look great, 100% rustic with a bit of elegance. perfect for a pool room ect. looks like you got the through tenon thing goin on! hard not to split out on the back side. they seem to be fitting well.
I am a live edge up kind of guy. I like to show it off.
OGH, on slabs with twist, you can put them back on the sawmill, shim them so that they do not rock, clamp them, then take a very light skim cut to make the top flat. Then you use the flat face to run down on the planer bed, planing the other side flat. Then flip and plane the side that you flattened on the sawmill just a little bit to get it smooth.
That's good idea WDH I will hang onto. This one is only 1.5" thick and is a top slab so the 'bottom' is full round. It would take a lot of work and a jig to get it back on the mill. Not worth it for a short small bench. You won't be able to feel it with your butt when you are sitting on it. ;D :D
BUT on something of size, your idea would work great.
Yeah Doc, I left the live edge up on that short one because it had so much character. I wanted the bug tracks to show. It tells a story. Also, there is a nice flare on one side because this was just above the butt.
A former co-worker saw the photo and now she wants me to make her a TV table with a shelf. That will be a new challenge I hadn't planned on. Maybe I should stop posting photos. ;D
and so it begins. be sure to get what you need. I find it helpful for someone to ask for something to push me to try new stuff and learn how to be more efficient. I do not charge but for Doc friends and other that can chip in, I let them donate to my polyurethane fund. to cover expenses but let them determine the amount. a few were going way overboard so I trended them down. no charge for vets, or in memorandum. I am just a hobby guy, so decide to take care of your self so you start off that way and it gets passed on with word of mouth business. might at least help with consumables, maintenance, and a few new toys as needed, like that planer.
Yeah, that is kind of the direction I am headed in too Doc. I did pick up that planer, but figured the top board job covered most of that cost. (OK, Half, close enough.) I am waiting for the wedding neighbors to show up so that I can get a better handle on what they wanted. I have to get rid of those two tables this morning too. Losing most of the day to birthday parties today and we have t-storms coming, so I am just chilling this morning, which I don't get to do much. It feels a little weird.
OK @doc henderson (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=41041) , i had a talk with the Happy couple today and cleared some things up while trying to draw a bead on what the expectations were. They changed their mind about benches and wanted something that was a little more 'built up' and I explained all that wood would have to be dried, planed, joined, the benches built and a lot of finishing work that was more than I could handle without equipment. They had already arranged to rent them, thinking it was way too much work, for such short usage. I did offer up 2" slabs on log rounds or hay bales, they liked that and the wood is reusable later. But enough slabs for 75 butts folks is a lot. It will be a 'lets see if we can get that one in' type of thing.
They had focused their request down to asking if making a bar would be too much. I told them that was very appropriate and would like the challenge. i have posted some basic questions on this over in the woodworkers section.
They also asked about some table bling and I suggested your tea candle thingies, they liked that. Also maybe something to put the flowers on. I mentioned the photos you etch and she got really excited. Sorry, I may have to take you up on that offer. How big do you make those?
We walked their yard and talked through the layout so I could get an idea of what they really wanted in case there was an opportunity to do something neat. I helped the measure out where the tent would be, etc. In doing so I threw out some ideas and when I left they had re-arranged everything and were much happier, it made more sense to them. She asked if they could take me on as a wedding planner. Not bloody likely. ;D
I worked on that twisted table just a little today and got the legs cut. I seem to be getting a tad better at that. This will wind up being a child's bench, I think. I may keep it in the shop for my grandsons or something like that. It's only 13" high. I have been having some trouble with my Mule in the last two weeks. I have narrowed it down to either the fuel pump, pump relay, or (worst case $$$) the igniter module. Changed the fuel filter today because it could have been an issue (when I rebuilt this 2 years ago, the tank was dry and rusty, I cleaned it as best I could, but....) that was FULL of fine rust, holy cow I have never seen so much. It didn't change the condition. I put a volt meter on it, and got it to finally exhibit the intermittent problem. Pretty sure it's the pump, but these things are so tightly coupled it becomes a chicken and egg thing. The pump is on order, hopefully it gets here before next weekend. It got really bad this afternoon. I took the opportunity to give it a wash and clean out the bed to get it presentable for the festival I use it at in a few weeks. I need to touch up the spray bedliner a bit. I also need it to be 100% reliable for that week.
The weather is getting hotter so my workdays are getting less productive. The mosquitoes down at the mill aren't helping either. Normally I am beginning my festival preps by now, but I have that on autopilot and am just going to ride along and do whatever I have done for the last ten years. I have lists. I do need to shop and replace some gear that is worn out though.
Is it butts or butt cheeks? cause that would cut the number in half. and maybe that last one was cut in half. :) . glad your wife gave you permission to go off the edge as we discussed earlier. i am happy to do an engraving for a friend. need a pic with little background, emailed at at least 600 dpi. or it can be done after if they want a professionally taken photo engraved. Phone pics are fine if in focus, and you can give them my email and have them send it.
if i were making a bar, I would make it with an almost 2 x 4 framed front, that can be covered with any kind of wood/boards. two back legs connected by aprons at the top to the front, and reinforcement at the bottom with a shelf going across to keep the whole thing from torquing (not twerking). i would have a lower back top at 30 to 36 inches high, and the top bar slab can fasten to the 2x4 framed wall at the top at about 48 inches tall. i bet width and length will not matter too much if it is all proportioned nicely. then if the top slab moves a little, it is resting on 2x4 wall and the twist will not matter as much. 3 days or more before the wedding it should/could be flattened on the mill, and finished or not depending what you (the wedding planner) has recommended to the couple. I always thought more of the movie wedding crashers when I think of you, but i guess the wedding planner from father of the bride is not too much of a stretch. :D :D :D
my laser can do 18 x 24 inches, but it has to be high resolution as to not pixelate at a larger size. i usually just do it with what width of maple I have, and crop the photo to look nice and the resulting size is what you get. in photos the grain needs to run left to right, not up and down. if a photo is too much trouble, I can at least engrave the names and wedding date onto something for the table. if it is still rustic, you can cut little cookies for the reception tables, and people put mason jars on them with flowers and such.
i would say the for 75 folks you would need 150 linear feet of slabs, butt these as mentioned could be flat sawn, and prob. only take a few hours to make, if unfinished ect. and if they provide hay bales. I will leave that up to you. if the logs are hard to come by, and you do not have a market for slightly used, albeit sat upon slabs, you may not want to go there.
you and they have a few months to decide. thanks for letting me help a little, and let me know what I can do.
Frustrating week here. I took the initiative and ordered a new carb for the generator before it failed. It was leaking and I am tired of patching it. the aftermarket one is 'not quite' the same and it I could not get ti to run at full speed. So I quit on that to do more research and I think I will take parts out of the new one to fix the old one, If not, I'll get the right carb. This means running back and forth to the mill a lot which is my 2nd issue. The Mule has an intermittent problem mentioned earlier which is getting worse. Up till now it would just slow me up a bit, now it is getting to where I may just get stuck wherever it quits on me. I am reduced to foot power which doesn't allow me to carry my boatload of tools around. I hope that pump arrives soon, I have a lot to do this weekend.
Spent last night working on a co-workers 455 rancher. Glad I don't own one, but I did find his problem and returned it to him today for him to do the final fix. What a pain to work on!
Maybe I'll just mow the lawn tonight if it doesn't rain. Oh, and the wife's van is now running very rough and sickly. Getting a pro to look it over today. We need it for her Craft show Saturday, if it's not reliable, she misses out and looses income, first show of the season for her. She in not happy and you can guess how that goes.
I would hate to lose a 4 day weekend over broken down gear with so much to do.
The frustration continues. Still waiting for the new fuel pump to arrive for the Mule and hoping that is the true solution to it's behavior. Time is running short, I have 7 days until I load it on the trailer for the festival week, which is the main reason I bought it in the first place, for just one week a year.
Anyway. I piddled with stuff around the house, delivered that last bench to a neighbor, and did a test with epoxy. That stuff is covered over in The Bar Top Thread (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?topic=106904.0). I wanted to at least select the slabs for the bar and get the joined edges cut, but I have not been to the mill in a week now. Abyway, I re-learned what I remembered about working with epoxy (it's messy, you have little time, you'd better have everything planned out well, etc) and repaired the 1st bench I made a month ago just for fun. It was cracked when I made it, but a glue fill failed big time (I needed to prove that to myself, there is success in failure). The epoxy seems as strong nails, I am amazed. I sanded it it and re-oiled, later adding a coat of urethane. I'll do a little more today.
It's been really hot, so heavy work is not appealing. The wife had a craft fair/street festival on Saturday as a vendor. She makes very nice quilted goods and this is a low risk, comfortable, town wide celebration in Roxbury, NY that she did last year and broke even. Better hopes for this year and she only does it if I go to help with the booth setup. It's a long day, we get up at 4:30 to be there by 6:30 to setup which takes 3 hours. Then I sit all day, or wander. There was a guy 3 booths down selling his wood products, everything from tuned bowls, cutting boards, some benches, tables, and some highly figured small slabs for wall hangings. It wasn't a lot of stuff, just a little of each. I stopped by once and we chatted. He let me look his stuff over and we talked techniques. I learned some things from his stuff that tells me I am on the right track. He had nice surfaces and great wood selections of unique pieces, but I thought his mechanics (legs and how they are attached, overall stability, and longevity) could have been better. ( he used deck screws and commercial lumber.) He did some things I had considered, but am now glad I didn't. Don't get me wrong, I am not knocking his stuff, his customers will get good value and his prices were quite fair. His 'eye' was simply not the same as mine, so I learned something. We had an enjoyable chat passing the time. I am thinking about making some pieces for a test sale at an event like this, not doing 'the circuit' like my wife does, I have been down that road with her for 20 years, not for me. But maybe some small stuff, child stools, things like that which are roughly elegant. I am thinking on it. This would be a good show to try, it's cheap, non-juried and I could work with my wife sharing the load. She can't do the very heavy lifting anymore. I was encouraged to see a vendor that made nice wood lawn furniture and porch swings had sold a small trailer load of stuff, so there are some buyers there. My wife more than doubled her sales from last year. (Location and show changes) It started raining as we packed up, so we have drying to do today. >:(
Back home late, and we have yet to unpack the van. Today more knocking around. Will sand and add another coat on that table. Probably walk down to the mill. This fuel pump is killing me. I ordered it last Sunday and picked a supplier in Jersey, it is only 200 miles away, figured it would get here faster than from CA, but it went from NJ, to PA, and has been sitting in CT for 3 days now, just marked as 'Transferred to USPS' this is nuts. I ordered a carb on Tuesday from OH, and it arrived yesterday, all thru USPS.
It's been really hot here, so I am not about to set the world on fire cranking out work, but sitting is killing me. Motivation is beginning to die. With the light rain last evening things seem to have cooled a bit. I should work on my packing lists for next week and check gear.
This is KILLING me! 10 days since I ordered the fuel pump and the tracking stopped in CT on Friday, 50 miles away, 5 days ago. How long can it take to ship a 1 pound box just 125 miles? I sent the seller a nasty-gram tonight because I have no idea if I will ever see it. I don't want apologies, I NEED the pump. SO I ordered another one, from a different supplier, paid the expedited shipping, and pleaded for them to ship as soon as possible. They say "by Friday" but Thursday is better and last week would have been best. I have not got a darn thing done and am too depressed to do anything else. I will try to improve my poor attitude tonight.
Just got home for the day. synchronize our watches, and in 10 minutes from now, I will have a beer with you! smiley_beertoast
OG, you did everything right yet you're the one that's getting put in a bind. Hopefully the second carb will arrive and fix the problem. It's enough to put anybody in a state.
Probably a good thing you re-ordered. Around here, when it says "transferred to USPS for final delivery", it is cause for alarm. 50/50 at best. I had the strangest conversation of all time with the manager of the PO here one time after the tracking stalled at "transferred to USPS" for several days. Perhaps I'll detail that sometime in the thread dedicated to morons.
Hang in there. After this kind of aggravation, karma says the new carb will arrive, it'll take care of the problem, and you can get back to worrying about the real stuff.
Hah, just saw this 10 minutes after you posted. I may have started 2 minutes before you. 8)
I walked down to the mill tonight, did nothing just checked things out. All secure, but you remember this photo of my bench when I made it?
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2548.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1558903643)
The legs and top came from a punky EWP 15 years dead on the stump. You can see the slabs are butted up against each other , you could not see through the gap. Now, here it is tonight, same angle, just a little closer. A full 3/8" gap!
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2797.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1562717888)
Both joints are like that. Pretty amazing. It's outside, just under a tarp, so no direct rain.
Also got some photos of the table I repaired over the weekend. 3 coats of verthane over danish oil. Before it was firewood, but now it's sold and will probably go by my neighbors dart board in the game room. We need a place to set a beer.
The crack you see is a natural split, not a drying crack, it goes clean through and about 1/3 the length of the slab.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2798.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1562718455)
Filled with epoxy in 2 pours.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2805.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1562718507)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2806.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1562718524)
It's white ash. This also came from the tree that almost killed me. Anyway, it's done, just sitting waiting for delivery.
AT least I got out for a walk.
Well, the dang fuel pump arrived today from the first seller, and now I have another due in on Friday SMH. At this point if I missed the root cause and it is not the fuel pump I have no time to get the next part inline, so I bit the bullet today and ordered the fuel pump relay for overnight delivery from CA. This $15. problem is getting an $80. solution, but at this point I don't care. It's messing up my life and I need to get back on track. Ever have that happen? some stupid thing that just throws you off and has an effect on everything else you do? I am not a happy camper, but I will try to sneak out a little early, get home and get this fixed.
8) 8) 8)
OK, the dang thing works. I had to crimp on right sized terminals and it's tight working in there, but I got it done i a few minutes. Seems to work better than the previous one. It does not cycle as much to keep it running at idle like the old one. That one would click slow and steady, this one is more less frequent. I am thinking the old one did not shut off when it should and was pushing too much fuel which is why it always burned rich when it idled and you could smell it. It doesn't do that anymore. AT any rate I have a backup pump coming as a spare and the fuel pump relay, just in case. Took it for a long run and it seems solid. Now I have to start my festival prep and packing and get focused. Gonna get a little time on the mill Saturday morning and then re-purpose the mule for use at the festival. I run about 15 gallons of gas through it in 7 days, I can't afford a failure. My purpose there is to work as part of the EMS crew providing public safety and first aid or emergency services as required. My job is to loop the 80 acre site looking for problems before they become problems, search for lost kids, and assist the non-professional partyers survive the week. ;D
Here is my rig last year just arriving where I camp in the Artist/Sponsor camping section:
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF1764.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1562799302)
And this is a partial overview of what will be my office for the next week: There is more behind the camera. We have about 5,000 full weekend cmaping passes and we get a few thousand more each day on day tickets. It's a comfy little Bluegrass festival.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/GF_overview.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1562799257)
It's a lot of ground to cover. I used to do it on foot, but I am getting too old for that and the Mule gets me where I need to be when something goes sideways.
Anyway, I can stop worrying about that and focus on getting ready. Lots to do yet. I also want to get those slabs pulled for the bar and figure out my edge cuts.
:) :) :) have fun!
Quote from: doc henderson on July 10, 2019, 07:35:53 PM
:) :) :) have fun!
It's the center of my year Doc. Working as 1/40th of the medical crew, mostly doing 14 hour days because I enjoy it, 5 days of great music, what's not to like? I have about 3 days left to prep and pack, I think I can do this. it's my 9th year.
Could you tell me the name of the festival, and location. It sounds like one that I would like to attend. Never make it this year. Maybe another time.
Thanks
Harry
Quote from: HP on July 11, 2019, 02:08:54 PM
Could you tell me the name of the festival, and location. It sounds like one that I would like to attend. Never make it this year. Maybe another time.
Thanks
Harry
Sure HP, it's the Grey Fox Bluegrass Festival, more than 5 stages, no waiting :) They have a great website that is easy to find, also a couple of FB pages that are useful. Always a good lineup with a nice eclectic mix. If you don't enjoy anything but straight traditional Bluegrass and cannot tolerate those who do, you might not have a great time, but if you have an open mind and can handle the mix of traditional and slightly more progressive, and a little of the downright "what is THAT!?" stuff, you will have a blast. Great crowd, family oriented, in a pretty spot. It's in Oak Hill, NY. Don't let the big numbers scare you, it's very friendly. If you are a picker, well, then it just gets better and better, the jamming goes all night (in some areas).
Not sure where you are, but c'mon up, over, down, or whatever applies. Look me up when you do. I'll be wearing a ball cap. ;D ;D :D :D
Thanks alot. My son has been there a couple of times and has assured me that I wouldn't fit. I am traditional all the way. However I do like Dry branch.
Thanks much,
Harry
Quote from: HP on July 12, 2019, 01:34:15 PM
Thanks alot. My son has been there a couple of times and has assured me that I wouldn't fit. I am traditional all the way. However I do like Dry branch.
Thanks much,
Harry
Did you ever consider maybe your son is trying to keep this party to himself? ;D :D They have a pretty good bill for the traditional folks, Del McCoury, Steep Canyon rangers, Gibson Brothers, Jim Gaudet, The Earls of Leicster (always a favorite of mine, Jerry is a funny guy and a sweet man, I enjoy every time we meet) nd of course Dry Branch, Ron and I share the same humor and I always enjoy talking with him. But if you can't take the other stuff I can see why it wouldn't be for you. I like it all and walk away from the stuff that is too much, and it's easy to find something else I like in just a few minutes, given the options. Besides, I am 'working' most of the time, I average about 12 hours a day because I like the job. You will find me cruising around to various campsite jams at 2 or 3am most days. Then back up at 7 and do it all again.
I spent my evening getting the Mule changed over from mini-logger mode to festival mode. Peeling off the decals from the last fest so I can put the ones on for this fest tomorrow in good light. I dumped all the logging and sawing gear in the mill shed and brought up the stove and some other stuff. Fixed a few things that needed it and cleaned out a years worth of collected junk in the glove boxes. I fixed the FM antenna that I only use at the fests, got the CD player secured, repacking my tool bags, etc. Tomorrow I switch to packing personal stuff and the campsite gear. It;s a good party with good people, and hard work and long days just make me comfortable (but I am done doing the overnight shifts, I see to be a 'shift magnet' never did I get more than 15 minutes sleep).
This should be under the 'Did something dumb today' thread, but the were so injuries so it doesn't quite qualify. However the number of mistakes I made make it very humorous and even embarrassing for me. But I can laugh at myself. I was doing pretty good on my packing and prep for my weeks work and somehow got the thought "Hey wouldn't it be neat if I took one of those odd slabs down at the mill, finished it up quick and used the stove stands as legs. We would have a nice little slab bar. That should be easy.'
Well, the slab I grabbed was a split working it's way into two stems. There was bark to clean out between them in order to get to solid wood. I was going to do a 'quick pour' (hold that thought) to fill cracks, sand it in the morning, put on some danish pile, then a couple of coats of verathane and it should be good enough to go on Monday Morning.
SO a lot of folks say you can use blue painters tape to seal a crack on the bottom side and pour epoxy over it/ "It works great!" they say. Yeah... well, no, not really. But I am all about making the mistakes, once. So I tried it, I had a bunch to fill and only one shot. I mixed up all I had left, hoping it would cover. It started well, then it all started draining out. tried a few things with no luck and wound up with 20 bucks worth of epoxy in a puddle on the ground. From the top it didn't look too bad.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2824.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1563064252)
I laughed and got a beer and went to sit in the hot tub and laugh at myself. I was pretty disgusted with what I had done. After I changed and had dinner I went out to try and salvage it. Wow, I had a hard time just getting ti off the support wood and needed a pry bar. Then peeling off the rap I had under it was another issue, got that foo and found this big 3/8" thick blob on the bottom. I shouldn't have waited. Well, that is a lesson well learned now.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2825.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1563064260)
SO water pump pliers, knife, and chisel went to work to try and get the bulk off. What a neat-o' mess! I dang near undid all the fine effort my Chiropractor did yesterday.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2828.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1563064347)
I got a bunch and left some, it should sand OK when fully cured. There is enough cured solid in the bottom of the split that it should hold fine on a second pour, (I can't believe I am saying that, here we go again) but at this point I don't know if I can get it workable in a timely manner. Maybe if I start at 5am or earlier?
I am still wondering why I am doing this and 'just for fun' is the only answer I can come up with, but it doesn't feel like fun just yet. I am squeezing in something I don't have the time for and don't need to do. Maybe it's the challenge of throwing it together on short notice.
I'll let you know what happens, even if it's a bust, but I don't accept failure well. Tomorrow might be a long day.
Don't skimp on the tape over the bottom :D Any little side cracks or internal checks, and it WILL find them. I tend to put on a couple of layers, running at 90°. Then put down newspapers as well. Yes I've glued a newspaper to the bottom of the slab a couple of times. I also plane / sand roughly before I epoxy, any saw marks make it easy for the goo to sneak out past the tape.
At least you got to it before it glued itself to the table completely. Anyway, nothing is ruined, and it can be fixed with some time and muttered bad words
Funny, I did almost all that. I had pre-sanded to level it all, took and air hose and blew all the dust out, got good tape holds, put the tarp under it just in case. and yeah. it did adhere to the table. I actually could not get it off without a pry bar and it pulled some wood OF the table that stuck to the slab. One thing I will say, this epoxy is strong! Trying to decide if I have the time to pull it off tomorrow, It will be a "Table top in a day project" if I can fit it in between packing the truck and trailer.
All in good fun right? :D
OK, I have put off updating this thread for 2 weeks, not because I lost interest but because I have been way too busy. I have not even been able to keep up with my reading here. When we left off I had that mess of a table slab I was trying to whip out at the last minute. Well the next morning I was working on it at 5 am, got it sanded flat, cleaned up the mess I had made the day before which was extensive. I reset everything and re-masked it, did another pour with 30 year old epoxy and prayed as I went back to my other packing for the week. It cured slower than normal and I though all was lost as I checked it during the day. Oh well.
By around 8pm it was pretty well cured, but not fully hard. I worked on it for a few hours cleaning sanding and planing and sanding some more. I put some oil on it and by about 11pm I applied a heavy coat of verathane and prayed again. The next morning I loaded it on the trailer and it was just a tad tacky. BUT, it worked and made Here is the slab the night before I loaded it up.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2851.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1564343945)
So I did the festival, the Mule worked just fine (my spare parts showed up 1 day after I left). We become the largest town in the county when this is going on with about 6-8,000 in daily attendance (5,000 resident full weekend campers and pickers). I did 3 days of prefest setting up, then worked all evening shifts for 4 days (7pm to 1am) mostly easy work with a few challenging cases along the way. We used 6 ambulances over the 4 days. It is very good field experience, but as an OLD GUY it is pretty much routine for me.
My office for the week:
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2863.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1564344664)
Most stuff is heat related, almost no drugs, a little bit of alcohol. I had one near death, seizures, snoring respiration, unconscious, unable to maintain airway. Pretty easy job but the patient refused to go to the hospital for elevated care and IV fluids he really needed. Tied up 15 people and took 2 ambulances out of service while he argued he was fine. He finally went.
It was very hot, heat index around 105 most days. I did not catch any music during the day just trying to hydrate and get ready for my shift. I left the site at 9pm Sunday and could barely keep my eyes open driving home. Unpacked Monday and could not hang and dry everything dues to some small showers moving through. I thought I could use my evenings during the week to get a little done each night and have it all good to go for next year. But things were about to change......
Enter Rushad:
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/RushadTakesAIr.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1564345119)
So I have this friend, Rushad Eggleston who is a touring musician, probably one of the 3 best cello players in the world now IMHO. I have not seen him in 2 years, but keep up with his music and travels through you tube and Facebook, he tours the world and he posts a lot. I know, you are wondering what this has to do with milling, but read on, I will get there eventually.
SO Wednesday night, late, I see one of his typical posts with tour dates and he is playing in my part of the world (NE USA) and he has an OPEN NIGHT! More importantly it is a Saturday night which is very rare (Usually Fridays and Saturdays are the 'anchor gigs' with decent money from a ticketed crowd and you fill in with house concerts and such between those gigs for much less money, but it pays for travel and lodging, hopefully). Having a Saturday opening blew me away. I love this guy a LOT, he has incredible talent and have always dreamed of hosting him for a concert. I sent him a note asking if I could set it up. He didn't see it. I knew we had little time, this was Wednesday night (LATE) and his date was Saturday. AT best, I would have less than 3 days to pull it all together. I vented to another musician friend and he sent a note to Rushad, who then checked his messages. By the time I arranged an actual phone call it was mid day Thursday. 2 days to show time, no pressure. I had to clear some contractual restrictions on his upcoming local gig at the end of the month to make sure we were clear to put it on. Then it hit me.. I have nothing ready for this. This man needs a stage. Yes, it is a 'house concert' in my backyard, folks bring their chairs and coolers and relax and enjoy. It's small, about 25-35 people, but this man is athletic and dynamic. He said, oh just give me a table or a board to stand on. I knew better. This is a guy that has been known to hang upside down from stage rigging or tree branches while playing his cello. I have seen him jump on speaker stacks, jump across security pits, crowd surf, all while playing his cello. No way am I giving him a table to stand on. ALso, I need stage lighting, a sound system and a ton of other stuff. I started to get my head in the game Thursday night. 48 hours, I can do this, I thought, but I was nervous. I also have to fill the house to make sure this is worth his while at 15 bucks a head, give or take. Kids are either free or a few bucks and we scheduled it for 7pm so we could get a bunch of kids involved.
Thursday night I mowed the lawn to get started and also get some tractor seat time to think it through. The grass was really high so it looked OK, but I had a lot of cut grass laying on top. Not pleased with that. Friday I left work at noon and headed to the mill (see, I told you I would get there). I found a couple of suitable logs but man doggy it was hot!
A stage in the making:
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2884.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1564347572)
About 800 pounds of green lumber, judging by the way the Mule handled it:
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2888.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1564347554)
It took me just under 3 hours to load and mill 4 2x8's and 3 2x6's but about 8-10 feet. I grabbed some filtches also and headed up the hill around 6pm soaked in sweat. I was just tuckered out from the heat and heavy work, I dumped the wood in the shop and jumped on the mower to go over the yard again and try to re-cut the top junk and spread it out. when that was done, I was really shot and I had not had lunch yet. I checked the fridge, no joy, grabbed some crackers. 24 hours to showtime. I went back to the shop and cut all the framing to length and arranged with my son to pick up and deliver 2 sheets of 1/2 plywood the next morning, saving me a 1 hour loop to town. by 9pm I was fully exhausted, I set up the coffee for the next morning and went to bed.
I was awake at 3am, beginning to stress, I got up at 4am. I vacuumed the main rooms in the house, cleaned the bathroom everyone would use and fixed the sticky toilet I have been putting off for years. Also drank 10 cups of that coffee to get me going. At 6am I started setting blocks for the stage after I picked a location based on the sun's position at show time and after.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2895.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1564347605)
My son had dropped off the plywood the might before and my son in law came by to help me finish off the stage and hang the basic lights they provided. We screwed some 10' filtches on the corners to hold the lights up, a bit shaky, but they worked just fine only they were not 'structurally sound'. I just needed to make Rushad aware of that so he didn't use them in his act for support (he did however use them as a source of fiber, but you kind f had to be there for that). When it was 'done' it looked OK after I added some royal blue carpet.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2901.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1564348002)
I was concerned that the lighting was all overhead and would not do the job in full darkness. I made a run to some other touring musicians down the road and caught them just before they headed out for their own weekend gigs to borrow their ' Duo road lighting kit' that they had offered the day before when I borrowed an amp. (Many thanks to Mike & Ruthie and The Mammals for this sage advice). Then I went to another neighbors to pick up the main amp.
Still I had a concern that this cheap plywood had some weak spots and with 24" centers might not hold up to what Rushad could lay down, so my son made another run and got me another sheet to cover the weak section in front. I set up the sound, added the front lights and the other plywood, then started calling to find out where my 'performing artist' was. we were 4 hours from showtime and he had a 3 hour drive. I expected him late morning, it was now 3pm. He said 'no worries' which drove me a little crazy because I had questions and wanted to create solutions for these to make it as perfect as possible. I have been at many 'sound checks from hell' and know what can go wrong and how much time it can take to make it right. I set about working on stupid details to keep me busy, ice for coolers, soda and juice for the kids, oh and I had not eaten anything but crackers since breakfast on Friday, I was shot and felt poorly. I needed a shower, so I did that too.
Rushad showed up 45 minutes before showtime and was very pleased with everything, he easily worked over my shortcomings, the show started 23 minutes late because we waited for the crowd to fill in and get settled, he was ready to go on time. My stress over getting enough folks to show up quickly went away. I had a few pleasant surprises in some folks i consider influential celebrity types that showed up, including Geoff Muldaur and a few others. I had invited John and Catherine Sebastian as well as Happy and Jane Traum and Jay Unger and Molly Mason who all sent their regrets due to touring obligations. Mike and Ruthy (The Mammals) were very regretful because they wanted to see this in the worst way, but they sent along a nice bottle of some special Jack Daniels for everyone to share. They have Rushad booked at their festival at the end of the month and as mentioned earlier provided technical advise and gear. SO, show time finally came:
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2907.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1564351390)
It may look like a small group, which it is, but we gathered around 35 folks, some of whom drove more than an hour to attend and collected a fair sum for my friend to continue his travels. Boston tonight, Colorado again next week, then back here (over the hill at a festival) at the end of the month. I had water supply problems at the house from having so many folks which I worked on a bit at 1am but fixed it finally this afternoon. It had no effect on the event, Just late night showers.
This is the 'post gig jam' around 1am which was small this time but fun. My son in law swapped out in instruments with Rushad and he played the fiddle like a cello, we had good music. I live for these moments.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2913.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1564351402)
This morning I took Rushad for a tour down to the mill before he headed to Boston. He is still pretty blown away that I grabbed some logs and made him a stage in 2 days.
Now I have done little to get this cleaned up today beyond fixing my water issues, but I can get a better start on it in the morning. I am just so tired, it sucks to get old. I am covering the afternoon shift this week for a vacationing supervisor, so I get to sleep late, which helps. I think I have found a home for the stage and will have to take it apart to move it, then re-assemble it, but that can be next weekend. I still haven't dried out my gear from Grey fox last week, so I have to do to too. I figure another week and I might be back on track, then I get ready for the next festival. Boy I wish I could retire and focus on the important stuff.
I believe we are caught up at this point. A few days of cleanup and extra sleep and I should get started on the bar project next weekend. Tight now I have all this left over beer from the concert that I need to get rid of.
Impressive effort OG!
Good job pulling a gig together on short notice, with a stage built from your own lumber!
QuoteThis is a guy that has been known to hang upside down from stage rigging or tree branches while playing his cello. I have seen him jump on speaker stacks, jump across security pits, crowd surf, all while playing his cello.
Never seen someone do that with a cello. Wow! :o
Quote from: Resonator on July 28, 2019, 10:19:57 PM
QuoteNever seen someone do that with a cello. Wow! :o
Go check him out on youtube, there are over a thousand videos of him. Everyone says "my friends HAVE to see this."
Just a quick update, I have been so busy with 'stuff' that I have barely had time to eat. The wife was away in Oregon for 2 weeks at her sisters and after that little house concert I spent time cleaning up, fixing my truck, shopping for a new truck, covering second shift for a supervisor on Vacation and trying to get my head back in the game. I have not run the mill since I made the stage. But I did drop a few hazard trees for a neighbor, trim the tops of 25 fence posts to his level line (my chainsaw accuracy is improving) and gotten roped into help with a cable suspension foot bridge restoration over at the Ashokan Center. This last one is something I am squeezing in because its worth it to help out. I can tell you more about the place and the project another time, but you can google the center, it's a neat place for outdoor education, music and more. I spent the evening there last night and tonight cutting mortises and fitting tenons. Not my strong suit, but I have it figured out now. They need some trees cut soon and I will be milling a few logs for them to use in this restoration and ongoing maintenance of the bridge. They also have a big hazard tree, I think it's a hickory they would like down, it's already broke and scares me a little, it's about 28" DBH on a side hill, difficult fall with lots of interesting stresses. I have no idea how we would get the logs out. They proposed come-a-longs. I laughed, hard. Too hard, I think. ;D ;D
Anyway, I pick up the new truck tomorrow after a LOT of running around for the loan, insurance, cash, etc. Then back to the Ashokan center to cut more mortises. I am also in the middle of installing, training, and setup of a million bucks worth of machinery which is not going well, so that stress is 'troublesome'.
Suffice to say I am staying out of trouble. In about 2-3 weeks things should calm down, but I said that a month ago and things keep happening. No, I have not lost interest in the mill, I am dying to get back to it, I have that bar to build and they need it only 5 weeks from now. I wish I were a bit younger. I'll do a more proper update with some photos as soon as I can find time, and take a few photos.
Tom
Another quick one. After work and dinner I am working over at The Ashokan center on a bridge restoration project just helping out. I spend my evenings cutting and fitting through mortises but they also have some trees to make into lumber that I am looking at and making plans on. Everybody there is either off work for the day, off to dinner, or working/playing at other things. There is a music camp in progress this week, so people are fond playing in any corner of the property at any given time and I can catch a show in the evening before I head home if I like, as I did last night. Last year I attended this camp, so I know a bunch of the 'campers'.
When I arrived last night I assessed some trees, the first is this chestnut which is a challenge and I mentioned a few days ago in the "what are you cutting thread".
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2933.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1565866717)
I will have to fell this to the left in the photo below.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2936.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1565866800)
Its about 30' from the stump to the break with an uphill lay. I'll think on that for a while. They also found me some oak that is much easier to get out.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2938.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1565866782)
After looking at trees I headed to the maintenance shop, which I had to myself. I have been in there many times over the last few years, but never worked in there. I started to notice some of the decorations I had not seen before. Apparently other folks have a 'goat thing' too. There is a pasture directly across from the shop door with a couple of big ones in it.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2953.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1565866973)
No piges here currently, I gues that's why this is hanging in the shop.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2951.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1565866959)
I noticed this one tucked up on a beam and hidden by the blower. I have no idea who would get a sign like that made.
[EDIT: I have removed this photo, because even though I thought it weirdly amusing, it has been pointed out that others may not, so I have removed it.]
Anyway, between goofing off, I got back to mortises and finished all the work that was laid out for me last night. They are re-using the old wood and adding bracing. That wear line you see is from the 3/4" cable the bridge planks lay on. Each brace set comes out, gets re-worked with new braces and posts, and then fitted back in and on to the next. It's a slow process, but about half done. I didn't thin to take pictures of the bridge yet. It's about 50' long and a half mile from the shop. We should have it done by the end of next week.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2949.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1565866889)
We figure the bridge was first made in the 50's or 60's, then had major repairs in the 70's. Now we are doing it again.
I went back over to the Center tonight for a few more hours and cut some more mortises, I am getting pretty fast, but my mind is on those trees. I am going to tell them to have a pro drop the broken leaner and save out the log. But the one that is down, plus the one laying on top of it is what I want to get out before they do another release from the reservoir and flood the area again. I am told October, but you can't trust New York City. I brought over my tape and measured it tonight. The butt log is 30" average diameter over 30' (34" at the stump) and I put the weight of that one section at 9,000#. After the first crotch, the main leader goes to 22" for another 16'. There is a lot of lumber in this stick and there are at least 2 more mill-able leaders, plus the little tree laying on top which is about 14" average by around 40'. I am anxious to start bucking and pulling logs up above the impending water line while I can still get my truck down there. We can load an move at my leisure after that. I am trying to figure out a) how long I can make these big logs and still handle them, and 2) how I am going to fit a 32" log into my mill with a 27" capacity. I think I can just slab the sides off by hand for the 1st and 3rd side, then fit it in and square it up. No idea what to mill it to or what it will be used for, so I'm thinking 12x12 cants to dry and worry about it later. What do y'all think? Keep in mind I am all manual, no equipment for lifting and moving.
This is the tree I am looking at:
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2940.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1565920707)
A little while ago I was looking at one of my "free park logs" my tractor would pick it up and move it., the log was just short of 10 ft 33" base 28 " top. I didn't have my big heavy blade on the back for ballast and it felt light on the rear end so I scooted it off to the side...
. I thought a second about how much a broken front end would cost on that tractor if I could find parts, it's front wheel assist made over seas. "Just because i could doent mean I should."..
I loaded the 18 to 26 in stuff came back with my wedges tried as best I could to stay straight and split the log.. Tractor said thank you. I have decided to split anything over 2 ft or so just works better on that little mill and my back and shoulders. I can saw up to about 18 feet. If I need longer I have a clamp on Haddon lumber maker for the chainsaw or heaven forbid I could go order a gluelam from the lumber yard in town. (self defeating but probably true)
I don't envy you turning it on your manual mill even as an 8ft log, there is lots of goodie in all three of those trees, my humble opinion is to break them down to 8 and 12 footers then halve more or less the big ones...
I think that 12" cants is a bad idea as they will split and check very badly. Much too thick to dry slow enough to prevent deep cracks, at least down here.
Quote from: WDH on August 16, 2019, 07:33:51 AM
I think that 12" cants is a bad idea as they will split and check very badly. Much too thick to dry slow enough to prevent deep cracks, at least down here.
OK, so you've told me it's a bad idea, what would you think is a good idea? ;D
OG, it looks pretty straight although in a pic that might be deceiving. In theory you can skim a 3 inch off the top and roll it 180° and take another 3 inch cut and now roll 90° and it is only 26 inches wide. i am not sure how you will move it. i assume the bottom is still alive? if not hard to estimate the weight. or decide what do you think you will do with it, and then just cut it for the most likely dimension. or 3 seal the ends and get it out of the sun and wait till you are ready for it. a few defects on rustic stuff is ok, but not fine furniture. many wood workers like stuff 6 feet long and not over 8 feet. so if it will be for wood working consider shorter lengths to make it easier to handle the whole log.
What you suggest @doc henderson (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=41041) is pretty much exactly what I had in mind to try first. I may buck and drag the logs tomorrow, just to get it started. I'll move them to my place at a later date, as I need their tractor and operator to load.
You could cut a mix of 4/4, 6/4, and 8/4. Make sure on the 8/4 that it is sawn from the top grade, i.e., saw the 8/4 from the clearest, best quality faces.
Quote from: WDH on August 16, 2019, 05:21:40 PM
You could cut a mix of 4/4, 6/4, and 8/4. Make sure on the 8/4 that it is sawn from the top grade, i.e., saw the 8/4 from the clearest, best quality faces.
I dunno, those are some small profiles. It doesn't leave me a lot of re-sawing opportunities. Perhaps 4x8, 4x12 and some 4/4 and 6/4 would be a happy medium? I want to have some that can be used for bottom support timbers for various sheds and outbuildings. This is an environmental education center of about 600 acres with lots of buildings and historic stuff to maintain. I am close to talking them into buying their own mill which I can help them setup and run, I am just doing some stuff to get them started.
I just got home from anther work session over there. They have a music camp in progress this week finishing up in the morning, so I could not work on those big trees lest I disturb the programs in progress, so I went to a pasture about 1/2 mile away from the main area and dropped the first of the big dead ashes that line the perimeter of about 4 or 5 pastures. It was about 18" DBH and about 50' tall, and the challenge was that I could only work from one side because the ground dropped off completely behind it. Standing dead (long time) with some top branches that I kept my eye on constantly. It also had a barbed wire strand running through it. It made a huge bang when it hit the ground. I got 4 and a half saw logs out of it and bucked the rest into a firewood pile. It too a lot longer to clean it up, than it did to drop it and buck it. MC was 22% near the stump and higher as you went up. I need to get them to supply me with a helper. We hand rolled the logs off the mowed grass and I will fetch them in the coming weeks. They will be milled to specific sizes, dried and treated, then stored as replacement planks for the bridge we are restoring now which is nearly done. The rain set us back a bit.
Everything is a plan in development and we are all learning as we go. I like volunteering my time there and getting interrupted by the little kids and city based adults who come by and ask questions about what we are doing and why. It's my way of teaching folks that cutting trees and making lumber or heat is all part of the cycle. In this place they can see the entire circle in front of them. Trees growing, trees being cut, lumber milled and being dried, buildings being built or repaired. I am surprised at how many folks have not really figured this out yet.
@doc henderson (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=41041) that log is darned straight, but it has a slight bow from the weight. I am not sure that will come out when I buck it. Still I am surely planning on just free-hand knocking a few inches off each side to get my first cuts in on the mill. Those butt logs will be no longer than 10' and I still may have to shorten them to be able to maneuver them around. One of the guys from the center really wants to come over and work with me to understand a little about milling so I will give him a crash course on these big logs. ;D :D I think I need another (bigger) cant hook. A 32" log 10' long comes in at around 3500#. My skidding arch won't even swallow that, not sure how I am going to do this AT ALL. I love a challenge.
Well, i got back there today and put in a half day after helping my wife set up at the county fair. It felt good to put 4 hours or so of straight saw time without being disturbed. Man it was hot working in the sun with 90% humidity! I could barely peel my shirt off when I finally quit. i bucked up the small log shown above in reply 216 ( I think), cutting the top into firewood length either for campfires or to be split for heating some of the many buildings on the grounds. After my third tank and second sharpening I was finally out of breath and sweat. I grabbed a chain and rigged and pulled the small logs under the big stick, so when I buck it, there will be rails to roll and turn it on. (I love the front hooks on my new truck, makes things easier.) I quit around 6pm to get home for dinner after I looked over my tasks for the next week to set up for the festival. I can do more cutting tomorrow in the morning and afternoon, if I have breath left, but then I need to get home and start getting my gear ready for the festival next weekend. I have a buddy working the gig who is driving in from KY Sunday night and I need to get some time with him before we both hit 'work mode'.
It's going to be another long week of getting beat up at work 9 hours a day, then grabbing dinner and heading over to the center to do something satisfying.
Anyway, I spent the afternoon cutting, but besides cutting about a cord of wood and 5 small saw logs, it doesn't look like I did much. No photos, sorry, when I am cutting, that is not on my mind, and a bunch of firewood laying in tall grass doesn't mean much. Look at the photo above and picture most of the tops gone and the over laying log is no longer there.
Got a Late start today, went over and dug a 50' long shallow trench to hide a power cord in for the festival next week to power lights in the first aid tent After that I went back to work on that big red oak down by the creek and cut about another 1/2 cord or more of firewood from the tops. I also got another few smaller saw logs. Getting into the bigger stuff now and it's taking some time and now I mostly have the tops off, with one main leader left. Now the unweighting of this huge trunk becomes tricky for me. I have to be careful and haven't been surprised... yet. I removed all of the main side leader, but there is another underneath that I can't really get at yet. I ran through 3 tanks of gas in the saw and my personal tank was pretty empty also. I sweat a gallon or so. Time to move on to another task so i headed home to get the mule ready for next weekend. I use it to spray water on the roads to keep the dust from choking everyone. More tasks to do every night this week.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF1165.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1566174299)
Yours look better than mine. We use to have go karts parties.We live on a dead end dirt hill with a good size hill. No motors and a couple carts will get going 35mph. Than we use my truck to pull them back up the hill.The kids have a ball. Well I did to. ;D I made a 50 gallon water for the wife's plants,all gravity fed. She use to have plants up and down the 500 foot driveway. I just use 2 pieces of metal conduit with a bunch of hole drilled into it. Took 2-3 trips to really help out the dust. Years ago the town used some reclaim tar with too much gravel mixed into it. Did not really pack down,remember I said too much gravel. But wouldn't that stuff make some black dust. :o It's really all gone now.
Well, time for a quick update. Festival season is over for me and I am recovering from just getting 6 hours sleep in 3 days over the weekend, and the mild concussion I suffered when I arrived home in the wee hours Monday morning. I am SO far behind on other stuff right now that I have to kick it into high gear but I also have to lay back for a few more days until my headache clears a bit more. It is killing me to 'relax', but I do feel pretty tired. So I have been doing very small things in the evening after work, taking the water system off the Mule and stowing it, then getting the log & wood tools back into the Mule. Maybe I will head down and check the Mule tonight for the first time in over 3 weeks. I hope all is well. Next up, this weekend I have to rebuild that stage down at my neighbors place for a party on the 7th, then I have to pick the slabs out for that wedding bar I have to make and do the edge cuts for bookmatching, even though they won't match. Then pick out, or more likely cut the lumber I need for the 'yet to be designed' leg system. All that I am hoping to get done on Saturday. Sunday I hope to run over to my buddies cabinet shop about an hour from here and join, biscuit & glue, then plane the top. Join and plane all the leg lumber and get it all back home. All I have to do then is start working on the top finishes, which I can do in the evenings, build and finish the legs. I HAVE to have this set in place by the evening of 9/20. No pressure. If I have dead time in September I have logs to go pick up where I have been cutting these last couple of weeks. This wouldn't be too hard if I could sneak in a vacation day here or there when it helps, but I am overloaded at work and can't afford to take time off from my projects there.
That's the plan. Wish me luck.
good luck!!! let me know if we need to do an engraving!
I really appreciate it Doc, right now I think I will just focus on keeping the promise I made. It seems the happy couple has begun to realize what is involved and is now asking for assistance on other things on a regular basis. They have me busy. ;D
OK, as much as my head is still hurting, I got back down to the mill tonight and found little damage to the tarp after 4 weeks of occasional heavy rain. I did have one big hole where it tore through, but no big deal. I did a little cleanup then I picked out the slabs for the bar. I did some moving back and forth to figure out how to make the edge cuts for the slab joint. SO right now, this is what I am working with (beer can for scale and realism). Does it look like a bar yet?
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2997.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1567127581)
Well, I got down to the mill, laid out the two slabs to figure my cuts and I edged one side of each. No this isn't a fancy bookmatch, but it will do ok once they are planed and joined. It's an outdoor bar. I will fill all the cracks with epoxy resin then finish. But man, I am so very tired. I have to force myself to move and the headache rolls on. An hour and a half and I am ready for bed. I hope this thing clears up soon.Tomorrow I have to rebuild that stage, then mow the lawn and do other household stuff. Sunday I head up to the cabinet shop and this should look more like a bar top Sunday night.
Does it look like a bar now?
<br
>(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2998.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1567207098)
if it still hurts that bad, consider a ct, it should hurt where you hit the skin, but not a terrible headache. get better soon!
Quote from: doc henderson on August 30, 2019, 08:59:45 PM
if it still hurts that bad, consider a ct, it should hurt where you hit the skin, but not a terrible headache. get better soon!
Well, since you mentioned it: the wound area you saw is normally sensitive, but the headache is bilateral across the frontal lobes, it only increases when I bend forward. It's mild, but constant. Mainly I am still tired all the time and thus the need to make myself move to get things done. Likely, this is wrong, but I feel I do no damage as long as I work slowly and don't do anything too heavy. I think I discovered tonight that I must have also bruised a muscle in my left upper chest area when I fell. It was pretty sore lifting those slabs. It sucks to get old and not bounce like I used to. I am headed to bed now and have decided I will sleep tomorrow until I just decide to get up and see if that helps. (TO answer the other questions on the list: negative LOC, no blurred vision, no dizziness, no loss of memory except for the fall itself, no nausea beyond and upset stomach the next 12 hours, positive ability to focus and recall, etc. )
you need to get a systemic/dystolic test via CT, (SP?) One is colagitive, the other not.....bad
Blood Clot?
Quote from: DennisK on August 30, 2019, 10:14:58 PM
you need to get a systemic/dystolic test via CT, (SP?) One is colagitive, the other not.....bad
Blood Clot?
Wow, um, OK. I don't know what that is and can't look it up. If you mean a systolic/diastolic test (commonly called Blood pressure) I am not sure what this would indicate with any accuracy. I also don't know what 'colagitive' is. Do you mean coagulative as in coagulative necrosis? I am just trying to figure out what your reasoning and suspicion is here and what you are basing it on.
And of course, Welcome to the forum.
OK, gt back to work today for real. Still taking it easy, but today is the first day I woke up without the headache since my mis-step. The pain in my left pec seems to be getting worse as I begin to work more. But really I am taking it easy, not going nuts, and keeping the sweating work down. I even asked a neighbor for help, which i never really do.
SO I got the stage rebuilt and leveled at the neighbors. It went so quick that I think I could do this in my sleep, maybe I did. (Pro tip: do you know the best way to tell if a stage is level? If the banjo player drools out of both sides of his mouth equally. As I used to play some banjo...).
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3007.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1567283800)
SO with that done, I had lunch then went down to the mill and cut the logs I want to use for legs for that wedding bartop. The neighbor was going to help load them in the mule, but I realized we could not lift them. Green maple, 22" dia by 41" long. SO I rigged up my little arch to keep them off the ground because I am leaving the bark on. These will be firwood or something else after the wedding I think.
Leg #1 all rigged up.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3009.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1567283801)
And Leg #2 headed up the hill:
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3010.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1567283880)
Considering I cut them with a chainsaw (too tall for the mill) on a side hill, they came out fairly good with just a tiny wobble. Once set on the concrete in the shop it is easier to find my defects. But they look fairly good. (Man they took everything I had to stand them up!)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3012.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1567283887)
I will re-cut when I settle on a final height. WHich is something I was curious about so I threw another slab on top just to do the industry standard 'Bar Lean test', and it worked for me, but I am 6 foot and this test slab is only 2" thick. The real one will be 3" plus a couple of 1" screw down straps underneath for security, so I probably need to take 3 inches or so off. Still I am good at this test so I thought I would show how it is best done, for educational purposes.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3019.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1567283937)
It does feel good to get some work done and NO headache. Ticking things off the list and ahead of my plan for the weekend. Now off with the wife to do the monthly food shopping. Tomorrow up to the cabinet shop.
Well, I found out last night my buddy could only spare 2 hours of shop time today and I was worried that we could get this top done. I shouldn't have. Planed, joined, matched, glued, and replaned in under 2 hours. Actual time was about 35 minutes. The rest was catching up and looking over his equipment, He has some nifty stuff. I can't wait to see when he gets that 42" flat sander going!
Hows this for a planer?:
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3022.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1567371687)
I got it home and started working on it, cut the ends square and planed them off put some corner breaks on, and sent a bunch of time doing handwork to clean out the bark in the natural splits in prep for the resin epoxy.
This is how it's sits now:
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3026.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1567371668)
But speaking of the resin, I had bought the resin for my last two or three projects at Home Despot off the shelf. SO I stopped there on my way home from the cabinet shop. Strangely, I could not find it, and the folks there said they never carried it. They looked at me like a "problem customer' when I told them (vehemently I might add) I had bought 2 kits there just a month ago. Sure enough, they don't have it. I checked online and it's not listed on the website either. It's like it never happened. I wound up ordering a bunch online hoping some of it will be here by the end of the week. I had hoped to pour tonight. This sets me back a bit, but I will make it. I'll just shift to other stuff for now. There is lots to do.
Good news is that my headache is barely there and the pain in my chest is diminishing at a good clip. I should be back in shape by Tuesday at this rate. I just keep plugging along.
hobby lobby will have resin called casting resin. looks great!!! I could drink a beer on that! 8)
Quote from: doc henderson on September 01, 2019, 09:19:20 PM
hobby lobby will have resin called casting resin. looks great!!! I could drink a beer on that! 8)
This is funny Doc, but just 20 minutes ago I found that Home Despot does in fact have it, in stock at my local store, under the name Glaze Coat, which is what I bought before. I must have walked past it 5 times, asked for their help, but got nothin'.
I will go pick up a kit tomorrow and hope the sassy smart arshed SOB that 'helped me' today is there so I can whack him in the head with the box. "Nope, we've never had that" he said after I told him I bought it there 3 weeks ago.
I'll be out in the shop early getting the slab prepped and sealed. I am a little worried about getting the pour right the first time after my last debacle. I also have to get the 'legs' cut level and a bit lower. I am going to try a new technique I dreamed up using a laser level to shoot a line to follow as I cut. Never used a chainsaw laser before. It's all about having a good time, right? It's a fun little project. I might have to hire a helper, if I can find one, to help me move and set it. The legs have to weigh about 180 pounds each.
Yes, I can't wait to help break this in.
My method for making cuts on both ends works good for me anyway. Might be worth a try.
I lay the log down and level it then use a plumb bob to make a reference line on each end. Roll the log 90 degrees and make lines using the plumb bob so I have a line on the top and side at both ends. I suppose it would be easier to use a laser set for vertical. Either way, I do better sawing vertical than trying to saw horizontal and end up right on both ends of the log.
Yeah, That is the first method I used because it has worked for me in the past on smaller logs. It did pretty good this time, but I have to take about 2" or a bit more off each log (bar height is a critical thing you know) and they did not come out as perfect as I would like. I did about 25 fence posts in the vertical last week and they came out amazingly square and level. I figured I would give vertical another try with my smaller saw. The big saw is hard to balance and it does not cut really straight, it wandered a bit even though I had a good line.
you said your mill is not tall enough. can you set the log legs down between the rails and do it? the mill is the easiest way to get flat parallel cuts, but may be more trouble than it is worth. If it leans a little one way or the other, after a few beers it will straighten right up. 8) :D. just has to be stable enough to lean on!!! :) :) :)
Yeah Doc, the mill was my first choice, because I cut these rounds right there, but even dropping them through the bed (if they fit) and setting them on the ground still makes them too high. My mill is pretty close to the ground to facilitate loading. Besides, at close to 200# ea. getting them in and out is 'problematic'. ;D :D
I want to try this new method because its another idea I can then eliminate from my thought process, unless of course, it works. :)
First let me say how much I've enjoyed your thread, your sawmill sanctuary and your creative projects.
To create leveling feet on the bar, T-nuts (threaded wood inserts) in the "legs with a bolt to adjust to level could work. Think refrigerator type adjustable feet. I have built many cabinets and machines that had to be leveled. We used captured nuts welded to the legs with bolts to level metal framed machines and T nuts on wooded cabinets and machine frames.
Quote from: SawyerTed on September 02, 2019, 11:12:28 AM
First let me say how much I've enjoyed your thread, your sawmill sanctuary and your creative projects.
To create leveling feet on the bar, T-nuts (threaded wood inserts) in the "legs with a bolt to adjust to level could work. Think refrigerator type adjustable feet.
Ted, Thanks for enjoying it. I was wondering if anybody was reading it at all because I tend to ramble and bore most folks. Mostly I did this thread as a record to look back on down the road, but it is also allowing folks to chime in, such as yourself with ideas and help I had never considered, so it is working out for me, your mileage may vary. ;D :D
Case in point, your leveling feet idea is a great one! Never thought of that. I will save that for another project, because for this one I am setting the 'legs' on crushed stone and soil, so I will be able to manipulate the ground to suit my 'level' requirements. But I do like that idea and have other projects coming where it would be a perfect application. Thanks for that.
Today I goofed off in the morning, slept in until 7am and was tired, so I stuck to my prescription and relaxed a bit. Nearly out of the woods on this concussion thing, but I am not going to push it for stupid reasons. It was rainy most of the day too, not heavy but steady. I went out to the shop late morning and began prep work for the pour, knowing that there is not way I can afford a blow out like I had last month. This time I tripled taped it then cut some pine boards that had a slight cup and put the crown against the bottom of the slab so that it pulled down and sealed. I screwed it home...and said a little prayer. I also taped and covered the ends to same way.
SO the bottom looks lie this:
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3034.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1567458301)
Flipped over (man this thing is HEAVY!), it looks like this all leveled up well.:
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3037.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1567458247)
There is one huge split, this is natural, not a drying split, it is where this tree forked into two major leaders, so the split was filled with bark which I chiseled out as far as was possible. I was left with a full 54" long gap that tapered from one inch wide down to zero. That is a lot of resin to fill in.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3038.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1567458304)
I went back to Home Despot and got the resin that yesterday's salesman/helper/industry pro said they never carried. It was right there on the shelf. i came home and combined the one quart kit with a half quart left over from another job and did the pour, no leaks, but I didn't complete it either. Not enough, but I expected that, but NO leaks, just one little wet spot of the bottom of one of the straps, but not a full drop. I figure this will cure and seal and then I can do another pour to fill and over top the cracks and do all the small ones I skipped this time.
Once that was all cleaned up I turned my attention to the 'legs' and my laser idea. I set the laser up to think it through and realized I can also use it to get the leg square to the floor using that vertical line. I was getting ready to move the legs to a better area for cutting when my son called that he needed the laser at the floor job he is doing. I knew this would happen, so I ran it down to him and stuck my 2 cents into the job he is doing. He says my 15 minutes of being nosy saved him about 3 hours of work and a day of frustration. All I said was "why don't you think about...?" :D
Anyway, this is what the lines look like on the logs:
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3045.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1567458370)
I wasn't too clear in earlier posts about why I am re-cutting these. Yes, they are a bit too tall, but the main reasons are that A) the cuts are not square to the log making them stand straight up (they have a little lean) and 2) The cuts are not flat, that is, my large saw kind of wanders and the cut has a wave, it is not a slant, but a wave. My little saw with the 18" bar cuts pretty flat and although this will be a physical challenge for me and too big for the bar on one clean cut, I believe I can do better and square things up at the same time. Let's just say I am using this to try to improve my skills. :D ;D (In so far as is possible for an old guy with questionable balance, poor vision, and a weaker upper body than I would like.) When I get the laser back, I will use framing shims the get the log square to the ground, then the line to guide my saw. What could go wrong? ;D ;D ;D :D :D
Well, I got the stage rebuilt for a neighbor last night and painted it. Tonight I grabbed some rounds I had thrown on the side down at the mill to use for legs on a slab for a party Saturday and sort of got them cut off level. Mixed results on using the laser. I think next time I will try something else. I did get them fairly close. I light sanded the slab I had finished in haste last month and put another coat of verathane on it. I'll try to get another coat on tomorrow in time to dry for Saturday.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3055.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1567729656)
Then I went back to work on the bar while i wait for more resin to show up tomorrow. I have a lot of sanding to do in the live edges. This is Ash that was EAB killed, so I like to keep the bug channels exposed. It adds character to the piece and it helps explains what is killing the trees and why I take them out. It's part of the 'story' of the wood. I like that. I sand it until it looks like this, then after cleaning and finishing it really pops, but it is subtle if I do it right.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3057.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1567729672)
My problem is that the cambium layer is not letting go and coming off easily in some spots. Like here at the ends:
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3058.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1567729798)
I have tried sanding, a wire brush, pocket knife (works best, but slow), and hand sanding (slowest). Does anybody have any tricks to get this dried cambium layer to let go and come off? I burned up a palm sander doing the re-finished slab and didn't want to use that on the edges anyway, it's a bit too aggressive. Once i do my final pour and get the dams off i can work on it better, right now they are in the way a bit. Just wondering if anybody had any magic bullet for this stuff. My hands are numb.
I've used a wire wheel on an angle grinder and it works pretty well. Match the stiffness of the wire wheel to what you're trying to get rid of. Sometimes I've had to use a knotted wheel.
try a heat gun, most wood connective stuff is heat sensitive. like bending wood. window putty hard as a rock reacts well to heat as well
Well the resin got delivered today and I did what I hope is the final pour. No leaks, all the cracks overfilled as I wanted and sit curing now.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3059.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1567818659)
It looks better than the photo shows. I am pleased.
I put another coat of verathane on the junk slab for tomorrows party. I cut the bottom straps for the bar. Sanded all the edges just to soften it and threw on some tung oil so they are ready when I need them. I let all the smoke out my son's failing orbital sander last night, so I picked up a dewalt on my way to work this morning, I need my own anyway. That seemed to work pretty well on the cambium layer on a gentle setting with some patience. Sorry Doc, I forgot to try heat, I still think that might be a good idea except for the areas where it is really stuck on solid. I am starting to get myself worked into a faster speed to get this done ahead of time so that I can set it the weekend before the wedding, which would be next weekend. No pressure. My neighbor across the road has a big party going on tomorrow, so that will kill a good part of my weekend. I will be parking cars at my place and there is the stage to get set with power and sound and all the other details he didn't think about. I know I will have a full day on that, but want to pull all the dams off the bar and see what I have and start sanding off the excess. Mu goal is to start working on finishes Sunday afternoon. That will give me the week for additional coats and hopefully fully cured/dried by Saturday next.
For a guy that is not a woodworker I am starting to feel like a woodworker. I have little idea how I got here.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3063.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1567818649)
for a guy who is not a woodworker, your shop is looking like it! double the chaos and quadrooople the projects, a little more wood on the floor and i think I would feel right at home at your place! yes that is a compliment! ;)
Well, slow start today. Too much party last night. ;D
I did a lot of sanding today. I had finish sanded the bottom yesterday and put a coat of tung oil on. Then flipped it to let it dry. i started onthe top today and got all the excess resin sanded off, worked my way down to 220 grit. Then I out a layer of tung oil on the top and flipped it again. Cleaned it then applied the first layer of verathane. I think it is starting to look like a bar now.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3072.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1567982514)
The large gap filled in well and stayed fairly clear with just a bit of haze.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3070.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1567982507)
I took one photo from each end. Considering the poor slabs I started with I believe it doesn't look too bad. These photos just show the bottom. I like to start there to get my hand practiced in applying the finish because I was never very good at it. I will say, it is as smooth as a baby's bottom and I like that. Tomorrow I'll light sand again and add another coat.
looks clear to me... maybe some ibuprofen and a bit of hair of the dog... and it will clear up!!! :D :D :D. look really cool.
Looks like you did a nice job should be great for the party. You'll have to raise your prices afterwards it's likely to generate more requests.
Quote from: Nebraska on September 08, 2019, 09:53:16 PM
You'll have to raise your prices afterwards it's likely to generate more requests.
"Raise my prices"? You mean, people get paid for this?
No, this is a just a small gift. My skills aren't really good enough to command a price yet.
well then might as well triple your prices! :D :D :D. when I get something for free and then give it to someone else. If they ask what I want for it , I tell them "twice what I paid for it". when strangers ask for gifts, that is when you can charge. I allow friends who ask for something (not a gift) I tell them they can donate to the Dr. Henderson Polyurethane fund. it is a non profit that pays for my finish 8) :). One Pediatric surgeon friend of mine, wanted a step for her aging dogs so they could get on the bed. she offered $260 and I accepted 60. I have now made 3 steps for docs with old dogs. on line they sell units with 3 tiny steps for dogs. big dogs do better with 1 big step
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/51041/08B4CEDA-CA1B-465A-A660-A076BB1AF7FD.jpeg?easyrotate_cache=1546318681)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/51041/926B0C83-7D8F-49A2-8F0F-1149954E6D2C.jpeg?easyrotate_cache=1549942387)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/51041/13CE01C7-DABC-43E0-86E1-043C541F77AB.jpeg?easyrotate_cache=1549942395)
Well I have been working on the bar every night sanding and giving it another coat, nothing worth reporting on, then I have shifted to trying to fix my Mule for the rest of the evening and going to bed depressed and frustrated. But now the weekend is approaching and I set a goal of getting this bar set this weekend. I still had to put a finish on the bottom straps after drilling and countersinking the holes. I found some nice solid bronze wood screws I had that were left over from my Dad'a boat building days in the 50's 8). Nobody will really see these straps unless they are on the floor under the bar, and in that case, I don't think they would be too critical. ;D But I wanted them to be sealed. The straps will screw to the top of the stumps and then I can run some screw up through them into the bottom of the bar, just to make it nice and secure. SO I did all that, and sanded and put another coat on the bar.
Then I had the stump to work on. I did not like the top surfaces. They will sit on gravel/dirt so I can deal with the bottoms and get them to set right, but the tops should be flat to accept the straps without distortion or stress. I at least need them to be flat for that, and the chainsaw cuts were no were near close enough and there was too much of a slant on one. I grabbed that power planer I bought a while back and went at it by eye just taking the high spots, looking it over, then taking more. It was pretty hacked up with the lines from the plane edges but was coming along. I was going to be happy with this but then I stumbled on something. If I turn my pattern and planed 90° to the first set of cuts, I only took off the high spots and it looks like one solid plane across the whole thing. No, it is not dead flat, but darn close. I did not flatten the entire top, that was not the goal, just to have a good flat area that will seat the strap.
In this photo the dark area is the wet, fresh cut (planed) area that I need.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3078.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1568331799)
You can see that is is pretty flat now, it had nearly a 3/8" swoop in it before.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3079.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1568331862)
I am pretty happy with this concept and will try it on some cookies soon.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3074.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1568331862)
All the pieces of the bar are pretty much ready, less drying.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3095.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1568331937)
And I think it is starting to look like a fairly nice bar.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3087.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1568331913)
Tomorrow I may do one more coat on the bar. Saturday morning I will haul the legs up and get them set, then attach the straps and top either then or Sunday. I'll be glad to have this done and out of the shop, and also glad to have kept my promise on time.
Are the legs too tall to stand up on the mill to have the tops sawn flat as if you were cutting cookies?
Quote from: WDH on September 13, 2019, 08:19:59 AM
Are the legs too tall to stand up on the mill to have the tops sawn flat as if you were cutting cookies?
Yes, I mentioned above, much too tall.
OK, the bar is delivered, set, installed, and complete. I also brought them up another finished slab t use for a serving table for sift drinks, etc. set on 24" tall blocks. I did a bunch of cookies for them on the spot just clearing out dead ugly stuff to make it look nicer. They are happy, which makes me happy. It too them a while to figure out where, at waht angle and in what position they wanted it. Once they decided and were happy I leveled the blocks with just two shims, screwed the straps down to the blocks, then screwed the top to the straps. It is rock solid and only out of level about an 1/8" over 6'. I am calling that a 'drain feature'. ;D It turned out the dry-layed brick patio is not flat (surprise) so my blocks worked quite well with their variations.
I may do some campfire benches for them later in the weekend, we will see, but I don't think they need them.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3100.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1568484621)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3101.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1568484573)
Now I need a dry shirt and a short nap before I get back to my stuff, like cursing at the Mule.
Well, yesterday, as already noted was a good one.
Today, not so much. I'll just put in a link here to another thread where the gory details are detailed. LINK (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?topic=107695.new#new) I am trying to decide now how to proceed, whether to buy a used differential or get a new gear set. Think I will wait until tomorrow to decide. Whiskey and early bed is the best course of action now.
Well, yesterday was the happy day for my neighbors and the weather was just perfect for them. I spent the morning running errands and filling in some gaps for them and also cut a little more firewood because with the surprise warm temp we got a bug hatch that was annoying. The smoke helped, so we kept a fire going all day. We parked cars at my place to handle the crowd and they had folks from all over. I had license plates on my lawn from Virginia, Maryland, Mass, Florida, and Alaska as well as others. Many came from across the pond for the day. I have rarely been to a better event. I would love to show a picture of the happy couple because they looked like something from a fairy tale, but they have requested no social media postings due to the celebrity status one of them endures. Because of that I rarely took my camera out but sometime is the wee hours, after the caterers were long gone and the party was thinning, i did think to take a shot of how the bar held up. This was taken during the self-serve period in the early morning hours as was not very well framed, but given my condition, oh well.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3117.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1569163268)
I met a lot of fine folks, and got to work a little on my German which has been long gone for a long time. ;D :D met a fella who spoke very little english but is apparently a Journeyman floor layer (I forget the term he used) he specializes in custom flooring with various woods in high end buildings and re-construction/repair of very old buildings. We had a very enjoyable chat that lasted over an hour. He loves the variety of woods we have available here. Everything for him is pretty much an expensive import and he was envious of what I have access to. That gave me a new perspective.
I have no idea what time I climbed onto the 4 wheeler and putted my way down the hill. ;D
Now I should really get moving and go lend a hand with cleanup, but my head hurts a bit still. I also have the Mule to work on a little more. Still waiting for the replacement differential to show up. The seller might be playing some games with me, I am not sure. I am hearing excuses that concern me. I did get the tires and got them mounted, I just have to put them on the rig, but there isn't too much more I can do without the parts after that.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3107.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1568592080)
Whiskey and early bed is the best course of action now.
Bed yes, whiskey, no, I enjoy your posts.
That was last week. Now I am just sitting on my hands and waiting for the differential to show up. I got a bit of a song and dance from the seller about how he broke the one he was shipping me, got another and was shipping it overnight. He also refunded the entire coast. If this is all true and the proper unit is on the way, this is a terribly honest man, but if the thing shows up and it is incorrect or sub-standard, I start the process all over again and lose another week.
So here I sit and wait as this perfect working weather slips on by.
Important thing is just don't spread yourself too thin.
;D ;D :D :D :D :D :D 8) 8)
I feel like I am spread so thin folks can see right through me. :(
I have so much to get done and ma dead in the water. You would not believe the stories I am hearing from this guy who supposedly shipped me a differential. Now I don't know if I should order from someone else, or just believe him and wait. Money is tight, and this ain't cheap. Time is just burning away and I am dying here.
You said he refunded your money? That is quite the man there,no matter what.
Quote from: thecfarm on September 24, 2019, 06:11:24 AM
You said he refunded your money? That is quite the man there,no matter what.
Well it might seem that way, but...
I wasn't going to put all the details of this miserable ordeal here, but then I remembered this is supposed to be a record of sorts of my first year, so here goes as succinctly as possible:
I ordered that differential last Monday. The seller indicated it shipped on Wednesday and would arrive Friday, which put me a weekend ahead of schedule, right? No. One Friday the wife calls at work to tell me a package arrived, but it is a small package with 2 iight bulbs in it (?!). SHe also said some guy from Arkansas called about my Diff. and wanted me to call him back ASAP.
SO I call him, seemed like a nice fella. He explains that he always puts new axle seals in his units before he ships them and when he was working on mine (on Wednesday) he dropped the unit off the bench and the housing broke. He says he has another he can go over and ship overnight, or he can give me a refund. I don't want the money, I want my part. SO I tell him to send me the other one and why did he wait two days to contact me? I also wonder why he didn't just ship the second one, it would have arrived as promised. I asked about the light bulbs. He says "Oh, I send those as a free gift to everyone who orders more than $100 dollars from me". I am wondering why he didn't just put them in the box with the diff. (It dawned on me days later, this provided a tracking number so that eBay thought the package arrived on time, duh.) He promises to knock $150. off the cost and ship the thing on Saturday overnight. He will give me the tracking number when he has it. I have to take the guy at his word and give him a chance right? But the hair on the back of my neck was tingling. Something felt 'off'.
So I had the wedding Saturday and no tracking number arrived. Sunday I sent him a note and ask. He says he dropped it off Saturday for overnight ship and starts calling the guys at the Fedex drop-off some very disparaging names and questions their intelligence. He apologizes, then gives me a number.
The number indicates that a Fedex label was printed at 11:15 Sunday morning and they were waiting for the package. As I write this (Tuesday morning), the tracking Still indicates the same thing. No package yet. I know there are some weather issues in the southeast, so I sit on my hands all day Monday and sent him a note last night. He goes off about the low intelligence in the labor pool where he lives and how everyone is an idiot. He tells me he went back there on Monday afternoon and screamed at them, but Fedex has the box and there is nothing more he can do. He also refunded what I paid for the unit less the 50 bucks sales tax. (I might have to get that back from Ebay, not him. I am not sure.)
Now I know Fedex can and does make mistakes and have delays, but it always gets right at some point. When I saw that there was still no movement at 4am this morning I became pretty sure I had been had. I have NO idea what this guy's game is, but the story he gives is way too bizarre to be true. He had 3 units listed when I ordered mine. The next day one was sold to me and the other 2 were taken down (removed from sale by the seller). I can't guess what is going on at this guys place, but he really made no money on this, spent some time dealing with it, lied to me, and cost me well over a week of lost time which is the thing I can't forgive. What is his point, I wonder? I can always make money back, but I can never get back the time. i will now lose another weekend of work while I wait for the next one I ordered.
I sent him a polite but pointed note this morning wherein I state that it is clear he is a cheat. I also state what he cost me in time and that I don't understand his goal. I told him I ordered from another seller and that I am still out the sales tax. I resent being lied to very much.
As I am writing this I just got a note from both him and paypal, sent at 5am his time. He tells me he refunded $60.00 for the tax (more than he owed me to cover any paypal fess) and the paypal note confirms it. Now I am really confused because this deal is now costing him. I want to believe what he is telling me, because he went overboard getting the money back to me, but nothing else fits into a normal scenario. He insists he is legit. He says he will be making calls this morning to see if he can locate it or he will try to find another one for me. At this point I just can't trust the guy. I have been scammed on ebay before for much bigger money and the whole thing took several weeks to resolve and a month before I had my money. I can't afford the time, every weekend is precious this time of year. I need to get back to work. If he is telling the whole truth, I can't believe that Fedex messed up this badly with a 20 pound box.
I don't know what to think. If the thing shows up I would be happy to pay him for it, I don't want anything for free, that is not fair. But I have a hard time believing I will ever see it and I can't just sit here. As I said, I wasn't going to share this, the whole mess has me pretty upset because I just come home from work and sit around or waste time. I can't do what I want to get done, and I still have a lot of work to put this back together when the part arrives, hopefully in good usable condition. I suppose this is just another bump in the road of life, but at the moment it is really making me a very grumpy guy.
Fishy at best, but you are square less time wasted. Part ways, return the phantom one if it shows, nobody has time for this. Wasn't anything you could control.
maybe he is a very small operation, and is in a bit over his head. hope it turns out he is a regular guy who is trying to make a living, but not very good at it.
QuoteHe says "Oh, I send those as a free gift to everyone who orders more than $100 dollars from me".
That sounds fishy, especially sending it separate from the ordered part, and if his ad never mentioned getting free light bulbs.
The rest of the story. :o ::)
Quote from: thecfarm on September 24, 2019, 12:38:05 PM
The rest of the story. :o ::)
Not yet...
I had ordered another unit from a different seller at 6am today in LA. I added a note explaining that I would appreciate it they could ship it soon as I had lost a week dealing with a 'poor' seller. I figured the request couldn't hurt. They printed the label at 7:30 am and it was picked up by fedex at 10:30 headed to the depot in MS. Should be here Friday. I hope it's in good shape.
