Engine Trouble

[leweee]

The 20 hp Honda on my resaw started over fuelling due to a haywire needle and seat in the carb.I have the tank suspended over the engine and run gravity and it filled the crankcase with gas because I didn't shut the fuel off at night .I drained and changed the oil but the engine still wouldn't run right because the needle and seat was allowing too much gas into the engine and it ran rich,which sooted up the plugs.

Same thing happened to my Honda 20 hp motor. Seems the bean counters at
Keien carbs decided that a brass seat was not needed....they use the carb casting as the seat smiley_dunce smiley_dunce smiley_dizzy....to make a long story short I lapped the seat area and it worked again

[Radar67]

I'm sorry if I missed it in your posts but what have you done to rule out the needle and seat causing your problems?

I took the float bowl off and removed the float and needle. Then, I sprayed carb clearner through any hole I could find. I also made sure the float did not have gas in it. The float bowl was clean as a whistle when I removed it, no sign of trash or gumming. I have left the fuel valve on a couple of times, but did not notice a rise in my oil level. My engine's oil level is fill to overflowing. No spillage when I take the cover off to check oil before running.

Stew

[Fla._Deadheader]

How did you check the float level ???

   That is one of the most precise things about an engine.  Also, the .005-.010 clearance on the valve is not that great a deal. That is the clearance between the tappet and valve stem, so when the engine heats up, the valve doesn't swell enough to eliminate all clearance and burn the valve head-seat. I wouldn't worry too much about that clearance. Still sounds like a carb problem to me.

[Radar67]

How did you check the float level ???

The float is plastic. I looked at the amount of fuel in the float bowl and checked to make sure the float wasn't stuck by pushing on it and making sure it lifted up and down smoothly. There wasn't any type of adjustment that I saw. Some of the older floats where made of metal and had a metal bar you could bend. I could only estimate the float's level by the amount of gas in the bowl (about 2/3 full) The float should "float" level in the bowl, is that correct? What is the correct way to check the float level?

Stew

[Fla._Deadheader]

These newer engines are getting beyond my knowledge. If the float is hung on a pin so it swings up and down, and is attached to the top of the carb, you hold the top of the carb upside down and eyeball the level of the float against the level of the carb top. It should be just a hair higher than level with the carb top. That way, it gets to slowly adjust itself as the engine wears out along with the needle.  There almost HAS to be a way to adjust it  ??? ???

  If it's not made like I have described, ignore my input, as most here already do.  : : ;D ;D ;D  Good Luck  ;) ;D :D :D

[Radar67]

If the float is hung on a pin so it swings up and down, and is attached to the top of the carb, you hold the top of the carb upside down and eyeball the level of the float against the level of the carb top. It should be just a hair higher than level with the carb top. That way, it gets to slowly adjust itself as the engine wears out along with the needle.  There almost HAS to be a way to adjust it  ???

Okay, I have not removed the carb, that is something I can do while waiting on my bolt. The float does hang by a plastic bracket that comes from the carb body and a steel pin goes through the bracket and the float. I'll have to study a little harder on the float to see if I can find an adjustment. Who knows, they may have it designed where the length of the needle regulated the float.  :-\

Stew

[Paul_H]

Same thing happened to my Honda 20 hp motor. Seems the bean counters at
Keien carbs decided that a brass seat was not needed....they use the carb casting as the seat smiley_dunce smiley_dunce smiley_dizzy....to make a long story short I lapped the seat area and it worked again

I think you will either have to replace the needle and seat or do what Lewee did and I'll bet the problem goes away.

[Radar67]

I hate to say it, but we were all wrong. Turns out, the exhaust lobe on the cam shaft was worn off, and I mean really worn. And the tappet/lifter was cupped. I've ordered the parts to repair it. Thanks for all your help.

Stew

[Fla._Deadheader]

That sure is discouraging news ???  How many hours, approximately on that engine ???

[Radar67]

My best estimate on hours is 50. I purchased the saw used. The original owner said he only cut 2 or 3 cherry logs, but I don't know that for sure. As for me, I've cut about 500 BF with it.

Stew

[Fla._Deadheader]

Man, and the cam lobe is worn off ???   NOT GOOD.  : : : ??? ???

[Minnesota_boy]

Make some phone calls.  Let the manufacturer know what happened.  That cam didn't get the proper heat treatment.  That happens and it usually gets replaced under warranty.  With calls to the right place that may happen for you too.

[Fla._Deadheader]

I agree. That's some BAD publicity, especially on the number one Forum on the 'net.  : : ;)

[Radar67]

I wanted to pass on my experience with customer service for http://www.m-and-d.com/

Due to Briggs and Stratton being closed for the holiday season, I had to find other means to get the parts to repair my saw. I'm in the middle of my first paying job.  :

Wednesday evening I went to M and D Mower's website and found the parts I needed and ordered them (about 4:00 pm) They had closed for the day. First thing Thursday morning, I called customer service to verify their shipping method. I have different addresses for US Postal and the delivery services. They told me my order would ship via UPS, FedEx, or DHL. I made sure they had the correct address to ship to. I made no mention that I needed the parts ASAP.

I was expecting the parts to arrive Monday or Tuesday due to the holidays and the parts coming from Ohio. Much to my surprise, the parts were delivered today (Friday) before noon via Airborne Express. Needless to say, I was very impressed.  ;D And what did shipping cost me you ask???? A mere $6.95 for STANDARD SHIPPING. I will direct all my business to this company in the future.

Thanks for all the help everyone gave me. I should be back in business tomorrow evening after work.

Stew