Blades to saw antique heart pine beams

Cypress Man · October 12, 2010, 06:54:58 PM

I recently bought some antique heart pine beams from a demoed textile mill that was built in 1910. Using a WM LT40 Super 25hp electric with .055 x 1 1/4 x 10 blades is not cutting like I think it should. These beams have seasoned over the last 100 yrs and is very hard. The blade seems to wander just after a few cuts and low feed rates. >:( These beams have been painted in white paint also. Anyone have any experience with cutting this to reccommend a blade to cut this? What about WM Silver tip blades? Thanks for the help.

Hilltop366 · October 12, 2010, 07:39:46 PM

It has been my experience that painted wood will dull cutting tools at a much faster rate than unpainted, not just tool steel but carbide as well.

someone else will have to help with the blade selection.

Magicman · October 12, 2010, 07:55:57 PM

Are you having any pitch buildup on your blades?

red oaks lumber · October 12, 2010, 08:33:10 PM

thats agood blade, pour the water to her and increase the feed speeds. the big blade can handle abuse. sometimes what i'll do if it has paint or whatever on it, take a cleanup cut on one side,then put that side towards blade entery, helps keep the blade cleaner.

fishpharmer · October 12, 2010, 08:59:20 PM

I don't know the first thing about sawing antique heart pine. I was wondering if anyone ever used the WM Stellite Blades on that type wood? I took this picture when visiting Pineywoods, actually we were at his buddies mill, Leroy. The stellite tips were noticeably thicker and looked somewhat like a carbide tipped circular saw blade in respect to the contrasting thickness. My $00.02.

terrifictimbersllc · October 12, 2010, 09:58:31 PM

I sawed 150 yr old barn beams some kind of pine, in half lengthwise. Can't remember if I used 9's or 10's now but do remember that wood-mizer recommended as little water as possible for really dry wood. The danger of too much water in really dry wood, was supposedly wood swelling and pinching the blade. Just enough to keep the blade clean, load up on the additive (I used WM additive). The only problems I encountered that day was that the beams were full of metal.
Recommend cutting slow and sighting along the cut line as the blade is exiting the cut, as long as that stays straight keep going. If you think the blade is climbing or diving slow down and check it.

LOGDOG · October 12, 2010, 10:11:52 PM

I've milled quite a bit of reclaimed. If I were milling it, I'd widen my set way out and back off on your hook angle ...4 or 7 degree. Widening your set and using as little water as possible will mix more air in your cut and keep the blade from getting as hot which leads to other issues. Water does cause the chips to swell in the removal process when the wood is that dry. All of a sudden you don't have enough clearance on each side of the body of the blade and you have heat. Also, set the blade first and then sharpen so that your tooth corners are razor sharp.

Red Oaks idea of taking a skim coat first and then turning it so that the blade is entering the clean side first is also excellent. I sometimes do that with dirty logs if there's no presure washer handy.

customsawyer · October 13, 2010, 05:46:46 AM

I agree with the less water and remember that what ever was in the building most likely made dust that landed in all the small cracks and dirt and dust will dull your blade very quickly.

MartyParsons · October 13, 2010, 06:59:54 AM

Most customers who saw Heartpine are using the 9 degree blade. The paint or white wash ( lime) will dull the blade. These beams will be dirty which will dull the blade. I was sawing Oak beams yesterday ( hand hewn) and I did use water on the blade. I have heard about the swelling of the old wood. You will need to see how the beams react to water on the blade. As you saw watch the blade tension gauge. If it changes , drops, you are making heat in the blade then add water soap mixture if it goes back up then keep the water on it. Lube-Mizer additive will work well. Pine sol will help and work also. You will need to saw slow ( in my experience) every sawing job is different on sawing speed. One customer washes the beams with water before he saws the Heartpine. Heartpine has resin which melts when sawn. Some beams have little resin and some have much more. I have seen it sawn with a putty knife on the blade scraping the resin off as he was sawing .

( dont try this please)
Hope this helps.
Marty
I agree with cutting the paint off the cant if that is possible.

Meadows Miller · October 13, 2010, 08:33:13 AM

Gday

If you have access to a good high pressure washer that has about 3 to 4000 psi at the tip you could take that paint and rubbish rite of it and clean out those cracks at the same time as it makes for clean sawing ;) ;D 8) I have one i use to use for just that purpose along with debarking logs for log building worked a treat and never had any dramas with the little band mill i had at the time Mate ;) ;D 8)

Regards Chris

toploader Ford · October 13, 2010, 04:22:24 PM

I used to saw thousands of feet of old pine (from old industral buildings) every week until my customer bought their own resaw machine. But for special cuts and quarter sawn old pine they still have me cut it. Some old pine saws real nice, generally the stuff that grows slow and has tight growth rings. The faster growing old pine with wide growth rings can be a pain in the butt! I avoid sawing into the large checks, that's where all kinds of nasty stuff is hiding that a metal detector won't pick up, namely glass and stones. I like to run my blade dry if I can. On the old pine beams that have lots of pitch, water just won't cut the pitch off the blade. I know it's a no-no but I use diesel fuel. I use the standard 10 degree Woodmizer blades. Be advised, if it has paint, it's most likely lead paint! If they been whitewashed, it can be power washed clean to get the grit off.

Cypress Man · October 13, 2010, 08:16:04 PM

Thanks for all the info. I'll see what will or will not work for me in this application.

Marty. I've never tried anything other than a 10 degree blade before. Will I really see much difference in a 9 degree from the 10 degree or should I try a 7 first.

LOGDOG · October 13, 2010, 11:00:20 PM

I use diesel fuel too with just a bit of chainsaw lube oil in it in place of water. Nothing I've found strips that heart pine sap off the blades like diesel. I tried to resist it for a while but it just works too darn good. I use it for milling sinker heart pine as well. Works like a charm.

Cypress Man ... if you're at 10 degrees I'd skip the 9's and bump down to the 7's.

Meadows Miller · October 14, 2010, 05:35:14 AM

Gday

I forgot to say Welcome to the forum to you Blokes

So Welcome to The Forum Cypress Man & Toploader it sounds like both of you have abit off experience ;) ;D ;D 8) 8) 8)

Why not ;) Diesels good enough for the big boys thats what they run on most of the big bands and it works and works well ;) :D ;D ;D 8) 8)

Regards Chris

John Bartley · October 14, 2010, 06:38:41 AM

Quote from: LOGDOG on October 12, 2010, 10:11:52 PM
I've milled quite a bit of reclaimed. If I were milling it, I'd widen my set way out and back off on your hook angle ...4 or 7 degree. Widening your set and using as little water as possible will mix more air in your cut and keep the blade from getting as hot which leads to other issues. Water does cause the chips to swell in the removal process when the wood is that dry. All of a sudden you don't have enough clearance on each side of the body of the blade and you have heat. Also, set the blade first and then sharpen so that your tooth corners are razor sharp.

Red Oaks idea of taking a skim coat first and then turning it so that the blade is entering the clean side first is also excellent. I sometimes do that with dirty logs if there's no presure washer handy.

This above is what I would have written if LogDog hadn't written it first. Even with a dull band, a properly set one should cut straight.

cheers

John