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Won’t Be Sawing For A While

Started by SawyerTed, October 15, 2021, 09:07:37 PM

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rastis

Quote from: sealark37 on October 16, 2021, 01:56:09 PM
The bone doc will tell you the meniscus repair will fix it, but not like new.  Depending on how much he/she trims, the repair is temporary.  Don't wait too long on the knee replacement when the pain returns.  Replacement will fix the knee, but the leg muscles will not understand the changes.  My knee is fine, but leg muscles may never catch up.  Good Luck!
I tore the meniscus in both knees in my 20's and had the tears repaired. Eventually my knees failed and I had the first replacement this past March and second replacement is scheduled for November. I'm an avid mt biker (mike belben rode with me when he was still in MA) and after 3 months of rehab was back out on the trails. I have a trainer set up in the house I'm on twice a day.

SawyerTed

Did follow up with the doctor today. Arthroscopic surgery is next. 

We talked about everything from doing nothing to knee replacement.  We even discussed some recent "alternative" treatments.  Arthroscopy is the best choice at this point.  My knee is otherwise completely healthy besides a bad tear in the medial meniscus.  

Traditional sawmilling is out but I did something different on Saturday.  My best customer was on the schedule for sawing.  So I took the mill and "coached" him through sawing his own logs for 2/3 of my normal hourly rate.  I got to sit and point a lot. 

He made around 600 board feet with no major mistakes.  I'll likely be doing this again with him as I recover. I won't be doing this with just any customers but it worked with him. 
Woodmizer LT50, WM BMS 250, WM BMT 250, Kubota MX5100, IH McCormick Farmall 140, Husqvarna 372XP, Husqvarna 455 Rancher

VB-Milling

Quote from: SawyerTed on October 18, 2021, 07:47:15 PM
So I took the mill and "coached" him through sawing his own logs for 2/3 of my normal hourly rate.  I got to sit and point a lot.
Was he beside himself with excitement that he got to run your mill???
If that had happened to me, I'd be grinning ear to ear the entire time.
HM126

SawyerTed

He really enjoyed it for sure. Afterwards he did say he appreciates the difference in experience.  While he comes from a family of lumbermen, he recognized its not as easy as it looks.  
Woodmizer LT50, WM BMS 250, WM BMT 250, Kubota MX5100, IH McCormick Farmall 140, Husqvarna 372XP, Husqvarna 455 Rancher

GAB

Quote from: SawyerTed on October 18, 2021, 09:15:33 PM
He really enjoyed it for sure. Afterwards he did say he appreciates the difference in experience.  While he comes from a family of lumbermen, he recognized its not as easy as it looks.  
Many do not have any idea how much thinking is involved.
GAB
W-M LT40HDD34, SLR, JD 420, JD 950w/loader and Woods backhoe, V3507 Fransguard winch, Cordwood Saw, 18' flat bed trailer, and other toys.

barbender

He probably would've paid  1 and 1/3 of your regular rate, for getting to run the mill😁
Too many irons in the fire

samandothers

Sorry to hear of the knee issue.  Sounds like you have a great attitude and a wonderful wife to support ya!  I wish you the best on your journey to recovery.

SawyerTed

Thank you for all the kind replies and for the advice and encouragement from those who have been through this.
Woodmizer LT50, WM BMS 250, WM BMT 250, Kubota MX5100, IH McCormick Farmall 140, Husqvarna 372XP, Husqvarna 455 Rancher

jrsloan1

Been there, done that. Hope it goes well. Mine did for many years, then had 3 knee replacements in 14 months!!  Tomorrow is the 6 month check up on the last one. My Doc knew "our" type and told me don't be stupid!  Lucky my mill is hydraulic, works good sawing from a chair if you have some good help. 
Never trust nobody cause you can't fix stupid!!!

S-M

@SawyerTed Are those Sun Drop cans in that cooler?

