Stihl FS130 brush cutting (review)

Flatheadyoungin · November 22, 2009, 08:17:31 PM

yeah, i want to see how to sharpen one too...

i've have all of stihl's blades.....i started with the square 4 edge blade about 20 years ago......it was ok....

then i went to the three blade star......it was ok too...

then i went to the "scratcher tooth" blade and i really like it......but I DON'T like that it's hard to sharpen....it was great in briars, etc.....

so you guys are sold on the chisel tooth blade? they claim it can be sharpened in the field.....

anyone have any luck with the fixed length line heads for just grass.....i would think .130 or bigger would last quite a while BUT sometimes thinner line of good quality will cut better....

who has a used fs250r or equivalent that is blown up....i got a smokin' deal on a fs250r without the bicycle handle bars........i want one with bars on it.......shoot, even one of my fs80's would be find with bicycle bars.......

John Mc · November 22, 2009, 09:05:57 PM

I've use the 3 and 4 tooth blades. They work pretty well on grass and brush, but saplings tend to be too much for them. I'm not sure what you guys are referring to when you say "scratcher tooth" and "chisel tooth" blades. The one I'm using looks like a cheap table saw or circular saw blade... the teeth are a little different shape, and they have more offset than the circular saw blades. I sharpen it with a 7/32" round file, which seems to work fine... but then I'm not doing this commercially, just clearing trails and cutting out buckthorn.

Reddog · November 22, 2009, 09:22:32 PM

This link has pictures of the blades.
http://www.stihlusa.com/trimmers/blades.html

John Mc · November 22, 2009, 09:42:42 PM

Thanks, Reddog. I'm using the Jonsered equivalent of a chisel tooth blade. I don't seem to have any problems with sharpening, just followed the directions on the package. I do have to reset the teeth from time to time. They tend to loose their offset over time... probably because I get lazy and try to cut down something too big (rather than get my chainsaw), and pinch the blade.

SwampDonkey · November 23, 2009, 05:50:19 AM

Quote from: Flatheadyoungin on November 22, 2009, 08:17:31 PM

so you guys are sold on the chisel tooth blade? they claim it can be sharpened in the field.....

It's not a claim, it's a fact. ;) I know some people that sharpen at night, but not very many. It don't take much time to touch up a blade and I see people waste more time "visiting" than blade sharpening. :D As I said before you can't cut larger dense trees with a claw like hook on the blade. Just a notch on the corner, like when you remove it from the carton, is what you want. Maybe your blades in the US are not pre-sharpened and set, we used to get those here, but all brands up here that I have seen the last couple years are sharpened and set. I can remember the Stihl rep putting on a training course and it involved sharpening. He went a bit over board, because everything is safety laden. He used a vise in the shop. Also showed that a snipped off poplar about 4 feet high in the field, and cutting a notch into the top, makes a good vise to. But no one does even that. You just place that blade stop in the gear head that comes with your saw and file with gloves on. But as soon as your starting to get a hook (cat's claw) to the tooth you have to flat file that off. That won't happen for at least 8 filings or so. And no you don't have to keep filing the blade as long as you stay out of the mud mounds, root wads and rocks. You can flat file 2 times, maybe 3, but by then it's time to unwrap a new blade from it's carton. :D Yes, you do have to set the teeth on occasion, but I never bother very often. More common in pin cherry and hardwood. There are cheap blades out there that are no good for anything. Stick with the brands that use hard Swedish steel, check where it's made. Japan had a blade brand that was too soft, they gave up making them and they are make in Sweden now. Might be different in the US, you guys get stuff in that we don't have here. I've got a whole pile of blades to fix up this winter, blades I never flat filed yet. I won't have to buy a new blade all next season. :D This season was 26 weeks long. ;D

John Mc · November 23, 2009, 09:27:04 AM

SwampDonkey -

I'm not seeing what you are talking about with the cat's claw hook on the tooth from repeated filing. I'm using a 7/32" file (as recommended on the packaging) and putting it in one of those holders that support the length of the file - in theory keeping the file at the right depth, assuring the proper tooth shape.

Are you filing freehand and perhaps getting the hook, or am I missing something and maybe losing out on a lot of performance?

You're right, it doesn't take long to sharpen. I don't even lock the blade. I just prop up my saw so the blade is vertical, hold the blade with one hand and file with the other.

I'm cutting mostly hardwood saplings (buckthorn), if that makes any difference. This type of blade is pretty slow in grass or small weeds compared to the 3 or 4 tooth blades (that look kind of like an oversized throwing star like you see in the martial arts movies). My neighbor has the identical saw, but uses the chainsaw-style blade. One of these days, we'll have to swap to compare performance.

