Started clearing my lot for a future home and took a few pics.

[Piston]

I started clearing a small portion of my lot for a building spot on my land in NH.  My intention is to eventually have around 2 acres mostly cleared of trees (I'll keep some), and then thin another 2 acres or so as a "transition" zone back to heavily wooded area. 

There are many "straggling" wild blueberry plants in the few places that still get a little sun, so I'm hoping by opening up the area I will start to see some more blueberry plants coming back. 

I have cleared close to an acre so far, my dad helped me a lot with the clearing.  We had intentions of bringing the 410 backhoe up there as well as my tractor, however, we haven't gotten the backhoe up there yet.  So far, it's just been the tractor since it's so much easier to transport.

I let my dad play on the tractor almost the entire time, and I was on the ground, sometimes running the chainsaw, but a lot of times just watching.  My dad has always taught me to let the machine do the work  ;) and I wasn't going to argue with him  :D


I used the grapple almost exclusively for doing the clearing.  I started out by clearing a small trail that would be big enough to get my tractor and truck back there. 

We started out by just "pushing" our way through, I tried to pick the easiest "route" to get back there.  (Note: "there" is the spot that I want to eventually build a house on)  I didn't want to take down any more trees than necessary since this won't be the permanent driveway. 

Here are some pics of our progress.

This first picture is the beginning of the 'trail' we started to make.   


We slowly worked our way into the woods...
 

 
 

 
 

 
 




The easies way we've found to clear out these "smallish" trees over the years, is to carefully start pushing the tree over with the tractor/grapple and as it starts to go over, back up, let it come to rest, then position the grapple underneath the uprooted stump, and curl/push the rest of the tree/stump out of the ground. 

You can see that most of these are very shallow rooted and came down fairly easy. 
 

 
 

 
There are a couple things we have to be really careful of when using this method.  The most obvious, is widow makers, and dead branches that can fall from the trees.  It's important to check the tops, and branches, of not only the tree you are pushing down, but also any tree nearby that may be affected.  A nice cage of some sort (FOPS I believe it's called?) would be nice to have. 

The other issue, is that my tractor is not set up for "logging" type operations.  I have to be very careful to move the debris out of the way as we go, as a limb could easily get lodged up into the underneath of the tractor.  The one good thing about this, is it forces me to clean up "as we go"  ;D

One other thing that my father has pointed out to me numerous times, is that sometimes when pushing a tree over, the rootball is much bigger than expected, and as it starts to fall, it can gain enough momentum and force to actually lift up the front of the tractor.  He had this happen on a full sized front end loader when he used to run heavy equipment back in the day.  Although it's fairly unlikely to happen with a small tractor (since I can't push over much bigger trees than you see here) it's possible and should be kept in mind. 

The box blade made quick work of smoothing out the rough trail.
 

 


 
 

 
   


 

 
 

   

 

This is the end of our "access trail" and the beginning of where we started the clearing.  As long as your expectations remain realistic, a small tractor like this with the combination of a heavy duty box blade, can get a surprising amount of work done in a day, just gotta take it little by little and have a lot of fun.  ;D

[Holmes]

Looks like you, I mean your father is having fun now.  Nice job, nice attachment... ;D 8)

[beenthere]

Do yourselves a favor and at least get some good hardhats. Might protect the noggin from the small branches and limbs that can come down.
Thanks for the pics. Looks like a fun project for you guys.

[logman81]

Nice work piston, compact tractors can be very handy for clearing land as long as you take your time and are carfull.

[thecfarm]

You have some nice ground there for NH. Not a rock in sight. I can dig just about anywheres and found at least one rock. I was just wondering why remove the stumps if not a driveway? I make new woods roads and just cut the stumps low and drive over them. When I want a new woods road I have to walk and flag it first. Takes me a few times due to rocks,uneven places and trees I want to save to get it right.Yes,the blue berries will come back and so will every other bush you can think of too. Looks like a good project.

[Dave Shepard]

Looks like a really nice piece of ground. I use the push it over and buck the stump off trick too. With a Kobelco 150 it works well on pine up to about 24", after that you have to take a swipe of two from either side with the bucket first. :D What do you have for timber on the property? Will you be able to source the material for the house right from there?

[Clean Image]

Wow!
I remember those fall days back East growing up as a kid...enough cold in the air to make your nose run but still filled with lots of sunshine!

