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Planting seedlings

Started by Exador, December 20, 2005, 09:15:35 AM

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Exador

I have a small plot of recreational property (2.6 Ac.) in southern Oregon. The property is at Bly mountain summit about 5000 feet. The property is well timbered except for an area about 100' x 200'. I would like to put some Incense Cedar and/or Doug Fir in the space. I plan to use 9"-1' plugs. First question is if I plant in early spring and only have the opportunity to water once or twice within 2-3 days will they survive? Second question, how close together should I plant? These may seem like simple questions but I have never tried any kind of re-forestation project before this. Thanks

Tom

welcome aboard, Exador!


A forester with knowledge of your area will find you shortly, I'll bet.  :)

SwampDonkey

I was gonna jump right in, but I am of the same opinion as Tom expressed. I do know from experiece on the left coast that they space trees wider than over here on the right coast. And as far as watering, it depends on the spring snow melt. Some springs can be dry from lack of snow. In my experience if you plant as early as possible you don't have to worry about water. I'm not so sure I'de get away with that if I was planting in a dry area like the Okanogan Valley. ;D
"No amount of belief makes something a fact." James Randi

1 Thessalonians 5:21

2020 Polaris Ranger 570 to forward firewood, Husqvarna 555 XT Pro, Stihl FS560 clearing saw and continuously thinning my ground, on the side. Grow them trees. (((o)))

jon12345

You could probably put some snow or ice near them, so when it melted it would water the seedlings.  They also got stuff you can put in the soil that stores water, and will continue to store water until the next rain or watering.  Here is one, maybe someone here has tried it.

http://www.soilmoist.com/index.html
A.A.S. in Forest Technology.....Ironworker

Tom

I have a call in to Tillaway.  He'll know something. :)

IndyIan

I can't say I'm an expert in planting trees in your area, but I've put in quite a few here in ontario.  I think you'll be fine watering them when you can, once in the first few days is often alot better than they would get normally.  Also you want all the roots in the ground, no stray ones sticking out...  Also plant the tree at the level that it was in the ground before, not higher or lower. 
Have fun,
Ian

Onthesauk

I'm a ways north of you and not nearly that much elevation but in NW Washington we hold off planting until we've had at least one good freeze and try not to plant any later then late Feb, early March.  We don't have to worry much about water but some will not make it if you plant much later then that up here.

For the most part replant is done on 10 foot centers, believe that's the requirement by DNR on replants.  That's for fir, cedar and hemlock. 
John Deere 3038E
Sukuki LT-F500

Don't attribute irritating behavior to malevolence when mere stupidity will suffice as an explanation.

Tillaway

100' by 200' openning is not very big.  What is growing around it?  Incense cedar comes in on its own quite well.  Southern Oregon has real problems with brush.  What is growing on the site you want to plant now?  Are the seedling you want to plant from the correct seed zone and elevation?  What is the source of your seedlings?  What is the aspect ( which way does the property face eg. North, South, Southwest, etc.)?

Usually a 100' X 200' hole in a stand can regenerate on its own if there is a local seed source and the site is not fully occupied by another plant.  If brush or hardwoods occupy the site then site prep will be needed, seedling planted, and ongoing  brush control measures will have to be taken until the seedlings are "free to grow".  Spacing could be anything you want, usually 10'X10' or 12'X12' is used.  Be sure to tube the seedlings and if you are planting on a south aspect maybe a shade card will be of benefit. Plugs are a great way to go be sure to select seedlings heavy to roots and a smaller crown.  The problem with plugs is that the tops can get a little too tall and be out of balance with the roots.  These tend to not do well, particularlly so in dry areas.  Careful selection of planting spots will help your success, north side of stumps and down logs for example.  Watering is not needed if you plant correctly.   Plant as soon as the ground thaws, if frozen, or as soon as the snow melts enough to expose the planting area.  Expect deer problems and rabbits and gophers are a real pest at times.

Over all you need to know the seed zone and elevation, to buy the right seedlings. Bly mountain summit is closer to Roseburg than Grantspass if I remeber correctly so talk to the local Stewardship Forester at the nearest ODF office.  They will help you out for free.