Meanwhile, back in Arkansas there has been no change in the status of the one that was "shipped on Saturday", fedex still has not received the package and I have heard no word from the guy that was going to 'start making calls at 8am and see if he could source another one", which I told him I don't want.
Whilst I sit on my hands waiting for the Mule differential to show up (it's coming) I have been filling my evenings with odds and ends, getting parts cleaned and ready to go back on, mounting the new tires, etc. Tonight i bench sharpened my saws which I like to do once in a while to bring all the teeth back proper and get the rakers right. The bench allows for comfortable work and good light. Then when my buddy drove by around 9pm and beeped, I went down to his place and we (he) welded the nuts in place for my winch mounts so that I don't have to fight with it anymore. From the wled shop we moved into the garage and played around with his temporary setup on his new Slabmizer. I had an ash cookie that had dried fairly well with minimal cracking, but the saw cuts were really rough, so we took a lot off of it. It was just a fun thing to do. He is trying to figure out how to work this into his business plan. We decided an hourly charge is the way to go. Too many variables involved.
SO I sit and wait, but I am getting a few things done. I hope to pick up some logs this weekend for another project next year. Hopefully I get it milled by winter.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3121.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1569552905)
Well I have really needed a vacation/mental health day and this weather has been perfect, so I took one today. I tried to put my Mule issues out of my mind and do something productive. The plan was to go over to the Ashokan Center and load up the ash logs I had cut back in mid-august, then go down to the creek and finish the bucking work on that bog blowdown, and MAYBE get the logs dragged up above the high water mark. It was a fair plan.
I got there and the maintenance manager was ready for me. There was still kids programs going on, so we were patient and worked around them, but loading the trailer went easy, as I had hoped. I pulled out in the pasture and we dropped the logs right in the trailer hung by chains from the loader bucket. It was my first ever log load with 5 small logs.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3122.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1569635001)
When done, we waited a bit for some kids to finish their program before we pulled my truck out of the pasture. I drove slow and he walked along and we chatted as we went. But I heard this strange PSSSST! noise come from the trailer. It wasn't constant, it was intermittent and related to the tire rotation. Very weird. 3 of us looked all over the tires and found nothing. I pulled the trailer up to a flatter spot up by the shop, then slowly backed up until the hiss was constant and watched the one tire just drop. We pumped it back up and I drove the trailer 100' to a safe relatively flat spot. My plan was to chock the tires, disconnect the truck, remove the tire and go get it fixed so I could safely drive the load home. Jacking a loaded trailer, even with a small load of logs, is not something I would choose to do, but oh well. I used caution, double checked everything, and got the tire off. I really didn't have many tools at all, but I made do. When I got the tire off and flopped it down, I was shocked to see a flat spot on the rim.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3127.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1569635045)
It looked like it must have hit a rock or something to bend it. The issue here is, that never happened. This trailer has never had the opportunity for this to happen. There was nothing in that mowed, flat pasture or any other place it has been. In addition there was not a scratch on the rim or tire. The paint was intact, not a chip. I couldn't figure it out. The guys were looking at it thinking I needed a new rim. Well, next to the maintenance shop is a blacksmtih's shop. I asked if they had a cross pein hammer. Turned out they did, so I let the air out, set the rim on wood blocks and went at it. The guys were amazed, looked just fine, except for the paint damage. I pumped it back up, stuck it on, and drove the load home without issue. I think the log load, my first ever, was enough to show the problem with that wheel that I may have had since I bought the trailer new.
I didn't get a photo of the flat spot, I was too shocked at what I found. but here is the rim after my "fix". The bad spot is at 12 o'clock. I was pretty happy my hammer work held up, it was a stressful drive.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3126.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1569634937)
Anyway, got the load home and parked it on the landing without issue. It will sit there until the mule is fixed and can drag the logs to the mill, then the lumber goes back to the center for restoration work.
I had lunch and drove back to the center and got a bunch of bucking work done on that big tree (more on that in the other thread about that tree). But near the end I had saw problems (more on that in another thread about that saw) and I had to quit before I did the final cuts on the butt log. SO I hung out with the guys back at the shop who were repairing canoes and fixing a shop bandsaw and shot the breeze for a while. A very enjoyable thing I do WAY too seldom. I headed home, helped my wife load up for a craft fair tomorrow, and figured out my saw problems before dinner. After dinner, I went out, fixed the saw and put it back together and put on the 28" bar to finish that big log.
Tomorrow? I have no idea. I may go back and finish that tree off, but I don't like working on something that big when there is nobody around if something goes wrong. Yes, I worked alone today, but the crew would drive by and check on me every once in a while. Tomorrow, nobody is there. They have a rare open weekend due to a canceled wedding.
Today was a good day, and right in line with my goals. Sure, things broke and went wrong, but that is part of the game, right? It's not the problems that ruin your day, it's how you deal with them.
The Mule differential is planned to show up tomorrow, but I am not going to hang my hat on that. I will work the day as it comes and if the part shows up, I will change gears (ok, bad pun there) but I need to keep doing 'stuff' instead of waiting.
OG, that's how Macgyver worked :D.
Long day today. BUT the mule is back on the (skid) road! I am exhausted but happy.
I spent the morning doing some of the chores my wife has been complaining reminding me about and visiting with a neighbor for a bit. Just before noon my differential showed up to my surprise. Yes, fedex said it was due for delivery, but they have said that before and not showed up, so I don't trust them at all.
So I got to work. Put the diff. in, re-installed the axles, reset the ball joints, connected the drive shaft and secured the mid-shaft bearing (which took 3 tries to get the bearing in the right place) and all the other stuff I had to remove to get that stuff out. Put the drums back on, torqued and tweaked everything. Finally put the wheels back on. Fired it up and slowly moved it back and forth, listening intently for any issues or binding. It sounded just a tiny bit rough. Then I realized I never put the grease in the differential. OK, did that. I shouldn't have to point out that each of these little things required a lot of gymnastics under this thing and reaching through small holes and trying to hold nuts in place with just one finger and more stupid things to get parts on working by feel alone. I know you guys know all this, and it is a tiny machine compared to what most of the folks here work on. Still I am getting old for a lot of laying on cold concrete and having ---- fall on my face. ;D
Anyway, I got it back together and moved it around in the driveway slowly, testing everything out gently. It all seemed fine. I took it for a quick gentle run through the woods. I returned my neighbors 4 wheeler, then came back and re-assembled the winch and put that in. Welding the nuts in place really helped, but it's been 3 weeks since I pulled it, so I had to go look up the assembly diagram to get it back together. :D I finished that and got the push guard back on. The last thing was to put the storage try back under the hood and I was DONE. 8) 8)
It took about 7 and a half hours to get it all back together and do it right. I am pooped, just shot. I did a little cleanup in the shop, but just didn't have the energy to finish. I always say that the job isn't done until the tools are put away, and that is the final goal for tomorrow morning.
It just feels good to have it done.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3144.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1569718078)
Funny thing, the new tires are nearly 3 inches taller than the old ones and it barely fits in the shop under the loft. I need to check the tire pressure tomorrow.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3147.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1569718061)
Final Talley:
4 new tires
Replacement (used) front differential
1 pint Front diff. grease
New front yoke
New u-joint
30 hours labor
I am just tired. Off to bed soon, then figure out tomorrow. I have a trailer of logs to unload and a shop to clean up. ;D
Good for you!! Glad it is up and going again.
I have a tractor I feel that way about. I am on it just about every day. Maybe only a hour a day,but I use it.
Today was a lazy day. Got up at 4:30, couldn't sleep, then I was too tired to do anything. My wife was off to a 2 day craft fair she is selling at by 6am. I made a nice breakfast sandwich, then dozed on the couch. Got up, still hungry, made another sandwich (I LOVE eggs). Pulled on my boots and headed to the shop, still tired and not very motivated. Kind of sore from yesterday still. Threw the tools back in the Mule and headed down to where I parked the trailer Friday. I pulled the logs off one at a time, hitched them up and dragged them to the staging area by the mill. One the second log, the hand winch on the arch broke. The bolt that holds the locking pall in place just sheared off. I was halfway to the mill, so I cranked it up and used a short chain to hold the handle in place. Dropped the log, ran up to the shop, found a bolt (1/4-20 x 3 inches long) and fixed the pivot point. Finished the logs but not before slicing my thumb open on a cable fray (yeah, gloves, I know). Then I pulled the trailer back to the house and parked it.
My son stopped by with his boys and they 'helped' with chores and cleaning in the shop putting all the tools away, playing with tools and vises (great for crushing sticks apparently) and asking a MILLION questions. We loaded up all the old tires I have been complaining about for 3 years now, they are off to recycling tomorrow. Of course the boys realized instantly that the Mule had been fixed. They pestered me for a ride for a while before I gave in. (They need practice in learning HOW to ask for things, so I waited until they had it right.)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/da_boyz_in_da_mule.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1569801587)
Seems like these guys can't come over without going for a ride. Anyway I took it easy on the old gal today just to get the feel for the sounds. The tires, as I said, are bigger even though I ordered stock size. When I hit a hole, the front tires rub just a little on the plastic fenders. It's not bad, just annoying. These tires do have better grip so I don't need to 4wd very much, just on the skid road hill so that the tires don't spin and I don't tear up the road.
Anyway, I got a lot of cleaning done in the shop and organized some piles so that there is less clutter for the winter. Sometimes things accumulate and I need to catch up on it. I hate a mess, it is hard to work that way. Then I grabbed a shower and headed over to the craft fair to help my wife load out. Got home, unloaded and done.
This week in the evenings I suppose I will start getting things ready to mill on the weekend. On Friday I have my GOL 3 class, so I don't know how much that might wear me out for Saturday. Also expecting rain most of the second half of the week, so that could changes things too. Seems like the season is about to change and I'll soon have to get my fall wardrobe ready (sweatshirt, jacket, and stretch hat in the morning, and t-shirt and ball cap in the afternoon).
Raining lightly when i got home tonight so no point in heading to the woods given the little bit of daylight left by the time we do dinner. SO I headed to the shop determined to do some decent cleanup and try to buy myself a little more working room through the winter.
My shop is dominated by the remnants of my machine shop business from years ago and my Dad's machines. I have thinned out quite a bit, but some stuff I just can't let go, at least not for a song. I have a vertical band saw, a small horizontal mill (Browne & Sharpe #00) my Dad restored , and a metal tool maker's shaper my dad restored back in the sixties. They were disassembled for moving 35 years ago and I have been moving the parts around for 25 years now. They would take less room if somewhat assembled. The basic parts are fairly heavy and I had been waiting until somebody was available to help with the lifting. Obviously that never happened, so tonight was the night. It too me an hour to pull everything out and spread it around the shop for working room. I cleaned and swept the floor area to remove a few years of dust and junk and re-packed the remaining 'stuff' in that area (the mill column, a 100# anvil, an apron brake, and some other stuff. I found a way to turn my radial arm saw so that it would be usable and accessible without having to pull it out. That was a win! Then I used my little hand crank fork lift and my back to get the shaper on it, then lift it up onto it's table. I threw the motor assembly in it's place also. That took two things off the floor. I pushed the whole thing into a fitted spot for it. Then I put the base of the bandsaw where I wanted it, this I really want to get back together and running, it's handy. I rigged the little forklift to pick it from the top and lifted that and placed it on the base. I dropped a couple of bolts in and secured it for safety. The saw should only take a day to reassemble, tune up, check oil levels, and debug, IF I can find all the parts. The search may take a few evenings. Then, with the space I had gained, I found that I had a nice spot where I could fit both my son's and my roll around tool boxes back to back and have access to both. Super win there!
So maybe I gained 10 or 15 square feet back, but I wound up having more stuff in a usable position and I have got more of an aisle to the back room, also a win. I stuffed what I had left on the floor back in the new hole easily, but I am not done. I have one big piece that will go upstairs for storage freeing more floor up. First I have to do a little cleanup upstairs on another night. It looks rainy this week, so maybe tomorrow. I like getting this stuff done, it feels good. As I sit out there thinking things over I am looking at where I can add another 12x12 loft area. All I need is some lumber :D. Then I have to do a LOT of prep work to clear the area and cut my bench down by 18" removing a set of drawers and resetting the side before I can even start. Each step is a project. But first I think I will work on the long side wall where junk seems to be collecting. My son wants to get the welder easily accessible. I can't blame him. Might finally use it myself. :)
No photos tonight. My shop is such a mess and packed too thick. Even 'cleaned up' it looks like a bad dream. ;D All I did tonight was work on one small corner, but it did feel pretty good to make an improvement.
I got into it last night and even thought this evening was really nice I stuck to cleaning in the shop. Spent the night working on the north wall cleanup. Pulled everything off the wall for about 25' feet cleaned, discarded, and replaced the stuff that made sense, and piled stuff for moving to a winter storage shed.
3 hours work and it doesn't look a heck of a lot better, but I feel a LOT better. I can find and GET AT stuff now. I found stuff I didn't know was there and could have used, had I known.
Here is the wall I worked on tonight, on the right. I hesitate to post these because my shop is not up to par with most I have seen here, but this is what I have.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3157.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1569981972)
This was the corner I did last night. Again, it doesn't look like much, but my son is ecstatic about the improvement. So go figger.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3159.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1569981976)
Tomorrow I will move that stuff out to the storage shed so i can get my truck in the shop and install the running boards I bought to make the wife happy so she can get in the new truck without as much grunting.
I had a lousy day at work, expending most of my energy trying to suppress the urge to choke the life out of some people so entrenched in a mindless corporate mentality that they require intervention or at least a merciful end. ;D I want SO much to walk off this job, but I can't, we have to eat. SO I come home and do things that make me feel like I did something good. It helps a little, but tomorrow I face the same crap.
So I came in and would have headed to bed, but my neighbor is doing this show on the Bravo Network where she is made up as a man to challenge the sexist conventions in her profession. I really don't have a choice, I have to watch this, but i will pay for it tomorrow for sure. I am not a late night guy. SO far it is pretty good, and knowing her as well as I do, it is a little weird to see her on TV.
Short night, lousy weather. My wife has trouble getting in the new truck, she is shorter and a bit older than me, but honestly we are both having a little trouble climbing up into the truck as the years go by. SO I ordered a set of step bars or whatever they call running boards these days.
"One hour installation" they say. 'Bull' I say. I had to tap holes find different screws, make adaptions, etc. If I didn't have the shop and a ton of stuff supporting it, it would have taken a day. As it was, it took two hours, but they are on. I have yet to find a 'bolt on solution' that is simply a bolt on solution. :D
I also checked my saws to make sure they were ready for my GOL3 class Friday. Tomorrow night we have the grandkids so I don't expect to get much done. I have to be on the road at 5:30 Friday morning. Hoping i may run into @BargeMonkey (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=24634) at breakfast. :) 8)
I'll see if I can get this post done properly. It's 8pm and I am fighting sleep. Headed to bed soon.
Today was Game of Logging level 3 for me. I've been waiting since April when I signed up for this. It's very hard to find around here. I was up at 4:30 and had to drive a half hour past @BargeMonkey (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=24634) 's town, which is about an hour and a quarter from me for the class. I had a great breakfast at Barge's store and picked up some breakfast sandwiches for the gal who organizes the classes and the instructor. I also got a few minutes to chat with Eric (Barge) before I had to get moving, but not enough time to really talk. He had more than a full day ahead of him with his loader down and other pressing things. I was going to try to catch him on my way back out in the afternoon.
Anyway. I got to the class and we had a short 'tailgate session' unlike the other 2 levels where the tailgate work is the first half of the day and the woods work is the second half. Today we got out there by 9am and started cutting. Also unlike the other classes, we focused on more serious sized trees. Everything we cut all day was in the 90-120' category and between 20 and 30" DBH. The point of this class is maintaining control on bigger trees with heavy back or side lean and felling them in directions 'against their will' so to speak. One tree we did was around 120' with 10' of back lean. It needed just short of 3 inches of lift. The class covered all the math and calculations to figure (PRETTY darn close) how much wedge height you would need to overcome the back lean. This involves the distance from the back of the tree to the face of the hinge and then dividing the height of the tree by that dimension (called a segment), then calculating how much movement you will have at the top with a given amount of wedge lift. As it turned out in practical application, it was pretty darn close.
We also learned some different types of cuts to augment control, such as a tenon cut.
Just as an example, here is a tenon cut before the fall, you will note the face cut at the extreme left of the photo for reference. This is after all cutting is done.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3164.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1570233946)
A wedge is applied at the back of the cut and driven to lift the tree and drive it over. This tree had about 6 feet of back lean and a lot of side lean. The purpose of the tenon is to provide more holding time on the opposite side of the side lean and prevent rotation. It also slows the fall, allowing more escape time.
Here is the tree after the fall. Note the tenon of the left side.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3166.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1570233972)
And here is the stump. The tenon pocket is at about 7 o'clock in this photo. I have to say it worked and kept the tree from rolling too soon in the fall which this tree should have done. It kept the breakage down.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3167.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1570234002)
There was also a lot of detailed instruction on bucking techniques to prevent pinching which I always need practice on and am looking for new ideas. I got a bunch today. My skills in this have improved quite a bit over the past year with practice, but today added some new tools for my mental toolbox.
Unlike my other 2 classes, in this one I was clearly the guy with the least experience. Everyone in this class was a full time professional logger. I also made a classic and fatal mistake by leaving my 372 in the truck and taking my 450 out in the woods. I didn't realize the size wood we would be working with. My tree was 24" DBH and with my 18" bar, which managed to find a load of dirt in the bark early into the fall, I had to work WAY too hard to get it cut. Then I had little left energy for driving it against the 8' of lean. I did have a 'perfect' stump, and my accuracy was also prefect, but I needed help driving wedges which was embarrassing to me. My hand grip capacity was pretty shot.
I didn't spend a lot of time taking photos, I was focused on learning and only thought of it last second. I did catch two tree falls, both of which i thought of too late. So here are some short videos to give you an idea of what we worked on.
https://youtu.be/C7xFI80yFH8 (https://youtu.be/C7xFI80yFH8)
In this one, there is a rotten hazard tree that gets taken out by the main fall, this was intentional. You will see a large tree in the foreground with an ax leaning against it, this was the tree I took out next, falling against the lean, perpendicular to the flat side and directly away from the camera.
https://youtu.be/07O-ep0Lk-4 (https://youtu.be/07O-ep0Lk-4)
At the end of the day, I was pooped, really pooped. It was 1/2 mile walk into the lot, which we did 4 times (lunch break) and I had a lot of driving over back roads. I was too tired to make the detour to see Barge, I wanted to hit the main road before dark, but i called him and got lucky on the 3rd try, we both had a signal and we chatted a while and caught up on 'stuff'. He kept me company on the drive for a while as I dealt with all the weekender traffic flooding the area on a Friday evening. (It's a very real problem here.)
Even though I was a tad intimidated by the crew, knowing that I was the impostor in the group (I did, they didn't until later), they were a good lot. I thought I was in trouble, when we first started walking up the skid trail and one of the guys saw that I had a 1" webbing loop on my saw handle which I draped over my shoulder to carry the weight. He cocked his head and said "Hey, what have you got there, are you wearing a purse on you shoulder?" I explained that where I cut is very steep and I often need both hands to help me climb up, also it makes the day a little easier on an old man like me. He looked at it again ( I thought 'OK, HERE it comes...') and he said "You know, that's a darn good idea, I should make one of those, that saw gets heavy!" Turned out the guy was a real smart alec, but he easily took, enjoyed, and laughed at all the jibes that came his way too. The other guys seemed to dump it on him when he dumped a comment on somebody else. So once I figured out the flow I felt comfortable and was welcomed to join in the poking fun.
So a good day all around with just a healthy and manageable amount of (internal) stress on my part. I learned a lot more, which was the whole point, and got some practice and guidance on things that challenge me. I met some new folks and hooked up with some friends. I didn't have to spend a day in the corporate heck-hole that is my normal life, and I was out in the (chilly, damp) woods. all day. I am very tired and will sleep well. I call it a winner. 8) :D :)
Man I was a lazy bum all weekend. I did a little dirt shoveling yesterday to cover the septic cover back up after pumping and I pulled a muscle in my leg. Kind of took it easy the rest of the weekend. Rainy and snotty today, so I headed out to the shop determined to get something worhwhile done. There is a rats nest of wires for battery chargers in the bay where I park the Mule that drives me crazy. All the chargers are on the floor and the pile of stuff along the wall seems to grow through the winter until I can barely squeeze by. Also the lights in that bay were 'temporary' until I got a chance to do something proper. They are just tied into a power strip I turn on for lights when I need them. Lastly the duplex outlet was a halfarshed mess done by the previous owner that used every manner of leftover electrical hardware you could imagine. I decided today was the last day I would look at that mess. I ripped out the outlet and put in 2 quad outlet boxes, 1 quad is switched with a proper wall switch. I plug the lights and the chargers in to this and they are only on when I am in the shop. I don't like leaving changers on 24/7 unless I am working some sort of major project and need them on. The other quad box has full time power. No before pictures, that was just ugly.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3180.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1570404456)
Then I made a narrow set of shelves to hold the chargers and my battery jump pack with some left over lumber. It is the same depth as the supporting column it is next to, so no increase in wall profile. Very simple and quick, and everything is off the floor.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3177.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1570404392)
Now the aisle is a lot more clear and after I moved one of those temporary overhead fixtures, it is a lot better lit.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3181.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1570404459)
For an electrician this would have been a quick job but I hate doing quad boxes and am slow at it trying to get the wires lengths right and tucked in properly. The whole little fix-it thing took me 4 hours, maybe a little more. But at least I can just walk in and flip a switch for the lights, the chargers are not on when they don't need to be, and nothing is on the floor, so it stays cleaner. No more (OK, LESS) trip hazards and better lighting. A huge expenditure of time for a small thing, but I am glad it is done. At least I didn't waste the afternoon away.
Still raining here since yesterday, depressing. I moved another light fixture in Mule bay to improve lighting just to make it feel like I did something today.
I am sure nobody noticed through all my prattle, but I have not spent much actual time on the mill. SO much other stuff to do. I was down there Sunday queuing up logs for the mill in the hopes of getting them done before the weather closes in. I had a asked a few good friends, who want to help and learn about milling to come over for a planned day to knock a bunch of wood out. I included the landowner in my invitation and he quickly asked me to cancel the plans. He is concerned about somebody getting hurt and the resulting legal actions. He had heard of a fatal firewood processor accident on our road and thinks a manual sawmill is similar to a fully automatic firewood processor. I understand his concerns and I cancelled the plans. I respect his concerns and it IS his property, he is king of that domain, no argument.
But this revelation makes it clear to me that anything I do at the mill is completely on my own (which frankly is a lot more dangerous than having a helper) and there is a big limit to what I can accomplish alone, without hydraulics or anything to lift a log on the mill, working on sloped ground. So I have been doing a LOT of thinking. I put the mill there because I had no other place for it, in fact I made the place for it down there clearing out 50 small hemlocks. Now I am thinking I could put the mill behind my shop, The mill is 24' long and my shop is 24' wide. Yes I would have the engine noise up here by the house and near other homes but one neighbor runs a motocross around his 1 acre plot for 3 hours at a clip on the weekends, and I would like to see him complain. ;D
It's a lot of work to make the move, first I have to clear and grade the area behind the shop. Not too bad, relatively flat, just bumpy and I am working by hand, so hand tools and shovels. Then I have to disassemble the mill and move it along with all the bunks I made and set, then reset them here and go through all the leveling junk again. Basically starting over. I figure with best case I am looking to be set back a month at least. I am not looking forward to the work at all, especially at this time of year.
I have tried to decide if this is the right thing to do, so here is my pro/con list:
Pro List
I can work a lot longer through the winter until the snow gets too deep and resume when we have some melting.
I will be closer to the house, meaning I can use short periods before dinner or other times to work.
I will have ELECTRIC at the mill instead of needing a generator.
I can easily add lighting, but it will not be nearly as dark as it is down in the woods in the evening.
I won't have the steep 1/4 mile run up and down the skid trail for every little thing.
If I buy any logs or just pick them up (fairly likely on occasion), it is an easy drop within 50' of the mill, right now I have to skid them to the mill one at a time.
I will be next to the shop with all the tools I night need.
I can have helpers when I need them.
The ground is a LOT flatter to work on.
Much easier to put a roof over the mill in the future. (a shed roof on the back of the shop).
The work will be a LOT easier on my little Mule. Dragging 1,800# logs up and down those steep skid roads takes quite a toll on it.
Con List
I have to move everything, this will take time and a lot of effort working alone.
I will lose at least a month in the move.
I will have to abandon the mill shed I built. Not a big deal, call it a gift to the landowner with my thanks. It's too tall to move safely.
I will have all the mill scraps up behind the shop. No chance of just throwing rotten stuff over the bank anymore. It will all have to be hauled backed to the woods. (this is sort of big for me)
I don't have much room to store logs so I may need to still keep some across the road and skid them back up to the shop.
I may hurt my neighbors feelings. (certainly not my intent, see further below)
There will be a lot less open working area, it will be tighter.
Disclaimer: I should mention that my neighbor (the landowner) put up half the money for the mill on the understanding that I would mill and build him something. It wasn't a lot of money to him, but it is a lot to me, and I hold my debts dear until paid. I have built him a small stage, and some nice finished benches for inside the house, but I am sure I need to do more to make it even and this in in my plans. Frankly I would love to just hand him the cash so that I don't have to worry about it, but things changed and that cash never came in. He will not come out short on this in any event and I am sure he could care less about the money, He has had a good time seeing the little I have produced. But I did want to mention here that I do have an obligation on this score.
The crew here has always been pretty good at pointing out things I have not considered. So I know, as usual, I have too many words here to describe what most of you will see as a simple issue. I think I know what I have to do, but I am second guessing myself as I always do because the confidence level, with things I have never done before, is on the low side. I am wondering if I have missed something or not thought this through as I should.
If I do make the move, I have to decide if I should mill the logs I have queued up (about 10) and then make the move, or wait and drag them all up the the house, or something in between. I want to have slabs drying through the inter, not later. But that's a bridge to be burned on another day.
What do y'all think?
I have spent many days,did I say many days,hauling rocks to make a good,safe road across the bog. Yes,it took alot of time,but it has held me up for many years. Even held a forwarder up too. The land use to sink in front of the tractor and then rise behind it. Don't no more. Just do it,in the long ran,years,you will be glad you did it. Just as I level my ground out and digs rocks,makes improvements that benefit me. It all takes time,but it saves time too.
sorry to hear your partnership is not perfect. after you build and mill things, will the mill be yours free and clear? I feel for the guy some. attorneys will not spend there time in a law suit where there is no likely money involved, but will if there is insurance and or someone with deep pockets. hope it works out well for all involved.
My own view I would try to figure out a way to buy out the other half ownership of the mill, then you are not under obligation to the neighbor. I would also add having heat, shelter and modern conveniences a few steps from the mill when working in winter to the pro list.
Maybe you need to sit down and have a friendly chat with him and explain that other help is needed in operating the mill. It's just a bit much for one person to do alone most of the time.
Maybe a hybrid solution would be best - instead of moving right away, wait until spring. Leave the mill in place and saw what you can until the weather shuts you down. Take the winter to make what preparations you can for the mill at your new site, and also take time to plan the move in the spring. With enough lead time, you could enlist your friends to assist with moving the mill. This along with your experience setting the mill up the first time might make it go somewhat faster. Waiting until spring gives you time to mill the logs you have, time for planning the move, and may allow you enough time to pay the remainder of the debt on your mill.
My advice, for what it's worth.
Get control and ownership of 100% of the mill. Forget about everything else.
Talk to the man. Buy his half. Get a loan if you need to. Or have him buy your half and then use that, and get a loan, to get another mill.
Or, see if he trusts you to make it good and settle on a deadline when you have time to make the trade, and pay him off in goods and services instead in money. Have him sign a contract and gives you time to fulfill your side of the obligation.
Many of you focused on the ownership of the mill. I only mentioned that to be clear about the full relationship. He has never broached the subject of payment, being clear that he was pleased with how things were going. There is no issue here and he will get his share back in due time, but the mill has to be able to produce something for me to do that. Creating deadlines would be a very bad idea for me right now with all the other stress I have in my life, ( I HATE my job and NEED to get out) the mill is supposed to be just the opposite of that. Adding to that stress with deadlines would remove any joy I can get from making lumber and 'stuff'.
This is why I am contemplating the move, to make it more productive with the little time I have available.
I have no disagreement with my neighbor, he is a kind and gentle guy. There has been zero discussion about money or debt. He is concerned about his liability and I understand that and respect his concern. I am not going to argue the point because he is right, in the event of something horrible happening, it could go all wrong. The fact that this is not likely is besides the point.
I am leaning toward the hybrid solution that Jeep mentioned. I have a bunch of logs there now, I should make what I can from them using the weather as I can. On poor days start the preparations up at the shop. I might be able to get the mill moved up if the weather closes in with just a half day's work. Then with it up here I can work through the poorer weather to begin setting it up. If it is still sitting down there when the snow comes to stay in late December/January, then it is locked in until the spring. I can't even drive down there. Last year I closed down the mill as the snow began falling for good and it took me a half day to shut it all down, pack stuff away and move any good lumber up the hill. It is do-able.
I just need to make a punch list and get to work on one or two items at a time.
Well if the landlord doesn't care if you move the mill up to behind your shop and the spot will work I'd say do it. It will save wear on the mule from skidding, wear on you from being able to have helpers easier. More productive sawing time by having lights when spring anbd fall short days end too early. Maybe a lean to roof overhead, no more tarp. Work out a deal with the land lord that works for the both of you just to avoid hard feelings and stress for you.
I will get electricity to my spot hopefully this fall yet, lights would be really nice.
sounds like you are the brains behind the operation in terms of maintaining and operating the mill. starting the process of having the mill in your proximity makes sense. Big of you to also see things also from his point of view. It is easy in a disagreement to have things fall apart. I would expect nothing less! Best Regards!!!
Yeah Doc, I am the brains, that's me ;D ;D :D. Actually I am the whole thing. He hasn't, nor won't touch it. No interest. I think I have made up my mind for a slow measured transition.
I went out back of the shop tonight and just stood there and looked at the mess I will have to clean up. I't much better now than it was 2 weeks ago, if you can believe it. ;D
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3183.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1570576079)
There were several sets of truck ties piled here for years, but I finally got my son to get rid of them. This spot has been a 'collector' of junk for 25 years and most of the stuff is covered by weeds. There is a utility trailer, yard trailer, lawn roller, disc harrow, cement blocks, and a bunch of other stuff hidden in the weeds. Plus a bunch of antenna parts from my ham radio days. When I was looking at this I caught myself thinking, 'wow, this is gonna be some work to level off'. Then I realized that where the mill sits now the bed is at grade at one end and 16' above at the other, there is also a lot of side slope. So this is really a piece of cake once I get it cleaned off. It is just very rocky and has a lot of crushed stone. I would put the mill parallel to the wall you see on the left side of the photo and about 6-8' away from the wall. Not sure which direction would be forward at this point.
I'll just keep plugging at it as I have time. I have to find homes for all the stuff that is there now. That will take a few evenings. Then scratch the ground clear and see what I have. There may even be some surprises buried there from the previous owner. I never really did a good cleanup there when we got the house 32 years ago. The previous owner had a huge pile of rotten rounds and tree stumps there and rolls of well pipe.
It's the right thing to do, but boy it's a lot of extra work. It was a year ago just this weekend that I went to look at the mill for the first time and in fact it was a year ago to the day today that I found it on CL. Ironic, ain't it?
that looks like the perfect spot. some lighting and plugs on the shop wall, a shed roof to cover. stereo speakers ect. the block wall will block/reflect sound, to where not sure. any way you can pour a slab there, that would be first class, but expensive. maybe just some level footings to frost line and then set up on those.
I think it will do, but you are getting ahead of me Doc with the roof and stereo. :D Not sure which way I should push the mill yet, but I have lots of time to think on it. If I push it 'away' in the photo, the exhaust will be aimed at the wall and I think bounce right back into my ear. The sawdust discharge will also be on that side. If I go the other way it will head to the woods and the house beyond. The discharge bucket would be on the open side. Right now I load logs from the non-discharge side. I am not sure if it makes a difference. I am thinking on it.
Well it's still rainy dripping nasty, but relatively warm so I did a little more incremental clean up for an hour/ I wanted to get the ground clear to see what I had for a level, and in fact I don't. I have waves and they are pretty solid. If I had a machine, i could have this dead flat in 10 minutes or less. But I don't and hacking at it by hand will be very laborious, but that is the next step, incrementally, given my age and abilities to swing a pick axe. It's most stone and rock, slow going. Once I soften it up (ha) I can bring in a load of crushed stone and make it better. I will have to spread that by hand too.
All in all, not so bad. I do have to work on the trailer I pulled out and get the tires pumped up, get is cleaned and back to service, at least in the woods. It is a home owner cheapo trailer I bought over 25 years ago for a single task and got a lot more use out of it than I expected. Then my son used it to start his landscaping business when he was 16. I would like to figure a way to increase the ground clearance (longer shackles?) but I have not even taken a peek underneath to see what I have to work with. Anyway, that's another task. If I get the tires aired up I can bring it down the hill and store it there, out of the way.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3187.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1570664752)
I have never worked on this piece of ground since we bought this place, so I have to do a lot to get it broken up. I won't know until I start. Maybe this rain has loosened it up a bit. We will see.
you prob. know this, but some will put the spring over the axle instead of under.
Quote from: doc henderson on October 09, 2019, 08:22:46 PM
you prob. know this, but some will put the spring over the axle instead of under.
I am digging back to a picture in my head from over 25 years ago, and I think the axle is already under the spring. But it is a fuzzy picture. This trailer had weeds dripping from all over it when I pulled it out. I was surprised one tire took air, the other is off the bead. Sure it needs new tires, but for now I just want to make it mobile and move it out of the way to a storage point. It would be good for hauling up my split wood from the woods and routine chores. I have some golf cart and trailer axles back in my storage she that may be better and heavier for this. But, I don't want to get sie tracked. Focusing on the "mission' right now. :)
Momentum goes a long way so I would not suggest slowing or stopping, never the less, you've come a long way. Cut your self some slack. You really only need a spot big enough for the mill and that should be ready by next season. The rest will fall into place. You've already put a lot of time into manicuring your original spot. I would humbly suggest enjoying that as much as possible. It's been great following this thread.
Well there is not enough light when I get home from work to head down to the mill, so I just keep poking along up here at tha house a little at a time and I will keep pressing. The work helps me clear my thoughts and work on a good plan. Not having the equipment, I have to plan better. I am actually thinking I can move the mill up before the weather closes in for good. I will mill on the weekends and get what logs done that I can. During the week I will work on the new site getting it prepped. A little of this and a little of that and eventually it will get done.
I lose this weekend completely because we have our annual visit to our cousins in southern Vermont to see the pretty foliage. ;D Sorry, that's a family joke. We leave the Catskills, where the place is swarming with leaf-peepers from NYC and NJ to drive to Vt where it is swarming with leaf-peepers from CT and MA. ;D :D But we avoid all that and just enjoy family. Maybe pick some apples and walk in the field checking things out. I need to go see how my young cousin's sugar shack has progressed since I last saw it. There is one good swapfest in town we usually hit when we drive through, I find some good stuff there once in a while.
SO I lose a precious weekend, but it is worth it to relax and spend time with good family that are also good friends. None of us are getting any younger and this is where I spent I spent some of the best days and gained the best memories of my youth. SO yeah, there is that. :)
Ahh, hit the nail on the head!
"I lose a precious weekend, but it is worth it to relax and spend time with good family that are also good friends. None of us are getting any younger and this is where I spent I spent some of the best days and gained the best memories of my youth. SO yeah, there is that."
You look like a hard working dude OG. I spent many many years hating my job. So many of us don't have the luxury of doing what we love at a particular time. Don't cram your life so full so that everything is stress. Doing an unloved job only adds to that as it is such a big part of life. Use your job to support what things you do love!
Your spot behind the shop looks pretty good in the pictures, that little mower trailer looks like a
Log moving machine to me. Ok it looks not lots bigger than one of mine and it has been pressed into firewood and log moving service. Looking at the slope you have, seeing the way the trailer leans, a dump truck of fill /sand would go quite a ways to getting you level enough to set the mill. Looks like a good option.
I had about 2 feet of gravel hauled in to level my sawmill spot. I use those rounds pads,6 inches thick by 2 feet across? But I have a tractor with a loader to get my logs up that 2 foot high incline. I was at a circle mill and they loaded logs on a trailer,and the mill was at just about the same height. If you do this make the trailer higher than the mill,by a few inches. Easier to roll the logs "downhill"
I have also spent time doing things,or building something and find out I should not of done it that way 6 months later. Yes,a bother to redo,but more of a bother to deal with it day after day.
Yeah, I will just keep plugging at this. You never know what the ground is like until you drive a pick into it. I would like to get it as level as possible by hand without bringing in crushed stone (our cheap fill here. I don't like the stone chips getting stuck on the logs. Eventually you miss one. ;D
It may not be so bad and there is only one way to find out. Keeping the bed close to the ground makes loading easier, but I could at some point anchor a couple of eye bolts in the shop wall to help with rolling bigger logs up. SO, lots of ideas to roll around in my empty head while I am driving back and forth to VT.
Yeah, Nebraska, that trailer in the last photo hauled all my firewood this year. I have a slightly bigger one I have used for logs (lifting is an issue yet). My son dumped a turbo diesel engine on it back in June that really needs to get gone so I can put it back in use. I'll also fix up the clunker that was buried in the the grass in the first photo for lighter miscellaneous stuff.
By the way, I forgot to ask: Are there any FF members in the Wilmington, Marlboro, Jacksonville, VT area? Maybe I could swing by for a very short visit. Not sure what our plans are until we get there.We drive over that way from Troy,NY. Rt 7 to RT 9, through Bennington, over to Wilmington, then south on 100. My cousin is recovering from knee surgery last week, so we may just hang around the farm on this visit. Just asking, you never know. :)
Well I spent a couple of hours with pick and shovel in the last 2 evenings, mostly pick trying to break up the high spots and move the rock around. I put the snow plow on the Mule to see if I could cheat a little (mixed results) last night. Did a little more hand work tonight and spread some of the stuff into the low spots. When I was shot I got a beer and stood there and looked at it for a bit thinking on it.
This is what I saw:
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3195.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1570833476)
The dark area is where I was working, there is a 5 inch hump there I flattened off.
I know it would take me many hours spread out over many days to do this by hand and get it perfect before I began setting the mill bed. I don't have the back and the breath I had 20 years ago. I also know I would beat the heck out of myself doing it. I asked myself why I was putting time into this and was it worth it. I realized then I hadn't thought too much about what was needed for the mill so much as what I wanted.
I have been having a very rough time at work these last few months (actually years), and these last few weeks it has been getting worse. No details here, but just understand that every day the urge to tell the boss where he can stick his spreadsheets gets stronger and stronger. It's now at the point that I have had conversations with my wife to let her know that one day soon I may snap and just quit. I didn't want her to be surprised too much. I have been making inquiries with folks I know about any jobs that may be available that include health insurance. ANYTHING. I have worked in my trade for over 46 years and am one of the best guys you will find, but I am being treated like crap and I don't deserve it, nor do I have to take it and be used as a whipping boy. I would retire tomorrow, but I don't hit 65 until the spring. My boss is retiring in February, but I don't think I can take this much longer. I think he plans to make some changes before he leaves to 'add to his legacy' which is already pretty dang disgusting. Anyway, because of these issues, each night I have needed to come home and do some real work that accomplished something. Swinging a pick felt good. I beat the sweat out of me and slept better for at least half the night anyway. I think when I saw the grade on this ground wasn't right, I just grabbed a pick and went at it. Probably a dumb thing, but what ever. (rant over)
So now it's Friday and I picked and shoveled some more and am trying to put that little weasel out of my head for a few days. I am thinking that maybe at this point, the ground is more than close enough. The current mill setup has nearly a 16" drop along it's length and 4-6" from left to right rails. Compared to that, this area is pool table flat with probably a 4" max variation. I'll set and level my blocks every 6' then run my 6x6's over the tops just as i have now down below and I should be fine. Dragging logs in should smooth off the walking area over time.
Headed to VT in the morning. I will think some more on this over the weekend, but not a lot. ;D
It's time to get some motivation back. I had to go back several pages here to figure out when the last time was that I cut something on the mill. It was August 29th. If I was of a certain faith I would have to declare this in the confessional tomorrow. ;D It's been too long I have been ditshing around with other stuff. Now that I have decided to move the mill I need to mill up the logs that are there. This is the weekend to see what kind of dent I can put in stack of logs by myself (unless a genie shows up). I had 40 minutes of daylight when I got home, but I went down to check things out, it's been a few weeks and we had some horrible wind and rain the last couple of days. There might have been damage control to do first, but everything looks ok.
One thing I had wanted to do and have put off too long is painting all the logs ends. I KNOW I should have done that sooner, but hey, no time like the present and I didn't want to do it after milling, so I had just enough time to do that tonight. Only one log had a bad split I can work with. A few had been done elsewhere prior, but now they are all done and should be dry by morning. This is most of them, I have 4 or 5 more out of the camera shot.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3207.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1571438704)
I think half the reason I did it was so that I could convince myself I was back to work down there and had a jump on tomorrow. Kind of to get my addled brain back in the groove. The weather is getting colder, first frost tonight, and it would be easy to sit in the house and drink coffee until the sun was high. But I need to get down there early and max out the day. The weather should be OK.
So the first task tomorrow is to make lumber for the Ashokan center to use for an ongoing footbridge restoration project. 5 logs is the goal. The logs are at about 18% MC now. The final product has to match what they have, standard lumber size (2x6= 1-1/2 x 5-1/2). So I will cut oversize and after air drying for a year, they get planed and joined to final size. Then they are stored until needed to replace the bad parts as needed.
So my question for anybody still reading along here is: What size should I mill them? I am of a thought that I should mill them 1/4" over in each dimension to allow for 1/8" removal on each face. If they were full green I might go bigger, but this tree was long time dead before I dropped it. I am pretty much giving them everything back. The slabs will be used for primitive benches and other stuff. Only the real junk goes over the bank or becomes firewood, and they don't need firewood, they have more than they can burn. :D I will back a trailer up to the mill and stack right on that. Delivery as soon as the milling is complete, then onto my own logs for winter work. I give myself a couple or 3 weekends for this work, then I need to begin the moving process.
if the mill is cutting smooth, at least and 1/8th over. more if they need to be perfect smooth. 1/4 should be plenty. looks like you are getting to work!
Well, I kept my promise to myself. I was up at 5 to get a good start on the coffee. The grey light doesn't come until around 7am and I got out soon after that. I hooked up the trailer and headed down to the mill and had the trailer in position before the sun broke through the trees. I did manage to remove one of those pesky tail lights on a tree that got in the way. Good start, right? Got a log dragged up and on the mill for the first cut, started the coffee pot (no coffee, no workie) took my first cut and it was a lot of work. The blade wasn't holding height, not really diving, but drifting down a bit, the blade would slow down and cutting seemed hard. Maybe, I thought, I had forgotten how tough this ash can be when it's dry? The sawdust looked very fine. The log was very squiggly and I had no idea how to get any usable dimensional lumber out of it. I could wind up with 2 2x4's and not much else, so I slabbed it in 7/4 so they might make some benches. I got 6 slabs out of it. But the cutting was really tough. Halfway through I stopped and checked the blade, it was dull. OK, stop and change the blade. As I am tightening up the last nut finishing the blade change I see a chunk missing out of the drive belt. DanG! Well, I am all done with the change, so I tried it. No soap. Keeps stalling in the cut. Back it up and take it all apart again plus the drive pulley and put on a new belt (yes, I knew it was going last year and ordered one, just waiting until I needed it).
This belt didn't owe me anything;
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3215.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1571523968)
Got it all back together AGAIN and now it cuts pretty much like a dream (for ash). Nice straight flat boards. Finished off the first log and threw the live edged slabs on the trailer as is.
I dragged up another log and got it set. Now it's noon. I haven't had breakfast yet. So I headed up to the house, emptied my sawdust buckets and made lunch. I laid on the couch for 'just a few minutes' to flatten out my back. Woke up and hour and a half later very groggy and headed back down. Now I had a good log up and milled a nice cant and got 5 2x6's and 5 2x4's out of it. Stickered and loaded that and I was pretty pooped. It was 5pm. I cleaned the coffee pot out, finished the last cup, put the tools away, blew off the mill, tarped it all up and was back in the shop by 5:30. I have no plans to go out and mess around in the shop tonight. My goal now is to stay awake through dinner. ;D
So a lot of mis-steps and fixes through the day, but I managed, in spite of it all to get something done. It sure doesn't look like much to me though:
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3219.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1571523981)
It has been more than a couple of months since I spent the day wrangling logs an I think I am a little out of shape. Nothing hurts, but I am a little sore and really tired. I don't know if I can do the last 3 logs from their load tomorrow, but that is the goal. I think I will run out of steam early. BUT at least I am back to work making wood!
Well, yesterday was a hard fought day and assuming I wasn't too sore this morning (I wasn't) I should have been able to make some time and knock off the last 3 logs in that lot. Nope. There were more 'lessons' in store.
So I threw up the 'tough' log, odd shape and thought about my approach for a bit then just made a choice and went for it. The first two sides came out OK, the third side was a challenge for me.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3236.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1571604830)
Now tell me if I'm wrong, but I thought I could take that hump off the top and still wind up with enough in the middle for the 2x6's needed. That was the plan anyway. So I took my first cut to get the hump off and the blade went for a ride toward the sky. It should not be dull at this point, but I checked it, and it was shot. Ticked off, but I put a new one one.
First cut with the new blade and I must have hit the end a bit too hard (note how much log is hanging out in space). The log grabbed and snapped and rolled a little and popped the blade clean off. OK, reset the blade (this is now twice I had to take all the guards off), move the log a little for better clamping, and approach with caution. Cuts OK, then after about a foot or so, the blade goes for a ride uphill again! What the heck?!
Now I take a closer look and found this:
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3241.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1571605398)
Two strands of barbed wire that had to be strung when this tree was about 4 inches in diameter. Now while you are clearing tears from your eyes, remember that I am new to this, I have never hit metal (until today), and I am not very bright. ;D (Dad always said I had to learn things the hard way. It still applies). So I grabbed the chainsaw and whacked 2' off the end of the log and put ANOTHER blade on. (now on the third iteration of pulling all the guards.) As if to drive the message home (maybe Dad is up there laughing at me), it now starts raining. I get the cant done and go up for lunch, then come back down, re-heat the coffee (still raining) and finish it (the log) off, but it is raining harder. I got 5 2x6's and 9 2x4's out out the log. Another full layer on the trailer load anyway.
At this point I am thinking of bagging it. I took a break, had another hot cup of coffee and sat in the mill shed listening to the rain. I don't know a prettier sound than the rain filtering down through the trees, even if it is messing up my plans. A hot cup of coffee has an effect too. ;D
So I grabbed one more log and got it loaded and milled it into a cant before I was too wet, it was raining too hard and I was either soaked in sweat from the inside or rain from from the outside. So I finally bagged it. Cleaned out the coffee pot, put the tools away, and left the cant sitting on the bed. Wet and tired is not my favorite condition.
I am not complaining, I got a bunch of stuff on the trailer and I picked up a new hard lesson or two. The first year, I guess, you get the hardest lessons, and then hopefully they get spaced out further, right? :D Yesterday was beautiful today wasn't too bad, and I know worse weather is coming. When I move the mill I am really going to miss 'break time' down in the woods, it is so nice and quiet and there are critters from time to time.
I came up, took a hot shower, and got on clean dry clothes. That felt pretty good too. :)
Didn't get much done tonight, but I got something done. Went down and finished off that cant I left on the mill yesterday. Clear skies so I had light until 5:45. Got 4 more 2x6's on the trailer and ready for the next log. Then some deer, 4 does, moved in when I was putting stuff away, so I sat on a log an watched the, watching me. I figured they were back, most of the apples I left here and there are gone. ;D Then it was dark.
I had ordered another ax scabbard from Grizzly Peak to fit the new ax I fitted up last week and while I was at it I ordered a good belt to go with it, I am tired of fighting with my old one. SO I took the time to put some neatsfoot oil on the belt (Seems like nobody oils their leather anymore?) and I fitted everything up on the belt. I like it, it all fits well and rides pretty good. I may add a set of braces at some point, lets see how it goes. For now I am happy with the rig. I try to get something done every day.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3257.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1571703950)
Did a post last night but we had a power blip just as I was done and I lost it. You didn't miss much. ;D
It was raining Tuesday night so I caught up on saw sharpening and cleaned out my sawbox in the mule which really need it. Too much junk collecting over the summer.
Tonight the weather was great, but still when I get down into the mill area there is't much light. I though maybe at least I could get a log up on the mill and ready to get started. I only have about 40 minutes or so. I managed to get a log up and get it milled into a can't then take a handful of 5/4 boards off the top before I could not read the scale or see what I was doing. I shut down, pretty happy with that. If there is enough light, I might be able to finish it off tomorrow.
Last log in the order:
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3259.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1571874917)
While I was closing up I hear the gosh awful noise coming there the trees, way up about 30 feet. I could tell what it was, sounded like a drunk chopper pilot trying t salvage a landing. Turned out to be a turkey coming in to roost right near the mill. When he saw me he didn't like being so close and he found another spot about 30 yards away. It was interesting. Man they are NOT elegant when they roost. ;D
At any rate, what I got down tonight means I can have the load done early Saturday morning at the latest, which was my 'hoped for goal'. I have a bunch of filtches to load on top, they can use those for benches or whatever. Then I have to bind it down and get it up the hill from the mill. I might mill another log (my own) before I deliver it.
After unloading at the center I am hoping to get that big oak finally bucked up. Anybody ever hear of an 'axle cut'? I am dying to try that on this stem. It might be a safer way to part this off, and if it isn't, or doesn't work, I won't be any worse off.
Short post here. Thursday/Friday I was sick, nt sire with what. Still not quite over it. Took it easy. Got my load all tied down and hauel it up early today. Brought it over to the center late morning. Nobody to help stack, so I did it myself. They did share a nice lunch with with me and I got the catch up with a music friend, Chris Eldredge. They invited me back for the concert tonight, and it was super, as I expected. Still not feeling 100%, but coming along.
Free boards for them, a learning experience for me. WIN-win.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3264.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1572149239)
Man, today was a total washout. It started raining just around midnight and rained all through the day and it still drizzling now. I guess it was just as well, I needed a day to just relax after whatever that was I had at the end of the week. I think it must have been a grazing shot from from the flu.
I had focused on that load for the Ashokan center and now that this is done, it's time to move on to the next thing. I have about 6 to 8 logs down there to mill and one is a good one, a nice straight maple about 22 inches at the small end and at least 12' 6" long. The others are 'eh' ok and I am hoping to get some slabs out of them I can make benches out of. That would be winter work which is part of the goal, get some stock to work on.
Right now i am trying to decide what to do with that nice log. I think I might just slab it to get it drying, but I am wondering if there is a better plan. I guess I will save that one for last. Most of them dictate what I can cut from them, so those are easy. But that one log is really nice.
Today marks two full weeks since I have posted here. It is not that I haven't done anything, it's just that my work life is beyond stressful right now. I am working on the worst project of my career and it is all going wrong. I don't really want to get into it here, but basically i was handed a million dollar machine buy project and am supposed to make these machines work to make our parts. The main issue stems from the fact that I did not have anything to do with planning this project or spec'ing and ordering the tooling. That was all given to another guy who was slated to retire. He said 'everything was covered' in his plan. The week he retired, they dumped the project in my lap, 3 months before the machines were to be delivered. I had no experience with the product likes these machines affect. I didn't know which way was up, I had to trust the plan. Well, everything that could go wrong, has gone wrong. The wrong tooling was ordered, and no tooling was ordered at all for one turret on each machine (4 axis CNC lathes x 2). The program conversion software is half baked and needs a LOT of work (and I am not a lather guy. Then to make it worse, my boss decides, just 1 week before delivery to change the plan for the second machine requiring a LOT more programming work and more new tooling to be ordered (to the tune of $10k or so). This is what happens when you put a guy in charge who can't read a print and has never had his hands on a machine. I have been working 12 hour days and barely sleeping at all each night. I am just sick over this whole thing because I have been in a lot of tough spots in the last 45 years, but this is the first time I can't seem to pull that rabbit out of a hat. And it ain't over yet by a long shot. I can't wait until I can retire in the spring. I am tired of suffering fools.
So milling has not been first in my mind. The dark evenings keep me out of the woods and I have only been out in the shop once or twice in the evenings. It's been hanging in the 30's and lower at night. Mostly I have dinner, read the FF posts, and go to bed. Yesterday I had to cover the afternoon shift at work so I only had time to fix the neighbors hot tub (again) and bring a few boards up from the mill, then go to work. Dark when I got home. I didn't sleep well again last night.
Today I forced myself to make an effort. I got up on the roof and cleaned the chimney. Then I came in and cleaned the stove, it took longer than normal as every vacuum cleaner I have was used by someone else and had full bags or other problems to be fixed. I dropped off the neighbor's mail (we take in in for them when they are not here) and headed to the mill. We may have a real snow coming this week, so I needed to get the tarp down before the snow destroyed it. 24 x 48 takes a while to drop, fold, and roll working alone but I got it done in less than an hour. Then I put a load of lumber on the mule and ran it up the hill onto a temporary stack. I just want to get it up from the woods so I can get at it. Moving 8-12' boards with the 4' mule bed is problematic :D, another reason I need to move the mill. (see photo below) I had lunch then went back down, no mid-day break today, must keep moving. I loaded more lumber from the drying stack onto the mule. I grabbed the last (maple) log I had cut about 15 months ago and ran it up on the mill. I got 2 5/4 x 12' and 3 8/4 x 12' averaging 11" wide. I stacked them on the side for another run. I now have about 3 logs left before the move starts. When I was taking a break to catch my breath, I was sitting on a log and looking at the nice one. It dawned on me that I can get 2 6x8 posts I need for my loft extension in the shop. So I think that's a plan. I need 5 of those posts in total to support the floor. If I start making the pieces as I have opportunity I can keep that moving along also. This is a project I have not yet mentioned here, more to come in the future, but there is a lot of prep work to do before I can begin the build. I am just trying to make a little more room in my shop. A 12x12 loft gives me another 144 sq ft and I could use it. I remember the days when I would have done anything just to have a 144 sq ft shop.
So I flat stacked those boards knowing they will be moved up to the house in a couple of weeks. I want to keep pecking away at moving the stuff on my drying skid and get the skid moved up to the house and leveled, then I can re-stack everything on it for the winter. I am milling slabs for tables, stock for legs, and focusing on that type stuff with the logs I have. Then get the mill moved up before the snow settles in. I might put the mill carriage in the shop and go over everything and bring it up to snuff before I set it on the bed.
Speaking of the mill, I have to say that since my troubles of a few weeks ago where I hit some metal, had to replace the drive belt and a couple of other things, my mill has NEVER run this good! Flat boards, solid cutting, no blade stalling, much less shaking/vibration in wide cuts. I could not be happier with the way this machine is cutting. It makes me smile every time I run down the log. I am beginning to learn a lot more of the finer points and how they actually FEEL in your hands based on what I have learned here on the FF and what I have seen and done with my mill. My confidence grows. It has only been about 54 weeks since I took my first worrisome cut with this thing. Now I am finally feeling like I understand some of this.
To end off the day I started a fire in the wood stove. First fire always takes a while, but it's going and the temp just jumped up to 73 here at the desk. It feels good, just like the first beer after a long day.
Here is one of those short loads coming up the hill today:
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3277.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1573423097)
I have to get a better lumber handling plan. ;D
You have a trailer ball on there,I suppose no receiver? I have see those on a truck,they go into the receiver and they extend out so many feet and have a square C on them,that goes up and down, to hold boards,pipe into. Should be able to make something like that.
Good luck on the job.
I had a Boss that would come up with a great idea. I was the go to man to get it done. I use to say Yes,dear each time. Finally he asked me why do I always say Yes dear. I told him,well you are just like my wife. She comes up with some great idea and if I don't make it work the way she sees it, there is H E double hockey sticks to pay. Boy he got mad. ;D ;D ;D BUT it was and is true. ;D
well i am havin one with you, goose island octoberfest! I like the sayin, "we have done so much for so long with so little, we can now do anything with nothing". prob. what your boss has come to expect. enjoy> cheers! smiley_beertoast maybe try pulling another something outa somewhere else! :D :D :D like a miracle
Quote from: thecfarm on November 10, 2019, 06:52:37 PM
You have a trailer ball on there,I suppose no receiver? I have see those on a truck,they go into the receiver and they extend out so many feet and have a square C on them,that goes up and down, to hold boards,pipe into. Should be able to make something like that.
Good luck on the job.
I had a Boss that would come up with a great idea. I was the go to man to get it done. I use to say Yes,dear each time. Finally he asked me why do I always say Yes dear. I told him,well you are just like my wife. She comes up with some great idea and if I don't make it work the way she sees it, there is H E double hockey sticks to pay. Boy he got mad. ;D ;D ;D BUT it was and is true. ;D
You know as soon as I looked at that photo (not when I took it) I thought the same thing. This has an 1-1/4 receiver, I would have to fab something, but that is much easier than build a trailer. I gotta do some research.
I have worked for a lot of bosses, and a few true leaders. Some are really good, some not so much. The best I can say about this guys is that he is an idiot. He should take that as a compliment.
Quote from: thecfarm on November 10, 2019, 06:52:37 PM
You have a trailer ball on there,I suppose no receiver? I have see those on a truck,they go into the receiver and they extend out so many feet and have a square C on them,that goes up and down, to hold boards,pipe into. Should be able to make something like that.
I did some quick looking around, Home Despot has one for a 2" receiver for about 65 bucks, that plus the receiver adapter puts me at around 90 bucks, which ain't too bad. I'll think about it for a week or so because I have some other more urgent purchases (like a tonneau cover for the new truck before the snow stays). It's a great idea though, don't know why it didn't hit me earlier. I will add it eventually. I need to sell some stuff. ;D :D
Quote from: doc henderson on November 10, 2019, 06:59:39 PM
well i am havin one with you, goose island octoberfest! I like the sayin, "we have done so much for so long with so little, we can now do anything with nothing". prob. what your boss has come to expect. enjoy> cheers! smiley_beertoast maybe try pulling another something outa somewhere else! :D :D :D like a miracle
Thanks for joining me in a beer @doc henderson (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=41041) , I am drinking my usual (cheap) Busch regular. My job is defined as doing something specific and difficult with practically nothing, I have been doing this my entire career, it's why I am so good at what I do, I have had a lot of practice. But theses days, my boss doesn't even have the first clue what he is expecting and when I try to explain it, he just says 'well we have to make it happen' like that is going to make a difference. He's an idiot, but he is my idiot and I have to deal with it, for good or for bad, mostly bad. Just like some of the folks I used to run into on the ambulance, some folks are just too stupid to live.
"some folks are just too stupid to live"
Now that's a good one! It really gets me thinking at times the broad range of slack humanity has to allow people to survive.
My sawmill is about a 1/4 mile from the cabin I built, so I was always shuttling cut lumber from the mill to the cabin. I had the same problems as you with the long boards. I ended up stacking the boards sideways on my SxS, and then removing any trees, stumps or brush they could catch on. This might be a better solution to your problem than fabricating something you don't have time to fabricate. Cheaper too. Just a thought.
Well, I have 2 issues to overcome. One is the steepness of the skid road and if I have too much weight on, the Mule wants to lift it's front wheels off the ground. The second is the trees I catch. I can only take out a few of them, not all and there is a gate to pass through which I cannot change and is supported by a 30" red oak. ;D
I put what I can on at an angle to maximize the ability to get through, but I still catch something every once in a while. I do have a small trailer, but it is tied up right now. When I free that up, I will begin running more lumber up. Once I move the mill, this will become a non-issue. But, I do like that hitch extension idea. That could be very handy if I can make it work.
can you use the log arch? could even support the front of the wood load on the hitch or bed, and put an axle behind at the back of the load, like a log arch, and toe it. I agree this is just temporary and not worth spending time or money for now. second, can and will you wife ride on the front of the mule?... ;) :)
The log arch won't work Doc, it doesn't fit. I need to make a dolly and would have to buy the wheels, which is holding me up, then I would have to fabricate. No time for that yet. I can make that little trailer work much quicker.
Tonight I started working on the bill of materials for my next loft addition in the shop. Just 12'x12', but it's more floor space, right? At least with a framing list I can start knocking off some of the lumber I need to make. The 6x8 columns (5) will use up a lot of logs, so I guess I just figured out what to do with the last few logs I have. Then I need more logs for the 2x10 headers (6), and the 2x8 joists (10). So I guess my project just made my milling plan for the near future. At least now I know what I am milling for so I can cut the logs the right length.
Well, it's been so cold (in the teens most nights) that I don't feel like going out to the shop, too much cold, too soon. Most nights I get home from work mentally exhausted. So I have been thinking on things and making sketches of build ideas. Maybe you saw my thread on the shed roof. That's been changed to a dog house for the mill head, so I have something else to mill for. ;D I am going to need more logs when I get the mill moved. :) I am also planning a short extension on the mill bed, so I need to break out the welder and brush up on those skills. Yeah, I am thinking way past my available time. But this is what I need to do to shake off the bad vibes from work.
I got voluntold to be in the office Saturday morning to do data validation after a server swap. I have unlimited unpaid overtime, so there is that >:( and I lose more time on the mill. Hopefully I can get it done early and fast. They said it would be done by 6am and I could get to work, but last weekend they said they would be done by 2pm Saturday and they in fact didn't finish until 7pm Sunday night. ooops. Have I mentioned how much I hate my job? ;D
Anyway, I have sketches for a neat corner shelf with live edges and a nice little end table I'd like to try. I am also thinking about trying a few live edge clocks with diagonal milled oblongs. Those will be my winter shop projects if I can come up with the material. Now I am motivated to get that mill moved and back to work. But of course, I have those logs to finish first. The weather is not helping me out. I may take a day off next week if one of them has good weather.
I try to plan my projects out so I can get the long lead time stuff moving along and it is ready when I need it. There are a few logs I can grab for current needs, but I don't think it's near enough. I have a arborist/logger/sawyer down the road that passes my house at least 4 times a day. I may see what 'arrangement' I can make with him to give or sell me some logs and drop them off on his way home just to get me over the hump.
So I am not posting much and have no photos to share, but the brain is busy. I am doing anything I can to keep my mind off work and sleep through the night. I'd like to make some stuff through the winter and try a small (cheap) craft fair in the spring/summer to see how it goes.
remember with overtime they are getting closer to paying you almost 1/2 what you are worth. ;) we need both time and money so the OT is helping on the money part. without the job, you would have all kinds of time but no pot to pith in! :) I hope things calm down, but you seem to thrive on problem solving. make it a game if you can, this gets you the money to buy the stuff you need when you have time to do the stuff you want to do. god bless, sleep well, you are a good egg my friend!
Doc, read my post again. I don't get paid for overtime, in fact they don't pay me at all for extra hours.
ahhhhh unlimited "unpaid" overtime. well that sucks then! better? :) best regards!
I will send you a note to take all next week off! ;D
Please send me a note that I can go back to work ;D. This retirement is for the birds fly_smiley.
Quote from: Ed_K on November 15, 2019, 10:01:39 AM
Please send me a note that I can go back to work ;D. This retirement is for the birds fly_smiley.
You want to trade places @Ed_K (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=257) ? ;D
Well, today was a pretty good day all around. I had to work in the morning but I managed to get my secret decoder ring stuff back working so i could work remotely from home. I don't have need to do that often, so I had to reset all my passwords and my decoder ring, but I got to work fairly early, got it done, and was finished before 8:30, all in my slippers. :)
SO I headed to the mill, but it was 20° and I really wasn't looking forward to the weather adjustment. Turned out to be one of those days where your toes are frozen and the rest of you is sweating. I slabbed a log that I have some ideas for and got half of it up the hill, then had lunch.
I am thinking of a corner shelf.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3284.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1573940939)
The left end would be the bottom and trimmed off square.
I have enough to do a table or something else.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3289.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1573940937)
I had to do some thinking on how to trim off the one edge. I tried this and realized it wasn't too workable ;D
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3282.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1573940878)
I cut them in pairs. Again, trying to stock to start working on over the winter.
There was some nice grain in some of that wood.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3293.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1573941002)
After lunch, I threw up a nice maple butt log. 12-1/2 feet long, it was heavy (you gotta love manual milling with no lifting equipment). I didn't think to speand a lot of time taking photos, but I milled that into a cant, got some 8/4 and a 5/4 or two, plus 1 6x8 I need for the loft extension in the shop.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3295.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1573941031)
I have one more major log to mill, and perhaps one I can get another 6x8 out of, otherwise, it might become next years firewood.
A long enough day, I quit when the sun dropped below the tree tops and started cleaning up. Tomorrow should be more of the same, I hope. Today the high temp was around 32° and I learned two things: 1) you have to watch your blade lube. mine never froze, it it ran dang slow, and 2) You had better scrape the sawdust off your boards pretty quickly in lower temps because if you don't do it quick, it will freeze in place. ;D
For the second day in a row I had a pretty good day. First, I slept 11 hours last night. I needed that. I have not slept through a night in over a month due to the stress I have been under. But I did so much heavy physical work yesterday that that I fell asleep in my chair at 7:45, got up and went to bed at 8:30. Didn't get up until 7:30 this morning. It felt really good.
A little slow starting, but I headed down to the mill around 9:30 when the temp hit about 23°. I had some sore muscles. ;D I pulled my bigger trailer down because I could not do anything until I got that heavy 6x8 (full green) off the mill. I also had a lot of lumber to move as part of the overall relocation plan. I had to cut the 6x8 to a rough length and of course I had left the chainsaws in the shop. So I unhitched the trailer and did the loop to get the saw. Even cutting it off to 86" made for a heavy piece of wood. My lumber calculator puts it at just over 100# (DRY) and this has to have an MC of at least 60%. SO you can take a guess, mine is around 150# or more judging by how much I sweat. :D I was thinking of @ManjiSann (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=46620) while I was dong this, given his issues handling short logs ad the challenges he faces (and overcomes).
Getting it here nearly popped my eyes out, and the next move was a bit tougher.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3296.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1574027524)
Still I got a pretty good load on. Some 2x6x12's, some slabs for benches, and a bunch of other stuff. I figure the load was around 1,000# and I was worried about making it up the steep skid road hill.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3299.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1574027558)
That Mule was screaming and for a little bit I was thinking I bit off more than it could chew, but it made it. I got caught on the game cam when I rounded the bend at the top. My enthusiasm may show just a bit. That load was touch and go.
https://youtu.be/9Nfoe4Fkkrs (https://youtu.be/9Nfoe4Fkkrs)
I went back down and emptied off my drying skid into the trailer, then managed to flip the skid itself onto the trailer and hauled that whole mess up too. I off loaded and flat stacked it all. Most had been air drying for nearly a year and a lot of it is remnants and junk I made as I learned. I will reset the drying skid when I get somebody to lend me a hand moving it into it's new home. I had a quick lunch. I had called a neighbor to help move the skid, but he had food poisoning. It's not THAT important.
So I parked the trailer and headed down to the mill again this time to do some work (as if I had been goofing off earlier). I had a couple of poor maple logs that I thought would wind up as firewood, but now that I am making lumber for the shop loft, I realized I might get another 6x8 out of the one, and some 2x6's out of the other. Funny how a day or two can change your perspective completely, isn't it? So I grabbed the bigger one and made a long 6x8, plus some good bench slabs. It has a little wane (or is it "wain"?, maybe "Wayne"? Wayne is my middle name, after John Wayne, but I digress), but that just adds to the attraction, I think. Anyway, this one I opted to put cross ways on the Mule to get it up to the shop, the sun was dropping. Not as bad as the other one, for sure but still quite a load on my back and I nearly lost it a time or two. I think the MC was lower in this one. I am not sure which was tougher, getting those pieces up on the Mule, or getting the strap around them working alone. :D I felt like a one armed paper hanger.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3304.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1574027585)
At any rate I got them up into the shop, off loaded and stacked the 4 pieces I have. 2 of them are not usable for the loft, too short. But I will look at them for a bit and come up with something for them to do. ;D I did note that the 6x8 I cut yesterday weighs at least 30% more than the ones I cut today. Interesting I think.
I was so pooped after all that stuff that I sat in the shop to catch my breath and I was looking where the loft will go. I think I may just put a 6x10 header of the front face of that loft so that I can hang a winch from it for lifting 'stuff'. It would be right over the front of the main bay. Something I have have to ponder some more.
So again, it was a pretty good couple of days. As my Dad always said, "Progress is being made".
glad you had a good couple days, it musta been the pep talk i gave ya!!! :D :D :D maybe 1 %?
Quote from: doc henderson on November 17, 2019, 06:28:54 PM
glad you had a good couple days, it musta been the pep talk i gave ya!!! :D :D :D maybe 1 %?
There was a pep talk and I missed it? :D Yeah, sorry, that was it Doc, the pep talk!
I think being able to spend 2 days in a row working on my own stuff without leaving the property. (OK, we went to a diner for dinner last night but the wife drove and I forgot to bring my wallet, so that doesn't count ;D).
I just keep pushing forward. Any progress is good progress, right? At this point, this afternoon, I figured I can mill up those very last 2 logs and start moving the mill Thanksgiving weekend. Before today I had not set a date as a goal. Getting near the end of the 1st season now and I am starting to firm up the prep work for the next session.
8) 8)Glad you had a great day, it was beautiful here all in all an excellent weekend.
Glad you were able to load those boards!
It never ceases to amaze me how much some of this stuff weighs :o :o I keep meaning to get into body building so I can lift it easier ;D
Brandon
Quote from: ManjiSann on November 18, 2019, 08:21:45 AM
Glad you were able to load those boards!
It never ceases to amaze me how much some of this stuff weighs :o :o I keep meaning to get into body building so I can lift it easier ;D
Brandon
If you are a sawyer, you are a body builder whether you like it or not. ;D I am a bit sore today, not a lot, just a bit.
Well as stated, I got a fair amount of work done this past weekend and I am happy with that. But now it's the miserable work week again. >:( It's pitch black before I leave work now and all my lumber is pretty much green so I can't do any shop projects. However I can keep my mind busy with that loft extension in the shop. I need to keep whittling away at that lumber so it's ready when I start building. I went out to the shop and took dimensions more specifically than I had before and made a sketch as the previous one was in my head and as I change the design it is getting hard to keep track. I also roughly calculated the board footage I will need. The framing comes out to around 380 b/f. I changed again yesterday when I decided to put a 6 x 10 x 12' header across the front. This will allow me to hang a chain fall at the front of the bay if I need it.
The build is a way off, I have a lot of work the prepare and clear the area, but once I start, the build should go quick as it did with the last one. (That was 12 x 20, this one is 12' x 8.5' with a small bridge to the other deck). So I would like to have all the framing lumber ready to go before I begin. I figure January if all goes well with the mill move.
I need more logs for these headers and rafters and a few columns and am not sure where they are coming from yet.
Now I am pondering the question of the deck. On the other loft I used 2 layers of plywood (17/32) and that worked fine, but it cost me cash. My sawyer at the time suggested I use his planks. So now I am thinking about 1" boards (maybe 5/4?). Now I have a good friend here on the FF who is always offering me pine if I need it. This would be a good opportunity for that. Here's my quandary: I need a 12' run, which means 12"+ logs. I don't have a trailer that will fit 12'+ logs, I can only carry 10' on mine. I MIGHT be able to get some 12' logs dropped off, but not sure yet, haven't asked. Now if I cut those boards on a 45° bias, I can use random lengths. I would need about 190 BF it it were 1". I think 1" is too thin. It won't compare to the carry capacity of 1" of plywood. I am not sure how 5/4 would compare.
So my questions for those still reading this thread:
1) Plywood or planks?
2) Bias or square?
3) 1", 5/4, 1-1/2 inch, or something different?
4) anything I missed?
Did you say what the spacing on the joists will be? That will determine the thickness needed.
Quote from: SawyerTed on November 18, 2019, 09:50:45 PM
Did you say what the spacing on the joists will be? That will determine the thickness needed.
Sorry, the joists are 2 x 8, spaced 16". All lumber is full sized.
5/4 gets my vote. Straight or edged at 45 °
+1 on 5/4
@Nebraska (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=45256) and @SawyerTed (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=38503) I am reading my post in the light of day now, it generates some new details for me. First some clarification: When I said on the 'bias', I meant that the floor boards wold be at an angle to the joists, say 45 or so. I did not mean edged at a 45. However I will have to think about the edging, it might make for a smoother floor.
Second, I should have mentioned that I want to put some small machines up there and some potentially heavy hardware cabinets. Probably 2 floor drill presses, a sanding bench, possibly a small Logan lathe and maybe set up my apron brake again. So I would like to have it pretty stiff.
I am thinking it doesn't really matter the lay direction. The edging is something I would have to set up on my radial arm saw and it would be nice to have a helper. That's a lot of wood to edge.
More important to me is rigidity. I think if it is softwood I would be better off with 6/4 and if it is hardwood I could do fine with 5/4.
Any thoughts?
5/4 is pretty good, but 6/4 means you'll be able to put just about anything on the floor. Cheap insurance. No regrets later.
Nix the 45 degree edges. They'll split off and leave voids. Square edge, nailed well will be fine. Consistent thickness on the flooring pays off. Plane if necessary, but should be ok with the rough sawn if it's consistent.
Actually, I'd like to see if I can get access to a local planer to plane the tops at least and hold a consistent size. It would also make for easier floor sweeping. I am a notorious sweeper. I hate junk on the floor.
I read it at first and couldn't decide what you were getting at, but yes I understand laying the floor at a 45, it's how the old part of my house is sheathed and decked. 6/4 will hold for sure then no worries, I think the flooring in my barn hayloft is only 1 inch tongue and groove on 16 inch centers back in its day I it held a winter's worth of hay.