VT_Forestry · November 23, 2009, 12:57:52 PM

We run FS450s with the chisel tooth blade for our precommercial thinning operations. Primarily cutting lob pine and sweetgum, works great, especially now that I got the set tool. We were noticing that as we used the blades, they would lose their set and not clear chips from the cut. The result was a razor sharp blade that wouldn't cut a stick of butter

Now that i've been able to put the set back into them, they are back to cutting quick again.

SwampDonkey · November 26, 2009, 12:22:01 PM

You could avoid the cat's claw shape by riding the round file high on the tooth I suppose, but that will still need filing off after a few sharpenings. A round file rubbed on steel makes a rounded gullet after awhile, sure ain't a square one. :D

eamassey · November 26, 2009, 07:11:42 PM

I am a FS250 user. Great machine. Not an 8 hour day user, sometimes maybe 3 or 4. Most of my use is with a two-bladed swinging blade "micro-bush hog" (12"). The unit is machined aluminum hub, with two free-swinging blades at about 3/4" x 4" x .160". Nothing beats this blade setup in briars and really small brush. I will cut up to about 1 inch diameter brush, but that is about it, and it is best on 1/2" and less. My primary use is fencerow recovery--- just got to be careful and not get the blade into the steel t-posts. I bought the cutter head on e-bay several years ago. When the blades wore out, I couldn't find the seller again. So I build my own blades out of old (real-full size, I have 6, 7, and 15 feet machines) bush hog blades. Anybody ever used one of these swinging blade micro-bush hog setups?

My fencerow tecnique is to tractor bush hog close as possible-both sides if I can, then go through first with a MS210 Stihl (small) and cut everything bigger than 1"--load it on fork-lift forks on a farm tractor, for removal. I don't remove any of the trash from the FS250 work. And I am trying to move to spraying to help some.

I had my first trouble with the FS250 this year. Muffler clogged according to the Stihl mechanic. He asked about the oil I was using - it was Poulan synthetic. He said that's the problem. I have now changed back to genuine Stihl. Anybody any coments on this?

Rocky_J · November 26, 2009, 09:33:41 PM

On the muffler clogging, just remove the screen and throw it away. Much cheaper than paying a mechanic to clean it for you.

I have seen a lot of buildup in mufflers from running Stihl mix (orange bottle) also, it's not much better than most of the marginal oils on the market. I run Stihl synthetic (black bottle), but it is quite expensive and most of my saws have been ported for additional performance. Echo and Husky synthetics are very good as well, and I'm sure there are other premium synthetics with equal quality and performance.

John Mc · November 26, 2009, 09:42:50 PM

Quote from: SwampDonkey on November 26, 2009, 12:22:01 PM
You could avoid the cat's claw shape by riding the round file high on the tooth I suppose, but that will still need filing off after a few sharpenings. A round file rubbed on steel makes a rounded gullet after awhile, sure ain't a square one. :D

My blade came with a round gullet. The file holder I referred to earlier keeps the file high on the tooth, supposedly giving you the proper angle of the tooth point. I'd be interested to see what your filing looks like... makes me wonder if I could be getting more performance out of my brush cutter if I filed it differently.

John Mc

SwampDonkey · November 27, 2009, 07:06:45 AM

Your probably using the file guide with the 15 ° lines on it. Anyway, it's the guide we use. I think I said 20 ° earlier, but this one has a 15 °. Some people do file at 20 ° though. Out of the box, the blades we get are not round notched, they are flat sloped.

Here is a blade that has been filed many times and developed an almost cat's claw shape. It looks sharp maybe, but wouldn't cut hardwood or dense slow grown softwood very well. The little whip sized hardwood and brush just spins around the blade in this condition. I have indicated where the rocks have been struck on the tooth edge and rounded it over with a line that indicated where it should be flat filed. The filing should slope at 15° with the set teeth across it's face, not radially to the blade centre. I use no guide for that, I just eye ball it. Tooth set would be checked as well. I free hand file, but use a file guide to dress the tooth back to like new with a 15° angle. I have a whole bunch of blades like this one that need flat filing and round filing back to like new. ;D

Flatheadyoungin · November 27, 2009, 10:31:46 AM

i'd like to know more about this "micro bush hog"

Quote from: eamassey on November 26, 2009, 07:11:42 PM
I am a FS250 user. Great machine. Not an 8 hour day user, sometimes maybe 3 or 4. Most of my use is with a two-bladed swinging blade "micro-bush hog" (12"). The unit is machined aluminum hub, with two free-swinging blades at about 3/4" x 4" x .160". Nothing beats this blade setup in briars and really small brush. I will cut up to about 1 inch diameter brush, but that is about it, and it is best on 1/2" and less. My primary use is fencerow recovery--- just got to be careful and not get the blade into the steel t-posts. I bought the cutter head on e-bay several years ago. When the blades wore out, I couldn't find the seller again. So I build my own blades out of old (real-full size, I have 6, 7, and 15 feet machines) bush hog blades. Anybody ever used one of these swinging blade micro-bush hog setups?

