Another build thread... JoshNZ

[donbj]

You guys do impressive work!

[JoshNZ]

Thanks fellers!

I haven't routed my cables yet but I'm sure their radius is way more than 10x their diameter, just where they sit.

It was going to be too difficult to get frame down to the bottom stand-off so I've just left it between sheets. Seems to be ok. I did run a little angle piece down from the frame to support the top one.



 

And that's it for the guards! I had a bunch of 40mm pregalv tube for bunks and cut and fitted these yesterday. I used a wooden template to punch them and then drilled at tap size, then transferred to the bed, then redrilled at bolt and socket size. Bit of stuffing around but it went together like clockwork.



 


 


 

I pulled the little jack apart completely, as soon as I got it open a little gauss filter fell out which I hope has been sitting in the check valve ball or something I don't know. I wound in the relief screw all the way, cleaned it out, and topped up with oil. Don't know what fixed it but it's holding rock solid now ;D I think the only way I'm going to tap into it is from the bottom and it will have to be with one tiny fitting! This is what the gizzards look like in case anyone is interested.



 

I was going to drag it outside for a test cut and then decided I better do a throttle so I'm not climbing all around hot exhaust each time, bodged together this little bracket and fixed an old dirt bike clutch handle to it.



 

Then dragged it outside and started milling!



 



 



Mill test - YouTube

This was a birch log, reasonably straight so I thought it'd be a good first choice. All went pretty good I think, I have a few kinks I need to work out but nothing too dramatic. I pushed the first cut to see what would give and the small pulley on the jackshaft is too small, it smoked the belt really quickly. I'll have to triple their circumferences I think, or double sheave..? So I'm nursing it in the vid.
My clamps are galling already too. Is mild steel always going to do this or would I get away with polishing them smooth and leaving them greased?



 

The other thing I've done, which is really stupid... The back stops are further outboard than the inside of the band wheel. It's not going to matter until I'm cutting 10" high cants but, all in the name of a bit of extra width  :-\. They're gonna be a real pain to move too. I'm wondering if just using dunnage for big cants will be the idea, since that's not something you'd commonly do?

I don't know if the engine mounts have softened or the guards have changed the resonant frequency but the whole unit is singing pretty sweetly now.

[Vautour]

...Nice craftsmanship Josh...looking good 

[Hilltop366]

It works!! Must feel nice to give it a try.

Can you add a second pocket for the backstops instead of trying to move those.

[Crusarius]

I ended up doing the same thing on the backstops. I have only had a couple times I have needed to shim to clear the cant. I think you will be ok just leaving it.

If you try to polish and grease will they still hold when you lock them? Harder piece of material would be ideal.

At least you were smarter than I was and drug it outside to try you first cuts. I did mine in the garage. what a mess

I also added a thick rubber flap just hanging off the guard to redirect the sawdust down. Now instead of shooting 60' out the side of the mill I get a nice clean pile down the side of the mill.

[Ljohnsaw]

redirect the sawdust down

+1  Also helps if it is windy to not have it blow quite so much back in your face!

NICE!  Feels great to get that first cut, huh?

For your cams, any possibility of heat treating them?  Otherwise, I wouldn't worry about the galling.  I happened to have some stainless steel rounds that I used.  They look fine but the arm that grabs the logs has a little galling.  It just holds better ;)

[JoshNZ]

Can you add a second pocket for the backstops instead of trying to move those.

That... Is a great idea =), one I'll def do - thanks! That solves the problem while leaving max capacity.

They will still lock greased yes. Their locking mechanism is over centering, not jamming, so possibly even better/smoother. I had dad on the clamps and helping roll the log, they worked brilliantly. Simple and rock solid. When I dropped the backstops down too they worked exactly as I imagined, dropped into their little recess and then the teeth on the pockets held the cant perfectly. I had to reverse the bolts in the clamps so the heads stuck out on the blade side. Lots of funny little tweaks like that needed, things you don't think of until you see it working.

I've tried heat treating mild steel to not much success, there is bugger all carbon in it so I don't think it can be hardened much beyond what it is. But I'm all ears if someone has a magic procedure!

I've got a ton of ali sheet left I could probably weld up a nozzle for the sawdust. I figured you'd want it clear to extract as best it could but it doesn't seem like it will block easily. I guess the sawdust stream is something you want to watch while you're cutting, a bit like chip loading on the lathe it must be a pretty good tell of where you're at with feed?