Quote from: Old Greenhorn on November 19, 2019, 09:43:24 AM
Actually, I'd like to see if I can get access to a local planer to plane the tops at least and hold a consistent size. It would also make for easier floor sweeping. I am a notorious sweeper. I hate junk on the floor.
Good point on the sweeping. Rough sawn lumber can really defeat a broom. Laying it down herring bone style guarantees it won't wiggle, so why not. Triangles are good. Also helps on the length issue.
Sure sounds like a nice addition to your shop.
@Nebraska (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=45256) , the nice thing about a hay load is that it is fairly evenly spread out (stacking choices notwithstanding), but with machines I will have several hundred pounds, or more focusing it's weigh on just 4 or 5 small points. True, I could, and probably put load sharing boards under the feet (AKA trip hazards) or make fitted skids for them to spread it a bit. I'd love to get my vertical band saw up there but I thing it is too heavy to get up the stairs.
@btulloh (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=29962) this is something that has been on my list since we bought the house 32 years ago. I am just keeping a promise to myself and trying to make more working room in the shop. After all this time I STILL have a bunch of machines I have not had room to set up and operate.
I am just trying to get my act together. ;D
I found this photo of the fist loft I did exactly two years ago this week. This one is 12x20 give or take. It's still holding up well and completely full of 'stuff'. Same basics: 6x8 posts, 2x10 headers, doubled up, and 2x8 joists. All pine and pretty doggone solid. Yes, it is an extension of the 12x12 you can glimpse on the lower right in the photo which was there when I arrived.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/loft.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1574183923)
Yep 6/4 for flooring to support machines and possibly some additional blocking between the joists where the machines stay. The blocking will help the weight spread to several joists.
When sheathing and subfloors were planks instead of plywood/OSB, they were applied at an angle to the joists. Angled subflooring had more to do with expense of plywood and installation of the finished floor. I don't think you will gain an advantage by angling your floor boards.
What are you doing for access? Stairs, ship ladder, ladder, elevator? Just curious.
Quote from: btulloh on November 19, 2019, 12:34:36 PM
What are you doing for access? Stairs, ship ladder, ladder, elevator? Just curious.
Well, I was thinking of levitation. But then I thought "hey, I have never heard of anybody using a solar elevator, maybe I can build one of those?" Then I woke up. :D
No seriously, there is already a set of stairs there and I am working around them as is. Mostly because I don't see any better ideas. I'll try to get a photo tonight if that helps at all.
@SawyerTed (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=38503) I think your are correct, there is little or no benefit. I think it would look nice, and I have never done one. Since I just this summer got my son roped into a job doing a custom oak floor on a 45° bias (and it came out fantastic!) I thought I should take some of my own medicine and try it just for fun.
I could also cut and screw down some heavier plywood on top of the floor under any machines. Then trim it with quarter round or lip molding.
I am sure you know, but braces between the joists would give structure to support tools as well. you could also laminate you floor with hardwoods. like a subfloor, and then a nicer wood on top, with an alternate orientation. you can also frame with 2x material flat under the subfloor to strengthen the area under a tool. you do good work. ;) (levitation was a great beer no longer produced by stone brewing company)
I have a loft in my shop, and store stacks of dry wood on it. it is above what will be my paint spray room, and only has 2 to 4 feet of head room. my shop ceiling is made with scissor trusses.
kids and wives do not always give credit to the men, who prioritize family, and put off personal goals for years. see that here all the time. god speed. @Old Greenhorn (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=42103)
Quote from: doc henderson on November 19, 2019, 04:28:33 PM
you do good work. ;)
That is not something I get accused of very often, in fact it's been a long time since I have heard that beyond this forum. It must have something to do with the optics and focal distance between NY and KS. :)
Yeah braces. I use them if needed, but I screw unistrut pieces to the bottoms of the rafter so that I can put long 'things' on top of them between the joists for storage. I hide a LOT of stuff that way. Putting solid blocks in kind of hampers that, but I think the unstrut straps help a bit to box it in.
I thought about the laminating idea, but then I am still spending a chunk of money on plywood. I might rather just make thicker boards, then I can claim the entire project as 'local harvested wood'. Of course that means nothing, except to me. But I am still thinking on it. I have months to decide.
Good work. Yeah Doc, I just recalled this photo when I was thinking "oh, if he only knew". You kind of have to study this for a bit. I have a hand crank lift and I was trying to get that last 2x10x20 header up there and I had just run out of gas in my legs and could not lift it. So I stacked a bunch of scrap up on the lift to get it high enough. I just had it balanced on the far end, no clamps or braces holding it up. I have no idea how I pulled this off without dropping it. I know it would have hurt a bit if I didn't get out of it's way. ;D None the less, I got it up there. (Kids, DON'T try this at home.)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/loft2.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1574200405)
some of our most "fantastical" accomplishments are at least part luck, if we are honest! "that which does not kill us, makes us stronger" looks like we also owe part of our strength to lessons learned. try to tell most kids today that the menial tasks are good lessons. Like you do not just drop your end of a heavy board, without coordinating with the guy on the other end! :o :). I also like "too soon old, too late smart" :D. (for a German accent replace "old" with "olt!) 8)
instead of plywood, use 2 layers of "free" hardwood. use pine or cottonwood under. the old sub floors were at a 45° to the joists, with hardwood on top.
Not to belabor this, but some photos might help those who are trying to help me. Understand the shop is a mess from a summer of running in and out with projects. It gets a good weekend long cleaning when the weather gets really cold and I will live with it for now.
Here is a shot looking straight down the main bay. You have to do a lot of cleaning up in your mind. That big green parts cabinet is going away, either as a gift to the first taker, or scrap. It takes too much room and does not provide value to me.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3305.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1574205096)
A slightly tighter shot. The loft will be between the stairs on the left and the block wall on the right. It will come forward from the back wall just 12'. If you find the weed whacker hanging in the right of the photo, you can just make out a window, this will mark the front edge. Before I can even start construction, I have to remove that big white drawer cabinet in the back. It holds about 1,000# of 'stuff' I have the remove all the drawers, cut one set of drawers off of one end, make a new side, and reconstruct it. (It's too long.) Once I have the back corner columns set, I can put it back in place. There is a shelving unit on the bench that will likely go elsewhere because it is probably too tall and non-value added.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3306.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1574205070)
Walking up the stairs and turning right, this is the view from on top. The loft will cover this area from the wall on the left to the window on the right.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3310.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1574205158)
It will look a lot like this one. By the way, this shot is from the exact spot I took the photo in my previous post 2 years ago. It's a 'bit' more cluttered now.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3314.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1574205213)
Finally Doc, here is a sample of the 'under deck storage. No space goes wasted at my place. ;D :D
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3312.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1574205164)
Right after I made that post I got a call from a guy interested in that cabinet. He just left and will pick it up Sunday. He wanted to throw it in his car trunk, I laughed and said go ahead and tip that thing up to get a feel for it. His eyes about popped out. It weighs over 200 pounds, I'm sure. I hope he comes back with a real truck. ;D WIN_WIN. He is very happy and I am glad for the new space I have.
@Old Greenhorn (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=42103)
It probably is beyond the scope of what you want but that is a tall ceiling if you could install an over head beam and trolley between the two decks stuff could actually levitate with a little chain or electric hoist. You have a nice "shop space" mine gets small really fast when I park my truck inside especially this time of year to keep it from freezing.
You read my mind. It is in my mind to add a small timber gantry over the stairs. I can't attach to the ceiling, it is a truss roof, cheap construction (load bearing wise). However I am thinking of a 'trap door' type setup over the stairs so I can flip a platform over and have an opening I can use, then flip it down for walking between the two decks and rolling things back and forth. That will be in the next phase, maybe next winter or fall. I just texted a neighbor/tree guy about the possibility of him dropping off some logs and he is up for it. 8) Not sure what they will cost, but he always gives me a good deal, if he takes any of my money at all.
OG looking good! I'm interested to see how the loft all comes together. It's pretty fantastic that you are milling the timbers then using them to build your loft, that's the ultimate DIY 8) 8)
I'll second Docs comment a few pages back, you do good work. You actually do the work! So many talk about it but never do it or pay someone else to do it, but you're doing it yourself! Wish I lived closer I'd come lend a hand just to see how you're doing things and learn :P
Keep up the good work and stay safe!
Brandon
Well, I am slow, but I try to stay at it. It won't happen fast, but it will likely happen at some point. I feel like a slacker compared to most of the folks here on the forum.
Something Doc said in reply 355 just popped into my head out of nowhere (I have told y'all that I am slow), he said
"kids and wives do not always give credit to the men, who prioritize family, and put off personal goals for years. see that here all the time."
I have never sought 'credit' for anything I have done, I just don't think that way. But, when my son was an adolescent and teenager he thought I was the laziest guy in the world. I would hibernate all winter, sit at my desk, go to work, come home, go to work, etc. I didn't touch anything in the shop for years at a time except to fix things we needed that were broken, like cars, trucks, lawn tractors, etc. Always it was just to 'get it going again'. The shop was a mess always, just packed with 'stuff'. Hard to do any work out there.
When the kids moved out our time was focused on caring for both my parents and my father in law, he moved himself into our house and set our family life on it's ear. (Mostly this is what got the kids to move out.) We spent about seven years caring for all 3 parents, it was a second full time job that nearly broke me. We had no money to do 'projects' let alone the time to do them. When my Mom, the last to go, passed away, I was busy with moving a lot of my Dad's tools, guns, and other stuff out. A project which still continues. This was 4 years ago and thus began my ability to do some stuff for our own home. I bought a pre-fab shed and fitted it out, then a temporary portable garage for cold storage. Then I added a loft in the shop and sold off 3 machines. I moved all the remaining machines around to make it more workable. My son watched all this with amazement and frequently commented that he could not believe I could get so much done, so fast, and almost all by myself. This was a new side of his Dad he had never seen. I know he wondered 'Why now?". That was my fault and I realized it too late. I was always too tired when he was growing up. True I had put thousands of hours into his Scouting career, and more into the Fire Department, I was out of the hose 3-5 nights every week, but nothing ever got done around the house for too many years. I am not very proud of that.
So I guess all this stuff I am doing now is an effort to play 'catch up'. I hope I have enough time. I look at it as I have failed in the past and now I am just trying to make it up as quickly as I can.
No you should be proud it is better to be a good spouse, a father, and a care giver, than a handyman, no failure what so ever. You gave to your family and community first. Vanity is not good and you shoved it into a corner for everyone else.. You can enjoy yourself a little more now and do what you want. Big kudos to you. 8)
OG, I read your post and thought "here's a MAN! Someone I can aspire to be like!" You put your family, not just wife and kids but parents, before yourself for YEARS. I'm only just now learning to do that and it's not easy at all. You did without so your family could make it. Hopefully your children saw THAT and learned that lesson.
Quote from: Old Greenhorn on November 20, 2019, 09:25:44 AM
I was always too tired when he was growing up. True I had put thousands of hours into his Scouting career, and more into the Fire Department, I was out of the hose 3-5 nights every week, but nothing ever got done around the house for too many years. I am not very proud of that.
Being a parent is hard draining work, whether you're the father or the mother. You go to work, bust your back hoping you'll have enough to pay the bills and a little extra for fun and retirement. Rather than spend it on yourself you spent it on your sons scouting career, caring for parents, etc. You sacrificed time with family working nights so they could have food and a dry warm roof over their head. It sounds like you would have rather been home with them than working but you worked. That's not failure that's maturity, something so many of us don't have (I'm tossing myself in that don't have basket.)
I could go through each line of your post but I won't. What I will say is we all look back and wish we'd have done things differently but from what you've said it sounds like you did all right. It's very easy for us to look at our lives and pick them apart and pile up the faults, I do that all the time (you've read my posts ;) ) and that gets draining. I wonder why we don't instead pick our lives apart and pile up all the things we did right, whether it was only a little right or a lot right. You may not have sought credit, but take a moment to give yourself some :) :)
Sorry for rambling, hope my meandering thoughts make some sense.
Brandon
AH, you guys are making me blush and it's undeserved. I did the best I could and try to get better where and when I can. Brandon, you don't want to be like me. I am sure you can do better. There are thousands of guys on this forum alone who have a better grip on raising a family than I ever will. We are all just trying to do the right thing.
If I ever grow up, I want to be like @doc henderson (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=41041) because he seems to be better at the balancing thing and he also made much better choices when he was younger than I made at the same age.
All you can do is the best you can do.
we all know our own defects. but just like a wood project, no one else even sees it, and even when you point out the flaws to others, they love it (you) even more. come visit some time, and I will let you in on a few of my blemishes! :)
Quote from: doc henderson on November 20, 2019, 09:25:14 PM
we all know our own defects. but just like a wood project, no one else even sees it, and even when you point out the flaws to others, they love it (you) even more. come visit some time, and I will let you in on a few of my blemishes! :)
Well said Doc :) :)
Brandon
Well it turned out the be a really good day. I went to work this morning, but with the free overtime I have been working I took the afternoon off. The temp hit over 40 (when I left for work it was 32 and beautiful, hard to go in at all).
Anyway, I got down to the mill at about 12:30 and got right to it. I had some junk logs that were going to be firewood, but I grabbed one and milled it into 5/4 x 4" boards for the floor decking. Waste not, want not, right?
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3321.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1574380412)
The other log was too small to waste time on, it's firewood, and I need that too, right?
Then I put up the log I had been waiting for, the last log!
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3316.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1574380361)
I got 2 6x8's out of it and a bunch of 5/4 boards.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3316.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1574380361)
I still have to edge the 5/4's on Saturday, but then I am done and the move begins.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3322.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1574380418)
I will miss working down in the woods, no doubt. This afternoon when I was turning a log, a red tailed hawk flew down the length of the mill about 5 feet off the ground. Pretty cool. I will also miss the deer that come around to say 'hi'.
I got he 6x8's up on the mule and threw on a 5/4 board I cut for a friend to make a wall mount for his flint lock rifle.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3324.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1574380454)
SO yeah, I only had about 4 hours, but I got a bunch done. AT this rate, I should have the mill moved a month earlier than I thought, then I just have to reset it and make it work again.
It has been working so well lately that my productivity has gone way up, I just keep clicking the boards off. Such was my thought today as I was cutting. That is, until I ran the blade into a backstop. ;D :D :-[ That blade was pretty shot anyway, but it doesn't pay to get cocky.
Good deal, glad you had a good day. I had plans of milling, the log is qued up and ready, but I never got close before daylight was gone. Next year there will be lights.
@Nebraska (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=45256) , I am hoping I can say the same thing in 11 months.
@Old Greenhorn (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=42103) , Well then I'll race yah. :D
Quote from: Nebraska on November 21, 2019, 08:10:32 PM
@Old Greenhorn (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=42103) , Well then I'll race yah. :D
OK, it's a deal. But I don't plan on that until late summer next year at best. I am in a rural suburban area. Eve though some of my neighbors seem to have a reason to run leaf blower or circular saws at 10pm, I don't feel right doing that, so I will need the lights when the sun sets too early in the fall. I figure I may have the mill setup and running again by mid-December, then milling lumber for the loft, then hopefully working on the loft Christmas week, then we will be in the dead of winter pretty much, so not much until next season. Dead of winter means mostly shop projects with the occasional mill job on a warm sunny weekend.
Most likely I won't get to it either til summer, to do it right I would need to trench a line and put a pole by the mill. Likely I will just check if my 100 ft extension cord reaches from the west end of the cattle shed up hil from my mill. If it's good then I just need to run an outlet down to that end, it's already wired, that barn on the project list for some foundation repairs and board and batten siding. Hoping to get there next year. Saturday morning I should be able to cut a little wood, and the weather will be decent. 8)
Looks like you had a very productive day!
There's some nice coloring on some of those boards.
It seems like often people want flawless boards with uniform coloring, I like it when there's character to it and odd coloring. Then I can look at the boards and wonder why it is the way it is and what the tree experienced to cause such things... or it's a Rorschach test and I'm in trouble ;D
Looking forward to pics of the loft as it progresses!
Brandon
The loft is at least a month off, probably two. I have to at least accumulate the framing lumber first, and with the mill move, that will come to a halt for a while. I need logs. There are a couple I can collect, but I am also working and getting some dropped off.
I like color and figure too, but I don't have any fancy trees. This maple is about as exciting as it gets. Mostly I have RO, WO (very little), Ash, and maple. Almost all of it is straight grained and a little boring.
Boring is good for framing lumber
Quote from: Old Greenhorn on November 22, 2019, 12:57:57 PM
The loft is at least a month off, probably two. I have to at least accumulate the framing lumber first, and with the mill move, that will come to a halt for a while. I need logs. There are a couple I can collect, but I am also working and getting some dropped off.
I like color and figure too, but I don't have any fancy trees. This maple is about as exciting as it gets. Mostly I have RO, WO (very little), Ash, and maple. Almost all of it is straight grained and a little boring.
Nothing wrong with any of that :) You have logs, that's the most important part!
That darn work thing always interupts the fun doesn't it :D
Brandon
Well it was another good day, but not without incident. ;D I was out a a music gig last night late, so didn't really get my butt in gear until about 7:30 and got right to work, didn't even make coffee. I had some slabs laying about that were thick enough to make 5/4 flooring boards out of, so I sized them and edged them. I am doing random widths in 2" increments. 4,6,8 and maybe 10". I finished those after a LOT of handling to salvage what I could and flat stacked them. I got right to the breakdown. I took off the end section of track and backed up the trailer, then dropped the tailgate and put the rack back on. This gave me a ramp to run the head up on the trailer with. That head is a LOT heavier than I remember!
I think you can make out the setup in this shot.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3339.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1574553836)
I got it loaded with some effort. Then put on 2 sections of track, some of the support timbers and whatever loose odds and ends were laying around. I was working pretty quick trying to make time. No chair time today at all, just stopped to catch my breath and consider the next step.
It was a pretty heavy load going up the hill and the Mule was working hard. I didn't take many photos today. But here she sits behind the shop, pretty much lined up with where it will live from now on.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3340.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1574553802)
I left the trailer right there and went back down and figured out how to get the rest of it up. You can read about that run in the "I did a Dumb Thing Today' thread. SO the whole mill is now moved and sitting in pieces. Re-bedding and resetting starts tomorrow. This is full week ahead of when I thought I would move it. I had hoped to have it cutting again by mid-December, but maybe I can beat that too. I still have a bunch of lumber down there to haul up, but I need to clean the trailer off first and set up a place to stack and sticker it up here. I am looking forward to getting into cutting the framing wood.
Here's a photo showing about where the mill will mind up. The mill bed will run the length of that block wall, 24'.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3342.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1574553869)
I am shot. The fella that took the surplus cabinet came by this evening to pick it up and we both busted a hump getting it on his trailer. When he was leaving he asked if I was needing anything he might have to trade. Half joking I told him I was looking for a planer I could buy cheap or borrow for a couple of weekends to plane my floorboards. He said he had a 220v 12" if that would do. Perfect I said, we'll keep in touch. ;D :)
Tomorrow we are expecting rain, so I am not sure what I will get done. Here's hoping, but I have a feeling I will be pretty sore in the morning.
Looking good and making progress!
Glad you and the mule are ok. Always a bit of a sphincter pucker moment when a load shifts :o :o
Brandon
Quote from: ManjiSann on November 24, 2019, 09:52:28 AM
Looking good and making progress!
Glad you and the mule are ok. Always a bit of a sphincter pucker moment when a load shifts :o :o
Brandon
"Shifts"? :D ;D Yeah, that's what happened. It shifted. In fact it 'shifted' from the back of the Mule cab to 30' back down the hill. ;D It was a real
'shift show' all right! ;D Just glad the gas can landed on it's feet. That would have been messy.
Well, I just got back from Home Despot. they didn't have the ones (cement blocks) I wanted but I got the same size (4x8x16") in a cheaper hollow block. I can tell you that the fork lift class they must use at that store could use some pepping up. :D Because of the heavy rain, town was dead and there were few customers in the store. Not a normal Sunday. I wanted to get there by 7:30 but a neighbor was without heat, so I went and fixed that (again). Got to the store at 9 and asked for help to get the pallet of block down from the shelf. After 15 minutes a guy comes by (he works in paint and is the very same guy who, 2 months ago told me they don't sell 2 part epoxy and never have, while it was on the shelf 15' away from him.) SO he says to me, "we have ladders so you can get to the second shelf stuff, y'know?" I look at him, look at the block, look back at him, and think "OK, I am going to have to make 24 trips up and down carrying these blocks, fine". SO I said OK, where are the ladders? He says "I don't know, they should be here, let me see if I can find one." !0 minutes later he comes back and tells me to wait. Then he comes back with another guy and tells him what we are going to do, then he goes to get a forklift. Then he catches the pallet on everything he can before he gets it down. Finally get the block, pay for it, and get it loaded. SHeesh!
On the way home I thought I would buy a nice breakfast in a diner as a treat. I found out where everybody in town was. Every diner parking lot was packed. Finally found one and had a good meal. Got home, unloaded the block in a downpour and am now happily soaked. Gonna take a breather for a bit, then start some shop work. This rain is steady and the radar shows it means to be here for a while. Heavy wet snow coming down like crazy just 15 miles west of here. I bet Barge is getting clobbered one way or the other, I hope he isn't working in this. (But he probably is so he can pay for that skidder tire ;D )
Quote from: Old Greenhorn on November 24, 2019, 11:51:16 AMWell, I just got back from Home Despot. they didn't have the ones (cement blocks) I wanted but I got the same size (4x8x16") in a cheaper hollow block. I can tell you that the fork lift class they must use at that store could use some pepping up. :D Because of the heavy rain, town was dead and there were few customers in the store. Not a normal Sunday. I wanted to get there by 7:30 but a neighbor was without heat, so I went and fixed that (again). Got to the store at 9 and asked for help to get the pallet of block down from the shelf. After 15 minutes a guy comes by (he works in paint and is the very same guy who, 2 months ago told me they don't sell 2 part epoxy and never have, while it was on the shelf 15' away from him.) SO he says to me, "we have ladders so you can get to the second shelf stuff, y'know?" I look at him, look at the block, look back at him, and think "OK, I am going to have to make 24 trips up and down carrying these blocks, fine". SO I said OK, where are the ladders? He says "I don't know, they should be here, let me see if I can find one." !0 minutes later he comes back and tells me to wait. Then he comes back with another guy and tells him what we are going to do, then he goes to get a forklift. Then he catches the pallet on everything he can before he gets it down. Finally get the block, pay for it, and get it loaded. SHeesh!
I was always told by employees those ladders were employee only due to liability... sounds like you got some quality help at your local HD ::) ::)
Some days you win, some days you get "quality" help. ;D
Brandon
Just think, if you fall on hard times and lose your job, you can always work at Home Depot ;D.
Quote from: WDH on November 24, 2019, 05:54:56 PM
Just think, if you fall on hard times and lose your job, you can always work at Home Depot ;D.
Well, I never say never. But for now um, yeah, no thanks. ;D
You folks should pray for me, or more importantly, my marriage. ;D
I did take a break this morning, then had lunch and went out to the shop and did some cleaning and moved a small machine to give me access to where one of the loft posts will go. I also measured out and cut the wall board off a section where another post will marry up. The I sat on a stool for a while and ruminated a bit. It was late afternoon'ish so I came in. Next thing I knew I was perusing C/L and other sources for compact tractors and/or skid steers or what ever else that I might be able to afford on a small budget. I did a lot of looking and researched all the machines that were new to me. I dream of getting something I can do log lifting with as well as a little grading and moving dirt/stone. In other words, fill all the gaps I have here for work I could do cheap if I had the machine. I looked at broken down stuff I could fix and use (my favorite way of getting stuff I can't afford) and I looked at stuff with financing (would need a true business plan for that).
My concern here is that this is EXACTLY how the sawmill thing happened. But a machine will cost a lot more than the mill did. No way can I go into debt over this. Yet I keep looking. I can't stop myself. I think I need an intervention, maybe.
My wife, needless to say, is not too thrilled with the idea. I am going to TRY to keep this low key and just keep my eyes open for that special deal that comes through an oddball route, like a friend or a friend, or seeing something on a roadside (that's how I found the Mule, in pieces).
Now that I am talking this through, maybe you guys are not the correct focus group to get me off this track of distraction. ;D
But I sure would love to have a machine around here.
If you intend to sawmill, you are going to have to break down and do it. You just have to figure out how.
Quote from: Old Greenhorn on November 24, 2019, 09:14:00 PM
You folks should pray for me, or more importantly, my marriage. ;D
I did take a break this morning, then had lunch and went out to the shop and did some cleaning and moved a small machine to give me access to where one of the loft posts will go. I also measured out and cut the wall board off a section where another post will marry up. The I sat on a stool for a while and ruminated a bit. It was late afternoon'ish so I came in. Next thing I knew I was perusing C/L and other sources for compact tractors and/or skid steers or what ever else that I might be able to afford on a small budget. I did a lot of looking and researched all the machines that were new to me. I dream of getting something I can do log lifting with as well as a little grading and moving dirt/stone. In other words, fill all the gaps I have here for work I could do cheap if I had the machine. I looked at broken down stuff I could fix and use (my favorite way of getting stuff I can't afford) and I looked at stuff with financing (would need a true business plan for that).
My concern here is that this is EXACTLY how the sawmill thing happened. But a machine will cost a lot more than the mill did. No way can I go into debt over this. Yet I keep looking. I can't stop myself. I think I need an intervention, maybe.
My wife, needless to say, is not too thrilled with the idea. I am going to TRY to keep this low key and just keep my eyes open for that special deal that comes through an oddball route, like a friend or a friend, or seeing something on a roadside (that's how I found the Mule, in pieces).
Now that I am talking this through, maybe you guys are not the correct focus group to get me off this track of distraction. ;D
But I sure would love to have a machine around here.
This sounds all too familiar from my life. I have a shoestring budget but I really need to afford the whole shoe, now how do I do that?
"Don't worry about it dear, I'll just get some firewood for free..." three chainsaws later ;D
Maybe we need to form a support group or something "Hi, my name is Brandon and my CSM addiction (bandmill addiction) has led me to buy..."
Seriously though, if you really need it and you keep looking and stay open to possibilities something seems to come along eventually.
Brandon
you know I can afford some stuff so I apologize for jumping in, but I still have to run big stuff by the CFO. I do not charge but I allow people (when it is not a gift from me to them), to donate to my polyurethane fund. try to at least break even. if you get a hunk of metal and fix it up, maybe sell it and get something better as time goes on, and it pays for itself or more. make the CFO happy. you do a lot of charity. you deserve it. might check in with @Southside (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=24297) , he seems to get away with all kinds of stuff! :D :D :D. @Old Greenhorn (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=42103) @ManjiSann (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=46620)
@Old Greenhorn (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=42103) The best thing I ever bought was a really worn Massey 85 tractor from an old neighbor client of mine. I found a wide front end for it as well as an original Massey loader, It was two wheel drive but got me by for a few years til I traded for my current tractor. It was a godsend a t the time. He sold it to me on contract I paid it a little at a time as I could on it. So yes I went into a little debt but came out a little ahead at the end. A small Ford, Yanmar, or older Kubota in the 30 horse range would do a whole bunch for you. Especially with some pallet forks. After you retire you could probably pick up some side work with it. Sorry not much help talking you back but my wife agrees with me we couldn't go back to not having one.
My concern is that this is how I get into everything, I start thinking, then investigating, then going to 'just take a look, no harm in that right?" Next thing you know....
I looked for a Mule for over a year, then I saw that one laying in the weeds in pieces. I knocked on the door and threw out an offer and they took it. The mill I found on a lark, just perusing C/L and borrowed some money for it.
I think I will wait until I have all my other ducks in a row before I get more serious about a machine so that I have a working system in pace to earn some money to pay for it. That will likely take until next summer, at least. In the meantime I will keep my eyes open for that special deal. I have a rough plan, I just have to stick with it. All things in due time.
To be fair, my wife now looks at the Mule as part of the household requirement, so there is that. It has earned it's place as a necessary tool around the place. I am hoping the same thing will happen with whatever I get next.
Quote from: doc henderson on November 25, 2019, 09:17:34 AM
you know I can afford some stuff so I apologize for jumping in, but I still have to run big stuff by the CFO. I do not charge but I allow people (when it is not a gift from me to them), to donate to my polyurethane fund. try to at least break even. if you get a hunk of metal and fix it up, maybe sell it and get something better as time goes on, and it pays for itself or more. make the CFO happy. you do a lot of charity. you deserve it. might check in with @Southside (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=24297) , he seems to get away with all kinds of stuff! :D :D :D. @Old Greenhorn (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=42103) @ManjiSann (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=46620)
The chicken population will be impacted ;D ;D ;D
Brandon
One good thing about older iron is that the depreciation is gone out of it. As long as it's not all bubble gum welded together and you are half way mechanically inclined then it has been my experience that you can do just fine with the type of equipment we are talking about here. The labor savings alone pays off for the machine - I have no idea how I ever managed to run any part of the mill operation without my Lull for example. Bought it cheap, had a few immediate fixes to address and have taken care of several more along the way but I knew that getting it and it has done more for me than I could ever imagine. Fix the leaks, tweaks, and creaks on an older tractor, use it to do your work, throw on some sin-hider along the way and you will sell it for more than you paid for it down the road and get something faster/bigger/nicer should you need it.
No chickens were harmed in the making of this post.... :D
Quote from: Old Greenhorn on November 25, 2019, 09:53:00 AM
My concern is that this is how I get into everything, I start thinking, then investigating, then going to 'just take a look, no harm in that right?" Next thing you know....
I looked for a Mule for over a year, then I saw that one laying in the weeds in pieces. I knocked on the door and threw out an offer and they took it. The mill I found on a lark, just perusing C/L and borrowed some money for it.
I think I will wait until I have all my other ducks in a row before I get more serious about a machine so that I have a working system in pace to earn some money to pay for it. That will likely take until next summer, at least. In the meantime I will keep my eyes open for that special deal. I have a rough plan, I just have to stick with it. All things in due time.
To be fair, my wife now looks at the Mule as part of the household requirement, so there is that. It has earned it's place as a necessary tool around the place. I am hoping the same thing will happen with whatever I get next.
I think the important thing is you're aware of the financial ramifications and you're trying to figure out how to do it without negatively impacting your family. It's a frustrating place to be :( :(
I really wanted a bigger chainsaw but told myself I wouldn't buy it unless the "hobby" started to pay for itself or I could save my meager allowance to pay for it. I had my eye on a new Echo large CC model as it was closer to my price range than any of the Husky or Stihls. Little by little neighbors payed me to remove some trees, I sold one of the other saws and bought the used Husky. I ended up with a fixer upper but I can afford sweat equity a lot easier than actual cash so I don't mind.
Something will eventually come along that will fit your situation, the hard part (for me at least) is being patient until it does. But once it does it's pretty incredible :) :)
My wife didn't used to like my truck but now she's more interested in upgrading to a bigger one than I am at times. It's funny how things evolve ;D ;D
Brandon
Your wife will soon see it's value seeing the things you accomplish with it. I agree with @Southside (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=24297) as long as it hasn't been abused much it should be fine. Most acerage tractors I see mostly mow weeds ,maybe run a little tiller or plow a garden, push snow, and maybe level a little dirt here and there. Probably don't get 200 hrs a year on them. You are pretty mechanically inclined anyway. Set your mill up, make a little rat hole money and something will happen.
There is a difference between neglect and abuse when it comes to equipment, neglect you can usually overcome with sweat equity, a few hours study at youtube university, and determination.
Well, my wife didn't go into screaming mode when I mentioned it at dinner the other night, she just asked 'about how much would that cost' and I told her 'too much right now' She said it would have to wait a bit, etc. After 43 years of marriage, she knows fairly well what will happen eventually. She is the CFO in the house anyway so....
Yeah, I will just keep my eyes open. I did find a few machines that were either free or nearly so, but they were pretty trashed and would become a full time job, and a money pit at the same time to get running. So I passed them on by. I will just keep my ear to the ground and work the plan as it is. I actually have a pretty good new idea for log loading now that the mill be be on flatter ground wherein I make a ramp to roll the logs on, then jack up the ramp so that the logs roll onto the mill bed. This would be a pretty cheap build too. It's not as much of a burning issue as I might think it is.
especially diesel stuff can set for 6 months and start right up. My wife is funny (just like all the others I presume) after the engraver was demonstrated, she got a wild hair and said we had to have it. she still has never run the thing. my 1976 dump truck I bought before I had met my wife, paid 3k and 100 worth of tires and wheels. my wife only complains once a year when we pay the taxes and tags (70 bucks) the rest of the year in comes in handy. You are all growd up, and we have no desire to know all your financial stuff. we just want to "balance" things out since you and yours are prob. thinking not. :). I agree with having a back of the mind plan. I think you neighbor or son should buy one and store it at your house. then you can start it and run it on a regular bases for them! :D best regards!
with some block and tackles can you use the winch on the mule? My brother went and bought a brand new JD mini tractor for about 18k with a loader (tini) and a tiller. my uncle found a well cared for used one they were asking 12, he said all I can pay is 8k and they took it. at this point they are virtually the same tractor. I called JD before my uncle bought it and all the used ones there were 16k. My brother said "he stole it". It was a friend of his who passed away and the daughters I think they wanted Uncle Jerry to have it. he still helps them out when needed with snow and such. see what comes along
Yeah Doc, I will back burner this for a while but keep my eyes open. Since I like to keep things generally positive here I will not be sharing my financial information, it would just depress everyone. ;D :D
I have no issues getting logs on the mill, and now that I will have that block wall next to it, I am thinking of mounting a 110v winch on that wall just for pulling logs up the load ramp.
The machine would just make things faster and safer AND I could groom the surrounding area to increase the usable ground I have for drying skids etc. It's pretty swampy right now and I would need a lot of fill, but it is doable if I had a machine. So it's more than just the mill work.
But I have some time. I just need to build up the mill account for a while.
A front end loader is really handy to have but an older 2 wheel drive tractor with a three point hitch will do lots of work, rear forks will lift more than the front and that is were really heavy things should go.
Add a few rear implements over time and you will wonder how you ever got by without one. If you get lots of snow drifts in your area a rear snow blower may pay for itself and the tractor.
A cab is really nice in the winter but not necessarily required if you dress right and stay in the neighbourhood.
If you upgrade later and stay in the same size range the implements will work with the next tractor.
My brother has had a MF210 2wd (25 engine hp) tractor that he bought new mid 80's it is not very big but you would be amazed at the work that thing has done over the years. It has over 4500 hours and I bet he hasn't spent over $2000 in repairs 35 years. That works out than less than $300 per year in ownership cost if he threw it away!
This probably isn't helping is it? ;D
SNow removal isn't an issue for me. The Mule plows just great and I have a 3 stage snow blower I have barely used in 3 years. If it get bad, my son has two 8' plow trucks as he runs a plowing service. It's the dirt moving that would make a big difference.
I am not looking to get talked out of anything, I just need to keep it all in perspective and work the plan.
Well, even though it was pitch black when I got home I was determined to do something tonight. Got my work clothes on and headed out behind the shop and plugged in the floodlight I hung 30 years ago and not used since then. It worked. I started to measure out and plan where the mill would go. Then the light burned out. OK, so I go in and grab a halogen work light and plug that in. better light. I dropped 4 blocks down and adjusted them by measurement off the shop wall. I picked a high one and started with that and dug it in and set it level. All the other blocks will be set in reference to this one. Then I got the dinner call. BUT I got the first block set, it's progress. Eventually I will have 3 blocks under each 6 foot section which will have 6x6 timbers on top of them, and then the tracks are bolted into the timbers with 1/2 lag bolts. In the prior setup, I only had blocks every 6 feet and lighter blocking I added later in between. I think this is where some of my head shake comes from on those wide logs and heavy cuts. I want that to go away, because when this mill cuts well, it really cuts, but that shake slows me down and roughs up the cuts. I hope to improve the quality a bit more.
Obviously I have a lot of work to do. I will work on the lighting to make it better for dark work, but I want to keep moving forward, so setting that first was a big step. The hardest part of getting it done is getting off your butt and getting to work. ;D
Tomorrow I hope to set another block or two. It's not much, but it gives me a leg up for the days I can focus on it. Oh, I would love to have the head and a couple of sections set by Sunday afternoon. That would put me way ahead of what I had hoped for and in a week I might be back to fetching logs and milling Which is 1-2 weeks ahead of my planned schedule. Then It's all about the weather and the logs I can get.
It may have been only one block but it's one block closer to your goal! I applaud you for the initiative! It's hard for me to get motivated when it's cold and dark, artificial light or not.
Brandon
AH this is frustrating. I was looking forward to having 4 clear days to work on the mill reset and we had a very small Thanksgiving planned for the evening so I should have had a full day in yesterday. The temp hit 45 and even though it was overcast with a 20 mph wind, it was very workable. But I woke up with a bad head cold yesterday morning and had zero energy. Try as I might, I just could not get going. I went out twice and worked for an hour or so, but I was just weary and finally bagged it. I think I have 3 blocks set.
Now I am studying the forecast and it looks like 6 inches of snow is going to start falling Sunday morning and continue thru until Monday after sunset. The 6" is no big deal, but I am in a disarray state with stuff still down at the mill, lumber flat stacked there to be moved up, lumber in temp stacks up at the house to be re-stacked and stickered, and the winter equipment swap yet to do (put the summer stuff in storage and take the winter stuff out and test fire it).
I need to a least get the mill off the trailer and onto the rails, which means I need to get that track down and level. I would rather not do this twice, again. Then I can use the trailer to at least get the remaining lumber up from the old site, get my drying skid re-leveled, then re-stack everything and put a snow shield up on top of it. I don't think that is do-able at this point in my condition with no energy.
Looks like it is going to be another grey day with a red sunrise and it won't hit 40 today, but I will give it a shot. I am hoping the fresh air helps clear this junk out of my system.
Once again I am feeling that self imposed pressure to make it happen on time, but the body doesn't have much in the tank. We will just have to see how it goes and deal with the results. Most folks around here hear "snowstorm' and worry about milk, bread, and beer. Here I am worried about sawmills and equipment moves. (Well, I do need to pick up some beer in case I feel better tonight or tomorrow.)
Time to pull my boots on.....
Keep on plugging away you'll get there, our weather went to junk as well.
I had the crud too. just getting back to normal. I worked Monday and Tuesday. had appointment to pull new underground electric service to the shop at 8 am Wednesday. I had the stomach crud all night. So went out at 07:30 in am and was happy they had pulled the wire the day before. took an hour to hook up both ends with a new fuse/switch. the overhead was damaged 2 years ago in an ice storm, bending the mast. I slept the rest of Wednesday, and the first half of Thursday. did not have my usual helpings at a thanksgiving dinner at 4pm. now I am close to back to normal. Was suppose to work Thursday, but a younger Military doc, asked if she could have the shift. Thank God! no fun to work when you are sick. work tonight. had a lot of plans for those days off. Hope we will have plenty more!
I just came in for lunch and to warm my feet. The temp has shot up to 33° but I still have cold feet. A full progress report later, but I will say that some progress is being made even though I still feel lousy. Heavy breathing in clear cold air seems to help also. I won't hit my original goal by a long shot, but I should be able to complete the immediate needs before the snow. I think.
OK, here is the daily log. Woke up at 5am feeling terrible again pulled on my boots and got out there at 7:30. The ground is starting to freeze and there is still a lot of residual water in the ground from last Sunday's 8 hour downpour, i.e. mud. Where I am setting the mill is is small rubble with very little dirt. Probably the material they busted up when they built the shop and poured the slab. SO I break it up with a pick, then pull it out with a mattock. It is slow going because I have to make a bigger deeper hole and get the big rocks out, then partially fill the hole back in to get the block at the right height. Because of the uneven ground I am also having to dig between the blocks so that the 6x6 rails don't lay on the ground.
This little bit represents abut 3 hours work to get it level.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3349.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1575061974)
You can see the ground I am working in is not super friendly.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3353.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1575061943)
By about 10:30 I had enough done that I could get the mill head set on the top end track and get the trailer out of the way, but there was no way I could maneuver the trailer for a perfect lay to do it myself. So I called a neighbor for help (that doesn't happen often) and he was tickled pink to some help me for a change. We had to man handle it a bit and it would be hazardous for me to do alone on a good day, but in my weakened state it was out of the question (stupid). With two of us it took less than 2 minutes to get it on the track.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3354.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1575062044)
So he went back to his chores and I got the trailer cleared (the first major goal for the weekend) and worked on setting more block. I have to say, the block I got from home despot is pretty poor. You tap it with a wood block to set it in and it just crumbles. I lost two blocks, one broke when I dropped it in it's spot from a height of 10 inches or so. Glad I got plenty of extras.
So I got more blocks set and more track down and wound up with sections pretty darn true (before test cuts and tweaking). I left the fourth section off for now because I don't need 24' of track in the forseeable future (spring?) and the 18' I have will allow me to cut 16' logs without a problem. i can add that last section anytime I need it with an hours work. I want to get what I have trued up and working well. I have too much other stuff to do before this snow hits.
This is what it looked like at my 3:30 quitting time.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3357.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1575062049)
Right now it's all about function. In the spring I will do cleanup, organizing, and tidying things up. In the photo you see a lot of stuff leaning up against the shop wall. Those are various antenna part for many different types of antennas from UHF down through the low bands from my days as an active ham radio contester. AT one point I had something like 35 active antennas working here and this new mill area was the boneyard for parts, pieces, and projects for the antenna farm. I will get that cleaned up in the spring after I think about it a bit. You may also note there seems to be a tower section straight up thru the center of the photo, that is my 70' tower which is currently holding roughly about 8 antennas (440 beam, 220 beam, 3x 40 meter slopers, 2 meter stick, and two tri-band HF beams). I only mention these details because I know there are a few hams here on the forum.
Anyway, considering how bad I felt this morning I got a lot done and am fairly pleased. It stayed below 35° all day but it was workable for sure. I got kind of light headed a few times and took 5, but kept moving. I wanted to be done with working in mud and sharp rubble. Tomorrow I focus on storm prep. It's not that I am concerned about a silly 6" of snow we MIGHT get, but I have a bunch of fall chores yet to be done and as I mentioned in this mornings post, all the stuff still down at the old mill site to move up. SO tonight I'll e making a punch list so I can hit that stuff hard, first thing in the morning. It's probably time I put the doors back on the Mule too. ;D
Now I just hope I can get a better night's sleep tonight. I didn't get much last night with breathing issues from this dang cold.
Progress is being made.
looks good. Feel better.
Things are looking good OG. Hope you're feeling better soon.
You get more done when your a little under the weather than I do at my best! :) :) Lookin good!
I thought about getting into HAM radio but the wife pointed out I already have too many hobbies so I just have the test book and a little Baofeng handheld. It was fun reading your post and having at least a clue what you were referring to if not a solid knowledge of it :) :)
Hope you feel better quick!
Brandon
It's amazing how much you can get done when there is a shoe hanging over your head like this 16" of snow we have coming. I hit it hard and hooked the trailer on the mule and headed down to the old mill site. I knew I had to do it now or I might get snowed out. I busted my butt but all all the important stuff loaded. The only stuff left in the mill shed is stuff I can walk down and carry up by hand if I really need it. I left the 'break room' and work bench tarps up just to see if how they hold up in the snow. I'll probably leave that workbench down there and call it a picnic table or perhaps a rustic bar. ;D
Anyway, I got everything loaded up.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3363.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1575158200)
I did my winter equipment swap, got the lawn tractors put away and the snowblower out. Set ups some quick and dirty drying skids, moved a little lumber. I hit all the high points on my punch list and started to relax a bit. After I unloaded and put everything away or found homes for stuff that didn't have a home up here previously. I did it quick and dirty, more work on that later. So I grabbed up a 6x8 short that I had and put it on the mill for a test. I milled it into 5/4 x 8's to use for floor decking. That went well, keep in mind that I have not yet done any tweaking on the mill, I have not run cross lines to check slant, not front to back lines to check swoop. I have done no shimming to tweak the level and straightness. Everything in my mind is rough, but the mill seemed to cut good. SO I ran down past the old mill site and bucked up a dead fall and took the butt log (the rest is firewood for 2020) and skidded that log up and loaded it up. I made a handful of 2x8's for the loft build out of it. It cut pretty good. Nice try for the first shot.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3364.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1575158261)
I have to say, one of the biggest pleasures I already have from the new mill site is being able to take a board right off the mill and take 5 step and put it on a stickered stack. That is a new experience. I see productivity growing. ;D
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3366.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1575158344)
I am pretty pleased with the day. We watched the grandchildren for the afternoon which is running well into the evening as my son tries to get his plow trucks prepped for tomorrow. What worked like a charm 2 days ago on initial test does not, of course work tonight. So I just came in from working in the dark with a headlamp trying to help him troubleshoot the pump motor on one of his plows. No joy, but I am frozen now.
I still have to get the mule setup with the plow, but that is shop work for the morning, I have plenty of time before the snow hits.
This last photo is for Brandon. You don't know what kind of bullet you dodged by missing 'the hobby' of ham radio. You have no idea how much labor, expense, scrounging, and years to put this tower together. Besides this I had another 12 antennas, many of which would go up in the fall, and come down in the spring. The only difference between milling and ham radio is that at the end of the day with milling you wind up with something you can use or sell, with ham radio, if you are really good, you wind up with personal satisfaction and a certificate. :D I was pretty good, I have a lot of certificates. But when I found myself standing on the peek of my roof, at 3am in February because I had blown a balun and was doing a repair so I could wok the Japanese stations, I asked myself why I was doing it, and really had a pretty wimpy answer. To each his own.
This is what sits directly above the mill.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3359.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1575158288)
Hmm never realized you were fluent in Japanese. :) Looks like a very good day.
Quote from: Nebraska on November 30, 2019, 09:25:15 PM
Hmm never realized you were fluent in Japanese. :) Looks like a very good day.
I am not. Ham radio contest communications are short, sweet and international. ;D
Quote from: Old Greenhorn on November 30, 2019, 07:41:55 PM
I have to say, one of the biggest pleasures I already have from the new mill site is being able to take a board right off the mill and take 5 step and put it on a stickered stack. That is a new experience. I see productivity growing. ;D
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3366.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1575158344)
I am pretty pleased with the day. We watched the grandchildren for the afternoon which is running well into the evening as my son tries to get his plow trucks prepped for tomorrow. What worked like a charm 2 days ago on initial test does not, of course work tonight. So I just came in from working in the dark with a headlamp trying to help him troubleshoot the pump motor on one of his plows. No joy, but I am frozen now.
I still have to get the mule setup with the plow, but that is shop work for the morning, I have plenty of time before the snow hits.
This last photo is for Brandon. You don't know what kind of bullet you dodged by missing 'the hobby' of ham radio. You have no idea how much labor, expense, scrounging, and years to put this tower together. Besides this I had another 12 antennas, many of which would go up in the fall, and come down in the spring. The only difference between milling and ham radio is that at the end of the day with milling you wind up with something you can use or sell, with ham radio, if you are really good, you wind up with personal satisfaction and a certificate. :D I was pretty good, I have a lot of certificates. But when I found myself standing on the peek of my roof, at 3am in February because I had blown a balun and was doing a repair so I could wok the Japanese stations, I asked myself why I was doing it, and really had a pretty wimpy answer. To each his own.
This is what sits directly above the mill.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3359.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1575158288)
Hey look, you have pretty stacks of wood!!!
I admire your energy and determination to get stuff done even if it's only to "tick the high points" as you say. All to often I allow myself to get overwhelmed by a task because I figure I can't get it all done by whatever time I have in my head so I get discouraged and don't try. You just plug along and make progress, very admirable :) :)
I wanted to learn HAM for a SHTF sort of survival skill. You may not have a physical/tangible thing you can point to and say "See that's what all my effort was for" but you have a skill, a very useful one should you ever need it!
As you say, I dodged a bullet on that one :D I don't need another hobby that I can sink thousands of dollars and countless hours into that doesn't have some sort of positive return to my family, not now at least. It is a useful skill but I need to be wise on how I use my time/energy/money right now. I still would like to learn HAM but I think waiting till the young'ns are a bit older and finances are in a better place would be the prudent thing to do.
Correct me if I'm wrong but the antenna you pictured, it's called a Yagi? :P
Keep up the good work, I'll have to mill vicariously for the next few months at least while mother nature blesses us with the moisture we need to live through the next year :snowball: :snowball:
Brandon
Quote from: ManjiSann on December 02, 2019, 09:57:52 AM
Correct me if I'm wrong but the antenna you pictured, it's called a Yagi? :P
Keep up the good work, I'll have to mill vicariously for the next few months at least while mother nature blesses us with the moisture we need to live through the next year :snowball: :snowball:
Brandon
Yuo, actually if you look close there are 4 yagi's in the photo of various sizes and for different bands.
I will keep plugging as conditions permit. Right now the mill is covered in 10 inches of snow, but at least I can walk right up to it. Had I not gotten the move completed, I would have been shut down for weeks, at least. I feel very good about that detail. :D
I didn't have time today with all the snow, but I did want to clarify my earlier statement about ham radio just to set the record straight. Although it is true it can be an expensive hobby, it doesn't need to be so. I was in my 30's when I started and raising a family, buying a home and moving 100 miles to have a better place to raise our kids.....with a 30% pay cut as a bonus. We had no money to spare, so I went into the hobby pretty much building everything I had. The very few things I bought were used and I can only recall buying one thing brand new ( a modest HF rig). All those purchases were covered by side jobs, overtime, or sell/swap/trade up deals. Hams are generous folks when they like you and I got a lot of help and donations, because I wanted to learn, so I went to a lot of antenna work parties to help folks put up big towers and antennas. Those folks would sometimes give me their old stuff which I would repair and put to use. I bought my entire tower setup for just $350. because I helped the ham that owned it, take it down and also helped him with some other packing and preparation chores as he prepared to move to FL. He liked me I guess.
A lot of other folks did too. I would build my stuff and try things and they would teach me new stuff and often give me parts. I would operate contests at other large stations and they appreciated my time. I was never a top ten world class operator, but I was top twenty and they were glad to have me. I helped them too with the mechanical stuff I was better at.
So yeah, you can get into the hobby for cheap. I will bet you have already spent more cash on your CSM stuff than I spent in my first 3 years in ham radio. ;D I didn't want anyone to think I was disparaging the hobby/skill in any way. My daughter got her ham ticket, but never really used it much. My nephew got his and is having a blast, now I give him my old and not so old stuff. As on the FF, I made a lot of friends around the world, there were 4 of us in a group on 12 meters, it was like meeting after work at a local pub, we talked most days of the week. One was in Alaska, one was in the UK, one was in New Zealand, and me. One new years eve we each shared our house parties as the time came around to us. The fella in Alaska even gave my daughter (4 at the time) a minute by minute update on what Santa was doing on Christmas eve and let her know when he took off to start his rounds (which turned out to be conveniently right at her bedtime). The next week he sent us a photo he took of a moose calf that was just born in the plot he had cleared out for his tower. So there was some benefit to my family too as I taught my children about the homes and lives of the people I had become friends with.
I maintain my ticket (I worked too dang hard for the Extra Class license under the old testing system) and when I get a little older, and a little more 'delicate' I will have a good thing to do in the winter months. The hobby has changed a LOT since I was active, I have a lot to learn, all over again.
I just wanted to set the record straight. I loved my time in ham radio, it taught me a lot that I used in life, and my job later on. I look forward to the day I get back to it. Right now I am just too busy.
Now, back to the subject. I did nothing on the mill yesterday, but I have to say, if I had any doubt about moving the mill, the snowstorm today cleared that doubt away for good. I tried plowing the skid road down to the old mill site at about 6am and got 100' down the skid road and got stuck. When I got home this afternoon and did a re clearing of snow around the house and pulled the snow blower out to cut a path from the house to the shop, I still had some daylight. So I took the mule around the back of the shop and was able to plow a path right along the bed of the mill. I had placed a drying skid exactly far enough away fro the mill to allow clearance (it was an accident). If I had too, I could do just a little shoveling and clearing and put a log up on the mill tonight. ;D Just having this as a possibility makes me more pleased than you might guess. :) I actually think I will be skidding up a nice log this weekend to work on. Had the mill still been where it was I would be shut down for a minimum of 3 weeks and have a heck of a time getting a log cut and the lumber moved up with the residual snow that will linger down in the hallow. I am very pleased that this has come to pass. Very pleased. It's kind of a big deal for me. Work can now proceed. 8) 8) 8)
OG, I didn't take anything negatively about what you'd said regarding HAM. My comment also was not in any way on how you'd gone about it, in case that was how in came across.
Quote from: Old Greenhorn on December 02, 2019, 06:27:49 PM
I will bet you have already spent more cash on your CSM stuff than I spent in my first 3 years in ham radio. ;D
You nailed it exactly! How quickly did I go from a little home owner saw to the wonderful Husky I am now enjoying? And then a mill attachment and I'm already trying to map out a 36" bar and mill, a trailer, possibly a robust stationary mill type thing, a solar kiln, a chicken coop ;) ;) Figure the same trajectory with HAM... or any other hobby, and I think you'll see my point. I try for moderation, really I do :) :) My comments were on my personality quirk of going full speed ahead on whatever interests me. I looked into the equipment for HAM and I tend to want the best, don't usually get it but I want it ::)
It sounds like you had some really awesome experiences with HAM and I hope you're able to get back into it some day :) :)
Brandon
Well I was up and at it at 5:30 again this morning because we had another 6 inches over night and I needed to get the snow cleared. That put us up at well over a foot for the storm, but others just 15 or 20 miles from here got 2' so I am not complaining. But still it had to be cleared so I could get to work because I knew the other two M/E's would not be in on time if at all and the boss would also likely be a no-show again. So I got it done, pretty quick and dirty, but well enough that the wife could get in and out safely and easily.
I got to work and was miserable. I have not slept well in 6 days from this cold and constant coughing and it is catching up. By noon most of my co-workers, and even my boss was in. I could not keep my eyes open and actually napped through lunch. By 2pm, I'd had it. I sent them all an email explaining my situation and left. I got home and took a 45 minute nap on the couch until the coughing fit came back. So I decided it was time for fresh air and I might as well finish the trim plowing and snow blowing. So I did that and we should be in good shape until the next storm. But then I thought about the remarks in my earlier post about being able to use the mill right after a decent snow. So I pulled around back and hit it with the plow, then did a little bit of shoveling to see how hard it would be to get the mill 'log ready'. It's a no-brainer. Good to go. Now my wood stack will need a lot more work, BUT that will come with time. I have not had any time to make snow covers for them yet. I might clean them up in the coming evenings, but for today I was shot. I had proven something to myself and that was good enough.
It's hard to tell in this photo but I got the snow down to grade next to the mill and 30' beyond.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3372.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1575412507)
I was able to clear enough to give me room to run the mule past the head when I drop a log, and then some.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3369.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1575412505)
This shows the view from the other direction. I will have to come around the corner of the shop on the right and make the turn to drag the log up parallel to the mill bed. It should be easier with frozen ground.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3373.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1575412569)
The lumber stacks could do with a bit more protection. This stack in the center I just milled Saturday, there is a bigger one just to the left of it you can't even make out.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3374.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1575412571)
So I am sick and feeling poorly but I am happy that I made the right choice and I already feel like all that extra work has paid off. Tomorrow I may wind up taking an actual sick day and actually staying home sick instead of sneaking in chores. I feel like that is a waste, but I also feel pretty darn punky right now.
Better rest up a couple days. Feel Better.
Rich
Quote from: richhiway on December 03, 2019, 07:07:58 PM
Better rest up a couple days. Feel Better.
Rich
How much did you get down your way? Or is it UP your way? Your two locations straddle me and I am not sure where you are.
Better weather heading your way, worked cattle in shirtsleeves this afternoon, got over 50. Take care of yourself and get some rest.
Quote from: Old Greenhorn on December 03, 2019, 07:10:39 PM
Quote from: richhiway on December 03, 2019, 07:07:58 PM
Better rest up a couple days. Feel Better.
Rich
How much did you get down your way? Or is it UP your way? Your two locations straddle me and I am not sure where you are.
I live in Monticello. My camp is up in North Hudson. We had a lot of sleet and about 10 inches. Lucky it wasn't a bad ice storm.
OG, looks like you're hard work payed off!
It's hard to lay around and "do nothing" but resting to get better is something. Won't do any good to get hurt or stay sick longer. Find a good movie or some nice music and have @doc henderson (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=41041) prescribe you a sick day :D
Get feeling better soon!
Brandon
Well I got very little stuff, sawdust wise, to contribute today. I called in sick yesterday and really was. i did NOTHING all day because I had zero energy. I watched Netflix until I was sick of it and any household chores I could think of meant I would have to get out of the chair and that felt too much like work. The 'number challenged' UPS guy delivered yet another package to our house that belonged next door. I took it over and while I was out I walked across the road and through the drifts to swap the card on my trail cam. I could see a lot of activity in the snow and 'somebody' had bedded down right underneath the camera which is strapped to a small Hemlock with nice low shade branches. Then I came back in and never went out again. I went through the clips and had a few usable ones. This one is a little notable:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3xkHWDluVU8 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3xkHWDluVU8)
I went to bed at 7:30 last night. Got up today thinking I would go to work, shaved, put on a clean shirt and all that but when it came time to go warm up the truck I just couldn't do it. Still no energy at all. SO I called in again, which I really did not want to do. This means havoc will prevail in my absence and I will have to do a lot of damage control when I return. Hopefully today I will recover a little more. I am going to take Barndon's advice and listen to some good music. I have a CD playing right now that is a new release from my friend Chris Loquette and is doing pretty well. It is very well crafted music and Chris's first solo release although he appears on many many ensemble albums with Dirty Kitchen and others. Chris is a monster on Guitar, Banjo, and Mando.
Maybe tomorrow I will have something better to add here. Today I think I will try to work on project sketches and the associated BOM's, maybe try to clean the mess that is my desk, although that is real work. ;D
Ayup, the camera has been found!!!
That seems to happen quite often. It's those dang infrared leds that attracts them in when they get close.
Oh no, you've been discovered! Time to scrub the site and disappear Jason Bourne style ;D ;D
Huh, someone actually took my advice?? That's gotta be a first :) :) Lets see what else I can do with my advice... "You have the urge to pack your sawmill up and send it to a bald guy in Utah..." ;D ;D
All joking aside, take it easy and get feeling better soon my friend.
Brandon
Home sick for the 3rd day in a row and I am miserable enough that I have not been able to do anything but read the FF, watch Netflix, and worry about how bad things are at work. And now.... it's flipping snowing again......
So I am forcing myself to do something useful even if it is down at the desk. I have always wanted to get a better handle on board footage which I feel is necessary going forward. I have never allowed myself time to go through the numbers and wrap my brain around it with respect to estimating within reason how many board feet will be required for a specific design or BOM, and how to estimate how much, or whether or not you can get that quantity out of the available logs you have or estimate how many logs you will require to fill out a BOM. I find all these very useful tools and something I should understand better. It also lets me figure pricing as compared to others in a more or less accurate manner.
SO I searched the forum as usual and as usual there is a ton of information and threads. Almost as much as oil/gas mix, sharpening chains, blade lube, chickens, and grits. ;D
Just picking two threads as examples that I found useful:
http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?topic=45346.msg655790#msg655790 (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?topic=45346.msg655790#msg655790)
(This one I really liked because Jeff weighed in to set the record straight for folks who might find the thread in future searches. That person would be me, and now maybe you too.)
I also found this one which is a good discussion:
http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php/topic,18015.0.html (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php/topic,18015.0.html)
I also found a few good references in the wider internet regarding 'how to' use of the various measuring sticks. I shopped for some sticks (looking for international 1/4 scale) but they are a bit pricey for my limited usage (at this point). However I find that I can just chart my log sizes then come home and use the FF calculator in the tool box ( http://forestryforum.com/calcs/sawlogbf.htm (http://forestryforum.com/calcs/sawlogbf.htm) ).
My goal in this learning experiment is to scale the logs I cut my my loft project, then keep track of what I get out of them and compare to get a feel for the ups and downs. I have added up the exact BF of the wood required for the loft and I want to see how my scaling measures up (see what I did there) against the final output.
I figure if I have to sit around, I may as well learn something while i am doing it.
Now I have to find something else to do because I feel like I am not going to be too much better tomorrow. I am chomping to get out in the woods and make some measurements.
Any suggestions for arm chair work?
OK, hearing no suggestions and never being accused of being a patient guy, I bundled myself up (I just can't seem to get warm, even in my 74 degree den) and jumped in the Mule to go measure the next logs I am taking, which are already down but not bucked, so measuring was easy and accurate. I marked as I measured so I can track the results through the process. Then I came back in and ran the numbers and here is where it gets interesting (from an educational standpoint) as well as confusing. I used 3 different calculators to figure the board footage. Now all of those pretty much agreed on the Doyle standard, only vary by a bf or two. But on the international scale they varied widely. I don't want to start a debate on who(m) is right or wrong so I am not going to list the sources. One was the F/F calculator, another was a calculator on another online forum/website, and the 3rd was a chart by a bandsaw mill company most folks know. (no, it is not woodmizer). I am not sure which to believe and I am also not splitting hairs here. The total board footage across these 3 sources ranges from 225 to 310 BF for the same logs (30%?). Again, I am not trying to pit one against another or find the exact right answer, I know this is not an exact science. I wish I had a scaling stick so I could compare what I get from that too. If anyone is interested I will list here the numbers I got and hope the formatting and everything comes through so it makes sense. Maybe you have a way to calculate the numbers yourself and come up with something different. It's a fun exercise if nothing else. The columns should read as follows: Log#, SED (small end diameter), Len (Length), Doyle, Int1, Int2, and Int3 for the 3 different sources used.
Log# SED Len Doyle Int1 Int2 Int3
1 14" 12' 75 83 100 102
2 13" 8' 41 30 55 58
3 10" 8' 18 22 30 32
4 15" 12' 91 90 115 118
Totals 225 225 300 310
I think it's interesting that there is an 85 BF difference between the high and the low numbers. If you were talking about dollars that could add up quick. But I am not thinking about dollars, just trying to learn how these numbers will relate to actual BF in production. My logs will have trim, but I did not include that in my calculations. The 12' logs will be bucked at 12'6" but the excess is waste, so I left it out. I think that was right, was it not? Anyway, that is a nit. I am more interested in which set of values turns out to be most accurate for me. I'd be interested to hear any thoughts on why the international scale results vary so much. obviously there are variances in the underlying calculations some where, but I am wondering why that is. There are a lot of guys here that know this stuff inside out, including our fearless leader. Anybody care to further my education?
I am going to try to trick this through the milling cycle so I can see exactly what I do get from each of those 4 logs. I figure that will be where the truth will begin to reveal itself. I just wish I didn't feel so poorly and those logs were not in a swamp covered by a foot of snow. It's going to be a little work to get them out. ;D
Good understanding comes from doing exactly what you are doing. Measuring logs, sawing them, then measuring the actual board feet produced.
It is interesting to compare the actual board feet produced by the thin kerf bandsaw to the three scales - Doyle, Scribner and International. The scales I believe were developed for circle sawmills and the wider kerf. I know what my experience is. It would be interesting to know others' experience in actual board feet compared to scaled board feet.
Quote from: SawyerTed on December 06, 2019, 04:42:28 PM
Good understanding comes from doing exactly what you are doing. Measuring logs, sawing them, then measuring the actual board feet produced.
It is interesting to compare the actual board feet produced by the thin kerf bandsaw to the three scales - Doyle, Scribner and International. The scales I believe were developed for circle sawmills and the wider kerf. I know what my experience is. It would be interesting to know others' experience in actual board feet compared to scaled board feet.
Ted, what do you think of the disparity I found in the 3 international references I found?
I bought an international stick after reading because I thought the way it was set up it would be more fair if I were to buy a log from someone. I know that with the narrow kerf of our band mills the yield per log will be a larger by a percentage. I also thought at the time I would have to buy some logs to saw but so far I haven't. If I need to though I could pull up a regional lumber price report and at least say in western New York Red Oak stumpage is bringing x amount. That way giving an informed bid. Around here we have two markets Walnut and everything else, and everything else goes to the pallet mills mostly. Since I'm not going to sell lumber and I'm sawing for me mostly it probably wasn't that important of a purchase but it killed a bunch of idle time reading about it when it was too cold to do much else. I havent measured a done pile from a log yet to compare how it yielded to the stick estimate, but if it's not dark when I get home I have a done stack laying by the mill I can do quickly from the last log..
This is probably a better topic to ponder than 35 hp front wheel assist loader tractors while you are under the weather. Hope you are better soon.
@Nebraska (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=45256) can you do me a favor and look at your stick and tell me what it says for a 12' log with 14" SED? I'd like to see if the stick shows yet another difference. Also, is your stick International 1/4" or international 1/8". I have just found that they are both 'out there'. Not everyone specifys which one they are. I am guessing your stick is 1/4" which means a 1/4" kerf is figured in the math.
Quote from: Old Greenhorn on December 06, 2019, 04:45:54 PM
Quote from: SawyerTed on December 06, 2019, 04:42:28 PM
Good understanding comes from doing exactly what you are doing. Measuring logs, sawing them, then measuring the actual board feet produced.
It is interesting to compare the actual board feet produced by the thin kerf bandsaw to the three scales - Doyle, Scribner and International. The scales I believe were developed for circle sawmills and the wider kerf. I know what my experience is. It would be interesting to know others' experience in actual board feet compared to scaled board feet.
Ted, what do you think of the disparity I found in the 3 international references I found?
What I found is the Doyle scale is most conservative - generally it scales a log to the least board feet. The International scale generally scales to the greatest number of board feet. In my sawing, lumber produced comes closer to the International scale.
Others with more knowledge can elaborate on the origin of the scales and the scale that is more accurate for small or large logs. I recall a discussion on this very topic here on the forum.
I get that part, it became apparent pretty quickly as I studied it. However, what I am asking is how can I find 3 different references that claim to be using the international scale and they all have very different numbers for the same log! I have since tried a 4th reference ad gotten yet another value. Who does one trust given that they are all 'accurate guesses'?
@Old Greenhorn (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=42103) I will check when I get home, and let you know when I can, it won't still be daylight yet. Work just erupted with an urgent case. Thought for a bit I'd have some light left no such luck.
Quote from: Nebraska on December 06, 2019, 05:34:00 PM
@Old Greenhorn (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=42103) I will check when I get home, and let you know when I can, it won't still be daylight yet. Work just erupted with an urgent case. Thought for a bit I'd have some light left no such luck.
No sweat the numbers will wait.
Maybe @YellowHammer (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=11488) or others will shed some light on the use of the scales.
Quote from: Old Greenhorn on December 06, 2019, 05:32:35 PM
I get that part, it became apparent pretty quickly as I studied it. However, what I am asking is how can I find 3 different references that claim to be using the international scale and they all have very different numbers for the same log! I have since tried a 4th reference ad gotten yet another value. Who does one trust given that they are all 'accurate guesses'?
I'm a licensed British Columbia log scaler since the mid 90's and have looked into some of the scales that a mentioned here. The ones that use only the small end diameter in my opinion are not a fair scale regarding actual volume. We use the metric scale and account for the taper in the log by a measurement at both ends with some allowance for the flare. If the flare has been cut off it's measured on the cut end.
The volume is tallied in cubic meters and is all the wood in the log, not just the small end run through, which in my opinion is "giving away" the wood in the tapered part. This is why it is easy to cut at times way over the scale especially in heavily tapered logs using small end scale only.
Metric scale gives you every bit of wood in that tree, now it's up to you to get what you can out of it including the tapered wood that at times holds significant wood.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/55256/20191206_210528.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1575688042)
14 inch log says 100 board feet on my stick, it's 1/4 " kerf international scale
The last Ponderosa log I milled was 23" tapering to 18 1/2, the stick says 140 bf at 18" under a 10 foot length. Under 23" it lists 235 bf. My actual yield was 215bf counting the 24 stickers I cut out of the waste. Granted my kerf is 1/8 so I gained quite a bit with that, but it still surprised me.
This is where the old saying that more money was made and lost with a tape measure and scale stick than ever was made with a sawmill. Some local places here buy on one scale and sell on another, for some species.
I myself have learned some hard lessons of being on the wrong end of a scale stick.
Most of the scale formulas, such as Doyle, are pretty easy and are only derived from a few basic characteristics of the log, but the Interntional Scale, developed back in the 1900's was an attempt to really get an accurate result, based on log taper and saw kerf. Clark, the original developer of the rule, developed a stepped equation that changed based upon the length of the log. Later, in the 1950's a fully integrated Rosenbaugh equation came into use. So, I would consider that equation the standard and compare your scale sticks to that. Put the equation in a spreadsheet and run some numbers.
As to the question of why the "most accurate" scaling method would have different results for the same log sizes, in webpage calculators, on scale sticks, etc, would have to do with which actual formula was used, and if it was adjusted for log length, such as the original Clark equations required, or if it was using the fully integrated Rosenbaugh equation that was developed decades later. It may be that the companies who produced the sticks or the programmers who authored the web page calculators used the wrong equation. It may also have to do with the amount of significant figures carried during the calculation because these are cubic formulas and a little rounding error could really make a difference.
Anyway, Purdue has a pretty good reference paper on the subject that provides good info on all the major log scales and their correlation to each other. It gives the actual equations you can use to determine which of your sticks is really right. I would this as a reference to cross check.
https://www.extension.purdue.edu/extmedia/FNR/FNR-191.pdf (https://www.extension.purdue.edu/extmedia/FNR/FNR-191.pdf)
I suspect that some of the old scales were developed to deliberately under-estimate smaller logs. The effect would be that the mills paid less for them, which was fair because they are take more time to saw, and on average produce lower grade boards.
International scale seems to give a better estimate with smaller logs, but it's not that popular because mills don't want to buy smaller logs for top dollar.
Here in NZ logs are usually sold by the ton, but there will be different price brackets depending on size and grade. Makes life pretty simple if you can load a truck with a full load of "grade x", and then just run over a weighbridge. Price per ton is lower for smaller and knotty logs. But it would get complicated with mixed species / grades on the same load, hence I can see why you might want to use a log scale.
OG and all, thanks for this conversation and all the info! I had no idea this subject even existed and now I get to learn even more :P :P 8) 8)
Brandon
I did not have a good night and had to get up a few times to clear coughing fits, that gave me a chance to read some of the above responses. But with my addled brain and the early hour, there was no way I could parse out all the math and thoughts. Now that I have 3 cups of coffee in me and a bunch more reading done I will take a shot.
@Nebraska (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=45256) @SawyerTed (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=38503) , @donbj (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=43431) , @YellowHammer (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=11488) , @Ianab (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=460) , and @ManjiSann (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=46620) thank you for your thoughtful and informative responses. Nebraska thanks for checking your scale that comes in pretty close to what I am narrowing in on as the most accurate answer and confirms to direction I was leaning in. YH, thanks for the link, but more importantly thanks for opening my eyes to the difference between the Clark and Grousenbaugh International rules. When I saw that in your note I immediately stopped reading and looked it up finding the Perdue paper (then saw your link when I went back to reading). Now many of the online calculators do not tell you if they are using Clark or Grosenbaugh's method. So there is disparity there, also Clark had a '1/4 inch rule' and a '1/8 inch rule' which only some of the calculators declare. One site had both (Spike). So right away we see there is disparity and confusion afoot.
Again, my goals here were and are:
1) get a better understanding of board footage calculations and the various methods.
2) measure some logs and record the results.
3) Mill those logs and see what board footage I actually get. This should solidify my level of knowledge and confidence.
4) the root purpose was so that I could estimate how many logs I would need for my own presupposes and projects. It was not for resale. This is why tonnage or cubic volume does not work for my needs. We build with board feet, not tonnage. ;D I can see where tonnage is probably the best, most fair for commercial sales, but I bet there is some debate there also. :D This not not an exact science. (it's very close, but not exact.)
The snag I hit was finding many online calculators and I naturally compared them (you can't trust everything you read on the internet- Abe Lincoln). All the Doyle calculators were very close, but the International calculators varied wildly. SO THAT was essentially my question: why the variation?
Given that there are 3 different formulas under the name of "International Scale" I think we can see the issue. (Clark International 1/4", Clark International 1/8", and Grosenbaugh International 1/4").
Now getting back to my little chart above after learning everything you folks shared and doing further reading, I went back and reviewed those numbers. The first column marked "INT1" comes from a straight chart. I went over this chart comparing other log sizes to the various international scales and can only conclude that this chart is just wrong. It intersects here and there with better values, but mostly it is wide of the mark. So if you throw that one away as bad data and look at the next 2 columns, you see they are very close. Much closer than I would worry about for errors. The lesson learned here is the different formulas for the international scale and that one needs to know which one they are using, if it matters to them. I also learned that the calculator here on the F/F is most likely using the Grosenbaugh formula, which means I can get my numbers right here in the future (Int3 column in my chart are the F/F numbers). I don't have a spreadsheet program here at home, but if I did, I am not sure if I am savvy enough to work the formulas into a tabular comparison. The Grosenbaugh formula is somewhat complicated (Board Feet International = 0.049 761 91 LD2 + 0.006 220 239 L2 D – 0.185 476 2 LD + 0.000 259 176 7L3 – 0.011 592 26L2 + 0.042 222 22L) and doing all the cell reference work would probably mess me up.
So I have learned a lot about this and I am concluding part 1 of this exercise (I think). Part 2 will be where I skid the logs up and mill them to see what I really get. The way I feel, that won't happen for a week.
I look froward to part two!
(BTW Brandon, this was something I looked into a year ago and read widely about on the forum and elsewhere. I came away with a headache and general confusion. This time I was/am determined to understand this knowledge that I think is necessary for me at this point.)
I can understand the headache and confusion part of it :o It's a lot to take in.
To make matters worse for me, there's no 3/8" kerf calculator for my purposes ;D I doubt I need that kind of accuracy right now but I'm excited to study the formulas and get a better understanding of how they work. I might eventually understand them well enough to tweak one to fit my chains kerf, assuming I ever feel the need.
