New LT40HD owners and hyd repair question?

[morgoon]

Hello everyone, 

New 2013 LT40HD owner here and while I have been hanging around for a number of years here with my manual mill, my wife and I just upped the game a bit and bought the LT40 with 2400 hrs on it.

We rented a patch of land from our neighbour and set up a saw yard, where we will build Gothic arch greenhouses and probably sell a bit of lumber. Below is a pic of a plywood version of the greenhouse that we were initially going to run with, but then the price sky rocketed. With the mill I can custom cut the bow lumber into single pieces over 8' unlike the plywood that I had to laminate so that should give us a lot of flexibility on sizes.

Being from Northwestern Ontario our wood species selection is a bit limited, but I have some black lash, cedar, birch, balsam, spruce, and poplar to get started with.

The saw was busy right away and so far we have put about 5000 bf of spruce, poplar and balsam though it for a friend...

I knew when I bought the mill I knew it was leaking some hydraulic fluid from the control box. It pushes fluid from the reservoir filler cap after the hydraulics are run for a bit, and from what I have read it seems like one of the pumps is not working.

If I understand correctly that one pump is doing all the work and pushing the excess fluid out the other not working pump. I tested both solenoids and verified that each pump was getting power and each solenoid functions as it should. (not that I am an expert but it transfers 12v across it when I use the hydraulic levers) 

All my grounds are good, everything looks tight.

From what I have gleaned from this forum it is most likely the brushes in the motor itself?

I wasn't sure how to tell if one pump was running and one not. I couldn't hear or feel any difference, and the volt meter says each pump is grounded well and getting its 12v ok.

There is our trusty 68 CT90 sidekick who gets me to the mill on time, and the old square body chevy plow truck working hard as a second pair of hands.  









Here is our first greenhouse in plywood but cutting wood for them now to use a bit later.








Regards, 

Morgoon

[tmarch]

No idea on the hydraulics but welcome to THE best place on the net to find help.

[Magicman]

Solenoids will sometime become intermittent before they fail and you could very well have a solenoid that is intermittent ie sometime supplying power to the pump and sometime not.  Notice which pump is burping fluid, and then swap the pump leads to the other solenoids.  If the same pump continues to burp fluid, then it has a problem.  If the other pump now burps fluid, you have a solenoid problem.

[barbender]

Great looking greenhouse, btw!

[morgoon]

Hey good tip Magicman!

And Thanks Barbender, they sure are fun to make.

[morgoon]

Well I just swapped the top main power leads to each pump. The top terminal on the solenoid.

Fluid came out of the vent cap again on the  same pump.

Looks like I will have to dig a little deeper.

[Magicman]

You just proved that you have either a pump or a pump motor problem, and it should be a motor problem.

You've gotta get all of the hydraulic controls/hoses, etc. out of the way.  Mark the motor end plates and motor housing for easier reinstall.  Taking the motor off of the pump is fairly simple, but care must be taken on reassembly.  The motor/pump drive slot has to be correctly aligned. 

[morgoon]

Thanks Magicman 

I have a few things in the list ahead of the repair before I can make any progress.

I'm gonna call wm dealer tomorrow and order brushes and bushings for both motors so I guess that will set my time frame.

In the meantime I'm going to put a pipe nipple on there and a length of hose to control the leak and make a bit of an overflow reservoir.

[Magicman]

No need for the plumbing, just take the vent cap out and put a plug in the one that is burping.  I have finished a job with only one pump.

[morgoon]

Right on...

 Thanks for the advice today, it was most helpful.

[Andries]

. .   I'm gonna call wm dealer tomorrow and order brushes and bushings for both motors so I guess that will set my time frame. . . .

Ordering parts has been a mystery to me here in the middle of the country. Depending on what it is, sometimes it arrives super fast from Linsay, ON or more slowly, comes across the US border at Emerson/Pembina ND. 
I wondered if you go to Wayne Howarth in TBay, or straight to WoodMizer Canada just North of Toronto? 
I suppose it could depend on where you're located in NW Ontario - that's a short label for a big piece of real estate. 

[morgoon]

Yeah its a big patch of land Andries. 

I'm not far from Wayne and am a good customer as I just bought a BMS 250 a bit ago.

We are the second owner of the LT40 tho...

I am waiting on a new drive belt shipped out of Toronto but they had the band wheel belts at WM locally.

Shipping and duty out of the States is always a consideration, but often unavoidable if you need the part. I'm hoping Toronto or Wayne has the parts, and the wait time isn't too bad.

Great to meet a Neighbour btw.

[Andries]

It's about a seven hour drive between us, but by Canadian terms, that's close enough to be called neighbours.  :D Travel restrictions will clear someday, and my wife has family in ThunderBay. 
Great green houses btw! 
I hear from a neighbour gal that runs half a dozen greenhouses that the poly covering will last about seven years out here on the Prairies. 
That's a great frame/plan for storage of boats or mills or even  . . . .   plants.
Good luck with the burping pump issue - you're getting advice from one of the best.

