I just spent the last hour (that's all I'll admit to - I spent more than that) futzing around getting my LT35 levelled. And yes, I'm still learning. I find the stock outrigger "jacks" to be just a little bit better than worthless. End do end, it's not hard to get the stock outriggers set, moving the head up and down. But I had to lift the rail-side wheel about 3" off the ground to get the bed close to level using a hydraulic jack.
I would expect that the WM FAOs have enough guts to lift the side of the mill, and would eliminate the need to go grab a floor jack. Yes? It's an ACME thread in there, so that can lift a lot.
At this point, I don't care what they cost.
Your numbers seem to indicate the mill is set up on a grade that is near or over max mfg recommended. The " rail-side wheel about 3" off the ground" would put the deck pretty high, no matter which side the tire was that high off the ground. If the tire was hanging from the springs that would put the deck much higher still. I've never encountered a situation which made that necessary.
It's rare but I have had to dig the outriggers in, so there might be cause to excavate for the tire. Gotta make a plan that works best for the grade you have to work with. If one side will require excessive elevation accommodation, that's gonna affect what must be done so the other side won't be out of reasonable working height, yet stable. If you put the landing gear on one side down with no forethought to the other side, then add in extra surface grade, you get side to side or end to end extremes.
For me, the loader side is most important..to keep in mind. The arms need to be fairly level with the grade when they are down. So I begin with some notion of how to achieve that goal. I don't set the loader side landing gear first to dictate the rail side height. Only to get an idea of where the rail side needs to be in relation to the loader side. Keeping the end goal in mind. First the main rail must be supported properly. End to end is easy if grade the length under the mill is fairly level If not, that may present the need to "average" the heights of the deck to level with the grade while keeping the loader side in mind. Getting the loader arms where they need to be as the deck is leveled is primary for me. They are the "control" points and the other points must be manipulated to keep the control points of the loader arms where they need to be.
All sides should be averaged so as to bring the deck into a reasonable working height and degree of level and...result in proper loader arm position. Some experience with terrain and the primitive landing gear should make your struggle seem minor. You can use dunnage, shims, and the handy bottle jack, as well as a small mattox to correct a bunch of tough terrain slope, if that spot is the only place you have.
Another factor to keep in mind is, all landing gear must be below deck cutting height when the deck is level. This may limit landing gear adjustment of dictate excavation. Whatever it takes to get that deck at working height while keeping the loader at proper position.
20 minutes is my best (setup and begin sawing) time. I confess it's taken me more than an hour to get the mill situated like I wanted in a poor location. Never regretted a moment of the extra time though.
If you're fighting your jacks that hard, you're doing it wrong. If you need to bring the loader side up 3", you should put 3" of planking down first and roll the tire up on them. Short of that, you can use your best friend/worst enemy, gravity, to your advantage and let the weight of the head help you run the jacks up. You can balance the head so there is zero weight on the jack you are trying to work.
They should come with FAO, couldn't cost much more. Steve
Your outriggers are stabilizers, not jacks.
Your first order of business is to level it side to side with boards under the wheel before you unhook. 2X8's or preferably 2X10's are the best for this. They need to be long enough so that you can place your wheel chocks fore & aft.
Your wheels should remain in firm contact with the ground to serve as additional means of stabilization.
Seems to me that raising the loader side tire that much could cause the lift arms to be well above grade. Mine will only go down so far before the loader side tire interferes with more travel. If his situation is the tire hanging by the springs 3" above grade after leveling, the deck had to be raised even more than 3" on that side. I wouldn't want either side to be that high.
It is not unusual to need to dig trenches, etc. for the loader arms and/or feet to settle into. That is just part of the setup on uneven ground. I do not know when nor why the loader side would ever be high because logs don't roll uphill. At least I do not set up that way.
You are trying to be perfect to set up the mill when you do not have to be. End to end is the critical as the weight needs to be on the ends. The mill is crowned in the centre, so that the log and the head will flatten as it saws the logs. The 4 centre jacks do not have to be load bearing. They are stabilizers. Hammer some wedges under them after sawing a few logs to take some of the weight. The tires need to be on the ground supporting the mill.
As MM stated 2x10 are perfect for side to side levelling under the wheels and I like mine to be high on the loading arm sides so the log rolls to the back stops.
Pardon my lack of "quote". I was replying to the comment regarding " If you need to bring the loader side up 3", you should put 3" of planking down first and roll the tire up on them'.
The OP apparently attempted to raise the "rail side" high enough to bring the deck level with the loader side as it sat at grade. Anyone who has operated a walk-along mill at that much extra height on the rail side will quickly see why I won't set up like that.
WoodMizer specifies a max of (10 degree) incline/slope/scalar, which is (17.6%) grade, and (one foot in 5 1/2 foot) gradient/vector. I've done all the digging and blocking I'm gonna do in places that were half that steep. BG
I just ordered the FAO kit from Ross over in ME. $1395.
I did have to dig in a little for the loader feet, especially to get them both in contact with supporting ground.
MM's point that the mill can be backed up on to blocking to level it out side-to-side is like a big duh for me. Why didn't I think of that? I learned a lesson here. Nothing can substitute for experience. Also that these are STABILIZERS, not intended to be JACKS.