With the small projects I'm doing and being so new to it I don't feel it's as relevant to me as it is to someone such as you who's building a structure or the others who saw for a living or are paid to. Right now my method is get the log THEN figure out what to do with it :D I'm still a tadpole in all this.
Still, it's an awesome subject and I appreciate you delving into it so much. I printed the Purdue sheet off and will put it in my reference book :P and I bet in the near future it'll become more relevant to me.
Brandon
Brandon, if you take a look at the Grosenbaugh formula near the end of my prior post you can see what you are dealing with. If you can find where in that formula to adjust for kerf, well you have me in awe. ;DI know some folks can parse out such things, but I will never be one of them ;D :D.
I think the key take-away is to go through the exercise and see what the formula predicts, then see what you really get and then adjust for your own purposes. If I can say 'I usually get 10% mor than predicted by Grosenbaugh on straight logs then that will give me a very good idea how many logs I need to produce a certain amount of BF. That, right there, is all I need.
Yes, I think right now you have more important bridges to burn, as I did just a year ago. It was just my time now, is all. When the day comes that a logger tells you he can drop off logs and wants $.10/BF then maybe you will have an idea where to find out what that means. :)
I'll let everybody know how part 2 goes. I had to get outside and get some air so I just skidded up 2 of the logs logs I am taking for this project. Now I need to eat and rest.
One issue I see with these different scale methods is the factoring of saw kerf. Take the same log and use different sticks allowing for different saw kerfs and the guy selling the log potentially gets different price depending on what stick/saw kerf is used, seems shaky to me. On top of that the taper can potentially be not accounted for but holds value. Kinda like buying a gallon of milk in a square jug but will only pay for the milk that will fit in a cylinder that will fit in that jug.
The metric scale accounts for every bit of solid and sound wood in a log. If you want to use a 1/4" kerf, 3/8" kerf, 1/8" kerf to saw it up that's all up to you, not me the log owner having to adjust my price by what the buyers saw kerf is.
No system is perfect.
Back in my logging days we used to call the scaling ruler the "gyp stick"
If I want a predictable out turn,I measure the small end diameter ,from which I know because if I have too i can draw it
I sometimes tell my clients to do the same. I might not saw it how theyve drawn it but I will be able saw those boards.
I prefer to use the JAS standard for log measurement because it suits a sawmiller or processer.
Forest owner may feel they are being had but if there are boards to be had from the extra taper and they have value then this is reflected on price...... IMHO.cheers
Understanding the log rules and their real world yield is important. I have found that I can easily match, exceed, or fail to meet the rule predictions based in the style of sawing I do.
For example, through sawing or conventional face sawing will always beat the Doyle scale, while parrallel bark or grade sawing plus also eliminating the pith will sometimes just barely beat scale, and quartersawing will sometimes not beat the scale. Also, end trimming logs to standard size will also push the yield down. So understanding yield vs your own particular style of sawing is important.
As a side note, I try to have the same scale stick in my truck that the log scaler uses where I buy my logs. That helps clear up difficulty when confirming scale values real time out in the mud and the dust. Around here, most of the pros uses the Lufkin folding style.
I personally prefer to use the blue metal, one piece Logrite rule because the numbers are big and readable. It's also the best scale stick I have found to swat snakes and other critters.
Very true YH, this is my goal, to build an understanding going forward. I have understood from early on that sawing methods directly affect yield, especially if the log has issues. I am narrowing in on this 'understanding thing', I think. ;D
Those scale sticks are a bit pricey for the tiny bit of use I would give them, (need a metal detector first) however if things progress and some cash comes in then it will make more sense to get one. I didn't realize Logrite made scales and when I went to their site I can see why. They are pretty much hidden and not on any of the main menus, you have to search. But I very much like how they have made them and their prices are quite competitive, so when the time comes, that is where I will go. They do not specify if their International scale is 1/4" or 1/8", so I assume it is 1/4". No matter, a simple phone call will answer the question when the time comes. It's just a nit, everything is relative.
I would actually prefer a folding ruler, but I have yet to find one using the international scale, they are all Doyle. No matter, I am a small operator at this and for now I just use my Spencer tape to collect the numbers and do the figuring at my desk. (Snake swatting is not a priority for me, particularly at this time of year, they are pretty much gone.)
I did skid up 2 logs yesterday just to get out in the fresh air. The one I thought was my big log (in the group) was supposed to give me the 4 2x10x12' I need for the loft headers. I scaled these covered in a foot of snow and now with the snow banged off I can see there is a seam running up 4' so I likely will not get what I need. If it warms up enough, I am determined to mill that log and see what I get. It's 13° here this morning and in my weakened condition I don't think I want to push it too much. when it gets into the mid 20's I'll go out. Not even sure I can get this log on the mill myself as I have not built ramps yet and don't have a lot of strength in my legs either at this point. It would be a shame to waste the day, blue skies, no wind, and crisp air.
I use a folding rule to get to the logs that are to far in for my 1/4' int. logrite scale. I can measure twice to get an average then look at the scale to get my bf.
On a side note could you attach a swinging pole to your garage to pull logs up on to the mill an also use it to turn them?
Yes Ed, I could certainly do that but I have a better plan I think involving a small winch. The mill has only bee set for a week. That stuff will have to wait a while, probably spring. For now I just horse them up. Given that this looks like a long winter I really want to get this lumber milled up before the snow gets too deep. Just getting by is good enough for now.
Well it was fairly cool this morning (12°) and given this crud I have and the little bit of sleep I am getting at night I really didn't feel like getting outside today. But I need to go to work tomorrow, like it or not, and I had to get some work out in clean air today to get my body moving along. SO, late morning, out I went. Thought I'd kill myself getting that 12' log up on the mill without ramps or help, but I got it up. I really wanted to mill it and see how my calculated numbers came up against the actual output. I need 4 2x10x12' for the loft headers and this log was cut for that. It was cold and I am weak, so I would work about 45 minutes then sense the need to come in and sit for 15 minutes to warm up my toes, then go at it again.
I mentioned that I had left off the last track section on the mill because I really didn't need it, and I don't right now, but I should have taken the 2 minutes to remove the end stop off the un-used section and put it in place on the last section. I thought about it, but thought "Nah, i'll be fine". Guess what? First cut on the 12 footer and I just pushed it off the end. Thank my lucky stars that the bottom rails got hung on the 6x6 timbers I had under the tracks. Easy to push back on and I'll never do that again, right? Nope, did it again an hour later. :D ;D I'd call that 'did something dumb today' for sure.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3379.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1575854299)
Anyway, I worked in those shifts and got it milled up. The interesting thing was the color in this log. It is maple (soft, I think) and the greens in the grain surprised me. I don't know if you can see them in the photos, but I have never seen this in any of the maple I have cut thus far.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3384.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1575854357)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3380.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1575854310)
There is a little bit of spalting also. This tree was dropped a little over a year ago and I am just getting to fetching it out. I did hit a hollow spot around the pith, but I think I can work around it.
The big question I had was "how does it measure against the estimates?" Well, in my little chart a few posts back this log was figured at between 100 and 102 BF. I got 4 2x10's and one 2x8 out of it, bringing the actual yield to 96 BF, which is pretty darn close on the International Scale. Now these were big boards. If I was milling for yield, I might have got more or I might not, it had an odd shape and that was tricky to work around. But this is definitely adding a piece to the puzzle of my education. I will continue to tally the other logs as they get milled although the next one is likely to be a flyer because I made a 'slight error' when bucking, but it's all good. Learning continues. Now if I could just shake this danged cold.
I have been following this post. thanks for all the information. this is not something that I really need to know because I don't buy or sell logs but I'm curious. definitely interested. I would some day like to be able to look at a log and know how much I could get from it. right now I just cut the boards I need and maybe a side board or two.
I don't buy or sell logs either. I just need a way to have a good idea of how much lumber I can expect from a log because I generally cut logs for the requirements I have, such as a build project. So the knowledge is helping me figure things more closely.
Knowing what to expect from a log, in my opinion, is an important step. All the information fits together onto a whole picture, and knowing what to expect before sawing, and then seeing the actual yield leads to understanding. To me it's just part of the process.
When I did a lot of custom sawing, understanding scale yields was an important part of me getting a good reputation. Since I knew I could beat Doyle, I knew I could cut the log up for quality and actually be more liberal with my cut selection, knowing I would still meet or exceed the initial cost estimates I gave the customer when they delivered the logs and produce a high quality product at the same time.
Quote from: Old Greenhorn on December 08, 2019, 08:38:07 PM
I mentioned that I had left off the last track section on the mill because I really didn't need it, and I don't right now, but I should have taken the 2 minutes to remove the end stop off the un-used section and put it in place on the last section. I thought about it, but thought "Nah, i'll be fine". Guess what? First cut on the 12 footer and I just pushed it off the end. Thank my lucky stars that the bottom rails got hung on the 6x6 timbers I had under the tracks. Easy to push back on and I'll never do that again, right? Nope, did it again an hour later. :D ;D I'd call that 'did something dumb today' for sure.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3379.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1575854299)
Should've grabbed a pair of vice-grips and clamped on the end of one rail as a stop ;)
Quote from: Old Greenhorn on December 08, 2019, 08:38:07 PMThe big question I had was "how does it measure against the estimates?" Well, in my little chart a few posts back this log was figured at between 100 and 102 BF. I got 4 2x10's and one 2x8 out of it, bringing the actual yield to 96 BF, which is pretty darn close on the International Scale.
Just to keep the record clean (mostly for my own benefit), I was driving home last night and thought about that log and realized that had I not had that defect in the log I would have gotten 5 2x10's out of it. There was just a little bit more wane in that last board than I could live with for it's purpose, so I am making it a 2x8. Had I gotten the 5 2x10's out of the log it would have been..... 100 BF, which is just as predicted. I just wanted to set the record straight.
The coloring in that maple reminds me of the poplar boards I see in the box stores. Real pretty in my opinion :)
Glad no injuries or damage to the mill, bet that was a bit of a tense moment when it dropped that little bit :o :o
Hope you kick the cold soon!
Brandon
Nah, no worries, it was fine. The cold is still holding in strong but I am gaining on it, I think. Still it's been 13 days now and I am getting tired of it. The weather isn't helping. Hoping to get back to work this weekend. I don't even have enough energy to piddle in the shop in the evenings. Yeah, I will watch the color in that and see if it holds, but I don't expect it to.
Well, I don't know if I am feeling better (took a heck of a nap at lunchtime at work today and woke myself up with my own snoring), but I came home and decided I needed to get into the shop and 'do something' to break this funk I am in.
I had bought a new tank for the blade lube on the mill a year ago and was just holding it until the other one completely disintegrated, and it is pretty much there now besides the fact that there was a clog in the fitting that was giving me fits, every time I cleaned it, it would clog 5 minutes later. Time to fix that. Hud-son does not supply a new fitting on their replacement tanks nor do they put the hole in them. They just send a jug. No biggie once I figured out how the fitting was installed. Drilled the hole in the new tank, cleaned out the fitting, put it together, new hose, new valve and it will be good to go when I put it back on the mill Saturday.
The next thing that was bothering me was the heater fan switch on the Mule broke clean off when I was prepping for last weeks snowstorm. No problem doing without it, but I hate not having things work right, so I ordered an aftermarket switch. Quite a job to get the old one out, all corroded and the nut was seized. My son was in the shop and grabbed a die grinder and we cut it in half and popped the nut off. Then I just had to figure out the wiring change from the old to the new switch. That worked on the first try, some dibble-dabble to make it fit and stay tight, and close the dash back up and good to go. Works as expected.
These were very small chores, but at least I got something done. Trying to queue stuff up for the weekend but Saturday is looking like a rain-out, so the plan is to skid up some more logs. We are back to mud now with all the rain and warmth so that should be fun. ;D It is supposed to be warm, so I should be able to keep working as long as my wind holds up. Sunday I should be able to get some milling done. It's nice to see that the snow is gone from my stacks so I don't have to work around that. There is a lot I can do in a light rain, but there is a limit. The mil bed is free of snow also, but I still have ice along the walkway next to it from going back and fourth last weekend.
Quote from: Old Greenhorn on December 10, 2019, 02:00:20 PM
Yeah, I will watch the color in that and see if it holds, but I don't expect it to.
Yes it will.
Quote from: YellowHammer on December 11, 2019, 08:18:50 AM
Quote from: WDH on December 11, 2019, 07:24:41 AM
Quote from: Old Greenhorn on December 10, 2019, 02:00:20 PM
Yeah, I will watch the color in that and see if it holds, but I don't expect it to.
Yes it will.
I agree.
Well then, so it shall be. Shame to waste it on framing. The next two logs up come off the same stem, but higher up. Some of it will be 5/4 for the floor so that will show anyway. Hopefully, no more bad spots. The rot hole I found around the pith was buried with no outward signs until I opened it up. Must have been a bug trying to build a condo complex. ;D
Bugs do that.
Quote from: WDH on December 11, 2019, 08:10:26 PM
Bugs do that.
Indeed. You never know what you are going to find.
The weather has cooled off again and the ground is stiffening up. Rain is supposed to start tomorrow and run through Sunday, very depressing. I am still recovering (slept for 45 minutes during lunch today) and I continue to try and do some little chores each night and work on project sketches.
When I got hoe today in the mail was the annual calendar from the Trained Logger Certification program for the watershed area. They do a very nice job with great photos of local logging operations that are new each year. The gal that takes the photos is really good. Anyway I was flipping through it to see what classes were on the schedule and when I got to September I glanced at the photo and saw a guy with an orange full brim hard hat. These are not common around here and I thought it was odd, so I looked at the photo closer and realized it was me. It was taken during my GOL3 class. Fortuantely, she got my good side (you can't see my face) and I blend into the crowd well. But I thought it was neat.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3385.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1576202620)
I am the guy all the way on the right in the black jacket.
Anyway, you know I am bored if this is the bright spot in my week. ;D I wish I had something exciting to add.
With all the rain we have coming I am thinking about going up to the Harbor Freight store which is about 45 minutes drive. I have never been and they have some stuff on clearance. My wife seems anxious to go. I figure if we get up there early, we will be back in time to get something done.
I am SO glad tomorrow is Friday, rain or not. :)
Harbor freight is ok. I don't buy tools there. But I see a bunch go out the door each time I am there. I buy cut off wheels,black tape,even bought some drill bits,for metal, there and they work great. :o Bought the wife a welding cart,big wheels,so she can wheel her garden tools around.
I have a fairly low opinion of Harbor Freight products in general. My experience hasn't been good with their products. The wrenches, sockets, screwdrivers and pliers are just ok. About 10 years ago, I had to have surgery due to an injury caused by a HF cheap drill bit. Cutoff wheels and grinding disks spin too fast for me to trust HF products. I worked at a company that used HF products extensively so I've used many of their products.
To go to the HF store, I have to pass numerous other retailers that offer higher quality products.
OH I know HF is not a source for quality, but for the oddball occasional use tool that may or may not hold they are fine. Just really going to look at pick up some filler junk that I have no need to buy first quality. It's not a bad source to buy things that you are going to modify anyway. I fully understand where they are on the quality ladder. ;D
Well we made the trip to HF yesterday, the wife and I. I dropped over 200 bucks on nonsense mostly. Well not exactly. I got parts and such to repair some things. I needed a trailer tire for an old small utility trailer I am going to refurb and use for moving lumber. Right now it is rotting, so might as well fix it. I also got a 2 inch coupler for it to replace the crushed one and match the rest of my trailers. I bought some cheap tools to try out some concepts before I buy good ones, plug cutters, pull saw and other odds and ends. I got a metal detector that seems to work fairly well so far, but I have to play with it. Also picked up a solar powered motion detector light that I needed for the side of the shop. This has been a very dark winter so far. Also got a new heavy duty tarp to cover the mill, the old one was porous. I got a cheap battery maintainer for the Mule because plowing season can be rough on the battery with the winch, lights, heater fan, and radio all going. nice to just pull it in and plug it in. I'll do a permanent mount in the Mule to make it simple. So now I have to put all these things to use. I will spread that out and do it in the evenings.
When we got home, the rain was just a mist so I skidded up a log and opened up the mill and made the last 6X8 I needed with a couple of 5/4 boards I will make into stickers. As I was finishing the 6x8 I realized the rain had crept back in and was steady. I can tolerate getting wet, but I had a lot of tools in the Mule which were getting wet, so I closed up, brought the column in the shop to dry off and put everything away around 3:30. Short day, but I got something done. I had been up since 4 so I was pretty tired anyway.
I am off for the holiday week, so I am thinking I might get into that loft build pretty well. I arranged to borrow a timber saw (I think it's a 16" blade) from a buddy to cut those columns which will save me a LOT time over the '4 cut method and finish with a handsaw'. I have never used a saw that big and am a little concerned I can handle it. I still have a little more framing pieces to mill up, but I think my task for today is to go find a log I can mill the 6x10x12' that I need for the main cross header I recently added to the plan. I am pretty much out of log stock. I may have to take a tree, which I would rather not do (more time spent).
Well, time to get at it and do 'something'.
Mid-day check-in while I wait for lunch to cook. Well I found my 12 footer an old 18" log that has been laying there a while. The center is really solid, but man I busted my butt getting that thing on the road and under the log arch. It was hard just to turn and point it in the right direction.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3394.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1576430685)
I made a path to it and backed the Mule in and got the arch on it, but I could not budge it, holy cow that thing is heavy! All four tires were spinning and the skidder wheels were sinking in the mud. I finally came up with the idea of putting a chain choker around an anchor tree and pull the mule with the winch and I yanked with the Mule.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3396.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1576430722)
It took several tries and more than a little back prying to get it to move, but finally I won out. Holy cow, what a mess of a mud trail I left up my neighbor's driveway with the discharge from the tires. I had to clean it up with a snow shovel for 100'.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3397.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1576430740)
I got the big sucker up to the mill, but now I can't roll it on. :D I'll wait till my son is over this afternoon and get him to help. I don't know how much more I can get done today, I am pooped.
If it is the Makita one, 16 and 5/16th I think, and they saw great. looks like a big skill saw? i was going to get one but the price went up 50% after the tsunami hit japan.
Not sure yet. He had a job with 24 6x6 posts. Paid for itself in one use. Never used it again, so I will keep it lubricated for him. ;D
I like H.F. for tools that I keep in the shed or truck. They are fine for daily stuff. They also started offering higher quality lines. They just had a sale on the 2000 watt predator generator. I was surprised it runs like a top and seems fairly well made. Time will tell I just wanted a light weight quiet machine to run my power tools. It also comes with a 12V battery charger cord.
I just went for the Milwaukee cordless chainsaw and blower. I have all Ryobi but I decided to spend the $$ and go for a higher end cordless. I think the saw will be very handy around the mill. I'll make a video of it if I have time.
That mule will pull!
OK, I am just about outta steam. Yes, @ricihhiway I think it's nice to have a battery chainsaw around the mill. My neighbor bought a ryobi and the darn thing works pretty good! Good luck with yours.
After lunch I was still pretty shot but I went back out, rolled the big log out of the way and put up some 5/4 filtches from the previous log to make stickers which I desperately needed. Then I restacked the pieces I flat stacked last weekend and I pulled the 2 2x8x12's I had at the bottom of a temp stack I made before the snow. I expect this stack will be gone in 3 weeks or less.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3400.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1576446957)
Then I closed up and dragged an old utility trailer that had been laying in the weeds for 15 years into the shop. I put a new 2" ball coupler on it to match my others, removed the rack, and swept the deck.
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(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3403.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1576447004)
it is covered in moss. I will leave it in the shop to see if it dries out at all. I plan a new deck in the spring, and I don't feel like using the pressure washer in this weather.
Now I have to go fetch my son to help with that log and shuttle trucks back and forth, but I am truly shot. A LOT of heavy labor today for sure, but I am having fun.
Edit to add: I took inventory of what I had for the loft now that I have it re-stacked. I am only 5 pieces short but one is a 6x10x12'. My son and I got the big log up on the mill tonight and it was tough for the two of us. I may have to put the extension on because I didn't get it as far up as I wanted and the two of us could not slide it up. I will figure it out and find a way to cheat it a little bit. I MAY be able to get the remaining lumber I need from this one log, but if not I have another next to the mill. The log scales out at 150 board foot so in theory it should all come out of it. I am keeping track of the chart I started last week and will add this log to it when I share the full results.
no updates in 4 days because I have done nothing in 4 days beyond small tasks to keep me busy for a few minutes each night so I feel like I did something. I am going CRAZY. We had snow and killed some time on that. Took the plow off last night hoping I don't need it for a while. ;D Too darn cold. I don't want to fire up the heat in the shop for just an hour or so of work. It's tough enough to go out before bed to fill the wood cart. Too cold, too soon. It's about 16 now. I can work in the dark and I can work in the cold, but I just can't get motivated to work in the cold AND the dark. Now we have a hard frozen glazed over something or other that is not a lot of fun to work on.
Tomorrow is my last work day for the year and I am going to a gig tomorrow night, after that, it's game on to get this loft going. I wish I had that timber saw, but I have not got it yet. First order is to get the posts all cut to the same length. It will start slow with all the detail work but once I get the slow details done, it should move faster. All I seem to be able to do in the evenings is sit and think and plan my steps so I don't waste time.
Cold and dark doesn't motivate me either. In fact cold and light doesn't motivate me much! It was in the low 20's here this morning. I kept the fire going and did inside chores until 11:00 or so. By then the temperature was 38. Got out and milled 25 2x8x16 white oak for side boards for a 2 ton firewood truck.
Tomorrow will be "cold" for here too. I have a portable milling job at the local builder supply tomorrow afternoon.
Quote from: SawyerTed on December 19, 2019, 09:09:04 PM
Cold and dark doesn't motivate me either. In fact cold and light doesn't motivate me much! It was in the low 20's here this morning. I kept the fire going and did inside chores until 11:00 or so. By then the temperature was 38. Got out and milled 25 2x8x16 white oak for side boards for a 2 ton firewood truck.
Tomorrow will be "cold" for here too. I have a portable milling job at the local builder supply tomorrow afternoon.
Everything is relative. Your cold is my warm, but judging by some of the posts on the weather thread my cold is somebody else's warm. I just want to get some work done so I can feel better. Lousy days at work dealing with the nonsense the new generation of management is dishing out. I counted 3 hours on non-value added time in my day just today alone and most days are the same. I had to fill out a form explaining our 'high risk task of the day' (it's the latest 'thing') and it took 4 of us to figure it out and fill in the blanks. I calculated the amount of man hours we spent on it combined to make a point, and when I handed it in at the meeting I said to the guy "Be very careful with this piece of paper, it cost us $500. in time to fill it out". He laughed, I don't think he got the point (everyone else did). We are doomed.
This is why I need to come home every night and do something of value, with my hands, that I can hold up, touch, and look at, that is not a spreadsheet or checklist, it helps maintain what little sanity I have left. ;D
It was beautiful here Sunshine and I think it hit almost fifty, hang on its coming your way. Wish I could keep it but for this time of year it was a blessing. Even milled a little chunk of basswood.
well, the holiday break I have been so looking forward to started off well enough last night. I met my buddy and borrowed his timber saw (more on that in a bit), then caught some home grown music, French Coffee house standards of the 30's and 40's along with some good jazz standards by a great trio of musicians. Got to bed late, and it was too cold (10) to think about milling so I started in the shop doing the loft prep work. I had to remove a tool board and cut and rehang it, you can read about that in the 'Did something Dumb' thread and I won't repeat it here. The pain is still quite real and holding me back. The middle finger is now a cross color between purple and black. The index finger that kind of exploded is just fine, but there is so much swelling stress in that middle finger that it is sensitive to everything, especially touch. i tweaked it more than once today. It will heal.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3420.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1576963969)
Anyway, after the 'incident' I went out and finished that part of cutting and rehanging the tool board. I had to take a break after that for an hour. Too much pain, tiredness and felt really cold. I had lunch and rested by the wood stove, then went back out. I emptied all the drawers out of the bench and stacked them out of the way.
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Then I pulled the bench and shortened it by removing one set of drawers and making a new foot on the new end. It is ready to go, but I won't put it back until I have the corner columns set in place so I have working room to do that. Of course this is making a mess out of the shop. ;D But I got the bench trimmed so, moving on.
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Having that done, I turned my eye toward the next step which is finish cutting the columns to length. These will support the entire loft. Last loft I built on the other side, I did these column cuts with 4 passes of the circular saw (one on each face), then finishing off the cut with a hand saw, then hand planing off any imperfections. It took a LONG time. So that's why I borrowed my buddy's timber saw. With a 16" blade it will do the whole cut in a single pass. Now I had seen this saw a few months ago and made a mental note he had it. But, it's a whole lot different when you have it in your hands. ;D It is a beast of a saw. I set up for a cut but then realized I need another person to hold that beam in place. I also realized my left hand is not in the greatest shape and you need every bit of both hands on this fella.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3414.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1576963942)
For scale, that saw is sitting on a 6x8 full sized beam. I will wait to cut these until I can get some help keeping it in place. Tomorrow I can either find somebody or do other work. I have started now, so I can't stop at least until I have the mess in the shop sort of cleaned up so I can pull a truck in if we need to.
But the god news is I am back at and making progress even if I am short a couple of functional digits for a while. It never broke 25 today, but tomorrow they are saying 40, maybe I will get back on the mill. Handling beams with this bad hand will be tough but I gotta get it done. I am just happy to be working on my 'stuff' and in spite of my dumb move, I made pretty good progress today.
I bought one of those saws used. Lots of fun. Has a bit of a torque kick when you start it. I made a special board the exact width of the saw shoe to the blade. I put that on the cut mark and then screw a temporary fence (1x2) to the beam on the other (left) side of it. Remove the special board/spacer and make your cut. The main reason I did that is I was cutting angles and it was easier to layout. Note that you want the fence to be on the "keeper" side of your cut. That way if you wander away from the fence, your beam/post will be longer than intended, not shorter! Make your fence board long enough to come out about a foot towards you so you can get your saw lined up for your cut. Easy Peazy. This big blade does not like you to adjust your cut angle while cutting ;) When you finish your cut and the piece falls away, DO NOT MOVE YOUR SAW. Release the trigger and let it come to a complete stop. There is so much gyroscopic power in that blade you might have a little accident if you try to walk away while running. You can see the fence and I'm letting it spin down at the end of the cut (no sawdust flying). I'm making multiple kerf cuts to chisel out a section.
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Thanks for those usage tips! This saw 'concerns' me a bit and yeah boy howdy it has both start up and shut down torque! Your fence method is better than the one i used, so I just changed. ;D I always let the saw stop before I pull it because a long time ago I caught the cord on a withdrawal and have never done that again. I am just wondering how this is gonna feel when I have it buried and if I can stay in the saddle if things go wonky. Given my left hand issues I am not attempting this without a helper to keep that beam secure (and dial 911 if needed ;D). Your advice raises my level of comfort (just a little).
Quote from: Old Greenhorn on December 21, 2019, 08:45:42 PMI am just wondering how this is gonna feel when I have it buried
It is actually a little under powered. If you try to steer it, it will bog down and came close to stalling it - though I was running it from a generator.
Geez, I better have a good grip on that puppy if I am going to stall it. 'Equal and opposite reaction' and all that stuff.
Well I got lucky and found myself a sucker um, generous helper who will be here around 8 and we will see how this beast cuts.
Quote from: Old Greenhorn on December 22, 2019, 07:12:26 AM
Geez, I better have a good grip on that puppy if I am going to stall it. 'Equal and opposite reaction' and all that stuff.
Well I got lucky and found myself a sucker um, generous helper who will be here around 8 and we will see how this beast cuts.
Well that was amazing! In and hour and a half we did the equivalent of what took me 2 full days when I did the last loft. It takes a bit to push that saw and controll the line, BUT it never bound or balked. There was a time or two we realized I was pushing the beam and my helper away ;D but we figured it out. I could have never done that alone. 5 posts (6x8 ) cut on two ends each and the variation from the longest to the shortest is 1/16". I can live with that. The finish this saw leaves is amazing! Like it's planed and polished. Yeah, I owe my buddy a case of his best beer for this loan.
OH, and @ljohnsaw (https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=20640) , as much as I doubted you, you were right, this saw is a lot of fun!
Break time is over. I need warmer boots so I can fire up the mill. 8)
Early end of the day today because we got invited to the neighbors for a dinner party and I really need a shower and clean clothes. ;D It hit 40 today and I am soaked with sweat.
After that last post I went back out but instead of milling I did some more shop work. My newly altered finger sensation really enjoy running a hammer drill (not) so I drilled a couple of the holes in the floor for the post pins and drilled one post to check out the fit. Then it seemed warm enough, so I uncovered the mill and took the opening cut on that big log that took two of us to load. I had to add the last length of track to give me some run-off room, I was just short. (and I thought I wouldn't need that until spring.) That was easy, but flipping that log...was not. I wound up rolling it half off the bed (mistake in judgement) and then spent the next half hour inching it back up with an 8' pry bar. Second side was fine, but flipping again was problematic and took a lot of time and sweat. At that point I am thinking 'man it's hot out' and took off my jacket. I brought it to 10 inches thick by taking a couple of nice 5/4's off of it. Apparently this is RO which explains the weight. The third side flip was a little easier, but by now my back was getting tired. Then the 4th and I got a 5/4 and a nice 8/4x 10 with wane I will trim to a 2x8. I thought I was finished at a 8x10 beam but it looked big. So I left it right there until I checked. My cut list was in the house. Later when I checked it, sure enough that 8x10 is supposed to be a 6x10, so I have one more cut to make to finish it. I will need help moving it to the shop anyway so it will sit on the mill until some unsuspecting person comes to visit. ;D
It turned out to be a fairly nice log.
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I found this white stuff in the middle of the log. I have no idea what to make of it, any ideas?
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I did learn a few more tricks about winter milling. First I need to be sure that there is no snow around the track and wheels. I had cleaned the track off, but the surrounding snow served as a block against certain parts of the carriage. Also, the blade lube somehow mixes with the snow and sawdust ofand gets on the carriage rollers, freezes and builds up. I need to watch that, it was a problem. Last note: Punky rot and bark is easy to clean off with a square shovel when the wood is frozen.
Not much time or thought for photos today. It was kind of like a double bonus day for me. I was worried what I could get done with the punky fingers, but between sizing all the columns this morning, getting a few holes in the floor at mid-day, and getting that beam milled up (except for the one remaining cut), it was a banner day. Sure I did have a few moments with the overly sensitive finger and saw stars a time or two, but that's just part of the fun. Looking forward to another good day tomorrow and may start hanging some lumber in the air. 8)
Well, I didn't start hanging lumber in the air today. I started on the mill while the shop was heating up and I finished off that log. Made the 6x10, edged some 2x8's and 5/4 decking boards. I am nearly done with the cut list. I may just need 1 more 2x8. but my cut list was generous so I may already have enough wood. I have one more log sitting there if I need it but I need to get that 6x10 out of the way. It's too heavy to move easily and I am not ready for it in the shop yet. I covered up the mill and I went in the shop and went back to the hammer drill to set posts. Here is where I disappointed myself.The first one was right along the outside wall near the footing and it was a bear to drill. I think I hit stone so that took a lot of effort and time. The poured floor there has a little spalting so it is not quite flat and level. I will have to do some shimming to get the column square. I also had to add a relief slot across the back of the column for a run of 1/2" EMT that goes through. Fit like a glove. Then I had to do some layout for the last column in the square (but not the last column). I wanted to make sure this thing comes out pretty square as a unit and things match. Just because my plan, by eye, made sense, doesn't mean the math would work out. Turns out the building is square within and 1/8' or less and the column landed where I wanted it. I drilled the hole in the floor, drilled the post, and did a test set to make sure it fitted and lined up. This one was a bear because not only did the masonry drill take a little walk, but so did the hole in the column. 8 times I had that 170# post up and down checking things and trying to make it fit right. By the time I finally got it I was physically shot. Nothing left in the tank. I still have one column left to drill and I had hoped to have it done today, but I am not wasting time wishing for things that didn't happen. Every day is progress and that is all that matters. It will just push out the end date to whenever. Yesterday I accomplished a lot more than I expected, so on the whole, we are still doing good. I can tell you my two crushed fingers were reminding me all afternoon how much they 'enjoyed' the hammer drill.
I have said it before, but it bears repeating: I am not a carpenter, I am not a woodworker, I am not very good at this stuff at all. (Heck, I am not even a logger but I stayed at a holiday inn just last month.) I just do my best to overbuild important things where somebody could get hurt and follow good accepted practices. But my execution is always just a little frayed. Cuts that don't line up perfectly, a 1/16 out of square here and there. I take a lot longer than I should to make things fit right. It has always bothered me that I can't seem to do it as well as a lot of people I have watched, worked with, or seen here on the forums. But with each project i try to get a little better and try new things. Tonight I was laying out on paper my plan for a step joint for the front beam header on this thing. I want it to appear from the front as if there is a solid red oak beam spanning from wall to wall instead of seeing the wall headers at each end. So I am going to hide them with a step in the beam and just two spikes on each end tying into the headers. It's a very simple thing, but I have never done it so this is a good place to try it. It will work, regardless of my skill, but I want to take the time to see if I can make it pretty. This might be my precursor to messing around with some timber frame joints, but that is in the future...way in the future. This is also why I am doing the floor decking on a 45° angle. I have never done it before and I want to see if I can and how it will look and function. I am even planning of planing it all the same thickness, another new adventure for simple minded me. It's all a learning process and if it goes wrong, I will know not to do that again.
I just wish I had more gas in the tank. I could be out there right now banging out the work, but I am pooped. Getting older just sucks sometimes. I'll hit the rack early and hopefully be back at it early tomorrow. I have to quit by noon and do honey-do's and I should probably start my Christmas shopping too. ;D It will get done, but doggone I am getting slower.
Oh, and by the way, if you recall that little experiment I am doing about calculated board footage verses actual yield., I have not forgotten that and am keeping detailed notes as I go through the logs I listed. I have one log left, and I will post the results when it's done. I can say it's been very interesting for me. (152 BF out of that last log I milled.)
i believe this might be the last lumber i need for the build except for the deck lumber, which is nearly done also.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3429.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1577145137)
Nice progress!!! 8)
That's a big circular saw! ;D ;D
Keep up the good work and try not to put too much blood into it :o :o
Brandon
I guess that is where the phrase, "blood sweat and tears" came from! :)
No tears Doc (yet). But I have a ways to go yet. ;D I don't think I can get this done by the end of the holiday break. but hopefully I can have it all framed up and just have the floor to finish. Then I have to go borrow a planer, run a 220 outlet for it and then plane the wood and do the deck. One day at a time, right?
you need 3 teenagers following you so they can learn to show up and get er done. I am sure there were some tears... but what happens in the shop, stays in the shop. :D Best Regards and enjoy your holiday and accomplishments. :)
doc is right about the teenagers part. I work in a hardware store. We hire them and they have no idea what anything is. If I send them for a ¾ inch bolt they would have no idea if it was a small one or a big one. Forget about asking them for a fine thread or coarse thread bolt.No idea how to cut copper pipe. I am not blaming them,but I followed my Dad around just like a puppy dog,poor guy, ;D even when I left home I did. But I learned all this stuff. I realize no one knows everything,but these guys know nothing!!! But they do ask questions. Some it sinks in and others I can tell,can care less. It's almost like,I will never need to learn this. ::)
Nope they can hardly fix a thing, but they can sure make a stupid looking face into their phone and send it out on snap chat, or barely write a sentence using cursive writing, or even look you in the face and have a short conversation. Ok sorry old dad rant, I'm sure my dad thought I was special too with my head phones and walkman.
@Old Greenhorn (https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=42103) glad you've gotten some time to get stuff done, all I've gotten done lately is drive by the mill and log pile and look at it. Hope your fingers heal quickly we've all been there, enjoy the holiday season. :)
Really Doc, there are no tears.
As for the teenager idea. I would love one, 3 would be a bit much to handle, but as Nebraska and Ray 'hinted' at It might take 3 to make one good one. They could takes turns on a 15 minute rotation and I would pay them accordingly. ;D I actually prefer to work mostly alone so I can hear myself think. As mentioned I am not very good at this so I am constantly thinking trying to avoid doing something dumb. Sometimes I fail. :D I also have a very low tolerance for people who have bad habits like not knowing where their fingers are at all times and putting the body parts in dangerous positions.
Short day today, I did some Christmas shopping at Tractor supply on request then headed to the mall and it was deserted at 8:30am. Didn't find what I wanted to get. Went out to the shop and drilled the last pin hole in the floor. I had gotten a new $22.00 tube of anchor pin epoxy because the tube I used for the other loft posts was now 2 years old. Didn't think it was any good, but I tried it and what do you know!? Still good and I did all 5 posts with what was left in the tube and never touched the new tube. All 5 posts are set now and curing up just shimmed square. I also slid the bench back, but I will wait on the drawers. i took off a row of 4 drawers so I will have to consolidate a little.
In this photo you can just make out the 5 posts: 2 against the back wall, one on the corner of the stairs, and the 2 front ones are at the extreme left and right in the photo, the left one is behind the drill press and the right one is at the edge of the window. Next I have to secure them to the walls then hang the first header on the right hand (outside) wall. I figure that to be a full day, after that my productivity should pick up.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3434.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1577205124)
Now I have to get in a Happy Christmas mood and clean the den, wrap gifts, and help the wife. Then this evening we start visiting. Truthfully, I would rather be working, but it is nice to spend time with family and friends. I just hate the drama that sometimes creeps into these things.
I was just thinking, the house 2 doors down just sold. Maybe there will be a teenager moving in that knows what a hammer is? (Well, I can dream, can't I? After all, it is Christmas.)
OH, and good luck to everybody in the drawing tomorrow. The sponsors and members are been unbelievably generous with their contributions and there are gonna be some extra happy folks in the world by tomorrow evening. Me, I had enough fun just doing the contest. Thanks to all for the wonderful event that helps make this forum different from anything else you can find today.
Merry Christmas and Happy Hanukkah to all!
:christmas:
The only thing different between teenagers then and now is we aggravated our elders and current teenagers aggravate us!
Some certainty don't know the difference among a wench, a winch and a wrench, but did we at 16?
Ed Zern or Pat McManus wrote about the fact every boy needs an "old man" who is not his father (as much as they need dads). The old man used to be grandpa but now sometimes he is a neighbor or family friend. I'm the "old man"/mentor for a couple of teenage boys. We fix stuff, we build stuff, they tail gun at the mill, we hunt and we fish. But importantly we talk and I tell them what I think. I'm not afraid to tell them they are being a dumbe$$ about something. They've come to appreciate it. :D :D
I'm also in the audience at school events or scouting activities. I believe they will be better men in the end.
I think both Ed and Pat wrote that as much, if not stated directly in their stories. I was, and am a big fan of their work. Had all of Ed's books and recently gave them to a young cousin, along with all of Pat's books that I had. I hope he enjoyed them. This is how it goes in my family and the writing just kind of fit for us. I spent 35 years or more (lost count) in Scouting helping boys learn to do things and make good decisions. I will confess, I got out of it and am focusing on myself and my wife for a change. But some boys still come hang around (mostly Grandsons) and the boys that still run into me are now in their 30's or more. It is rare that I give them a harsh criticism, but when they need it, they get it. ;D It doesn't change our friendship in the least. But there aren't many of the young ones around anymore that seem to get off the couch. I tried to befriend the kid across the road, but he wants to wear gloves if he is going to be near any dirt and he is afraid if I put a tool in his hand. He asks his Dad, and he is all about not getting dirty either. Go figure folks out? You try but.....
SawyerTed,I knew the difference and many of my friends did too at age 16. What helped me was my older brother was 9 years older. I was the wrench go gotta. ;D Or Ray's hand are smaller,he can get that bolt started. ;D
I am not saying nothing bad about the young kids,I have no idea who they follow around,if anybody. ::) I try to teach the ones at the store what I know. Which does not take long. :D
I worked for the YCC,government for 2 summers,at a national park.This was the last 2 years of high school.I kinda got elected to help build a trail with big rocks. None of them understood leverage. We could not use equipment to put the rocks in place. In fact I was even in charge of choosing what rocks got hauled to the trail. Some kids had no idea how to even use a shovel,or how to cut bushes with lopers. That was a eye opener for this country boy. I thought everyone knew how to do that stuff. ;D
My best friend growing up was an "old man" two doors over, he taught me a lot about life. We spent a lot of time fishing, hunting doves,ducks and pheasants, going to watch the sandhill crane migration in the spring, shooting fireworks, and generally just talking or goofing off. His namesake "Ted" graduated from college last Saturday starts his job the sixth of January. I hope someday I can return the favor.
I read Field and Stream and Outdoor Life cover to cover every month as a boy. I don't have EdZ ern's books but Pat Mc Manus is on the shelf. Bless all of you who can be an old man in a boys(or a young lady's) life you make a difference and they will be a better "man" for it.
I've met a few people that don't have a clue how to use a hammer or what a phillips screw driver is. It's a little hard for me as my step son has zero inclination to learn this type of skill nor does my little brother who is 12 years younger than me. My little brother went to college and is a computer programmer so I guess he figures he'll pay people to do this stuff. I'm not speaking bad about him, he works for his money and he made different choices (wiser in many ways) than I did. I'm just saying I struggle to comprehend not wanting to do stuff myself... though as I type this the thought comes to me how often I'd rather pay the mechanic to fix my cars... I can do automotive I just don't enjoy it... ok maybe I do have more of an understanding that I thought. Anyhow weird tangent over, I've had to learn it's just not everyone's cup of tea.
My step son and I have agreed I'll leave him alone about it for the most part so long as the things I deem he must know, like changing a tire, he won't fight me on and will learn. So far he's been a good sport about it. He's come home a few times to a load of fresh milled boards I've asked him to haul in the basement to dry. Once he gets his music worked out...seriously how long does it take to find a decent song??... he hauls it down without complaint. He's a good kid, just has different goals than I do and I struggle to understand sometimes.
I've recently realized I'm not very patient nor a good mentor (I plan to work on both of those skill sets :P ) so want to say to those who have been the "old guy next door" thank you. I was a scout and I didn't realize how much work and passion those men put into it nor did I appreciate it till I was much older. Now my old scout master and that guy next door hold positions of honor and respect in my mind and memories. It's funny, I met up with them a few years back and they are a lot shorter than I remember but yet when I think about them they are still 10 feet tall. My point is, you gents make a difference and I thank you.
OG, looks like it's coming along nice! Be way cool to see it when it's done!
Well Merry Christmas to all, or whatever your holiday of choice is, and be safe!
Brandon
I was very fortunate growing up to have an old man mentor me. He was like an adopted grandfather and his wife was closer to me than my grandmothers. He taught me a lot about catfishing, hunting, trapping , beekeeping, etc. When we moved here my son used to hang out with the old man who bought the across the road from us and I could relate to that. He'd help him with his cows and just sit and talk for hours and both are better men for the time they spent together.
Quote from: WV Sawmiller on December 25, 2019, 06:41:50 PM
I was very fortunate growing up to have an old man mentor me. He was like an adopted grandfather and his wife was closer to me than my grandmothers. He taught me a lot about catfishing, hunting, trapping , beekeeping, etc. When we moved here my son used to hang out with the old man who bought the across the road from us and I could relate to that. He'd help him with his cows and just sit and talk for hours and both are better men for the time they spent together.
Brandon, first let me say that it is very difficult to mentor your own son because the relationship is so complicated and I am not putting step-sons in a different category because I have never had one and I don't think I would treat one any different than my own. But I could be wrong on that. When I was in my second heavy tour in Scouting, my son was in the Troop I Soutmastered. We had other adults with their own boys and we (the adults) had this discussion about mentoring your own boy and and came up with the idea of 'swapping kids'. i.e. I would spend time with my friends son, and he would hang out with mine. It worked out very well, was easier on the boys and easier on us. We kept that going until they aged out. I still see one of those boys at least once a month now and he speaks highly of me to others I am told. The point is, there are some things a Father can't do no matter how hard he tries. That's whu God gave us neighbors and adopted grandfathers I think. As a side note: my kids were always a little annoyed because their friends would tell them they had a 'cool Dad'. My kids could never see me in that light. ;D
WV you had a cool key statement in there: "and both are better men for the time they spent together" emphasis should be on the word BOTH. It's a 2 way street. I have tremendously enjoyed the time I have had sharing adventures with youngsters. I truly am the better man for that time spent.
I don't believe that there is a "one size fits all" because each of us are still individuals. Quality seeds planted when your Son(s) are young have a chance of maturing as you both get older and the Father gets wiser. Yup, it happens after the Son experiences a few painful learning experiences. Be there for him but not with a "told you so" attitude.
Well Christmas is pretty much done, we had a great family time yesterday, but back at it today. I had to go to home despot and get a larger spade drill than I had in my set and a new 1/2 masonry bit, the other one is shot. Got to work by 10 and got all the posts secured to the walls except one. I did cut the board I am using for that stitch to an existing wall, but it had some ice on it and I want that to at least melt and dry off a bit. It is prepped and ready to nail.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3441.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1577413060)
Then I got the drawers back in the work bench now that I am pretty sure i won't have to move it again (for a while). That was a little fiasco because all the drawers are not the same size, vary by 1/8" here and there. But it's done.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3442.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1577413137)
Then I hooked up that rescued little trailer and started bringing in all the framing lumber so the ice could melt off and it could dry a bit. This is the load with the big 6x10 header. That trailer worked out just dandy, nice and low.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3435.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1577413055)
Then I got the first header up and tied that to the outside wall with 5 1/3 tapcons. It took a long time to plane the section over the door swing for clearance. I could have just cut a square notch, but I wanted to make it sort of disappear so I planed a long swale into it that really does not show that I removed any material, but in reality I took about 1/4 inch.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3440.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1577413009)
That's my son looking dubiously at my work. (He thinks I over engineer stuff.) At this point it was 6pm and time for dinner. But I was both tired and on a little roll, so after dinner I went back out and cut the sister header for the first and hung that over the door and repeated the marking and shaving process. I only had to put the one up 3 times before the door swung freely and I left it up the last time. I am searching for the right size nails to attach it with. I know I have 50# of them somewhere. ;D I was tired at this point and it was 9pm, so I just took the planer and put mitered corners on that stitch board and sanded the face and edges so it's look pretty. I will score this as a fair days work for an older guy and I am happy with what I got done. Rain expected tomorrow, so I am gad I got all the framing wood inside.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3449.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1577413120)
It's a little tight in the shop, but very workable. Also tomorrow I promised the wife that we would do our 'movie day' which is something we have done for years during the holiday week. There is a family across the river in Red Hook that owns a large piece of property where they put up a movie theater and also have a place where they sell old items reclaimed from estates and clean-outs. It's called Hoffman's Barn and they have some good stuff. We spend an hour or so going through the 'barn' then catch a movie across the parking lot. I know a guy that works there and they may have some table legs I can use on slabs. So it will be a useful trip at some level, but the best I can hope for is a few hours in the evening out in the shop. Maybe a few in the morning before we leave.
Progress is being made. I hope to have the framing done on Saturday, depending on how long it takes to cut and set that big beam. Then I turn to the flooring which again will have a slow start as I arrange for a planer loan. I am not quite sure I have enough material for the floor, but a quick inventory tonight tells me I am good on the framing BOM, so that other log I have left can be flooring and should certainly put me over the top (I think). :) I am pegging the completion date at 1/5, lets see now I do.
OG, I don't have a biological son so I admit I'm making some assumptions here but I agree with you as far as step son being no different. At least I feel like I treat them the same as if they were my own. You and Magicman make some good points and I appreciate you both sharing your wisdom and experience with me :P
The loft is looking real good! I laughed about your son thinking you over engineer stuff as I have the same mind set about engineering. My sister once told me she often has a project and things "I bet Brandon could do this quick..." then her next thought is "Do I need it to survive the zombie apocalypse?" If the answer is no she either does it herself or finds someone else to do it :D :D I tend to very much overdo things. I chalk it up to knowing I'm ignorant of details of load stress, weight carrying abilities, etc. So I build things more robust so I have a large margin for error. It also stems from not liking to redo things, I'm largely a set it and forget it sort of person.
As I understand engineering, the swale instead of cutting a little box out of the header over the door was the correct choice. Sharp corners focus stress forces at the 90 degree corner and will cause a failure there whereas a rounded corner or arch gives the stresses nowhere to focus and so the forces are born equally around the radius.
Keep up the good work and thanks for sharing the adventure with us!
Brandon
You are never too old to have a happy childhood. ;D
Well this was a weird day, work wise. I stuck to the plan and got in the shop around 7, but I had strict instructions to quit by 10. I nailed up that sister header, first with some 4"nails the old fashioned way, then with the air nailer for good measure. Then started the swale trim on the shelf. Because you can't buy joist hangers for full sized lumber and because those joists are way too heavy to hold in place to be nailed square and true, I came up with the idea to screw a 2x2 'shelf' on the bottom of the header to set the joists on. This means the top edge of that shelf has to be true if the joist top is to match the header when you set the joist. I mark the bottom edge location of each joist and then make sure the shelf hits the mark on each one as I go down the length and screw it in. Last time I bought KD 2x2 for this. This time I made full sized ones. So I spent the morning working on the first one. I power planed it to make it look clean, then I had to match that swale which took pretty much the same amount of time as the headers.
This photo shows the trimming over the door and if you look close you can see the radial swoop.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3452.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1577495475)
Then I pre-drilled holes every 16" so there would be a screw under each joist. I kind of hit a bump when I came up against driving the screws into hardwood. Easy fix, I just have to back up and punt but I looked at the clock and I was out of time. Happy wife, happy life, so I shut down and came in for an early meal before we headed out for the day.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3450.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1577495489)
This photo (above) shows the header arrangement with the shelf not yet secured. By the way Brandon, I use the planer technique because it was easiest and looked good because it fades in and out. Also, I have never tried that before, so I figured it was time. It had nothing to do with stress concerns. If square corners would have made a difference here I would be WAY too close to working limits. As it is, I am way over. I have one full 2x10 bolted to the wall, then a second 2x10 nailed to the first. That notch wouldn't mean anything. When I get done, this will feel like a cement floor. ;D
Anyway, we followed the plan outlined above, saw the new Star Wars movie, hit the barn (I bought an old hook from a peavy to make a MM log turner assist with and some railroad spikes for another project). We picked up lunch/dinner on the way home and ate at home, but then I got off track. I planned to go out in the shop and work the evening, but I sat in my chair for a few minutes and wound up taking a 2 hour nap. I guess I needed it. Now I cant wake up and surely don't feel like going to work. I don't even feel like getting wood from the pile and filling the stove. So I am taking the night off and will hit it hard in the morning, I have to make up a little time.
Tomorrow is another day, right?
For what it is worth, my son looks dubiously at my work and has for years! :D He's a professional civil engineer.....
Quote from: SawyerTed on December 27, 2019, 08:48:18 PM
For what it is worth, my son looks dubiously at my work and has for years! :D He's a professional civil engineer.....
Well that could be read one of two ways..... I get a kick out of his questioning, but he has pretty much giving up. Nothing surprises him anymore... hardly.
:D It's just what sons do, I think. My daughters are relatively ruthless on their old man too! :D
Man, it's starting to feel like all I do is work on this loft, every day all day. But it is coming together, I just keep jumping around a little. I figure I am around a half day behind my schedule at this point, but I keep moving. Today was a lot of over head work and my back and shoulders are reflecting that. Hardwood is heavy. I got all the long joists cut hung and nailed in place.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3459.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1577583841)
I mis-cut one joist (an inch short) which I can use for the portion over the stairs and I thought I counted one extra, but it turns out I was short, so I had to mill a log after lunch. More on that log and my scaling research in another post to follow. That took me up to dinner. After dinner I went back and started working on the big header. The issue with this was that I didn't have a helper to hold back against that big timber saw. So on the first end, I used my little crank fork lift to hold a plank at the right height and put one end against and existing post and pushed the beam up against the other end. Worked great. I did the end cut and then the 4" deep notch cut. On the other end I was working in the opposite direction, and had nothing to push against, so I hog tied it to another post.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3466.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1577583922)
That worked pretty good also. Again, I did the end cut and the 4" notch cut. Then got the smaller (normal size) circ saw and did the end face cut to finish the notch on each end. It came out looking pretty good and I am happy with the notches, no apologies. In the morning I will have to work on the rigging and figure out how easy this will be to move. If my plan works, I should be able to set this beam myself. But I have to do some cleanup first, the shop is getting smaller by the hour with all the scraps, lumber, tools, ladders, sawdust, etc.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3468.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1577584686)
All in all not as fast as I would like to be moving, but it was a productive day.
Quote from: Old Greenhorn on December 06, 2019, 03:47:41 PM
The columns should read as follows: Log#, SED (small end diameter), Len (Length), Doyle, Int1, Int2, and Int3 for the 3 different sources used.
Log# SED Len Doyle Int1 Int2 Int3
1 14" 12' 75 83 100 102
2 13" 8' 41 30 55 58
3 10" 8' 18 22 30 32
4 15" 12' 91 90 115 118
Totals 225 225 300 310
I am going to try to track this through the milling cycle so I can see exactly what I do get from each of those 4 logs. I figure that will be where the truth will begin to reveal itself.
OK so back on December sixth I made the above post. I have cut out a lot in the quote, but you can go back and look at it. The basic idea was to scale some logs and use the various scaling systems to estimate the amount of board feet. Then keep good notes as each log was milled and record the actual yield. I finished the last log today. I had to make adjustments on log number 4 (blue text are changes) because when I cut the log off the stem it measured and scaled up differently. I wanted to keep the results accurate. i added a column in read for the actual yields. SO here are the results:
Log# SED Len Doyle Int1 Int2 Int3 Actual
1 14" 12' 75 83 100 102 100
2 13" 8' 41 30 55 58 32 This log had defects causing loss, got some stickers which I did not count in the tally.
3 10" 8' 18 22 30 32 41
4 17" 12' 127 n/a 150 154 152
Totals 225 225 300 310 325
The scale sources were as follows: The Doyle scale was industry standard, all sources gave the same numbers. The 'Int1' came from a Norwood chart and was so far off I discounted it. The numbers don't seem to follow the calculations. The 'Int2' came from Woodweb's online calculator. The 'Int3' came from the forestry forum calculator and I find that by far to be the most consistent and accurate. The bottom line for me is that I now have a scaling source I can trust. Thankfully, it's right here. 8)
Anyway, I sort of promised I would share the results. Maybe this is of interest to some as it was to me. I like having numbers and calculations I can rely on and know if they will be a little high or a little low. This is big stuff for little me. :) I have simple needs.
Quote from: Old Greenhorn on December 28, 2019, 09:52:10 PMThis is big stuff for little me. :) I have simple needs.
I did the same for the first two years of milling for my cabin. It was interesting but time consuming. What I discovered is that I can do about 500-600 bd-ft a day by myself (depending on the logs), 750 on one really good day with good logs and 1,000 with a good helper. Manual mill with a SkyTrak to bring logs/haul lumber & beams/remove waste.
Ah yes, that is the next question for me, but it will have to wait for a while until I have some logs stacked up. For me right now it was just a question of figuring how how many logs I would need for a given BOM. Productivity estimates will come soon for me, but with a manual mill, I am dubious I can hit your numbers. :D
Man I am tired and sore tonight! It's getting harder and harder to go out each morning because It is starting to feel like a job. ;D Go the big beam prepped and the last header set before I called my neighbor for help. He came over and I had the beam on my lift rig in general position, but it was touch and go with the capacity of the lift, it's stability, and the height. We did a pre-job risk assessment, (if anything goes sideways: RUN!) and my neighbor played spotter because I couldn't see the ends of the beam. Alignment was tricky, but it went right in. I was just concerned about moving the rig with the beam at full height, it was shaky. Worked like a charm and I could have done it alone, but who would call 911 if it went wrong? ;D
The lift rig.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3473.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1577660818)
SO up it went and set. My neighbor left once it was in and I set to securing it. Those 10 inch spike are a bear for an old man to drive.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3477.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1577660775)
Got that done and set to finishing up the framing work. I had to move some electrical things around and relocate the air hose reel, everything takes time. But the framing was done.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3478.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1577660847)
Man, I am pretty happy with that front beam. It's overkill, but fun anyway. When I am dead or move on, I hope whoever buys this place enjoys it. I know I bought the place because of the shop building, I think somebody else will do the same.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3480.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1577660886)
I brought in all the wood I have for the decking I brought inside and piled and stickered on the loft. Looks like I would have enough it a did it square, but I know I will need more with the loss doing it on a 45° angle.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3482.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1577660906)
I also like the way it is shaping up. The old loft (built 2 years ago during Thanksgiving week) is going to tie in nicely with the new loft.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3486.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1577660947)
I can't wait to get this finished and start cleaning up, doing the railing, and hanging tools on the wall and moving machines in place. Just in time for the cold part of the winter. I do have to get more fuel oil. ;D
I am sore from swinging a sledge hammer overhead and a few hundred steps up and down the ladder whacking stuff in place. I think I am taking the evening off. :)
Quote from: Old Greenhorn on December 29, 2019, 06:40:34 PMI am pretty happy with that front beam. It's overkill, but fun anyway.
You can always use it for an engine hoist!
Quote from: ljohnsaw on December 29, 2019, 07:04:59 PM
Quote from: Old Greenhorn on December 29, 2019, 06:40:34 PMI am pretty happy with that front beam. It's overkill, but fun anyway.
You can always use it for an engine hoist!
For a small car maybe, but those turbo diesels are pretty heavy. ;D It is nice to bring in a lawn tractor and put a hook on it and get it up in the air to work on though. I could do it, so I did. I think the opportunities will present themselves as time goes on. When I fill in the grease pit right in front and under this loft I embedded a bar below grade to provide a winch point. That turned out to be pretty handy for pulling in dead vehicles, but it seemed silly at the time. I just wanted to try it.
Looking good glad you have so much to show for your break. You are making that shop awfully nice looking.
Quote from: Nebraska on December 29, 2019, 09:35:23 PM
Looking good glad you have so much to show for your break. You are making that shop awfully nice looking.
Well Thanks Nebraska. I had not thought of it that way, but your saying so made me feel pretty good. :) I don't like sitting around. I still feel that I am a day and a half behind my overall timeline and that 1/5 completion goal is slipping away fast. Not a big deal, just part of learning. As for nice looking. I am just trying for functional and useful, which it really hasn't been for me because it is so cluttered. I have to pull machines out to use them, then put them back. I can only do one project at a time because of that and it makes me crazy (OK, short trip, I know).
I have been breathing too much sawdust (yeah, I should try a mask thingy) and not sleeping well because I can't breath at night. So up at 4am again this morning drinking coffee. This will likely be a 2 pot day, given the weather.
For the first time in several weeks, I have no idea what I am going to do today. I am still trying to arrange for that planer, but the guy hasn't told me his schedule yet. I do have to re-enter and explore the wiring in the shop and figure out where that 220 circuit went to that I disconnected years ago. (The previous owner had run 220 to a 15a 110v outlet. When I plugged in a drill that thing sure worked well, for a while. ;D >:(. ) I have a lot of cleaning up to do before moving forward, so a full day either way, just not sure now where I will start until I get out there.
Well, it seems I have that same cold back that I got Thanksgiving weekend, but not quite as bad. Still I am miserable and could not get motivated today so I did mindless stuff. I swept the whole shop (I hate working in a pile of sawdust). Then I just reviewed what I had done to see if I overlooked any details. I never stuck a level up and checked it to see how I had done.
Here is the east to west level, not too bad.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3492.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1577757233)
And here is the North to South level, not bad at all.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3490.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1577757245)
I think I can live with that (I'll have to).
Then I looked around and tried to plan where things will go when this is done. Anything I did that created dust just made it impossible to breath. I was still miserable. Wound up taking a nap mid-day. The weather was miserable, rain all day, 1/2" of sleet in the middle, then more rain. I did some household chores but didn't get much done at all beyond thinking. I hope tomorrow is more productive. Still waiting to hear from the guy with the planer. Thinking on plan B at this point.
Short post as we will be leaving in a few minutes for a campfire and some fellowship with friends, maybe even a drink or two.
Still another drissly damp snotty day, ut the fella with the planer finally got back to me last night and I went and fethed it this morning. This thing is HEAVY. We laid it down in the traier and it was easy with the two of us, but when I got home, none of my close by helpers was available. I got it off the trailer in the laid down position OK, but when it same to standing it up, well I just tried to lift it and hurt my back pretty good (or bad, I guess). The owner said it weighs over 300# and now I believe him. So AFTER I hurt my back, then I stopped to think about it and I did it in stages with some mechanical help. But it was touch and go, I had the ends of the forks caught in by the very smallest of margins. I have to add the caveat: Kids DO Not Try This at Home!
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3498.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1577837275)
Sorry for the lousy photo, I only stepped away for a few seconds to shoot it and never checked for quality, I was pretty worried about this lift.
Anyway, I got it set and had to run out and get a matching line cord socket for it. It's 220V, single phase. Come home, wire a drop cord with the socket, hook it into the box, check for voltage and give the machine a quick test. By that time is was nearly 3:30 and I wanted to quit by 5 for a shower and dinner. But my son was in the shop rewiring lights to LED ballasts, so He gave me a hand and we ran about 250 BF or more through it on the first pass to get it all pretty even. Not quite as quick and easy as it sounds. Funny thing about a planer, it tells tells you repeatedly about defects in your milling skills. ;D I also got to notice a lot of wavy and non-square edges, I am going to have to figure a way to address that also I guess. Oh well, I wanted a learning experience and it looks like I have one. The planer works pretty nice and never stalled or bogged.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/planer.jpeg?easyrotate_cache=1577838010)
Assuming I can walk tomorrow, I will search for a helper and see how far I can get. Happy New Year Everyone! 8)
looks like a good planer.
good to hear, I thought the planer was tipping over! and who is the old guy in your shop? smiley_old_guy :D :D :D looks like it will be a great place to work. @Old Greenhorn (https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=42103)
Yeah, it's a good planer Richhiway. I am pleased with it, especially as a loan resulting from an accidental meeting.
I have had some 'iffy' moves Doc, but I have never dropped a machine yet, this is as close as I've come. Well, there was that one other time, but... Anyway, it works well and I may have a helper tomorrow afternoon not saying who but 'some of us' need some sobering time. ;D I'm a little worried about my back it was screaming all evening, lets see what the morning brings.
The alleged 'Old guy' you refer to would be me. ;D
I bet the grandkids will love the loft, and will have fond memories of working with grandpa in his woodshop. Sorry but I think you are becoming a woodworker! there are worse things... although cannot think of any just now. :) Best Regards, and happy new year.
He will be buying a planer before you know it ;D..
AN odd day today. The last few years we have been home early on NYE either because of winter colds or just because we are getting old and no longer enthused by the festivities preferring a quite evening with just a few friends in good conversation. This year, there was a new couple in the mix and we had some fun meeting up and exchanging conversation and some music. It went late. I was beginning to feel the full effects of tweaking my back pretty well and I took about 1/2 hour to lay flat on their couch and let it relax. While I was doing so, their pup, a lovable/powerful German Shepard decided that as long as I was laying there I could pull on her toy and play with her. She really is a gentle brute of a gal and she pawed at my arm to get my attention. She paws pretty hard.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3505.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1577919183)
She opened up a few holes and it would not stop bleeding for a while. I guess I am developing that old man thin skin thing. It was no big deal, just embarrassing to be standing there for an hour with a blood soaked paper towel. I finally taped the dang thing on and forgot about it. Wrapped it up more proper when we got home so I didn't get blood on the sheets. I am going to have to think of a good bar fight story for tomorrow at work, because folks are going to see this and ask. I don't want to blame that sweet pup that just wanted to play.
Anyway, we got home late and I didn't get to bed until 3am. I was concerned about the back issues getting worse, so I was in no hurry to get up. I figured rest was good for it whether I liked it or not. Turned out I slept until 11am. I can't recall when I have done that, but I guess I needed it. The back feels a little better today and I think it will heal up fine. But man, I got up really late and it was still overcast and snotty out. I wasn't really motivated and thought I would take the time to think, reflect, and tune up any plans I might have.
I had mentioned that planing your lumber brings to light all the weaknesses in your milling skills. Last night, even in the haste of trying to get the first pass done on all the boards I did notice that my edges are not square on all boards and some have quite a bit of wave. Yes, I know, if you have a planer (which I don't but there is one sitting in the shop right now), then you really need a jointer. Just on a lark I did some looking on C/L and found one about 50 miles away that appeals to me and is going for $275. I might just pull the trigger on it if it works out. I need to think on it a day or two. I wish I had some income on this stuff to offset these expenses.
So I am taking a beat here to figure this out. I could try to rig something up on my radial arm saw to resaw the edges, or I could try to bring them in with the hand power planer, but it is going to be about 500 linear feet of edges or more. I am thinking a jointer is the right thing to do. I could also just live with the edges as they are and try to mate them up as best I can at installation. After all, it is a shop floor, right? But then I thought "wait, you are doing this as a learning experience so why compromise on that, do it the right way." Then there is the FF axiom that keeps repeating in my head "Every process you can add to the wood increases it's value". (Not sure if that was Yellowhammer, Southside, or somebody else, but they are right.)
ARRGH! This thinking and reflecting stuff is hard. i decided to back up a bit and take my time, as I am working on stuff I have never done before and I don't have a Rabbi (mentor) to help me through it in person. So I went out to the shop and did a second pass on all the boards trying to bring them into the same thickness. One more pass may do it and they are all at exactly 1-1/4" now. Running the planer alone is a little tougher, feeding and catching keeps you busy and works up a sweat. After that I filled another garbage can with chips and reset for the next run. But my back was beginning to make noise, so I took a ride in the Mule to check the woodlot and swap cards in the trail cam. It has been over 2 weeks.
When I came back in and hung my hat where it sits, I looked at it and realized that the new hat I just got from Bailey's 2 months ago has already been relegated to "work hat".
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3501.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1577919209)
It's no matter. They don't make those crushers like they used to, sad to say. You used to be able to shape some character into them, but now they just take on funky forms and hold onto them. I miss the old crushers, these are just getting too cheap, with a higher price tag.
Back to work tomorrow and I am already trying to plan the weekends work. :D
Oh, and WDH, it looks like I may be buying a jointer before I buy a planer. Doc, I may be becoming a woodworker, but I assure you, it is by accident and I will never compare myself to those guys with skills and good tools.
Can't wait to hear your bar fight story. Better than trashing the pup's reputation though, and a good chance to spin a yarn. Should be entertaining for the people at work. :D
It would be easier to straighten those edges on table saw (with a little help from a jig) than the jointer, even if you had it sitting there. You do need a jointer one of these days, but it's not the best tool for long 5/4 boards.
Take any kind of board the right length that has a straight edge and screw it to the face of your deck board with the straight edge protruding past the wavy edge. This serves as a reference to run against the fence. Set the fence to the the width that will just skim the other edge of your deck board - just enough to straighten it. Remove the straight edge board and then flip the deck board, set the fence and run it through the saw again. Now you've got both edges straight and parallel. You can use anything for the straight edge board as long as it has a good straight edge. Or rip a piece of plywood or masonite. Anything will work. One screw at each end will hold it in place.
This works well when you don't mind making a couple extraneous screw holes in your target. Otherwise you can make a fixture out of masonite that goes under the target and has a couple of toggle clamps to hold the victim down. Not a bad thing to keep around.
This really doesn't take that long to do this way, and it's going to be easier than trying to run long heavy stuff over the jointer. I wouldn't want to do this for production, but I use it all the time for straight-lining stock off the mill, and I have two jointers.
(just a side note - I wish the FF dictionary had the word "jointer" so it would stop giving me the razzzz. :D :D )
Quote from: btulloh on January 01, 2020, 08:12:15 PM
Can't wait to hear your bar fight story. Better than trashing the pup's reputation though, and a good chance to spin a yarn. Should be entertaining for the people at work. :D
It would be easier to straighten those edges on table saw (with a little help from a jig) than the jointer, even if you had it sitting there. You do need a jointer one of these days, but it's not the best tool for long 5/4 boards.
Take any kind of board the right length that has a straight edge and screw it to the face of your deck board with the straight edge protruding past the wavy edge. This serves as a reference to run against the fence. Set the fence to the the width that will just skim the other edge of your deck board - just enough to straighten it. Remove the straight edge board and then flip the deck board, set the fence and run it through the saw again. Now you've got both edges straight and parallel. You can use anything for the straight edge board as long as it has a good straight edge. Or rip a piece of plywood or masonite. Anything will work. One screw at each end will hold it in place.
This works well when you don't mind making a couple extraneous screw holes in your target. Otherwise you can make a fixture out of masonite that goes under the target and has a couple of toggle clamps to hold the victim down. Not a bad thing to keep around.
This really doesn't take that long to do this way, and it's going to be easier than trying to run long heavy stuff over the jointer. I wouldn't want to do this for production, but I use it all the time for straight-lining stock off the mill, and I have two jointers.
Well I don't have a table saw, but I like your idea and could set up the radial arm saw for ripping and do the same thing. However, I has considered getting (a little) fancy and putting a 10° angle on the edge so that there is some overlap on the boards when I lay them down. I could of course do that as well on the radial arm saw. I'll have to think about that, Thank You for the fine idea.
And yeah, I have found a few words the FF dictionary doesn't like that are trade specific. I am getting used to it, but it does make me question myself quite a bit. :D
The redline on misspellings wouldn't bother me so much except I find myself misspelling words I always knew how to spell. I don't know if it's age, or too many autocomplete things in my life now. Well --- it couldn't be an age thing . . . :D
A fixture for your circular saw might be easier than running those long boards through your RA saw. Before track saws were around we used to make up a jig to use with the circ saw. (I still don't own a track saw . . . soon maybe . . . )
Take a piece of straight 3/4 lumber maybe 2" wide or so. Rip a piece of masonite that's just a bit wider than the piece of lumber, plus the distance between the edge of circ saw and the blade (the wide side of the shoe). Attach the masonite to the 3/4 piece with some screws - maybe 12" apart. (You can take a crook out of your 3/4 piece while doing this if you need to.) At this point you've got a fence with a masonite base that should be just a bit wider than your cut line. Take your circ saw and run it down the fence you created and you've now got a fixture with a fence a straight edge that exactly matches your circ saw cut.
Just sit your victim on a pair of sawhorses, clamp or screw the fixture to it, then run the saw down your new fence and you'll have your straight line. Plus you don't have to handle the heavy deck boards as much.
Not sure that 10 degr bevel is going to buy you much. In the summer the deck boards may be tight to each other, but for the rest of the year they'll gap a bit and your support will disappear. Plus the acute edge on top will be a weak spot and want to split when you run a wheel over it.
Quote from: WDH on January 02, 2020, 07:47:04 AM
Quote from: Old Greenhorn on January 01, 2020, 08:27:51 PM
Well I don't have a table saw....
What? ???
Yeah, only so much room to work with and I already have the RA saw. Besides, those things are DANGEROUS! Never needed one because I am not a woodworker. (I may have mentioned that before ;D :D).
First day back to work and it was a little nutsy. Got home tired but went out and did another pass on all the boards before dinner, then did another pass after dinner. I am almost there getting all the boards even and learning a bit about operating a planer. It's not easy doing 12 footers alone, but it gives me time and quiet to think.
I have been bouncing back and forth about getting a jointer or getting a table saw and looking at my wobbly plan for the immediate future. I think I have settled on the table saw to start, but it will consume a lot of floor space. Maybe I can put it upstairs? So I sent an inquiry off to a guy selling one on C/L that seems like a really good deal. We will see if/when he answers me.
No photos tonight, too tired and nobody wants to see big piles of wood chips anyway, although it was great fun making them. I need to get a snow shovel for inside the shop.
Quote from: Old Greenhorn on January 02, 2020, 08:59:31 PMMaybe I can put it upstairs?
You need at least 6' before and after the blade. Eight feet is even better... BTW, IMO, I think a radial arm saw is more dangerous then a table saw. But both can do a lot of harm when you get comfortable and complacent.
If you put your table saw upstairs, every single piece of wood or panel, has to be carried up there to saw it. I have limited space in my shop. I bought a table saw that had a good set of retractable wheels(casters) on it, so I could push it into a storage space, out of the way, and wheel it out when I need it.
ljohnsaw, any machine will grab you as soon as you make a mistake, saws just happen to grab harder and faster. Truth is when I was in college I had a job working as a company carpenter for 2 different companies in the same building making boxes, crates and fitted skids. I put many thousands of board feet through a 12" RAS and got a flat bed load every 4-6 weeks, plus plywood. I was very comfortable with that saw and never complacent. I would sometimes just cut wood, 9 hours a day, non-stop for 2 or 3 days before I started making the next order of crates. Better the devil you know that the devil you don't right?
Dakota, I have thought about that very hard and am not done doing so, but the bottom line is making it available to USE, not having it stored away requiring setup every time you want to cut something. Also I am not a woodworker (It says so in my signature lines) and my usage I expect will be fairly low. This loft build project is rare for me and I anticipate my table saw use will be mostly small stuff for rustic furniture builds. Keep in mind, upstairs is a loft, with open sides, shoving wood up there isn't really hard to do.
As john says this saw requires a lot of room, he doesn't even know it has extended tables on both sides and extended fence guide rails. so it's even bigger. Ground floor space for me is an absolute premium and I protect it with a passion.
We all have to make choices, right?
Well no response from the C/L seller and I sent him another note. Very annoying. Time to work on plan B.
I spent another hour or two in the shop tonight running the planer, I have lost count of the garbage cans I have filled with shavings. I was trying to get them all even with the thinnest board, but I have gone far enough. Of course as I was planing I was looking at my edges and getting disgusted. I have learned a huge lesson about paying attention to my milling. Some of the narrower boards have side bend (there's a word for that) and I am not sure what to do about that, it's pretty severe. Many of the boards have square edges and I can work with them as is. The ones that concern me are the ones without square edges. Given the prior advice (above) I will see what I can do with the radial arm saw. I guess that is the project for tomorrow. I may cut and screw the first few boards to see how far I get and work the pile down a little to see how much more lumber I might need.
