Small Yarder...

doc henderson · March 05, 2019, 09:48:08 AM

is your telehandler 4 wheel drive? I agree with a prev. post that you could manage the steepest part of the hill in other ways. the reason I had suggested a winch is it could be used for other things. might even mount to the back of the skytrak fork area/guard and use it like that small yarder. 12,000 pound winch HF on sale for less than 300$ and rated best value by 4 wheel mag. do you need most of your logs full length? can you post a google earth view without location info. sounds like you would have to remove a lot of trees to get a strait line to the top. that would certainly change the look of you property, kinds like a chair lift on a mountain at a ski resort. you need a long trailer you can steer the front and back like the wind turbine blade trailers! :laugh:

RPF2509 · March 05, 2019, 06:39:40 PM

To run a skyline you need two drums - that machine only has one. Its rigged for yarding direct with a bit of lift from the tower. Once you get 50' or so from the machine, the lift will be negligible. That cable looks light for ground leading big logs even if they are short. With ground lead, every boulder and stump will be a hangup point. Looks more like a winch system for a firewood cutter. $1k seems spendy for what it is.

RPF2509 · March 05, 2019, 06:44:59 PM

Looking at it again I'd say the angle iron on that is too small to withstand much stress. Like I said its probably a firewood cutter winch. A 16" diameter log would likely max it out.

RPF2509 · March 05, 2019, 07:39:45 PM

ljohn, really what you want is a local with a skidder or small dozer. For the price of that winch, the right machine could sort out your access trail and get your logs in a day. Yarding logs on steep slopes is not for the faint of heart or the inexperienced, and sometimes its best to pay for it. Of course availability and timing are the rub now as you are buried in snow, and come summer everyone will be busy. Still now would be the time to start looking for someone local as moving a machine from out of the area would not make sense for a small job like this. Calfire might take an interest at what you are doing if you hire someone to do the work. Personal use is one thing, hiring someone could elevate it to commercial - depends on the inspector and how many trees you are taking. Sometimes don't ask don't tell works best; other times the hypothetical neighbor with a few trees to cut needs some advice works. In any case, Dept of Fish and Wildlife as well as Water Quality might want to get involved as well. No creeks or nests makes it easier. How do your neighbors feel about what you are doing - one wrong phone call can bring the agencies swarming. You can do a lot with a 10% dead - dying diseased exemption and a lot more with a firebreak exemption. Contact your local Calfire forest practice inspector for options.

doc henderson · March 05, 2019, 08:27:05 PM

ljohn, may have just misspoke, but for safety I have to comment, I think the safe angles for your skytrak may be reversed. Can tolerate steeper angle front to back and less side to side. i.e. 22° and 12°. look MM I am using the degree symbols again!!! @Magicman

Ljohnsaw · March 05, 2019, 08:51:25 PM

Quote from: doc henderson on March 05, 2019, 08:27:05 PM
ljohn, may have just misspoke, but for safety I have to comment, I think the safe angles for your skytrak may be reversed. Can tolerate steeper angle front to back and less side to side. i.e. 22° and 12°. look MM I am using the degree symbols again!!! @Magicman

Actually, I thought the same thing when I looked in the book. But, the SkyTrak is capable of load leveling side to side. I've been on some nasty side slope and can make the cab almost level. Its just that the tires start to slide on me! When I try to climb too steep, it just don't go - there may be some issues with the hydro-static transmission. Great on level with tons of motive power.

Ljohnsaw · March 05, 2019, 09:07:59 PM

Well, too late for the comments ;) I had $200 burning a hole in my pocket from selling my rebar bender/cutter (that I picked up for $40 IIRC). So with another $600 cash, its mine

:

I saw what he was moving (pretty respectable logs) and he also used it to haul motorists back to the road when they slip off in the snow

A quick $50 each, he says - lot better then a tow truck. I doubt he has any insurance!