I would have dug in the uphill side for the wheel too, but there's a big flat rock at the surface right where that wheel is sitting, and it must be at that spot to line up with the logs there on the ground. I have a very small area of "level" ground, with no room for a machine to move logs. My tractor with forks to offload will have to be up at the end by the hitch. These are my logs, at my home, not something I would want to be doing at somebody else's site. But it's good experience.
The outriggers are used for making coarse "jacking" adjustments of the sawmill. "Lift the weight from the locking pin using the jack
handle. Pull the locking pin to release the outrigger and lower the outrigger as necessary. Secure with the locking pin."
"Lower the outrigger" means the mill is elevated by jacking the outrigger down.
The operator manual instructs to use blocking in order to "always make sure the trailer (IE: tires) is supporting the sawmill frame when operating a sawmill with adjustable outriggers."
The FAO's provide (1 1/2") fine adjustment.
Another caution regarding the loader when setting the mill: If the loader feet are positioned below parallel with the deck, there is a tendency when lifting very large logs, for the feet to cause the mill to elevate and shift towards the loader side.
Quote from: Ben Cut-wright on April 22, 2024, 10:36:31 AMAnother caution regarding the loader when setting the mill: If the loader feet are positioned below parallel with the deck, there is a tendency when lifting very large logs, for the feet to cause the mill to elevate and shift towards the loader side.
I was wondering whether it was possible for a big log to create instability in the mill.
Not in the sense that I am interpreting from your question. A big log ain't gonna turn it over, but a big log rolling across the sawmill bed and hitting the side supports will shift the sawmill toward that side. Especially on a big job, I will have to readjust the outriggers. I have had the sawmill to almost "walk off" of my leveling boards and have to use the outriggers to raise the wheel off of the ground to reposition the boards. 2X10's give you some "wiggle room" which is why I prefer them.
I have also had the customer to use his loader to shift the sawmill tail end back toward the loader side.
The loader arms should remain as high up as possible but out of the head travel until there is NO chance of rolling off. This doesn't mean until the clamp is holding the log. This caution is probably known by everyone here, but I never miss an opportunity to point it out.
I try to make sure the logs a level or uphill from the loader arms. I will sometimes lay a couple of pieces of dunnage or slabs down to make a tract to toll the logs on. Normally I have to put 2-3 1X boards down under the rail side as mentioned earlier to raise it. It does not have to be level just straight. Of course if it is not level front to rear your power feed works harder and the head may want to roll back on its own. If it is too far out of level side to side it may put more strain on the debarker too.
The hardest part is lifting one end of the mill when you already have the jack down at the other end (DUUHHH) but nobody ever tries to do that. :uhoh: I make sure both ends are tight and take my Jack rod home with me as a security measure to harass thieves.
WVS, good tip on the jack rod going in the truck with you. Simple and easy theft stop. Not just any steel rod will work. Most are soft.
Sorry to say but any 3/4" rod will work in the jack - hopefully most thieves won't have one handy. I lost my jack handle and bought a 3' piece of rod stock at my local hardware and it works fine except it is too long to reach the drive side jacks. (Yes I could cut it off and it would work just like the factory one.)
Leaving a log on the mill and moving the head off the power strip is a much more secure technique to harass thieves and safeguard the mill.
I have no concerns about anyone stealing the sawmill, but I do regularly leave a log on the loading arms or even on the sawmill so that I am ready for the next morning's startup.
That way if the customer or tailgunner(s) are slow to arrive, I may have a log sawed and lumber ready to stack when they get there.
Howard,
What about getting a hitch ball lock? That would slow them down for sure. But keep a spare key in your truck!
Another option to consider to discourage someone from moving or removing your mill would be to take off the hitch. It is held on with two bolts. With the battery powered impacts it only takes a minute or so and you won't bump your knee if it is in the truck.
The LT50 has FAOs. If I were running the 35 now knowing what I know about FAOs, I would put one on the front and back. Possibly one on the loader side front, I tend to use that one to raise and lower when hitching and unhitching. The others are nice to have. The front FAO on the 50 sometimes runs out of travel before the front loader side one does.
I typically use the same mindset in leveling the sawmill that I use in leveling my travel trailer. Level left to right first before un hitching.
After pulling up on the blocks and level l to r, I unhitch and continue set up. With the LT 50 board return left to right level is a bit more important than if not using the return, boards tend to go down hill (left or right) on the return.
Like others I carry a variety of blocks for leveling including some 4x4 and 4x6 for the front or back.
Quote from: caveman on April 30, 2024, 10:46:21 AMAnother option to consider to discourage someone from moving or removing your mill would be to take off the hitch. It is held on with two bolts. With the battery powered impacts it only takes a minute or so and you won't bump your knee if it is in the truck.
That would be cheaper for sure.
I rarely leave my mill in an area that is not very secure anyway. Usually it is in someone's yard or gated pasture. I just take a few extra steps such as putting a padlock through the hitch, removing the jack bar and leaving a log on it. I take the gas and sometimes the lube tank with me to refill anyway. I used to use one of those little ball locks but it broke and I never replaced it.
I put a couple of appropriate sized hitch pins in my hitch on the mill. Not because I am worried about theft (mine probably hasn't left the yard in 5-6 years anyways) but because I get sick of hitting my shins on it😬
The only downside is trying to remember where I threw the hitch last time I took it off, after forgetting to remove it and hitting my shin on it😁