Ooops... almost forgot the most important question, why is there nothing growing there now?  Have trees grown there before?  Holes like this are common so if there are no stumps or signs of trees having grown there before chances are good that they won't grow now.
Making Tillamook Bay safe for bait; one salmon at a time.

robotguy

exodor .
there is a seedling nursery in klamath falls that grows seedlings for that area , as your  land is about 25 30 miles from there & in about that elavation you may want to check with the soil & conversation district there in k-falls  i dont know the address but they are located on south 6 th street in klamath falls. i went there once time checking on some info for my forestry robot i am working on.  the forester there probably will be able to help you there.   

merry x-mas !!!!   robotguy 

SwampDonkey

So tell us about this 'forestry robot'. Create a new thread. Pictures and captions appreciated by all. ;D
"No amount of belief makes something a fact." James Randi

1 Thessalonians 5:21

2020 Polaris Ranger 570 to forward firewood, Husqvarna 555 XT Pro, Stihl FS560 clearing saw and continuously thinning my ground, on the side. Grow them trees. (((o)))

crtreedude

One thing to remember in planting seedlings, particularly if it is in a Jiffy pot (I have no idea what you all use up there, but some of ours come in Jiffy pots)

Don't let any of the netting, or pot if you are using a pot, show on the surface. It will act like a wick and dry out the seedling.

We plant after the ground is soaked and when the regular rains set in - this gives us about 6 months of daily rain for the trees to be established - we only really need 2 months they say.

But, I am almost certain my experience isn't worth much to you. For about 8 months, we get between 8 to 10 inches of rain every month.  :o
So, how did I end up here anyway?

Larry

I've used Terra-Sorb...a polymer that fixes water to help bare root seedlings get past a dry spell.  Available from almost anybody in the tree planting business www.forestry-suppliers.com comes to mind quick.

Don't know if it would help in your location but here in the midwest most tree planters consider it very cheap insurance.  Maybe Tillaway could comment if needed in your location.
Larry, making useful and beautiful things out of the most environmental friendly material on the planet.

We need to insure our customers understand the importance of our craft.

Exador

I placed some photos of the land in my album. I believe it was logged back in the 40s-50s. I have found some large stumps. Mostly Fir and Cedar now. I don't really know the history of the place. One local told me it was a large ranch that was divided up and sold off in the 60s. It is about 220' x 550'. I slopes south at about 2 degrees with the 220' feet fronting a gravel road. I don't want to plant to harvest timber, just to keep it natural and able to support wildlife. Lots of deer and rabbits so I think I will need mesh for protection. A special thanks to everyone who posted here. I have lived in the city all of my life and this has become a special getaway place for me.  I hope to be able to build a cabin and spend more time there upon retirement.

Ron Scott

Yes, would like to hear about the forester-robot??
~Ron

Tillaway

The plugs do not have containers but those little pots do wick out moisture.  Check with the Stewardship forester out of the ODF office in K-falls if they are the nearest.  They can put you on the track of a good seedling source.  They will also visit the site.  Getting seedlings established in that area can be tough if we have a drought year.  Are there any stumps in the openning you want to plant?  If you don't have naturals trying to establish themselves then getting your seedlings to grow can be tough.  You may have a harsh microsite that will not grow anything.

If the rest of the property has trees and you want to just attract wildlife then I would say do not waste time and money planting trees.  Opennings are wildlife magnets in that area.  Trees prevent the growth of browse and habitat that the wildlife you want to attract will need.  You need a mix of opennings, timber and edge.  Dense stands of timber are virtual wastelands for wildlife in that area.  The supply thermal cover and hiding cover but a real short of food.  If your land is surrounded by timber then I would leave it alone myself.  I doubt that you could improve habitat much short of planting a food or making a water source.
Making Tillamook Bay safe for bait; one salmon at a time.

Frank_Pender

Thank you for covering all of the basis, Tillaway.  For some additional help you can check with the extension service and ask for some assistance for a Master Woodlands Manager.  These folks have gone through at least a year and sometimes more rigerous training  by the folks from Extension and Oregon State University, School of Forestry.
Frank Pender

maple flats

I second that Frank. At least if it is similar to how NYS runs it. WE call ours Master Forest VOLUNTEERS. They get their training from the local Land Grant College (co-operative extension) and then help those who ask thru a site visit and lots of coaching. Ours do not do the work, just educate you to do it with specific reccommendations for your specific situation.  :)
logging small time for years but just learning how,  2012 36 HP Mahindra tractor, 3point log arch, 8000# class excavator, lifts 2500# and sets logs on mill precisely where needed, Woodland Mills HM130Max , maple syrup a hobby that consumes my time. looking to learn blacksmithing.

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