Feels great to have the first cut done for sure! Partly relief that this whole project isn't a blunder, I imagine it isn't too difficult to have built a saw that is fundamentally flawed and will never work well so I'm glad I've squished that bug in the back of my mind.
And it's a ton of fun! What have I done...

I do want to swap those helical gears on the lift screws for spur gears. And I think I'm going to replace the motor with a 12V. It could easily be twice as fast and still have good control. It'd be painful waiting for the head to climb half a log if I was slabbing and leaving them on there for weight.

[JoshNZ]

The whole pulley re-kit cost me nearly $400  I want it to be bullet proof though I think it has to be done.

I got a big double sheave cast pulley for the jackshaft and then two single 4.5"s (up from 2.5") I think with the room I've got left on the shaft the drive side belts will have to straddle the driven sides. Will look a bit funky but is what it is.

Have been looking at DC motors too I want to go back to 12V at nominal speed. I think I might do away with the gears altogether and run a little toothed timing belt between the screw and motor, there's a store online that sells them in all sorts of sizes. Would quieten/smooth it down a lot, as long as it wouldn't slip?

[Crusarius]

My guards where just like yours. I had the bottom open for the same reason. All I did was put a 6" rubber flap hanging off the corner of the guard. Works perfectly. No need to over engineer this.

[JoshNZ]

I took a bit off the lip of my band pulleys yesterday. Mounted them on a wood turned mandrel/plate on the wood lathe and hit them with a flap disc, a bit crude but it worked pretty well for a one of job. Really didn't want to remove the gap from the metal lathe for just this.

I don't think I have a photo of it before but I've given myself probably 3mm clearance for the band now. That lathe is an old union graduate, I machined a new drive shaft to spin work on the outside backwards, and fitted a 3phase and VFD and second control station on the back, so I stand on the other side for doing big platters or.. cast iron wheels =/. It's the coolest tool in my workshop at the moment!

It would basically work with anything that spun your wheel at around 30-50RPM. Even on the mill itself with a hand crank and helper. For anyone else with the same issue






 

[Crusarius]

That is great Josh. I had some smaller parts I needed to taper the ends so I put it in the drill press and did the same thing with a grinder

[charles mann]

you going to cover that galvanized sq tubing with some stainless? from the things iv read on here, and vids iv watched, the moisture and acid in the wood will react, even with galv. steel and stain the wood. i was told the same by a nyles kiln rep when i was discussing using a conex as a kiln and using foam insulation with aluminum sheet to cover the foam. he said the moisture during drying will speed up the corrosion and stain the wood. 

not sure how long it would take for the acid to eat the galv. off the metal, leaving bare metal to the elements. 

im gonna go with 2"x2"x1/4" to bring my bunks up to the top of the carriage track, then bend some 0.062" stainless to cover the sq tubing and use some an3 or 4 bolts to secure the bunk covers to the tubing.  
we had a tool bin get knocked over and dumped 5 trays of an hardware (bolts of various lengths, washers, nuts, for the an and bac hardware. it was cheaper to sweep it up and "throw the away", than to pay several people $25-30 an hr to sort through the hardware and organize. 

[Ed_K]

 My god no wonder everything cost so much these days  . Josh I like the wood lathe idea, just bought one little clean up of rust and some paint an I'll set your idea to it  ;) .

[JoshNZ]

Jeez no I hadn't thought of that. Hadn't planned on it. Might just see how it goes with the species I run into here.

I'm still scratching my head about stabiliser legs : I cut a bit of steel the other day then put it away haha didn't like my thinking.

Found a pretty good deal on some low profile R13s, that has solved the blade interference problem. Rated for 900kg each, I doubt I'll ever bring 1.8T of timber home on it but who knows. I've been scratching my head about securing the carriage for travel as well. What do you guys think of using the saw heads lift..? I'll still have a pin or two each side that you drop into holes to stop it moving but I thought as well, I could loop a strap or a steel 'hook' over the carriage and then lift it until it barely stalls out, to take up any slop.  ??? ??? I'd have liked to just use the beam only but I have heard that motor skip teeth before. Not that that could happen from forces on the beam, with it being a lead screw... Maybe it could work. What do ya think





If I looked in my rear vision mirror and saw my carriage tumbling end over end down the side of the highway I probably wouldn't stop :D I'd probably head straight to a good hypnotist to erase any memories of a sawmill from my mind 

[Crusarius]

I like you idea of securing it. right now mine get a pair of vice grips clamped in front of and behind the carriage. But I only move it around my property and I do have hooks to keep the carriage on the rails.