Working your equipment on a day like that, clearing land for your house and most importantly doing it with your Dad...I just can't imagine it getting any better than that! My Dad passed away a few years back...I think every day as I progress with the building of my own home how much he would have enjoyed being a part of it and how much I would have enjoyed him being there...

Thanks for all the pics, good luck with your project and I hope you enjoy the process as much as the end result!

Duane

[Leigh Family Farm]

Nice "little" project. How much land is on the property? How far will your house be away from the road? One day, the wife and I would like to build a small mountain cabin doing the same thing your doing.

[Piston]

You have some nice ground there for NH. Not a rock in sight. I can dig just about anywheres and found at least one rock.

Your right, it does seem like there aren't many rocks in those pics  ;D
It's pretty neat how in some spots it seems there are virtually no rocks, yet others you can't even walk across without twisting an ankle.  There are specific divisions where there are, and aren't many rocks.  There are also specific divisions on each sides of the stone walls, where one side is all pines like you see in the pics, and the other side is almost all younger hardwoods.  There are certainly some old abandoned fields that I'm clearing on.  There are some large rock piles that some poor farmer went through back breaking work piling. Or at least an Ox or something.  One pile is 30' wide by 70' long and fairly low, only a few feet high or so. 

It's no coincidence that the areas I'm clearing are the ones that are free from rocks!  Well, I can't say free, I'm sure there are just plenty of them lurking below the surface just waiting for their chance of freedom and a breath of fresh air!

I was just wondering why remove the stumps if not a driveway? I make new woods roads and just cut the stumps low and drive over them.

The main intention of this initial clearing, was to clear for the house lot.  Our plan was to remove all the stumps since we'll be doing some digging for foundation and finish work.  Although this trail has nothing to do with that work, I think we just had it in our heads that pushing the trees over like this was the plan, and that's what we went with.  I also had it in my mind that I can't scarify the ground with the stumps cut at ground level, which is what I had planned for leveling out the trail.  In hindsight though, there is no reason I couldn't have left those stumps, so I have no good answer, other than because it's just plain fun!  :D

[Piston]

What do you have for timber on the property? Will you be able to source the material for the house right from there?

There isn't much timber on the property much larger than you see in these pics.  This land was logged a long time ago and never properly managed.  Once I'm able to spend more time up there, I plan to have a forester visit my property (I've already met with the county forester once) and help me come up with a management plan, hopefully I can improve my little piece of forest with their help. 

I probably won't use much of the material on the land for the house.  However, my grandmother has a nice stand of old EWP in central MA, and she has told me in the past that I can use her trees to build my house with.  As long as she is still willing to let me do that, I will use those trees for the timbers, of course, there is a chance that won't work out though, so I'm not relying on it. 

[Piston]

Clean Image,
Yes, I do have fun with my dad doing projects like this.  We work good together in these situations.  I sometimes "overthink" things and will take forever to decide on what tree to take down, which route to go, what the best method is blah blah blah, whereas he is a go getter, and will just START going to town right away, left on his own, he'd probably clear out my entire lot!  So between the two of us we meet in the middle and get a good amount of work done, but not so fast and aggresively that we ruin the forest.  I know it takes a long time for these trees to grow and I can do a lot of damage in a short amount of time, even with the small equipment I have. 

Nice "little" project. How much land is on the property? How far will your house be away from the road? One day, the wife and I would like to build a small mountain cabin doing the same thing your doing.

We own 31 acres.  My grandfather is my neighbor and he owns another 20 acres, my aunt is also a neighbor and she only has a couple acres.  If you get the lost in the woods and go the wrong way, you can be walking for a few miles without crossing a road.  However, it's not in the middle of "nowhere" either.

The house will be about 700' from the road or so, I haven't measured the straight line distance. 

[g_man]

Neat pictures. Take all you can. When we did our place we didn't have a camera. I borrowed one from work a couple times so we have only a few and they are spaced out years. I wish I had a picture story like you are making.
Your doing a nice job. Taking out the root balls allows you to make a good road. With such a nice site you might as well have a good woods road to match. Once it is there you will always use it I bet. Where are you hauling everything?  Burning, chipping, or burying it ?

[Woodchuck53]

I would check the local auctions for a little protection. I found 2 for 150.00 (state orange) and modified them to fit my two main tractors. May say a trip to the ER. Very nice place.

[Piston]

I would check the local auctions for a little protection.

That's a good idea, but how do I find out about local auctions like that?  I've tried looking online but all I really find is what's listed on tractorhouse.com which isn't really that plentiful for my area.

