Small Yarder...

[Ljohnsaw]

Here is my situation.  I have 10 acres of which I have a 500' "forest" road that is suitable for my ATV.  So this gives me access to the upper 1/4 of my property.  I've used my 2wd tundra on it but it is very steep in a couple places and I had to get a running start to make it back up.  I have some logs I'd like to mill up and was contemplating bringing my mill down to them, somehow.  And then just have to haul timbers and lumber back up.  Far from ideal.  I have a big log arch but neither my ATV or my truck are up to the task of getting it back up the hill loaded.

Reading back over this I think I've about convinced my self I need to do something different.  Perusing CraigsList, I came across this:


 


 


 
Its described as a small yarder / tall winch. :D

Looks like a Wisconsin engine and is supposed to have 750' of 1/2" line.  My understanding of a yarder is there is a high line that is used to lift the logs up as you winch, correct?  My forest road is all windy so if I got this, I'd have to clear a straight shot down to the lower area.  This would also allow me to get some trees from the lowest most section of my property, another bonus.

I see a multi-pulley block on the top of the mast but what other items should there be with this?  I see some heavy cables with hooks to presumably tie it back to a big tree?

I suppose it would be good to use as a zip line!

Before I say what they are asking, what would you say its worth, assuming complete, running and the cable is good?

[doc henderson]

I have no experience with yarders but if you do not either, it could be a man killer!  If you have a windy road, can you get a regular winch and do 100 feet at a time, like from a tractor or your truck?  I assume it is a few thousand dollars.  so I guess it depends on if the wood from your property will pay for it and more.  and how many logs you have to move.
can you move the logs to the bottom of the hill with the arch, winch them up the hill on the arch and then hook on and move them to the mill?  might need a wheel to keep the tongue of the arch from digging in.

[doc henderson]

You can google and watch old episodes of ax men, and of course the drama was played up, but sounds like it can be dangerous.

[Ljohnsaw]

I have no experience with yarders but if you do not either, it could be a man killer!  If you have a windy road, can you get a regular winch and do 100 feet at a time, like from a tractor or your truck?  I assume it is a few thousand dollars.  so I guess it depends on if the wood from your property will pay for it and more.  and how many logs you have to move.
can you move the logs to the bottom of the hill with the arch, winch them up the hill on the arch and then hook on and move them to the mill?  might need a wheel to keep the tongue of the arch from digging in.

I realize the potential for it to go way south and will take the necessary precautions.  I do have an acquaintance who's family was in logging.  I'll probably hit him up as well.  I'm looking at a couple dozen trees with logs (30?) being in the 30' range.  I was thinking the highline type of hauling would be easier/faster/cleaner then a regular winch (which I don't have).  What is available to move with the arch is a small portion.  Most of the trees are on steep ground/side hill.  I've learned to fell them up hill so I don't destroy the wood - I need a way to pull them down or to one side.
(he's asking $1,000)

[doc henderson]

what do you currently pull your arch with?  the arch will keep them out of the dirt.  could make a sled for the tail end.  If you want to use your curvy road instead of a straight shot clearing, you may want to buck them to length to help get around the bend.  From the looks of the yarder, it may be prone to refurbish and maint. issues or in other words, unforeseen cost.  If you are just looking for an adventure, it looks like fun!  If you got a winch for your truck you could tow the arch to the base of the steep hill, unhook and drive to the top, then winch the arch and logs to the top, then tow home.  if I am understanding you topographical description.

[doc henderson]

 Looking back, I think you need a 4 wheel drive, 1 ton dually, and a ranch hand bumper with a 2 inch receiver built in.  That is what I have with fleet wiring to front and back, with a cheap 12k winch from HF on a 2 inch receiver mount.  I can tow or use winch from front or back of truck.  in 4 wheel drive low it is like a tractor, and the weight allows pulling qhite a load, and can also fasten to a tree from other end when winching.  Wish I lived closer, this sounds like a fun challenge.

[Old Greenhorn]

It's really cute! If it weren't on the left coast, I'd ask to rent it from you for a month. We could have some fun with that.  ;D ;D ;D

[Bruno of NH]

I would put a $700 offer in on it.
Set it up and run it. I like the idea.

[Ljohnsaw]

Looking back, I think you need a 4 wheel drive, 1 ton dually, and a ranch hand bumper with a 2 inch receiver built in.  That is what I have with fleet wiring to front and back, with a cheap 12k winch from HF on a 2 inch receiver mount.  I can tow or use winch from front or back of truck.  in 4 wheel drive low it is like a tractor, and the weight allows pulling quite a load, and can also fasten to a tree from other end when winching.  Wish I lived closer, this sounds like a fun challenge.

Yeah, if wishes were fishes, or something like that.  I'm just building my cabin, not logging for profit.  Just trying to use my trees before I just have to drop them because of fire risk.  No monies in the budget for such a nice toy.  And like I said, no winch at the moment.  I was thinking of making a gas powered winch like KBietz did - but this is already done, if it works still.
So far, I've used my arch in conjunction with my SkyTrak.  I chain up big logs to the arch (too long or too heavy for the SkyTrak alone - 9k lift), use a set of log tongs on the other end and "drive" the arch home 1/2 to 1 mile.  Anything smaller and on the main road, I use the SkyTrak to load my little flatbed and tow that with the Tundra.
There's a chunk of metal on this yarder but I'm thinking I could haul it around and stage it with my ATV (660 lb unit, 550cc).

