sharpening bandsaw blades for others

[Gere Flewelling]

I purchased bandsaw sharpening equipment three years ago when I purchased my saw mill.  I was thinking of ways to create some income when retirement time rolls around.  I learned the basic principles of tool,hand saw, and circular saw sharpening from my father when I was younger.  He was a contractor back in the 50's and had to sharpen his own equipment to keep his business functioning.  I have always sharpened my own chain saws with a file and kept my cordwood saw cutting pretty well for many years now.  Sharpening bandsaw blades just seemed like a natural progression.  I have only sharpened my own blades up until recently.  There are only  a couple of saw shops in this region (that I know of) and I often thought of trying to hire on on a part time basis just to learn about operating the many related machines.  One shop was looking for help but wanted nothing to do with an old guy like me.  The other was operated by an old co-worker and friend.  I never asked him about a job as he worked with his wife and son out of their home and seem pretty self sufficient.  Well recently the second guy passed away quite unexpectedly.  I have learned that His wife and son are keeping the business going but do not want to make,sell,or sharpen bandsaws.  I have gotten a couple of opportunities lately to sharpen blades for some of his old customers.  Apparently his old customers do not want to move over to the other saw shop as that shop doesn't seem to have a good reputation among some bandsaw people.  The blades I sharpened had a similar profile as the blades I have been using and looked to have sharpened and set nicely.  I am still waiting for confirmation from the customers as to how good a job I did or didn't do.
I am thinking about "hanging out my shingle" and advertising to see if I can attract some local saw millers business.  I do not have an established business yet but I do know what is involved in getting it started for the most part.  One thing I do not know about is what kind if insurance would I need to operate a business sharpening bandsaw blades for others.  It doesn't seem like there would be much of a liability issue, though I am sure a law suit could arise out of something I am not seeing.  I would appreciate some advise from those with any experience along this line. 

[Bruno of NH]

Gene,
Do you know if they are going to sell any of the bandsaw sharpening equipment that Jeff had?

[barbender]

If you've been sharpening your own with good results, I'd say go for it- if you like sharpening that much. Some do, some don't. Me, it depends on the day😊

[Gere Flewelling]

Bruno, I don't know for sure. He had some really nice commercial sharpening equipment.  I can't imagine she will want keep it.  I attempted to e-mail her but got no response.  It might be too soon for her.  It might be a good option for you.

[WV Sawmiller]

  I have never sharpened a blade in my life and it is unlikely I ever will so keep that in mind when evaluating my input. ;D What kind of equipment do you have and is sharpening equipment pretty generic in nature? I have only used WM blades so never did much research on the differences between blades made by different manufacturers. Would your existing equipment sharpen blades made by various companies or would you have to invest in more equipment? How long does a sharpening stone typically last - i.e. how many blades can you sharpen with it before having to replace it? How much do they cost and how much time/labor is involved in changing between hook angles and profiles?

  How many blades do you expect to sharpen per day/week? What do you think you can reasonably charge? Bottom line - how much money do you think you can/should make in this endeavor? Remember sawing and, by default I assume, sharpening is somewhat seasonal with wide ranges in volume so how much turn around time do you anticipate? Will you sharpen all by yourself or do you expect to hire seasonal help if needed?

  The insurance is a good question. Since most people running a sawmill have to be moderately hard workers we'd all like to think they are/will be fair and honest. ;) There is probably one or two out there who is/are not. :( I'd write up a contract and pass it through my lawyer with verbiage to the effect " Since the sharpening vendor has no control over the conditions of use he assumes no liability for injury or equipment damage resulting from failure of sharpened blades. Furthermore the sharpening vendor's liability is limited to repair/resharpening defective blades and/or replacement purchase for any that cannot be repaired/resharpened." This may not hold up in court but it is a start.

  Good luck.

[Gere Flewelling]

Thank you WV Sawmiller for your comments and suggestions.  You bring up some very good points.  I have Cook's sharpening equipment and have had enough time to work out many of the logistics.  Although some of your points I hadn't thought of.  Thankyou especially for your last paragraph about insurance.  Great food for thought.
I have never had my own business, but my wife and I have help our two sons get their businesses up and running with some success.  And have kind of shared in their successes and failures.  One was into Landscaping and design for a few years but decided to sell out.  The other is a logger who seems to be doing pretty well despite all the issues small loggers seem to be having in New England these days.  