Neat pictures. Take all you can. When we did our place we didn't have a camera. I borrowed one from work a couple times so we have only a few and they are spaced out years. I wish I had a picture story like you are making.
Your doing a nice job. Taking out the root balls allows you to make a good road. With such a nice site you might as well have a good woods road to match. Once it is there you will always use it I bet. Where are you hauling everything?  Burning, chipping, or burying it ?

I tend to take a lot of pictures  ;D  Probably too many, but I enjoy going back and looking at them.  For the mean time I'm mostly piling them to burn this winter, however, I recently purchased a PTO chipper for the tractor and will probably chip whatever I don't get burned this winter.  I'm trying not bury anything but we'll see about the stumps.  Once I'm done clearing the building lot, I'll cut the trees down rather than push them, then grind the stumps down below the soil.  It seems to be much less 'messy' this way and I don't have to handle the stumps numerous times.  I also feel that it will help with erosion by keeping the roots in the ground until I get some sort of grass/brush/weeds growing to hold the soil together.  Hoping the blueberry bushes come back with a vengence!  ;D

[thecfarm]

Probably i would dig out stumps too if I did not get 10-20 rocks per stump.
Call on your power tomorrow. we put in a house in 2000,just about a 500 foot driveway. We knew we was putting the house in the year before,1999.I called up the power company in Feb. If we would of just called CMP in 1999 and just got a work number we would of saved $5000. In 2000 the rules changed that they would only put in one pole,than the land owner had to do the rest. before 2000 the others customers would of paid to put our power in. Story of my life. 

[Piston]

My first post was showing the pics I took while we were creating a trail to get back to the build site.  This one will start where that one leaves off.  For reference, there is a stone wall that runs up/down the hill which separates where the trail stops, and the clearing for the building site begins.  There are numerous other stone walls on the property as well.   


Prior to clearing any trees, it was really too thick for me to picture the "perfect" spot for a house, so one thing I wanted to accomplish with clearing, was to clear out a large enough area for be to get a better idea of where the best spot would be.  I had a hard time picturing where to build when all I saw was trees, and then more trees.  After opening up the site a little, it is now much more clear to me. 

Here is a view of the stone wall I mentioned, looking uphill (south).  If you turned 90° to the right, you would be looking down the trail we cleared. 

The next picture I took by turning 90° to the left.  You can see how the "trail" continues up towards where my father is on the tractor, in the background. 

We had already cleared a decent amount of trees at this point.  I do have some "before" pics, but all it shows is nothing but trees, you really can't see into them too far. 


When I took the picture below, I was standing basically where you see the dog in the picture above, looking in the same direction.  The dog is Cayman, he's a 5yr old golden who just wants to be with someone, it could be anybody, he just needs company  ;D 
 

 

The following picture was taken from pretty much the same spot (although not the same time) by just turning around.  You can see the stone wall in the background. 
This a good series of pics showing how we would push the trees over, uproot, and carry them away.  We made a large pile that will eventually be cleared around with the intention of burning it.  The pile grew pretty big pretty fast, so we'll probably light a smaller fire nearby, then feed it from this larger pile, I'd hate to light the woods on fire  :D
 

 


 


 

The old man really started having a good time when setup my Bose noise cancelling headphones with some music I knew he'd like on my Iphone.  After that, there was no stopping him, I'd look over at him once in a while and he'd literally be dancing in the seat.   :D 
 
He was a little skeptical when I bought the grapple a few years ago, as he thought it was too much money, but after getting some seat time operating it he's become a full believer.  He always says how amazed he is with how much more productive that makes the tractor.  I TOLD YA SO DAD  :D :D :D


  

   



Just as we were thinking about taking a break for some lunch, my grandfather came driving through the woods with some sandwiches a couple cold beers  8) 8) 8)  Boy that tasted good!


 


  

Back to work....
 

 

What little hardwoods there were, we (meaning I) cut them up into shorter peices to later process into firewood. 
 

  

 

With a wide enough grapple and two 'thumbs' on it, I was able to carry multiple stumps at the same time, this effectively cut my trips to the stump pile in half. 
 