Anyhow, it has a 14hp B&S with a gear reduction box running a triple belt to a large pulley attached to a small pinion gear meshed to about a 20" gear that has a big toothed engagement thing connected to the drum. So, stepped down pretty well. There is one lever for the drum brake, one for the drum engagement and one for the belt tension (to make it pull). It is just like the machine linked above in post #14. It has "Sewer 1102" stenciled on the side so apparently use for sewer cleaning. There is a shadow of a circular emblem from whatever district it belonged too in the past. I counted wraps and measured diameters and calculated there is about 750' of cable left on the drum. He whacked off 200-250' because there was a burr that scratched him :

I think I would have tried a torch or a file to knock it off first.

It looks to have been very well greased/lubricated. It just has a funky rattle can yellow overcoat. I'll probably sand it down and give it my silver coating I like. It is a pull start but starts up right away and run nice and smooth.

Ljohnsaw · March 05, 2019, 09:23:52 PM

Quote from: RPF2509 on March 05, 2019, 06:39:40 PM
To run a skyline you need two drums - that machine only has one. Its rigged for yarding direct with a bit of lift from the tower. Once you get 50' or so from the machine, the lift will be negligible. That cable looks light for ground leading big logs even if they are short. With ground lead, every boulder and stump will be a hangup point. Looks more like a winch system for a firewood cutter. $1k seems spendy for what it is.

He used an old car hood as a skidding plate. I'll likely do the same, maybe laying logs down as a corduroy road to aid in skidding. Or I may use my log arch with an additional wheel up front so it doesn't dig in. I will be doing in stages. I have a big flat area to drop and drag to the base of the hill/road. Then I have about 60-80' pull up the steepest part of the road and it turns sharp there. The next is a gentle S curve that is not too steep and about 100-140' stopping at a sharp turn, where I can drive my SkyTrak to retrieve them.

Yeah, the frame is not the stoutest. I was thinking of running the cable out over the tower pulley, down to a far tree around a snatch block, back around the tower pulley and out to traveler. So, there would be two aerial cables supporting the traveler. The log would be partially lifted as is comes up the cables. But that's just a dream...

Also, most of the large rocks/small boulders seen on my ATV trip have been used around the base of my foundation as seen in My Timber Frame Build

doc henderson · March 05, 2019, 09:27:58 PM

sounds like you are having a blast. can prob. sell it for that, if and when you are done with it. congrats!!! 8)

Old Greenhorn · March 05, 2019, 09:29:19 PM

Well, the very best of luck with this adventure! Of course, we will expect follow up reports and perhaps a video when you have it hauling logs. This is pretty neat.

Ljohnsaw · March 06, 2019, 12:58:47 AM

Now I have to wait a week for the weather - rain for the next week or so... More snow up on the property. So, when the snow finally melts...I have tons of chain but no chokers. I do have some of those big hooks (not sure what they are called) that don't hook the chain links. Maybe use one of those to act like a choker since it would slip and tighten up? Or just use regular chain and hook it as tight as possible?

doc henderson · March 06, 2019, 08:02:59 AM

john if you use chain, you can go around the log twice so there is a section of the chain that can tighten with tension. or instead of hooking the clevis to the "pulling" side of the chain, go around that chain and hook back to itself so the chain loop can slide and tighten the hold on the log. you can buy the connector online to make chokers. good luck

Old Greenhorn · March 06, 2019, 08:16:39 AM

Chain choker (slip) hooks work really well for me and don't drop off the chain like a chain hook will. If you don't have slip hooks, Doc's idea of a double wrap can be helpful, but it seems like it is always a crap-shoot as the whether the hook will not slip off before it settles in and gets loaded. I actually prefer the chain chokers over cable, easier on the hands. YMMV

btulloh · March 06, 2019, 09:12:43 AM

Get a couple chokers from Bailey's. You won't regret it. They're cheap and they work better than chain chokers. It's worth having a couple in your kit. Just being able to push the cable with the bell under a log or through a tangle saves a lot of aggravation. Plus they're really useful for choking a big bunch of limbs when you're cleaning up.

Chain chokers are fine too but they're really not as handy as the cable chokers. It's good to have options.

Congrats on the new piece of equipment.

Don P · March 06, 2019, 09:28:59 PM

Most chain comes with grab hooks rather than slip hooks, but you can make it slip easily enough. Run the end of the chain around the standing part and then hook it back to itself making a little eye that the standing, pulling, part can slip through, then it'll choke.