SawyerTed

Yes, Sundrop is one of my vices. 
Woodmizer LT50, WM BMS 250, WM BMT 250, Kubota MX5100, IH McCormick Farmall 140, Husqvarna 372XP, Husqvarna 455 Rancher

Sixacresand

Have patience and allow nature and the doctors to get you  healed.  Praying for you and a speedy recovery.  
"Sometimes you can make more hay with less equipment if you just use your head."  Tom, Forestry Forum.  Tenth year with a LT40 Woodmizer,

YellowHammer

Everybody is different, so I can only tell you my situation.  The meniscus thins out with age, it starts to tear very easily.  It's a fact of getting older.  I had my hip replaced in 2014 and my knee hurt even then.  So I'm not afraid of that track and I was told I would need a new knee in 3 years, or 2017.  However, I'm still on my real knee.  I even went to a surgeon and could barely walk for the pain in my knee, years ago.  I wanted to try everything.  I had the Scope surgery.  I started physical therapy with a "real" physical therapist, not a 25 year old, just out of school, hospital cookie cutter one.  I also got an injection in my knee to get the swelling down.  Due to the pain, my muscles has stopped properly aligning my knee, and I was bone on bone anyway.  The more I walked, the more pain I was in, the weaker my muscles got, and the more pain I was in.  I eventually got to the point where I could not sit on a 5 gallon bucket and stand up straight up without using my hands.  My weak muscles were putting much more load on my joints and making matters worse.

There were two options.  Get a new knee and build up my muscles again, or do everything I could and build up my muscles again despite the pain, and hopefully the pain will start to go away.

Before long, my knee, while still hurting, started working better.  Part of physical therapy is doing stairs, which was not fun.  However, at my 3 month followup, the doctor walked in the office, folder in hand, and opened with, "Well I just don't see how we can avoid surgery, your old X ray is a mess."  I exclaimed, "Not so fast, I walked up the 3 flights of stairs to your office, and my knee feels good, not great, but good."  He was shocked.  That was years again.  He X rayed me again, my joint was lining up correctly, my pain was down.  No, I can't run without it hurting, that's too much.

I have settled down to a few basic exercises every day.  I slowly walk up and down 10 flights of stairs every day, in my barn, before I do anything.  Doing steps was part of my original PT, and I still do it.  160 stair steps, every day.  It doesn't sound like much, but for a guy with a bum knee, it sure taxes my will.  However, about halfway through, my quadriceps start to burn (one of the major knee alignment muscles, indicating its still weak, but getting stronger), and my knee starts to warm up, and the knee pain starts to go away for most of the day.  I also do a couple basic stretching exercises, and that's it.  I am also very careful on it.

I'm doing all this with my Doctor intently watching.  My physical therapist supervisor, who is a physician in the same practice "Sports Med of Huntsville" says she rarely sees a person continue the PT, although, in some people, like me, it does wonders.

Anyway, I know at some point I will need a new knee, who know, maybe in a couple months, who knows?  But not right now.  However, as others have said, joint replacement that come with its own issues, just as my titanium hip has.  

So, my advice, which means nothing, is to take it conservatively, step by step.          

YellowHammerisms:

Take steps to save steps.

If it won't roll, its not a log; it's still a tree.  Sawmills cut logs, not trees.

Kiln drying wood: When the cookies are burned, they're burned, and you can't fix them.

Sawing is fun for the first couple million boards.

Be smarter than the sawdust

SawyerTed

I appreciate hearing others's experiences with knee trouble and so many full or nearly full recoveries.  Other than this knee pain I'm otherwise a healthy and active 59 years young.  We just got new electric pedal assist bicycles I've been dying to try out.  Living with this pain isn't a viable option nor is continuing this slug-like limited activity 5h1t. :( 

Yellowhammer, the doctor has described the thinning of the meniscus as we age.  She also talked about the fraying of the thin edges of the meniscus.  Apparently the MRI shows a complex tear of the body of the medial meniscus, meaning the tear is actually two tears starting from the same location and going two directions.  The edges are intact. She anticipates the surgeon will do a repair rather than remove the torn area.  But the surgeon will make that decision during the arthroscopy.  The surgeon is one of the best knee doctors in our area.  He fixed this knee 25 years ago when I had some issues from an injury when I was an "indestructible" adolescent.

