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Hickory Door

Started by TimW, May 28, 2019, 12:17:06 AM

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TimW

Within two years, I will be building  a log home.  I'll build the front door out of Hickory.  Two weeks ago, I had to cut down a beautiful Hickory tree.  Now, should I cut it into boards now and stack and sticker to store above my barn shop, or just keep the log off of the ground for up to two years?
hugs,  Brandi
Mahindra 6520 4WD with loader/backhoe and a Caterpiller E70 Excavator.  My mill is a Woodmizer LT40HD Wide 35hp Yanmar Diesel. An old Lull 644D-34 called Bull

WLC

I'd saw it now, stack and sticker.
Woodmizer LT28
Branson 4wd tractor
Stihl chainsaws
Elbow grease.

Weekend_Sawyer

I'd cut it now and cut it a little thick and stack and sticker it with a lot of weight.
You never know what hickory wants to do, I haven't cut a lot of it but what I have noticed is that the bigger the tree the straighter the wood when you mill it.
I recently cut a 12" and it cupped in 2 different directions on the same board!!!
I wound up using it for smoking wood.

Jon
Imagine, Me a Tree Farmer.
Jon, Appalachian American Wannabe.

TimW

Thanks Guys!  I cut it ASAP.
hugs,  Brandi
Mahindra 6520 4WD with loader/backhoe and a Caterpiller E70 Excavator.  My mill is a Woodmizer LT40HD Wide 35hp Yanmar Diesel. An old Lull 644D-34 called Bull

TimW

Will 7 degree blades saw it, or will I need a blade in another degree? 
hugs,  Brandi
Mahindra 6520 4WD with loader/backhoe and a Caterpiller E70 Excavator.  My mill is a Woodmizer LT40HD Wide 35hp Yanmar Diesel. An old Lull 644D-34 called Bull

nativewolf

PPB love hickory so be sure to spray boards with borate.  Another reason to saw.  A reason not too would be that Hickory stains badly in hot weather.  For this reason there is generally no commercial hickory log sale from May to September.  
Liking Walnut

TimW

Quote from: nativewolf on May 28, 2019, 10:13:02 PM
PPB love hickory so be sure to spray boards with borate.  Another reason to saw.  A reason not too would be that Hickory stains badly in hot weather.  For this reason there is generally no commercial hickory log sale from May to September.  
What is PPB?  Never heard of it down here in Texas. 
 I had to cut it down ASAP, as it looked like it was gonna uproot onto my friend's trailer.  He has phobias of leaning trees, as Harvey uprooted one on his RV trailer.  We were out in Harvey's full force trying to get the tree off of his RV, while trying to keep my 4WD Mahindra from sinking up to the axles, then tarping the trailer.......................not fun at all.
hugs,  Brandi
Mahindra 6520 4WD with loader/backhoe and a Caterpiller E70 Excavator.  My mill is a Woodmizer LT40HD Wide 35hp Yanmar Diesel. An old Lull 644D-34 called Bull

LeeB

Powder Post Beatles, and they do exist in Texas.
'98 LT40HDD/Lombardini, Case 580L, Cat D4C, JD 3032 tractor, JD 5410 tractor, Husky 346, 372 and 562XP's. Stihl MS180 and MS361, 1998 and 2006 3/4 Ton 5.9 Cummins 4x4's, 1989 Dodge D100 w/ 318, and a 1966 Chevy C60 w/ dump bed.

Weekend_Sawyer

Quote from: Bindian on May 28, 2019, 10:06:52 PM
Will 7 degree blades saw it, or will I need a blade in another degree?  
hugs,  Brandi
I cut mine last year using a Woodmizer 7 Degree blade on my Norwood manual mill. I had no problems. It was a pretty big tree and straight I got 5 9' saw logs out of it.
Jon
Imagine, Me a Tree Farmer.
Jon, Appalachian American Wannabe.

TimW

Quote from: LeeB on May 29, 2019, 02:10:23 AM
Powder Post Beatles, and they do exist in Texas.
But do they exist in Southeast Texas with all our humidity?  We have Pine Burrow (Bore?) Beetles here big time.
hugs,  Brandi
Mahindra 6520 4WD with loader/backhoe and a Caterpiller E70 Excavator.  My mill is a Woodmizer LT40HD Wide 35hp Yanmar Diesel. An old Lull 644D-34 called Bull

TimW

Quote from: Weekend_Sawyer on May 29, 2019, 07:37:35 AM
Quote from: Bindian on May 28, 2019, 10:06:52 PM
Will 7 degree blades saw it, or will I need a blade in another degree?  
hugs,  Brandi
I cut mine last year using a Woodmizer 7 Degree blade on my Norwood manual mill. I had no problems. It was a pretty big tree and straight I got 5 9' saw logs out of it.
Jon
Thanks.  I found another thread on Turbo 7s and others cutting dry and green Hickory.
hugs,  Brandi
Mahindra 6520 4WD with loader/backhoe and a Caterpiller E70 Excavator.  My mill is a Woodmizer LT40HD Wide 35hp Yanmar Diesel. An old Lull 644D-34 called Bull

