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Author Topic: Drag sharpener vs CBN  (Read 1820 times)

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Offline Crusarius

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Re: Drag sharpener vs CBN
« Reply #20 on: September 14, 2021, 03:46:58 PM »
Yellowhammer, I would stay away from peanut oil just because of the severity of some ppl's allergies to it. Doubt it will matter on lumber but if you have any employees come in contact with it, it could be bad. Plus you would have to hang up signs notifying of the use.

Offline DON FRANK

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Re: Drag sharpener vs CBN
« Reply #21 on: September 14, 2021, 09:05:03 PM »
Do cbn's have to use and oil bath or can they be used dry.  Can cbn's be used on a drag sharpener like a  woodmizer 525. I use cbn wheels dry to sharpen woodturning tools but they are a harder steel than a bandsaw blade.

Offline JoshNZ

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Re: Drag sharpener vs CBN
« Reply #22 on: September 15, 2021, 12:52:05 AM »
I've been told by several people using them dry will significantly reduce their lifetime. Oil bath or sprayer/mister.

Not sure why you get away with grinding hss tools dry

Offline YellowHammer

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Re: Drag sharpener vs CBN
« Reply #23 on: September 15, 2021, 07:27:31 AM »
A dry CBN wheel will dull up very quickly.  

Drag sharpeners would have to be modified for a traditional CBN wheel because a CBN sharpene does the whole profile by a single drop onto the entire tooth profile, sharpening the tooth, gullet and shoulder at once, whereas a drag grinder "drags" the stone across the whole profile.  Two completely different sharpener strokes.  
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Offline jimbarry

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Re: Drag sharpener vs CBN
« Reply #24 on: September 15, 2021, 10:15:38 AM »
I liked the BMS250MU so much I bought a second one. Like YH, I switched to mineral oil, same cost here.   

You can't compare sharpening a chisel dry with a bandsaw blade that have 160-180 teeth. You gotta use a coolant, otherwise the heat build up on the wheel will destroy the adhesive properties of what keeps those cbn particles on the alum wheel.
Jim
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Offline Hilltop366

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Re: Drag sharpener vs CBN
« Reply #25 on: September 15, 2021, 12:10:54 PM »
I have only seen videos of the cbn sharpeners and heard the talk of the oil mess and it got me wondering if a cabinet around the entire operation would be nice to have (like a cnc milling machine would have), it would keep the mess pretty much contained and could be vented outside or through a filter.

Offline Bruno of NH

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Re: Drag sharpener vs CBN
« Reply #26 on: September 15, 2021, 12:52:51 PM »
My friend who passed away last year had 3 of the Woodmizer cbn with cabinets it still made smoke and oil in the air .
I have never seen the others run.
I would think an overhead draft hood would be needed 
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Offline terrifictimbersllc

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Re: Drag sharpener vs CBN
« Reply #27 on: September 15, 2021, 12:59:36 PM »
BMS 250 does come in a more or less enclosed cabinet with a duct on the top lid. If you ran a hose to a small fan to outside, the other openings in the lid would have fresh air coming into them and probablyAll the oil mist would go out the duct hose.
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Offline jimbarry

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Re: Drag sharpener vs CBN
« Reply #28 on: September 15, 2021, 01:37:02 PM »
BMS 250 does come in a more or less enclosed cabinet with a duct on the top lid. If you ran a hose to a small fan to outside, the other openings in the lid would have fresh air coming into them and probablyAll the oil mist would go out the duct hose.
Not probably, it would, and does. At least for me. I got rid of the K*N filter and now vent outdoors.
Jim
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Offline Quebecnewf

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Re: Drag sharpener vs CBN
« Reply #29 on: September 15, 2021, 04:53:11 PM »
Now to add a bit more to the mix.

A friend sent me Dina Sharpener . A newer version and full auto where as mine is semi auto . He has not had any luck with it do now Iím going to give it a whirl . 

The wheel on this one is a diamond wheel . Not sure about that . There is a broken normal grinding wheel in the box . 

Anyone use diamond wheel on drag style sharpener ? 



 

 

 

For some reason pics are tipped on their side . A job for our fearless adm .

Quebecnewf 

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Re: Drag sharpener vs CBN
« Reply #30 on: September 15, 2021, 05:27:13 PM »
Pretty sure diamond is for carbide and will not work as well or last on bimetal. hopefully if I am wrong someone will correct me.

Offline Quebecnewf

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Re: Drag sharpener vs CBN
« Reply #31 on: September 15, 2021, 05:33:21 PM »
I was thinking the same thing . I thought all the drag style used grinding wheels . Thatís all I ever used and I donít remember anyone in here saying they used a diamond wheel on their drag grinders .