 
 

  

 

 

    



It was a nice feeling to really start to feel the sun beating down on us for most of the day.   This is the first time the forest floor has seen this much sunlight in a really long time.  ;D

Once again, the grapple allowed us to make quick work of the 'log handling'.  There is now enough space cleared to be able to move around, and have room to make piles.  Once the snow starts falling we'll be able get some nice bonfires going.  ;D
 

 

 

 

It's hard for me to judge, but I estimate that we cleared close to an acre, maybe closer to ¾'s of an acre, but I'm being optimistic  :D

[Piston]

Probably i would dig out stumps too if I did not get 10-20 rocks per stump.
Call on your power tomorrow. we put in a house in 2000,just about a 500 foot driveway...

On some of the larger trees that we took down, the rootballs grew to a pretty good size, and when they went over, we certainly had some rocks to deal with, not only that, but there was quite a hole left to mess with.  In the future when I'm taking down the larger trees, I'll cut them with the chainsaw and grind the stumps just below ground level.  I think this will save a lot of backfilling the stump holes. 

Regarding power, I have talked with New Hampshire Electric Co Op a couple of times.  One thing is for sure, power will not be cheap  >:(  Especially since I want to run it underground. 

[Mooseherder]

I priced some underground wire for our cabin.
It was 1200 dollars for 500 foot of UF8-3 wire at Lowes but they were out and would of had to order it.
Buying the 500 ft spool was the same price as buying 385 feet. :
I bought 385 foot of UF10-3 wire for 375.00 from my Electrician's supply house instead.  This length only got me to the well head junction box.  I have to buy more wire from there next year to make it to the cabin.  We were are running a hundred foot of 12-2 and 400  ft of extensions from the junction box to the cabin.
The poles the Electric company put in from the road came in at 350 feet at no charge.  I'm going underground from there.  I had to cut a dozen trees for that to happen.
If they let you trench your own wire you can save a lot of money.
I tried to rent a trencher while we were there but the rental company didnt have one available so the wire had to be put away before we left.  I hope they have one available next year.

[samandothers]

Really nice work!   It is great fun to clear land when you have a purpose.  The grapple is a great tool.  I use one to clearn brush and rock.  Some times I'll use a backhoe to dig the trees out and then grapple to move them.  The box blade must be pretty good size to counter the weight of the grapple with a load.

Have fun and be safe.

[thecfarm]

Nice pictures. You will enjoy looking back at these in years to come. I could use a grapple and a backhoe. I would like to have a backhoe like what you have. One on back of my tractor would be good,but a backhoe-loader all by itself is really what I need. I have my winch on most of the time. That way I would not have to dig around on all sides of some rocks and make that much more of a mess and find that many more. I'm clearing the pasture and keep finding a dump cart of rocks that was just dumped in a pile. I know of at least 2 big piles, but there are many single dump carts loads that I keep finding.

[moosehunter]

Piston,
I may have missed it, what size is your tractor and what brand it that grapple?

mh

[Piston]

Mooseherder,
I am supposed to be meeting with the power company to come up with a "plan".   I'm hoping that they'll let me run my own cable and do all the work myself.  I figured I'd use the backhoe to dig the trench but since it will be close to 700' long or so, I think it's probably worth looking into renting a large trencher? 
They did say that the first 250' of cable is free for underground though.  It turns out that the cost of underground won't be drastically different than the cost of running wires/poles above ground.

Sam,
The box blade is a Landpride HRL 3578, it weighs 1,000lbs with the hydraulic scarifiers which is really great for ballast.  I also have the rears loaded with Rimguard which adds an additional 1,100 lbs of weight.  Quite honestly, I'm using every bit of power this tractor has.  I do feel like I could benefit from a larger tractor and plan to upgrade in the future, but that will have to wait since my tractor fund is now going into a college fund for the newborn baby boy  ;D

Cfarm,
The combo of the tractor and 410 really is a good setup.  I've maxed out the loader capacity more than once on the tractor and the backhoe has really helped.  The tractor will do probably 85% of the things I want to do, but for that 15% that it can't do, the backhoe really shines.  Not to mention, you can pick up a used 310 for only a couple thousand more than buying a new backhoe attachment for the tractor.

