Lumber prices too high

[nativewolf]

Our horse fencing sold out, we didn't cut close to what we wanted but every stick sold.  bark on spots?  No problem we'll take it, too thin?- no problem, too thick- no problem.    It was ridiculous.  Our only problem has been taking forever to figure out the shafts were the problem and then blowing up a gearbox. By the time we really got going it was time to go back to cutting trees.

[Nebraska]

Yes but the bugs are worked out for the next whack at it. The next stretch will go better. Glad the startup venture worked for you.

[BradMarks]

Green DF 2x4x8 #2 & better, $3.86 yesterday, down from nearly $7 earlier in the summer and only twice as much as it was before the crud 

[IndiLina]

Our horse fencing sold out, we didn't cut close to what we wanted but every stick sold.  bark on spots?  No problem we'll take it, too thin?- no problem, too thick- no problem.    It was ridiculous.  Our only problem has been taking forever to figure out the shafts were the problem and then blowing up a gearbox. By the time we really got going it was time to go back to cutting trees.

Which species and dimensions did you cut for horse fencing? Is there an industry standard for horse fencing?

[mike_belben]

its gotta keep a horse in.  

;D

[btulloh]

1x6 white oak is typical in the east. Sometimes people use pine thats been  painted or sealed. Don't want PT around horses. I see horse fence that has a sealer that looks like creosote but it surely is not. Different in different parts of the country. I'm seeing a lot of horse fence from the pvc forest these days$$$$$.

@Brad_bb would have some good input on fencing horses. 

[Brad_bb]

@Brad_bb would have some good input on fencing horses.

I'm not an expert.  I only know all that we went through deciding what we were going to do for horse fencing.  There are so many different options, many in conjunction with electric, and some not.  What you do for outdoor stall run fences versus paddock fences are varied as well.  It varies alot with budget too.  I'd say it would be a real gamble to try to make something specifically targeted for horse fencing.  If it were a board that could be used for horse fencing or many other applications...giving you many options and possibilities to sell. Maybe 5/4 1x6 grade white oak with no sapwood?  Some people might buy the same in pine or larch or ?, if they are very price sensitive.  But then, it's not going to last nearly as long.  I knew a guy who was collecting pallets and any such scrap pallet wood he could get for free to make pig pens.  I suspect he'll be remaking those in a year or less.
I've seen pen and pasture fences made with 4/4, 5/4, and 8/4.  Three board, four board, five board and six board fences.  I've seen PVC, fiberglass(from the natural gas industry) and steel pipe (also from gas/oil industry).  Our stall runs are made from 2x6, 1/4" wall steel tubing and 6x6 1/4" steel posts.  It was very expensive and could probably hold back elephants.  But it was either that or a nice sports car.  
  For our pens, we use 50 year treated 6 and 8 inch posts.  On the outside we used PVC coated tensile wire (Very thick coated that could not hurt horses. The bottom three wires are probably 1/2 inch diameter and the top is a 5" wide band with two wires embedded in them.) This is more for looks for people.  We have a single electric rope line on the top on the inside at eye level so the horses can see it.   Alternatively you could just use electric rope on the posts (We like Endura brand electric rope).  You can also make rope gates using tension spring handles.  Endura is much more economical and a very good solution.
With horse fences you have to be very careful with the height of your bottom board.  Too low and a horse can lay down or roll up against the fence and get their leg under and not be able to get up or out, or break a leg.  

[Brad_bb]

I was at Lowe's today and I saw 2x4's x8 for $3.49.  Before Covid I think they were $3.09.

[IndiLina]

@Brad_bb would have some good input on fencing horses.

I'm not an expert.  I only know all that we went through deciding what we were going to do for horse fencing.  There are so many different options, many in conjunction with electric, and some not.  What you do for outdoor stall run fences versus paddock fences are varied as well.  It varies alot with budget too.  I'd say it would be a real gamble to try to make something specifically targeted for horse fencing.  If it were a board that could be used for horse fencing or many other applications...giving you many options and possibilities to sell. Maybe 5/4 1x6 grade white oak with no sapwood?  Some people might buy the same in pine or larch or ?, if they are very price sensitive.  But then, it's not going to last nearly as long.  I knew a guy who was collecting pallets and any such scrap pallet wood he could get for free to make pig pens.  I suspect he'll be remaking those in a year or less.
I've seen pen and pasture fences made with 4/4, 5/4, and 8/4.  Three board, four board, five board and six board fences.  I've seen PVC, fiberglass(from the natural gas industry) and steel pipe (also from gas/oil industry).  Our stall runs are made from 2x6, 1/4" wall steel tubing and 6x6 1/4" steel posts.  It was very expensive and could probably hold back elephants.  But it was either that or a nice sports car.  
 For our pens, we use 50 year treated 6 and 8 inch posts.  On the outside we used PVC coated tensile wire (Very thick coated that could not hurt horses. The bottom three wires are probably 1/2 inch diameter and the top is a 5" wide band with two wires embedded in them.) This is more for looks for people.  We have a single electric rope line on the top on the inside at eye level so the horses can see it.   Alternatively you could just use electric rope on the posts (We like Endura brand electric rope).  You can also make rope gates using tension spring handles.  Endura is much more economical and a very good solution.
With horse fences you have to be very careful with the height of your bottom board.  Too low and a horse can lay down or roll up against the fence and get their leg under and not be able to get up or out, or break a leg.  

Thanks for those details. I'm looking to mill up some of my timber and was curious about the market. But what you said about not trying to mill specifically for that market since the specs vary makes sense. 