Well, I wanted a learning experience, looks like I've got one, and THIS is why I am not a woodworker. :D ;D
why don't you just stack the boards in the mill and edge them? Should be true enough for construction lumber.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/35823/Screenshot_20200104-094855_Facebook.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1578149490)
Craftsman Jointer on FB marketplace in Sussex for a good price. I have tha same one works good, heavy duty. Might be worth a ride it's about thirty miles south of Monticello.
I whiffed on an online auction for a jointer two days ago. Got busy working and missed the close by 1 minute, had already found an after market helical head for it. Went for a couple hundred under what I had in mind. Oh well.
I got my 6x36 (maybe more?) Craftsman jointer for free off of CL last year. Passed up on another free one a couple months later. I moved up from a 4x24 Craftsman - so nice. Only problem is now I'd like a 8x48! (then maybe a 12x72...) ;)
@richhiway (https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=25823) I decided to let the jointer go for now and I am glad I did. Shop space is a real premium. I made and edged my lumber on the mill but a few boards have wave and unsquare edges, not good enough for the flooring material.
@Nebraska (https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=45256) Sorry you missed your jointer, I am still pursuing that table saw on C/L but the seller is pretty poor at responding. He finally answered me near noon today, too late for me to get cash, hook up the trailer and go see it, so I asked if we could do it tomorrow in the morning, gave him my number (again) and asked him to call me. No reply as of yet. ARRRGGGHHH!
@ljohnsaw (https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=20640) I think you should just jump to the 12x72 and be done with it. :D ;D
So I got started at around 7:30 this morning not sure where I would begin. But I rearranged the shop, stowed the planer and pulled out the RA saw. Started sorting my floor boards and realized not all of them had bad edges, in fact many of them didn't they just had side bend. So I started with the better boards and moved along slowly because I was checking every thing twice. for the boards that had bend I would screw a block down and use a bean clamp to pull it in while I screwed it down. This worked great.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3519.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1578179828)
I took 15 for lunch and got right back at it. The boards that had wavy or unsquare edges I found I could true up quite a bit with my hand power planer using the edge guide to keep it square. working slow and exercising patience got me some pretty usable results. I screwed up one board which really ticked me off because I thought I was being careful but I just had a brain fart and flipped it the wrong way when I cut the second end. I am coming up short on lumber anyway and will have to mill some more. I expected that but I had to get some of this completed so I could narrow it down. I still have several boards to fill in as I get closer, but I will still need some more. No big deal. I came in at 5pm to check in with the wife and sat down for a minute. It was at that point I realized I was pretty shot. My hands, back, legs, and shoulders were pretty sore. I nearly fell asleep. I guess 50 or 60 trips up and down the stairs took their toll. It was only a 9 hour day, but I worked non-stop and I guess I am past the days of rolling off the 12 hours stints. It stinks to feel your age.
Anyway. i got about halfway through the floor today which is more than I expected (considering I had no idea where to start when I walked in the shop this morning). I don't have the energy to pick it up tonight again. Tomorrow could be a lost day. The wife wants me to go to town to help with the food shopping, that C/L seller may finally figure out he has to call me if he wants to sell his saw, and I need to find a log (one 10 footer should do it) and do some milling.
Anyway, this is pretty much where I ended up.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3518.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1578179822)
I figure I need about another 50 sq ft of material to finish the deck. Pretty sure I won't finish it tomorrow. But I did this as a learning experience and mostly what I had in the way of lessons were things i had already read here on the forums. Raise your hand if any of these sound familiar.
1) the more care you put into your milling, the less work you will have bringing that lumber to the next value-added level. (OH BOY! that lesson won't ever leave me now.)
2) Having everything planned out to the final point makes things go much faster without second guessing.
3) doing things correctly and thoughtfully the first time is actually faster than taking short cuts.
4) When one of the 'journeymen' on the forum says 'you might want to consider...' It's time to stop and rethink what you are doing. Much of the advise I was given here I accepted right off the top and just did it. Some I waffled on, and I paid the price (mostly small things).
5) Take care of the small details and there are no big problems. (this one is killing me because I do this every minute of every day at work, but at home, not as much as i should.)
6) When doing flooring, all boards should be exactly the same width or exactly the same sizes in each width. I did some 4, 6, 8, and 10" boards, but did not consider if I had enough of each to do some full length runs. I also varied in some widths by almost 1/4" which is a killer when you are doing flooring. LOTS more work with the planer.
Anyway, it won't be done by my target date (1/5) but I am close. In spite of all the aches, i am enjoying how this is coming out. It is rock solid to walk on. This will help in the operation of the mill and making 'stuff' to sell when I retire. I also have not considered the railing yet, I will need more logs for that too. I have some material from the last loft because I never finished that rail and it will cover at least the front rails which are the main ones I am concerned about. I can't let the grandson's up there until the main rails are on. Now I can cleanly tie the two lofts together, as if I had planned it 2 years ago.
Progress is being made.
Learning is taking place.
Healthy work is being accomplished.
Looks good. What I was saying was to put the boards you are using back on the mill and take a little off each side. I think you will find it will square them up. Also a lot of boards get a little curve in them when they dry.
you get the wave as you are making the cant and hit a knot or whatever, then all the boards have that wave.
I have noticed that a lot of builders over cut, let it dry then put it back on the mill and cut to finished size.
Keep up the good work. Hope 2020 brings good health.
That looks really good, I am on today, so for myself all I got done for me was 14 10 ft 2x6s out of a Douglas fir log, they still sit on the mill because I finished with the head lamp a little while ago a d was tired. My last office visit was for a kangaroo and it was past dark when I got home. I will post a picture of it somewhere else. Yesterday started with a hedgehog, so why not a kangaroo.. Glad your project is moving along I hope that craig's list dude comes through with a reply.
Quote from: richhiway on January 04, 2020, 08:57:00 PM
Looks good. What I was saying was to put the boards you are using back on the mill and take a little off each side. I think you will find it will square them up. Also a lot of boards get a little curve in them when they dry.
Yes, I understood that, but it would put those boards at a different width than the others and when laying flooring that does not work. I just planed off the high spots and let it ride. For this project, I have no time to dry and re-saw. I am milling and nailing as I go to get it done, but trying some new stuff and trying to make it look nice. I would love to have that kind of time to wait and resaw, but that wasn't happening. The MC on this wood, I just checked it today, is averaging 20%. Higher than I would like, but we gotta do what we gotta do.
It's all about choices I guess.
Rough day today. Not a bad day, just not really fulfilling. I had a rough night sleeping last night and that cold that took me down Thanksgiving week is back in full bloom. I guess it is going to be one of those winters. I finally heard back from the table saw seller late last night. Around 6:30am the wind pulled a storm window off the front of the house, so at 7am I was out there cleaning up a lot of broken glass which took nearly and hour. Then I got the trailer hooked up and left at 8:30, grabbed something to eat and went and looked at the saw. It was as advertised, a simple 10" Rockwell with the extended fence. They had build a router table in between the extended fence rails and the router was included. Needs new wiring, no big deal, needs a new blade, they only had a fine tooth count for it for trim work. Not bad for $150. It is big for my shop and I will have to figure that part out. They did not have the miter square, which perplexed me. I will have to order one from somewhere, kind of need that. ;D Got it home and unloaded it myself (nobody around) and it wasn't too bad. I felt very run down and tired. Really wanted to go fetch a log and mill the remaining lumber but the wife wanted me to "help" with the monthly food shopping trip. That means I go and stand with the shopping cart and follow her around, help unload the cart onto the cashier belt, pack the bags after load the car, go home (picking up lunch on the way), then unloading the stuff into the house. I don't feel like I do anything but burn up 2 hours until it comes to helping her unload at home, which I do whether I go or not. Today was worse because I had these coughing fits the whole time we were in the store and it was embarrassing and it got bad to the point I started gagging. I could not get out of there fast enough and was miserable. Anyway, we came home, unloaded, ate, and I went out and grabbed the Mule to go on a log hunt. It's windy and still nasty and I was not in the mood. I was pushing myself. I was looking for a 10 footer but no joy. Finally found a 9 footer I had forgotten about it's an ash and as I recall it had some growth stress in it, but we will see. This would is not going to be long between milling, planing, and screwing down. Well, I got the log up and rolled it on the mill, but still I was feeling poorly and could not bring myself to start milling. I felt like (fill in the blank). So I went in the shop and laid a few more boards, but my lumber variety is getting low and I decided I did not want a lot of end joints. So I took a pause and thought it through and decided I would put a hold on the progress until I made more lumber and could do a nicer job. By this time I had a banger of a headache. I decided to bag it at just 4pm. The shop is cluttered with machines now, the RA saw, the Planer, lumber, and the table saw are consuming my working space and I don't like it much. I have no energy to fix it right now.
The old Craftsman 10" I picked up to replace my 8" didn't have a miter gauge ::) So I just use my old one. In the meantime, you can make yourself a sled. Get some thin plywood (luan will work) and a piece of nice hardwood. Cut a strip that fits your miter slot (needs to be a little thinner then the depth of the slot). Work it until it goes end to end with no hangups or looseness. I had to file the miter slot ends on my 'new' 10" at they were off a few thousandths in the width. Next, glue and screw this to the plywood such that the left edge will get trimmed by the blade and the right side extends 2 to 3 feet. It will also help if the hardwood extends 6-12" on the far side but flush with the near side. Need some really short screws. Could just glue it if you wish. This extension on the far side helps when you are trying to cut some really wide stuff. When dry, run it through your blade to make the left edge parallel to the miter slot and exactly the distance. Using a framing square, attach a "fence" to the edge closest to you, square with the freshly cut edge. Glue and screw. Now you can crosscut boards and sheet goods square (stuff that is too wide for your RAS). You can make some triangle blocks with your radial arm saw to put on this sled if you want to make some angled cuts.
I was going say make a miter sled too. I rarely use the miter gauge but use the sled often.
Well this cold really took me down hard. I was in my pj's until 2pm, that never happens. I didn't even have the energy to respond to anything here on the forums and I took a 3 hour nap between coughing. It's bronchitis but oh well. What are you gonna do? First time I stepped out the door was 10 minutes ago to fetch wood.
Yeah, the sled is a great idea, that is something woodworkers do right? Still the miter gauge seems for flexible and I will probably wind up with both as my skills and interest improves. Obviously did nothing today and tomorrow ain't looking so hot either. I just wanted to jump in here and acknowledge the suggestions.
I am now returning to my lethargic state.
Git better... soon
PJs!!! what no pics? hope you get feeling better. :)
feel better soon.
Well today was the best day of the week for sure, I am feeling a little better but not by much, so I had to force myself to get out and work. The temp went over 60 today and there is no way, sick or not that I am going to let that slide by. The shop is more of a mess with each session and I have to start working it back down to usable. I still don't sleep well at night. This week I was out of work 3 days, went in Thursday, and bagged it at noon on Friday, but came home and just took a nap.
This morning I got out there at 10, turned on the heat in the shop where it was much colder than outside. Then went out to the mill. I already had a log clamped up but forgot to level the pith so I did that and started work. I made a 10x10 cant and cut it into boards, also edged a couple of maple 5/4 I had left off the last time. Wound up with about 70 BF, more than enough to finish the floor. Since it was very warm I was working in a shirt most of the time, but the wind was about 20 MPH off and on. I ran an air hose from the shop to the mill and blew off all the previous frozen sawdust, bark scraps and junk that had been building up on the mill in the last few sessions. Loaded from the mill direct onto that little salvaged trailer, I moved the boards to the shop and re-arranged machines. It is like playing checkers now, with the new table saw, the borrowed planer, and my RA saw all cluttering the floor. It is making me nuts, but the end is in sight.
In this photo the table saw is under my butt (behind me). This is supposed to be a fully open truck bay:
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3539.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1578780122)
So I started planing, but it is quite a load on the back when you are feeding and catching with no roller tables. I think it took 6 or 7 passes on all the boards to match the working thickness of the other material. Last run through I stickered the new stuff to let the blade lube evaporate off. This log was ash and I used a heavy flow. Wood chips are really starting to become an 'issue'. I have about 5 garbage cans worth and neither do I wish to spend the time to load and haul them out, nor can I tolerate a 4" layer of them all over the shop. I was holding off for one big cleanup, but I don't know if I have anymore room to wait. :D Maybe I can sell/give them to somebody who raises gerbils or dare I say chickens?
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3543.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1578780194)
Anyway, here is the production for the day. Although I was only at about 70% of normal (which is 50% of what a lot of you guys do on an off day), at least I made some progress in my pitiful 7 hour day that wore me out. Tomorrow I hope to get that floor done now that I have material.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3542.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1578780127)
When I quit at 4:30, I came in a found a package on my desk that came in the mail. My wife asked "what did you buy now?" and although I had bought a miter gauge for the table saw, that is not due until Monday. As it turns out @Nebraska (https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=45256) had sent me a variety of dust masks including some nice N95's for me to reduce my dust intake. It was a nice reminder that I should take better care of myself and not breath all this stuff in when I have an option. Point well taken my friend. In fact I had just stolen one from my son's toolbox this morning, but it is a cheapy and I wasn't happy. The ones Nebraska sent are much nicer. I laughed when I saw the surgical masks because all my trauma kits have a few of these and I NEVER thought of using them. :D Anyway, it was VERY thoughtful and I am truly touched. Thank You. The friends I have made here on the Forum, both those I have met and those unmet have been wonderful people.
So it wasn't a real productive day, but it was a good day, and it ended with a bonus. Normally I would go back out after dinner, but I don't think I should push my luck.... yet. ;D
It was nice today. Fixed the roof on my drying shed that the tree fell on a few months ago.
Hope you feel better soon.
It only takes a few minutes to make a simple table saw sled, I use mine a lot. Just you tube it. I used hardwood plywood and an aluminum runner.
I also have a video on my you tube of a table saw lathe I made that will turn round legs for benches.
Quote from: richhiway on January 11, 2020, 05:48:05 PM
It only takes a few minutes to make a simple table saw sled, I use mine a lot.
I also have a video on my you tube of a table saw lathe I made that will turn round legs for benches.
Yeah, the sled will likely come in time when I get the saw properly set up. I bought a blade the other day and have yet to put it on. Gotta get it situated first, finish the loft, then play.
That jig you made for legs has been in the back of my mind for a long time, since you posted it, I think. That is definatley on my list. I am not sure if I will do it on the table saw or the RA, but I will do it for sure.
Tom,
You are very welcome, actually my motives are fairly selfish as I'd like to see this thread go on at least long enough your grandkids are proficient at felling and milling. 8)
Quote from: Nebraska on January 11, 2020, 10:22:46 PM
Tom,
You are very welcome, actually my motives are fairly selfish as I'd like to see this thread go on at least long enough your grandkids are proficient at felling and milling. 8)
Well, that doesn't sound very selfish, just considerate. I expect I will be around longer than the average person can tolerate. ;D
As for this thread, I never intended to keep it going more than a year, so I have to check the start date, but that is around the time I will cut it off. (April or May I think.) There is only so much drivel folks can endure. :D
Once again, thank you. I will be trying them out today.
(EDIT to ADD: I was fascinated by the shipping box you chose. What is Bovine-Rotavirus-Coronavirus vaccine? It's a little foreign to my world, not being a livestock guy. Does it taste like chicken?)
@Old Greenhorn (https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=42103) ....Just recycling... I think that box contained vaccine for momma cows to help pass immunity to calves via first milk. It is to help prevent neonatal diarrhea in its various forms,......or it was an oral vaccine that goes straight to newborn calves still for calf diarrhea, either way It is a serious herd health issue in cattle. Calves that get sick cost money and don't perform as well later on when they are growing. I seriously doubt either one tastes like chicken. ;) As far as the thread, yes I suppose you can only have one initial season. So you probably could modify the title a little going forward. 8)
could just add an s to season and make it pleural. :) @Nebraska (https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=45256) I think he is wanting a dose or three of the vaccine. @Old Greenhorn (https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=42103) might reduce your colds, and or diarrhea. :D . I am sure he will do what ever for a fellow woodworker! ;)
@doc henderson (https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=41041) Well the injection needle might be a just little big. ;)
Just in for a breakfast/lunch break and had to respond: Please don't send me any bovine meds, oral or otherwise. I will do fine, it just takes time. Really, I'm good, but thanks for the thought. Now back to work, this 62 degrees ain't gonna last long.
:D :D :D
OK, still not sleeping well or through the night, and the coughing, although less is still distracting at least. But the temp was just around 60 when I got up this morning, holy cow. Can't sit around and let that get away! So I got through my morning dreariness and got out there around 9am. Turned on the heat to take the chill off (it was still warmer outside than in the shop) and got back to laying the floor with those newly planed boards. Got the main floor finished and did the 'bridge' for the old deck to the new deck. I only missed on matching the finish height by a 1/16". I'll take it.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3552.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1578869487)
So my neighbor that helped set the front beam stopped in to see how it was going right after I did the last board and he was surprised at how well it came out. He was even more surprised to learn those old 'rotten' logs I have been cleaning off his property supplied 90% of the lumber for it (save the ash log I milled yesterday and used about 4 boards from). He said it changed the way he will look at every dead tree from now on. :D
I kind of like it so far.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3557.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1578869502)
The deck isn't what you would call a fine quality hardwood floor. My edges aren't really great, the face screws are pretty obvious. There is a little mismatch here and there. I tried some stuff on this just to understand the pitfalls better, like the opposed bias between the bridge and the main deck area. It was fun and came out OK, but not even close to perfect, so no close-ups of my fine jointing skills will be found here. ;D
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3553.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1578869454)
At this point my back was pretty tired. After lunch and a quick fending off of an offer for some 'special application meds', I got back out there and commenced to getting the total mess under control. I found a taker for my planer chips, but he could not get over today, so I made up 5 big bags for him and the rest went in the compost pile. I did a quick sanding on the floor to take off the screw burrs, blew the deck off and worked my way down the stairs and alternated between air hose and broom to do a first pass from the back of the shop to the front. This took quite a while and I still have to do the RA saw area, and then a full second pass, but at least it made it more workable and I am no longer wading through 4" of dust and chips. The N95 mask from @Nebraska (https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=45256) made this a whole lot more do-able for me. I would have let it sit were it not for that mask.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3562.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1578870504)
I know I need railing, But I have put zero thought into that so far. This will have to go up next, at least on the front, which will tie into the existing loft. Then I can do around the stairs and I want to think about that a little. I need to leave room to make a turn at the top of the stairs, so I may have to get a little fancy. I also have to re-do the top step or two on the stairs to make a turn left or right easier. Before, you could only go left.
So I could not muster the hours I would have liked to work this weekend, but progress is being made and I can tell you I am a fairly tired dog tonight.
One more thought to increase the working area of your loft. Why not make a trap door/floor? Have it hinge up to the right and it will become the railing when up but workable floor area when down? You'd just need to get some wood from somewhere or other ... ;)
Add a rope with a counterweight on the end wall to help lift it up. Put a cleat on the joists/beams and the wall to support it when down and use 3 or 4 door hinges set down so you are not tripping over the pin area sticking up.
yeah, that's a good idea. In fact my son and I had beat that one around a few weeks ago. I thought about it, but finally put that idea on the side because I would have to open the 'door' to get up and down, which means it's not very feasible for working project space and the whole counterweight thing consumes more space. Still, I kept it in the back of my head and this afternoon I came up with the concept of putting a workbench at the rail height (about 35") from the bridge to as far as it practicable without interfering with head clearance, perhaps another 3-4 feet. I have a small bandsander, a little bench drill press, some buffers and grinders that would mount up there nicely and be very usable with access from 3 sides.
Waddya think?
Quote from: Old Greenhorn on January 12, 2020, 08:44:22 PMWaddya think?
Can't quite picture it, need a drawing. But, I'm not thinking of it as project space but more as walking space like when trying to cut a big piece of wood. You could have a workbench along there that is no higher than your table saw. But with the "door" down, you can access the workbench from all sides and it doubles as an out-feed or in-feed area for the table saw, for example. Not sure what is on the other side of the staircase on the loft. Maybe a wall there?
Nice progress on that deck it turned out well. I like the work bench idea instead o f some sort of railing. You've got way more to show for today than I.
Quote from: ljohnsaw on January 12, 2020, 09:31:59 PM
Quote from: Old Greenhorn on January 12, 2020, 08:44:22 PMWaddya think?
Can't quite picture it, need a drawing. ......
......Not sure what is on the other side of the staircase on the loft. Maybe a wall there?
@ljohnsaw (https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=20640) no time for a sketch, I am late leaving for work (bad night last night). If you look at the 3rd photo in last night's post, picture that just to the right of the 'bridge' I add another platform, but raise it about 35" creating a bench. This will give headroom for someone coming up the stairs. It will be like a box with a top (bench) and open on the upstairs side. I'd like to keep the head clearance suitable for a 6'2" person, so no 'ducking' required. I don't understand your last question about a wall. The floor is all open space, but it is cluttered right now prior to re-organizing. Right now there is a 19" rack cabinet blocking the walk over which I am trying to get rid of. The stairs when you walk up, end at the back wall of the shop.
The more I think about it, the less I like the door idea, because if I get up there, close the door and get working on something then have to pee.... I will need a ladder ...... or a bucket. ;D I have yet to take any measurements to see how feasible this might be.
I grabbed some measurements before I left for work. Yes, a 'hollow' bench 35" tall would allow for a bench about 34" long (along the direction of the stairs). This will cover the small bench machine I wanted to mount up there. However, I realized 35" is too low and would have me working bent over too far. A 40" height is much better and it will let me make the bench about 48" long and still have good head clearance. This is more than I expected. I can also add some 16" or so deep shelves on the bridge side to store power hand tools in, which is another weak spot right now. I keep loosing track of them because they have no 'home'.
Putting a trap door in would allow me some 'off and on' use of the space, which is all dead air, but putting in the machine table will give me full time use and put utility machines available that right now I have to pull out and setup some place.
Yes, I think we have a winner. Now I need to find some more lumber. ;D 8) Looks I just cut myself out some more work. :)
Well, obviously no time to work on this today (being at work) but I did have some time to think about it. Back in '16 when I bought a prefab 12x20 shed to move a lot of my Dad's stuff into after he passed I was overwhelmed with the stuff I needed to fit in there. I was determined to make it fit and have it all usable and accessible. Shelves, benches, some small machines, cabinets and a lot of stuff. The floor plan options began to get confusing in my head so I finally broke down and made a solid CAD model of the shed and each of the shelving units, benches, machines, etc. It took some time, but then I could move stuff around in the model. Every iteration gave me new ideas and in the end after 9 different layouts I had a plan that I would never have guessed. Everything fit and even more, plus I still had room to put a lawn tractor in there to work on it. When you have the models and exact dimensions there is a lot more you can do than you think. Some stuff fit within an inch or less and looking at it I never would have even tried it because it sure didn't 'look' like it would fit.
I have resolved that I need to do the same thing here. It's a lot of detail work modeling everything, but in the end I hope to wind up with a neat and usable layout. So at lunchtime I made a sketch with all the basic dimensions left blank to fill in tonight. Then I have to measure up all the shelving and cabinets. Tedious for sure, but I am hoping it will be worth the time in the end.
This is good, because I was worried about running out of things to do. ;D
Short update, I spent last evening taking dimensions of the floor space and all the various storage units, shelves, etc. Some I really don't want to unload, move, and reload. I also measured up the 2 saws I want to move up there. Even though walking around up there is tough with all the clutter, the numbers showed that only 20% of the floor space is consumed by this stuff. It is just poorly arranged. So I have to make some decisions to get rid of stuff I have been hanging onto for a long time that I have never used. I already did one big purge 4 years ago. Time for a smaller one. I wish a lot of you guys were closer, I could do a FF yard sale. ;D
I also have to make a place for indoor storage of lumber, which is not yet included in the layout. I know as I progress with this in the back of my mind some openings will show up. I'll see if I can get the model started during lunch today.
Funny I never considered doing this when I decided to build the loft, but I guess I know this is the best way to approach it.
OG, it's shaping up real nice! I like the work bench idea instead of a rail over the stairs, more usable space! My only thought is vibration from machines or hammering, any thoughts on how you'll dampen the noise on the hollow bench?
Hope you get to feeling 100% soon. You do more at less than 100% than I do at 100%, keep it up :)
Brandon
Quote from: ManjiSann on January 14, 2020, 11:20:10 AM
OG, it's shaping up real nice! I like the work bench idea instead of a rail over the stairs, more usable space! My only thought is vibration from machines or hammering, any thoughts on how you'll dampen the noise on the hollow bench?
Hope you get to feeling 100% soon. You do more at less than 100% than I do at 100%, keep it up :)
Brandon
Yeah, I just work slower, but try to keep moving. ;D
Spent some time during lunch today working on a layout. This is only a first pass and it will surely change. I will spend time staring at the drawing and walking the floor before I settle in.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/floor.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1579024394)
That's probably pretty small, not sure how a person would make it readable.
Here is an ISO view.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/flooISOr.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1579024768)
So tonight my son and I will look it over and play the "what if" game. What you don't see included here is the rack cabinet, desk, and the floor clutter which I intend to remove one way or the other. :D
@ManjiSann (https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=46620) I forgot to answer your question, sorry. I have not thought too much about sound. I don't expect it to be a 'work bench' per se. I expect to mount up grinders buffers, a sander, and a drill press. I don't think they will generate a lot of sound, but it is something I will watch out for.
Of course now I need to make some 2x4's for the frame and gussets. We are getting some snow Saturday afternoon/night. SO we will have to see if I can sneak a log up the hill, I may go grab it one evening so it is ready for Saturday morning. Once that lumber is in the shop, I don't much care about the weather. Plenty of work to do in there and once I get thing 'sort of' arranged, I need to move the table saw and RA saw up there, probably in pieces. I need to keep my eyes open for some able bodied 'volunteers'. ;D :D
Well I got started last night re-arranging. My son was over and he looked over the first floor plan. He also got a good feeling for what, of his stuff, I expect to see removed to 'cold storage'. Mostly he was happy to see me making decisions on parting with some stuff that we don't need, and consolidating other things. This is going to be a long process.
As long as he was here, I took advantage and had him help me move that 5' rack cabinet I have been trying to get rid of downstairs. That was a bear, it probably weighs 200# and is bulky. I wanted it down before I do the railing so we could make the turn at the top of the stairs easier. It was touch and go for a little bit. ;D I moved the first set of shelves over to the new loft while I waited for him to arrive.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3566.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1579090493)
That yellow stack will be filled with milk crates for storage of larger items. We talked a lot about the options and had a beer while we beat things around. Today's versions of father/son time.
We(I) have quite a bit of work to do getting this organized and it seems like there are a lot of things I can't do before I do something else.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3563.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1579090517)
Yeah, it's quite the mess. If you look at the above photo, you will see a run of 1/2" EMT parallel to the rail post and running through that Becks sign from floor to ceiling. It lands right smack in this middle of the bridge. This was a boneheaded move by the previous owner I have been tripping over for 32 years. It has to be relocated to the ceiling. It powers the ceiling fan and will also power that new built in deburring/sanding/grinding bench I hope to build this weekend. That is a job in itself because while doing that I am have to relocate the fan by a few feet and I am not sure how to do that...yet.
Also a priority is to get the table and RA saw upstairs before the railing goes up. But I need room first. SO there is a lot of bouncing back and forth. I just keep moving forward.
AT least I did a full night's work for a change, didn't get in until 10pm. Wish I could sleep through the night, That would help. OH, and when I came in the house I got an email from a guy who is hot to get my rack cabinet and he has a truck, so it will be very easy to load. Big weigh off my mind and another 6 sq. ft. of floor just opened up. 8)
Off to work.
that looks really good. I tell people that if a messy desk means you a genius, then I must be "really smart". reading about getting big stuff up before the railing, I wonder if you want to make the railing removable to facilitate "big" changes in the future. you have prob. thought about it already. maybe your retirement job could be shop organization. :)
Quote from: doc henderson on January 15, 2020, 09:29:55 AM
that looks really good. I tell people that if a messy desk means you a genius, then I must be "really smart". reading about getting big stuff up before the railing, I wonder if you want to make the railing removable to facilitate "big" changes in the future. you have prob. thought about it already. maybe your retirement job could be shop organization. :)
You're right Doc, about the railing (not the genius part, for me anyway). My son actually mentioned it last night about using screws, and I made a note to do that, it's a good idea. My son is hot for me to get the rail up so he feels better about where his boys go in the shop. They are being raised like he and I were, being in the shop when work is going on and learning by watching, 'helping', and asking a million questions. :D
I won't do all the railing until all the big stuff is up, or down, as it needs to be. This will give him motivation to help, and also clean up
his stuff which is in my way.
So screws it is. I am also planning a mid-height rail for the youngest one. The rail is at 35" now so another lower run is in order because he could walk right under it, although he is very conscious of the rail. Within a week I should have it all closed in, except the stair rail details. We keep discussing the options on that.
Yeah, I could hire on as a consultant for hobby/home shops. I bet there is big money in that. :D
Maybe use some 1 1/2" sched. 40 with the next size up for pockets. Then it'll lift right off. Or stake pockets from trailer store if you want to use wood.
Looks good. Makes we want to go re-organize my storage. Trouble is, every time I do that I spend a lot of time and end up with 1.6% increase in usable space. :D Maybe I need to hire a consultant.
until the boys are bigger, can add orange plastic safety fence to the rails. As well as you get older and busier, the rail may keep you from getting comfortable and falling off as well. I like the three generation workforce you have, poss @Old Greenhorn (https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=42103) & sons. :D
Quote from: btulloh on January 15, 2020, 09:51:40 AM
Maybe use some 1 1/2" sched. 40 with the next size up for pockets. Then it'll lift right off. Or stake pockets from trailer store if you want to use wood.
Looks good. Makes we want to go re-organize my storage. Trouble is, every time I do that I spend a lot of time and end up with 1.6% increase in usable space. :D Maybe I need to hire a consultant.
It's so rare that I add/subtract a piece of equipment that I think wood and screws will be fine.
Organizing is tough and tedious work, make no mistake. But I think the return in time saved doing the real work is huge. Just being able to find stuff makes a big difference, but who wants to 'waste' a lot of time labeling all there storage drawers?
Yeah, you should get a consultant, Last time I passed through VA was in '86 I think. Maybe it's time for a return visit? We should talk. ;D
Quote from: doc henderson on January 15, 2020, 09:57:56 AM
until the boys are bigger, can add orange plastic safety fence to the rails. As well as you get older and busier, the rail may keep you from getting comfortable and falling off as well. I like the three generation workforce you have, poss @Old Greenhorn (https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=42103) & sons. :D
Not a bad idea on the fencing Doc, I'll look around for some cheap stuff or cast off's from a work site.
As for OG & Son's, I think I will wait until they are generating part of the income before I underwrite them. If they generate enough funds to support my retirement, I will give them the whole business.
I'd be tempted to make part of the rail a gate on hinges, you must have a couple of hinges in that stuff. :D
Put a pin in the latch end with a small padlock so no one can remove the pin with out authorization, A railing that moves unexpectedly is probably worse than no railing!
Don't sweat the clutter. I used to tell people "If a cluttered desk is a sign of a cluttered mind, what is an empty desk a sign of?"
Quote from: WV Sawmiller on January 15, 2020, 05:12:30 PM
Don't sweat the clutter. I used to tell people "If a cluttered desk is a sign of a cluttered mind, what is an empty desk a sign of?"
I HATE the clutter. Makes it really hard to work. Spent 2 hours out there tonight. some more stuff went in the dump trailer. My son was there for a bit and I got him to clean up a 'little bit' of his 'stuff'. I spent the whole time doing what seemed to be nothing. Moving this pile over there, then clearing that out, then moving another pile and when I quit, it didn't look much better. but I keep reminding myself I am moving forward, which I am. Tomorrow night will be the same thing I am sure. Removing dead EMT runs and stacking things in a more orderly and condensed pile. Eventually it will all pay off, I keep telling myself anyway.
Funny I had a stack of batten boards I milled up last winter and some odd dimensional pieces I re stacked tonight. HOLY COW that was bad stuff. Most of it will go into the wood stove I think eventually. What a difference between my 'milling eye' last winter and this one. The journey continues.
Just keep walking it forward.
Well, I think I am taking tonight off. I only managed about 3 hours sleep last night and it was a very long day even though I left work early, but thanks to an angel I got a scrip for a med I think will help reduce the cough. Oh, the thought of most of a night's sleep is almost too good to be true.
As it is, I did a days work anyway. This morning a co-worker approached me nearly in tears and desparate. Apparently a tree came down on the private road she lives on, her land and it is blocking the road for all her neighbors. She said the tree is 5' in diameter and she had no idea who to call to get the road opened up. All the big tree companies are tied up. I told her 'no promises' but we went in my office and called my son. Good timing, they were just between jobs and he could have one of his guys there within the hour, then he would join him when he fished picking up materials for tomorrow's work. I left work at 2 to go get my prescription and get it started, then headed over there. We had 30-40MPH winds all day today and the power company and tree crews were busy all over. Her 5 foot diameter tree turned out the be a 6' diameter stump with two 30" DBH stems about 90' tall (now long). Rotten at the stump in the center, but solid from 6' and up. Very heavy stuff. So I gave the boys a hand running the saw because bucking a tree that size is still tricky for them. They hooked up a winch and snatch blocks to haul off the road. All good and clear now. They offered me the tree but I told them I have no way to load them on my trailer. They are going to check resources about getting them lifted for me. ;D
So I am relaxing tonight to try and get back on track. I will admit that clone saw with a 28" bar came in mighty handy and worked very well. One of the guys from the power company working on clearing downed trees on power lines came over and watched me cut. He complimented the saw and asked where I got it. He thought it cut really well, and I was pretty happy with that stream of chips ripping off of it. I don't need therapy, I just need my chain saw. :D
Making sawdust is therapy! Spread over the life of sawdust making tools, the cost is reasonable. Fishing and hunting are the only things I can think of that rival making sawdust for "therapetic" (for fans of Andy Griffith) diversions.
I just spent an hour writing a post here and when I clicked post the system said I was no longer logged in and dumped my post. Tried a bunch of stuff cant retrieve it. but I have the photos in the gallery and the rules are I need to post them so here are the photos and cryptic descriptions. I am not going to re-type all what I wrote.
First, I made some shelves last night to use dead space and clear junk off the bench.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3586.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1579392394)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3584.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1579392319)
Thanks to @nybhh (https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=38169) for the lumber used in these, they are the drops from the roof sheathing he gave me for my mill shed last winter.
Then today I got the railing up.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3577.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1579392271)
I used a swooped piece of white oak for the interim barrier, rather than make it firewood.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3578.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1579392268)
The tie-in to the old loft looks good, but the new stuff is nicer than the older.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3582.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1579392394)
After the railings, I did the 'workbench/stairwell cover/ box thingy'. Using scrap plywood to sheath this in and will paint it when done.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3588.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1579392442)
Tomorrow I have a choice: either get this area ready for moving the table saw up in it....
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3596.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1579392519)
...Or I can take care of this electrical mess I have been ignoring for as long as I have owned this place
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3600.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1579392507)
We've got 5" of snow so far today, so I will either plow tonight, if it stops or in the morning and lose work time in the shop. Either way.
Sorry I lost the original post, no way could I save it. I thought it was pretty good. Just bad timing I guess. G'night.
Nice progress. Good way to spend a snowy day.
I used to lose posts that same way. Frustrating. I started logging in for 1 day instead of 1 hour. No more time outs and losing my post.
Before using the longer log in time, I got in the habit of hitting ctrl a, ctrl c (select all, copy) before hitting post. Then I could just log back in and paste the contents into a new reply without losing anything.
Either way will keep from that annoyance. It's frustrating to write a long reply and then lose it because the session timed out! Usually was one of my pulitzer-worthy efforts too. :D
Very clever idea, that workbench over the stairwell.
Quote from: donbj on January 18, 2020, 10:01:28 PM
Very clever idea, that workbench over the stairwell.
Accidents happen! ;D :D
Well that's a happy accident :laugh:
OG, I'm enjoying your loft build. It really is turning out nice. It has me thinking about something similar for supply inventory in my shop. It also might make a good bandsaw blade sharpening area.
Well yesterday I felt lousy and just went out to dress up the plowing. I didn't even plow around the mill, wanted to see if I get less ice by not plowing. If I need to I can plow it when I need to saw. It was only 5 inches, but it is staying cold around 12) at night, so it may last a while. I am not going out tonight either, full day at work with a surprising 'safety stand down' for 2 hours that messed up everyone's day (there was a very minor fire and somebody up the ladder freaked out). It's not worth the oil getting the shop up to heat just for an hour or so and I still need to take it easy. So I have been making a BOM for the electrical work, and doing some thinking. I went back through some photos and found this one, which happens to be exactly 1 year ago today.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF2135~0.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1579567680)
Although I didn't know it when I took the photo, it was this snow that shut me down until the spring. After that we got just enough snow to keep the skid road un-usable until spring. I had just cleared out any wood and tools I might need and brought them up to the shop as the snow was beginning the day before. This makes me feel good about relocating the mill up behind the shop. Now I can use the mill through the winter unless we get clobbered with 30" or something.
Well I have been laying low this week, I really want to kick this bronchitis/cold thing in the worst way. I feel like winter is half over and i still have a lot of winter projects planned. So I have been doing just an hour or two at night at the most. Last night I went out and stripped down the table saw. I need to go over it, rewire, oil, tighten things up, etc so i didn't mind taking it apart. I like to know my equipment and I found some stuff to fix as I took it apart, so win-win. Can't get it up the stairs in one piece anyway. I took off the motor, router table, fence and fence rails as well as unwired the motor. Now it's just waiting for some young and dumb helpful young guy to stop in for a visit and lend me a hand.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3601.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1579827190)
Tonight, I cleared out the table saw spot, mostly. Because I have not had time to finish moving stuff and I have wiring to do to the box/bench before I can make a proper top (I have a nice 1" thick Formica desk top I am going to put on it) and I have to build the shelves underneath. AT this point I keep bouncing back and forth not seeming to get much done. I move stuff over here, then clean the area, and re-stack somewhere else. It will get done but it's slow right now. I have a bunch of stuff moving out to cold storage, which will also help. So here is the saw spot ready for filling.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3602.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1579827238)
Then I took a few minutes to look at the bench and rethink. I decided how to do the shelves and will be pulling one piece of plywood I put on without thinking where the shelves would be. Also realized I had that nice top waiting to be used, so will have to do that. I might have to piece it. In clearing the floor I took 2 of the small machines planned for the bench and stored them up there for now.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3603.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1579827240)
Funny story about that little drill press. That belonged to my Grandfather, it's a little Walker Turner. My Grandfather was a smart guy, a licensed Steam Engineer, he had a few patents, could make anything or build a house. He did some work on the side in his basement shop for a guy named Tesla when he had a lab in Shoreham Long Island, maybe you heard of him? Anyway, my grandfather built all the machines in his shop. When he built his lathe, he started by making the patterns and had the castings poured, then he did all the machining. As I recall, it had an 8' bed. He did the same with his big drill press, the milling machine I don't remember much about, and he had grinders he made from shafts, pillow blocks, and spare parts. This little drill press was the only factory made machine in his shop. My Dad bought it for him in the 40's as part of a small contract job my Grandfather was doing for my Dad's company. Anyway, I have it, and it is one of only 2 pieces I have from his shop. The other is a small tool post grinder he made from parts. I love that little drill press, very delicate. Right now as you see it, it has a tapping head I adapted to it for running #0-80 tapped holes in a tiny brass job I used to make years ago. I did a full restore on it in the 80's and when I wipe the dust off, it looks like new. I will put the chuck back on it when I get things finished up. Can't wait to let my son use it. That will make 4 generations on that little machine. Maybe get my grandson's in on a little project and make it 5? I hadn't thought about that until just now.
Not really making much headway, but I just try to keep moving forward.
Looking good! Fun story about your grandpa and that drill press!
Brandon
Quote from: ManjiSann on January 24, 2020, 11:16:52 AM
Looking good! Fun story about your grandpa and that drill press!
Brandon
Yeah, I don't know why, but I get pretty sappy about stuff like that. My Grandfather died when I was about 6 and I truly wish I had some time with him when I was older to understand his life better. He started as a merchant seaman at the age of 13, spent a month becalmed in the Indian Ocean once. Moved to the USA in about 1892. He built two homes for his family over his lifetime. Had the first house with electric power in Howard Beach, NY (batteries and a generator). Started a few business. Was a founding member and later Chief of the South Aqueduct Fire Department, and of course that stuff with the that Tesla fella all interest me greatly but is largely lost now.
But I still have his drill press and a few other hand tools and trinkets.
The more you say about him the more interesting he becomes! It's sad how so much history is lost.
It's cool that you still have some of his tools. Wouldn't it be cool if they could talk and tell stories?
Keep up the great work and the fun anecdotes!
Brandon
Quote from: ManjiSann on January 24, 2020, 05:40:53 PM
.... Wouldn't it be cool if they could talk and tell stories?
......
In a way, they do. They bring my Dad's stories to mind about my Grandfather, so in that respect, they do talk to me. And they help me remember the way both of them worked and approached things so much better than I ever could.
Anyway, back out in the shop tonight blowin' and goin'. I was getting frustrated that I am spending so much time on this little bench and other details that I decided to just whack it together and get it done tonight. It looks lousy, but it's very functional and when I paint it, it should look better. Except for the 2x4's I milled for it, everything else is scraps, including the Formica top. Some is 1/2" ply, some 3/4", and some 1". I don't really care. I need to get rid of the scrap and the bench is more than solid. It will work just fine.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3617.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1579916799)
I got all done and when I was walking down the stairs I clearly noticed that in my haste, I messed up and one shelf strap is 1" higher than the other. (It's hard to tell when you are working upside down.) So I'll have to re-do that one strap tomorrow. I just laughed at myself. Slob.
The view from above now shows the shop as a pig sty. The mess has got me frustrated. This should be a clean open bay.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3616.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1579916879)
Upstairs is even worse. All this stuff needs to be organized, both the back half....
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3620.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1579916853)
And the front half...
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3622.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1579916909)
I started this 'little project' thinking I could get it done over the holiday break. Now it is looking like my whole winter project. Not what I planned. I have work to do. ;D Tomorrow I will paint that bench because I don't really like looking at it the way it is. Then I will start to get wiring to that bench and maybe start moving the little machines on it. Wiring all that stuff in will kill time, and I have stuff to move out to cold storage too. We will see how much rain we get. Maybe Sunday.
While we were working last week and looking at the layout, I came up with an idea for lumber storage that would also use dead space similar to that box/shelf/stair cover thingy. Gotta make some more lumber for that. Need to finish this first, but that would be a huge help.
It just seems like it never ends. I desperately want to get some of my drying slabs in the shop and start MAKING stuff.
you may not want to eat off the floor, but that is a shop that work is getting done. genius!.
OG, Doc is right, that is a shop that work is getting done!
You've been a bit under the weather and yet you're still making amazing progress, seriously give yourself a pat on the back or a high five or both. It looks great and you did it all yourself. There's not 1 man in 10 these days that can pull off what you're doing or is even willing to try. It's frustrating to have a time frame in mind and not meet it, believe me I understand that (its why I stopped guessing when I'd get my basement done, it'll get done when time, energy and money allow.) I know you've got things you want and even need to get done but try and relax and enjoy the ride and take some time to look at all you've done and feel dang good about it my friend!
I wish I lived closer to you, I'd be over there helping you because dang you've got some drive and some skill and now some really cool stories about your grandpa that'd be worth all the work just to hear (can you tell I like a good story about how it used to be back in the day :))
Anyhow, sorry, don't mean to be on a soap box or preachy, just hate seeing a friend so frustrated.
Keep up the awesome work and stay safe my friend.
Brandon
I just read the "caution" tape. very funny! " danger men playing" smiley_carpenter_hit_thumb :) :) :)
Of course, you are right Brandon. It's just what I do, I beat myself up to keep myself moving. It's part of my process. ;D I have to remind myself I am lucky I have that work space. After 30 years I am finally getting it close to what I planned the week we moved in. That loft I am working on now has been on my mind for all that time and very shortly I will be actually using the space 8). It just seems to be taking too long, that's all.
Good Lord, you are lucky you don't live closer, once i start telling stories it's hard to know when to stop. :D I have done a lifetime worth of dumb stuff. Well, it's time to get back there, fire up the heat and do the two things I hate to do most besides spackeling: Painting and wiring. Hope I don't run out of oil again.
Doc, I was wondering if anybody would catch that. I have had that roll for about 10 years waiting for the right application. Seemed like the time.
I like it, the yellow tape. ;D
Well today was a long 10 hours of doing stuff that doesn't really show but needs to be done. First I fixed the cock-eyed shelf. Then I got out the paint (thought I had white, wound up with grey from the previous loft job) and I painted the bench inside and out. I hate painting. Ran out of fuel (for heat) when I finished, so I went out and got more so it would dry properly. It does look a little better. Note the EMT coming up from the floor I have mentioned before. That was the next task, one that I dreaded.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3630.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1579998903)
So I started. Geez, the guy that wired this place had no clue. Who uses red wire for an equipment ground..... sometimes, then it's black in other places. Then he has one circuit feeding through another box. Just trying to undo the damage. I spent as much time trying to figure out what he did as I did running wires.
While I was trying to parse all this mess out, the Grandsons came over and decided to build 'houses' with will the saw scraps from the floor and loft.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3631.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1579998921)
This one, the youngest, is going to be a plumber.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3632.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1579998942)
Anyway, I finally got that EMT run up off the floor and out of the way. I drop the control switch over the new bench and still have to finish the drop to, and through the bench. That is tomorrow. For now, I have the fan run up on the ceiling and everything is wire nutted off so I can run that fan to keep the air moving.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3638.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1579998993)
So now at least, I don't have that thing sticking up in the way and I can stop tripping over that run across the floor (who does that?).
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3637.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1579999602)
So I still have to put a quad box in over the bench and drop down through the bench to put in a box to hard wire most of the grinders, sanders, and buffers that will be hard wired in. I foresee another day on that, at least. For as hard as I worked I sure don't have a lot to show for it that I can see.
that looks like the place where young men get to know their grandpa. god bless!
Quote from: doc henderson on January 25, 2020, 09:51:33 PM
that looks like the place where young men get to know their grandpa. god bless!
It's either this, the sawmill, or the woodlot. I am not much on video games. Legos I can work with.....to a point, then I let them take the ball and I watch. We are still working on getting them to know the shops safety rules. NO running, watch what is happening around you etc with some success but it is a process. ;D
I think they would rather play with sawdust and wood blocks (with a toy dump truck thrown in) than most stuff. When we do a painting project, lets just say one needs to be prepared.
[edit to add]; Actually, I had to come in for dinner while they were cleaning up the mess they made with their Dad. They had my sawdust and chip pile pulled across the whole shop. Wonder what I will find when I go out there in the morning? Well, it was due for the next level sweep and clean anyway. :D
I had a 3 year old grandson help me once. Well more than once. One of my friends came over and we watched the grandson swept dirt INTO the garage. I can still hear that friend laugh about it. RIP Ron. I just laughed too. One good thing about a 3 year old, they can't move much dirt at a time and their attention span is short. ;D All that matters, he was having fun. In his eyes he was doing a great job and helping.
I do love having the boys in the shop. I believe it sets the tone for how you get things done in life, piddling or working in the shop and fixing or building things for yourself and family. Not playing golf or watching TV. However, a pre-requisite for that is that they learn the fundamental safety rules early and well because they are too young to understand the seriousness of an accident and I am not ready to demonstrate that for them. My son, being a single Dad with 3 boys has his hands full, but is doing a good job. we both stress often that when we lose it and yell at them, it is not because we are mad, it is because we are concerned for their safety, that's all. We still work on this all the time. For our part, we remain consistent in that rule and we don't yell, we talk calmly and explain things (over and over and over), but for safety, that is a different thing. We keep it pretty simple "stand right there and don't move until we finish lifting the truck and tell you it's OK."
Right you are, attentions spans are short, sometimes milliseconds. Constant repetition is required and sometimes this is tough when you are working on a problem that has you stymied.
But it is worth it. Small things make a big impact, and I can never figure out which ones. Last year I took a mostly rotten 21' pine log and milled a 6x6 timber to help in determining if the mill was cutting true. It worked out and I had the timber laying on the side when the boys came around. So I took the timber and laid it over another short block like a see-saw. They had so much fun with that simple toy. Every time they came over they kept asking where it was so I finally had to tell them I sawed it up and made a work bench down by the mill and showed them. But then they just asked when we could make another one. It still comes up from time to time. I guess I have to make another one when I tweak the mill as the weather warms up. ;D
Oh, and that sweeping thing, yeah, I see it all the time. the push broom concept takes time to perfect. The 4 year old still thinks it is a 'push-pull' operation. We are working on it because they know that before you leave the shop, you have to sweep up. Many times there are fights over the brooms, guess I need more.
what great problems to have! :D
Plumber!
Nothing better for those boys. You are a fortunate man.
Well, small progress again today (did I mention I hate wiring?). I had a rough night last night and was up for over an hour in the middle coughing and trying to get my head cleared out (I note there is very little activity at on the Forum 3am). As a consequence, I slept in...way in, and didn't get up until very late. Started in the shop around 11am. First order of business was to finish getting power to the bench and get that all cleaned up. That took an hour or two and didn't come out too badly.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3643.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1580082575)
Had a quick lunch and back at it. I dis-assembled the grinder bench that has been stuffed in a corner and unusable for 30 years. The wiring on all the machines is cracked and needs replacing. My Dad built that little bench and it was tricky to get it apart, he didn't waste any space. I carried everything upstairs and set it all on the new bench to start figuring out how to fit this stuff. The goal is to permanent mount everything and tie all the wiring directly into a box under the bench. Keeping it all clean and neat and uncluttered as well as usable. The only units that keep their lead cord/plug will be the sander and little drill press in case I need to use them somewhere else, all others are hard wired in.
Should be easy, right?
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3647.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1580082581)
These all have to be cleaned up and re-wired first, then mounted. I need to add a switch for one because it has a line cord snap switch on it now, and I don't like those.
This will probably kill any evening time I have this week at least, and I am away next weekend for a festival. It should be easy just a little tedious. It's the 'uncluttered' part that may be a challenge. Lets see what I can come up with. I think I have a plan, but I keep getting this sinking feeling that I am forgetting a piece that should go up there. I also want a small vise on there too.
Looks good making progress, that set up will be really handy when you are done. I love the story about your grandfathers connection to a fellow named Tesla btw...I hope you throw this chest cold soon.
Hey OG, just wanted to let you know it is 3:00 am in NY and all is well on the FF.
I thought I read you were going to "hard wire" these tools but I see a double duplex in the center. I think that is good so you can easily work on or switch out tools. You stated you are not a fan of wiring, but wondered if you would want a master switch to that plug,(light switch) so little ones cannot walk by and turn on a machine. just a thought and prob. not needed. we are all just trying to keep you busy! :D
Quote from: doc henderson on January 27, 2020, 09:11:51 AM
I thought I read you were going to "hard wire" these tools but I see a double duplex in the center. I think that is good so you can easily work on or switch out tools. You stated you are not a fan of wiring, but wondered if you would want a master switch to that plug,(light switch) so little ones cannot walk by and turn on a machine. just a thought and prob. not needed. we are all just trying to keep you busy! :D
5 of those pieces will be hard wired in so that I have no exposed wires to collect dust/dirt/chips and tied into a box under the bench. I suppose I could add a switch, but the boys are really good with the machines, they just don't touch them. 2 units (the sander and the drill press will plug into that quad outlet) as well as a point of use light I put there after photos. Those switches, as well as the fan control (hanging from ceiling box) are unreachable for little hands. They do love to play with the fan control when they had access to it, so we fixed that. ;D :D Once I get all the machines re-wired, cleaned and bolted up I will think about that switch and where I would put it.
Looking good OG! Red and black wires for ground :o :o :o :o As a DIY guy I shouldn't cast aspersions on others but... well let's just leave it there.
I don't mind wiring, I take some pride and satisfaction that I know how (at least I think I do and nothings burned down yet and it's even passed a couple inspections so fingers crossed) that I know how to wire. It always cracks me up, I have 3 sub panels in my house, all installed by me. Do I actually NEED that many? Eh probably not but since I'm the electrician and it only costs me supplies I did it and I think it will pay dividends in the future. Each room has at least one circuit, the office has two and all the lights are on their own circuit with the plugs on theirs. I hate when multiple things that to me don't go together end up on a circuit... breakers are dirt cheap but I guess it costs money for professionals to do their jobs so compromises are made. Ok, bragging over, I'm just blessed to have the skills to do what I do.
Heh, sorry, ego hijack over. Shop is looking fantastic and I have no doubt you'll be super grateful you put in all this work down the road!
I'll add my sentiments to Nebraskas, hope you get feeling better soon my friend!
Brandon
Quote from: Old Greenhorn on January 27, 2020, 09:30:07 AMI will think about that switch and where I would put it.
Put right up there with the fan control! Have it cut power to the quad box and all the hard wired stuff. Done!
I am the same. I have to be in the mood for wiring. when i wire plugs, I use a 20 amp breaker and a 12 g wire, with usual 15 amp plugs. this way you can operate more than one tool on the same circuit. i am about the only person i trust, and have redone a few "professional" jobs.
Quote from: ljohnsaw on January 27, 2020, 02:12:08 PM
Quote from: Old Greenhorn on January 27, 2020, 09:30:07 AMI will think about that switch and where I would put it.
Put right up there with the fan control! Have it cut power to the quad box and all the hard wired stuff. Done!
I don't have room for any more 'stuff' in the quad box (BTW, have you noticed none of the box stores carry 4" box extensions?) and I am already past that, not going back to it. ;D
If I do switch it, it will be someplace on the bench the boys can't reach of find. Besides, I want to keep the quad powered up in case I want to leave a small fan running or something for drying paint or finish work up there.
Like Doc, I have to be in the mood for wiring and these days, I am not in the mood because I am looking at so much of it in front of me. After 32 years I have yet to hook up my rotary phase converter and get my 3 phase machines operational, I am still waiting to get in the mood. ;D :D
Not much got done last night. I was out rewiring motors when I got a phone call from my cabinet maker buddy. I had called him last Wednesday see about returning his timber saw (see above) and another unrelated piece of business. He didn't answer and I left a voice mail. Figure he was busy and would call me the next morning. He didn't call back and I had a note in my head to try again this week. Well, he called and as it turns out, right a the time I called him he was busy.... having a heart attack. He apologized for not picking it up.
They put in 3 stents and he is home recovering and they say about 4 weeks before he can return to work. This really shook me up. We have been friends for more than 30 years, he is about 15 years younger than I and can outwork me by 30% on any given day. He was raised running a family orchard and learned cabinet making from his Dad and built a commercial cabinet shop. As we talked I got more upset that this could hit him like that. My clinical senses left my head completely. After about 10 minutes we returned to joking and poking at each other like normal. He said I could keep the saw for a while, he can't even lift it right now. I mentioned going to look at a jointer this week that needs a full rebuild so it should be cheap. He said "don't waste your money. I have a nice 6" for you that you can have". After we finished and hung up, the gravity of it all really hit me and I came in the house and told the wife while we had dinner.
Back out after dinner still thinking about Paul and I got another phone call regarding an unpleasant family matter I could not ignore. So I bagged working in the shop and addressed that for another hour.
When I went to bed I surprisingly had no coughing issues and could sleep. I didn't think it would last, but it did. None the less, I was up at 3am again with all these thoughts in my head about the family issue and my friend. The dreams were not pleasant. At least there was a lot more to read on the Forum this time. Went back to bed at 4 and now am really dragging and will be 1/2 hour late getting to work.
I got 2 motors re-wired and ran into issues of having the right screws for mounting. Maybe tonight I will get a little more done.
Sorry to hear about your friend.
Quote from: Old Greenhorn on January 28, 2020, 07:48:35 AMran into issues of having the right screws for mounting
What do you need? ;)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/30640/20180311_b.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1521518766)
Thanks for the offer, That's a nice cabinet! Funny thing about those screws. I measured for what I needed and decided a 1/4-20 x 2-1/2 carriage bolt would be best. What are the chances of finding that on hand? Well, I had a whole box (100). But for some reason, those bolts (galvanized) won't take my 1/4" nuts (nickel plate) for some odd reason. (yes, same pitch.) I checked the nuts against other bolts and they fly on. Not sure what is up with these bolts and before I could figure it out, the phone started ringing. Maybe that's why I had a full box? Somebody else couldn't use them either? ;D
Quote from: Old Greenhorn on January 28, 2020, 10:07:01 AMThat's a nice cabinet!
Thanks. The longer 1/4" carriage bolts are in a different cabinet. Funny thing, that is an old picture. It is completely crammed full now. And that's not even half of my stock - just the little things. I guess you cold say I'm obsessed with storing every little nut, bolt and washer. But, it sure is nice not to have to run to the hardware store for anything from 4-40 to 3/4" in plain, galvi and stainless steel. Even a selection of metric.
When I get my cabin built, I'll be taking a healthy sample up there to have on hand so I can have some breathing room down here. ;) I picked up a big bag of SS 1/4" lock washers for free on CL. Either I have 10,000 washers to last my heirs for their lifetime or I'll make a chain-mail vest (they slip together).
OG, sorry about your friend, glad he's on the mend!
Hopefully your phone leaves you be for a while and you can get some work done :)
Brandon
can you hit the zinc oxide with a wire wheel. good luck. I just bought 1/4" x 3.5" inch carriage bolts for my corn hole game to hold/pivot the legs.
Quote from: doc henderson on January 28, 2020, 11:43:13 AM
can you hit the zinc oxide with a wire wheel. good luck. I just bought 1/4" x 3.5" inch carriage bolts for my corn hole game to hold/pivot the legs.
Yeah, I can. Just as soon as I get my motors rewired and hung on the bench and powered up. You see the irony here? :D
@old greenhorn
We get all our bolts in bulk from woodword steel and we have had problems for quite a few years with the 1/4 inch carriage bolts longer than 3 inches .My dad said it is from China putting too much galvanize on the bolts .the only way we can use them is to run a die down them .We have hundreds of carriage bolts with this problem . We usually just go buy more .
Zeke
Yeah, that's what I was thinking, but I didn't get a chance to confirm. Ain't got no time for chasing threads. ;D
Still dragging from last night. Took it easy, and out of oil in the shop again but it was 38 out there, so not bad at all for working. Grabbed some other bolts and finished mounting the one I started last night, and bolted up 6 of them. I still have to find the parts to make a switch box for the wire wheel and wire that up before I finish mounting that, but the frame is bolted up. The only thing not tied down is the sander. That will need all new wiring too, everything is cracked and dry. Cleaning also is needed and I need to get some belts for it.
First side (Grinder on top, barrel sander/buffer (beartex wheel), full buffer, and wire wheel):
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3654.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1580262619)
Second side (Drill press/tapper, bandsander, tool grinder):
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3652.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1580262616)
I am going to bed early tonight and see if I can't catch up on sleep and avoid the dreams that wake me up. It's like a cascade once it starts, first it's little routine things, and the next thing I know I am back working on an ugly car accident with multiple trauma patients in the snow. Comes out of nowhere and the only solution is to get up for an hour and drink water and look for a distraction. Doesn't happy very often anymore, but I think because I have been sick and have some unresolved life issues, it is taking hold now. Good news is that the cough is waning.
No pics tonight (you're welcome). I picked up oil tonight and got the heat running again. The temp is dropping, so that helped. I rewired the wire wheel and added a proper toggle switch. I realized I am not sure of the rotation direction on some of these units so I may have to move some stuff when I get them all powered up. I redid the feed wire on the band sander, made the wire shorter and gave it a new dead front plug. Fired that one up (I need to order some belts for it) and it runs fine, but the drive belt is getting stiff so I may replace that and while I am at it, play with the pulley size to get a little more speed on the abrasive. I also removed that tapping head from the drill press and (amazingly) laid my hand on the original chuck on the first search and re-installed it. That too needs some TLC with oiling everything to free it all up some cleaning of the moving parts to make it smooth. I keep thinking I did full rebuilds on all this stuff, but I also keep forgetting I did it well over 30 years ago. Then my son dropped by to see how it was coming and I spoke the 6 words he must hate to hear: "Hey, as long as you're here....." (My Dad said that EVERY time I stopped by after work and it usually meant getting into whatever project he was working on that day, missing dinner, and getting my wife really mad at me. I try not to be quite that bad. And no, I never minded helping Dad, he didn't ask unless he couldn't do it alone, which made for a short list.) So while he was here, we moved the table saw upstairs. It's still apart. Not quite ready to move the RA saw yet. So I also have to rewire the TS, but probably next week. I don't expect to get much done tomorrow night. I have to go fetch my granite surface plate which was on loan to the shop I was teaching classes at for the last couple of years. They have a big project and my plate is in their way. Not sure where I am putting that. The plate is a small one only 90# or so and is on a steel stand. I had steel wheels they were supposed to weld on it for the class so I could move it around, but they never did. They might do it tomorrow as a 'thank you' for the loan. Either way is fine. I have moved that all over by myself many times, but it will take some space I hadn't figured on. Can't decide if it goes upstairs or down and I need to make a cover for it (which has been on my chore list since I bought it in 1982 ;D). Anyway, by the time I pick that up, get it home, unload and move it, a lot of my time will be shot and I have a music festival this weekend that I have not started my prep work for yet, I lead the First Aid/EMT staff and help with setup, breakdown, security issues ad a bunch of other little stuff. Plus, I need to pack my gear. I have to be there by Friday noon. So probably I won't get back out in the shop until next week.
All this wiring is tedious but has to be done. On the TS I have to do a lot of cleaning and polishing moving parts as I re-assemble it. I want things to run properly. I also have to re-do some of the work the prior owner did in a more professional manner.
As I am getting close to the end of this project I am beginning to work on the plans in my head for the next, and final 'mini-loft' which will be a lumber storage area over dead airspace in the shop I mentioned a week ago here. Haven't even sketched anything or taken dimensions yet and I will need logs I don't have, but we will work toward that as time goes on. This will free up more floor space and give me a place to put up the lumber for the winter projects and get another level of air drying out of it. Also trying to figure out where I will put this jointer I am getting in a month or so.
And now for something completely different (sort of):
SO I had this festival I 'work' every February and as I packed my gear Friday morning I realized if I stick to my plan, this will be the last fest I work before I retire. No more taking vacation days and having to trudge into work and the real world on Monday morning again. I kind of relished that thought and carried it most of the weekends. Things will (hopefully) be very different in the coming year. Setup went very easy and mellow after 6 years of our team working together. So I had some time to check on non-fest projects at the Ashokan center with extra time on my hands. I walked down and checked on some stuff I have planned for the spring.
I am still thinking about how to attack this hickory:
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3662.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1580677827)
Then I still have that RO storm fall to finish off. The challenge at this point is to figure out how to get this home to the mill. I have figured out how to cut it several months ago. I met their educational director (nice older fella, like me) and I offered the idea of making a 10" thick cookie table from the butt of this tree that they could put along a trail that they use for educational walks and put a timeline on it for the kids to count rings and connect to the local history that was happening as the tree grew. He loved the idea and by Sunday when I was leaving, we were up to making two, one for the science side of it for the educational programs, and another for the general public visitors that come for other events to be displayed in a more central area. There is a special Ash that they also I have I need to look at which they figure is over 100 years old they would like to do a similar thing with. I think the stem is close to 40" diameter.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3663.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1580677779)
I also checked the bridge work we did back in early August, all those mortise and tenon joints seem to be holding up OK.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3665.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1580677859)
So the fest took off, and mid-day on Saturday our ice sculptor showed up and created this piece. It's a little hard to tell from my poor photos, but this is a pipe organ with a double mushroom seat, mushroom pipes, and the owl relief carving on the front and a different owl on the back.
This is the front with a fleece on the seat. (Lots of folks were taking posed pictures and a few performers were doing shoots for future album covers or whatever.)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3671.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1580678203)
And the keyboard detail:
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3672.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1580677974)
ANd this is the back, almost a separate piece of work:
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3670.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1580678337)
This fella does nice work every year for us. The kids (big and small) love to watch him work. Last year it was about 18° when he started and dropped to about 2° by midnight, this year, it was 35° and stayed warm overnight. So herein lies the challenge. Normally everybody just lets these things melt. We don't. We run 2 festivals a year. The next one is in August (not a real good time for ice sculpting). We bring this back out in August and set it at the top of the hill behind the main stage in front of the fire where we have the late night song circle and THEN we watch it melt (which can take all night and more). So we had to get this thing into the freezer today. It weighs well over 1,000#. We had thought the artist had left and we tried to figure it out ourselves. I started with the chainsaw after much discussion. After two opening cuts, the artist drove past and saw what we were doing. He smiled, parked and came over. (Boy was I glad, I had no idea what we were doing). He looked it over and the stuff we were trying to cut apart he could take apart with an 8" ice pick and a little tweak. I felt stupid. He advised that it was too dangerous to move and to just let it go back into the ground. He started pointing out the weights of various sections, the condition of the ice, and how far we had to move it (about 300 yards) over mostly rough muddy ground. We listened to all his sage words, asked some questions, agreed with his advice, and decided we were going to move at least the section above the keyboard and save it for August. The facility Chef wanted the 3 mushroom pipes on top and the mushroom bench. The artist laughed and said we had a 20% chance of getting that section to the freezer in one piece. (I think I heard one guy on our crew mutter "hold my beer".) Anyway, with due caution and pre-briefings in case of ice failure we got it down and eventually into the freezer with no mishaps or loss. We (I) will probably build something out of timbers to get it high enough off the ground in August to look good up on the hill (Yes that move is also a challenge, about 3/4 mile). Sorry, not photos of this move, but my hands were busy, wet, and cold, and my brain was a little stressed. Next year, I think I might build a timber skid for him to build his work on, then we can drag the whole thing in the freezer.
In talking with the sculptor I learned he also works in wood. So I will look for a nice tree for him to work on in August. ;D
So strictly speaking, this post doesn't relate to my milling year, but it does relate to those things that influence me in my pursuits and interests and what drives where I am going and what interests me. It's the place I see, learn, and discuss things with folks I like a lot. We try to cultivate a safe place for the kids to run free and safe and learn new things. It occurs to me that it also provides a similar experience for adults that are open to such things. I have met and engaged in long conversations with folks that are so dissimilar to me and I would never meet anyone like that anywhere else and share a conversation over coffee with them. So it's all good. Now I am sitting here writing this and listening to all the music I missed over the weekend via the recorded live streams, which is also pretty neat. Turns out, we put on a heck of a show. ;D :D :)
Wow, no updates from me all week. Hope y'all enjoyed the break ;D.
Truth is I have been laying low because I am tired of being sick. Coughing reduced considerably this week and sleep is slowly improving, but I have been dealing with a family issue that is both distracting and upsetting which has me 'off my feed' and it's hard to focus on my own stuff. Also, that bench wiring was not something I looked forward to at all. I poked at it a little each night, but its a lot of tedious stuff working overhead so I would mix in other things. I finally finished it last night and fired those machines up (carefully) for the first time in about 33 years. Everything works. I have one wire wheel that I have to flip because it turns the wrong way, no photos today, sorry. I now need to replace wheels and stuff like that (a sanding arbor, burring wheel, sanding belts, etc) to get it all in top shape, but that can be done as time and money permits. I took one evening and worked on the layout and BOM for the last loft (lumber storage area) and worked it down to how many logs and sizes I would need and sent out an inquiry or two for logs. (I am learning that log foraging and fetching is taking more and more of my time.)
Today was a lot of boring fill in work: moving stuff upstairs, cleaning downstairs, and I moved a lot of stuff out to my cold storage 'hut'. Took a drill press apart and when my son stopped in, we got that upstairs and back together but one of the tables (I have two on that one) is frozen and I continue to work on freeing that up.
All in all although I hit no real milestones, the shop is beginning to look like a shop and I can begin to see some space opening up that I can actually do project work in. For me, this is huge.
I figure the last loft will take two weekends, one to make the lumber, and one to build it with a couple of evening thrown in for hanging that first header against the head-wall. Let's see if I can finally hit a goal. ;D But that is not urgent, waiting on the logs.
I took a look at some slabs I cut last summer and they are looking like they are ready to make something out of, so the juices are beginning to flow. :) Gotta get some of that moved inside.
Tomorrow is more general work cleaning up and putting things away. But it is coming along, just wanted to check in here.
sounds like the rest of us. occasionally I start a project and it goes faster than expected. always nice, but not frequent. the log acquisition is like a pipeline. once you get it going, it is hard to stop. I have been "putting it out there" for about 7 years. My wife asks, "do you really need that log?" but I hate to send something to the landfill, if I can at least burn it some where, even if just for pleasure say at a campout. I make every effort to take something, even if I do not need it at the time, as to not shut off the pipeline. I usually find a project for each one. I prob. have 100 millable logs in my yard. and a hobby guy living in the city limits on 3 acres. good luck, and be careful what you wish for.
well Doc, I am not looking for leftovers for this one. I sent a note to a logger/heavy equipment guy down the road. Not sure which type of work he is focused on right now. My request was specific for 6 logs, 2 of which were 12' the others 8' plus trim. 14" average SED. I didn't hear back, but that doesn't mean anything with this guy. I might come home Tuesday and find them in the driveway then it will take me months to catch him and pay him, IF he can decide on a price. Another guy, I just met seemed anxious to find an outlet for Pine, so I asked my son to check with him and sent him my list. Lots of stuff to keep me busy while I 'wait'. In fact my wife is a little ticked I am starting another loft, seems she has some 'things' she would like me to spend time on instead.
Quote from: Old Greenhorn on February 08, 2020, 06:28:35 PMIn fact my wife is a little ticked I am starting another loft, seems she has some 'things' she would like me to spend time on instead.
that is weird. :o :o :o (you can tell her I said that :D) most of the logs are what I want, just not at the time I want them. It works for me. and free. my goal in part is to find a use other than them burning at the land fill for no benefit.
Quote from: doc henderson on February 08, 2020, 07:28:35 PMmy goal in part is to find a use other than them burning at the land fill for no benefit.
The culture here is a bit different Doc. Most folks don't waste hardly anything they can find a use for. I only know one guy with a 'log dump' and that is from site clearing and excavation work. Mostly stumps and junk slugs. The guys I sent my inquiries to, for instance, cut firewood from their logs to sell (processors) burn the junk stuff in their OWB year round, and make lumber. They rarely sell logs, but don't mind a small guy like me with occasional tiny requests, especially if they can drop it off on their way home or back to the yard. Yes, I can get 'free logs' but they come with the usual price of pulling them out and transporting. Not my forte' right now. ;D
I know quite a few home owners who stalk the roads looking for trees cut up by the highway or fire dept that they load up and take home. Still it kills me to see all the down trees going to rot in the woods. Everything here is forest and there is more stuff than anyone can handle, but the good stuff..... gets handled. :D
I was out and about yesterday and passed a newly constructed mini strip mall. It appeared that when they cleared the lot they cut and neatly stacked 15 or so 10' - 12' logs. But it must have been a few years ago as they were beginning to rot and no way to get to them. What a waste... :embarassed:
when I lived in Albany, I lived at the twin oak aprtments, and down the stree they cleared land for an office park, prob. twin oaks. I spent many Saturdays going with my Bonco II and my homelite to cut 35 inch oak logs. @ 18 inches long it was all I could do to buck them, and get them in the back of my"truck". I could only fit 2 at the time in the back, and after I got 20 or so, I had a good stack of wood along the side of my apartment. then I could go out with a maul, and split away. I think neighbors thought the "Beverly Hillbilies" had moved in. smiley_hillbilly_tub_base smile_banjoman smiley_old_guy smiley_fiddler
OK, today I was alone all day, so no distractions and I was a tad tired from playing pool on the neighbors new pro table late last night (his GF is a touring pro). So I continued on the path of cleanup, fixing loose ends (I have about a months worth of loose ends) and trying to figure my next steps without falling into a rabbit hole.
First, here is that shot of the wiring job Friday night, I added that cutoff switch that was (very well) suggested to keep the boys from getting hurt. They can't reach it.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3679_-_Copy.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1581285210)
There was a hole through the bench area that seemed to attract the boys attention, so I closed that off. Thought I could also use it as another tool board.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3697.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1581285412)
It also provided a place to hang an all important safety sign that I keep moving around.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3699.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1581286849)
(Those should be the LAST photos of the bench you see, it's 'done'.)
While I was waiting for the paint to dry, before I could screw it in, I worked on freeing up that frozen drill press table. Got that done and rolled it into position, so this is the first floor machine operational upstairs.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3680_-_Copy.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1581285740)
Somewhere in between, I finally put a light up over the workbench downstairs because with the new loft it is pretty dark down there.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3685_-_Copy.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1581285308)
That's a big help, should have done it 3 weeks ago.
Speaking of Drill presses, I found this little guy as I was shuffling things around and cleaning. It's a shame it is missing the table and everything is frozen up but not badly rusted. It will be some summer evenings project to make it function again, but not now. I just clamped it to the rail to store it and get the kids to ask questions about it.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3689.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1581285933)
This little area behind the big lathe (downstairs) was just a cluster pile last week, but having gotten that grinding bench out of the way I can now store stuff there and it is accessible to roll out when I need it. This is a big deal for me. By the way leaning against the wall on the right is a piece of 304SS 1" think and 36" in diameter. Anybody have a use for it? Barring that, maybe some ideas on what I could do with it? It's a 'little weighty'. ;D
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3683_-_Copy.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1581285248)
This area showed up as a pile of 'stuff and junk' in previous photos. Now, although it appears cluttered I can get access to everything and walk around the shelves to pick and store stuff. (huge difference!)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3692.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1581285360)
At the end of the day I got a beer and looked things over. I decided that being able to see this much floor opening up upstairs is worth the effort and I can finally envision a 'work space'.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3700.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1581285463)
I still have a lot more to do and feel like I didn't accomplish anything concrete this weekend, but it is coming together. On the way out I looked up at where the last loft will go to fill this open hole.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3705.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1581285508)
It will be a little higher than the existing loft on the right and be tagged into the header wall on the left, but give me a space to store lumber. When that happens it will open up more floor upstairs and be the last piece I need (or think I need) to get it all ship-shape.