Piston,
I may have missed it, what size is your tractor and what brand it that grapple?
mh

The tractor is 46hp (39PTO) and the grapple is a WR LONG OBG-2 model.  I highly highly highly recommend WR Long.  Every time I've called them with a question I've talked directly to the owner, and he's always spent the time to explain things to me, never feeling like I was rushed off the phone.  People rave about WM customer service and I rave about WR Long in the same manner.  There are cheaper grapples out there but you notice it in the build quality, such as thinner steel in places, no zirc fittings in the pivot points, not sufficient bracing etc.  My grapple is: http://www.wrlonginc.com/obg2.htm
I posted some more pics of it in use in this thread (which I haven't updated in a while) https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?topic=50047.0

[Mooseherder]

That's a good deal if they won't charge for the first 250 feet.
One spool of 500 ft. should finish your run and you'll have some left over for another outbuilding if you are doing that.
It may be more cost effective to let them trench it.
When I had first talked with people in the know about getting power to the cabin, it was suggested that would cost around 15 grand because it's about a 900 ft run.
That was out of reach,  so fast forward a couple years, power company gets bought out with new philosophy and wambo my neighbor filled me in on how cheap it was for him.  The Electrician, Wire, boxes and breakers cost me a grand.  I need more wire, about 400 feet but it feel it's a bargain over hauling gas for generators.  Besides, I've worn out one generator and it needs replacing.

I may hire  a guy with a dozer to trench my line along with making some woods trails while there if a trencher isn't available.

[Piston]

Did the power company outline exactly what needs to be done for your power? 

I have to have a 'consulatation' with a planner at the power company ($250) and they will supposedly outline everything I need to do, or have done.  I'm not sure if they will let me run my own power or not though, I called and asked and all the woman could tell me was "you'll have to ask the planner when you meet with him"

So hopefully I can do the work myself, and they tell me exactly what type and size wire I will need, as well as the conduit, how many runs I need, and how to backfill.  I want to run at least one extra empty line of conduit in case for some reason I want to run another line in the future. 

[Mooseherder]

Their District supervisor drove over to the property, met with me and the electrician who was setting up my power panel and asked what I was going to need for service and sized it up.
We basically set it up for a future house.
That may happen but if it doesn't it's okay too.
It was a whole lot easier than I had thought it would be.
The lines don't need to be in conduit anymore.
The wire grade takes care of it.  Famous last words. :D
If you run conduit put a string in it to pull wire through later.

[Holmes]

 Around here conduit is needed, but in NH who knows?  Usually 3 of 4 conduits are run ,1 for electric, 2 smaller pipes for telephone and internet and a 4th to put lighting back down the driveway.

[Piston]

.... and a 4th to put lighting back down the driveway.

There's something I didn't think of.   ;)

[GRANITEstateMP]

Piston,

Meeting with the Co-op will help answer a lot of questions.  I went through this a few years ago with them (but much shorter run!) and learned a LOT.  The $250 is actually a "design" charge, you'll get that back off your first couple of bills once the juice starts flowing.  The designer is gonna want to have the house site marked off (within 10-20ft) and if the driveway isn't marked off he'll want that marked as well(or the power right of way if not the driveway, something else to discuss with them).  The whole process takes longer than it should BUT the Co-Op is pretty good to work with.  We ended up getting the plans and the quote from the Co-Op and taking it to a local company (that the Co-Op usually sub's stuff out to) and saving about 50% (cash still does talk!).  We had to buy 2 poles, one as a support for an existing pole on the main road, the other as a ways to cross a wetlands and then went underground another 200 or so feet.  We did all the digging / trenching ourselfs and cut all the trees in the right of way, we also layed all the conduit and sand in the trench.  The Co-op wasn't real happy about my shopping around but that's there problem!  They did bust my nuggets about burying the conduit without them seeing it and wanted me to dig it up so they knew the depth.  Lucky for me, I also took a bunch of pictures and had some with me in the trench holding a tape up!  In the end it all worked out BUT if I ever lose the pole in the driveway I need to buy the next one, not them, since I didn't have them install it!  Also, you can only go so far underground before needing to put in some kind of transformer or something, not sure of the term or the amount of feet you can run before you need one.  Hope this helps.

Matt

[Piston]

Matt,
Thank you for that post.  There is a lot of very helpful information that you just told me about.  You actually answered a lot of the question's I've been wondering about, that even the lady at the Co op couldn't answer for me  :D

I'm glad to know that at least I CAN run my own cable and lay my own conduit.  I will be able to dig the trench with my backhoe and run the conduit.  I think they quoted me about $21 per foot so 700' or so would certainly add up!  If I could do it for half that I would be tickled pink! 

I'm hoping to meet with the design guy in the next couple of weeks.  However, I still need to get up there and mark off where I will be clearing for power (I'm not planning on running it along the driveway if I don't have to) as well as mark off the house location, so as long as I can get those things done I'll make an apt with the design guy. 

