You would think that a guy called chestnut would know what it looked like ;D. Well, I do know the tree when I see it, but I don't see many boards.
This came off an old barn my dad was fixing up. I don't know when then the barn was built but it has a stone foundation and a lot of cut nails, some round but I believe they were repairs. I planned both sides and was pleasantly surprised!
End grain
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/17815/DSCN0334_-_Copy_28229~1.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1644882675)
The board
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/17815/DSCN0338~0.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1644882535)
May be..
American Chestnut | The Wood Database - Lumber Identification (Hardwood) (https://www.wood-database.com/american-chestnut/)
Looks like it from here.
Thanks fellas. First chestnut board I've used on a project. Hope to find more in the stack.
And a beautiful piece at that
Chestnut as well as the oaks are in the beech family. One distinguishing characteristics between chestnut versus the oaks and beech is that the medullary rays in chestnut are not visible to the naked eye. No medullary rays are visible in your end grain pic, so that is right for chestnut.
@WDH (https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=4370), I've been told that when it is riddled with borer holes it was a blight killed tree where pre blight they are generally clear? It may be as simple as post blight that was all that was available and pre blight a wormy stick was kindling/
That board sure looks like chestnut to me.
Around here if you find a chestnut tree growing, good luck, and it is big enough to saw, keep an eye on it. Soon it will die and if you can cut it then. It will yield wormy lumber.
Don, I believe you are correct in that those black lined "worm" holes are ambrosia beetle holes where the ambrosia beetles attacked the dead and dying trees soon after the blight infected and killed them. When standing dying and dead chestnut were salvaged, the ambrosia beetles came along with the ride and became part of the whole "wormy chestnut" persona.
Yes, to American Chestnut.
Lucky find. :)
A good many have been confused with ash. But with no visible rays, it makes it a good candidate for chestnut. In a lot of ash, you really have to squint to see the rays to.
Here's an ash, them rays are mighty fine. :D
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/11009/SD_White_Ash_EG.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1269297279)
Earlywood pores in chestnut have tyloses, although sometimes there are only a few. There are no tyloses in ash.
Also the latewood pores in chestnut form a dendritic pattern, that look like bubbles oozing up from the earlywood pores. This pattern is perpendicular to the ring. You can see that in the OP's end grain pic. Earlywood pores in ash are scattered and do not form the dendritic pattern.
Tylosis is numerous in white ash, very few in black ash though.
Forest Products Lab, WI, comparison of black ash and white ash. You need a very sharp knife to distinguish damage which may have the appearance of tylosis from a very smooth cut that has not damaged the cell walls.
https://www.fpl.fs.fed.us/documnts/fpltn/fpltn-d011.pdf (https://www.fpl.fs.fed.us/documnts/fpltn/fpltn-d011.pdf)
Good to know SD. I have never seen tyloses in white or green ash so now I will take a more detailed look.
I'm pretty sure my photos shows a lot of them, but also some empty ones. It's not a great clear photo because of image compression.
Let's see if this shows up, I just cut sanded with 1000x and rinsed with alcohol. The chestnut on the bottom looks like a cobblestone path of, I guess I polished the tyloses in the earlywood. That's sassafras on top.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10017/sasschestOP.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1646006593)
Incredible photograph wit stunning detail on the tyloses!
Quote from: Don P on February 15, 2022, 10:26:49 PM
@WDH (https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=4370), I've been told that when it is riddled with borer holes it was a blight killed tree where pre blight they are generally clear? It may be as simple as post blight that was all that was available and pre blight a wormy stick was kindling/
I pulled up a chestnut hay floor in a local barn about 35-40 years ago that was on a farm owned by a vo-tech teacher I worked with at the time. The deal was that I replace that floor with any 4/4 common mixed oak after removal. The barn was all oak on the outside and one hwy facing wall had faint leftover circus advertisement painted on it from long ago. Thje barn was torn down later to become a small factory site.
Every board I pulled was pre-blight and generally speaking, had zero borer holes. Among the many old buildings I tore down for chestnut, it was the only one having pre-blight wood in it.
At this time my plan is to use that very wood as the finish floor in my cabin project, as I never used any for many furniture projects over the years. While it lacks the interest and color contrasts seen in bored chestnut, it more than makes up with the aged effect of many years previous use for hay.
A pocketknife test on old chestnut is often required to tell what you've got in an old board as it can seem to be some type of oak until you see either the end grain cut cleanly or fresh face or edge grain.
What little chestnuts left to salvage, not gone from weathering exposure, now is often that which is hiding inside a building as those who know the wood well have no idea what it is. It then often goes to a land fill or is burned via ignorance and lack of interest, in spite of value. That, plus the commercial mania for salvaged barn wood means the average joe cannot get close to any of what's left.
nearly 40 years ago I salvaged some chestnut wainscotting from a renovation project I was working on.
it was 5/4 t&g and painted.
I was sadly lacking in woodworking tools in those days having just an old 8" delta table saw with a 4" jointer attached.
I sawed the paint off and used it as wainscotting it in the kitchen of my house at that time, a log cabin.
Ran out before I was done and finished with butternut.
I blended in pretty well.
One other chestnut story is about a barn that the State of NY DEC owned and sold at auction.
Full 1"x 16"x 20' White pine siding and had 2 chestnut beams inside both 36' long.
The swing beam was if memory serves, 14"x18" and the smaller one 12"x 16".