[Southside]

I have never sharpened a blade in my life and it is unlikely I ever will

Harold - given your other recent posts, I found that statement to be very comforting.  Stay the course, at least in respect to this subject.  :D 

[longtime lurker]

If you had the right equipment production wise, and you like sharpening saws, and you do a good job... honestly I can see a viable business there.

People will ship saws by the box a long way if they're guaranteed a good job. And it's a lot less sweat and equipment than sawmilling.  And it's one of those support industries where every mill sold becomes a potential customer not a competitor.

Well worth doing some sums on anyway.

[Chuck White]

I sharpen a few bands for the few bandsaw millers in this area, and like I said "a few"!

I've told each of them "don't advertise for me" because I DON'T want to make a business out of it!

A sharpening business can do a real good business, especially if it's the only one that's real close!

I'd say, if you REALLY enjoy sharpening, then go for it!

[kelLOGg]

Gere,
I assume you have the cat claw drag sharpener as do I. I have used 4 different brands of bands and for the current one, Kasco, I cannot get a cam so I have "modified" one I do have and it is not as good as I would like it. Different bands require different cams and grindstone profiles. Make sure you have a supply of these on hand.

[Old Greenhorn]

I have never sharpened a blade in my life and it is unlikely I ever will

Harold - given your other recent posts, I found that statement to be very comforting.  Stay the course, at least in respect to this subject.  :D

Gee Southside, I don't know if that is a fair assessment (Funny yes, but fair, I am not so sure). I mean blade work should never require a ladder or pushing equipment just a tad past what it can handle and it is done on stable flat ground. I don't see the 'exposure' here. On the other hand, there is a lot of constant blade handling so that may open new opportunities. :D Either way, I am sure he could be very good at it (although adding some items to the first aid kit should be considered in the initial investment costs, at least that's what I would do). 

[YellowHammer]

If I was to go into business sharpening bands for others, and after having toured the WM Resharp facility a couple times, I saw bands sent to them that looked like they had been dropped in the mud, stomped on, and left to rust for 6 months.  Others I've seen are so coated with pitch and sap, I couldn't hardly see the metal of the band.  Just a nasty mess.  Then they expect Resharp to make them good as new.  So Resharp has a rig that is basically car wash for bandsaw bands, composed of a set of wire wheels and a dip tank that feeds the band through a cleaning solution, and then spinning wire brushes that do a good job taking the rust and sap off.  Such a machine could be shop built pretty easy and would be a great timesaver, as time is money when sharpening bands.

[Gere Flewelling]

KelLOGg, I do have the same sharpener as you.  I am in the process of adding cams to fit blades as I come across them.  I personally have only used one style of Cook's blades and haven't had to expand my collection of cams specific to the other manufacturers.  I did find that I could adjust the angle and shape of  the grind rock to fit a Woodmiser Double hard 10 degree blade recently.  I was able to duplicate the tooth profile pretty well.  If it cuts satisfactorily for the customer (he hasn't tried it yet), He only uses that style of blade.  I suspect I won't be as lucky in the future and expect to be adding to the cam collection.  Thank you for the heads up on the Kasco blades.

[LeeB]

and for the current one, Kasco, I cannot get a cam

Not sure why you can't get a cam. Contact member Cuttingedge. He made one for me.

[Bruno of NH]

YH,
I have thought about sharpening for others but for the reasons you have mentioned above (cleaning of the bands) is one of my main concerns.
I wouldn't do it for others till I had mastered the craft up to my quality standards. 
Dirty and rusty bands would be a problem I would think.

[barbender]

You could start out demanding cleaned blades, etc. Or charge a premium for doing it. I'd think if you do a good job sharpening, you could choose your customers.

[sealark37]

I would consider finding a blade welder, along with a supply of blade stock in rolls.  

[WV Sawmiller]

@sealark37 ,

    I would think that would increase your risk/liability considerably! Every time a worn out,rusted, crimped section of the original band broke I'd bet your new band stock and welding would be blamed. I would not touch that with a 10' pole!