Did they pretty much spell out exactly how you needed to run the wire?  As far as depths of the trench, what to fill and how much, what type of conduit/cable you need to run, and things like that?  As long as he can spell everything out for me, I can follow directions.  I won't be doing any sort of electrical work, but I can do the labor intensive stuff. 
Thanks again, that was a really helpful post.  ;D

[GRANITEstateMP]

Piston,

The trench part is pretty easy, it's so many feet/inches deep (I think it was 3ft), it depends on how many tubes/conduit you run.  The "main line" goes into a 3in? piece while the cable / phone can go into 1 1/2in?  The trench gets filled with sand and a Electical Line Buried red tape.  the key is keeping the 3 tubes separated and what order they go in.  Also NO sharp turns!  The plans were really detailed, so much so that they could have been printed in another language!  The sub contractor that pulled the line provided the cable for me so I'm not sure of what is required there.  When buying conduit, there are different grades or schedules, I belive you need a Sched. 80 if it's in a driveway or under a tote road and sched. 40 if its just a path.  As others suggested run a string or something in the conduit as you go.  My wifes Uncle dug and helped with ours, when we had the conduit done he grabbed a shop van and a string pulled it the couple hund feet, worked slick!  You will need metal conduit going up the pole (1 section?) a 90deg bend in metal and maybe the first section away, can't remember...  For Co-Op you also need a master power ON / OFF switch before the meter on the house side (they don't give those away either!).  Like I said the Co-Op was very helpful, just a bit too much $$$!

Matt

[grweldon]

I ran my underground power line from a pole about 100' from my house.  They wouldn't run the power until I had a septic system put in.  Also, my wire was quite a bit bigger than #8...  I used 3/0 aluminum for the conductors with 2/0 for the ground.  I would imagine that the power company won't allow you to use anything less for 200A service.

[beenthere]

also need a master power ON / OFF switch before the meter on the house side

After the meter I can understand, and maybe that is what you meant. Such a disconnect is apparently new code put in by the firemen so they can disconnect the electric supply within 10' of the meter. Not sure why the firemen don't just pull out the meter from its socket.  :

[Piston]

I really appreciate the additional info. 

I'm printing off the 60 page .pdf that they have on their website, it should give me some good info I hope and at least I'll be prepared with some questions for the design guy.

I'd like to have a small barn of some sort (some kind of small woodworking barn or similar) about 500-600' in from the road, then another 150' back or so, would be the house.  So....

What I would like to do, if I even can??, is run the electric from the road, underground, to where the small barn would be, then have my meter mounted on the barn, rather than on the house.  Then, I'd like to run undground from the barn to the house. 

Can I do something like this?  Or do I have to have the meter on the house?  If I needed the meter on the house, then would I have to run the power all the way to the house (700 or so feet, give or take) then go BACK to the barn with underground wire? 

I'd also rather have the meter hanging on the barn, than on the house, for aesthetic reasons. 

[GRANITEstateMP]

Beenthere,

Can't remember if it's before or after the meter but NH Co-Op made this deal code after some bad flooding hear in NH a few years back so that emergency personel could turn off the power from the outside instead of in a partially flooded basement.  Made sense to me, hope it never needs to be used!

[GRANITEstateMP]

Piston,

When we got our site visit, the line designer brought us a neat book, with pictures (I like pictures!) that was a big help.

[Piston]

I just finished reading through the .pdf for installation guidelines. 

One of the things it mentions is "Primary" vs. "Secondary" power.

For instance, in the specs to bury the conduit for the "Primary" power, it shows 3 separate runs of conduit for power to run through, then it shows 2 separate runs above those, one for Telephone and one for Cable TV. 
It also shows a #6 guage copper wire, run at the bottom of the trench, the entire length. 

For the "Secondary" power trench, the specs show only 3 runs of conduit, one for power, one for cable, and one for telephone.  There is NO copper wire for a ground wire in this trench.  Also, all 3 conduit runs are side by side. 

It seems the "secondary" power trench would be considerably cheaper, as well as easier to run. 

I have no idea what the difference between "primary" and "secondary" power is. 

Which one would I be using?  Or at least, which one did you get installed? 

[jcbrotz]

I have no idea what the difference between "primary" and "secondary" power is. 

Primary is pre transformer secondary is post transformer.