[SwampDonkey]

Letter today from Robin Lee at Lee Valley Woodworking Tools.

"Dear Customer,

This time last year, I wrote an email to convey our uncertainty about what the fall would look like. This year, we have a much better idea of what to expect, as the hangover from COVID-19 continues to disrupt the economy.

We are now seeing lead times for some products that exceed one year, if our order even gets accepted – and not all do. International shipping continues to be an issue, with unprecedented backlogs throughout the supply chain, and costs that are several times what they were pre-COVID.

You can expect to see some supply shortages through the fall season and can count on many prices increasing. Most industries are also facing labor shortages (we're hiring too!), and this will affect the ability to handle spikes in volume or deliver services on a timely basis.

Within the next few weeks, we will be releasing our Christmas catalog, which is uncomfortably early for us. Again this year, we are recommending that you shop as early as possible, as we will not have the opportunity to replenish inventory before Christmas. For those who shop in-store, we also recommend ordering online and picking up in-store – that way, you know the products you need are waiting for you, and it helps us ensure that we can serve you as quickly as possible, at the time of your choosing.

I would also like to take this time to thank you all for your patience, understanding and support over the past year – it has made a real difference to our staff during trying times."

[stavebuyer]

Letter today from Robin Lee at Lee Valley Woodworking Tools.

"Dear Customer,

This time last year, I wrote an email to convey our uncertainty about what the fall would look like. This year, we have a much better idea of what to expect, as the hangover from COVID-19 continues to disrupt the economy.

We are now seeing lead times for some products that exceed one year, if our order even gets accepted – and not all do. International shipping continues to be an issue, with unprecedented backlogs throughout the supply chain, and costs that are several times what they were pre-COVID.

You can expect to see some supply shortages through the fall season and can count on many prices increasing. Most industries are also facing labor shortages (we're hiring too!), and this will affect the ability to handle spikes in volume or deliver services on a timely basis.

Within the next few weeks, we will be releasing our Christmas catalog, which is uncomfortably early for us. Again this year, we are recommending that you shop as early as possible, as we will not have the opportunity to replenish inventory before Christmas. For those who shop in-store, we also recommend ordering online and picking up in-store – that way, you know the products you need are waiting for you, and it helps us ensure that we can serve you as quickly as possible, at the time of your choosing.

I would also like to take this time to thank you all for your patience, understanding and support over the past year – it has made a real difference to our staff during trying times."

I can't bring myself to "like" the comment but Robin Lee called it as it is.

[doc henderson]

I appreciate his honesty and reporting facts beyond his control.

[leeroyjd]

Happy Birthday Doc!

[metalspinner]

2x6x16 #2 SPF $15. Lowe's, Maryville TN

[nativewolf]

I have no idea what a 2x6x16' used to run but I can only compare to our oak 1x6x16' at $14.  Shake, knots, and all.  Lets just say fence boards are not structural grade.

[WDH]

2x6x16 #2 SPF $15. Lowe's, Maryville TN

Including tax and the way that I calculate board feet, that is $1.15/bf.
The big commercial pine mills saw their 2x stock at a target thickness of 1.75" or a little less, then kiln dry to 19% and plane to a finished thickness of 1.5 inches.  Therefore when I calculate bf in a store bought 2x, I calculate it thus:
6" wide x 16 feet long x 1.75 inches thick = 14 bf.  
$15 x 1.07 (our sales tax rate) = $16.05 divided by 14 bf = $1.15.

[mike_belben]

the tax in TN is 9.75%  

i used to deliver stuff to that HD from the pressure treater in stony point NC.  

[Satamax]

That's it, madness has touched France. 


I was doing an invoice this morning. 

A batten, 6x4 cm. About 1.5"x2.5" has raised a smidge more than 52% 

My local sawmill has raised it's prices 14% and some change. 

Not fun! 

I have to invoice a door, with a window in.  It's more or less a shutter. She told me "do it" I'll pay whatever. 

10 hours work, easy. 204€ of wood, if i charge as i should, 88 of security window, 77 of hinges. I haven't looked at the lock yet. I bet she'll cringe. And i'm cheap. 

[SwampDonkey]

2x6 x 16' #2 and better still double it was 3 years ago, but same lumber same company in Yarmouth only $3 more than 3 years ago. Gouge NB'ers.

[mike_belben]

Prices are falling here now that the knee jerk, brainless reaction crowd has had the orders filled and has left the building.

Prices had about tripled but are settling toward a doubling which is the exact right thing when the money supply in circulation has doubled. The market still works very well.  Its the govt thats broken. 

[LeeB]

77 of hinges

77 euro for hinges? Must be some fancy hinges.

[Satamax]

Dunno if you call those hinges.  11.53€ a piece, x3, plus margin and fitting, plus my taxes.

[quilbilly]

Dunno if you call those hinges.  11.53€ a piece, x3, plus margin and fitting, plus my taxes.

So when can the wife and I visit and take a look at those mts in the background. That looks like a real pretty place.

[LeeB]

Dunno if you call those hinges.  11.53€ a piece, x3, plus margin and fitting, plus my taxes.

That makes more sense. I thought maybe you were talking about standard leaf hinges.

[Satamax]

Dunno if you call those hinges.  11.53€ a piece, x3, plus margin and fitting, plus my taxes.

So when can the wife and I visit and take a look at those mts in the background. That looks like a real pretty place.

Well, whenever you want. I made a friend on the MIMF many years back. Who came all the way from socal, to visit! :D And another one from South Africa.

Here's another view.