WDH

Powderpost beetles love the South.  Nativewolf's advice to spray with borate is spot on.  Like has been said, it if is hot with no air flow, hickory will blotch with an ugly gray stain.  Also saw it soon as the ambrosia beetles also love hickory and will riddle the log with little black lined holes.  Powderpost beetles only infest the dry lumber whereas ambrosia beetles infest the green log. 
Woodmizer LT40HDD35, John Deere 2155, Kubota M5-111, Kubota L2501, Nyle L53 Dehumidification Kiln, and a passion for all things with leafs, twigs, and bark.  hamsleyhardwood.com

Raym

Sorry to pop your balloon but I would not build your front door out of any wood much less hickory. As a builder I do not recommend even installing commercially made wooden doors but if a customer insists, they must sign a wavier. The problem is that the margins required for an entry door are very small and the slightest movement will result in unconditioned air making its way inside an otherwise "tight" house. If you install a wooden door, it WILL move, warp, twist, all the bad things......you cannot avoid this as you have one side conditioned and the other exposed to outside elements.

I would suggest use your hickory for a feature barn door inside and install a commercial fiberglass or steel exterior door.
Just my opinion.
'14-LT40 super, nyle l200m kiln, vintage case 480E loader.

It's not the fool that askith, it's the fool that agreeith.

TimW

Quote from: Raym on May 31, 2019, 04:15:44 AM
Sorry to pop your balloon but I would not build your front door out of any wood much less hickory. As a builder I do not recommend even installing commercially made wooden doors but if a customer insists, they must sign a wavier. The problem is that the margins required for an entry door are very small and the slightest movement will result in unconditioned air making its way inside an otherwise "tight" house. If you install a wooden door, it WILL move, warp, twist, all the bad things......you cannot avoid this as you have one side conditioned and the other exposed to outside elements.

I would suggest use your hickory for a feature barn door inside and install a commercial fiberglass or steel exterior door.
Just my opinion.
Thanks for you input.  But there are several ways to build a door that can minimize what you have waivers signed for.   Challenge accepted.
    hugs,  Brandi
Mahindra 6520 4WD with loader/backhoe and a Caterpiller E70 Excavator.  My mill is a Woodmizer LT40HD Wide 35hp Yanmar Diesel. An old Lull 644D-34 called Bull

LeeB

'98 LT40HDD/Lombardini, Case 580L, Cat D4C, JD 3032 tractor, JD 5410 tractor, Husky 346, 372 and 562XP's. Stihl MS180 and MS361, 1998 and 2006 3/4 Ton 5.9 Cummins 4x4's, 1989 Dodge D100 w/ 318, and a 1966 Chevy C60 w/ dump bed.

TimW

Quote from: nativewolf on May 28, 2019, 10:13:02 PM
PPB love hickory so be sure to spray boards with borate.  Another reason to saw.  A reason not too would be that Hickory stains badly in hot weather.  For this reason there is generally no commercial hickory log sale from May to September.  
Can I use a solution of water and Borax, the 20 Mule team variety?  I found how to use it here.... https://www.hunker.com/13425952/how-to-treat-wood-with-borax
hugs,  Brandi
Mahindra 6520 4WD with loader/backhoe and a Caterpiller E70 Excavator.  My mill is a Woodmizer LT40HD Wide 35hp Yanmar Diesel. An old Lull 644D-34 called Bull

TimW

I have 2006 square feet of hickory flooring in my shop.  Should I spray it with borax also?
hugs,  Brandi
Mahindra 6520 4WD with loader/backhoe and a Caterpiller E70 Excavator.  My mill is a Woodmizer LT40HD Wide 35hp Yanmar Diesel. An old Lull 644D-34 called Bull

LeeB

That would stop any new infestation but won't help if they are already there. Not sure what the water will do to the boards as far as warp/cupping goes depending on how dry it already is. Some of the others will have to chime in on this. 
'98 LT40HDD/Lombardini, Case 580L, Cat D4C, JD 3032 tractor, JD 5410 tractor, Husky 346, 372 and 562XP's. Stihl MS180 and MS361, 1998 and 2006 3/4 Ton 5.9 Cummins 4x4's, 1989 Dodge D100 w/ 318, and a 1966 Chevy C60 w/ dump bed.

nativewolf

Quote from: Weekend_Sawyer on May 29, 2019, 07:37:35 AM
Quote from: Bindian on May 28, 2019, 10:06:52 PM
Will 7 degree blades saw it, or will I need a blade in another degree?  
hugs,  Brandi
I cut mine last year using a Woodmizer 7 Degree blade on my Norwood manual mill. I had no problems. It was a pretty big tree and straight I got 5 9' saw logs out of it.
Jon
That's a nice tree.
Liking Walnut

tacks Y

I put a fiberglass door on my house when I built it, lasted 10-15 years. Now I have an oak door I made, just as old and still good. I made my door with 3 layers of oak not single 2". Go for the hickory.