PT is coming right after the surgery.  Everything is set for Thursday's surgery.  Pt will be a week from Friday. They seemed anxious to get it scheduled.   I'm thinking there's a masochistic slant to that business.  My Dad had to go through PT a few times over the last few years.  He calls it pain and torture.....lol

This bout of knee pain has been off and on for about 10 or 12 months.  I tried to keep my normal activity level for as long as I could.  The last six months has progressively gotten worse.  Over the six months I did exercises the doctor prescribed and cortisone shots.  We took a conservative approach but the knee got worse.  Up until October 2nd I've done everything as normal.  That day I did a good bit of solo sawing.  On the drive home the pain was excruciating.  I've gone through some painful stuff before including kidney stones.  My knee pain is significant (not the "I think I'm going to die" kidney stone pain) but significant.  

My wife encouraged me to do something about it so here I am.   

As far as sawing goes, I've had to reschedule or postpone several jobs.  A few others I've turned down completely and suggested some other area sawyers.  A few have called back to say they will wait for me.  As best I can tell that means at least 14 jobs of a half day or more on the books for after my recovery.

I've gotten no indication on how long recovery to "sawing form" might take.  I'm guessing a few weeks.  Maybe I'll be in fishing condition in a couple weeks,
Woodmizer LT50, WM BMS 250, WM BMT 250, Kubota MX5100, IH McCormick Farmall 140, Husqvarna 372XP, Husqvarna 455 Rancher

red

Before and After my back surgery I went to Work Hardening Physical Therapy . . it was very brutal ! 
Honor the Fallen Thank the Living

beenthere

My knee pain experience is much like Yellowhammer (for me). 
Several years back, knee pain mentioned to my Dr. brought the comment "we can replace the knee anytime you want".  Three years ago, the Orthopedics clinic started some "joint seminars" where the joint surgeries were presented by four Dr.s.
Key for me was they talked about movement/exercise. I discovered the stair exercises that helped the knee pain. But sleeping at night the pain kept me awake. Tried foam pads, etc. and didn't want to take Advil more than one a day. 

Had tightness in the upper leg muscle and experimented with a random orbital sander as a vibrator.  That was over a year ago, and may (or may not) be why I do not have any major pain in my knees. Still bone on bone. 

First consulting visit to the Ortho Doc in July with X-rays resulted in a scheduled right knee replacement Dec. 1. Pre-surgery visit 2 weeks ago and was asked how the pain was in each knee. Said I really don't have pain, just some stiffness after setting. Both the Dr. and PAC asked me why I was going for a replacement. Answered that I thought I understood that was the only option to "bone on bone" so planned it after deer hunting season. 

Then I heard the explanation that in a study of knee replacements, 19% had pain after the surgery. So it wasn't a cure-all for knee pain. 
The Dec. 1 joint replacement surgery was cancelled. 
I continue to use the orbital sander to massage both knees while sitting in the area just above the knee cap for about 10-15 seconds every night. Remove the sand paper.. :D
Works for me, 
south central Wisconsin
It may be that my sole purpose in life is simply to serve as a warning to others

samandothers

I've heard it said the only difference in a terrorist and a physical therapist is you can shoot the terrorist!

YellowHammer

It also sounds like your physician knows his stuff, so that's a good part of the battle also, as they are willing to work with you.