So really, no big stuff happening, but I am moving forward, and that is always the goal, right?
very inspirational. now in addition to loosing a few pounds, I think I will start on my shop. that SS chunk looks something useful. feel free to drop it off if you are in town... wait this is how I got all the stuff I have that I need to organize. It looks fantastic. wish lived closer, I would come help with something, maybe the beer part at the end!
smiley_beertoast
Quote from: doc henderson on February 09, 2020, 05:17:11 PM
I think neighbors though the "Beverly Hillbilies" had moved in. smiley_hillbilly_tub_base smile_banjoman smiley_old_guy smiley_fiddler
This is just like my life when I lived on Long Island (let's just keep that tid-bit between us, shall we?). I started looking for a way out when I was 14 and didn't find it until I was about 30ish. In our first house (suburbia central) I had 2 woodstoves (house and shop) that I fed. I would drive all the way upstate with a flatbed, load logs, bring them home, buck and split with a maul. The neighbors had no idea what I was doing.
I sure hope you had a woodstove in your apartment. ;D bon_fire
Quote from: doc henderson on February 09, 2020, 05:52:45 PM
very inspirational. now in addition to loosing a few pounds, I think I will start on my shop. that SS chunk looks something useful. feel free to drop it off if you are in town... wait this is how I got all the stuff I have that I need to organize. It looks fantastic. wish lived closer, I would come help with something, maybe the beer part at the end!
smiley_beertoast
Doc, if you ever make it back east I think a visit would start with the beer part. We have two much catching up to do for a couple of guys that have never met. Probably a little campfire would be nice also. But I try not to let significant work interfere with good fellowship.
just had a wood burning fireplace. I did try to adapt and old box stove, but the maintenance guys did not like that, something about burning the whole place down. :D I rewired the out door 3 x 6 foot storage closet so I could do wood projects on the back patio. a few folks missed and a few were prob. glad to see me go. ;)
That ice looks good.
You are a gaining!!
Looking great!
Brandon
Well I got a little done tonight. We had surprise snow this morning and I thought I would have to plow tonight, but when I got home my son and his 3 boys had plowed and shoveled for me. 8) So after chores and dinner I got an hour or so out there. I spent some time working the rust layer off my drill press tables with scotch brite and and wd-40. They are not prefect but they do allow a vise to slide around nicely. I just need it to be functional and clean. Now I have to find where all my drill press vises are hiding and some other stuff, like chucks and drift keys, etc. :D
Next I rewired the table saw, something else I have been avoiding (have I mentioned I hate wiring?). It wasn't as bad as it could have been and went quicker than I thought. Fired it up and there was no smoke, so I figured we are OK. ;D Glad to have that done, did I mention I was avoiding it? Tomorrow I am looking forward to putting it back together, getting a new blade on it and trying it would be really nice. :) Gotta fetch me up some of them fancy plastic push stick thingys because I hain't haven't never run one of these things and I would really like to minimize my finger exposure.
Looks and sounds really good. Making me feel guilty about not accomplishing more around here.
You must be kidding, I feel like a slouch. Things are not getting done as quickly as they need to and I keep adding stuff as I see it. I feel old and slow. Wasn't too long ago I would have been out in the shop till midnight most nights. I should probably sit down and write a short list of goals and focus on that. I have my plan for the very short future, to make some stuff like you do and Doc and WV does and see if maybe I can sell it (the 'hobby' funds are getting low). I have to finish up the table saw and router table, then get the RA saw moved upstairs, then I have to decide to either throw myself into the last loft build with milling the lumber and all that, or start pulling in some slabs and making some stuff. I have been making sketches all winter and am dying to get going. It's (I'm) moving too slow.
Well, you are no slouch, you are getting old, and you sound like a woodworker to me!!!!!! ;) :) :D 8)
You could do like my wife does. She makes a "To Do List" but doesn't work on it in any sequential way. So she winds up working on other stuff about half the time. Next time she looks at her list she adds the other stuff to her list - then she marks it off!
Well Doc, I am still as good once as I ever was, but I ain't as good as I used to be (also, read my adjusted tag line if you haven't already). ;D
Ted, I often do that, and in fact just did it at lunch time today, preempting your suggestion, or maybe it was ESP? :D
Anyway, I also added time estimates to each item. This might allow me to pick them off the list when I have a little time. I do note that I find myself with about a half hour available at the end of the evening, but can't remember any of the little tasks, now I can look at the list and maybe get some of those done.
Part of my (new) problem is that as things get cleaned up I think to myself 'oh, now I can finally set this thing up that I haven't been able to use in years' and off I go playing with that. It's kind of like rewarding myself for making room. It feels good, but it adds new tasks. Like the drill press. I set it up, then realized the tables needed to be cleaned in order to be usable, so there went another hour. Now that's done and I realize I don't know where my vises are, so there goes some more time. ARRGGHH! It all needs to be done, of course, but I should let some stuff slide until the need arises, then tackle it.
In any event, making the list and looking it over convinced me to hold off on the last loft for a month or two, finish the open items currently in work, and make a project or two. Every other day I keep making sketches of things I want to try making and the list is growing.
I always update my 'to-do' list with the other things I might end up doing for that day or week that were not on my original list. It makes it look like I really did more than I had planned to do... smiley_roller
Yeah, I always mess that part up. I add new stuff to the list as I am working that I think of as I go. When the day is over I may have crossed off 3 things, but added 4. :D ;D >:(
Emily has made a clinical diagnosis for me - Level 10 MPD.
Multiple Project Disorder. :D :D :D :D :D It's bad but it keeps me out of trouble!
SawyerTed -There now my wife has a fitting diagnosis for me, I'm going to borrow that one.
OldGreenhorn- several times a year I sit down and make list of stuff I want to accomplish then It gets buried on my desk till I am purging it. Then i refind it and sometimes I am really surprised at how much I have gotten done, usually there is plenty yet undone. I get frustrated but then I look back at what a mess my place was when I bought it and look at it now and it's more than I imagined it would be at first. So I count my blessings and go do the things I have to be doing that don't necessarily mesh with what I want to be doing. You have accomplished a bunch even while fighting a nasty bout of the crud. You will turn out some pretty cool stuff in that set up and have grandchildren that won't be clueless about how stuff works.
I think it is fairly safe to say that Ms. Emily has nailed a good many of us right there. :D
Yeah, that list I made today helped to lay it out in my head and we just finished dinner so I am anxious to get out there and knock some things off the list. But I left the list on my desk at work. ;D :)
I'm always writing lists of things I want to do when I get home from work... then I get about a block away from home and somehow I forget about the list in my pocket. :D
OG, you're doing great! You may not be where you want to be but you've accomplished a lot my friend!
Brandon
so (too) many things i had thought to say reading over the new posts today. i know you do not need coaching, but might be fun to start a grand kids list, so dad can drop them off for a few hours (that yes you personally will not get as much done) and they can do for you. they already feel like such a part of that shop and sawmill. You are a lucky man! I will leave it at that. ;)
OK, more little stuff tonight off my list, but I feel pretty good about this one. I had figured that finishing off the table saw setup would take two evenings and that was on the list for tonight. But I finally got a replacement deburring wheel so I mounted that up and then gave it a test drive by taking all the 40 years of patina off my framing hammer. I immediately realized I set the wheel too close to the buffer (I am out of practice) so I will have to re-drill some holes and move it, but no big deal there. My hammer looks better too. :)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3706.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1581471735)
Then I jumped to the table saw. Mounted up the fence rails oiled all the under-workings, installed the fence, and put on the new blade. Took a test cut on a KD 2x4 and holy cow! This thing cuts like a dream! Then I tried a piece of ash, SAME THING! the blade makes NO sound going through. When I got it (a month and 5 days ago, but who's counting?) I tried cutting a 2x4 and what misery! Turned out, they had a 8" laminate blade in there and when I yanked it, I could see that it was toasted. This new Diablo I have (10" GP) with the chatter slots cuts like a flippin' dream. I still have some things to make better on the saw like grease on the elevation quadrant, calibrating the blade angle gauge (way off) and stuff like that, but it is working. The second part of this was the router table the previous owner had built. Nothing about it appealed to me except that it included a 1/2 HP Rockwell router. He had attached it to the table saw with deck screws through the sheet metal (who does that?). I draw the line at that kind of workmanship, sorry, and there was no way I would put it back together that way. I had been thinking about how to do this for a few days (OK weeks) and tonight it finally came to me. There is no reason that router table needs to be attached to the table saw, right? So I just made it a stand alone with legs and set it right in where it was between the fence rails. I used his one existing leg (plywood) and added 2 ash 2x4's for the other legs and used 5/4 scraps from my flooring for gussets. Solid as a rock. Now i can move it out if I have a project requiring a lot of work.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3708.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1581471744)
There will be more tweaking down the road when I do the last loft because there is a conflict where the garage door track comes up over the present loft floor (this is why that last loft will have a 10" step up). So I am not finalizing anything but it's all workable. I will move and adjust things when I do that last loft. I like being able to pull stuff out or turn it for specific projects, then put it back when I am done. I just don't want to have to re-arrange the shop to do that. Something simple and easy.
You can see the conflict better in this photo, so I will have to move the saw and table about 10" to the left to resolve that for now.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3709.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1581471821)
I also have another conflict which is the loft railing, shown here (it's a grey rail just behind the saw table).
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3711.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1581471807)
So I will either have to raise the saw or lower the rail. No biggie, I will think on it for a while yet. Probably raise the saw and router table with some nice custom milled planks which may help cut down some of the vibration noise from the saw through the floor.
Anyway, I am very happy with how that table saw works, I am a convert now. I have to give kudos to @btulloh (https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=29962) and @WDH (https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=4370) for shaming me into the purchase. That was a pretty darn good $150. capitol expense. ;D
While I am thanking folks I should point out that @ManjiSann (https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=46620) was spot on when he asked about noise transmitting through the bench I added to the new loft. It does indeed 'resound' but nothing too terrible. Actually every machine upstairs makes the loft vibrate and resonate. I don't see it as a big deal. In fact I find those sounds somewhat calming and comforting. Since I was a little kid, my Dad's shop was in the basement right under my bedroom and he would work down there after I went to bed. Many many nights I fell asleep to the sounds of the shop running. I could tell which machine and as I got older what he was doing on what machine. It's how I began to develop a sense of 'good sounds' and 'really bad sounds' that i carry to this day. Maybe I am just weird. I like those sounds, they comfort me.
Also @doc henderson (https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=41041) had the idea for the master cutoff switch I added to that grinding/sanding/deburring/tool bench which I used and am quite pleased with, so thanks for that. Also @Nebraska (https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=45256) @WV Sawmiller (https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=28064) and @richhiway (https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=25823) for encouragement and support. There are others I am sure I am missing and I apologize for that. The folks here are so supportive and giving of their thoughts and even seemingly off-hand comments that serve to make me think in a new direction and change (improve) my thinking. It all adds up. Tonight I just really thought I should mention that, because it's a big deal to me. It's as if you guys are stopping in after work and checking progress and offering a hand or ideas. Its a pretty amazing thing we have going here. You guys should know it matters to me. Thank You one and all.
Tomorrow I will find that DanG list and check some things off. OH and while I was jumping around doing all this stuff I happened to find one of my drill press vises I had neatly stored (3 years ago) on a shelf. I put it back where it belongs, finally. ;D :D 8)
Nice idea about List Doc. We actually do save stuff for them to do. They love sweeping and building stuff with wood scraps (so I mustn't burn them all), but yes, I do keep a list in my head. I should probably write one and hang it on the wall as things occur to me. I do need to get more brooms because they cause fights. ;D
Quote from: doc henderson on February 11, 2020, 08:26:33 PM
so (too) many things i had thought to say reading over the new posts today. i know you do not need coaching, but might be fun to start a grand kids list, so dad can drop them off for a few hours (that yes you personally will not get as much done) and they can do for you. they already feel like such a part of that shop and sawmill. You are a lucky man! I will leave it at that. ;)
You're a wise man Doc Henderson
thanks @donbj (https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=43431) as the Volga Germans from Hays, Ks would say, "too soon oldt, too late smart"!!!
chokes me up a little my friend. all I can think of is with the table saw and rail, it may work as an out feed table if you plan to cut up there, which i assume you do. maybe even a roller or two on the rail.
Quote from: doc henderson on February 11, 2020, 10:36:37 PM"too soon oldt, too late smart"!!!
Beautiful! How many generations since Adam and we're still working on that! Priorities in life, I'm just as guilty as the next guy.
Quote from: doc henderson on February 11, 2020, 10:45:08 PM
chokes me up a little my friend. all I can think of is with the table saw and rail, it may work as an out feed table if you plan to cut up there, which i assume you do. maybe even a roller or two on the rail.
Maybe I can raise that rail and under-sling a long roller?! Not a bad idea. I will look at it tonight and ponder on it a while. I have some better push sticks en route. Gotta stay on task. It's functional now, lets move on. But I do like that idea.
I didn't mean to get sappy, just wanted to let y'all know how much I appreciate the very real help. I've never been good at accepting assistance and it is rarely offered anyway, but i am trying to change the former.
OG, for whatever little contribution I have made, you are very welcome. I'm thrilled I can give back to you and all the others that have given so much of their time and knowledge to me!
Keep up the good work!
Brandon
Well kind of tired tonight, but I knocked 2 things off the checklist. I removed a piece of 3/4 ply and moved it up on the wall. That was painted and hung as a high tool board before I built the loft. After the loft went in, it was at floor level so we moved it up (my son stopped by, it was a 2 man job).
I also took an old counter top and set it on some low storage shelves to make a bench I can put slabs on for sanding. It's a little hokey and am not really pleased with it, but it is functional. My focus is narrowing toward getting some project work started. Had a new idea for lumber storage last night. I may start on that tomorrow night (yeah, another side trip, I know, but it is on my list). But we have some snow coming in the morning, so the evening may be lost to plowing.
No photos, not much to show.
I really hope to move some of my wood in the shop this weekend and start something very shortly.
Well, the snow worked out in my favor today and pretty much melted through the day, not worth plowing what is left so I got right back out there. Frustrating night but I got something done by forcing myself through it and I took one and a half things off the list.
Last night, as I mentioned, I moved the tool board up and I keep fussing over what tools and how I should hang them. I will have at least one upstairs and another over the bench down stairs then some on the downstairs side wall and possibly some ones with dedicated tools or shelves by specific machines with the right stuff for those machines. I think I should stop thinking about it and just start hanging tools. I know I will have to re-do them as I learn or refine what I need where, so I should just get at it. Right now it is a blank canvas:
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3713.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1581646052)
Here is that bench I tried last night. It may go away or stay. I will see how it works out. Its a bit warped, so I put the hammer drill on it to help flatten it. If it stays and is useful, I will firm it up with some screws and make it more proper. Right now, just trying out the idea. It may be in the way or too much when I move my Dad's lathe here.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3714.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1581646152)
Anyway, tonight I made a quick and dirty lumber rack that is overhead of the table saw. Because of the location, I won't be whacking my head on it. I may make another one on the other side over where the jointer I don't own yet will go.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3718.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1581646119)
The rack allowed me to get almost all of last year's leftover lumber off the floor (opens more floor up!) I still have a few pieces. Frankly most of it is junk but there are a few pieces like 2x4's I could have used on the loft build if I could have found them. So, a nearly open area now except for a couple of pieces and some plywood I may use for another tool board by the jointer. which will go in approximately this area.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3720.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1581646203)
This is what that area looked like a few weeks ago. Lumber on the right and the left and a 'few things' in between. So I guess I am making a little progress. 8)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3596.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1579392519)
Tomorrow I really have to bring in some wood to begin working this weekend. The temps are gonna plummet tomorrow night and I really should have done it tonight, but everything was covered in slush. Tomorrow it will be frozen. Either way I will be doing it in the dark which is not preferred. ;D
Got a 3 day weekend coming up and I want to make it count. I have to pick up some diesel on the way home to keep the shop warm.
Stay warm. already down to 10 here at 8pm.
did you ever see "french cleats" be a good way to try out the table saw.
wranglerstar on you tube has a vid on them I think.
have a good weekend.
Yeah, 12° out now and continuing the decline since 2am, the wind held at about 20 MOH and up today which made things cooler. I got home and had about 30 minutes daylight. SO I changed quick and pulled apart the 2 woodpiles and pulled the stuff I need for the 2 projects I want to start NOW. (Enough of the cleaning building and hanging for a while) One pile was easy, but all the wood is frozen and had a little ice on some of it. Heavy slabs and just in case I grabbed a few 2x2's in case I need to make some legs, but they are not in the plan, maybe a side job. The other pile, the cover had blown off in the back and I didn't see it. The pieces I wanted were frozen together solid. I almost gave up, but I managed to yank and drag them out. Man my fingers were just frozen. I mean like I had been camping all week and was out of dry gloves. I got it all inside and tried to warm my hands. I know cold and working in it, so this upset me because I finally got my fingers to the point that they began to hurt. It happened very fast, 40 minutes. I could not break apart the boards that were frozen together. But the shop was heating up, so I stood them up, dumped some more oil in the tank, had dinner and went back out. Finally got the frozen boards broken apart and stood them a little closer to the heat, but not too close. The heat is off for the night anyway now.
So I carried the two slabs upstairs and laid them on the bench and stared at them.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3727.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1581732727)
I have two slabs about 5' long, 2-1/8" thick and roughly 18" wide. The rough plan is to make a coffee table that can be knocked down and transported or stored flat. So I am going to make my first attempt at a wide through tenon with two wedge pegs on each end. One slab gets cut in half for the legs and the other is the top.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3729.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1581732928)
I am really new at this. (OK, I have no clue, I am working from what I have learned here on the FF.) I laid out a center line on each slab based on the width at each end, then I could lay out the end cuts square to that line and so that I could visualize it better, I laid out the lines for the tenon cuts on one end to look at the proportions (and I adjusted them based on what I saw), (boy, you lose a lot of table surface to the tenon! This will wind up being a 4' table.) I am going to have to go at this slow and think everything through at least twice. Yeah, I know there are a bunch of ways to attack this and I think I sketched most of them, but I settled on a compromise to keep it simple and raise my chances against putting 20 or 30 hours labor into some pretty pieces of firewood.
It's a 3 day weekend. I am going to do my best to get this roughed out. The mortise scares me a little. I will have to dig out the chisels and put a hone on them. Wish I had a corner chisel. ;D
And now the temp is down to 11° and it's gonna be cold in the shop tomorrow morning.
I like the use of the ceiling space for storage but I can't see enough of the bracing to feel warm and fuzzy about that much weight overhead. I use lots of knee braces and such for my shelves and such but I am sure they would be in your way there.
How is your rack fastened and supported?
Quote from: WV Sawmiller on February 14, 2020, 09:41:24 PMHow is your rack fastened and supported?
Agreed, it's a little hokey. but holding :D. The box hangers are secured into the roof trusses with 3" screws and I hung my 182 pound frame from each to test before moving on. There isn't a lot of wood up there, even though it may look like it. the vertical opening is only 10" or so. I built these quickly with the intent of taking them down once the loft is a little more cleared out and I can make something better. Also, that last loft will wind up being the real lumber storage area and these may wind up being a place to hold just the stuff for the current project, so just a few pieces in it.
So today I went back to school. It has been a long time since I used a chisel to try and hold a straight line and I never was very good at it on my best day. Certainly I have never attempted a 2" x 10" through mortise in RO. So I cut the legs up to size then laid out the mortise lines. I set up the drill press to whack through with a 1-1/2 forstener bit and rough it out, then after searching for my chisels and finding most of them, then finding my stone, then finding my mallet, I started whacking away. Trying to get the feel for the chisel and how it cut best and remembering how to best work with the grain, and how to get a flat surface across the grain. It all take some patience and I didn't have high hopes, so I took my time and worked away.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3730.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1581809411)
I made a boo-boo about halfway through and got too close to the far side and broke out 2 pieces.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3735.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1581809347)
One I found and glued back in, the other is gone and will have to filled with epoxy. I need to epoxy anyway because there is a hairline crack running up the center line of both pieces and it needs to be strengthened. Probably a very minor drying split, barely visible.
After about 4 hours of messing around and chiseling, I wound up with this:
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3738.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1581809424)
I took an hour break to contemplate what I had learned and rub my shoulder which was a tad sore from all the pounding. This is taking WAY too long I thought. So I went back out to start the next one and tried something different. I am never a fan of plunge cutting with a circular saw, especially in hardwood, since I nearly got hurt doing that when I was in my 20's. But this newer blade I have cuts pretty good, so I tried that method. It took me about an hour to make this one nearly complete except for fitting.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3739.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1581809468)
But I made a boo-boo here too. When I was cutting with the saw I focused on the wrong line and overran the correct line.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3740.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1581809496)
So I guess I have another spot to drop some epoxy. ;D
The second one actually trimmed up more true and square than the first even though I didn't have much to trim. That last photo is before I did the finish pass with the chisel. Fitting it all up will be where I really got some lessons I am sure.
Tomorrow I will start on the tenons and hopefully I won't have any mistakes with the saw again. I haven't even thought about the peg holes yet or how to make the pegs.
It does feel good to start making something again and having the space to work in without working on saw horses. Even if I am making a mess of this first project, at least I am retraining the muscles and remembering things I have not used since my Dad taught me as a kid but I never put into real practice. I heard his voice in my head more than a few times today.
Good to see a project taking shape after all your work on the facility. You're gettin' to be a woodworker, whether you wanted to or not! Gotta love that sawdust addiction.
Would you like a couple suggestions that would make chopping those mortises a little easier? I'll share a couple techniques if you're interested.
Keep up the good work!
Bring it on. Always trolling for ideas! 8)
Layout the mortise with a knife. That allows you to register the chisel in the scored line. Very precise that way and easy to hold a straight line. To help see the line, just go over the scored line with the pencil point. It'll track right in your scored line.
It's pretty standard practice to chop a through-mortise from both sides, going half way from each face. Just layout the mortise on both faces. In this case, you've got a square end to reference off of. Obviously it needs to be accurate.
Chopping from both sides keeps from splitting out on the bottom side and it's just all 'round better.
Yup, tried to do all that stuff. I scored my lines by going around with the 1" chisel, but the knife would be faster. I was trying to work through from both sides, but got too close because it was cutting so well. :D I did layout both sides. I have the procedure, now it is the skill to apply it where I fall down. ;D These are all the lessons I need to learn..... that hard way.
Clamp with a waste board under it to the bench.
Helps with blow out. Router works good to. then just finish up with a chisel.
Looks good.
Not a bad day at all out in the shop. I started with cutting the first tenon end and as everybody says, you fit the tenon to the mortise, it's easier and now I know why. :) I did do some adjusting to the mortise where I could see high spots but mostly made the tenon fit. It felt really good when it slid home.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3741.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1581887630)
Of course in continuing my education, I quickly re-learned why straight & square cut lines are so important. So I have to do some careful cleaning and squaring with a chisel to make the end fit better.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3744.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1581887629)
These two chisels show roughly where I intend to put the pegs. I am still figuring on that and looking for a drill the right size. I may have to use an auger bit.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3747.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1581887695)
The second end went faster than the first, but this used the first mortise I had completely chiseled out and the mortise required still more cleanup. But boy it sure felt good when I slid that second end on and hoisted to beast onto the floor.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3748.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1581887713)
Still all rough, I have lots to do before we get close, but the function is there and it is solid even without pegs.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3757.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1581887747)
I may let this sit and dry some more for a week or so because it seems like I am seeing new small cracks and splits showing up and I want to get epoxy into all of those the help firm it up. Wish I could afford that west system stuff, but not yet. I am also thinking about shortening this a bit (its a little high for a coffee table, the wife says) and possibly adding a stringer across the bottom for stability. I think I will wait on that decision until I get the pegs made and installed.
If the peg is angled and the peg mortise is angled to match, When you tap the wedge home, it will pull the pieces together tightly. If you glue the peg in, it will be solid as a rock, but you might want it to be able to be taken apart if I remember correctly.
This walnut bench has the angled peg and mortise.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/14370/Picture_001.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1581901327)
Looks great.
Nice walnut bench too.
I like the wedges.
I don't know how long you air dried those slabs.
I bring my indoor benches in the house and let them get down to the ambient moisture before I finish them up.
Most of my air dried gets down to around 12% it's drier then that indoors.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/35823/20200203_150725.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1581910552)
Here is the one I am working on now. Probably be an outdoor bench. Tough to dry those cookies without cracks.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/35823/20190620_182624.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1581911419)
If you look close you can see wedges driven in splits in the tenon to tighten. This is glued. I know you want to be able to take yours apart, the wedges tighten it up nice.
Boy, I tell ya, you go out to dinner and come back to find all this neat stuff! So working backwards: Richhiway, yeah I am amazed you got those cookies to dry without cracking, that is quite the piece of artwork you have there, nice Job.
Yes, I do have to check the MC on those, I had confused them with the dry ash I had, the ash was dry, these were not so much. ;D
WDH that bench, which looks like a pretty fine table to me, is a bit above my skill level for now. I had thought about angled mortises, but discounted it right away because I knew I would screw it up. :D Beyond that , yes, I planned a taper on the wedges to lock it up. I figure and end hole at about a 10 angle should work. Yes, I planned to have it so it can break down and be transported in the back seat of any passenger car. Kind of like a Rustic IKEA kit (tm).
Well in terms of actual work, today wasn't exactly a barn burner but I made progress and feel good about it. Yesterday when my wife came out to look at the progress she remarked that I had all these scraps around that I could make 'stuff' out of. She went on about how if I am planning to sell at craft shows I should have a bunch of inexpensive small stuff to sell for cheap because it draws folks in and adds up in sales. What I would call 'hobby woodworker junk'. She kept going on a grabbed a block that came out of the tenon cut on the coffee table and gave me 3 ideas on how I could make something simple to sell. I know she is trying to help, but I had other ideas and didn't want to make 'bird houses and such'. Still, to keep her quiet (and play a little with the new table saw ;D) I made one of her ideas for her this morning. Apparently it is a smart phone holder or tablet holder. She says she needed one, actually two. SO I did that. She thinks I can sell them for 6 bucks. (P.T. Barnum was right!) 2 minutes on the table saw, 2 on the sander, wipe it over with Danish Oil and it's done. I guess I can make a few and see if anyone wants them.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3770.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1581982332)
Then I got to work on the table. I made a jig to put my holes in at 2.5° off the vertical. That was stupid. It didn't help much and the first hole I put int the wrong place because I was sighting down the hole carefully lining up on my mark only to find out later that it wasn't my mark, it was a tiny crack that looked just like my pencil line. :D SO I pitched the jig and drilled my 2.5° by eye, it turned out to be more accurate. (Machinist mojo right there. ;D)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3763.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1581982184)
So pay no attention to that extra hole (or the man behind the curtain). I will epoxy fill it in, then insert a shiny penny with this years date just under the surface and it and call it some kind of proof of production year thing. Then I had to start making pegs which I cut off on the table saw at the 2.5° (I dunno, it's half of 5° and seemed about right to my eye) then worked on the belt sander to make them match the holes. Initial results weren't too bad.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3765.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1581982222)
So I cut a handful of pegs and went to town on the belt sander. I moved the holes out 1/4" on the second side to get a better fit. With trimming, adjusting, and fitting, eventually I had it all roughed together and set it (all 90 pounds of it) on the floor to see how stable it is.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3771.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1581982277)
Holy cow, those 4 pegs make it solid as a rock. I don't see any need to add a stringer. I sat on it and wiggled my skinny butt back and forth and it doesn't move at all.
Then my son stopped by and I got distracted. I did a little rough sanding to smooth out the live edges and give me time to think about the next step. I do want to trim up one edge on a joint to make the fit better, but I think we will move onto the sanding stages at this point.
So, not a bad end to the weekend. I do have to say I love working in the shop now and being able to walk up to a machine and use it without moving other stuff out of the way. Having the tools out and available is another big plus and having ready places to put the tools out of the way (and not on the floor) is also most pleasant. :)
It's funny, 25 years ago, if I had drilled that hole in the wrong place I would have been SO angry and likely throwing things at the wall. It would have ruined my weekend and I would have quit for the day. But this time, I just laughed at myself (after I muttered just a few bad words). What are you gonna do? I am finally finding some peace in this work, even if I am not very good at it, I am really enjoying it. Considering all the things on this project that I have never done before, I think it came out fairly good.
I know regional markets vary WIDELY, but what do you folks think a table like that would be worth to the average buyer when it is all finished, urethaned, and shiney? I have a number in my head, but am curious what others think. When it is done I believe I will have about 30 hours in it.
$400.00, just my guess, because I bet the next one takes you a bunch less time. Looks good can't wait to see the done product.
Yeah Nebraska, that is just about the number I had in my head 400-450. Of course, you have to find someone who sees it the same way and therein lies the rub. :D
I too am anxious to get this close to finished. I just have the one little trim to do on one end to make it more flush and square. One delicate cut with saw and chisel, then we start sanding.
that wood and project turned out great. Pricing is tuff, the folks who love it, may not have 400 bucks to spend. plenty will start at your price and try to work you down. we would do the same. I like the penny idea. adds some character and prominence. be sure and add in cost of materials so ...$400.01 :)
Well, bearing in mind what you just said, I thought I would start at 450 and let it sit for a while to see what the responses are. Yeah, gotta include the coast of parts and supplies.
I think you'll sell it faster than you think. Just takes the right eyeballs to see it. Take it to your music festivals you work set it up and use it. Or make a smaller version for camping, Folks will see it and ask, if it's against the spirit of the event to sell stuff you can say ...."I will be at Joe Bob's craft fair in blueberry county with several more example's of what we create from salvaged forest products. Here's my card I own Blue Stone Wood Creations. ;D
The penny is for authenticity for when its an antique.
Oh obviously it's much easier to tell someone else than get it done yourself....(poke directly at myself) it looks to me like a fun project... If wife and I ever get to the point we can walk away from this life and get a little Airstream to pull around or a big slide in like Jarheads, I think I need a version of that with maybe a couple of peg collapsible stools for breakfast and coffee in the mornings.
Awful pretty bench you've got there. You mentioned sanding to smooth out the live edge. Why? Was it that rough or punky wood or something? I recently used a wire brush on some old LE cherry I had where the sapwood was punk. The wire left the LE look but removed the punk down to solid hard heartwood.
WV, I pretty much do as you suggest. I do not remove the effect, just the hairy cabrium that will stick up through the finish or flake off later. I use fine pads on a palm sander and stay true to the original surfaces. There are a few areas where a cant hook may have gouged it and I smooth those a little too. I like softening the corners to blend them toward the mating parts, but generally, it's a light touch. I am thinking of little kids bumping their heads on the corners so I round everything smooth but I stop way short of rounding off the live edge.
Well tonight I had one joint to square up, then sanding begins. Turned out I did not need to take a cut the fix that joint, I didn't even need to trim with a chisel, I just had to sand some high spots and it slipped up tight as it is going to get. It's what I get for using machinist eyes wood project. So I broke it down and started on the top. Man, I forgot how much work that is! I do love it when it gets down to 'plastic smooth' though, I don't think there is any better feeling in the world. The fine sanding (when I finally get to it) lets me feel what the wood is doing and where it is holding thick or hard. I am not looking for 'perfect and flat' just smooth and pretty. There may remain a mark or two from sawing or something, but everything has to be smooth. This one I have a lot of tiny cracks and some long ones to epoxy and this also helps find those and let them open up if they want to. I kept noticing these lines I don't understand, it is in the grain, but not with the grain. You can see some blotches in this photo:
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3784.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1582077156)
But then I flipped it and started on the bottom. After a first pass with 38 grit they really started to pop. Can anybody tell me what I am looking at? This is red oak (actually scarlet, I am told).
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3780_LI_28229.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1582077142)
They don't follow the grain, they are not from handling or stickers. Some of them glisten a little. I am at a loss and I really want to know. Where oh where could I find an expert on this I wonder? ;D Are these what they call rays? If so, what do they indicate? I feel quite the fool here and need some tutoring.
Anyway, after an hour and a half, my back was sore and the sander was really hot. (Note to self: work on a dedicated sanding bench that I can walk all the way around.)
I need to pick up more belts in the proper grits, seems like I always have lots of the wrong grit and one of the right grit left. ;D
I'll just spend my evenings this week getting things close sanded, then inspect and open any cracks that needed it. Epoxy after that in small layers. Oh, and when I stopped at the local convenience store tonight it occurred to me to check my change for a new penny. I didn't get one, but saw one in the 'take a penny' tray so I swapped a few of my pennies for that brand new 2020 penny and told the clerk she made a good profit on the trade. :) Now I just have to remember to take it out of my pocket and put it on the side before I lose it.
Looks like ray fleck.
looks like rays to me. look at the end grain and it should be close to perpendicular to the flat top side of the table. you can up the price and refer to it as quarter sawn. it always costs more! if that is a little pith in the center, then it is quarter sawn. you can also tell them it includes the first wood to the last wood, count the rings and make it a history bench/table. you are so, the woodworker. :) :) :)
Quote from: doc henderson on February 18, 2020, 09:26:00 PMyou are so, the woodworker. :) :) :)
Let's not get carried away Doc, I would give a real woodworker a bad name.
But yes, this is definitely quartersawn by the definition, the end grain is nearly vertical. I like your sales ideas. I had been thinking about making information sheets for the larger pieces explaining where the wood came from, how it was made, and what specific features it might have (such as the EAB tracks or whatever) some folks like the value they get in the knowledge.
I saw a guy with some 'OK' tables and such at a show and I asked him about the wood in some of his pieces. The best he could do was say "oh, I cut that one out a guys stump dump, and this one is from a piece I found in a barn someplace." He wasn't much of a salesman. Also the big turn off for me was the cheap deck screws he used to put his 'furniture' together. He had some beautiful raw wood pieces, but he screwed the legs on with deck screws. It was a turn off from the aesthetic point of view. No way would I put that in a nice home, let alone mine.
I quickly learned that if you teach people about a piece they come to appreciate it on a level equal to the information you provide. Maybe it salesmanship, but I try to share the joy of what I see in the wood because for me, that's what it is all about. It's awesome and amazing stuff nature makes for us to work with. Maybe I am just a crazy old man, but maybe folks like to buy stuff from crazy old men, who knows?
I like your idea about counting the rings. consider it stolen. ;D
ok! you are a woodworker! ;D
Well OK, I will meet you halfway. Let's just call me a poor woodworker and be done with it. I have no training (beyond what the folks here offer me) and I have no skill or discipline. I just admire what the folks here create and am trying to fake some of it. I have no illusions but I do prefer to earn any labels that are hung on me before I can use them. Not your fault or anyone else's. It's probably subliminal and stemming from when folks started calling me a hero years ago. I hated it and was very embarrassed every time it would happen. I kindly asked them not to do that and explained that I was just part of a team and did a small part during a bad day they had, but still they persisted. Even writing about it now makes me uncomfortable. I guess some things you never shake and they make you weird. So that's me, weird.
well there are plenty of non heroes who would not walk across the street to help someone, so if that makes you a hero... but i respect what you are saying. i will admit you may be a beginning woodworker, if that makes you feel better. but you are a woodworker, and proud or not, that is the way i see it. and i enjoy poking the bear occasionally! :D :D :D.. as far as no skill or discipline,... please. God bless my brother!
Quote from: Old Greenhorn on February 18, 2020, 09:10:10 PMThey don't follow the grain, they are not from handling or stickers. Some of them glisten a little. I am at a loss and I really want to know.
I read some articles on this today and I don't think those lines are rays. According to the articles, the rays go with the grain and these certainly do not. I hate to bother him, but I wonder if @GeneWengert-WoodDoc (https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=20498) would teach me(us) a little about these lines? Unfortunately those are the best photos I can get with my camera. I can't seem to find any references, because if they are not rays, I don't know what they are called. They are about 60° to the grain lines are are not from sawing or handling. They are throughout the wood, but lighter in some areas than others.
I sure would not mind finding a way to make them pop in the final finish.
The Burr Oak I have shows as that as well. I have always thought them as flecks and rays. I know you are an expert materials worker, I was going to say metal but I know you work with machining plastics and other things. If I gave you a block of brass a little bigger than a door knob, I am pretty sure you could presto chango, viola shape it into a pretty nifty door knob. You can thread shafts, set up machines to mill parts etc. Wood is another material but once was living, it's not as consistent in density and texture but you can figure out to make it behave and look the way you want it too, and face it we have access to one of the greatest buckets of knowledge assembled right here through the generosity of the group.
I like the history in the wood approach it gives people a connection to the piece by the things and events that have shaped our lives. Almost need a marking system and an index on the underside. Any way will sit back and watch the replies you're looking more and more like a woodworker to me.
Yeah, I have always called them rays, but now I am looking at everything through new eyes as I learn here. No, it's not metal or even a 'defect' in the wood, it's pretty and even glistens when the light hits it just right. Sand out fine and you can't 'feel' it at all.
Funny, when I had my machine shop, my primary customer was a high end custom hardware company in NYC. I made door knobs, hinges, door plates bathroom hardware, all sold brass. Sometimes they plated it gold or platinum (who does that!?). My stuff wound up in some pretty upscale places with a long list of captains of industry, heads of state, and plenty of celebrities. It always surprised me what these folks would spend on just the hardware for their homes.
But back to the pseudo-rays, I really would like to figure this out. I will keep looking as I get time.
I think they will be there in the final finish. I still think they are rays. but like you I would like a Judges ruling. @WDH (https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=4370) @YellowHammer (https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=11488) .
They are rays presenting as fleck due to the cut not being exactly 90° to the grain
Those are medullary rays as is desired in quarter sawn oak. Since your board was milled through the pith (almost), which is one of the first steps to the quarter sawing process, you will end up with a center cut board with slight pith check in the middle (those cracks and defects you have in the center of the board) and with quarter sawn edges showing fleck. Typically, after drying, the middle pith is edged out which results in two quarter sawn boards with fleck.
The reflectivity is normal for fleck and is why it finishes so nicely.
Heres a picture
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/21488/IMG_3259.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1486345569)
.
Medullary rays, well there you go then. I found this on wiki which explains the purpose.
"Medullary rays are cellular structures found in some species of wood (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wood). They appear as radial planar structures, perpendicular to the growth rings, which are visible to the naked eye. In a transverse section they appear as radiating lines from the centre of the log. In an axial section they may appear as a variety of transverse markings, depending on how close the section is to the plane of the ray. In a tangential section they may be hard to see at all.
They are formed by the activity of fascicular cambium (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cambium). During the process of the division of cambium, the cambium cuts out cells on both the outer and inner side. These cells are parenchymatous (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parenchymatous). Most of these cells transform into xylem and phloem. But certain cells don't transform into xylem and phloem and remain as such.[clarification needed (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Please_clarify)] These cells cut out by the cambium towards the periphery are phloem parenchyma while those towards the pith are xylem parenchyma. Both of these cells together work as secondary medullary rays.
These medullary or pith rays are essential for the radial conduction of the water, minerals and other organic substances. They transport the substances from centre to periphery. These rays are also known as vascular rays or pith rays."
These last 2 lines above are what I was looking for. They are like the commissary for the tree. Yes, this one is cut right along the pith and the cut is perpendicular to the grain. I wanted to keep this as a slab and just fill the pith cracks with epoxy, it makes for a nice look, most laymen say.
Anyway, I find this fascinating and thank you for the education. Flecks or rays are both acceptable references I suppose, but I knew there was a purpose to this and didn't think it was disease or bugs or decay. Now I feel a little smarter. (Just a little.)
Most cells in Hardwood are functionally dead, that is, they do not have a nucleus or protoplasm. They are essentially open water conducting tubes to transport water from the roots to the growing shoots. However there are some living cells in the wood such as these medullary ray cells. All trees have them, but they are larger and more prominent in four groups or species of North American hardwoods: the white oaks, the red oaks, beech, and sycamore. It is the goal of quartersawing these species to orient the saw blade to slice these cells open longitudinally to expose the "ray fleck" figure.
Well, I guess I did that by accident. :D
That is what I call the "blind hog" syndrome.
most great things in life are some skill, some luck, and mostly just showing up! ;)
That's me, all over! 8)
Not much to report tonight. 2 hours of sanding and exposing more medullary rays 8). Also identifying all the sanding belt grits I don't have on hand. ;D I am thinking about getting a 4x24 belt sander, but will have to order all the belts going forward. The sander I am using is a 3x21 and my Dad bought it either before or just after I was born. It has held up quite well. I sanded ALL the floors in our second apartment and refinished them back around 1978, yes, with a hand belt sander. :D I never was one to take the easy way out, we were living on french toast, pancakes, and chicken once a week.
Anyway about the time my back started talking to me (can't print that conversation here) and the heat started getting comfortable in the shop, it was time to quit. SO I came in the house and worked on one of those things I keep putting off because I hate to do it. I set up another wireless router that should provide coverage out to the shop with 2 ports (2.4g and 5g). I ordered a smart phone the other day (my first) and need it to tie in to the wireless from the shop. So I worked through all the admin stuff, its been a long time since I've needed to do that stuff. I hate it, but I got it working and tested it with my tablet out there and it worked. I password protected it just to keep the usage down. ;D The router was sitting on my desk in the house, so it should work a lot better when I move it outside when the weather warms up. Glad that's done, now I just have to waste a couple of evenings learning how to use a phone when it comes. ;D It's all part of getting ready for retirement and getting things set up. Making progress every day.
I have heard about those sanders that run on kerosene. my 4 x 24 is an "electric" porter cable. :D does your smart phone have the BIG buttons? there you are, showing up and getting stuff done. i have started ordering my belts online. i still have a one handed skill "sandcat". it like a 2.5 x 16 inch belt sander. nice to have a variety.
Man, I have been running non-stop at work for the last 4 or 5 days because... well, I'll just let it go. Anyway, yeah Doc, thinking the bigger sander would save me some time and having another so one could cool for a bit would help too. Eventually this one is gonna die on me. I couldn't find any of the kero fired ones. ;D I am trying to hold off on spending any cash except needed supplies until I get something coming in. It would be nice to have a variety and cut down on belt changes.
On a lark I made a call on some free pine logs because they are only 15 minutes from me. Now the guy found out I have a sawmill and he wants to sell me sawlogs for 250/1000 and deliver 1500/load. Wouldn't mind having a pile, but I can't spend the cash. I will keep the door open, might see him tomorrow as it turns out he is delivering on my road.
I don't know nuthin' bout smart phones, but I guess I can learn me up some on it.
Easy night. finished the first pass sanding on the last leg. Then I prepped all the pieces on one side for filling the small cracks. Tape, clamps, and blocks as needed. It's cool in the shop (mostly because I am there :D) for a pour, but I mixed up about a jigger and stirred it extra long. It was enough and I had a tiny bit left over and had to search for a floor crack to use it in. 5 minutes later I realized I completely missed one spot I had to fill where I made that over cut with the saw. ;D Well, I guess I 'll get that on the next pour. This will take a few sessions anyway.
I have felt fairly well for the last few weeks and now it appears I have a sinus thing starting up. I've been really careful using dust masks, so it's not that, just the weather and bad luck I think.
Anyway, just keep pluggin' along. The wireless is not great in the shop, but it works and I managed to run netflix out there as a test on the tablet. It will get better when I move it to the porch in the spring, which I am told is just 10 or 15 days away, something like that.
250/1000 delivered would keep you in projects a while. I bet you can get that delivery in th e future as well. Esp. Since you have made the contact. You know if you can run a tablet the smart phone is no big deal. It is basically a tablet with a dialer added to it. Glad you've been good wearing those masks I thought about it earlier when the mice got to mine. You won't be getting as much done now with that Netflix out there in the shop. 8) I won't feel like as much of a slacker watching your projects.
Yeah, I feel like I am putting some of the little things in order. The internet in the shop could easily be a distraction, but it seems to be the opposite. So far It seems to be the opposite. I wound up working an hour longer last night than I usually do. It makes for company when you are working alone I guess. Also, it will keep me connected instead of having to come in the house to check emails, etc.
We will see about those logs, time will tell.
I use to have big problems out in the shop with mice years ago. But we got on it hard and they have not really been around much in recent years. My son is obsessive with the control methods and it drives me a little nuts. Haven't caught one in years now and only find the occasional fossil when cleaning.
Yeah the masks are a pain to get used to, but I am trying to make it a habit. Also using a vacuum more than I ever had before to keep the dust down. Building new habits, as it were. The sinuses are acting up today and I called in sick. I have to be very careful because when I get a sinus infection it can take me down for weeks. It's a big issue in our climate with the high humidity and grey winters. I'll try to do a little more epoxy work today, that seems safe.
Quote from: Old Greenhorn on February 20, 2020, 04:30:46 PM
I don't know nuthin' bout smart phones, but I guess I can learn me up some on it.
Now we get to find out who is smarter, you or the phone ... ;D ;D ;D It's really a computer you carry around with you and has the added functions of phone and camera features. ;)
Greenhorn
You need what the old timers called poor mans penicillin to get rid of the bad bugs in your system .
They are garlic ,horseradish,and honey .
I have been growing the garlic and horseradish for many years and I think it helps or at least it keeps people away that have germs .
Zeke
Well A-Z, that sounds yummy, wonder how you mix that up? Maybe I should take a run up the thruway one afternoon?
Rayar, I think the phone will win, be we shall see.
So just an easy day plugging along. Had to do some household chores which killed a good piece of the day, like going to the accountant to review the taxes, etc. But I did a second small epoxy pour, might need a third on the top to even things off.
I put the penny in the hole I partially filled yesterday then I filled over it.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3802.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1582329326)
I refilled a lot of the little cracks that had settled below the surface over night.
I also filled that mis-cut I made.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3806.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1582329327)
Some of these are still settling down, so probably one more small pour tomorrow. I am just using solo shot glass cups for mixing, so not a lot of material. Because it is not real warm in the shop it's not curing very well. I preheated the epoxy by the furnace before mixing and went over it with a torch to pop bubbles after pouring, but it is taking a long time to cure. I cranked the oil burner most of the day, but that block building holds a lot of cold in the walls and floor.
While going back and forth on that stuff, I began work on the next project. Brought the main wood upstairs and started the layout and the first 2 cuts on each to give me some working edges. This will be a corner shelf unit.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3800.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1582329722)
I just strapped it together to see if I came up pretty square to the floor with my starting cuts.
It still has the bark on, so that will have to come off.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3799.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1582329845)
Funny thing about this one is that I have little idea how I am going to do this and make it look good. Each step is a new adventure. The two sides are not equal width so these shelves will not be 45's and each shelf will be a different width. Not quite sure how to attach the shelves yet either. The top and bottom shelves will be fixed, the ones in the middle, I am not sure.
Anyway, I spent some time setting up the table saw to make the lap joint cuts for the back edges and cut a test piece. But I want a second pair of hands to run these boards through so I don't mess them up. Table saws still scare me a bit.
Trying not to overdue things so I don't get run down and give this sinus thing the upper hand, but I need to keep moving forward.
OGH - I like that corner shelf idea! Now are you going to saw cookies and quarter them and use them for shelves so they have round, live edge front? Just a thought/suggestion. Installing the shelves may help hold the other 2 pieces together while you glue them together.
Quote from: WV Sawmiller on February 21, 2020, 08:19:35 PM
OGH - I like that corner shelf idea! Now are you going to saw cookies and quarter them and use them for shelves so they have round, live edge front? Just a thought/suggestion. Installing the shelves may help hold the other 2 pieces together while you glue them together.
You know, this whole idea came from the wood. When I milled it, this idea popped in my head right away (it was the feet-like things on the bottom from the crotch). I thought of cookies right away. It seemed to me to be the best way to make the shelves. But I have yet to master cookies like Doc has. Cookies crack and split pretty badly for me and they are not really stable. In order not to have this thing weigh 200 pounds, I would need to keep the thickness down to around 5/4 and a cookie that thick I am pretty sure would be really unstable unless it was walnut or something dense like that. I have no such resource. So I am looking at other options and frankly have no planned solutions yet. I may just cut some stuff from the same maple with a straight live edge across the front. This may be one of those projects where I get just so far and can't figure the next step, so I let it stand there for a while and do other things then come back to it when the right idea strikes me. I started this without and 'end game' planned and just want to see where it leads.
OGH,
If you quarter the cookies I think you would have removed most of the stress that causes cookies to crack. I haven't tried it but may now looking at this post. I coated some 2" thick walnut donuts (the center was gone or punky) with anchorseal and they have held up pretty well and been cut 2 years or more.
I like your creativity and letting the wood drive what it wants to be.
Quote from: Old Greenhorn on February 21, 2020, 09:08:36 PMCookies crack and split pretty badly for me and they are not really stable.
Whole cookies will crack. But, if you split the cookie into thirds, it shouldn't crack. Once it drys for a bit, the outer edge will shrink more then the inner, so the 1/3 will be something less. Now cut them into 1/4 cookies to fit your standards. Because of the shrinkage, I don't think you could get 4 full 1/4 cookies and still maintain the very center (pith) in it. If the cookie is oversize and you don't mind loosing the pith, you could cut into 1/4s and true them up after drying.
Arg, WV beat me to it while I was typing...
Well there you go then. Reading my post again and your comments made me think on it some more and I went back and found my post on this thread when I milled this log (post #333 on page 7) and I found this photo. Now those two pieces are NOT the pieces I am working with (well one may be, but the other is certainly not). I don't know what happened to those slabs. I guess tomorrow afternoon when it warms up and the slab pile melts a bit more I will have to pull it apart and find these and either start on a second shelf or at least replace one side of the one i just started. OS my project just hit a little hitch while I reset. The pair in the photo is much nicer than what I am working with. Thanks man!
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3289.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1573940937)
OK, this concept of cutting cookies into quarters or thirds is brand new to me. You can bet, the next time I have the saw in my hands and a log in front of me, I will be doing some testing. Very neat idea! Thank you both!
I think @ljohnsaw (https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=20640) has the better proposal cutting into 1/3's to allow for shrinkage (Although quarters are probably easier to cut :D) then trimming after drying. There are other threads about drying cookies such as storing them in sawdust and soaking in an antifreeze like solution, and such. Try them all and let us know what works. ;)
Wood stabilizer maybe?
Quote from: WV Sawmiller on February 21, 2020, 09:44:31 PM
Try them all and let us know what works. ;)
:D :D Cookie drying is akin to gas/oil mix here on the forum. I have heard more different solutions to the problem than I can list/ I have yet to hear the method which requires swinging a dead chicken around one's have a specific number of times, but I am sure it will be forthcoming eventually. ;D
Trying Doc's method has been on my list for nearly a year (I even bought the alcohol, but I drank it and now need to get more ;D). But cookies will not make it into this project.
In my opinion, they are really overdone and don't add a lot to a nice piece of work in most cases unless you can achieve the quality like Doc gets and some of the other examples I have seen here. All of those require good dense wood, and I don't have access to any of that. The general public seems to love them though.
Funny story: I was helping the neighbors get their place ready for their wedding back in September. The bride had pots with flowers to define the aisle up to the 'alter'. She asked if I could cut some stumps or something to put the flower pots on, so I grabbed a saw and bucked up a downed small tree in the woods. She was tickled pink. then she wondered if I could make thin ones to put under the flowers on the tables, sure, I whipped off about 30 cookies 4-5" diameter. Then she says "Well I guess I can take back all these round wood things I bought at the store for the tables because yours look better." She had bought a dozen shrink wrapped cookies for $10.95/ea. I told her when the dinner was over, they could use them in the campfire. :D I admit, I don't 'get' cookies, but I will try to work with them as soon as I figure out how to make them look and play nice. :)
thanks for the mention, and I agree that one they are no longer a cont. circle, the stress is gone. the only aesthetic here is if you want the shelves to be live edge as well. It will come to you as all things do. If you cannot decide and it is going in "your wife's house" I guess you could open up that can of worms and ask her opinion. :D . looking good!
SO (here I go getting side tracked) I am thinking if you take a round(ish) cookie and just cut one slot to relieve the perimeter stress, do we think it would dry in a nice state? I need to get some logs and try this. ;D
yes. I will try to send pics, but too much going on till Sunday!
No rush Doc, I know what you are up to, surprised to even see you here. This is NOT a burning issue a all, its maybe for the next one.
did not spend the night at camp. 22nd anniversary. I made my wife "olive Garden"
my maple snowmen all had one split to the center and stopped. I kept one and it is 4 years old and stable.
deer mount. walnut.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/51041/079.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1546898032)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/51041/00D1461E-4352-401F-B259-1A7706E7A9E7.jpeg?easyrotate_cache=1550528687)
cottonwood, 3 years in my container.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/51041/5EC29048-7140-4426-81CD-44626C3B0AFF.jpeg?easyrotate_cache=1559262365)
inch and 1/2 thick. 4 years in a heated/cooled shop (maple). no special care, sopping wet off the mill.
may not have split at all if he was a non-smoker! :D :D :D
Well the phone came today so I am trying to get used to it.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/IMG_20200222_120514967.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1582391718)
So I went back to the lumber pile and found the CORRECT slabs to restart that corner shelf with. :D
Still learning the hard way 😉.
Old greenhorn
You are going to like the smart phone .You are just a short trip on the other side of the river from me .I will drop off some elixir and a couple 100 year old cortland apple trunks with my flat bed dump.I have not cut them down yet but once they stop salting the roads I will do it .
Zeke
Well this weekend was pretty loaded with low level frustration, mostly at myself. A very short list as to what I did, and and even shorter list of what I accomplished.
Mostly I bounced back back forth between heating the shop to 'Epoxy levels' mixing and pouring tiny dribbles into tiny cracks, looking at, and taking a few beginning cuts on the (now) 2 sets of corner shelves as I figure how to make these things with what I have, getting the new phone set up, and some household chores. As for what I accomplished: Getting the phone setup, and some household chores. :(
Now that doesn't mean I didn't learn anything. I learned that it makes little sense to try and make joint cuts on lumber before it is dead flat and has one good edge. I also learned I can't run 5/4 x 16" x 7' maple down the table saw on edge without a helper. I further learned that what looks flat and square on the mill does not necessarily look flat and straight when you start working on it in the shop. The problem with these corner shelves is that they won't fit in the planer I have. I need 18" or more. (and I just now think I thought of one I might use close by)
All the pieces for the coffee table have been flipped and I am working on filling cracks in the other side. Finished a little glaze coat over the 'date penny'. It wound up deeper than I planned, but you can still see it.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/IMG_20200223_141014334.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1582507110)
Lots of little cracks to fill. I am finding the torch helps a lot to warm it and help it penetrate and flow.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/DSCF3807.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1582507130)
My mixing equipment:
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/IMG_20200222_111738249.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1582507096)
(those are shot glasses not 16 once cups, not a lot of filling going on here.)
As for that whole thing with the phone, it seems to work well enough and as expected there are some nice things and some disappointments to deal with. First, it has terrible coverage around my house and this setup doesn't really like the WiFi for phone calls. I also can find no way to transfer photos directly to my computer...yet. I am hoping when I add an SD card it might be easier. I sent out texts to many of my contacts with the new number so they can update my info. Even hooked up with a FF member I haven't seen in a couple of months when he got my update and we caught up a bit. Will probably go and play with some trees and see all the nifty project work he has done since my last visit. He has been very busy.
At the end of the day, I got on one of those quick print sites and ordered some business cards with what I think will be the new business name. Mostly I just wanted something with the new number on it I could hand folks that need the new number. It was a cheap and quick, probably temporary solution to get it off my mind.
A-Z I would welcome a visit anytime. Wish I had something of interest to show you or trade. That elixir sounds pretty appealing. I love horseradish and garlic, and everybody loves honey. Can't imagine how they taste together. ??? But a visit would be great. I would love to see that farm I have heard about in dibs and drabs. Long history there for sure. Maybe I could run up and help you drop and skid those trees?
So this week I will do some re-thinking, maybe change my 2nd project to something else until I get the planks planed and maybe jointed.
I was taught how to add pictures to this site . My wife says just e-mail them and she puts them on the computer in a folder. I retrieve them from there. ( I'm not very techy, no email, no face book , etc. ) Maybe with your experience you might know what she does. Hope this helps. We all like pictures. :laugh: :laugh:. Oh, just type in the e-mail like you are texting.
I used to do that. but you can also get the forum on your phone and go to upload image and put them in your gallery using your phone and taking them direct from you phone album. then I get on the computer to make a post and have the photos already in the gallery.
Old greenhorn
That is what is so great about this forestry forum everyone adds a piece to all of us learning something new every day .I have been cutting apple trees for fire wood since I was old enough to swing an axe.My dad and uncle said that is the only thing apple wood was good for .Most of the apple trees out in the orchards now are dwarf trees which do not get a very big trunk .There is a semi dwarf orchard coming out this spring so I can plant it to a hay crop .And it will just get pushed out and burned because it is all limbs .
But I think it would be interesting to see if you could make something from apple wood from our old orchard.
Zeke
Apple wood makes good barbecue and smoking wood!
There was a brewery near here and a friend as a machinist there. He said there were conveyors and other equipment that used apple wood bearings. I don't know if that's true but I've heard from a couple of people that apple wood was used a lot for bearings and rollers.
I think the old Babbitt bearings (bushing) had wood and a oiler. I thought it was oak, but not sure.
Wow, lots of chit-chat going on I need to catch up to. Blew most of my evening messing with this ding-dang cell phone. First, I found out the carrier they stuck me with is t-mobile which has terrible, if any, coverage in this area. Very frustrating. Talked to a nice young lady this morning who gave me instructions to get my carrier switched to AT&T without starting over. AT&T is still poor, but better. I ran up to the mall and got the right sim card and an SD card. I also asked her about how to get photos directly from the phone to my PC and she said the only way is to email them. That ticked me off, it makes no sense to me. Anyway, came home, installed the sim card and called them. Got a nice fella this time (after being on hold for 30 minutes) who worked through it quickly. He said it would kick in in a few hours and I would be good to go. He also said there was no easy way to get files from phone to PC. Well, in 15 minutes I got a note I was good to go, and it worked for making calls from the house OK and seems to use the wireless, which it did not before. Tried to set up my voicemail, but every time I call it, it tells me the voicemail has not been setup by the user (me) yet and hangs up. Very frustrating. HOWEVER, in my stubborn way, I figured out that all I need to do to connect the PC to the phone and shift files back and forth is change a selection in the phone as to how it uses the USB port. Seems like I have to do it each time, but it works fine and I can drag files back and forth, just the way I wanted. I even copied a bunch of my music over. win-win! So I am much happier with this phone thing. I still need to improve the wireless in the shop, but that is very do-able, just have to wait until the weather gets a little better.
At some point I did something to my left knee and it has bothering me more and more all afternoon, now I walk with a limp. Not sure what is going on. No trauma, so I have no idea. Between the wasted time on the phone, and the bum knee, I decided to take the rest of the night off, what's left of it. I just checked on my epoxy and almost all of it is done on the tops and bottoms except one crack that keeps sucking it down with very little leakage. It has to keep going somewhere. I will have to re pour that again (4th time?), but can start some sanding on the others. I may have some end cracks to pour a little in, but it's getting there.
Now this whole thing about applewood has me intrigued! I don't come into contact with it much. This whole valley is filled with orchards, but I never cross paths with it. I am sure A-Z is familiar with some of the ones in New Paltz and surrounding areas, not very far from me. But those trees are all cut and trimmed by the owners and don't get out in the area much at all. I would love to work with some. If it was used for bearings, it must be pretty hard. I know the grain I have seen in some small turned pieces is very pretty. Yeah A-Z, I would love to come up and see if we can find some pieces big enough to fit on the mill, maybe 4' or so? Have you ever milled it? I would think it would take a nice polish, so now I now have to learn how to polish wood. ;D
Old greenhorn
I have milled apple at 5/4 and 9/4 and it is stacked and stickered in one of our barns but I have not used any of it yet .When you get a break from your busy schedule stop over and you can mill up some apple trunks .They are between 18 inches to 26inches diameter to up to 6 feet long .It is a hard wood but hemlock knots seem to be harder.
Zeke
I did do a little research into applewood. Turns out it is rare to find in normal lumber sizes because it is generally pruned back for crops. Used for fine furniture, mallets, handles. Very dense, high shrink rate, sometimes very neat grain structure. My mouth is watering!
---
SO I didn't get a lot done tonight, began sanding again after epoxy. I had two spots that I had to repour before I can sand. Think I have them now. The sanding opened up, to showed me some more minor defects (the finer you go, the more you see) so I poured them too.
The knee is still bothering me, I may have overbent it a some point. When I walk, it works out a little, but when I first get out of the chair it hurts fairly well. So I am trying to take it easy on that knee.
The phone is finally getting squared away and training me in how to use it. ;D I've got my tunes working on it, I can play them through the truck system, texts work there too, voicemail is squared away, figured out how to keep the data use to zero or a minimum when not around WiFi, and the battery life is super. I am pretty happy with it all around.
I Bought my first app this evening. I have been hearing so much about this SawLogCalc and had tried the free version that I decided to make a capitol investment ($2.99) and get the pro version. It took a little while to figure it out, but what I like is being able to run up a log tally and email it to myself so I have a record or could put it in a spreadsheet. It also has some neat uses to convert stuff. The weights are helpful for skidding with my small machine and mostly, of course, the board foot calculations in any scale I care to use. Pretty happy with it. Another tip I picked up here on the forum that saved me a lot of time messing around trying to find the right one. I think the guy would sell a lot more copies if he was a sponsor here on the forum, he already has fans here.
SO that's it for this day, the knee hurts and I am headed to bed after I fill the wood stove. Getting on a knee to fill that stove is turning into the toughest part of my day. :D
OG, hope your knee feels better soon! When it does you can do a dance like this guy 8)
The SawLogCalc app, do you know if it will let you estimate weights of different species of wood based on diameter and length? I'm thinking it'd be nice to know how much I'm actually trying to move instead of just guessing :P
I'm toying with trying colored epoxy on some projects in the future so it's great to see you playing with it and read how it's going for you. Keep the projects coming!
Brandon
Yes, go download the free version and play with it. It does weight and BF is several scales. Download the instructions on the writers website, that set me straight.
The knee is fixing itself slowly..
I have not played with colored epoxy yet but am getting pretty good with it straight.
I am just in that sanding finishing cycle and the more I sand, the more little things I find that I want to make right. Last night I didn't even go out because we had my daughter and her hubby over for her birthday and it was much more fun to catch up with them. Tonight I will have to do another tiny pour for something else I missed on the first (and second, and third) go-round. Because it is cool in the shop the epoxy is taking longer to hit full cure which delays things. But I keep moving to other parts and sand away. Sanding is thinking time, just mindless tedious work and the time has to be filled with something so I think.
And that's when I get into trouble. I believe that is where I came up with the idea for that last loft which is on hold until I get some logs. Night before last when I was out there I was thinking about the heat and how getting 5 gallons of oil every 6 days or so was beginning to add up. When I go out there the temp is between 32 and 38. After the heat (oil/hot air) is on for about 1/2 hour, it gets up to around 48-52 which is fine for working. However because the heat is off most of the time, the walls, floors, and machines are all cold thermal mass. Keeping in mind this has been a very warm winter, what happens when it hits 10 below? They key is to get that mass on my side of the heat curve and the only way to do that is a full time heat source and oil is not the answer. I heated my last shop entirely with wood and the temp held very well. The only answer I came up with is 'wood heat'. You might say that's a no brainer, but there is a reason I have not done it over the last 32 years, and that is cost. I would have to install a proper chimney and that might run close to a grand. That's where the thought always ended. There is no skimping when it comes to chimneys, it has to be right and with new materials. I actually have a very good stove ready for it, but that chimney cost was always the killer (plus the high ladder work).
Anyway, while we were getting things ready for the kids arrival last night I was thinking on this out loud and my wife started asking questions. This morning she said, "you know, I think we really need to put a proper chimney in the shop if you are going to be out there so much." (I love my wife ;D).
So, now I have another project in the queue but have a timeline for this one that ends in September. I might like to get some of the attic work done before the big heat comes in July and August. It's close to 40 years since I put one of these in so I have to re-learn the codes and make sure everything is done right. I also have to re-furb that stove over the summer, it has been waiting a very long time to be used again. It heated my last shop.
I'll be back at the sanding tonight. Should give me some time to think through where this thing is gonna go. ???
Hey Brandon, if you have some log sizes and species you want me to run, I can do the numbers for you. I can even direct email right from the phone app to you if you like.
Quote from: Old Greenhorn on February 28, 2020, 04:37:30 PMYou might say that's a no brainer, but there is a reason I have not done it over the last 32 years, and that is cost.
That ole dilemna. There are times when the cost, if it brings enjoyment and adds to your life, it is justified.
Yeah Don, it's been so many years and I could not justify it for working out there on the occasional weekend and wood heat just for the evening doesn't make sense. But now, with retirement looming and me spending more time out there day to day, it just makes sense.
I am not looking forward to the roof work or shopping for a supplier for the materials but no pain, no gain, right? Of course, it also adds quite a bit to the wood gathering, splitting, stacking, drying chores. But its still 'free' heat, right? ;D :D
OGH, the only other thought I had is an outdoor wood furnace. not sure if the forced air ones are that efficient. but I think the pipe can run outside, and takes up no floor and clearance space in your shop. but then you have to buy the furnace as well. I love a wood stove in my shop. found my brother a good one used for 250 bucks.
In the mean time, I have used heat lamps (like for chicks) to pre warm and finsh curing paint and epoxy. so just heat the item, not the whole shop. I now have a retired military hospital blanket and fluid warmer I use. goes up to 160°, but I am careful to not leave it on unattended.
We have some funny town regs about the OWB's and I don't think I can legally have one. When they got popular some folks were using them on 1/4 plots in tight residential neighborhoods and smoking everyone out, so they put in big restrictions. There are few on my road with folks that have the land and space to use them right, but it would be tight for me. I did think about it though.
Funny story abut the stove I have: I think it's an Atlanta castings (now out of business) and very nice welded 3/8 plate with a catalytic combuster ( I call it the after burner) and it throws a lot of heat when that thing kicks in and the flue gasses are clean. Anyway. when we were newly married my wife worked in the testing labs for J C Penney's in NYC and they tested everything Penny's sold from underwear to ratchets. SO they got this new stove in for test from the manufacturer and had a hard time setting it up and finding fire wood (in 1981 in NYC). Ever try to hook up a wood stove on the 16th floor of a 40 story office building? ;D But they managed, and they burned some pallet wood to do their BTU assessments. Then they had this stove sitting there and the builder didn't want to ship it back, it was 'used'. So they put it in an employee auction. I bid $27.98. I felt nobody would know, or have the where with all to get it out of the city, let alone have a truck and the handling equipment. I won the auction, picked it up, and was happy as a clam with it all the days I used it. The stove sold for about $800.. It was full time heat in my shop, 7 days a week, fall to spring, for 5 years until we moved north. Now it sits out in the cold storage hut. I need to knock the rust off, make new gaskets, and get this thing heating coffee again.
great deal! I love that. I was thinking more the forced hot air type. but I would rather have a stove I can throw scraps in as well, and see and feel the nearly silent heat. but it will take up some space. so can you build a side addition onto your shop, and put the stove in there, and circulate the heat. I know you are looking for more projects. :D I enjoy throwing out ideas, but I am sure you will make the best choice for your situation and location. with a tall ceiling, at least you can run quite a bit of stove pipe and not so much the expensive chimney pipe. I do use the double wall stove pipe. we have a 16 foot ceiling in the living room. I have bought and sold about 5 stoves that were too good to pass up. not at a profit, but more like a item that needs a home. I have not got a deal that good! love to see a pic. someday. maybe in the summer or fall!
Yeah, the shop ceiling is just about 16' and I figure the stove to be down on the main floor, so a lot of black pipe and about 8' of chimney or so. The plan is to set it where I can still pull a truck into the bay and work on it, so probably up by the work bench area, but in the spring I can pull the black pipe down and move the stove into a corner. That is real easy with my hand crank fork lift. Like moving a chair. Then in the fall just move it back. It means doing an initial re-arranging again but I am getting used to that.
I have to do some measuring and thinking, but I have time. Last shop I had it installed with a straight shot up through the roof. That was a mistake because when I wanted to remove pipe sections, I had to lift the whole chimney straight up. This time I will put a jog in it to make disassembly easier, which will also make alignment easier and let me get it closer to the wall. All cement block walls here, so I really don't want to put in an alcove for it.
I had toyed with the idea of putting a masonry chimney going up the out wall, but I think the pre-fab is less expensive.
OGH - if you are close enough to an exterior wall to safely do it I'd suggest run a shorter length of the black stove pipe out it rather than a longer length out the top. I suspect moving that long pipe each season is going to get real messy real quick. JMHO.
Quote from: Old Greenhorn on February 29, 2020, 06:12:21 AMOf course, it also adds quite a bit to the wood gathering, splitting, stacking, drying chores. But its still 'free' heat, right?
For sure. Wood is one of those heat sources that you get warmed up about 4-5 times by the time it's thrown into the stove.
Just put visions in your mind of the feet up and sitting back in front of that wood stove next winter on a cold winter night. That should motivate the plan:D
Yes and you just watch - anybody visiting the shop in August will still back up to that woodstove or fireplace as if they are actually warming their backside. Its just an instinctive reaction sort of like scratching your head when somebody starts talking about cooties. (I saw you scratch when you read that. :D )
nothing better. you can keep it a little cooler in your shop so you can work without sweating, but if you have to go outside and your hands are cold you can stand next to it, and warm them right up. i love mine. It is perfect for us woodworkers. no one sees our mistakes. and the ends we cut off from our own lumber do not go to waste. my buddy gets a sore back and the first thing he does is put his back to the fire and stands there talking to me sittin by the table saw 20 feet away. usually drinking a Pliny the Elder (muscle relaxer). smiley_beertoast
I realize there is a budget involved, but I think a block alcove with a little wood storing area alongside (with a cool custom sawn coffee cup holding mantel piece) would be nice to have in January. Too cold outside.. no problem just kick back by the fire with some coffee all warm as toast waiting for the epoxy to set up while catching up on the forum. You've got that new phone, I can see it now. Just would save dragging it back and forth and taking apart the chimney every year.
Wow, I step away from the forum for a few hours and look what happens. I have not mastered the multi-quote yet, so I will just do the best I can to respond to each in kind.
Howard, I worked the wall idea through my head a few times. First, I would have to either go out about 30" past the wall and go up to miss the soffet, or cut through the soffet. Either way, it will give me a lot more prefab chimney to buy at a premium. Black pipe is much cheaper. Also, I have done the 'remove the chimney thing' in my 2 previous shops and it actually works much easier for cleaning and maintenance. I finally decided on the interior route. I think it also makes the outside portion more secure and the install is easier.
Don, those visions have been in my head for years. I still have memories of the last shop and having my morning coffee doing phone calls, working on quotes, or just planning the day sitting next to the stove. I am concerned about the amount of wood, the shop may well use more than the house and that would put me up around 10 cord/yr. More than I ever thought of putting up, let alone storing.
Howard, yeah, summer times most folk don't identify with the stove unless it'a a cold evening. I used to sit on that stove when it was in use because it was near my Bridgeport mill. Tough habit to break every fall. ;D (and no, sorry, I did not scratch, well not the first time anyway.)
Doc, yes, I too am a romantic when it comes to such things. The wood seems to heat my soul and as I write this I am trying to get the temp up in the den to get that cleansing warmth into my bones after a day in the shop with cold feet. As for burning mistakes, my wife has me on this little side trip of making chothckie things out of my scrap to sell at flea markets. The scrap used to look like wood stove fodder to me, now it looks different. But mill scraps are a different story. ;D (see below)
Nebraska, I like this idea a lot, I really do. I think for my case it would require about a 6x12 area for what you propose. It would of course, be the biggest part of the budget (I have never done block work and my best resource for that died 5 years ago). I think I would still like to keep the chimney inside running up through the roof, and this too is do-able. However, being the conservative that I am, and possessing a never ending lack of confidence in my plans, I think I would like to run at least one season with just the stove on the shop floor and see how it heats, how inconvenient it is, and whether it is a good decision in the first place. Adding the alcove would be a nice idea, but I have to put it down the road a bit. If I make it long enough I can add an outside door on it and bring wood in that way.
More in the near term, I have a commercial Bunn coffee pot, 2 burner, sitting in the shed that I salvaged. The only issue it has at the time was a small drip. It needs cleaning and when I retire I am anxious to get it going in the shop. I LOVE Bunn coffee pots. 12 cups in 5 minutes. Takes me all the way to lunch time! I need to create a place of honor for it.
So today it was fairly cold and took a while to get the shop decently warm. I was watching the grandsons for a while also this morning. My plan was to get the coffee table fine sanded and start oiling it. I had decided on Danish oil for this because it seemed to brig out the medullary rays much better on a test piece. So I replenished my sanding paper stock, never seem to have all the grits I want, then got to it. Of course, the finer you go, the more you see, and feel. I found some more tiny cracks. So I did another tiny pour and also did the one I missed 4 times. SO I never got to finishing.
I had time to kill, so I grabbed some scraps and made more chotchkies. All random, just winging it. All the slot sizes vary, just looking for what works best. I made about a half dozen.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/IMG_20200229_170027127.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1583019535)
Side views;
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/IMG_20200229_170057699.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1583019554)
And yes, that is a new 'business card' you see there. I made those because I just needed something with my new phone number on it to give friends. Nothing official yet. Just kind of trying the name out.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/IMG_20200229_170126451.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1583019580)
I am finding that all these 'devices' have different thicknesses so I will have to do some research and settle in on some standard slot sizes.