[barbender]

Geez if 7 hours put you in range I should get to be a neighbour as well (note spelling😁) there's just that pesky border in between us, which I hear is quite a hurdle in these Covid times😊

[morgoon]

Well Howdy friends, neighbours and neighbours eh...

Tbay is eight hours to Winnipeg or Sault St Marie, and most Northwestern Ontario folks consider Winnipeg, the Soo, Minneapolis, Duluth and Wisconsin as places we would regularly visit. A regular neighbourhood of sorts. 

Well prior to everything at the moment for sure.

7 hours away is like finishing your drive early and getting there just in time to line up for the bbq

Good to have some time frames on greenhouse plastic btw thanks for that...and (someday) you fine folks are welcome to stop by. I don't live in Tbay but just outside it. Far enough out that we have a little space to do stuff and still go to town when I have to...Like going to WM for parts

[Andries]

. . . .   there's just that pesky border in between us, which I hear is quite a hurdle in these Covid times😊

It is that.
But, would that be a problem for the operator of Ponsee Buffalo?  :D 
Back in the day, a brother in law that farmed, had fields that straddled the US Canada border. There is a very old tradition of farm boys tiptoeing across the line to visit someone special with a bottle or two.
That was then, and this is now. Drones, listening devices and vibration detectors have stopped all those shenanigans. Replaced by Amazon trucks and Face Time.  ;)
Good to hear from neighbors and neighbours ! 

[morgoon]

I see my computer auto corrected neighbor's..to the Canadian way so my joke was less funny

A dear friend of mine who is in his mid ninteys now used to cross into MN in the early 60's from the Pigeon River Bridge at the original location to use the phone. 

He was hauling pulp wood with a KB7 (I think) and if you wanted to go for a drink at the tavern or use the phone you could just walk under the border chain in the off hours. There was no phone line on the Canadian side at the time in that area so it was a common occurrence apparently.

As for WM repair I spoke with the dealer and have a new brush kit and bearings on their radar to be sorted/shipped in next week.

I did get the dead pump fill spot plugged shut today with a proper plug.

Good thing as I have 6 decent sized 16' poplar to go thru for someone Wednesday and some Saturday sawing on the agenda as some one wants 6x6s for a flower bed.

And 26 ish decent sized spruce to go thru shortly for someone else.

[Magicman]

Before you continue to use it, disconnect the power cable going to the dead pump motor.  When the brushes start to fail the pump will draw some serious amps so hopefully the armature or field winding did not burn when the brushes failed which is what can easily happen.  If it did, you will be replacing the motor.

I said it but I will say it again, mark the end plates with the motor housing before you disassemble anything.  Reassembly without being marked will eat your lunch.  Just a deep scratch, chisel, or center punch will be fine.

[morgoon]

Don't know why I didn't think of that Magicman.. disconnecting things is a really good idea.

I still haven't really ruled out a hyd pump issue beyond the electrical side of things and won't really know till I dig into it.

I greatly appreciate your time and you can bet I will mark everything and take lots of pics along the way.

[Magicman]

The problem should be the motor, not the pump.

[morgoon]

I agree, I was just doing the worst case scenario in my mind.

I'll get some time soon to digi to it and I'll take pics along the way.

[barbender]

I think they'd catch me at the border even with the Ponsse😊 One Ace the local Ponsse service center has up there sleeve is one of the mechanics is a dual US/Canadian citizen (His mother is Canadian). He said he crosses the border with other Minnesota guys to go fishing, they are kind of giving the rest of the guys a bit of a hard time. They look at his documents and are like, "oh your fine, come on in."😊

[morgoon]

Yep sure gonna be a while before we can get back down to Grand Marais for a day out I think or folks can come up here fishing again.

I know most border towns tend to think of neighbouring states as being like the next county over, not the next country over. 

Good thing sawmilling is universal

On the upside I should have a bit of time to tinker on the mill. I am still waiting on parts but I can do as Magicman suggested and disconnect the non working pump. 

[morgoon]

Hey everyone...

Well it took a bit but I finally got some parts in regarding being a motor down on a 2013 LT 40HD.

I ordered what I thought was two motor rebuild kits and when I picked it up at the dealer (they were gone away). I just picked up a sealed box left out for me and went on my way.

When I opened the box I it is brand new motors. I see it's listed as a kit number right on the old pump, but its an entire new motor to go on the hyd pump not just some brushes and bushings for a rebuild.

Wm part no. 052807 Motor kit,  Hydraulic replacement is what I ordered based on the sticker on the old motor saying order this kit #.

Nice to have for peace of mind but is there a simple motor rebuild kit?

Perhaps that's all I need. I can keep one new motor on the shelf for a rainy day.