Ljohnsaw · March 30, 2019, 12:49:39 PM

Little update. The "yarder" is really made to pull straight up (out of a sewer access hole). The frame is not made to take a side load. The top arch actually is pinned to fold down over the trailer to get through a small garage door. The PO said he had a snatch block added to a bottom brace piece to facilitate dragging logs or cars from ditches. But someone stole that. So, looking on CL and eBay, I didn't want to spend $150 to $500 on a snatch block. I have some scrap around so I'm fabbing up some blocks. First, I had some 6" well pipe that I cut three rings from. Next, I have some 1/4" plate that I need to make some side pieces (9") for the sheave (pulley) and the side plates for the block.

I have a cutting torch but my hand is not that steady to make something nice. So I rigged up this clamp-on circle cutting guide:

Then, I drill a 1/4" hole at the center and cut away!

This is the ugly side with the slag before I knocked it off with a hammer. They actually came out pretty decent. I've since cut the side plates and will post more pictures when I get it together.

Ljohnsaw · March 30, 2019, 09:03:32 PM

Finished the prototype - the first of three.

I might bang on it a bit to flare out the pulley sides. I originally intended to cut the top pipe so I could put a sling on it with a pin but decided to leave it as is for strength. The pin (bolt) that is up there is just a spare for the pulley in case I loose it or bend it. Just need to clean up a little weld spatter and paint it.

I welded a long piece of 3/4" black pipe in the center of the pulley. Then I welded the side plates to that along with the top pipe. I used a hacksaw to cut the pulley free and then welded in a curved top plate to make the frame rigid. This should be strong enough to use with the yarder to haul out some logs.

LeeB · March 30, 2019, 11:13:48 PM

Looks pretty good but do not get under any load you have lifted. Check your sheave pin often and grease it every now and then.

Ljohnsaw · March 31, 2019, 12:05:02 AM

Quote from: LeeB on March 30, 2019, 11:13:48 PMdo not get under any load you have lifted

Since this will be about 1 foot off the ground, I should be pretty safe! :D Point well taken.

Quote from: LeeB on March 30, 2019, 11:13:48 PMCheck your sheave pin often and grease it every now and then.

I wanted to put in a zerk. I could drill the bolt and put a zerk in the head side but since I will be taking the block apart every time I want to put the cable on it, I'll just grease it then.

thecfarm · March 31, 2019, 08:43:15 AM

Your cuting skills are great!!!

gdaddy01 · March 31, 2019, 05:39:57 PM

that looks good and is a good ideal , I too was looking at the price of pulleys , you saved a lot of money .

Ljohnsaw · March 31, 2019, 06:12:55 PM

Quote from: thecfarm on March 31, 2019, 08:43:15 AM
Your cutting skills are great!!!

Thanks, but not really. Notice there are very few straight cuts - on purpose! I used my arc cutting attachment that took out all the waviness. Look close at the straight cuts and you will see what I mean :-\

Ljohnsaw · March 31, 2019, 06:15:50 PM

Quote from: gdaddy01 on March 31, 2019, 05:39:57 PM
you saved a lot of money .

Only because my time is free.. ;) Probably 3 or 4 hours each by the time I'm done. What's a fabricator/welder make? $50/hr??? So $200/pulley :D

thecfarm · March 31, 2019, 07:23:33 PM

Don't ever turn down a compliment. ;D There are plenty of people that will put you down. Or try too. ;) There is always the ones that can do it quicker,better,cheaper. :

Don P · March 31, 2019, 07:52:52 PM

Quote from: ljohnsaw on March 31, 2019, 06:15:50 PM
Quote from: gdaddy01 on March 31, 2019, 05:39:57 PM
you saved a lot of money .
Only because my time is free.. ;) Probably 3 or 4 hours each by the time I'm done. What's a fabricator/welder make? $50/hr??? So $200/pulley :D

Try $75, I just hired one, you made big money ;D. After busting too many cheap ones I got lucky in a trade, I've got a $600 sheave here, it used to hoist guys and bricks up those 300' industrial chimneys. It'll outlast me but it is a handful to move.