[samandothers]

You will need to discuss with their planner whether the meter can go on barn versus house. They may not allow a residential meter on the barn. Also consider your house may be the bigger load and you may want the shortest run of secondary cable to the largest load to reduce voltage drop and flickering lights when AC compressors start.

Primary usually refers to a distribution voltage like 7.2 kilovolts and runs to a transformer. The transformer steps the voltage down to the secondary voltage level for the house 240/120 volts.

I don't know why the number of conduits for primary. I would expect one to the transformer for a radial feed and two if looped, third may be spare.
primary

[Piston]

(Disclaimer, I know nothing about electricity, as if that isn't obvious  :D)

So, would I have primary going from the power lines on the road, underground to a transformer somewhere, then secondary going to my house in another trench? 

OR,

Is the transformer mounted on the pole at the road, then I have all secondary going to my house, in only one trench?

OR, is it one of those "it depends" answers? 

I'm hoping I can only run secondary from the pole at the road, all the way to the house.  That would certainly be cheaper and easier from the sounds of things. 

Thanks for the help guys.  I know this is something that the design guy will tell me but I like to have a little bit of a clue before talking to him.   :D

[samandothers]

If you are 700 feet from pole you will need primary.  The length of secondary depends on load and motor sizes. The planner can help you with this.  The more load the greater the voltage will drop in the lower voltage higher current secondary. Also large motors when starting can cause lights to flicker more than you may want if the run of secondary is to long.

[thecfarm]

Put your meter somewheres by your door or someplace you shovel. In my other house it was on the wrong end of the house. The walkway was on one end and the meter on the other end. A bother for the meter reader and me. But dummy me,is there such a thing now? We just got the Smart meters here in Maine. But make sure the oil or gas fill is by a walk way.  ;D

[Ljohnsaw]

One (sad) thing I've noticed about this forum is that everyone seems to be east of the Rockies, or even the Mississippi!  Is there anyone out here on the left coast?

Wow, only $250 for the initial work?  PG&E (Pacific graft & extortion Gas & Electric wants a $1,000 retainer for engineering look-see.  And then they may ask for more if it gets "involved".  The money would then be applied to work that they could or must do.  I have the option to dig my own trench.  For my property (6,000' elevation), the electric service is underground at the road.  My property is probably 1,000' from where a bank of transformers are located.  I'm hoping for a permanent meter point at the entrance to my property and then running about 200-300' to my cabin and/or well head.

[thecfarm]

We did did our 500 foot driveway 12 years ago,it did not cost us anything. Back in the early '80's there was no power here. Power had to come 2-3 miles. I had the power company do a plan,$150,000.    This was before cell phones,so I had the phone company do a plan,I only had to pay $40 per pole.  Big diffeance in price.Too much for me.I did check out wind power too.Both plans were at no cost. Than more people wanted to build up here in the "90's and they brought it in. That was just about like kicking a ant hill. People started to move in up here.

[GRANITEstateMP]

The deal with primary / secondary was moot with me.  I had to cross a small swampy / wet area and did that above ground (cheaper / permits....) so that took away almost all my problems.  The pole in the drive has a small transformer and the underground run is about 200ish feet.  We ran one big conduit (3in?) that had all the electrical, and 2 smaller ones (one for cable / internet / phone) the third is the spare AKA just in case!  I belive if we would have gone underground from the road to the house then we would have needed either a transformer station deal (technical term is unknown to me!) or run primary the whole way (more $$$), like I said the soft ground / wet lands took care of that problem!

[Ljohnsaw]

Granite,
Interesting point about the wetlands.  Were they on your property or someone else?  For me, there is a road/utility easement on my neighbor's property to mine - it makes a very long, upside down, L shape to my property.  The straight path would be OVER the very end of a seasonal pond, potentially cutting my cost.   However, there isn't an "easement" listed for that and my neighbors might have a issue with the wires. I'll need to do some research on that.  I can see PG&E not wanting overhead because of winter maintenance issues at my elevation.

[jdonovan]

Not sure why the firemen don't just pull out the meter from its socket.  :

meters tend to explode when disconnected under load. SOP around here for all departments is NOT to pull meters. If I believe there is a undue hazard; pull the crews, and work from outside.

[Woodchuck53]

We had an issue with fire a few years ago and didn't know the power company had pulled the meter till we started cleaning up. Then they wanted to charge me to reconnect?? We also just got the smart meters. We'll see how smart they are now that I am supporting even more of the area peoples power needs.