My fencerow tecnique is to tractor bush hog close as possible-both sides if I can, then go through first with a MS210 Stihl (small) and cut everything bigger than 1"--load it on fork-lift forks on a farm tractor, for removal. I don't remove any of the trash from the FS250 work. And I am trying to move to spraying to help some.

I had my first trouble with the FS250 this year. Muffler clogged according to the Stihl mechanic. He asked about the oil I was using - it was Poulan synthetic. He said that's the problem. I have now changed back to genuine Stihl. Anybody any coments on this?

stonebroke · November 27, 2009, 11:47:08 AM

I have been using Stihl synthetic oil since it came out. Worth the money if you don't want breakdowns and want your saws to last.

Stonebroke

SwampDonkey · November 27, 2009, 04:27:13 PM

Quote from: Rocky_J on November 26, 2009, 09:33:41 PM
On the muffler clogging, just remove the screen and throw it away. Much cheaper than paying a mechanic to clean it for you.

I modify the screen (replace) with a drain screen. Don't care how good the oil is, they clog up the screens in professional brush saws when used extensively. The drain screen doesn't and it passes inspection. ;D I use synthetic all the time.

Now I suppose the hit parade will start up. :D

paulpieter · December 30, 2009, 10:40:59 AM

Thanks to the discussions on this thread, I have purchased the husky harness for my new-to-me FS130 and at the same time, my chisel tooth blade arrived. The harness is great, easy to put on, even over jackets etc, and nice quick-release mechanisms are very ergonomic and user friendly. There is a quick release clasp on the chest to remove the whole harness and on the hook that holds up the brush cutter. I used the blade on 1 cm to 3 cm buckthorn - a very hard wood and up to 4 cm boxelder and it is NICE!!!! 8), like a hot knife through butter. It cut so fast I couldn't feel any change in resistance as the blade approached and then severed the stem. Just love it. The problem is I continually needed to stop the cutter to clear the brush which accumulated so quickly. It there a particularly effective technique for that, or does everyone always have to stop to clear the brush. Still learning :P.

SwampDonkey · December 30, 2009, 10:54:54 AM

Power is the answer, but not the end all. Still have to clear a wedged stem 1/2" diameter once in awhile from a FS550 guard as well. Don't modify the blade guard, although some shave off the outer radii of the guard. I didn't say anything. :X

As to your harness, keep an eye on the hook where it attaches to the brush saw. If the attachment point on the 130 is hard steel like on the 550 it will eat the harness hook up within a week of every day use. What I do is use a sacrificial hinged clasp between the harness and the saw. The hook on the Husky harness is softer steel than on the Sthil saw.

John Mc · December 30, 2009, 01:10:31 PM

Quote from: paulpieter on December 30, 2009, 10:40:59 AM
The problem is I continually needed to stop the cutter to clear the brush which accumulated so quickly. It there a particularly effective technique for that, or does everyone always have to stop to clear the brush. Still learning :P.

I'm no expert, but I've found that sometimes different techniques in how you approach the brush can help. My first inclination was to push the blade into the brush ahead of me. This didn't work too well, since the brush always wanted to fall right into me and blocked me from the next few feet of brush I wanted to reach. Now I look to cut from the left side of the stem and use the cutting head to push the bases of the brush to the right, causing the brush tops to want to fall left. I also sometimes start the cut more or less from the opposite side of the brush trunk (the side facing away from me), and pull the cut ends towards me a bit. Even if the tops don't drop all the way they tend not top drop towards me, and I can more easily reach the next row of brush. I still may eventually have to push through some of it, or stop and pull it out of my way, but these two techniques do seem to lessen the frequency of needing to do that.

That's some of my rookie method. Hopefully, some of the more experienced guys here will give us both some better tips.