Anyway, not a big progressive day, but I keep moving on. Thanks for all the thoughts on the wood stove, helps reinforce that I am heading in the right direction. If I can't sand tomorrow, then probably I will do some cleaning and storing of stuff in the shop, never really settled into the new workbench downstairs and have stuff I put in boxes that need to be dealt with.
Nice! As far as slot sizes for devices, you can go wide(r), just make them deep(er) and it will work for most anything.
Not much happened today here. the dishwasher went down last night with a hard breaker short. The wife was not pleased. So I waited for her to get it unloaded most of the morning so I could tear into it. I hate working on dishwashers. Finally got it out around 11am and disconnected the power feed, water and drain without too much trouble. Didn't see anything obvious. started tracing wires, turns out the main controller is inside the door, removed another dozen screws, checked connectors and then I found one connector on the main controller which was toast, totally melted, smoked out. Lucky it didn't catch on fire. Even if I replaced the main controller I would still have to find someway to make a new connector and then find what caused the problem, which I suspect might be a seized motor or something like that. I did the math in my head and decided we were done with this dishwasher. ;D Wife is still not happy.
SO by the time I got out to the shop it was about 2:30. Ran out of oil pretty quick. Did some final sanding to take out the last epoxy pours lumps, then bought it down to something approaching 'pretty smooth'.
Then I started hitting it with some neutral Danish Oil. It really brought out the grain and medullary lines. Here is one leg with the oil and one without.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/IMG_20200301_154404488.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1583107759)
Those rays are really starting to pop, I hope it shows in this photo fairly well.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/IMG_20200301_151606166.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1583107781)
I stuck it back together and find that the joints are a bit looser than before I did all the sanding. Also the pegs will need a lot more work to be fitted. I expected this so I didn't spend a lot of time on the pegs until it was near finished. Now is about that time. I need to stretch the holes on one end a bit, might have to make some new pegs, no big deal.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/IMG_20200301_155933021.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1583107795)
I need to do another coat of oil to even out some blotches and I will start focusing on getting those pegs right. I am thinking when it has a couple of coats of urethane, it will tighten back up again. I also need to finally decide on a finished height. I am thinking 19" is abut right, which means I have to cut around 5" off the height.
SO not much done, but something anyway. Gonna loose more time this week installing the new dishwasher.
I have seen my wood stove smoke more than my OWB. ::) Stick with the wood stove and let it smoke and all is good.
Just so you know,the OWB now, don't smoke much at all. But my FIL knows they ALL smoke ALL the time, because he knew "someone" that had one. He had no idea the kind, or what they burned in it, but he "knows" they smoke All the time. ::)
Seem like there was a member that got a OWB, a newer one. The neighbor came over when it was being set up and said they would complain about it. ::)
I think another member lived in some town in Maine. The town zoned all sawmills, so he could not run one at his home. He said there was a person years ago that had a circular saw with a big diesel motor and did not keep up on the waste. So all sawmills was lumped into this zoning.
I like the card and device holders! I'll have to make a few with the off cuts :)
I wish I could have a wood burning stove, or fireplace :( Unfortunately any "solid" fuel burning is heavily regulated in my area during winter due to poor air quality. I get why they do it and I guess I agree, but it takes the fun out of the simple things in life like a wood fire. Gas fires just aren't the same to me.
Brandon
There isn't much that can warm a soul like an appropriate fire.... I like your business cards and the various holders, it all looks good. If you were closer I have a concrete saw that would make the addition to put the stove in easier. It will take a fair pile of wood to heat that shop but I bet it's not to hard to come by in that neighborhood. I've been surprised about how much slab waste my little mill made over the last year, it makes heat just fine. It's a significant amount of my heat this year.
Yeah, Brandon hit on gas (LPG) for me and I looked into it and ran the numbers because it is convenient, but the costs didn't change my overall situation much compared to oil and that is just not workable for a winter season. I know I will go from using 4-5 cord for the house to perhaps up to 10 cord for the winter with the shop and that is a shoot load of wood. I am running out of dead trees to cull. I am hoping on the slabs to help out and I have a section of neighbors property behind my shop with dead leaners that need to be cleared and he told me to 'have at it' whenever I am ready. That makes for a short skid to the shop :) .
My wife keeps harping on all these little things from scraps to have on a table when I do a show or market. She says the 5 to 20 buck items can really make the difference between a good day and a bad day. SO I am trying different stuff. Gotta get my own planer and jointer. I had a new idea for a tabletop mini-bookshelf that would hold about 12-14" worth of books. They are kind of handy on a desk or in a kitchen, but it's jointing work. She figures those little business card things should start at 5 bucks. I suppose that could add up.
Slow progress since Sunday. Monday night I installed the new dishwasher and got almost no time in the shop except to dump some oil in the tank and bleed it out. Took 10 minutes to bring the shop up to 50° because it has been warm and after weeks of evening and weekend heating, the shop is dried out now. I did a little more looking and thinking on those pegs that need adjusting. Last night I had some other chores to attend to but took the table apart and started working on lengthening the slots with careful chisel work. It's a lot of tiny cuts, then fit and try, then more tiny cuts. Trying not to overdo it. Also started a new pair of pegs. I got far enough along to know that this will work fine and fit properly when I get it done. So a short session but I made headway.
My son has his truck in the shop now to do a water pump so that fills the bay, but gave me a chance to see how the woodstove would fit with a full length truck in there. It seems workable. One thing for sure, a year ago if he had his truck in there, I could not do any work at all except to my Mule in the other bay. Now the new loft has added just enough room for me to work without disruption and still have the two saws and other stuff accessible upstairs. (We moved the RA saw up there late last week sometime.) For this I am very grateful. I think my son is too because he doesn't hear me complaining as much abut the truck. He will have to do the work today but let it set over night for the gasket to dry before he finishes it up tomorrow. He was working on a pre-spring cleanup at an estate yesterday and says he has a 16' dump trailer full of firewood logs to drop off for the shop. He also has some tall spindly hickory and ash (long dead) out by the pond that he wants me to come an drop. We may have to move a foot bridge to be safe on one of them. Two of them have to be cut at the 8' line so I have to think on that a bit and look it over.
No work tonight either, I have to go to a retirement dinner for the boss ( 8) ).
So i am just plugging slowly and waiting for the weekend when it will be cooler again after this beautiful warm week. Mud season is back already. Not like @Swampdonkey has (or will very soon have), but we have it, just the same. It is starting to feel like prime milling weather.
Just checking in. I lost a few evenings this week and not a lot of progress to show. Lots of sanding. The temps have been on a warming trend so the shop is heating quicker, easier, and is more comfortable working. Last night I spent time refitting those pegs and broke one and made a replacement. I am rethinking my choice of Ash for the pegs and may just start over with oak. But the fit-up is getting better and with the pegs tapped in the table is again rock solid with no shake. I am pleased about that. Today I need to whack 5" off the bottom of the legs to bring the height to about 19" which seems about right for a coffee table. Then I guess I will work toward finishing it in earnest. I have added a good rubbed in coat of Danish oil and want to do it once or twice more before the urethane. It brings up a nice shine and makes the details pop. I also have too go back and do one more tiny pour on a crack that keeps widening. I don't seem to be getting the epoxy to adhere well on one wall and it's a small crack.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/IMG_20200306_200337740.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1583578946)
Beginning to look toward the next few projects. I may begin on some simple slabs benches like i made last summer, but this time for sale. I have a cookie sitting in the shop that I should work on, and I have some bench leg stock that should be planed before I return that planer. Hoping to make a trip up to my buddies cabinet shop next weekend with those corner shelf pieces to plane down. He is still recovering from his heart attack, but looking to at least get in the shop and direct somebody else doing some work. I really should start making a list. Tomorrow I have a tentative date with another FF member to go cruise hi place and mark some trees for TSI work, then next week or two we will get them down and I can get a few logs for the loft build. So things are happening, just slowly.
OG looking good! I really appreciate you sharing the coffee table build and what's working and what you'd do different. I have some ideas beginning to take root in my mind of what I want to do with the wood I'm milling and your coffee table build and some of the other things you're working on are helping me in planning my builds. So again my friend thank you :)
I may use the peg idea on the bench I'm building for the missus for the table. I think it'd make it look really nice and from what you're reporting it'd be very solid :)
Keep up the good work 8)
By the way what is TSI?
Brandon
Looks like your wood is not totally dry, still shrinking, therefore the persistent cracks.
Quote from: Old Greenhorn on February 24, 2020, 09:29:59 PMso now I now have to learn how to polish wood.
If you're not familar, have a look at Beall wood buffing system. Very easy. I look forward to using it whenever I can. Here (https://www.amazon.com/Beall-Tools-Wood-Buff-System/dp/B0037MDCPI/ref=sr_1_2?hvadid=78340336782757&hvbmt=bb&hvdev=c&hvqmt=b&keywords=beall+buffing&qid=1583588629&sr=8-2)
Just came in for a last cup of coffee, so some quick responses.
TT: fine finishing has always been my worst skill so it is something I continue to works on. I have looked at that buffing system and would like to try it as soon as I can sell a few things and make some money. Curious as to how much labor is involved in a small table.
WDH I had thought there was some of that going on too, so I checked it again and get 9% MC. Just worked on those cracks again and now see that they are not really opening up, I did not do a good job of getting the epoxy down into the crack. This time I poked it in with a toothpick and really saw how bad my previous pours were. Had to keep going back as it settled into the crack. I think I may have it this time. It is hard to get the epoxy to flow into those small cracks even with added heat.
Brandon, from me you should be learning things to avoid! :D ;D Some of these are one-offs and some require further development.
TSI stands for Timber Stand Improvement. It's selective cutting to release better trees to grow. This member has 40 acres and has done a lot of work in a short period to improve his property, but it is an ongoing thing and he is ready for another round.
Well, back at it, much to do and I have to work the chores in somewhere too. Later folks.
Pretty good 9 hour day, but I am pooped. Got the legs trimmed on the coffee table and refinished the ends. Did the last (i hope) tiny epoxy fill done. I made about 10 more of those device stands, sanded and oiled them. I pulled out that old cookie, it's pretty pithy and spalted. I think I would have to use a bunch of epoxy just to make it stable. Probably can't do this as a specific project so I will work on it in small pieces between other jobs. My common sense tells me to just toss it, but I want to give it a try anyway. It will likely be a failure, but an education.
Then I went out to the slab pile and grabbed some slabs that I will make into benches, mostly 4 feet long, one 5 footer, and one that I would like to try a stool out of. I cut and put about 6 of them in the shop to get started on. I also planed some leg stock up, but I need more. Then I cleaned and oiled up the planer to get it ready to go back to it's owner next weekend.
I had hoped to get back out there tonight and sharpen my chainsaw and mix some fresh gas, but I am too pooped out. Tomorrow I head over the NYBHH's place and the plan is to mark some trees. None the less, I will throw some gear in the truck just in case we decide to do more.
Moving along.
Quote from: Old Greenhorn on March 07, 2020, 09:52:14 AMCurious as to how much labor is involved in a small table.
I wouldnt have thought of using it for a table. I like it for small items that I can hold up to it while it is spinning. But I see they suggest that it can be used for small furniture.
I use it mounted in my lathe. They do mention using it in a hand held polisher though cant see this demonstrated in their instructions. They also say that wood is best sealed first with sanding sealer or oil like Watco but not linseed oil. I havent ever done that. Just after turning a small item I can use the poisher on the lathe to have it finished within 15 minutes or so.
Full instructions are here: Beall Instruction page (http://www.bealltool.com/instructions.php)
Well it was a really nice day. I didn't get much accomplished, but had a really nice day. Sometimes you just have to do that. Headed over to NYBHH's place first thing this morning, and it seems when we get together the yacking starts and the clock spins. WOW, what a job he has done at his place since I was last there. I will let him tell the story if he has time, but he surely puts me to shame. He is going to have one heck of a nice shop in pretty short order at the rate it is going. When I was last there, they had a guest house on that spot with serious issues and since then it is gone and there is all new construction from below grade on up. He also put a complete new roof on his barn while he was resting, I guess. Then between all that other stuff he built himself a gorgeous 8' woodworking bench.
We did some cruising and found the 2 ash trees he needs out soon, one is in a tricky spot that will have to drop across his driveway and the logs will like be too heavy for his tractor grapple to lift, but we think we figured it out. AT any rate it's the kind of tree most of us would want a partner on. Felling it will require a spotter, and all the bucking and cleaning up is a lot of work. Further out in the woods we measured a couple of white pines that will fit with his tree/land/future plans and will help me out with my last loft. He asked me a couple of times if it would cover my needs and I was embarrassed to admit I was pretty sure we were good, but I didn't have the numbers with me. I had not reviewed them yesterday as planned and I did all the math weeks ago. When I got home I checked and there is more than enough for the task. So we have a plan for next weekend.
As we were walking and yacking we came across this tree with deep furrowed bark, neither of us knew for sure what it was.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/IMG_20200308_100857713.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1583715135)
But then we realized that the winter had not eradicated the leaves, so I took a photo of that.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/IMG_20200308_100910956.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1583715130)
I was thinking this was beech, but in consulting my references, it could be Elm. What do y'all think?
We walked and talked and then talked some more, then we said goodbye and talked some more. By the time I left it was 1pm. I had a great time just relaxing hearing and asking about his projects and seeing the beautiful work he is getting done.
One of the pines we found that we thought about taking down had this:
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/IMG_20200308_100007612.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1583715061)
It was about 12' above the stump. But we decided to let it be for a habitat tree. We also saw a fisher cat right in this same area, which we both thought weird. Also saw a hawk hard on the hunt and pretty vocal, maybe looking for her/his mate? Anyway, a most enjoyable morning.
I got home around 2, had lunch and started going through my gear for next weekend because I haven't dropped any trees since the fall. Made up some new gas and just checked everything else over. I need to dig out my chains and binders still.
I emailed a guy on CL with a 12-1/2" Delta planer, and have an appointment to go see/buy it Tuesday at noon. Turns out he is 2 blocks from my workplace. Good price and it will do the stuff I need except for the big boards. I didn't want to spend the money at this time, but it's a newer one, lightly used from what I can see, and the seller does not sound like a nut job (rare around here, buyers too).
The weather was so nice that I did one of those 'walk around assessments' looking at the trees, my messes around the yard, and making some mental plans for going forward. I checked out back behind the shop where there is a mess of trees hanging that have needed cleaning up for a while. I avoided it because they won't hurt anything when/if they fall and they were mostly rotted junk. Well, on closer inspection it turns out some of them are not rotten and I figure there is at least one cord of firewood in there and a couple of logs I would like to throw on the mill before I decide to burn them. Since I will be burning in the shop next winter, this comes as a bit of a windfall (pun intended). I also see some vertical trees that should be dropped that are about half firewood and half usable logs. Once again, these are not on my property, but the landowner not only said I could "cut 'em all down" but thanked me for doing it. The trees I looked at are only 200' from the back door of my shop, so I figure transport won't be too much trouble. ;D
Anyway, as I said, not much work done today, but some planning and re-assessment which was in order anyway was done. I am still pretty pooped from yesterday and the time change is messing with my head a bit. There is no sense in pushing it when you are tired and all afternoon I was tired.
The tree is chestnut oak, Quercus montana.
Looking good!
Wonder what caused that weird hole in the tree, looks man made to me.
Wish I lived closer, I'd be offering to help fell trees with you though I'm sure we'd end up talking more than working which can be just as good :)
I may learn a few things not to do from your posts but I also learn a lot of what I'd like to try and the positive peer pressure to stop watching TV and actually do something useful! So for that I thank you my friend and say Keep On Keeping On 8)
Brandon
That there hole was done by a pilliated woodpecker. We have some large and highly motivated ones around here. They can hear the bugs and grubs inside a tree and just go for it.
Yes, WDH is of course correct, it's a Chestnut oak. Rare around here and it wasn't on the top of my thinking list.
Also, a correction, that was a mink we saw run past us, not a fisher cat. My identification skills were pretty poor yesterday. ;D :D
I have a spruce on my place the pileated woodpeckers have attacked that looks a lot like your picture. They knock off chips 2-3 inches long and bigger than kitchen matches. I have a number on my property and they are one of my favorite birds. One lit in a tree about 20' from me last week while I was working on my new shed but flew before I could get his picture.
That oak tree probably has acorns twice the size of marbles and a deer stand near it might be a good idea as they love those big acorns which are a type of white oak. I have many on my place and years ago I had a climbing stand and was bowhunting on a ridge among them and I'd keep hearing the leaves behind me rustle, stop, munching on acorns, repeat. I was about to go crazy not being able to see but knowing it was a huge buck coming straight to me. When he finally got in sight out of the corner of my eye he turned out to be a big fat groundhog with a stubby tail that looked like an old barbers shaving brush. I let him go and saw him several more times over the next couple weeks.
I can't tell you the number of times I shouldered the gun in anticipation of what was 'obviously' a large browsing buck only to see a fat happy squirrel come out of the Laurel. ;D :D
I will check for the acorns when we are cutting this weekend.
OK, I have to share this, it can't wait. So I found this delta lunchbox planer on CL for 200 bucks that looked fairly 'not too old' and lightly used and made arrangements to see it today at lunchtime. The seller was a nice fella, had it ready and plugged in with a board for me to try it out on. Try as I might could not get the board to feed, let alone throw chips, just dust coming out with me leaning on the board to feed it. The guys says, 'OH, you really have to crank that handle down to make it feed and cut, look here, I did all these boards with that planer." Well I have it cranked down to where I consider the board jammed, he reaches over and gives it another half turn and the board reluctantly start to feed, but just dust coming out. I unplug it and reach in and feel the blades. Seem like they should be sharper. Then he grabs one of his "planed boards" and shows me how it was cutting. At this point it all became clear.
Me: 'You planed THIS board on THAT planer?!'
Him: 'sure did! I did all of these."
Me: 'Well I see the problem'
Him: 'Where?'
me: [points to board] 'you see all these dots? Those are nails, there must be 30 of them in this board alone.'
Him: [smiles] 'yup, like I said, it planed all those boards'
Me: [shakes head, looks at the ground] 'planers don't cut nails, the nail wins that fight every time.'
him: 'OH'
silence for a bit
Him: 'Then I guess I shouldn't run any boards with nails through that newer planer either (12" Grizzly)?'
Me: "no, you should not, in fact maybe you should give me that one for safe keeping.' :D
We both laughed, he knocked off 25 bucks, I will have to go over this whole thing, but it will do the small stuff I need until I can afford to graduate up.
Geez, some folks just shouldn't operate machinery. He was a very nice fella though, asked for my card to maybe get some wood from me down the road.
The only planer that guy is qualified to use is a manual block planer and I am not even sure about that.
Quote from: Bandmill Bandit on March 10, 2020, 03:59:47 PM
The only planer that guy is qualified to use is a manual block planer and I am not even sure about that.
Being a fan of hand planes and old planes I'm not sure I'd want to see one subjected to whatever this polite but misguided fellow might do to it :'( :'( :'(
OG, you're a good man. I'm not sure the look of "How did you not know this??" wouldn't have showed so loudly on my face that I'd have offended the gentleman. Sometimes I'm a little full of myself and forget that I've done some rather silly things because I didn't know better at the time and some nice person educated me in a kind way. Of course life then usually gives me a quick lesson in humility to remedy that lapse in manners on my part ;)
Glad you got a good deal and with luck the only thing really wrong with the planer is the need for a new set of blades :)
Brandon
It takes all types, ::). Oh well a few new blades and a little time and you're good. I bet you'll even sell him lumber without the nails in it. 8)
I am going to assume that the lumber he destroyed the blades on the planer with was reclaim lumber from an old building and NOT lumber he milled himself? Or is there a deeper story here?
Yeah bandit, it was reclaimed (mostly ;D) lumber. He could not fathom running a saw mill. Read below for the rest of it.
Nebraska, I wouldn't be surprised if I sell him something. I'll have to remember to ask if he wants nails added. :D
Brandon, he was (is) a good guy, has a sense of humor and also very clearly knew he was hacking his way through things. No offense taken or offered.
SO I got the planer, then got a call from my son to look at a simple tree job, just drop them. A simple 4 tree cluster of dead hickory.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/IMG_20200310_170428015.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1583884888)
That's a pump house, fixed in the ground with a water pump and pressure tank in it. And yes, it's 4 trees, not three. Each one is tricky. Not so easy to move and reset that little shed either. There is also some ornamentation on the one tree to be dealt with. The drop zone contains a footbridge that will have to be moved. Trying to from dropping them in the pond or whacking the corner of the pump house. It is park like grounds, so no skidders or useful equipment can be moved in. Golf carts are pretty much it. Also there is a dead ash with a big crook in it aimed at the bridge, so that bridge has gotta move, not taking a chance.
So anyway, get home with the planer (I had already ordered a pair of blades for it this afternoon). After dinner went out and opened it up. HOLY COW SWEET MARTHA! The edges were so far gone off the blades that the blade clamps were beating against the stock. You can see the blade and clamp in the left side of the photo but as you move right, they become one.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/IMG_20200310_191855104.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1583884842)
Here's the blade itself:
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/IMG_20200310_192244113.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1583884875)
These are the original blades with the Delta stamp on them, and of course, the second side was never used! Pristine. I stoned off the bumps and galls to make them flat again and flipped the blades. Put it all back together threw in a piece of 8/4 oak and went at it. It cuts like a dream and you could not ask for a better finish.
Of course, this is a light duty lunch box planer, no illusions about that, but with a little patience it does a great job and that's what I hoped for and expected. Now I have to figure out some way to suck the chips out of it. ;D
My used blades would cut like razor blades compared to those.
Well I hadn't planned on it, but I decided to change projects tonight. The last few days at work have been rough and I have not really done much out there in the evenings. Gonna hit the rack early tonight too, another stressful day for tomorrow on the block.
Anyway, I am getting a little tired of working on that coffee table every night and that's usually when I get sloppy and hasty. So I picked something else to change things up. I had this simple idea for a desktop bookshelf, the kind that would only hold a small set of books but be easy to move around. There is one on my desk here that my Pop made when he was killing time on the transport ship to the Philippines during WWII and he had it on the desk in his Sub Chaser. Said it kept things in order.
I found a piece of spalted ash that I milled over a year ago and it has been in the shop for a year. It's dry and was about 7/8 thick (here and there :D). I used the new planer and took it to an even 5/8" then cut the parts on the table saw and made dado joints where the sides meet the bottom. The plan is to glue and screw it with brass screws after final shaping and sanding. I have to think about how I want to add some shape to the tops of the end pieces before I go further and I also need to pick up screws. The planer worked well, the table saw worked well and so far I have not screwed this thing up. But I have time yet. ;D
I did a little work on listing my inventory of supplies. Trying to coordinate a shared spreadsheet between my phone and desktop because I am loosing track of what grits of sanding belts and disks I have and buying the wrong ones when I am in the store and take a guess. I use the phone to record things I need as it occurs to me. I also keep spreadsheets to track the time I spend on projects and another to list projects that I want to do or have done. I figure it may help with pricing later on. Maybe not. It's a work in progress.
There is a local surplus place (a real one, think: army/navy store meets industrial commercial junk clearance) and they just put up a photo yesterday of these cases of table legs, probably pine, maybe maple. 1-1/8 diameter by 14" long for a buck a piece. I am going to run over at lunchtime tomorrow and see what kind of a deal I can get on 50 of them. It's real easy to drill a hole with a forstener bit and glue in a turned leg. I figure I can make some stools and short benches with them. Seems too good to pass up. We shall see.
SO I ran out at lunchtime and checked out those 14" spindles. Wound up buying a box of about 46pcs for 35 bucks or .76/ea, not bad I thought. Also, they had some zip up hooded sweatshirts and I have been looking for a lighter weight one to keep and wear in the shop. Brand new, 5 bucks, how could I go wrong. They also had a barrel full of handsaws that could probably be pretty nice with a little cleanup, but I didn't let myself get sucked in. The longer I stay there, the more I spend, so I got in and out in 10 minutes, including dickering time. ;D
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/IMG_20200312_123149147.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1584043145)
So, what do you think? Did I do good? I have no specific idea what I will use these for. They appear and feel like maple to me. They were bought and surplussed by a company here that makes quality toys and mobility aids for disabled children and adults. Brand new, not sure why they dumped them.
they would be fine for legs, and or num-chuks. also a rolling pin that puts lines in the dough. :)
Turns out they are Maple Doc, turned out by a shop up in Maine. WIsh they didn't have the finish on them. Not sure how to get that off easily.
Got out there tonight for a bit and worked on the little bookshelf. Got it glued and screwed and put on a layer of Danish Oil.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/IMG_20200312_202219592.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1584060032)
Maybe I made it a bit long, dunno. Have to go back and do a little more fine sanding that showed up after the oil was on. No biggie. I don't know that anyone besides me would have an interest or need for them, but it was an idea I wanted to try.
I tried to find an 1-1/8" bit in my shop, but I jump from 1" to 1 1/4" in just about every bit type I have. Back to the store again. ;D I did want to try out those legs and start messing with them. It will have to wait a bit.
do you have a lathe to spin them on, and hit with sandpaper. or does your radial arm saw have a chuck opposite the blade like my Dad's did. could rig a support for the other end like a live center, chuck it up with a screw into it or something.
Yeah, I guess I could rig up some kind of spin jig, but that is a lot of sanding. Maybe do it in the drill press. I think the RA is way too fast. I'll play with them a bit and see what I come up with. I might consider painting them too. That might give some nice contrast.
they may look fine as they are. you can do testing to find out the finish type. or just take one and put finish over it and see how it looks. especially if you are going for bulk production for sale at craft style venues . cannot put you heart and soul into every one for sale to the public. one offs are for family and friends, in my opinion.
Quote from: doc henderson on March 13, 2020, 10:07:56 AMcannot put you heart and soul into every one for sale to the public.
That is a hard lesson to learn. My standards are very high, but that can be a weakness as stated in the quote.
Yes WDH, Doc's comment resonated with me. I know and am conscious of what he means as well as your comment about being one's own worst enemy. In fact, I am never happy with the stuff I make which is probably why I can't think of a thing that I have made in the last 20 years that is in my house. (When we were fist married and had no money I made 'stuff' which is still floating around, but not stuff I point at with pride, but my wife likes it, so...). I never realized that until now. I don't think much of the stuff I make. I am just pleased that I am learning how to make it and it does look pretty cool. Other folks seem to like these things, or so they say and I am fixin' to see if they are willing to buy it. ;D
Hence I tried putting a coat of polycrylic on that book shelf tonight because I have never used it and bought a small can today to try it. It does seem better with this Ash, but it is tricky to apply. So I will see what this looks like in the morning.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/IMG_20200313_201919134.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1584148119)
This finish was so clear it was hard to see where it was, and where it wasn't. Hence my puzzled and focused look (also wanted to see how that 'other' camera worked on my phone).
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/IMG_20200313_202018302.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1584148125)
You can see by my lousy joints that I am not really good at this, but I will work on it. I think these might be nice for cookbooks in the kitchen, but who knows if anybody uses books anymore besides us old folks.
I also finally remembered to bring toothpicks out to the shop so I could do that little epoxy pour on a couple of remaining cracks in the coffee table legs. Haven't touched them in a week and have to get back on it. (I need the toothpicks to push the epoxy down in these small cracks and get the air bubbles to come up.)
I also picked up a forstener bit today to try boring holes to see how those legs will fit. I am painfully low on pocket cash halfway through our pay period (bought that planer the other day, remember?) so buying that and the polycrylic was pretty much my limit. Turns out I bought the wrong size. Got an 1-1/8" instead of 1-1/4". >:( DOPE! So it will have to wait a little longer and I added to my set of forstener bits. Eventually I will have them all.
Funny little thing:I was browsing CL today and found a guy that makes the exact same little phone/tablet device stands that I made a week or so ago (scroll back). They look exactly like mine except I think he made them from box store 2x4's. He is asking 10 bucks a pop for them. When I made the samples, my wife said they were worth 10 bucks, 7 minimum. I was thinking nobody would pay more than 5. I gotta think about that now. Maybe my wife was right?! (Once again.) Of course, I have no idea how many of these the guy has sold.
Anyway, I made some slow and plodding headway. Tomorrow is another day.
your look seems normal to me, and I put lots of light around when I spray finish to see the reflection to know when finish is wet and able to flow. the joints look fine!
I find that the polyacrylic spray cans "sputter" and leaves little glops or globs on the piece being sprayed. I really do not like that.
Well I didn't think of spraying. I got a small can to brush on.
now you get a tree that means something to the family, and make those for your family, maybe even the grand-"men".
OGH,
Everything looked good till you posted the picture! Then I had to do a double take as I thought you were my old roommate from when i worked in Saudi a long time ago. :D
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/38064/IMG_20191003_0004~0.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1584191656)
Which one is Fred?
The taller one (on the left).
Yes, I can see some similarlys :D
EDIT: The last word in the sentence above is supposed to be 'similarities' dang autocorrect! >:(
sometimes on rustic i brush or roll (on large items like benches) until the porous grain is filled, sand, then spray the final coats. I use spar urethane on nearly everything, uv protected.
Quote from: Old Greenhorn on March 14, 2020, 03:43:03 PM
Yes, I can see some similarlys :D
You didn't think I was talking about the one in the middle did you? :D :D
Yeah Doc, I am trying different methods to see what works best for me. Time matters too. ;D The polycrylic is very clear and does not affect the light color of the wood. I like that, but it is more time consuming to apply. I could not find it in a spray can. One of these days I will try a foam brush on a larger piece.
WV, you did notice that I didn't ask if Fred "was the one on the right or the one on the left"? I figured I would leave it wide open to save us both possible embarrassment. :D
Not much done today, but a full day anyway. In no particular order:
I ran back to town and got the right forstener bit for those legs I bought this week, grabbed a piece of oak and made a little short rectangular foot stool. Cut the legs and glued them in, and that sits drying. I sanded all the device stands and the little bookshelf, then re-coated them. 2 hours later I gave them another coat. The stuff dries fast. I did another small pour on the coffee table leg cracks. One I got finalized, the other still need a little more. These tiny cracks take more time than a big pour. At least this time I have them masked so there are no leaks, but getting the epoxy to suck into those tiny slots just take time. I also did some beginning pours on that cookie that is starting to show up in photos. It's a mess so I know this will be the repository for any excess epoxy I have as time goes on. I think I have the main center split (heart) filled and this thing is really dry, but also very punky in places. My back is achy from all the half bending.
My neighbor also called and asked me to check some trees that are 'endangering his driveway'. I looked them over, they are not and have been like that for nearly a year. I'll clean them up next time I am out with the Mule and have a few minutes. Now that they are up here full time for a few weeks or more escaping the city to bring the panic up this way, he is looking around. I get that it's a real problem, but some folks are getting carried away and not thinking things through entirely. If I ever get to the point I start ordering gallons of water on amazon, I hope somebody will do me a kindness and shoot me, just sayin'. ;D Oh, and I also made the mistake of stopping at the local food store to get solo shot cups (for mixing epoxy) and toothpicks and there was not much in the paper goods aisle. People are crazy. Yes, there were quite a few people on line, but not a huge amount. Down in town at the big food stores it is an entirely different story, just crazy nutso.
Just another day.
Today was pretty much the same as yesterday, lots of little things. I spent an hour or two working on a Facebook page for the sales end. Keeping it very low key for now and not very descriptive, just the basics. I had gotten some interest expressed in that little bookshelf (go figger) and expect at least a small order to result. Got out to the shop, did what I really think is the last tiny pour to fill one more crack on that coffee table...finally. It just sucked it down when I shut off the lights last night or something, I dunno, but there was still a small void this morning and no leakage. I sanded the other table leg where I had finished all the epoxy work and re-oiled it. Looks good. When I sand and re-do the second leg tomorrow I will be ready for urethane, so I figure that's where most of my evenings will go this week, with no cutting or sanding to keep the dust down. I should do good cleanup first.
I fired up the new planer and took down 3 well dried Ash boards, then cut enough pieces to make 7 of those bookshelves. Tomorrow I will try to get the dados done before the cleanup takes place. It's a good feeling to make nice clean and straight flat boards. I think I am headed in the right direction with my choices so far. Dumb luck and good advice, I guess. ;D
Oh, and here is that foot stool I whipped up yesterday. I thought I posted a photo, but it seems to have slipped my mind. It is sitting on that big pithy cookie I am slowly working on.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/IMG_20200315_104556389.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1584322465)
Lots of little things going on and not too much being finished right now. But that should change soon I hope.
Well I am spending more time looking at that FB page I made and thinking about it than I should, but this whole virus thing is really distracting. I have stayed away from participating in the discussions on the forum because I had enough of that during my active years in EMS. I understand the enemy, know the drill, and read the right stuff. I lost my tin foil hat decades ago. ;D
So getting into the shop and diverting my mind from this other 'stuff' becomes important because at work it is even worse (don't ask, I might share it). Got out there last night and got the first finish coat on the coffee table top, it looked GREAT! also did one leg, but the other leg STILL had one little blow hole in the epoxy after sanding and I am NOT going to let that go, so I have to do yet one more tiny pour to fill it. ARRGGGGHHHH! but this is how it goes in this world and i have to learn to put my zen mask on and work with the flow, right? I also put a urethane coat on one of the device stands to see how it would look compared to the water based stuff.
The top looks good to me:
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/IMG_20200317_183654311.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1584496842)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/IMG_20200317_183708836.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1584496874)
Tonight I went out and everything I did looked good but the temp in the shop overnight was not warm enough for everything to cure hard plus I think the humidity might have been a bit high (gotta get a meter out there). So I could not sand it for the next coat. I let it all set, as is, for another day. I cut dados on the book shelves and set up a drilling rig for doing the screw holes. That was my evening.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/IMG_20200317_192556737.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1584496881)
I am trying to get my to my short run production skills and ways of thinking back in the groove. I did it for more than 48 years in metal, working in wood is somewhat different, more forgiving in some ways, but less forgiving in others. I am working on that advice my journeyman cabinet maker friend gave me "It's time for you to stop thinking like a machinist and start thinking like a woodworker". Sage advice that. :)
that big bench is extra pretty.
Well, I have been trying to catch up with the reading here and just that has been tough enough, I may have missed a few posts. Things are hopping here in my state and with my job. I spent the whole day yesterday setting up a home office work space. No time in the shop, did a little more work this morning, then headed out there. I got the pieces finished for some of those little bookshelves. did all the screw holes and cut the tops, then glued and screwed.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/IMG_20200322_150002147.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1584921206)
I seem to have a verbal order for a few of these already. Might have to make some more to sell.
I also sanded and put another coat on the tabletop and one leg and the foot stool. That footstool may be done if this coast comes out OK.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/IMG_20200322_154445048.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1584921220)
In some ways I am getting better at this finishing thing, but in some ways I am finding flaws easier. I should really stick to do finishes when it is daylight, I see more stuff and make less errors.
Tomorrow is the first day of working from home and I am not looking forward to it, but we have to do what we have to do.
I hope everyone is staying healthy and in a good mental state. I hope y'all are sleeping better than I am. ;D
Well, I have to admit I am having a difficult time doing this 'work from home' thing. I can't seem to 'turn it off' and I already have 26 hours in this week. Getting out to the shop has been tougher than I might have guessed. I get involved in the work I am doing and can't find a natural break point to stop. I had thought I go on out to the shop at lunch time and put a coat of finish on stuff or do some sanding, but I barely have time to eat. I have to work on this and I never thought this would be an issue. I can barely keep up with the forum reading and I missed a few posts here and there.
I did quit just before 5 today and got out to the shop before and after dinner and got some light sanding done and started finishing the flip sides of a few pieces.
It is starting to close in on us here. We have a lot of folks from the city coming up and moving into their vacation homes full time. They bring what they have with them, maybe a virus, maybe just crude habits, like cleaning out a store. They set up a screen testing facility in town and I haven't heard how it is going there. I am starting to hear about local infections of folks I know (waiting 7 days for test results). This is not a good time in our lives, but we will get through it. I worked through the H1N1 mess a few years back with my EMS crew. I know the deal, it's all the same, just a bit worse now. Most of the public takes SO long to learn the simple procedures and basic understanding. This is the real enemy here. Sorry, didn't mean to bring this subject in here, but it is keeping me from working in the shop as I am used to. Whether I get caught up in this or not, I am affected, just as we are all affected. I feel bad for all of us. Usually in times like this I check on the neighbors and help where I can, but now folks don't want anyone knocking on their door. Strange times. Hurricanes, fires, wrecks, disasters, and floods I can, and have, dealt with. This is different and I am still trying to figure it out.
Maybe tomorrow I will get a little more time in the shop and feel better. I hope everybody is getting on as best they can. We'll all be breathing easier in a few weeks, let's work toward that!
Well, it ain't gettin' no easier yet, but I ain't givin' up. ;D I didn't get out in the shop last night, it was the wife's 70th birthday and we had something bigger planned, but given the current situation, we did the right thing. I left the house for the first time in 5 days to go get take out from a decent restaurant. It was quick and easy with no close proximity. The young lady taking money was one I have known since before she was born. She is still a cutie. I dropped exact change plus a tip on the counter, asked about her family and was out in less than 2 minutes. Nobody else in the place. It was a good dinner. Back at work today and my neighbor who has a newborn (7 weeks) had a medical issue with the baby, so between my work I made calls and texts getting references and finding a place to take the child to get looked at. They were treated like lepers from every Doctors office they called even though they have not left their house here in 3 weeks. I found them a Doc and they are all feeling a little better tonight. The issue seems to be resolving itself as happens with newborns many times as their bodies develop. Very stressful none the less.
Then at 5pm my big boss lays a bomb on me and tells me that he wants me to look into 'making ventilators' because he hears they need them and we should do something to help. I wanted to tell him where he could put that idea, but I took a (slightly) higher road. I know what a ventilator is and how it works and what the requirements are. there is a reason they cost up to 50 grand. He has no idea. He reads the internet and has this idea that we could make these because we are 'manufacturers'. He has no clue. Now I just spent 2 hours doing the research any college freshman could have done to find out where we are and why this is a non-starter for us. But I will waste a good part of my day tomorrow making lists and having meetings trying to talk these fools out of wasting a LOT of time. I want to tell them if they want to make a difference and help, they should run a blood drive, there is a big need and they could do that pretty quick with good results. Ah, I can't wait to retire and get away from these people.
I forced myself into the shop tonight to shake all this frustration and get away from the work computer. I got some more sanding done, applied another coat of finish, and did what I hope is my last teeny tiny epoxy fill on the coffee table. Maybe I am nit picking now, but I really want this table to look nice. My wife is asking me about doing shows, but I can't even think that far out, given the uncertainty and not knowing if I will have time or materials to fill a booth with 'stuff'. Al in all, I am getting a bit testy. The weather was quite nice here today and I did go out for 20 minutes at lunch time, did a short walk and some sanding in the shop, but I need to get into something that wears me out or I will soon go crazy.
Instead of a whole ventilator how about support parts like hose fittings, stainless barbs, or machined valve bodies. From what you've mentioned about your manufacturing facility and products doesn t seem like a fit. You should put him on networking with different folks to be part of a pool to make ventolators just supply parts xyz.. Your blood drive idea is better. Glad you got your wifes birthday done up a little, tell her happy birthday from us, maybe you can use that homemade stage and have a good party for 70 plus a little bit in a couple months.. Stay well.
We all need a break from work, to work on our projects. ;D
Hey OG good to see you are still at it!
Keep up the posts, try to stay sane and we will all have a big sigh of relief on the other side.
Happy birthday to your missus!
Brandon
Brandon, nobody would think you foolish for trying to help someone who needs it. Having done a few things in my time that others would (and have) been considered 'putting myself in harms way' I understand this decision. However in all cases, it was always a risk/benefit analysis that went on in my head (usually in a few seconds given the circumstances) and I knew the options and relied on my training. The first thing first responders, medical folks and others learn is that if you become unable to perform, you are no longer helping the situation and have now added to the problem. You need to remain safe and healthy in order to continue to provide aid. SO do take all precautions washing, masks, change clothes and shower when done. It protects both of you. This is why I didn't run over to check on that infant. There was little I could do or add that wasn't already being done. Hard decision sometimes when you want to 'be there for them', but you have to follow your head too. Be careful and thoughtful.
We will get through this each in our own way. I am just having trouble wrapping my brain around it and there is the added stress of working from home, trying to be productive, doing phone meetings, skype sessions, emails, etc. With the company increasing workload on us to find alternate sources for suppliers that are closing up. Getting handed a major (waste of time) project at 4:55 in the afternoon that keeps me at it for another 3 hours of research. That alone wasted most of my day today.
It's a little like making the adjustment immediately after 9/11. It just takes a while for the brain to settle while you are trying to make sure you cover all the bases. My brain doesn't settle very quickly, I am not that smart or quick. ;D
Today I am determined to quit on time and get out in the shop. I will turn off the computer and try to have a 'normal' weekend (less the social interaction). There is a lot of cabin fever beginning to boil up in these parts and here about. :D
I've gotta go dig some holes or mill some logs or something. Keep your chin up.
Hang in there. We are staying home as much as possible. Getting a lot of little long neglected projects done. Milled a few days.
Just be extra safe. Not a good time to need medical care because of a preventable injury!
Take Care.
Man I tell you guys, it was slow dawning on me, but I was really depressed about this whole thing going on. The forum being my safe place where I could get away from life and read and communicate with good folk about things I loved. I maybe didn't agree with everything I read, but respected the points of view. Last week, it plum wore me out with all the 'stuff' being posted. Not that there was anything wrong with it, just that there was so much of it. And it's all fine, it was just that with the news stations, work stuff, public advisories, executive orders, etc, coming here and seeing more of it, just plum wore me out. I was in a funk and after work didn't feel like doing much. I got some stuff done on the weekend, but not as much as I would have liked. I am concerned about my family, my young and older neighbors and my co-workers. It wears on a body, you know? Yeah, I suppose you do.
Today, for some reason, I sort of broke through all that. Yeah, the issues are still there and getting worse but I think I am adjusting. My sister, the last of my immediate family, is fine. my wife and I are fine and my kids and grandkids are fine, so far. I should be happy for that, and I am. Until to today, I hadn't thought of that or in quite that way. I do know this thing is getting worse and we are not over the hump yet. I had better toughen up and get adjusted if I am going to get everyone through this, so that's what I am doing now. I recognize now that I have been pretty depressed, not sleeping right or on a regular schedule, so I am changing that today. I hit the rack at a regular time last night, got up a bit early and worked a 'regular' day, quit at 4:30 and got out in the shop, did some sanding, some epoxy, and urethaned another coat on a mess of stuff. Had dinner, took a long shower, and am now relaxing before another regular bedtime. Having spent years responding to other's emergencies and now being done with that, it's been an odd adjustment for me. I cringe every time I hear the scanner with another EMS call for my former crew and they add to the dispatch 'Respiratory precautions are required for this call'. That should be me climbing onto the ambulance and pulling gear on the way to the call. I pray for them. It's a numbers game. A lot like roulette. I pray for them and feel a bit guilty I am sitting home and safe.Yeah, I did my time and have my scars both visible and otherwise, but it never leaves you.
Anyway, all that was to just say that I am trying to come back. I tried catching up with all the reading here, but I am too far behind, just glad to see the virus posts are dwindling to a very manageable level I can handle. Trying to get back in the groove. Sorry I have no photos to post, you have seen too much already of the stuff I have on the bench now, just picture a fresh coat on everything. ;D Sunday afternoon I shot a short video that is a little tour of the shop for my FB business page. You have to go there to see that but it is nothing special. (It took 6 hours to upload!) Maybe I should have put it on you tube and linked it, but who knows.
Anyway, trying to get back into the groove here (I think I said that last week before I knew what that really meant) and I think I am making a little progress now. Everybody please keep themselves safe. I am worried about reading of the first one of our members that gets hit with this thing. I already have two friends with it (both had NYC connections), one is just past the critical stage (barely got through it) and recovering, the other is not quite there yet. Both are touring musicians.
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Here is a idea for you. If you could get someone to bend the metal, they are easy to build.
I restored this one with Cherry. You could also make the legs from wood.
@richhiway (https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=25823) yes, I do like that idea. In fact, my wife and I are always looking in junk and salvage shops for legs we can use of any type. Getting them fabbed up would not be as cheap as buying new and the new ones run $50-150 for a set. Rite Leg does not yet make a set with a back, but when they do, it's on my order list. If I have to pay $100 for a pair then I would probably need to get 180-200 for a bench that in the end looks a lot like something they can buy in a big box store for 75 bucks. Tough sale. I am looking at making wood end legs when I find the right log(s).
Speaking of logs, I am up early today, just headed out to load the truck with my gear and hook up the trailer and head on over to another members place and drop a tree or two. He is clearing around his house for new planting and I need some logs to finish that last loft. Both of us, with our wives have been cooped up in our respective homes for weeks and are looking to get some air, exercise, and sweat going. We should not have any problem maintaining our distance, and I have masks in the truck if that changes. ;D
Got my saws fired up last night just to test. Had to replace (again) the kill switch in the 382 clone. I had an original switch in there which I had repaired once because it would not short and kill the saw. But now the saw wouldn't start (open?). So I put in an OEM husky switch I had ordered a while ago and that doesn't shut the saw off. I guess there is a reason they sell these in 3 packs. :D Guess I will order some more till I find one that works.
As it turns out, my son is having a buddy coming over late this afternoon to lift the utility body back on his truck after replacing half the rear frame with new steel. The buddy is bringing his mini-ex with a log grapple to do the lifting, just the same way they got it off. Now if I time this right I should arrive home while they are doing that, and with a trailer full of logs to empty, so this may just work out. :D
Quote from: Old Greenhorn on April 04, 2020, 06:37:33 AMRite Leg does not yet make a set with a back
They do have a system for adding a back, not sure if they are in full production yet.
OK, I am so tired I don't feel like eating dinner, but the wife is cooking now, so I guess I will do as I am told. Today was a day I had been waiting for, not that is was a super special day, but I finally got to spend a day doing hard work, and with good company to boot. Got over to NYBHH's place today and he had 2 trees that need dropping. One was an EWP about 100' feet or so and 23" dbh if I recall, that is sort of in his 'front yard' and we had to drop it across the driveway and lawn. Not a big deal really ,but a big tree nine the less and well within reach of his new construction if it went tideways. We were ore concerned I think with the trees we wanted to thread it through and not cause damage. Brandon cut that one and the top only landed a few feet to the right of the mark we had set. More importantly, there was no damage or scarring the the trees that are staying, so win-win there. I think it took and hour or so to buck it up, haul all the branches to a mulching pile to be chipped in the coming days and then load my trailer with some of the logs. My trailer is only rated for 1,500# and we were only a few hundred over that with these two logs. I'll go fetch more tomorrow.
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Then it was my turn to cut one and we took down that big ash that we looked at last year the first time I visited. It's big and right near his driveway. It leafed out a little last year, but not much/ Looked like a lot of dead stuff up top and there was a bunch about this tree we were both concerned about, but we talked it through, then looked some more, and talked again and agreed on a plan. It worked out just fine and she came down pretty much as planned. The top was about 20" short of the expectation we both had, which was good because it was the base of the power pole that feeds hi home. ;D She was a long one.
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He bucked from the top, and I bucked from the bottom up as I had the longer bar on the 372. A little heavy to move but we got it cleaned up in short order.
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So we had some lunch his wife thoughtfully made and boy those brats went down good with a nice beer. We cleaned up the tools, did some other stuff and I headed home around 3:30 or so. I got home and the mini-ex was not here yet, so I unloaded my own logs.
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Geez you gotta be SO careful to not even touch those log ends or you have sap dripping off your fingers. This is my first milling experience with white pine. I am learning quick.
So having all that done, and having been up since 5. I thought it was beer-thirty. But apparently not. The mini-ex showed up and I got called into service to drag the truck out of the shoo and help with spotting and alignment and generally lend my wisdom and learned eye to the operation.
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Anyway, I am tired tonight. GOOD and tired. I feel like I earned my day today and had a fine time working with a like mind and we accomplished something of value together. There is a lot to be said for that. Tomorrow I'll make another run up and grab some more logs. Then I am going to learn about milling Pine. :D
Looks good glad you got a bunch done, my friend who runs an excavator and I dropped two black hills spruce trees in his mother inlaws yard, not nearly as nice as the whack of logs you just got, my plan for it is dimensional lumber, the price was right took me about two hours to drop, limb, load and haul home. Glad you are well, don't watch too much news it gets to me as well.
OGH,
Glad to see you had a safe and productive day. I sawed WP for a neighbor friend a couple years ago. His brother was stacking as I sawed and he was cutting and bucking logs so 30 minutes after cut I had them on the mill. One had a crotch that dripped like honey in a bee tree when I cut into it. I spent hours with a WD40 soaked rag cleaning up the sap on my mill. It built up so much it was affecting the bed height.
Looks like that ash stayed pretty intact. I cut one 2 weeks ago and it shattered everywhere when it hit. I did get a really nice 15' butt log with 300 bf of framing. I like to find good clear ash with 12" wide boards and cut it about 3/4" or less and dry and plane to about half inch X 12" wide and 18-24 inches long for cutting boards. I made several boards like that out of this one. We have such a cutting board we've been using several years and it works great for big projects.
Stay safe out there.
Funny I only just found out during our last words during the 'pre-drop briefing' that this tree had leafed out a little last year, so it was not fully dead. But it was certainly fully EAB destroyed. It had an average MC in the 40's and the center was actually wet when we bucked it. It hit really hard and shattered the top off of a bluestone rock it landed on. He got some really nice saw logs out of it. The butt log he couldn't lift with the tractor, we just dragged it to the mill. 8) Cutting boards? I gotta try that.
It was a good day for sure. Thanks again for the help. Gonna have a long day of chipping tomorrow and may drop that other ash behind the house while all the gear is out. I'm tired too but the beer is going down too good at the moment to retire. Have to do my part and help the local brewery/restaurant stay in business! See you for that next load of logs tomorrow.
A HA! Got you to come out of the woodwork! Add to that the first photo of you as far as I know on the forum and it's a banner day. Yes, I had a blast today and enjoyed that more than you would guess. It feels good to be tired from work and not stress. All my gear is still in the truck, so I can lend a hand with that if you need it. "Look for me, coming from the north, at about 9:30 am" (ish). :D (Doggone though I am tired, but you are right, the beer soothes my old bones and is just starting to take hold.)
Well, up at 5 again today and still pretty sore from yesterday, which I take as a good thing. Nice to be doing some work that pushes me a bit after too many weeks of light shop work. I caught up on my reading here, did some other stuff, then headed up to NYBHH's place and got there around 9:30 (it is Sunday after all even if all the churches are closed up. I saw a neat sign on one small Church tucked up in the woods not far from Bradon's place, it said "This building is closed, but Christ is still working." :)). I had 3 logs left plus a stout 3 and a half foot stubby one. I realized it would be folly and pushing my luck and my trailer to try to get those 3 logs on in one load. I would rather blow time on an extra loop than blow a day or more repairing a broken axle or spring. So we loaded a 10 and an 8 footer on the first load, I brought those home while Brandon was chipping up the tops from the pine. Skidded and staged those by the mill and talked the wife into making the second run with me for company. Shot back over and loaded up the 11 footer (my trailer is 10') and that short piece. I will make something silly out of that. It was a sweep section between two straighter sections. I only took it because it was one less thing Brandon would have to deal with, but then I started thinking of ideas to play with and I might try that method of freehand chainsaw milling to split it in half. I dunno, that's for some random Sunday afternoon when I want to mess around. While I chained everything down Brandon's lovely wife came out and we had a nice chat about trees and dogs, and other stuff for a half hour or so. It was nice to just 'visit for a bit' and we were all about 15 feet or more apart, in case anyone is concerned. So now I have logs at the mill.
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We bucked up a total of 6 logs from this tree (counting that short chunk) and it scaled out at 3,750# and 625 BF. Brandon noted that two of the logs have a pretty good sweep and there will of course be loss there for sure, but this is more than enough than what I need for the loft. The log lengths were cut to match the cut list which is why they are a mix of lengths.
After I unloaded the second load we had lunch and I was already pooped and still sore. I must have fallen asleep in my chair for a while ;D. I got back out around 3pm and cleaned up the logs, put away the trailer, unloaded my stuff, and parked the truck. Then I tried to get that 11 footer up on the mill, but the sweep made it hard and I just could not budge it, but along about then my son showed up and the two of us just managed to get it. He went back to his stuff and I set up and took the first cut of the spring:
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8)
Those 10 degree blades cut really nice in that white pine. I needed to get at least 3 2x10' out of this and 1 2x8, and 1 2x4. I made a 10" cant and got 5 2x10's which I can make all the 11 foot stuff I need from it, Plus I got some 6/4 side boards I can use for the random flooring sizes when I edge them up. That log scaled out at 120 BF and Brandon and I both agreed there would be pretty good loss because of the sweep. Best I can figure, before edging and re-saws, I got 124 BF out of it. I am pretty happy with that.
What I am not happy with is the mill isn't cutting flat. I knew when I reset it up behind the shop it was a quick and dirty leveling and setup. Then I milled all that lumber for the loft I built in December-February and noticed than that I had a lot of tweaking to do, but today I had forgotten about that mostly. So now I see it and will have to dedicate time to getting it right before I go further. It really seems to show up in the pine a lot more than in the hardwoods. BUT, I got a start on some milling. I called it a day around 7pm and came in for dinner and a well needed shower. Pine sap brings showering to an entirely different level. :)
GEEZ! This sap is a pain. Brandon gave me great advice yesterday when I took the first logs. He said "just use gloves you can throw away when your done", and of course, this is true, but he also should have added pants and long sleeved shirts to the list, as well as a hat and, Oh yeah, SKIN! :D ;D
Anyway, another very good day. Lots of hard work and I should sleep OK tonight. Tomorrow is back to the desk job right here at this very same desk for the 3rd week in a row. I was supposed to go in this week, but one of the other engineers had a project he needs to be there for so there is no sense in both of us being there. I will go back in the following week.
I hope everybody has a good safe work week, if you are working, and that you get by fine if you are not. I sense that three is some light at the end of the tunnel coming soon. Not that it will be over by any stretch, but we should start seeing some light soon. We have already lost too many good folks.
I like WD-40 to help as a sticky pine sap remover, get a little bottle for the shower. a little behind the ear, drives those gals crazy! :D
Actually I was using that on the blade while cutting, worked well. Didn't think of taking care of myself as well as the blade, I guess. :D ;D
As long as you keep it out of your hair, it's nothing good soap and a long shower can't take care of ;)! In summer with short sleeves, it was always the underside of my forearms that bore the brunt of it for some reason. Shame to hear the mill isn't cutting level but once you do get it dialed in, pine cuts like butter as long as you mind the knotty sections.
As you know, EWP is what I learned how to mill with and do I enjoy it, mess and all, but part of that is partially because it just isn't as precious as the hardwood to me so I take larger opening cuts and with logs that size, keep to the heart wood as much as possible, and just don't stress about it as much as hardwoods. "There is always another pine tree that need to come down". The heart wood doesn't blue stain nearly as easy either. Reserve judgement until after you are finished building. No one should have to pre-drill holes in construction lumber!
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Nice to get some good pine logs. you need a little boat winch on the mill to get those big logs on.
Over here I started the addition to the saw shed that will be the mill head "garage".
Man I like that little worm gear chain saw thingy! Can you do thru mortises with it? DO you have any videos of it cutting? Who makes that? And Yeah, I need a garage for my mill too, it's on the list (a very long list).
Speaking of projects, here is one we decided to abandon. It seemed like a good idea at the time, but as I recall there was beer involved.
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I think it was supposed to be a doodle bug with a short wheel base for short turning in the woods and the back end would have a skidding plate and winch. There was a cut-out to handle the gas produced by the driver. The back seat was for the winch operator. But we ran out of time (and sobered up) and now it is folded up in the dumpster along with the falt dump body that came off of it. My son had gotten it for a parts truck, and there wasn't much left of it.
Today I only had time and energy for a walk-about at lunch time. The sap is still running out of those logs and there are icicle-like drips hanging off of it.
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Tonight after work, I went out and went over the mill with a level again and made some adjustments. I also put on a new blade and threw some pine-sol in the lube tank (how much is enough?). I edged some boards and it cut straight. SO I am back up and running and will keep an eye on it as I cut more.
I got an order request today, sort of an RFQ. He needs hardwood for an old truck restoration. It seems like every board is a different size. I am going to have to transcribe it into something I can work with and he followed up with a note to ask if I could cut 1/4" boards. ;D Sure! BUT....
Its about 30 boards with thicknesses of 3/4, 1", 1-3/4, 2-1/2, 1-1/2, 5/8, 2-1/4,and 2". Widths include 10", 2-1/2, 6, 8, 3/4, 7, 2-3/4, 3", 2, 6, and 8". I am going to need a tally man to keep track of all this. :D But he is a friend and he is retired and is restoring this truck with his son, so.... I will figure something out. I think the truck is a '23 but don't know anything about it yet. He does nice car work and runs a car show or two. Anything for a laugh, right? :D
I am in my third week working at home, just me and the wife, and my son in and out working in the shop on his stuff, and the rare short visit from the grand boys. During the workday, I am producing more than normal with no distractions BUT there is a lot more stress, I am getting emails, skype messages, and doing phone conference/skype sessions daily. Everybody wants everything right now because they figure you are working at home and can do that for them. I try, but sometimes there are 3 things hitting critical mass at the same moment and I begin to loose it. Plus, trying to work through very technical explanations in an email is not the most efficient way to do things and can be very painful and time consuming. I am concerned about this virus and do not take anything for granted, but it sure would be easier to go into the office for a day or two and get things taken care of. AT the same time, I am trying to see if I can get my company to work a deal and move my retirement up somehow. My birthday is on 5/17 but there is the issue of being insured until Medicaid takes over. If I am uninsured for even a week, it becomes a mess. They have had our site reduce our headcount by 7 people this week. They managed to do that by counting retirements, overtime, and some other finagling. But the corporate greed is never satisfied, so I know they will be coming back for more. Our CEO is demanding to maintain profitability at 'normal' levels in spite of the world situation (this from a guy that picked up about a 15 million bonus last week). So heads will roll. For once, I am going to try to see if I can make their greed work in my favor and get me out a month early so I don't have to deal with this stuff anymore. I am tired of these guys. All they have to do is agree to cover my insurance for 4-6 weeks (maybe less), my severance and vacation will take care of the rest. I have been shafted by every company I have worked for in the last 50 years (except one short tenure). I am hoping this time I can get what I need instead of the other way around. Any body want to take odds on this? :D The ball sits in their court right now and I am not holding my breath, knowing who has the ball, very low confidence. They never act until their back is at the wall.
If I didn't have the work stress and I could just worry about my wife and I, things would be a lot easier. I have never looked for the easier way, but this time, this one time, I am leaning in that direction. Right now, for probably the first time in my life. I have to think about my own home and family and peace of mind. It's got to be my turn one of these times, right? My wife is 70, I want to keep her home and safe.
That project does not look bad, but back seat needs some rethinking. :o I guess the dumpster is the answer to that.
Quote from: thecfarm on April 07, 2020, 09:07:59 PM
That project does not look bad, but back seat needs some rethinking. :o
Yeah, you're right. We realized we did not consider a proper place for the cooler at all. Major design flaw right there.
Hey, I'd play hard ball with them. If they just want to do a staff reduction and let you go, call it age discrimination! Then they would be willing to make a deal to keep you happy.
Well, not being driven by pure greed myself, I never know what they are thinking, but I don't think I would be very high up on their hit list in most cases. I appealed to their unstated desires, which is to keep the younger or newer hires, which are cheaper than an old warhorse like me. My management does not understand the value of experience and for once I hoped to use that to my advantage. They only know how to look at dollars, because that is what the colleges teach these days. We will just see what these guys do with it, if anything. I have been working through worse things over my career, I can work through this too if I have to. I am just tired and want out so these guys can beat each other to death while I am blissfully unaware and working out in the woods. :D
That is a $20.00 garage sale Skil worm drive saw with a Prazi beam cutter attachment the I got on ebay for a hundred bucks. Works pretty good.
Would COBRA health insurance work for you if you left early?
Well that saw is a pretty neat setup no matter how it came together. I never see those worm drive saws in yards sales that haven't been beat to death beyond repair. Good on ya.
Yeah, cobra would work, but last time I checked they were getting about 3 grand a month for the package I was offered. That ain't happening. I will be happy to let the company pay that, if they want to make a deal.
As it turned out, around 10am I got a message from one of the supervisors that they needed some programming done. "When?" asked, "Well, the guy is standing here in my office and the machine is set up, but he needs a program." Really?! you didn't know this work was going on the machine a week ago? You didn't think to mention it earlier, or before he started the machine set up? Well I can't do the programming from home. None of that software works over VPN, so I had to pack my stuff up on 5 minutes notice, drive in and reset it up, then figure out what they needed. I was not a happy camper. I did the program he needed and the next two coming down the pike. Turns out somebody was asked to tell me all this a week ago and he dropped the ball.
Stressed as I was going in after hearing on the daily management meetings that tempers were short and stress was high in the shop, it was good to go in. Turns out the info in the management meeting was all wrong, but it was delivered by a guy who is pretty much hated in the shop, so.... The men and women in our place have their act together, they are following all the protocols without prompting, keeping things clean, and keeping distance and they are quite relaxed, except when a service guy or somebody like that comes in from the outside and nobody knows where he has been. Then they get testy. But I think having all the salaried people working from home really reduces the stress in the shop because those folks are not going around and making change requests and asking for other things and in general adding to the normal stress of the job. At least that's how I see it.
SO I got my work done and took the time to plot out and file all the design work I have finished in the last 3 weeks, it was a lot and I was glad to get it done, neat and clean. I left early and brought home an office chair that was in the recycle bin and is much better for my back that the 25 year old chair I have been using at home, which was not designed for 9 hours of sit time everyday.
I got home around 4:30 and headed to the mill and edged up the remaining boards from that first pine log. I am getting better at avoiding the sap and have none on me as I type this. :D SO that felt good, but I'm tired.
I also learned that my neighbor across the road, in his infinite wisdom, invited an artist friend to come up and camp at his house and paint a mural on the side of his garage, he said he needs the money and is broke. So in other words, he invites a guy to come up, from the most infected city on the planet to stay in our town, one of the least infected, to get a cheap mural. He says the guy is not coming in his house and will eat, live, and take care of his bodily functions outside. Can't wait to hear how this goes. Hopefully the rain and chilly temps will send him home soon. From my point of view, he just contaminated a neighborhood that has done a really good job of staying home and clean. Everyone I have talked to here has been at least 3 weeks, most 4 in their homes, just going out on 15 minute shopping trips to get what they need once a week. Stuff like this aggravates me and causes stress on everyone.
Life goes on, we deal with what comes, right? One day at a time, one foot in front of the other.
I get those messages that I GOTTA come in for a fire that should have been handled through regular channels. It makes me want to put gasoline and dynamite under the bridge when I burn it.
My point being, if I were as close to retirement as you, I would encourage things a bit... by not doing their bidding very well.
Quote from: APope on April 08, 2020, 08:46:22 PM
I get those messages that I GOTTA come in for a fire that should have been handled through regular channels. It makes me want to put gasoline and dynamite under the bridge when I burn it.
My point being, if I were as close to retirement as you, I would encourage things a bit... by not doing their bidding very well.
Yeah, you may be right, but it is just not my style. I have worked in places where co-workers asked me how I dealt with all the abuse and yet every day I gave them 100% and they could not understand why. I would tell them
"It's simple, they can mentally beat me, abuse me, and do what ever they want, yes it is demoralizing, but I need to walk out that door each day and know that I gave them a good days work, because in the end, they are paying me for a job and I need to do that job as well as I can to keep my own pride and self esteem. If I stop doing a fair days work, I stop respecting myself, and THAT is something I cannot live with."
A person has to take pride in the work they do, and if they don't, well it's all down hill from there and the ba----rds have won. I do the job I signed up for. That's just the way I am. I keep my promises even if they don't keep theirs.
OGH - great attitude. I highly concur. I have seen people go wipe their computer when they left for fear there may be some info or process left on there that might be useful to the company. I might save a copy on a disk to take with me for future use or info but if I did the work on the company computer during company time it belonged to the company IMHO. I have turned the lights out on a couple of projects being the last guy leaving because of that kind of attitude too.
I respect and understand your work ethic. Had mine beat out for the last 12 years.
40 something years and they ain't beat me yet.
If you want to put up a hot wire to keep the artist from crossing the road I think I have a spare electric fencer in the barn. It gets the goats attention RIGHT NOW!! mine accidentally once in a while :o...
Maybe the neighbors could have paid half down and had the work done later. Hope he has a little camper because living in a car will be a cold miserable experience in a couple days. Good for your neighbors and their charity towards someone in need, just pray that it doesn't bite them or you and yours.
Hang in there you have one month less til retirement than you had on March first, and a chunk of April is gone now as well.
Quote from: Old Greenhorn on April 08, 2020, 09:01:02 PMYeah, you may be right, but it is just not my style. I have worked in places where co-workers asked me how I dealt with all the abuse and yet every day I gave them 100% and they could not understand why.
I tip my hat to you OG. I know of what you speak. I've been in these types of situations myself and no matter how working relationships are, never could do crappy work. I've did my best to instill that in my kids and grandkids
Quote from: Nebraska on April 08, 2020, 10:29:49 PM
If you want to put up a hot wire to keep the artist from crossing the road I think I have a spare electric fencer in the barn. It gets the goats attention RIGHT NOW!! mine accidentally once in a while :o...
Maybe the neighbors could have paid half down and had the work done later. Hope he has a little camper because living in a car will be a cold miserable experience in a couple days. Good for your neighbors and their charity towards someone in need, just pray that it doesn't bite them or you and yours.
Hang in there you have one month less til retirement than you had on March first, and a chunk of April is gone now as well.
Yeah Nebraska, its not a bad idea and something like that had crossed my mind, but I figure nature will take it's course. we had 3/4 of an inch of rain today between 9 and 3. He is not allowed in there house, so his only option is to sit in his vehicle. Bathroom facilities are likewise whatever he can manage. So the hosting skills are a little on the short end. :D
I figure he should have just paid him for the mural up front and let him do it in 2 months when the walls are dry and weather is better. But what do I know. It will be what it will be. I jst learned I will have another week at home because the young ninja wants to be in the shop to follow his projects. I have taken to calling him Harry Potter now because he waves his wand and tells everyone the problem has gone away. (In truth, he never understood the problem in the first place and thinks he solved it, but after he walked away and somebody else did what needed to be done. The guys in the shop really don't like his style or working with him.) Whatever. I am taking it one day at a time. We deal with what comes, but so far, so good. Might be doing some milling tomorrow if the weather works out. High winds (40 mph) predicted, so I ain't headed to the woods to cut dead ash, for sure. ;D >:(
Just about ready to call it on that coffee table. I am done sanding and re-coating. AT some point I have to stop.
Waiting for what I hope is the last coat to dry as i type this. Tomorrow is a holiday for us so I can do what I want and I am not sure what I want. :)
Having a guy live in his car with no facilities to paint a mural might make my personal list of "did you see that?"
Yes a little cold and windy today for outdoor chores. Enjoy your day off. Snowing over here in Monticello.
does not really sound like essential work.
Yeah, I don't think it was the best choice for anybody, that. But we are keeping to ourselves. I can't worry about what anybody else does as long as they keep to themselves.
DId some cleaning in the shop and hunted for lumber for that order and found more of it that I can use. Then he contacts me and says he has oak logs we can use, so he is bringing them over tomorrow. The adventure continues...
After cleaning up and making more room, I finished up that coffee table, took some photos and put it up for sale on FB. Lets see how that goes. It doesn't look bad.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/IMG_20200410_105724990.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1586563341)
I know it's not up to the standards of many of the folks here, but it isn't a bad start. took WAY too long to finish. I kept sanding then re-coating, not liking what I saw, re-sanding, re-coating and finally called it 'good enough' today.
Time to move on.
It is like a woodworking scholarship. when you sell it, you get to keep all the knowledge and experience. and the money too! some projects are like that. maybe start a cuss jar in the shop...on the honor system! smiley_furious smiley_beertoast the table looks great!
I thought this table was for you to use, I don't think it will last long on FB. It looks good from here.
Quote from: Nebraska on April 11, 2020, 12:12:47 AM
I thought this table was for you to use, I don't think it will last long on FB. It looks good from here.
OH, We can't afford fancy stuff like this! :D
Doc, no need for a cuss cup. I just make funny twisted facial expressions every morning when I go out to see how things dried..... then I grab the sander. >:(
This was/is kind of a test. First I need to learn where peoples interest lies and what sells. Second, I need to generate some funds to buy a few logs and shop supplies. Still operating on less than a shoe string and all my expenses either come out of my weekly allowance or the family budget. Third, if I can move stuff on FB or other means, it cuts down on the need to do shows and sales, which cuts costs. So it's all part of the learning process and what keeps me a Greenhorn. :)
Well, not a bad weekend, all in all. I did lose a bunch of time waiting for my sawing customer to show up on Saturday, he had to borrow a trailer, then go load logs. Arrived around mid-day when I was running out of little things to fill my time, then we got to work and whittled down his list (one of these, two of those, 1 of these, 5 of those, etc). SO that took a while, but one guy tail-gunned and the other kept the tally and told me what we needed next and that saved a lot of time because I could just focus on on sawing and getting them the best wood out of the logs. They brought 5 and almost used 2 and left me the rest. All red oak. We had a fine time working together so it was a win-win. One of them is a wood turner and looking for turning blanks. I think I might help him out there, and they have a source of logs so they asked for a list of what I wanted. ;D
Today I was up again at 5 and out in the yard early, but I realized that it is Easter Sunday and even though nobody including us, is doing the traditional stuff, there is still family time, etc. SO I was reluctant to fire up a chainsaw even at 10am just because it was so quiet. I like the quiet too. I painted the logs left yesterday. I queued up a log on the mill and loaded it, then got started milling by 11am figuring it was safe. I had to stop at noon because I had a Zoom meeting (new for me) with the senior staff of one of the festivals I work on. It was just a check-in type thing to see how, and what, everyone was doing through this thing, and cheer each other up. They got a kick out of me calling in from the mill and I showed them the log I was working on. In this group of musicians, artists, and other gifted folks, I am the oddball out. :D
Once the meeting ended I had lunch and fell into milling heavy and did all the framing lumber I need for the loft. Edged, stacked and ready to build. I still have yet to do the floor boards, but I have time. Getting that loft started will be the tough part. That first header will take time to fit and clear the existing area around the garage door spring mechanism and associated stuff. After that, it should go quick. Anyway, a good day of milling, working alone. That stuff is heavy. even the 2x10x12' are getting heavy for me. I feel old, and I am sore, a little bit. But tomorrow is back to work day and we are supposed to be getting over an inch of rain with 40 MPH winds, so doing the day job and focusing on some design work is probably a better option for that weather. It will give my back a chance to heal. Trying to build those back muscles up again after the winter of not doing much milling. So, progress is being made.
Well we got 2 full inches of rain today and some winds over 30 mph. Kind of miserable, but it was warm, so there is that. :D Normal workday for the man and I really didn't feel like walking out to the shop this evening, but I did anyway figuring I would piddle around cleaning up or something. Now that I have the framing lumber cut for the last loft I figured there was no more putting it off. The first part is to deal with that dang garage door lift spring arrangement. I hate those things, they can take your hand off if you are not careful. I measured out the heights of where everything would lay on that head-wall. Turns out that I only had to adjust the middle 2x4 strap that anchors the spring. That was put up pretty sloppy when the door was installed.
SO I had to take the tension out of the spring. Did I mention that I hate those things? Well, I do. But I got it undone safely, no fingers were lost. Then I unbolted the anchor from the wall and busted up the 2x4 to get it off the wall and broke off all the cement nails. Measured things up and cut a block off a 2x8 that would fit better. I found some 3/8 tapcons just right for the job but don't have my sons hammer drill handy so I had to quit at that point. Soaked in sweat.
One thing I didn't figure on was the weight of that door. It's only a 7' wooden garage door, but I can't even begin
to budge it without that spring. Holy cow! So that door is shut until I get the spring back in working order. :-[
Anyway, this is the part of the job I was dreading and I have it nearly half done, so I have started it. Once I reset the door I can start measuring and trimming that first header and fitting in in, then things will pick up speed. I just keep poking along.
Holly cow,
You got the springs off a roll-up door with the door closed!
Will like to know how you did that, I wont touch those springs when fully stretched. I only mess with them with the door open so much less/no energy stored.
JJ
;D Oh, that's a secret! ;D
These are torsion springs, so when the door is up, I have no access. I have to do it when it is down. There are 4 holes around the perimeter of the anchor hub. I put a rod in one hole, then CAREFULLY loosed the two set screws locking it all up. I could feel to load when it came into my hand, then I let the rod come around about 1/2 turn, put a rod in the opposite hole, pull the first rod out and go another half turn. Then I just keep repeating that until the spring is dead loose. It's no big deal, you just need to be careful and it helps to have somebody there that can make a phone call if needed. :D
I will say there was a LOT more torsion on that spring then I ever would have guessed. Maybe 6-8 turns? I hope I can get it back to where it was.
I got a few minutes at lunch time and got the new block tapconned up and re-attached the spring anchor, but ran out of time. I will go out after work and tension it back up while the boys are still here working.
I hope you counted the turns in your springs as you unwound them. That is kinda critical to the door working properly whne you reset them.
I ALWAYS do them by 1/4 turns cause it is just safer. 1/2 turns are too easy to get away on you and those spring have a a real snap to them when the let go.
I have a double door (16') that has two of those springs. One broke and the garage door opener would still work but put a bit of a kink in the door ::) I found a spring on CL for free to replace it. That's when the fun started. I unwound the other one, noting the paint stripe and how many times it spiraled around. Then had to slide the bar out and the spring off. Right... The rod was surface rusted that the locking collars are a pretty close fit. I had to use emery paper all the way across and all the way around the rod to get it off. Then it finally came off with some persuasion. Cleaned it up a bit further and slipped on the new one, reattached the cables on to the end pulleys and rewound up the springs. So far, so good after about 4 or 5 years. Just waiting for the other to pop! I have another spring/spare.