I would love to find some of those tires for mine. But I do not want to buy them

As for the staining of the wood. I dunno if the galvanizing will be ok or not. I can tell you After painting my mill I get blue lines on the bottom board. Before I would get black lines. Hopefully you will be ok with galvanized but when all else fails plan for stainless. I know V2.0 will have stainless or HDPE.

[JoshNZ]

They were only $80 odd NZ each the tyres, maybe $50US. Found a guy with an engineering shop who ordered them in bulk.

Yeah I've done some moving around with clamps but at highway speeds it def needs something better. I've towed it on the road with 2 strops over it but that's annoying to setup, I'd like something quick. 2 Pins, an arm swung up from the bed and secured to the beam, stall the lift out, and away you go. I'd love it if that were enough!

[charles mann]

IF, i can get my monster portable, i'll turn the carriage sideways, setting it on the log bunks, or weld in "carriage bunks" and use turn buckles and rigging clevises to prevent lat/long movement, plus locking bars for the saw beam/eng frame, that will pin in place. 
Im hopping to locate, well located already, attempt to purchase a former military 5tn wrecker with a 7tn crane. I can climb in, lift the carriage in travel/work position, haul it to the job site, load logs onto the mill, off load the milled wood and go back hm. 
Plus its a 6 wheel drive with a tire inflation system, for them sandy location iv ran into before. 

[Ljohnsaw]

I've been scratching my head about securing the carriage for travel as well. What do you guys think of using the saw heads lift..? I'll still have a pin or two each side that you drop into holes to stop it moving but I thought as well, I could loop a strap or a steel 'hook' over the carriage and then lift it until it barely stalls out, to take up any slop. ??? ??? I'd have liked to just use the beam only but I have heard that motor skip teeth before. Not that that could happen from forces on the beam, with it being a lead screw... Maybe it could work. What do ya think

I'm using chain (like bicycle chain) to raise and lower my head.  Four sets.  I was bringing my head home to work on it when I hit a small pothole before getting on the freeway.  I saw the head drop until it hit the sideboards on my trailer.  All four master links popped!  Now I loop a decent chain around the top of the saw frame and around the head.  Then I drop the head so only the heavy chains are supporting the weight.

I'm just saying, there are a lot of forces acting when you are going down the road.  I wouldn't want to have any unnecessary wear on your lead screw or nut.

[thecfarm]

On mine mill they use 2 pieces of half inch flat stuck,4 inches wide maybe 8 inches long,with a ¾ inch hole for a ¾ inch bolt to go ito. One goes on top of the carriage and one under the carriage. One on each side of the mill. Tighten that down and it is not going to move. Locking nuts on each bolt. I have never tried them,but when he delivered the mill,they was on there. I myself would put something around the head of the bolt,to keep it from moving, so only one wrench, a rachet is needed.

[JoshNZ]

Have you got a photo handy by any chance? Sounds simple enough.

[RAYAR]

Here's my set-up, it's solid. Not the best pics, but I just browsed through my pics and this is what I could come up with showing the carriage securing set-up.






A hinged plate welded to the side of the frame that swings up to a piece of square tubing welded to the carriage frame and a pin inserted through to lock the carriage in place.







 

[JoshNZ]

Ah yep I see it. That's a good idea. The carriage must rattle around a little though? With the slop in the pin and hinge?

[JoshNZ]

This is what I'm thinking for stabilising feet. I'm just dreading making 6 more of them haha...

If I do all 6 in stages it will prob only take me half a day, which makes them cheaper than anything else.. I'll drill holes in the leg spaced closer than the amount of thread available at the foot. Might put a hole in the base to insert a screw driver if it ever needs to be cranked tight.



 

[RAYAR]

Ah yep I see it. That's a good idea. The carriage must rattle around a little though? With the slop in the pin and hinge?

It's actually quite snug, not really any slop at all, but with the weight of the carriage still sitting on the rails, it wears dimples in the rails over some travel time. I've welded them up and ground them smooth. What I'm looking at doing is to take the weight off of the carriage rollers once the carriage is locked in place.

[JoshNZ]

Ahh that's interesting to hear... I suppose it is a lot of weight on a very small surface area. I wonder if you could lay another length of angle iron long enough for just the carriage on top of the tracks. With the ends ground tapered like ramps. Lay it on the track and roll your carriage on before transport. Otherwise you'll need a mechanism to lift it won't you.