My boss bought the barn and salvaged all the good lumber and sold it.
He never did tell how much he made but I bet it was a bundle.
Also when I lived in that cabin My son discovered a 10" Chestnut in a grown over old field just below my house.
I watched it for 10 years and it produced burrs but no nuts.
I got to be 14" then died.
I was working on some white oak window sills today and, well I seem to be all about the stones lately :D, I was curious what I could see with a slice on the scanner.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10017/WOscan.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1647150183)
Riddled with bore holes could also be ash, a log that laid on the ground for the ambrosia to invade. :D
But that being said, any nice chestnut from the era before blight would be a national treasure wouldn't it? ;)
Big thick rays and pores clogged with tyloses 8).
The other slice I took while showing wood to a buddy in the shop yesterday. We held the slice of white oak up to the light and nothing passed through. This red oak slice (couldn't tell you which RO) looked like a lace curtain with light behind it.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10017/ROscan.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1647176254)
Quote from: SwampDonkey on March 13, 2022, 05:24:38 AM
Riddled with bore holes could also be ash, a log that laid on the ground for the ambrosia to invade. :D
But that being said, any nice chestnut from the era before blight would be a national treasure wouldn't it? ;)
I have a bunch of that stuff-maybe 1,000bf that runs ~ 6-10" x 12-14'. The colors are VG which I think comes from the hay floor effect and lack of weathering-it's destined to become a loft finish floor in my cabin build.
Chestnut tends to be either a tan or reddish or pinkish tint, this pre blight wood I've got is a darker brown mostly. My home is literally full of chestnut furniture and cabinets. My dining table, made from tobacco barn 2x girts is a dark brown which in part comes from the effect of the Waterlox varnish used. Darker than WATCO Danish oil for sure. As you can tell I love the stuff.
That is a beautiful board, and I hope you found more of them!
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/70133/image~2.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1654169362)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/70133/image~1.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1654169154)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/70133/image.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1654168792)
I have an 1830 home here in Va and it looks a bit like my flooring. I thought I might post a few pics and see if in fact these floors are chestnut because nobody can seem to help me identify them! Sorry about the end view- there is only a tiny bit showing where my fireplace is... Thanks
The end view pic is a softwood, not a hardwood. The thicker latewood bands would indicate pine.
The prize is to find chestnut lumber with no worm damage if only because most of what turns up is wormy most of the time. Timbers should be considered for use or resawing. They say chestnut lasts longer than locust.
Quote from: moodnacreek on June 07, 2022, 12:35:10 PM
The prize is to find chestnut lumber with no worm damage if only because most of what turns up is wormy most of the time. Timbers should be considered for use or resawing. They say chestnut lasts longer than locust.
I would argue the opposite as the Chestnut with worm holes is the overall norm for one thing and the other is that the worm holes add some degree of (is this a word? :D) antiqueness to the look. Pre-blight wood is mostly gone to wood heaven via insects and weather. In old buildings I've torn down, most being those constructed w/o concern for termites or weather by poor folk, I have seen termites eat it but an oak board next to the Chestnut ones is usually long gone. In the woods now I never see a Chestnut log lying about, whereas about 40+ years ago you'd see a very few here and there, mostly hollow and nearly gone.
One I found is sort of noteworthy. I drug it from the woods with a rope, cut three largish holes in it's top then sat it on our PT deck on a piece of black plastic and we planted three miniature roses in it. In the last years of it's life as a planter I'd wired it together but it went to tree heaven.
My dining room table legs are turned from Chestnut drug from the woods by a local guy who "lives off the fat of the land" :D, probably on disability? He collect driftwood for sale to taxidermists and greenhouses and came on hard times some years ago and called me trying to sell these Chestnut squares he'd had sawed for the wood he'd fetched. I bought it all. It comes from the lingering Chestnuts that sprung up from roots of blighted trees for many years in the north to south original Chestnut areas of the eastern USA. I see very few in recent years but they were once common. I personally have never seen one bear nuts but I've read that rare ones did.
One of my (I was an admin there) HS biology teachers, a younger gal left teaching to work FT on the American Chestnut project. Her Dad was at that time, the superintendent of the Daniel Boone NF in nearby Winchester, KY.
Sounds like I have to go for a hike to check on an unfinished cabin on the mountain [but not in tick season]. I found this in the '60s and it was started before I was born [1949]. The first course of logs on the dirt, are chestnut. I sell wormy soft maple for a good price but that does not mean I like any wood with worm holes. To me it is unprofessional. I have for years had customers reject any board with worm damage. For me it is not cute to have to keep handling boards many will not buy. It is enough work to do the good stuff. To each his own. Also I have found chestnuts from small root suckers in the fall trying to replant themselves
Wormy Chestnut "got wormy" while still standing and from the blight, not from laying around on the ground as you mention.
One person's cute is another's not so cute huh? :D
Root suckers from blight-stricken chestnuts are very common-or, at least they were.
Quote from: kantuckid on June 11, 2022, 08:42:47 AM
Wormy Chestnut "got wormy" while still standing and from the blight, not from laying around on the ground as you mention.
One person's cute is another's not so cute huh? :D
Root suckers from blight-stricken chestnuts are very common-or, at least they were.
Yeah, I know. I have cut standing dead chestnut and sawed it on my sawmill years ago. Those cabin logs ; I am trying to figure out how long the have or have not lasted. And i was talking about finding the burrs that fell from root sucker saplings.