Those torsion springs are NOT all created equal and you must have the right springs for your specific door. The lock/loading caps are color coded with spray paint. Red, 2 different blue shades, green, black, orange, yellow, brown and a few more.
DO NOT mix match these springs. That can cause a catastrophic failure that can actually destroy a door and or cause serious injury or death.
I used to help my brother install and service large doors like this and they are not a difficult thing to work with. Just have to be sure you dont miss a step and be methodical in process and check every step twice. Test the full travel of the door 2 or 3 times and recheck every thing again.
:D
I was imagining my door springs, where a 2.5' spring is stretched to about 10' with the door closed. I think if you manage to unhook one end of that spring while stretched, you will get quick lesson on how to fly fly_smiley.
I've seen the doors with torsion springs, just never had one, or needed to fix one myself.
JJ
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Working on a coffee table for my wife. First time making this style base. Top is maple,base is Cherry.
I thought you might like the look for your next project. Careful with that spring!
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/35823/20200412_162304.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1586914411)
You might need to come down here and give me some epoxy filling tips.
I never expected a garage door to generate so much discussion. I thought I was the only one who hated these things. As it turned out, getting it reset up was tougher than I expected. Did it 5 times and the door still would not close fully because the spring would drive the bar to the left and jam at the last 2 inches. A lot of fussing with hand wrapping the cables and balancing the spring. I finally realized the left hanger bracket was set too close and had been right on the margin. So I pulled the single bolt (there should be two) and moved it over 3/8" and everything worked fine.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/IMG_20200414_192016710.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1586913842)
You can see in the photo where I removed the 2x4 that was anchoring the center bracket and replaced it with a block. I threw the 2x10 up and made some rough marks tonight and I will start cutting the notches tomorrow. Got a phone call and ran out of time. The door to the left in the photo is a 12' door and has double springs. I really don't want to mess with that, but it has always been SO heavy to lift. Someday.
Anyway, the door is back to working and it's time to move on.
richhiway, I like that table and especially those legs. Consider your design stolen. ;D That looks like some very easy epoxy pours. Just small cracks, except maybe the 'extra' chainsaw cut. :D
Give that left door a half turn tighter on each spring and that should get you close. Try it. Go 1/4 turns on each side if you need bit more till it feels right. They should stop about an 1" to 2" above the floor when you let it drop about a foot to 18 inches. If your 2 to 3 ish inches your in the range.
With the door closed snap the cables like a guitar string. They should be the same tone. If not tighten the one that is low to bring it up to the same tone as the higher toned one. Then you know they are balanced.
Only need to do this on doors with 2 springs and often a 1/8 turn will do it for you.
And don't get your face too close, it happened to the garage door guy around here a couple of years ago, I don't know the details but it was something like a bracket came off the wall and spun around and the lag bolts or large screws caught him. A couple of nasty scars on his face last time I seen him.
Our local garage door company can match you torsion spring, and cut from a bulk roll they have on hand. Ours broke and a replacement was about 70 buck. the took the parts, and put it all back together with a new matched spring, and my son and I then reinstalled it. I have several 1/2 inch rods 18 inches long that fit most of the cast aluminum heads. there are four holes around the head that you use to wind up the spring. I think it is a 2 man job. so someone can tighten the set screw, and if you get caught up in something, you have a helper.
Thanks for all the hints on the springs guys. I may try adjusting that 12' door someday, but today is not that day. ;D
I snuck out at lunchtime and did some measuring and a little cutting. After work, before dinner I got the header up and drilled and set 8 tapcons to hold it in place.
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After dinner I started figuring the next step pulling in those boards. Wasted some time there trying to pick the best method and I could still be swayed to alter it. This is the area I will be framing and flooring.
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Then I headed upstairs, cleared out some lumber that was piled in the way and started knocking loose the rail posts that will not be needed. Originally I was going to work inside those posts, but then I realized taking them out would give me a better end result and make the work easier by a long shot. The one on the south end along the wall is useless after the loft is up anyway and I could run my framing up against the wall, but I want to leave a gap of about 2" to allow for wiring and air and other stuff to come up thru there.
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Those posts are a bit heavy, so I have to wait until I have another pair of hands, just in case I drop one.
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Progress is slow, but moving forward.
Hey, the son just showed up, I am gonna run back out and get that stuff done I need more hands for. Later. :)
Ah, that worked out good. 10 minutes of his time helped me get those posts off easy and I ripped down the 2 2x4's a need for a square sill plate under the joists. Set me up for tomorrows lunch time session. More progress.
Quick update: My son's welder was working on his truck in my shop yesterday and sometime in the afternoon the oil ran out. The temp was around 52 when I went out there around 5pm and I didn't want to waste time messing with it to get it back up. Just as well, I piddled for a while trying to figure how to set the first rafter, this is an odd framing job for sure, so slow going figuring it out. I got that up and had to quit to go a pick up a Friday night pizza for the wife and me. (Note to self, don't get take out on a Friday at 6:30pm, too many idiots out and about with the same idea.)
Got back out there at 7:30 and tuned in to a live 2 hour concert my friends on the other side of hill were doing for themselves (they needed a 'pick me up') and their fans around the world. It was a good time for sure.
Anyway, when I restarted, I realized I was so focused on that first rafter and how to set it, that I completely forgot to measure and cut it off to the proper length! So now I had a rafter firmly anchored on one end and too long on the other, so I had to figure a way to cut it off square in-situ. ;D I did that, finishing with a hand saw (man's best friend) and pulled up the next joist for the opposite and (to establish a box so I could check squareness) and set that one while I was listening to the concert. By this time I was sweating like a piglet in July so, not missing the heat. I pulled up the 2x10x12 and measured twice, then cut that off as the back header. Then I did some figuring on how this is all going to work as far as setting the height and keeping it all level. The new loft will set on top of the existing loft at one end and is anchored to the block wall at the other end. I am going to have to cut blocking to go under these things and set the height. So I was running 3 or 4 different approaches through my head and I decided to quit for the night and sleep on it. The music was getting very good so I came in the house to listen to the rest of the gig. That's when I learned it was snowing like crazy. :D Geez, what next?
Still snowing this morning and I am scheduled to run over a few counties to my buddies cabinet shop to plane some boards and look at a 30" tree he is offering me. He just texted and pushed it out 2 hours because he has some family obligations to do first. I just don't want my nice air dried lumber to get too wet during the drive of 45 minutes each way. I hear it is raining to the north and east as I will drop in elevation. The radar indicates some clearing, so perhaps the delay will help.
Full day today for sure. I got up to the cabinet shop at 11 as prescribed. We planed my boards with me doing a good part of the work this time and him tail gunning when he felt sorry for me. ;D That took about 45 minutes (or 30 minutes too long according to my buddy). We BS'd for a bit, took a look at a downed willow tree. He showed me a 6" planer he wants to give me, it's in his way, and of course I graciously accepted. Next trip I will pick it up, no room in the truck today. I have to prep a spot for it too. Then I headed home.
Got back around 1pm and found my son's welder at work again. I did to want to disturb him (he's on a clock)so I carried in all my lumber and set that back upstairs, then started bring 2x8's from the mill around to the front of the shop. I started figuring the blocking for that back header and custom cut some stuff on the table saw to fit. Squared off the basic box of the floor frame then started setting the other joists. It was rough going with little or nothing to rest the joist end on, but I figured out a way and I would get one end located on the head wall, then walk back through the shop, up the stairs, and back to the front where I would drive the other end in place, check elevation and squareness, then nail it in. Then back downstairs, up the ladder and tweak the front end and nail that in place, then repeat the process, passing the nail gun back and forth from upstairs to down, each time. Lots of trips. I got the near the end with 3 joists to go and they did not quite 'jam in' so they were loose, but I set all 3 in near positions on the head wall, and as I was going upstairs my son walked in the shop. ;D ;D So I recruited him and in about 5 minutes we got the last 3 in place. Now I just have to run some spikes in through the ends of the joists ( make me fell better) then cover the loft end with one more 2x10 and the frame is done.
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That is the plan for tomorrow morning, then I have to mill all the floor boards. I am going to do 5/4 x 6, I think. Hopefully I can cut all the stock I need, but I don't know if I will get it all down. I have the evenings next week for that if I can just get it milled and indoors.
It's not the prettiest thing I ever built, by far. But it is up and moving along. Time to start thinking about a floor plan for the area to build lumber racks to get the most out of it.
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My overall plan, for good or bad is to make lumber as I can during the summer and fall and stack and sticker it to air dry, while also building a few needed things around the mill with some of it. The before winter sets in pick the air dried stuff that is pretty low MC and bring it into the shop and stack it up in the loft (still stickered) for further drying as I work on projects and select and use it as I go. That's the plan anyway and it is subject to reality checks and adjustments along the way. You gotta start somewhere, right? Long day. Up at 6am, quit at 7pm. Dinner went down fast. :D I am tired, but I think I earned it today. All these hours sitting at a desk at home during the work week is getting to me. Normally at work I walk a couple of miles a day in the plant and only sit at my desk for 209 minutes periods, 1 hour tops. Now I sit all day long. Gotta fix that soon or I will turn into a weak wimpy reflection of myself before long. ;D Hoping to beat myself up pretty good tomorrow so I start work tired on Monday and need the rest. :)
Well another pretty good day. The wife had heard from her friends that the Spillway was.. well, Spilling, so as it not not happened in a number of years she wanted to go and see. So we headed up there, then did a little loop to check the falls down below because we don't get to see that really cooking up steam very often.
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When we got back I went to work and finished up the last header, drove a pair of 5" spike in every joist with a 2 pound lump hammer, then nailed that last header plate on and secured that pretty well. So the framing was complete.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/IMG_20200419_113455490.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1587339583)
I headed out to the mill and could barely roll this nice log on the mill myself and thought I popped a blood vessel in the process, but I got it on. My goal for the day was to get all the flooring out of this one log.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/IMG_20200419_134800722.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1587339641)
It scaled at 120 BF and I needed 115 (calculated, not including loss). I also wanted to see if I could make boards as nice as @nybhh (https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=38169) makes out of his pine. I have been getting a lot of wave in my boards. I know it is a result of only having 10hp and 10° blades, but I needed to find a way to make that work. So I squared up a cant that was 12x16 and split that in half so I had 2 6x16 cants.. Then one at a time I stood those up and sawed 5/4 boards out of them. My results were MUCH better. Now I have to work on my thickness consistency. ;D SO I wound up with a small whack of 25 5/4x6x8' boards, which was just a tad over what I needed.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/IMG_20200419_151725936.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1587339698)
And yeah, I took the paint off a log clamp and put some scratches in it on the last board.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/IMG_20200419_151702535.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1587336586)
SO I rolled it all around to the front of the shop and threw it up in the loft and started cutting boards to see how it would lay.
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Nothing is nailed down yet, just cut and layed in. I was running out of steam so I went out and cleaned up the milled, stowed the trailer out of the way and pretty much bagged it at 6pm. Dinner time.
When I came in and took my hat off, I could tell a I did more than sit around soaking up the sun all day.
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Well I went out at lunchtime and cut a few more floor boards, then again at quitting time before dinner and I got all the floor boards cut. After dinner I went back out and nailed everything down. I just had to rip some stuff to fill in the odd gap which only covered to double 2x's at the head wall so I grabbed all the drops from cutting the floor boards and used those up because it was just a height filler. I wound up with 3 boards left over that I didn't touch which is exactly what my calculations told me I should have. Accidents happen. ;D
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Now I just need a safety rail on the left side and then I have to start building lumber racks, as soon as I figure out what they will look like. :) I think my safety rail is actually going to be a support for one side of my sheet goods remnants rack which are always a pain to keep out of my way.
Finishing this section of the lofts will finally conclude the end of my five year plan, which I came up with just 32 years ago. 8) The only thing left to my overall shop plan is to get a woodstove in there and I hope by fall that will happen. Then I guess all I can do with my time is make stuff.
[Edit to add]: I just went back and checked when I started this to see how long it took me. Turns out I started making the lumber 8 days ago. So I am fairly proud, in so far as is possible, that I got it done that quick. I must be getting faster, or the projects are getting smaller. ;D Either way, I'll take it as a win. I think the difference here is not going weekend to weekend and working on the tough pieces in the evenings every night, even if I am tired and don't feel like it. Knock one off each night, and you make some progress that adds up.
Looks good wish I had that much to show for my last 8 days.
Well Nebraska, sometimes things just line up. Most times they don't, short a few boards here, ran out of nails there, didn't plan on having this or that problem, the weather hates us, etc. Good weeks and bad weeks. I already fell like I have been working on this thing a month because of the big logs, all the lifting upstairs, hanging those joists alone with no hangers, etc. Wore me plum out, so I was actually shocked it was only 8 days, well 9 now and I pronounce it complete. I put the safety rail up which will also serve to lean sheet goods against. I cut this one very close on my figuring. I had 2 floor boards and 1 2x8 left over. The cutoff scraps from all the work would fit in a 1 cubic foot box. only 1 piece over 10 inches long and that was a rotten piece I chose not to use. Even the 2x4's I made by accident got used for the railing, but then I didn't put the railing in my calculations.. I re-used the old top railing that had been on the end.
It's DONE. 8)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/IMG_20200421_200612529.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1587515395)
Now moving on, I drew up an idea for lumber racks. I am going to try using double lap joints or whatever you call them things were you cut a slot the width of your mating board halfway through, then do the same on the other board and slide them together as a cross joint. It's a lot of cuts and joints, but what the heck, I've never done it before and I am itching to find something else I am not very good at. ;D If it works, I figure it will be more stable. I figure that's about 40 of them joins, which means 80 slot cuts. Plus I have no lumber. I figure I need 63.1 BF in the form of 2x4's. I have 2 EWP logs left and one is scaled at 65bf but has a lot of knots, the other is 95 but has a sweep. I think I will give that one a shot first to be safe. This will probably take longer than making the loft. :D
should be able to lean boards from below, and pull from the top. should be a good team sport to load and unload the loft wood, with the grandsons as they get older. Nice. (maybe a half lap joint.) smiley_beertoast
OG, looking good! Wish I had half your energy and ambition!
Brandon
Brandon, I wish I had HALF the energy you think I have. I have to push myself a lot of nights to do something. Last night all I did was clean the floor and vacuum (lots of stuff building up over the past few weeks, couldn't stand it anymore, it was a mess). Doc, we have been passing stuff up over the side for 3 years now, since I built the first main loft. Wood, parts, machines, you name it. That's why I have a gateway up there (really need to make a gate for that).
Rough day today working and also trying to talk to folks about retirement requirements and paperwork on the phone at the same time. I am trying to pull this all together quickly because of this virus and the resulting corporate greed and generated pressure to maintain normal profit levels while this is going on because the guys that already have too much money need more. They are beating the working person to death and we have less value to them than run hard wore out cattle. Time for me to get out and let them drown in their own money. But I am trying to do it gracefully and not leave my co-workers with a mess to clean up. So I have a lot of critical work to document for them to pick up on, most of which they have no idea I even do (and have done for years). And I topped off my day with a surprise family issue to add just a bit more stress.
So yeah, it was really hard to get out there tonight and do something after dinner. None of the tasks I needed to do appealed to me and I am lacking some supplies for each of them anyway. So I decided to make an incremental Step toward getting tools off the benches, floor, carts, and machine tables, and moved up onto a tool board. Never could decide on a format for the tool board so I kept avoiding it. Tonight I got a start and just picked a start point. I made a box to hold handsaws. I have some good ones but they are scattered around and I needed to give them a home. For good or bad, I made it and hung it. It killed an hour or so, and I can say I got something done.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/IMG_20200423_194635248.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1587695251)
Yup, first thing on the board. lots of empty space there.. I thought of just driving in a couple of nails but I have many saws and they are all different. Figured I would try this for a change.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/IMG_20200423_194627535.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1587695238)
I have never been really happy with any tool board I have done and wanted to have a good plan for this one, but then I thought "you gotta start somewhere" and as long as I can find the tools, what does it matter?
Tomorrow I have a vacation day that I scheduled back in January, to take a class in chainsaw maintenance, but the class was cancelled (surprise!). I could have just worked tomorrow, but I thought I needed a day to do more insurance paperwork and I have 5 yards of topsoil that showed up the other night that needs spreading. So working from home and I am taking a day off. :D I need to polish that shovel anyway. If I can get this retirement thing squared away I could be done working in about 8 workdays and take the next 3 weeks of my vacation time until June 1st.
We are supposed to get about 1/2 of rain tomorrow, but I really don't care, there is stuff I can do to move forward. This is a very strange time. It is not a good time to be going through a major life change. Not how I thought things would go, for sure, when I finally walked out that door. Even if I do feel like celebrating, I can't throw a party or even have a few good friends over for a fire. Not that I am in a party mood anyway, more worried about getting my first check and being able to buy food going forward.
Funny thing, as stressed as I am, I have no regrets about pulling the trigger now. I'm an old dog, I have no value that they understand, they want young kids that make pretty spreadsheets. A shop rat like me they don't understand. When things go really bad after I am gone, they will never even recognize that I was the guy that always prevented those things from happening in the first place.
Time to move on with it.
Well, I had a vacation day today, but I still checked into the Daily Management meeting this morning just to stay current. It rained just about all day until evening, so I was in a big hurry to get moving. Besides, I am have really tired lately, maybe working more than I needed to. Couldn't mill today and really could work on moving dirt, but I did a little anyway. I walked in the shop about 10am and had no clue what I was going to do. I wanted to get that lumber rack made, but need to make lumber first. When I was looking around I spied a handful of 2x4x12' that my son had dropped off last night, leftover from a job. Well, those are a pain for me to store, so I thought 'Hey, why not make a lumber rack out of those?'. SO I laid it pout with a slightly different design, but still heavy duty. Started cutting all the pieces and almost had what I needed, but came up short by about 16' of 2x4's. So I went to Home Despot for the first time in 3 weeks. All new protocols there to learn, glad I had a mask or I couldn't get in. i had a list and got it all pretty quick and paid and got out. Got home skipped lunch, cut the last few pieces then put it together. Pretty dang solid! or, as my son put it 'way overbuilt'. Whatever. I don't like having a load of anything on a rack that begins to sway when it gets full.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/IMG_20200424_201006720.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1587776231)
Then I put some stuff on it and went and had dinner with the wife. After dinner, I moved some more material around, and put up some spray can racks downstairs (using up white oak scraps I found). I m sure I will be moving the lumber storage a few times before I am happy with it, but it is working for now. That's and 8' x 11' piece of floor I never had access to before. So in the last 4 years, with the 3 loft sections, I have added 436 square feet of workspace to my shop, and that feels pretty good. Total investment about $600.00 mostly for mill lumber and plywood for the first loft.
Edit to add: In about a dozen days this thread will be closing out. I started it on May 6th last year, and it was just supposed to be my first year of milling and learning and getting things going. I have been pretty slow, but I have done a lot of learning, and a lot of stuff I have not done before. I still have a long way to go.
Good Luck with your retirement.
Well it rained all day yesterday, so no real outside work except throwing a few shovels of dirt each time I walked past the pile. 5 yards of dirt is a fair amount to spread and grade by hand and I was trying to spread the labor out. I get winded pretty good after throwing dirt for just a half hour.
Last night I did something dumb and stayed up watching too many episodes of a netflix series and finally got to the point that I wanted to just finish it off. Wound up going to bed at 1:30 which is NOT normal for me. Slept until 10am this morning and by the time I had consumed a reasonable amount of coffee and got my boots on, it was nearly noon, also not normal for me. I went out and looked things over after reviewing the weather forecast (great today, washout tomorrow thru monday). Decided I really had no choice but to spread that topsoil today before the heavy rain. SO I put the charger on the garden tractor because I would need that for the roller, and hooked up the snow plow on the Mule hoping I could cheat a little. Mostly I spread by hand and had to wheel barrow a bunch to other parts of the yard. I just kept at it, taking 5 minute breaks every hour or so. Just some pushed with the plow to at least break it up or move it from the main pile, but a 'dozer it ain't ;D. Then the grandsons showed up and lent a hand as best they could. They filled the wheel barrow for me a few times and helped fill in the tire grooves out by the driveway, then got their toy trucks and played in the pile while I worked. Kids and dirt piles, right?
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All in all it didn't turn out too bad once I rolled it. There are some little bumps here and there, but it is a lawn, not a pool table. I won't be hitting roots in this area again for another few years anyway, and it is DONE and the boys had some fun. The wife threw down grass seed at the end of the day. Hopefully I can still stand upright tomorrow. :-\
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I pretty much quit by 5pm and realized I had not yet had breakfast, let alone lunch. :D SO I came in the house and had an orange and a beer for breakfast.
No work in the shop at all today, and I think I am out of steam for tonight. Tomorrow is going to be a rain out, so no milling this weekend.
Well, as predicted we got our rain out today. I went out in the shop thinking I would start a project, but when I got out there I realized it was pretty messy and cluttered and I hate working like that. I thought I could be making more room, so I moved my router table up onto the new loft to get it out of the way, shoved the table saw over a bit, moved a shelving unit and some little storage cabinets up there. and tidied that all up. Vacuumed the floor a bit. Made a step up onto the loft. It looks fairly good now.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/IMG_20200426_190805359.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1587949186)
Doing all that freed up a little more floor space and makes it easier to set up saw horses or whatever for a project. It looks better too.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/IMG_20200426_193135713.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1587949209)
I have also been annoyed whenever I have to use an air hose upstairs. I have to go down, strip hose off the reel, throw it upstairs, and open the compressor valve. So I put a tee, another valve and a gauge (which reads low, but that's OK, it tells me there is pressure), and a hose dedicated to upstairs. I still have to open the compressor line, but I can do that on my way in. I'll work on that on a hot summer day some more, I want to add a switch and a 5 watt red light bulb to remind me when the compressor in on.
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While I was cleaning I found a box full of these little bins. I have been driven close to crazy lately trying to find the screws I need when I am building something. Boxes spread all over the shop, shed, tool bags, etc. It's a big time waster and drives me nuts. So I made a rack that hangs from the ceiling and holds a bunch of these little bins. I labeled them by length and drive type (torx, square, or Phillips) and collected every partial box of screws in the shop and made a bin for them. Now I can see what I have and what I might need easily and quickly. A lousy shelf job, but very handy, none the less. AND, I got to use up a 1x4x12' board I milled by accident when making 5/4's 2 weeks ago. Only had 12 inches left over.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/IMG_20200426_190600998.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1587949167)
One of my Grandsons was over today to have some one on one time with Grandma (baking), but he came out to the shop to help Grandpa for a while and he helped cleanup a little and he told me where to hang some of the signs I found from my machine shop when I last had my own business 40 years ago. He thinks it dresses up the place a little, I think it reminds my son and his guys not to leave me a mess. :D
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/IMG_20200426_190723301.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1587949153)
So, another day with no project work, but hopefully this work will make the projects go easier. At least now I know I am short on screws. ;D
The most important thing I see you have accomplished the last couple of days is time spend with the grandkids. I know they will look back on those times as the best in their lives. Keep up the good work.
Shelves look good to me.
Your shop looks really good glad those kids were around to help out. Grandpa's teach us many things that stay with us for life. I was fortunate to have known mine.
Cfarm, those shelves look great from up your way, but up close, not so much. :D They are solid and do the job though. Another task off the list and some efficiencies picked up. Plus I only have a handful of those little bins cluttering up a shelf, so win-win-win.
WV and Nebraska, I love spending time with the boys, of course. I hope they just have memories that whenever they came over to visit I was doing something. I don't want to remember Grandpa as a guy that sat in a chair, watched golf, yelled at the TV, and read the paper all day. I confess that I am trying to teach them the value of work and how it can be fun as well as satisfying and rewarding on several levels. All three of them look for tools to help out when they get here, which tells me it might be working. That, and the million questions..... all the time..... in a steady stream..... that never ends.................ever. ;D :D
Quote from: Old Greenhorn on April 27, 2020, 08:18:32 AM
Cfarm, those shelves look great from up your way, but up close, not so much. :D They are solid and do the job though. Another task off the list and some efficiencies picked up. Plus I only have a handful of those little bins cluttering up a shelf, so win-win-win.
WV and Nebraska, I love spending time with the boys, of course. I hope they just have memories that whenever they came over to visit I was doing something. I don't want to remember Grandpa as a guy that sat in a chair, watched golf, yelled at the TV, and read the paper all day. I confess that I am trying to teach them the value of work and how it can be fun as well as satisfying and rewarding on several levels. All three of them look for tools to help out when they get here, which tells me it might be working. That, and the million questions..... all the time..... in a steady stream..... that never ends.................ever. ;D :D
OG, the lessons you are teaching them are worth more than they will ever know. A solid work ethic and desire to work hard are so important! They are very fortunate to have you as their grandpa, and don't try and tell me you're not the greatest or sell yourself short as I know you'll do. You're doing a good job there my friend and I'm going to tell you so even if you don't want to hear it ;D
Good luck on the retirement, hope it comes together for you the way you need it to!!
Brandon
Teach them young. I have only good memories of my grandpa, he passed in 1974. I was also lucky to have a great grandpa for a while. He was a master at refinishing antique furniture.
Well thanks for the encouraging comments folks.
I suppose it takes a while to reach the rank of 'Grandpa' and I try to do the best job I can because the responsibility is pretty heady. :) As they get older, it becomes more fun. Still at their tender age now, I am surprised (and impressed) at the amount of work they can actually do. It's tangible to me, besides the fellowship and general fun we have. It does take some preparation before they come to line up a proper day of applicable activities. ;D
Spent the work day (day job) doing fixture design work and filling out medicare part B forms. This causes a lot of stress for me. Worried about something going wrong or missing a check box on a form that causes a delay of days or weeks. I also had a couple of skype meetings, first with my big boss to make my retirement plans clear (he didn't seem to get it) and then, after he realized this was an issue he had to deal with right now (as in, he should have dealt with it weeks ago but wasn't paying attention to what I was saying), we had a later meeting with him and my immediate co-workers so we could make a hand-over/transition plan (which I have been asking for for over a month now). SO, now the cat is clearly out of the bag and we have sort of a plan. My last work day should be 5/6 or so, then I will be on vacation until 6/1 at which time I will be retired (and broke :D again). I still plan on making myself available to my co-workers for questions through the end of the month, because I really don't want to leave them in a lurch. This should give them both a chance to really understand what I am doing and where they need to focus. So I figure if they can get a hold of me with questions, that should smooth it out for them. I am probably going into the office Friday to plot out and file a lot of prints I have done in the past few weeks, finish some job folders and start packing all the junk in my office (glad I have a truck).
This is scaring the heck out of me, I confess. I don't know how this is going to go, but what the heck. But the paperwork is pretty much done now. Too late to turn back now.
This evening I got back to a real project and it din't go so well. No bog deal, I am learning and will just keep pluggin' at it until I get it right. Lots of thinking going on in my head right now. Might have to dump the original planes and scale it back a bit to salvage it. Lets just say a jointer would have come in handy on this one. :D Instead of 65 inches tall, it might wind up be 36" ;D. More when I get a clue what I am doing.
Tom
By the way, I just realized, my last day of work is also the day I started this thread a year ago and will be closing it out. Funny how that works out, ain't it?
OGH - You have enough "Hobbys and such" to keep you focused once you are officially retired, so don't worry. You will be surprised the good feelings that come to you once that "Monkey" is off your back. :D
And keep making memories with those grand-kids...
I have 20 or so men working for me for the last 18 years. about a dozen of them retired in that time.
most had a least 30 years on the job.
they all had a lot of worry and emotion. within a month or two they were never happier.
you're going to love it.
best of luck.
(I have about 3 or 4 years to go)
Oh I am not at all worried about what I will 'do with myself' or 'stay busy', that's not an issue. I was more worried about things like food, gas, insurance premiums, taxes and things like that. Eating is a hard habit to break, and the reduced income concerns me quite a bit. Being busy and having things to do is only a problem in that I don't have enough time to do all the things I need to do.
I expect you guys are right, it will be fine. But if it doesn't go as planned, I will figure something out, I always do. Still, I reserve the right to worry about it. ;D
I read that last post and the "Don't worry be happy song started in my head". I am happy for you, just glad you can get things lined up and exit on your terms.
HA HA! Yeah, good song. If I was leaving on my terms, there would be a pension involved. :D I worked for two companies that withdrew the pensions they promised when I was hired just a year before I was fully vested and gave us pennies as a lump sum at that moment. Companies, especially corporations, treat their employees like livestock. If one gets sick, put it down, and get another. I predict, when this 'thing' subsides, my company will be looking for folks to handle the upsurge and will tell the media 'we can't find qualified people' without mentioning that they screwed the ones they had and layed them off when things got slow.
But there I go again, and guess what: it's not my problem any more. 8)
Enjoy your up coming retirement, Tom. I retired a year ago this coming Saturday, May 2nd. I'm doing fine myself. I still drop in to my work place occasionally to see the guys. I also do some little projects there at times. Retirement is actually good, don't have to report to work on a daily basis. You'll be fine once you get accustomed to it.
Keep this tread going. Your Grandkids will be able to look back at it. :D
We have all had bad times in life, money wise, and wonder what we will do? We always make it!!
I am looking so forward to having time on my hands, doing what I want to do, but having no money to do it!!! :D
I will be here with my tractor digging rocks and working the land.
Best wishes on your retirement, it is great, I found that I had extra $ because I was not buying lunch in town most days and was not going to Hbr Frgt 2-3 times a week or the recycle or habitat restore stores, plus the daily gas for the 50 mile round trip to work and back. One thing I noticed is that the time really sped up and the days, months, yrs go by way to fast.
In a few months you will look back and think "wish I had retired sooner."
Strange day today. I never set foot in the shop or near the mill. I went into work for the first full day in 6 or more weeks. I had done so many designs and prints that I was loosing track. I had to go in and get them printed/plotted and either filed or out to the tool shop for build. I had also worked on documenting some of the tasks I do that nobody else has knowledge of and turn that work over to my peers in a meaningful and useful manner. So I needed to work with them directly on that.
The first 4 hours I spent just plotting out prints (and getting the coffee pot primed and working again). The I started cleaning my desk and sharing stuff with others and catching up on things I missed being out of the building. A few folks dropped by to wish me well on the retirement thing. Not many. Everyone is wrapped up in their own concerns these days. I get it. I am too.
The afternoon I spent cleaning out and packing personal items and tools from my office. I can't take it all, nor do I want to. Mostly photos I had on the wall with celebrity friends and some award plaques, my own tools I came in with, many coffee mugs (I am a sucker for them and I always offer coffee to a visitor when they come in) and some doo-dads and odds and ends one collects over 15 years. Anyway, just 3 boxes of stuff that added up to about 150 pounds or so. At the end of the day I went over some stuff and gave some 'going forward' advice to the 2 guys that will be stuck with the slack I create, and some of the detail work, and how to handle a workload beyond their capacity. They are becoming a 2 man department that should be a 4 man department, it means they have to make choices. I did the 2 man department gig with another guy for 5 years and I explained how we managed through it. It wasn't pretty, but two guys with some grit and backbone can do it. Whimps will not survive. ;D Both these guys need to \grow a pair and let the big boss know what they are dealing with... in graphic detail.
It was a full and busy day, I took a 10 minute lunch and left late. When I got home, I unloaded all the junk in the shop and came in for dinner. One of our cats (the female attached to me) was sitting at the door with that " Where have YOU been all day" look on her face and did not get more than 3 feet away from me for the next 3 hours. Apparently everyone is feeling changes. She missed me, my wife says she was a pest all day, acting very odd and clingy. I guess I have that effect on women. :D
Anyway, This was probably my last functionally productive day in the office. I will go in on Tuesday just because it is my last full day and spend some time with the folks in the shop I did not see today. I did not do a 'tour', physical distancing is not conducive to that, but I did have to see certain folks on current business and ran into others. The guys are wishing me well, some are jealous, a little, but their turn is coming. These are good folks, I feel bad to leave them, but the time is right for me.
Yeah, it was a log day, but one I needed to get through. two more full days and then I am on vacation until the 29th when I go in for a half day ( I will still have 4 hours vacation) and turn in my computer, phone, and whatever else they want, then call it quits.
This still feels a bit surreal. I never really expected to live long enough to retire and I am still having a hard time even saying that word.
Well enough of that retirement and job talk, back to the real stuff. Yesterday was a perfect day. First time working in a t-shirt all year and I lathered up a good sweat. The mill area is a bit of a mess as I try to figure out the best organization method and reconfigure for that. Stuff is dropped everywhere, but I am starting to see how to make this odd shaped area work better. I took some of the leftover pine 6/4 boards and hacked it into bunks for the drying skid and just threw 1 nail in each to hold them in place, then I moved the better stuff over to that skid to clear off the trailer a little. I still have some stuff to trim and mover over, probably today, then I can pull that trailer out and begin organizing the area more.
I had a log I rolled onto the mil during the week to get it out of the way, a bent EWP and figured I would not get much out of it once it was square so I might as well mill it up and be done. It had a goodly sweep:
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/IMG_20200502_105405758.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1588505059)
I got 10 2x4x12's out of it but with the knots, some of them will be short. One weird one came apart when I picked it up, it had a break clean through it, not rot or defects, it just fractured, I figure it was created when the tree hit the ground. I got a few other random boards and put them all on the skid. I need to make some saw bucks to throw my slabs in and make them into fire wood, so this should work for that.
Then I rolled up a maple log that I cut 2 years ago. It had developed a split when I dropped it, a very hard leaner in a tangle for years. I worked around (parallel) the split. I needed to get at least 2 nice boards out of it to close out a special order I will have to plane. That was a bear, for some reason it was harder than heck and the new blade I put on was bucking like mad. (See other thread regarding 4° blades.) I got the 2 I need and was cutting a third when I split open a big nest of groggy carpenter ants about a foot long. I cut off the invested parts and let them sit in the sun, they hate that. ;D Then I cut the rest into 2x4's and cleaned up the mill.
Since I did all that pine I am having trouble with sawdust sticking to the carriage wheels and bed rail. I may have to scrub all that stuff today and come up with a better control solution. Hardwoods collect and build up, but flake off easy, this stuff, with the sap, not so much. I also noticed I am due for belt changes, things are beginning to look a little frayed, so I will be making a list of parts today and maybe take it down next weekend and do the annual stuff to get everything is good shape. I think I will finally put that new tire on the idler pulley that I bought last year and see if that helps things any.
I have a small mess of firewood to buck in the driveway from one of my son's cleanup jobs, probably a face cord. So today I have lots of choices and will bounce around as my wind holds up and try to start getting a hold of all these chores to organize my world. Gonna need more logs to make another drying skid so I can separate more stuff by size and species. Lots to do and with only 2 more full work days left in the day job, my mind is turning toward the immediate future. carpe diem, right?
You will like being retired. Seem like you had a lot going on at work too. Did I say you will like being retired? ;D
I have a feeling that being retired may work me to death if I am not careful. Now the work really starts. ;D :D
OH, and I forgot to mention in my earlier post I had another sale this week. A gal I work with saw some of the little book shelves I made on my FB page and asked for 4 of them. I bought in 6 on Friday some she could pick what she wanted. She bought all the unfinished ones I had (5). Sorry, no photo. It was raining steady and we did the exchange out at my truck in the parking lot. Now I have to make more, she cleaned me out. :D
I was about to say, that you may never have been so busy as you will be in retirement. Life is a series of "getting your name in the paper" moments, from birth to the end. marriage and kids mentioned in the middle. All the rest is up to you. You got the grand child thing down. make sure it stays fun for the most part, and get your name in the paper a few more times. Congratulations and may God continue to bless you and your family.
Now the real "work" begins. ;D
I "work" around here. The neighbors will stop, when I am down by the road, and ask if that's all I do is work all the time? But the next sentence they say how good it looks. :o ::) I don't mind working at my place. Not much pressure to get a job done at my house. :D Don't have to rely on others to help out either. If I want I can sit on a stump and watch the world go by. The boss don't seem to mind much. ;D
You will enjoy being retired. It is waking up in the morning then deciding what you are going to do that day that requires some getting used to. Even if you have something planned, realizing that you are the master of your own plans is nice.
In September I will be retired 5 years. It will likely take a few weeks to get employment stuff out of your head. It's a process. Missing the people is my biggest problem, I worked with some great folks. Staying active, which you don't seem to have a problem there, is the key to adjusting to retired life. In a few months you will suddenly realize work was getting in the way of the stuff you wanted to do!
Congratulations enjoy the freedom of retirement. It is a lifestyle change but reduced income can easily be made up by being creative.
Ah Ted, you hit the nail on the head. Work has always been an impediment. But no doubt your predictions are spot on.
I woke this morning thinking I would work on tweaking the mill, which is needed. But when I got outside and did a little survey and realized it is Sunday and changed my plans and just went with what struck me. I always try to do something fun on Sunday, just for the heck of it. It might be fixing something I rarely use, but just want it working right, or it might be trying something odd I have never done before, just to see how it goes.
For 3 years now I kept telling myself I need a sawbuck for cutting up slabs and junk wood. Well this week my son dumped a load of hardwoods from his cleanup work and it's all good, but mostly small. Today was sawbuck day. So I whipped this up from the 2x4's I milled yesterday.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/IMG_20200503_120207978.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1588543021)
I had to test it, then added that center support, and cut up nearly a trailer load doing the small stuff. I bucked the split-able stuff and threw them to the side for later.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/IMG_20200503_161653522.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1588543132)
It works pretty much as designed. When I get this stuff cleaned up I will move it back by the mill for loading slabs on as I mill them off and save some steps.
After messing with that for a few hours I was getting tired and decided to change gears. I had brought back an odd chunk of EWP from @nybhh's place a few weeks ago when we dropped those trees. I had no idea what I was gonna do with it, but I always wanted to try the freehand CSM technique, so today was the day for that too. I had a hard time cutting down the middle and it takes some practice to get the saw to track right, but I can see how guy with some practice can make this work. I should have used the big saw from the beginning, it tracked much better.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/IMG_20200503_160638247.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1588543022)
But split it, I did, and it was not as bad as I thought. Then I had to figure out what to do with it. so I started on an idea.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/IMG_20200503_163116308.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1588543125)
And quit for the day (on this) at this point:
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/IMG_20200503_164243584.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1588543217)
I want to run some big ash lag bolts in to hold the legs in place before I flip it to do the other side. I didn't have anything long enough on hand, so it can sit for a bit. I was pretty bushed anyway. The last bit of business was I had recently pieced together a pintle hitch for the truck form parts I got or had here and there over time. I rarely have a need for this, but when you need one, you really need one. I wanted to paint it a bright attractive color so my shin could find it easier, this is what I found on the shelf.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/IMG_20200503_165603818.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1588543221)
Now its dinner time. I may go back out later and do a little cleaning up of the junk I brought home from my office. I didn't have time to go through all the papers at work.
But I am bushed. I had no idea I would be doing ANY of this today. SO Ted, you are correct. It is nice to be in charge of your own time. ;D
I like the sawbucks idea. I could see a bunch of them staged out at my slab pile
On the freehand CSM work I worked a long time in central Africa and vacationed in the Amazon and in both places I saw local tribesmen making boards with just a chainsaw and they were pretty doggoned good at it. The lodges in Ecuador (Same place Naked and Afraid did a 40 day challenge and several others since) were made of rough boards sawed that way. Of course they were up on pilings about the normal high water marks.
Good looking benches in the works. Don't overthink the legs. Nail/bolt them on then put them on the mill upside down and cut them to length/angle with one pass of the mill.
No overthinking (that takes too much effort). just a simple plunge through the set the leg angel and two quick cuts, with maybe just a tad of cleaning out. This is a good way to work on my freehand saw skills and saw control, then two lag bolts on each leg, but because it is pine I am using long bolts to catch some meat. I may counterbore them and drive in cover plugs. Maybe not. I bet this pig weighs around 150 pounds or more/ Local delivery only. :D
Made a two person saw buck at the camp for a bunch of small wood, I put two boards on top to make a V shaped trough so one person can push the log ahead and the other can stay on one end and cut the log, it worked pretty good.
And "the best revenge is living well!" I forgot to add that. Living well doesn't have to be elaborate or expensive - healthy, vibrant, interesting and active. You have that part down!
Sharpen the chain to 10 degrees and it will sail through that pine.
the saw guides work good and you can cut square ends with them also.
I have vids of them. The lumbermaker guide is what got me started in all of this.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ydLCp4s0LJc (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ydLCp4s0LJc)
On the pending retirement Dad always said we had this wrong/backwards. People started work in or around their early 20's when they were young and healthy but did not have the time or money to enjoy themselves and worked till they were in their 60s then retired when they were too old and worn out to enjoy what they were doing. He said what we should do is have people retire till they hit about 60 then just work them to death.
I say that about collage too. Kinda hard for a 18 year old to know what they want to do for the rest of their life when they have not even done anything yet.
I am coming around to your Dad's way of thinking. ;D :D
OG, her are some pics of my old saw buck. it is 4 feet tall, folds up, I kept it to use as a pattern for a new one when I have time. the fingers are 16 inches on center, as that is my firewood length I like. It allows uniform length makes it easier (neater) to stack and a face cord is then 1/3 cord. My stove can take a 24 inch log side to side, 18 inches front to back. with a hot fire, I do not want to get a piece half in and get stuck.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/51041/FF338588-020B-4B97-85B1-F4BA391B62D4.jpeg?easyrotate_cache=1588850772)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/51041/00C88E6A-14A0-437F-BF63-290BD9F74258.jpeg?easyrotate_cache=1588853133)
OGH,
Isn't today the day you join the officially retired? If so congrats and keep the posts coming.
Well technically Howard, I am officially retired on June 1st, but yesterday was the first day of my vacation which will run until the 29th when I go in for one last half-day to turn in my gear, keys, computers, credit card, etc. and sign papers. Tuesday was my last full workday and I gave them the whole day and was still working on issues late in the afternoon that came up. In the evening my wife cooked a nice steak and we had a little fire in the backyard even though it was a little chilly. We invited over of the neighbor couples over to complete the circle but they had to decline ( I had forgotten they have their parents staying with them and they are being very cautious.) Yesterday was my first full day home and those same neighbors wanted to mark it, so they insisted on buying us a very nice takeout dinner of our choice. I called in the order and they picked it up and delivered it, along with a case of the beer I drink. It was a very nice thing for them to do which we very much enjoyed. Also, Tuesday night I was contacted by 'somebody' to find out if I was interested in a black market haircut. ;D You bet I was! All neat and clean procedures in place, one on one with the barber, masks in place, all supplies changed out after each customer, everything cleaned after each haircut. But because the barber in question is risking their license to help out a few friends, it was like the old speakeasy days. Park in a certain area, walk around to the back of the building, down the alley, knock 3 times and wait. If you had an appointment and the room was clear, you could come in, the door was locked behind you. I am not much of a law breaker and neither is the barber, BUT... oh boy did (does) that feel good! I didn't get much else done besides that. I took a stab at making progress on that lump of a bench but for some reason I could not get into it and was doing sloppy work. I felt pretty tired all day and the weather was dank, cool, and overcast. Today is looking much better.
Doc, I think you showed photos of that buck in the past and that is pretty much what I had in mind for mine. Mostly it will be for slabs, but also some smaller stuff for the stove. I use my mingo marker for the lengths and like 18's, but the stove going in the shop in a few months will handle 24's front to back. Once I get this little pile of small stuff done, I will move the buck around to the mill so I can throw the slabs right on it from the log then cut them when it is full and sort of keep up with it as I go. Right now I have a pile of slabs to cull through for either firewood or benches. Plus I need to get a bunch from the old mill site and get that cleaned up.
Looks to me like you had a pretty good sawing day yesterday!
I wasn't happy with the work I did yesterday, I was not 'into' it and did sloppy work. This morning I sat and thunk on it for a while and realized that I am probably pushing to get into this retirement mode quickly and hurry up and 'do stuff' because I have so much to do. So I changed it up and today was a lot better and a bit more enjoyable. I went out and worked on the first thing I saw which was all those boxes from my office that need to be cleaned up, put away, or what ever. I had a lot of photos and posters from events that I worked on, which I took home because I knew the 'next guy' would just throw them out. I grabbed them and hung them in the odd open joists and beams around the shop. Some I did not, I may make frames because they are prints of an artists works and I have a series of posters covering about 10 years for one event, but the other stuff is just things I liked to remember. I know they will get covered in dust and sawdust, but it IS a shop, right?
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/IMG_20200507_154709059.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1588895767)
I think it kind of dresses the place up a little. I am not one of those guys that ask celebrity types if I can get a picture with them, it take me years to ask that question. Pretty shy i guess, so the few I have are guys or gals I know pretty well and see often. That makes them special to me in that it's not the 'hey, look who I met!', its more of old friends or folks I had the pleasure of working with more than once. Jay Unger, Bela Fleck, and Bill Keith ( a very close and dearly missed friend), and of course some picker friends none of you would know but play really well and are dear to me. There is a Grandson or two in there also. Figured it was as good a place as any for my EMT of the year plaque too, what else am I gonna do with it?
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/IMG_20200507_170617124.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1588895750)
So that emptied a box. Another thing bothering me was the workbench area. I had these 5 gallon buckets of stain and paint that I have been stepping around for months. So I got them stored and ripped out a shelf some bozo made before I bought the place that was useless and cleaned all that up and made the space under the stairs a bit more useful. More work yet to come on that for sure, but I need to figure out what I want first. Then I went to work on the bench and cleaned that off. I was going to re-mount the vise my son took off 10 years ago, but discovered they (him and his buddies) had rendered it useless because the swivel lock bolt is missing. Something else I have to fix now. ;D So I put it on the side for now and moved onto project work.
I had some cookies the wife wants me to make into cocktail tables. They are in sad shape, but what the heck? One I had been using for a place to dump excess epoxy and she thought it looked nice, but I needed to make the bottoms seal up, so I made up some epoxy and spread it like butter cream on the bottoms and sides.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/IMG_20200507_154036776.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1588895710)
They will still need some more work, but I made a step anyway. The photos look like big voids in the covering, but that is the light reflecting. They ain't near done yet. They will need more epoxy than they are worth. :D
Last chore of the day for me was pulling out the Bunn coffee pot I had salvaged from work about 2 years ago. I really want a pot out in the shop, and I LOVE Bunn Coffee pots, 12 cups in about 3 minutes. Right now I hang out in the house until the coffee is done, then go to work. Having a pot out there might make it easier for me to get started earlier (or work later). SO I took it apart and pulled all the internal parts that contact the water and cleaned those up (some of it required a putty knife ;D) and checked all the wiring. I brought the 2 pots in the house for scrubbing up and will do that before I hit the sack. Then I put it all back together. I don't have any of the correct filters here, so will have to pick those up, but tomorrow I will run a bunch of water through it to purge it out, then maybe in the afternoon do a test run. For now it will sit on the bench, but eventually I will have to find a proper home for it where I can keep the supplies for it, keep everything clean and dust free. Perhaps I will have to build a wall cabinet or something? Anyway, having a pot in the shop will make it a complete shop in my mind, at that point it becomes a home. (Well, come to think of it, a little refrigerator would be nice too. :) ) It's just one of those weird things I always wanted, so I am doing it.
I was given a TV for the shop a couple of weeks ago. I don't watch TV much at all (although I still watch MASH reruns when I catch them) but I do watch netflix and some YouTube stuff and some music stuff. The TV is actually turning out to be a good companion in the shop to keep me company. I rarely look at it, (can't really see it anyway) but I listen as I work. This TV has no stand, it was a tear out from a house job and must have had a wall mount, so tonight I ordered a mount so that I can swing it for upstairs or downstairs viewing and at least I can get it off the floor and out of the way. It sounds (and feels) pretty silly, but with today's technology, I can also cast how-to videos up on it when I am trying to figure something out. It is not hooked up to TV or cable, it's just a monitor that I can cast stuff from my phone to. We will see if it lasts.
Just this morning I realized this thread should have ended yesterday as that was one full year since I started it, but I completely missed the date given my distractions. I am kind of on the fence where to go with it now. Some have asked that I continue it (thank you, that is kind of y'all), but I don't think a lot of folks are really reading it and I feel like I am consuming bandwidth without providing much value in return. It's mostly just me rambling about how I waste my days, really. ;D Frankly, I am surprised anybody reads it. :D
I really think I should taper this thing off. Now that I am home I don't spend any time during the day keeping up with all the other posts, like I used to, so I try to catch up on the day's reading in the evenings, but sometimes I miss a few posts if it has been a busy day and I can't get back far enough in the recent posts listing. I'll think on it a little more.
Feel free to do what you like. I think plenty read it, and for those who do not, no harm done. maybe a new one with the initial retirement/starting my craft/hobby/business thread/season/ what ever. feel like I know you a bit. keep it up one way or another. :)
I second Doc's reply !
Keep it up or start a new one. I read regularly and enjoy it.
Hey Tom, you've had over 37,000 views of this thread, so yeah, I'd say people are interested.
I'm a reading!!
I read it regularly, and like Docs idea. I hope to retire in the next year or two and pursue woodworking and sawmilling as a way to make extra money in retirement, so I have been following your progress on that with a lot of interest. Great thread!
Jeff
Well, I guess because I like documenting my days so I can look back and see if I spent them wisely and re-learn from my own mistakes, I guess I will continue it in some form. Very long threads are not good for the forum, they choke things down when loaded, so I will start a new one. I will ponder for a day or so what the supposed point of that thread might be. If any of you have suggestions, let me know.
Quote from: Old Greenhorn on May 07, 2020, 09:28:42 PMRight now I hang out in the house until the coffee is done, then go to work play
There, thats better.
I think you would be suprised at how many folks stop and read your thread. I enjoy seeing what you accomplish or not. It's good to see you making the transition to retirement. So I am looking forward to whatever shape the new thread becomes.
+1 on continuing relating your activities whether in this thread or a new one.
Well, just another day getting used to new things. Had my monthly Chiropractor appointment (tune up) this morning which killed half a day. Good to see Doctor Marc, he is a big fan of my sawmillling and tree felling life, always has questions. Always shakes his head when I tell him of my latest dumb mistake that he needs to adjust. :D
As long as I was out I ran into to Home Depot to get some hardware for the screen door I ordered from a local door shop yesterday. 4 times the price, but buy local right? Been wanting a screen door on the side door for years, finally gonna do it this year. A nice simple pine screen door, no lock set, spring hinges, lets see how this goes.
Got home around 11:30 or so and headed to the shop. Ran some white vinegar and water through the coffee pot a few times, then a LOT of water to clean that stuff and taste out. Eventually made my first pot. Just about the time it finished, my son and his 2 guys showed up to change out the front axle on one of his trucks because the rain was heading in. I offered them some coffee, but I drink it black and told them they would have to bring their own fancy mixings if they wanted them. One of the guys jumped on it. The coffee was OK, but will get better when the pot seasons in. This one seems persnickety, I will have to see if it has issues, or I just need to learn it better.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/IMG_20200508_202708021.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1588986536)
Once armed with coffee, I went upstairs and took another look at that 6' tall corner shelf idea that wasn't coming out so good. i decided to cut it down to a more manageable size and picked 3 feet. But then I found the table saw had developed a layer of rust, so i had to clean that up with some scotch brite and WD40. Looked pretty good when I was done.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/IMG_20200508_132648389.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1588986434)
Anyway, it was clean and I hacked the shelf down, re-cut the back edge lap joint, clamped it and drilled the joint holes and threw some brass screws in it. Then I tried to work out the shelf shapes, which are not 'normal' in that this is a live edge deal and the two sides are unequal length, very much an artsy concept.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/IMG_20200508_202455206.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1588986454)
So I crashed and burned a time or two on the first couple of attempts and all I could do was laugh at myself, First one came out PERFECT.......But the live edge was on the bottom (the shelf was upside down, I measured from the wrong ends). Firewood, try again. :D Eventually I got better at it and cut the three shelves. They still need trimming where the edges meet which I will do after I have the screw holes in.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/IMG_20200508_202506236.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1588986475)
Dinner time or so I thought, so I checked and found out I still had 45 minutes or so. So I had to fix my belt sander. I had gotten a few shocks from it yesterday that I took to be more than static electricity. I knew the wire was shot, but I guess it developed a leak or two. ;D
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/IMG_20200508_202535194.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1588986502)
What was very cool to me was when I opened it up I saw saw what was clearly my Dad's meticulous wiring job, complete with shrink tube over the butt connectors. He had re-wired this tool about 40 years ago. There are more miles on this tool than most heavy trucks. He ran it hard before I was big enough to lift it. I sanded all the hardwood floors (3 rooms!) in our second apartment with this little 3x21 belt sander. So it was neat to clearly see my Dad's hand in there and I tried to replicate his care and neatness and it is all back together and running fine.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/IMG_20200508_202548807.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1588986526)
I went back out after dinner when the boys were gone and piddled around a little more with odds and ends.
I am still trying to figure out what to do with the next thread objective, but when I do, I'll get it started up. I think I need a day or three more. I don't want to do a retirement thread, that's not me and not my focus, and not very interesting for all the young vibrant and active folks here, many of whom know more about retirement than I ever will.
I am beginning to lose track of what weekday it is, I think that's pretty cool because I don't care. But Sunday is Mother's day and I was informed today I need to keep track of that and not plan a normal work day. ;D
the rewards of a shop and home away from home. very whimsical shelf. Looks like you are using rusty plyers to stir the coffee. :D . I have my dad's old metal housed saw, jigsaw and router. do not use them as much. at least you have a grounded cord.
Well, Saturday used to be my main workday, now it is just another day :D. Weird day for sure. It was 31 when up got up and flurrying. In fact it varied from flurries to blue sky and sun, the whiteouts, then back again throughout the day, strong wind, WNW all day. Never got over 40. The lawn turned white, then melted at least 3 times today. I could have stayed in the house, napped, and watched movies all day, but it didn't appeal to me. Neither did working outside. ;D
This photo is 2:30pm, you know, the hottest part of the day?
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/IMG_20200509_171021480.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1589072882)
So I went out in the shop and got back to work on that corner shelf. I finished the joints on the top shelf and drilled and screwed the shelves in place to see how they looked. The corners were pretty funky where they met the sides, especially the top.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/IMG_20200509_110301629.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1589072783)
But once I had everything screwed in, I took to sanding and filing all the blends in and it didn't come out too bad.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/IMG_20200509_120205833.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1589072800)
And overall it looks fairly good for a wood butcher's work.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/IMG_20200509_120212120_BURST001.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1589072821)
Then I took it back apart and did the flat sanding, got some remaining shop marks off. I put a first coat of verathane on the shelf bottoms and the insides of the side pieces. Tomorrow I will do the flip side, then put it back together. Much easier to get even coats in the flat rather than assembled. I also need to get some more #10 brass screws.
So whilst that was drying I turned to the dreaded tool board. Today was the day I would take another small step and start to get things hung up. I am sick of having tools scattered on the bench. I looked through all the hooks, hangers and thingies I had to hang things up and found nothing suitable. So I grabbed some maple drops in the scrap pile and made a rack for the chisels. Then I made another one for the carving tools after dinner. I still have no layout plan. I am just starting at the far end and working my way back. I figure if I do at least one or two tool types a week, I will eventually run out of space or tools. Most likely the former will happen first. Way too many tools here. But the upstairs board should be easiest because it will focus on wood working tools and I only have a few hundred pounds of those.
So I didn't get a lot done, but I moved forward. I might get a little time in the shop tomorrow, but I don't expect much. The wife and I may make a trip to the veteran's cemetery about 1/2 hour away to visit my parents graves. It has been a while and I am due for a visit. My son wants to bring his boys down too, so it may turn into some kind of family event for all I know. I am not in control of anything, so we will see.
I read this thread, it's real life!
I very seldom sign in but read all new posts most every day and have enjoyed yours
Happy Retirement!!!
Holy cow, I just lost a post that took me 40 minutes to type. I ain't gonna do it again. SO here are the cliff notes:
Nice Mothers day yesterday with the Grandson's over to 'help' plant stuff and they helped with me hand splitting wood.
Today I worked on the tool board some more.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/IMG_20200511_153400384.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1589243648)
I sanded some cookies, sanded the corner shelf parts, then glued the spine and put the sides together, with the top shelf. I then set that up and put another coat of urethane on it. It still doesn't look too bad.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/IMG_20200511_175902911.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1589243687)
I like the top shelf joints.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/IMG_20200511_180000180.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1589243696)
Sorry, the previous post I typed at great length was brilliantly witty and humorous, but I don't have the energy to do it all again. You just have to trust me on that point. :D
Post and copy can be your friend.
Well I have been keeping up a pretty regular schedule work wise since I went on 'terminal leave'. But today I just didn't feel it happening. I did not sleep at all well last night, finally got out of bed at 4am and was tired from the get-go. Made breakfast at 5:30 but I just wasn't feeling it at all. I could not get motivated and kind of hated myself for it. So I put the shelves back in the corner shelf and put what I hope is a final coat on it. It seems to look OK.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/IMG_20200512_095010771.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1589330988)
Funky shelves with the uneven side lengths, but it might appeal to somebody. You never know until you try, right?
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/IMG_20200512_095053177.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1589330970)
I came in had lunch and took a nap on the couch. I never do that. My ear is making funky sounds and I am wondering if I am coming down with a cold. The weather is cool, damp, windy, and stinky even though it is not raining.
Anyway, after my nap fedex showed up with the cheapo wall mount bracket I ordered for the shop TV, so I put that up. Then I looked around for the next project. I found a RO slab that had split down the middle before I planed it, so I am looking at cutting the heartwood out and doing a glue-up to keep the live edges and just about 2" or so more narrow than the original slab. Never did that before either, so why not? Maybe I could stick a maple center insert section in it? Anybody have an opinion?
SO basically I goofed off all day. I guess when you are retired, which I am practicing for, you can do that and not feel too guilty? I still feel like a bum today. Hoping I sleep better tonight. Tomorrow I have to go pick up the screen door I ordered and maybe get that on, but I am not very good at that stuff, so it might kill the whole day even if I have everything I need on hand. I am also hoping those 4° blades finally show up from WM but I don't think I will get to those until Thursday because I am doing the belts, grease, and guide alignments before I try the new blades out. I want to give them a good shot.
I hope this weather warms up just a tad pretty soon.
your shelf is cool. maybe will take off like @Bruno of NH (https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=26349) raised beds. you will get a rhythm going soon I am sure. a job is like a younger brother. they drive you crazy, but you sure miss them when you no longer get to see them.
Doc, I think there is little chance I will ever hit on something as popular as Bruno has. That only comes along once in a great while, if at all. I am very glad he (and now some others) are doing well with it. That funky little shelf of mine will likely never even find a buyer, I bet, but it was fun to make anyway.
Well I am trying to be philosophical about today because I am dog tired and a bit frustrated.
But a bad day working around the house, in the shop, and on the mill is ALWAYS better then a good day at work. Got a solid night of sleep until I was awakened by a screaming charlie (charley?) horse in my leg that shot me out of bed dancing in pain. I should have never slacked off on the tums before bed, I got sloppy, sorry Doc. By the time I walked it off, I was wide awake, so I got got dressed and started the day.
After catching up on the forum and other online stuff and emails, I went and picked up the screen door. I got roped into picking up a door for my neighbor at the same time. Trimmed up the door and fitted it with a little adjustment planing here and there, but not too bad at all really. I must be getting better and I had one Grandson here to help which was nice. We ripped down some maple for the door stop strips. I now have to find a low profile doorknob because the screen door will not close all the way, it hits the knob (3/4" interference). If I can't find a door knob I'll pull it down and put thicker trim on the door that will move it all out another 1", but I would like to replace that knob set anyway, the youngest grandson has a lot of trouble opening it and my wife struggles with it once in a while also. Still the door opens and closes and as soon as the wife decides whether to stain it or paint it, and if so, what color, I will take it down and let her do that part, or I will do it at her direction. >:(
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/IMG_20200513_161724643_HDR.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1589412609)
As we were finishing up the big brown truck showed up with my 4° blades, so after I cleaned up the tools I switched gears and went out to do the mill maintenance. The belt change was easy, the old one wasn't too bad, so I saved it for an emergency, but put the new one on anyway then I set to putting the new tire on the idler band wheel. Had to pull the pillow blocks off and remove the pulley, got the old tire off easy, but there was no way to get that new tire on. I fought and fought, tried using tire irons and every trick I could think of, but there was no way this thing would fit. After I nearly got whacked in the head with a loaded tire iron, I decided it wasn't happening and I decided to clean up the old one and out it back on. When I took the new one out and compared the diameter to the old one here is what I saw.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/IMG_20200513_173219329.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1589412626)
That new tire is WAY smaller than the original. SO either they sent me the wrong size, or I ordered the wrong size. I bought this over a year ago to have a spare and used the manufacturers site reference table to select the 'right' one for my mill. I can't imagine any safe way to install this tire, so I will have to see if I can figure out what happened...later.
Now my problem is that having removed the idler and THEN finding out the set bolts it rests against are missing, it is way out of alignment. I put a blade on and it is clearly not tracking right at all. I messed with it for a while, but it wasn't getting much better. It was 5:30, I was tired, so I quit for the day. I will have to find some bolts and nuts to set the stop blocks and align it properly. This just became a small project to make it right. I will have to read the manual tonight to see if they have alignment instructions. If not, I will figure it out tomorrow.
But I am tired, produced nothing all day, but got a little bit done.
OGH, sorry about the tire not working out for you today.
But you got the screen door hung and spent some time with one of your Grandsons.
Now all the screen doors I used growing up had good strong springs and the hinges squeak when opening or closing... :)
And at least once a year somebody ::) put their hand thru the screen.
low tech. security if someone is going in or out you hear it! and a hook latch to keep the little kids in, and or the slightly bigger kids out in the yard to play. let the sun in, or look out, and a little fresh air when the temp is right. kind of miss the old screen door.
I thought it was just me. I love the sounds of a wooden screen door. When I was a kid and we had a summer bungalow (my Dad's version of a 'little build project') there were screen doors front and back. I can still hear 3 distinct sounds in my memory; the slap of the door closing, the squeak of the springs when it opened, and some adult in the kitchen yelling "Don't slam the screen door" every time we went out. Nothing like wood, I hate the aluminum ones.
Yesterday my son stopped in to pick up his son and check out the door. While he was looking at it one of his boys ran through and out the door being chased by another and he let the door slam as he ran by. My son hollered "Don't SLAM the screen door!" and he turned to me and said "I hate that sound, these kids will never learn." I smiled and laughed and he said "what's so funny?" I just said "I LOVE that sound" ;D :).
I put self closing hinges on this one and they work perfect, but I sure would love to find one of those catchment things everybody had 50 years ago. These days nobody knows what I am talking about. I have a hook and eye just to keep the cats in when a little furry critter or bird goes by, but the door should give them lots of entertainment and fresh air for all of us. Long overdue.
Last night I read through the Hud-son manual...nothing on aligning the band wheels, so I did some general searching and wound up right back here as the best source for general alignment tips. :D I should have known. Well I will give it my best shot today and see what happens. Tomorrow we have rain coming so I may head up to harbor freight and pick up some cheap disposable supplies.
I might be able to help you on the catchment part. All hardware stores need an Old Guy so the Old Guys can explain what they want and the Old Guy can find it.
Quote from: thecfarm on May 14, 2020, 06:29:56 AM
I might be able to help you on the catchment part. All hardware stores need an Old Guy so the Old Guys can explain what they want and the Old Guy can find it.
Oh this is very true! It seems you can never find (another) old guy when you need one! ;D
I just went out and checked on the internet and they are still made and available. My son is going to check his local building supply because I would rather buy local. If he can't pick one up there I will order it on fleabay.
The small pleasures.
Quote from: thecfarm on May 14, 2020, 06:29:56 AM
I might be able to help you on the catchment part. All hardware stores need an Old Guy so the Old Guys can explain what they want and the Old Guy can find it.
After I posted above I was catching up on reading the rest of the new posts and came back across this one. It reminded me of a few years back (15?) when I was working on something and the right material for whatever I was doing was oakum. For the life of me, I can't remember the job, but I do remember that oakum was what would be the best and proper solution. So I was in the big box store for other stuff and figured I would just take a stab and see if they still sold it. So I am looking up and down the shelves in the plumbing section and this young fella (about 25 y/o) in a spiffy store vest that walks up and cheerfully says " Can I help you find something today sir?" I looked up, smiled and said "I doubt it, but what the heck, do you folks have any oakum?". Of course I got back the puzzled look and he started to ask what I needed it for, what does it do, etc. I just said, it's something old craftsman use and I really don't have time to give you a lesson on it right now.' Well there was an old guy in a worn vest just down the aisle, he comes limping over and steps between the young guy and me, effectively removing him from the conversation in a semi-polite way. He says "He doesn't know what that is, but I will explain it to him later. No we don't sell that stuff, nowadays they sell all the chemical plastic crap that is supposed to be better but is not near as good. You need the right stuff." He smiles, leans in, and directs me to an old plumber with a shop on the other side of town. "You have to call him first to make sure he is there and not out on a job, but he will sell you what you need." Then he winks.
The young fella had no idea what we were talking about. I thanked them and walked away and as I was leaving I heard the old guy starting a teaching session. :D
Did you ever try to go in an auto parts store and tell them "I need a straight muffler, about 18" long with a 2" inlet and a 2-1/2" outlet" ? All they know is 'make, model, and year'.
Quote from: Old Greenhorn on May 14, 2020, 07:50:18 AMAll they know is 'make, model, and year'
I go looking for parts for my Davis Little Monster (1965) and I get that question all the time.
After yesterday fighting with those pillow block alignments for the band wheels I kind of had to have a talk with myself to get back on it this morning. It was cool and the mill head is in the morning shade, so even cooler. I waited until 9am then waded into it, getting the tools and bolts I thought I would need. It took about an hour to get the set bolts into the welded nuts and ready for adjustment. Too short, had to do it over again with longer bolts. Looked to me like they had never been in there at all, I wound up pretty much taking it all apart and running a tap through the nuts to clean out all the gunk, but I finally got it right even though adjustments are difficult because of the surrounding weldment parts.
I tried the string alignment method and got the wheels pretty close then got everything a bit more than finger tight so it would still slide. I put a new blade on, man those 4° are a lot thicker than I am used to. Anyway, got it on and made the band just tight, not loaded. rolled it over by hand and the tracking was not good at all. Dead center on one wheel and half off the other. SO I start skewing the idler wheel the way I thought it should go and it got a whole lot worse, so I went in a direction counter to my intuition and it centered back up. I tweaked some more (wow, it is a sensitive alignment) finally just moving the screw about an 8th of a turn or less each time until the blade ran even on both wheels. I tightened up the pillow blocks, tensioned the blade and hand rolled it for a half dozen turns to be sure. If I had not put those bank/adjusting screws in there to give me a reliable adjustment I would still be out there with terrible results, like chasing a ghost. The bolts make it a LOT easier to control. Why they were missing or removed, I will never know.
I put all the guards on, fired it up and let the blade and new belt run in at about half throttle for about ten minutes. It was about 2pm by this point and I didn't have time, energy, or a plan to throw up a log. So I grabbed a thick ash slab and put that up and cut about 2" off the top x 8' long. The cut went smooth with no grabbing, no bucking and is FLAT with a much better finish! I also edged up some red oak for a table idea I am starting on.
Then I had this table/bench thing I made on a whim when I tried freehanded CSM a week or so ago. I put the other 2 legs on it, then used a hand truck to wrangle it over to the mill and with much effort, I got the thing and and positioned and clamped then I saw that one leg was not screwed home properly and had to remove it and fix it. Then I saw that there was no way the legs would fit between my guides. I was pretty full up with road blocks today and losing patience. This thing is a beast.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/IMG_20200514_140608760_HDR.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1589496659)
So I pulled it back off and got the hand truck under it again. No way to push this through the sawdust so I had to pull it and about halfway to where I was going I stepped on a rock that rolled under my foot and down I went pulling the hand truck and the 200# monster table up over my feet. I landed on a piece of the chunk I had cut out for the leg notches in this table/bench/thing and it stuck right in my cocyx carrying my body's impact. Lets just say I laid there for a minute figuring out what happened and how bad I messed up. Finally I moved and bit and except for feeling like somebody tried to get me on a bull with a broom handle for a saddle, I didn't feel all that bad, nothing was broken or leaking that I could see. So I got this thing off of me and crawled up to my feet. Yeah, my tailbone hurt pretty good, but everything else worked, so I righted the hand truck and pulled it over where I was going. Got the truck out of the way and when I pulled the table/bench/thing over to stand it up one of the legs caught me in the shim. Now if it was a normal table/bench/thin it would be a big deal, but this thing has mass and it again got me pretty good. So now I am limping and have a big pain in the a__. But I could not re-cut the top on this thing flat in the mill and the legs are sticking up above the top surface. SO I figured I would just CSM the top flat. What could go wrong? ;D SO I got out the long bar saw and leveled the top as best I could. It came out fair, for free hand and given that I was taking off a thin shim rather than a board. (note to self; don't do that again, take at least 1") When I got down I decided I had had it for the day. I went in and got a beer and spent a half hour putting away tools.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/IMG_20200514_154016361_HDR.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1589496653)
So the mill is in better shape now, that bench is finished and out of the way and I have no idea what to do with it, but I feel like I didn't get much done today either and now I am hurting pretty good. Almost glad we have rain coming in tomorrow and I have an off day where we will run up to harbor freight for some 'stuff' and stop at the big box stores near home looking for a better doorknob. Hopefully I'll feel better in the morning.
In other news, one of our cats has discovered the screen door and is getting used to it, slowly and with caution. The other cat is still clueless.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52103/IMG_20200514_161558524.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1589498903)
My son found one of those catchments in a good old fashioned local hardware store, so that too is on my list for tomorrow.
Ouch, be careful out there, better weather coming your way.
Yeah they say we could get some pretty severe stuff this evening so I am keeping an eye on it. Pretty sore and slow moving this morning. I have to be very careful how I get into and out of a chair. Guess I whacked myself pretty good.
Well off to Harbor freight.
well at least with you walking slower, no one will question your senior discount. enjoy the rest of you vacation... until you retire. best regards.
OG, I enjoy your posts! They are like positive peer pressure to get things done and not just sit around wishing things were getting done :D
Congrats and good luck on the retirement!
Brandon
Brother you gotta be careful! Please take care of yourself so you can enjoy retirement. My younger self still thinks I can do things like I did 25 years ago. My older self has to step in and stop the testosterone charged younger self from hurting the old guy.
As you know the number one safety thing is housekeeping around the mill. It is those little chucks of bark, sticks and cut offs that hide on the ground that kill my ankles and back.
Tuesday and Wednesday I was on a portable job, there were several inexperienced helpers there. I asked them several times to help me pick up the junk on the ground. It wasn't until one of them tweaked an ankle that it got important.
Yeah, of course you are right Ted. It probably was not a rock that rolled my ankle, but one of the 4 slugs I cut out of the log and yes, I should have cleaned them up. I done it to myself, most likely. Man, I been hurtin' all day and sitting down is the worst, very hard to find a comfortable position, etc. I didn't get a lot done today, just changed the door knob, added the catchment on the screen door, and messed with the stuff we bought at harbor freight. I am calling today an off day. I even sat in a chair in the yard and enjoyed the sun for a little while. It got over 70 today for the first time ALL year! But this too shall pass and yeah I have to be more careful. I am pretty much a neatness nut most of the time in that I like tools cleaned up and put away and not having any junk laying in the way. Sometimes I really get on my son and his guys for not moving things out of the way in the shop when they are done for the day. I hate trip hazards.
By the way, I really like your new avatar, and have been trying to find a way to mention it since you made the change, but I always seem to fumble things like that. Just wanted to say that is a mighty good lookin' gal you are hanging out with. I hope that doesn't rub somebody the wrong way.
Yep she is a gem in many ways! My best friend and partner in crime! I believe seeing a pretty woman is like watching a gorgeous sunrise, sunset, looking at the ocean or mountains. God made them all to be admired. It's just when when someone's mind goes beyond that it all goes wrong.
So one gentleman to another, you were quite appropriate in your complement. Thank you!
Reny's. ?? There slogan is, Reny's, a Maine adventure. But they probably have the name brand ones too.
Quote from: SawyerTed on May 15, 2020, 06:38:08 PMSo one gentleman to another, you were quite appropriate in your complement. Thank you!
As intended. I looked at that photo and thought now THERE'S a happy man with a happy woman. And I thought you were were a lucky guy.
I once 'tried to compliment' a young woman who I admire very much along with her husband for their musical skills as well as the job they do as parents. She was going on stage at the moment and asked if she looked OK, I just replied with a big smile "You are one handsome looking woman!" She shot me a look and asked "what the h**l is that supposed to mean? I look like a man?"and I just mumbled that she looked great is all and felt like a jerk... for a long time. The last thing I wanted to do was hurt her feelings, and ever since then I have been a bit shy about any compliments that go beyond 'nice job'.
Thecfarm, I assume your comment was about my inquiry on the other thread? I checked your lead out, but it appears they don't sell hats. They did have a good deal on men's briefs though. ;D
The one about Reny's? I wondered what happened to that reply. Wrong thread,but you got it. ;D
Quote from: thecfarm on May 16, 2020, 06:51:23 AM
The one about Reny's? I wondered what happened to that reply. Wrong thread,but you got it. ;D
Yeah, I figured it out. I guess I know how you think. :D
There is a place in Vermont that has them with free shipping if you buy 3 or more, but I am not sure I am ready for that kind of commitment. ;D
Well, I am keeping my promise and closing this thread out. I have started a new one in the General board called Staying Busy and Out of trouble... (https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?topic=110766.new#new)So those who would care to can read about the dumb things I do to keep my mind busy, hurt myself in new ways, or whatever. See you over there.
It's been an interesting year, and with the changes in my life, I am looking forward to seeing what the next one brings.