John Mc

SwampDonkey · December 30, 2009, 04:45:21 PM

Yes, the brush does not fall like felling a large sawlog tree. You go through the stem so fast that the force causes the top to tip toward the direction you came from. If your going to cover any amount of ground you have to have the brush fall out into the area already cut. When you cut, a little hillside is beneficial. Cut from bottom to top. If brush is falling in front of you, your going to be a lot less productive. Usually you cut across a face and snip from the left of the blade going to the right across the face, and from the right of the blade going left across the face. You sometimes have to direct the taller stuff or around maple clumps. When there are clumps you thin the stems of surrounding trees first, then go into the clump and space it out. The clump stems fall away usually with no hang-ups or tugging. But you'll want to snip off them little finer twigs that grow up and out like apple limbs first because they slap your face. That stings. :D You might think pawing brush or directing it by hand is non productive, but you will cover a lot more ground if you get the cut stems down to the ground. The job looks a lot nicer with no crop trees being leaned over by hang ups and no tee pees. On my advancing edge it's like a moving foot path, all I have to step over is stumps, no brush to wade. A little bit of a hook when severing the tree helps it tip in the direction you want.

customsawyer · December 31, 2009, 04:16:21 AM

I have not used my brush saws for several years (2 husky 265 I think that is the right number on them) I just hook the brown tree cutter up behind my tractor and I can clear out a lot more than 1 acre per day. It works very well in the ways I use it but there is still certain areas that a brush saw would be needed. I am on the other side of the sharpening thing from SD I liked to put a little bit of the cat claw hook on my blade as it seemed to cut better, don't know if this has to do with cutting mostly soft wood or not but it worked for me.

SwampDonkey · December 31, 2009, 10:50:00 AM

Two different applications. I'm talking spacing trees and cutting up to 6 or 7" but trees. I could cover more ground if it was just mowing down all the trees. And a tractor would never be able to leave the road in places I'm using the saw. Even in field with 20 foot spruce or birch is no place for a tractor. Now an excavator with a hydro axe or something or a mini blade on the front I can see chewing up the stems, but they don't use those thinning. They have tried though, and the quality was too poor. Too much residual damage, too wide a spacing and looks like the trail of death with spears left behind sticking out of the ground. As to the blade sharpening, the cat's claw is sharp for small stems, still not as sharp as I described, because stems the size of raspberry canes just whorl around the blade. But, when you get into the larger stems the profile your using takes too much bite and you loose saw momentum. I can push my blade into a 6" pin cherry like it's a chain saw, but not with a cat's claw profile. Maybe an inch, and that whoomph feeling. Too much bite.

customsawyer · January 08, 2010, 04:51:51 AM

Well as I was saying it has a lot to do with the type of work you are doing with the equipment you have.

VT_Forestry · January 08, 2010, 06:34:19 AM

Since Hurricane Isabel came through a few years ago, we have areas that were salvage harvested and replanted in pine. These stands are surrounded by mature pine stands, so natural regeneration has created patches with 10-20k TPA, sometimes more. I've been pre-commercial thinning loblolly pines for the past few weeks with an FS450, and we've been adding an additional step to dealing with the brush. Once we get the tree on the ground (a task in itself with 20ft tall trees as thick as dog hair) we go ahead and trim most of the branches off and then top the tree so it lays as flat as possible. This helps the stand look very clean when we are done (public perception is a big part of my job) and helps get those nutrients back into the ground faster. It takes some extra time, but the end result is something that looks good and doesn't cause my phone to ring with people complaining about how i've "destroyed the forest" :D

customsawyer · January 10, 2010, 01:54:24 PM

The tractor is used in clearing lots and stuff like that and it will take down your 7" trees with out slowing down any more than you do. When using the brush saw I get by better with the little bit of hook in the small soft woods as the brush saw will cut these just like a weed eater goes through grass. The point of my reply is to give the other members of the forum a chance to see what works in different areas of the world.

SwampDonkey · January 10, 2010, 02:10:04 PM

Nothing wrong with sharing your experience for sure. However, I can't really picture dragging a bush hog in 7" hardwood or even fir for that matter without being hung up or fetched up and spinning your wheels. I never seen your equipment. I have seen hogs here and 3" was pushing things. We used them some on fields to clear alder and willow for tree planting. Anything heavier than 3" had to be dozed (alders) when the ground was frozen so they would snap off and not move a mountain a good earth with them, or an excavator with an attachment to cut and mulch it up. But I hated working in those spears planting trees or sending anyone into it. Sometimes I had guys just cut it up with a brush saw if small acreage along the field edge. They used an excavator in pre-commercial thinning to make safety trails. It was a bad mess. Them spears about knee high, so you could bust a knee cap any moment. I'd rather cut my own trail or wade brush. They stopped using them when everyone complained. They are great on power lines and right of way and lot clearing I suppose, but not where I gotta walk through it. ;)