Don P

Most of us use a borate solution which is DOT, disodium octaborate tetrahydrate. The old USN mix was borax+boric acid heated in water until it goes into solution. The easy way to get that combination is to use Timbor. This works well on green wood and is EPA listed for that use. The cheaper and more readily available way is to use the chemically identical ag boron amendment Solubor at a rate of 1 to 1.5 lbs/gallon of water. Dipping the wood is best but you can spray or roll it on heavily. A drop or two of liquid soap helps break he surface tension and helps it flow on.

If the wood is dry a glycol helps wet the fibers and deepen penetration, ethylene glycol, anti-freeze, is the glycol used in the listed solution Bora-Care but any glycol will work, RV antifreeze is low tox and performs similarly. Rewetting dry wood risks relieving drying stress and causing distortion. If the wood is not yet machined that can be viewed as a stress relief. If the flooring is already machined the risk of damaging the finished product is high.

OffGrid973

Not much on here about the type of wood , so I wanted to add my experience with hickory (heavy).  The slabs I cut three years ago never were purchased by anyone, most likely have some beetle character and will become firewood later this week during the yearly cleanup.  

If it's a go regardless, then get it up off the ground to avoid any staining, (unless that is what you are going for) and buy some heavy hardware. If your design allows for double or triple layer door you can cut thinner and build quicker, plus allows for easier manipulating if needed during setup/glue-up.

Spar varnish (marine grade) always great for a top coat...good luck.
Your Fellow Woodworker,
- Off Grid

tacks Y

Some one asked for a pic of my door. The edge shows the 3 layers of oak, instead of a 2" single board. The center was wormy oak tree I cut. Otherwise I made it like any other door. It has stayed straight with the 3 layers.

 

 The raised panels are layered also with the board joints staggered.

Weekend_Sawyer

Quote from: nativewolf on June 01, 2019, 06:34:38 AM
Quote from: Weekend_Sawyer on May 29, 2019, 07:37:35 AM
Quote from: Bindian on May 28, 2019, 10:06:52 PM
Will 7 degree blades saw it, or will I need a blade in another degree?  
hugs,  Brandi
I cut mine last year using a Woodmizer 7 Degree blade on my Norwood manual mill. I had no problems. It was a pretty big tree and straight I got 5 9' saw logs out of it.
Jon
That's a nice tree.
It was a magnificent tree and I wouldn't have taken it down but I noticed it the year before as it was dropping leaves earlier than expected. The next spring it was dead. I had a logger doing a harvest and he dropped it and bucked it for me.
Imagine, Me a Tree Farmer.
Jon, Appalachian American Wannabe.

Brad_bb

Consider using 4° band if you have it.  It will take a smaller bite and is all I can use with my mill (19hp kohler engine).  Hickory is so darn hard and around knots or grain direction change, can make the balde want to ride up or down.  Dry hickory is the worst.  Really hard to band saw.  7° requires more HP, and likely more prone to waves in hickory.  I've sawn a couple green and one dry hickory barn beam that was like sawing concrete and dulled a band in one pass.

If you build a door and you glue up, if you're using titebond glue, use the original.  Don't use Titebond 2 or 2.  They have more tendency to creep (soften and let the wood move) when heated by the sun.  Original titebond is better for that. Also, will you have an all glass storm door in front of the wood door?  Such a situation, with sun shining on it, can raise temps in that space like a green house.  It would be better if it could let heat escape and not get so hot.

I recommend getting Timbor or Solubore.  Spray your wood as soon as it's sawn.  If adult PPB lay eggs in the wood, it would be months before you'd see the larvae boring and by then they'd be in the wood.  The only way to kill them in the wood is kiln sterilization.  So you want to prevent them from getting in the wood in the first place by spraying right off the mill.  Your T&G that is inside, is the building they are in sealed like a house?  Will it prevent adult beetles from coming in and laying on the wood?  If it's a floor that is installed, and it has a finish on it, a film finish like oil based urethane or water based urethane, then a film finish will prevent adult PPB from landing on it, tasting the wood startch and then laying.  If they don't taste wood starch, they won't lay on it.
Anything someone can design, I can sure figure out how to fix!
If I say it\\\\\\\'s going to take so long, multiply that by at least 3!

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