I have never sharpened a blade in my life and it is unlikely I ever will

Harold - given your other recent posts, I found that statement to be very comforting.  Stay the course, at least in respect to this subject.  :D

Gee Southside, I don't know if that is a fair assessment (Funny yes, but fair, I am not so sure). I mean blade work should never require a ladder or pushing equipment just a tad past what it can handle and it is done on stable flat ground. I don't see the 'exposure' here. On the other hand, there is a lot of constant blade handling so that may open new opportunities. :D Either way, I am sure he could be very good at it (although adding some items to the first aid kit should be considered in the initial investment costs, at least that's what I would do).  

OGH,

   Thank you for standing up for me against the bullies in this world (who can't even get my name right :D). You are a pillar of might and virtue standing up for the poor and downtrodden (and run-over) souls in their time of woe and misfortune. I am certain you will be mightily rewarded in Heaven and I just hope it is not any time soon. :

[Old Greenhorn]

  Thank you for standing up for me against the bullies in this world (who can't even get my name right :D). You are a pillar of might and virtue standing up for the poor and downtrodden (and run-over) souls in their time of woe and misfortune. I am certain you will be mightily rewarded in Heaven and I just hope it is not any time soon. :

Well, I don't really know that you needed any 'standing up for' I just calls 'em as I sees 'em. OTOH I do see how it would seem to cheer you up. About a year ago we had an engineering project going on where everybody knew I had serious concerns about a few design issues I KNEW would turn into a manufacturing disaster, and I made my opinion clear with suggested alternate approaches. When they had the second phase of design reviews I was 'not invited' to those meetings. One of the engineers involved in the review was shocked I wasn't there and he made a loud protest about it stating that I had brought up valid and serious concerns in the first phase and he wanted to hear my opinion now. The Project manager said "his opinion isn't worth the price of a [cow pie]." To which the Engineer stood up and yelled "OH YES IT IS!" So I know what it's like to have a buddy behind you. (by the way, that project crashed and burned, as predicted, it only cost us a million and a half or so, and the project manager got promoted to chief engineer for the division. One of the things that helped me decide to retire, a company run by fools and children.)

[Southside]

I would consider finding a blade welder, along with a supply of blade stock in rolls.  

There are a few "weld em up" shops out there, I have not heard good reviews back from folks who have used them.  Like everything else (including making a joke and messing up the member subjects name :) the devil is in the details and often not as easy as it seams (pun intended).  

[Gere Flewelling]

Thank you for the many suggestions.  I have invested in some decent equipment so far and will probably do some "water testing" before sinking any large amount of $$ into more equipment like blade welding or stocking rolls of blade to make my own.  I do think YH idea of a blade cleaner is something I could build and keep expenses down and if it works out expand on that in the future.  Until I can determine what I will need for profile cams on my existing equipment, I will need to be careful to make sure I have the ability to correctly sharpen a blade before agreeing to attempt it.  One thing I have been thinking about is a set reducer to run blades through prior to sharpening and then resetting them once sharpened.  I am interested to know if anyone has come up with something like that.  It would seem if you can get the set down to .010" they would sharpen more consistently and then set them where they need to be.  Trying to do it with pliers is just too time consuming.

[Chuck White]

I had an unsetter/desetter/set reducer made a few years ago!

When I get ready to set blades, the first thing I do is draw the blade through the rollers backwards to remove some of the set, without damaging the points!





It really works nice, speeds up the setting time.

There are a couple of more pics in my gallery.

[Gere Flewelling]

Thanks Chuck White,  What a great idea.  I think one like that will do just what I want it to as well.

[Chuck White]

Once the blade is drawn through the rollers, the (the way it's set now) set is reduced to .015-.016!

This one is slightly adjustable, because I had the holes through the plate drilled just a little oversize, so it's adjustable by a few thousandths!

[Gere Flewelling]

Chuck, How do you draw the blade through the rollers?  With gloved hands or do you use some other method?  Pulling a blade backwards through the rollers seems like it would be hard on the hands pulling against pointed teeth.  Does it require having a large box of band-aids available?   ???