And as we know if it hasnít been tried on this site then it havenít happened 

Quebecnewf 

Offline Bruno of NH

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Re: Drag sharpener vs CBN
« Reply #32 on: September 15, 2021, 05:50:41 PM »
Valley sawmills in Quebec is a stocking dealer in the right wheels for that new style.
The new wheels are quite different. 
That's the sharpener I want.
The owner has passed and the company is in limbo at the moment. 
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Offline Quebecnewf

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Re: Drag sharpener vs CBN
« Reply #33 on: September 15, 2021, 06:27:18 PM »
Do you have any info on type of wheels . Iíve been to that location . They make some good mills

Quebecnewf 

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Re: Drag sharpener vs CBN
« Reply #34 on: September 15, 2021, 06:57:22 PM »
Pretty sure diamond is for carbide and will not work as well or last on bimetal. hopefully if I am wrong someone will correct me.
You are correct.  The diamond will glaze over and stop cutting leading to overheating both the blade and the wheel.  Very light grinding on steel won't hurt it too much (I'll hand sharpen small drill bits with one) but heavy or extended use will.

BMS 250 does come in a more or less enclosed cabinet with a duct on the top lid. If you ran a hose to a small fan to outside, the other openings in the lid would have fresh air coming into them and probablyAll the oil mist would go out the duct hose.
A better idea would be to try and fab up a mist collector to filter and recapture the oil mist while also creating a negative pressure inside the work area that won't allow any mist to escape.  I worked in a grind shop that didn't do this and the amount of mist that gets put into the air is quite excessive, not to mention expensive.

A dry CBN wheel will dull up very quickly.  
When pushed hard, yes.  Keep the grinds light and the wheel won't glaze over.  

Offline LeeB

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Re: Drag sharpener vs CBN
« Reply #35 on: September 15, 2021, 10:03:50 PM »
At one time there was a fellow on here from Ireland that made CBN wheels for a drag sharpener. I had one and it worked well until I dropped it and broke the grinding edge. The grinder I have is similar to a cooks and I think it was made by the same people before cooks started selling them. It's labeled as Suffolk. They no longer sell it.
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Offline Quebecnewf

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Re: Drag sharpener vs CBN
« Reply #36 on: September 16, 2021, 05:01:42 AM »
Would the grinding of bandsaw blades constitute as ď very light grinding ď Iím wondering .

The diamond wheel mounted on the unit ( there is another spare in a box ) is thin and the edge is about the same profile as the rock stone that I use on my olderDinasaw sharpener . 

Would be great if it worked . A lot less mess . I will try to reach out to the manufacturer in AU. If I can and see what they say .

The company in Quebecís eastern townships that sell s these units also offers a sharpening service based on these soi will look for info there ? 

Quebecnewf 

Offline Quebecnewf

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Re: Drag sharpener vs CBN
« Reply #37 on: September 16, 2021, 05:35:55 AM »
Preferably use ABN / CBN wheels and wear a suitable dust mask.

The above is a line from the instruction Manuel for the sharpener . 

Guess that answers the question? 

Quebecnewf 

Offline YellowHammer

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Re: Drag sharpener vs CBN
« Reply #38 on: September 16, 2021, 07:34:15 AM »
I didn't really like the mess of my dry grinder drag grinder, the grinding residue would fall all over the floor, and was a mess.  I like the WM style CBN style, it come with a hood, but smoke and vapor comes out.  Both have their drawbacks.  

I mounted mine to a rolling cart and simply roll mine outside on the concrete apron and get to sharpening.  In my mind, one of the significant advantages of a wet CBN system is a one and done grind with no burning, about 2.5 minutes around the band and done.  

In contrast, my Cooks dry drag grinder was 7 minutes around to not burn the teeth and required 2 to 3 light passes, so resulted in 14 to 21 minutes per band.  Way too much time.

The WM sharpener has a hood and a blower suction port, so if I was going to do it inside, I would mount a vapor suction unit to the port and send the vapor out the duct.   

YellowHammerisms:

Take steps to save steps.

If it wonít roll, its not a log; itís still a piece of tree.  Sawmills cut logs, not pieces of trees.

Kiln drying wood: When the cookies are burned, theyíre burned, and you canít fix them.  Donít burn the cookies.

Offline Cedarman

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Re: Drag sharpener vs CBN
« Reply #39 on: September 16, 2021, 08:38:29 AM »
I adjust the oil sprays so that during grinding there are no sparks or very few to be seen.  Never see any smoke.  I set up  a small fan and hose to blow outside.  But have not noticed any difference of fumes inside.  When not using fan.  Most oil seemed to stay inside.  there would be a few drops fall to the flow while sharpening, but they evaporate.  So I know some is getting into the air.  If a blade sets after sharpening the oil on the blade evaporates also.
Anyone got any masks these days.!!
I am in the pink when sawing cedar.


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