[Ljohnsaw]

I would put a $700 offer in on it.
Set it up and run it. I like the idea.

I sent them an email with a list of questions.  It's about an hour drive from me and the tires need to be roadworthy for me to get it home.  My flatbed is under 10' of snow at the moment and an hour in the other direction.

[doc henderson]

I was trying to think of safe ways that might cost less money, but if you get the thing and it works, you can prob sell it for what you have in it and get the use for free.  And a few stories and pics to share with the rest of us!

[dgdrls]

Hi ljohnsaw,

From what I see you'll need a mainline and some type of carriage/pulley block to get the logs off the ground.
The unit pictured looks like a skidding winch only.  Is there a second line to work with?

I don't think I'd try to pull 30"x30' logs on a 1/2" skyline

D

[Ljohnsaw]

dgdrls,
Thanks for the insight.  I am waiting on a response.  If you look at the last picture, there looks like there is a spool in-line with the crank shaft of the engine.  I was thinking that might be main line?  Don't know.  I'm ok with just skidding, might use my arch to keep the end up and move easier or a plastic barrel as a sled but a skyline would be sweet.  Kind of thought about using self-releasing snatch blocks up high to help lift and steer it up the road.

[Puffergas]

Seems like I've seen one of these posted before. Looks like a good start.

[Puffergas]

Here is the one I remember:

Winch ideas in Forestry and Logging

There is a video of it working. Remember to work safe when building or working on machines.

[Ljohnsaw]

Thanks for resurrecting that.  I remembered watching that and wishing...  Now if only this guy would respond to my email!

[Riwaka]

Is there any helicopter logging in your area, where your job could be included with another larger job within a few minutes flying time?
Work out the weight of each log etc
Still big skidders in california? 
848L John Deer - YouTube

Pulling the logs from the hollow with ground based machinery.
Probably more realistic to hire a skidder or dozer (even a reasonable size ag tractor) to pull the logs out of the hollow? or use a contractor with skidder/ dozer/ shovel etc depending on cost.  
X# number of logs per turn, distance of turn, average time of turn etc work out estimated time of hire x cost per hour of hire plus additional costs of hire etc = total cost of hire.
Hire rubber tired loader/ excavator with grapple if logs are bigger than what a  hired skid steer with forks can handle to load logs on mill.  


If leaving the logs in the hollow.
Depending on how big the mill is, any good neighbour's 4x4 tractors to pull the Tundra with the mill attached back out of the hollow, once the logs are milled?  or just pull mill in and out with tractor with hitch etc.

[starmac]

Interesting, My understanding of logging with a yarder that lifts the logs, involves spar trees and quite a bit of riging, not sure it would be worth it for 30 trees.
That rig may well just winch them out for you, if you can't cut a straight path, some snatch blocks would work to wind the log up your existing road.

[Iwawoodwork]

With a good 1/2 inch cable you could use it as a skyline if you could get it high enough that it did not have to be bowstring tight (deflection) and put a rider block on it. attach a choker to the block,  and raise/tighten or slack/lower the skyline to provide lift to get the end of the log off the ground for skidding. a second drum with cable would be good for a skidding line, or if the ground is not to steep your sky trac could pull it to your landing area.  Or you just pull the line up the hill with your ATV and ground skid to your landing but then will need to clean or build a debarker.

[Ljohnsaw]

Here is a short video of my "forest road".  I start out on my leach field.  This is on a shelf about half way down my property but where I will be retrieving a number of large aspen and cedars and maybe a few pine.  It is about 1 acre of flat, VERY heavily wooded.  At the 45 second mark is where I start up the hill that the logs would need to travel.

ATV trail

[Riwaka]

Narrow width skidder with already scuffed tires. (might use and excavator to pick up a few rocks - split a few rocks using geobreak or dexpan etc - expanding grout if the area is still dry and the rocks are not sacred to 1st peoples etc.
Might cut the logs down to half length prior to hauling, depending how long they are.
The skytrak might be useful if still around to sort with.

[Skeans1]

From what I saw that's pretty flat nothing there for lift of the cable would be an issue without making lift to start with. Looks like pretty nice gentle cat ground, does anyone around there rent cats with an arch and winch?

[Don P]

I've used a fair amount of dexpan, it takes a large Hilti drill at a minimum ~$1500, the dexpan and a young buck to run the Hilti is not a bad idea. I ran it horizontal up in a workbasket all afternoon yesterday while thinking, this is a young man's tool :D.

The bitterroot yarder info might give you some ideas on how to rig that thing if you go that route;
https://www.fs.fed.us/t-d/pubs/htmlpubs/htm83512305/

[doc henderson]

can you take a measure you steep part in % or ratio.  this doesn't look bad on video, but maybe we are not getting the big picture.  the video is helpful.  nice piece of heaven you got there.

[Ljohnsaw]

The video does NOT do the hill justice :-\  At the start of the climb, there is a 30-40' section that is close to 45° - VERY steep.  That levels off to about 25° for a good bit.  Then the hill is going on around 15°.  The design spec on my SkyTrak say no more than 12° front to back and 22° side to side.  I've exceeded that a bit and its a bit unnerving to feel that tilt on a 25k pound machine - especially when it begins to side slip