I've had some excellent Physical Therapists, and some not good ones.  The better ones will make adjustments to my exercises to limit pain.  This is what I said about the "cookie cutter PT" places.  As my Physician told me, pain in rehab serves no purpose.  In contrast, it causes harm as it generates inflammation, which causes an auto immune response from the body, which causes more inflammation and increases recovery time, swollen muscles, aggravated nerves, etc.  Proper rehab is just opposite, it triggers endorphins that make you feel better, reduces swelling, increasers alignment, etc.  There is a big deference between the PT companies and practices that do it.  I will not go to a PT facility unless it is non hospital affiliated (independent) and has at least one PT trained physician on site at all times.  Most of the hospital affiliated PT facilities are used as training for fresh PT graduates.  Not acceptable to me.  All physicians will direct their PT prescription to whichever facility is chosen, whether hospital affiliated or not, and they will do their best to increase healing and decrease pain.

I'm not dogging any body's PT experiences, but I am just stating my own.  I have gone through proper and improper PT for several things, and the differences in approach and result for the same conditions is amazing between different facilities.

Also, prior to joint surgery, I requested pre op physical therapy to get a jump start on muscle flexibility and strength.  So post surgery PT went extremely well.  I knew the exercises, my body knew the exercises, and the trauma was reduced during surgery, especially when the surgeon does full range of motion trials.  So I would highly recommend it.  Its also one reason I keep up on my exercises, whether I do it in formal PT of at my house.  It decreases knee pain, sure, but it also prepares me for surgery with the best chance of a successful outcome as possible.

My Mom has had to knee replacement.  First was not good, she ignored PT, didn't put her heart into it.  The second one, she knew better, did pre surgery PT, then faithfully did her post surgery PT and the second knee replacement healed in well less than half the time and she was mobile very quickly.  Same surgeon, different knee, different outcome.   

YellowHammerisms:

Take steps to save steps.

If it won't roll, its not a log; it's still a tree.  Sawmills cut logs, not trees.

Kiln drying wood: When the cookies are burned, they're burned, and you can't fix them.

Sawing is fun for the first couple million boards.

Be smarter than the sawdust

SawyerTed

Again I am very thankful for the kind words, messages and the varied experiences you all have shared.

The surgeon is expecting much improvement. The deed is done.  I had carrot cake therapy at lunch. Doctor said don't do much until PT says I can.  

I feel pretty good right now


 

 
Woodmizer LT50, WM BMS 250, WM BMT 250, Kubota MX5100, IH McCormick Farmall 140, Husqvarna 372XP, Husqvarna 455 Rancher

VB-Milling

Wishing you a speedy and painless recovery!  8)
HM126

YellowHammer

That cake looks good.  Glad it worked out.  You'll be back at it in no time.  
YellowHammerisms:

Take steps to save steps.

If it won't roll, its not a log; it's still a tree.  Sawmills cut logs, not trees.

Kiln drying wood: When the cookies are burned, they're burned, and you can't fix them.

Sawing is fun for the first couple million boards.

Be smarter than the sawdust

WDH

Woodmizer LT40HDD35, John Deere 2155, Kubota M5-111, Kubota L2501, Nyle L53 Dehumidification Kiln, and a passion for all things with leafs, twigs, and bark.  hamsleyhardwood.com

YellowHammer

Yep, sometimes ya just gotta flop on the couch, TV remote in one hand and a plate of cake or chips in the other. 
YellowHammerisms:

Take steps to save steps.

If it won't roll, its not a log; it's still a tree.  Sawmills cut logs, not trees.

Kiln drying wood: When the cookies are burned, they're burned, and you can't fix them.

Sawing is fun for the first couple million boards.

Be smarter than the sawdust

Resonator

Under bark there's boards and beams, somewhere in between.
Cuttin' while its green, through a steady sawdust stream.
I'm chasing the sawdust dream.

Proud owner of a Wood-Mizer 2017 LT28G19

Don P

The neighborhood has been making sure Michelle doesn't starve from my cooking while recovering from the hip job. I had to have 3 desserts but I think we're close to caught back up  :D. Only hitch is I've got a DOT physical coming up  :'(

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