First lumber thru the PH260

[karl]

 Shed is up, genset in place, woodmaster with home built edger set up with kicker table and rolls, kicker table and accumilater on Logosol, stacking/banding rack built.

Need to neaten up wiring, add lighting, add shelving/storage, doors, shavings silo/trailer/whatever, add a seperate blower for the Woodmaster and who knows what else- but sized and v-jointed 5-600 bd' of WP this afternoon 8)

Logosol handles stock faster than I had anticipated- that's nice for a change :.
Genset is capable of running all the machines at once with juice to spare 8)
Thinking I may want to run 4 knives in the top (face) head for a tad better (mo'cuts per ")finish maybe ???

I really appreciate all the input from the forum members when I started thinking about doing this- Thanks agin.

I'll see if'n I can get some pics up this weekend....if the wknd is long enough :

[Justin L]

Good luck with your setup! The kicker table/accumulator sounds cool, I'd like to see it when you post pictures.

As far as running four knives vs two, only one knife will make the finish cut even if it is only .001" higher than the rest. The others will cut away the wood, but if the wood chips are too small the won't carry away the heat from the cutting. The hotter knives get, the quicker they go dull. The duller they get the hotter they run and so on and so on...

You can bump up the feed rate to make up for this, but only one knife is making the finish cut so the finish gets worse as you go faster. My old Paulson moulder has 8000rpm heads and I run it at about 30'/min. Sometimes faster on flooring type runs.

Build a cabinet for the knives- you'll have more money there than in the moulder

[logwalker]

But...that one proud knife can do a better job if it has three brothers knocking down ahead of it. As to the heat dissipation by 2 versus 3 knives, I would like to see some empirical data on that theory. Do you have any. I am serious about the request. It is an interesting subject. Joe

[Justin L]

I asked my tooling supplier(Charles GG Schmidt Co) about 2 vs 4 knives when I was doing 5,000' runs of a deep profile on a regular basis. I was told the knives will not last as long because of the heat buildup. I'm sure they would have been happy to sell more knives, and I had heard this discussion before so I believe them.

I do have a Bellsaw planer/moulder that I use three knives instead of the usual one. It helps having the other knives to cut, and balance is much better. If I could use only two I would though.

The same theory goes for saw blades & router bits. If you feed too slow they heat up and burn the wood, and also dull faster and get hotter.... My ripsaw is a good example, run it at 60-180 fpm and can get 30-40,000 LF before changing blades, but I also have a 10" tablesaw that is hand fed and it seems like it is dull before I get the spindle nut tightened.

I don't have any text or charts but it seems like there would be some somewhere.

Justin

[trim4u2nv]

As I understand it, more cutters are required for faster feed rates.  The faster you feed the faster you must remove the chips hence more knives (or head RPM's) and more suction on the dust collector.  Feed too slow and the cutters and wood will heat up faster because the same chips and tooling surfaces come into contact over and over instead of conducting the heat away.  Some of the 16 knife heads can feed 300' minute where 2 blades can feed 30' minute depending on desired KPI.

[beenthere]

An old wood machining publication, by E.M. Davis might help answer some questions being raised here.
A lot of good information about differences between different woods, feed speeds, moisture content, density, growth rate, etc. and knife geometry.

Machining .....US Hardwoods

[karl]

Another few hundred ' of vj today, then reset for shiplap.
Kept warmer doing shiplap (3 sides) at 35+fpm instead of 15 fpm for the vj, felt like I might be making money too.
Woulda got more done 'cept I spent half an hour or so trying to figure out why the Dang machine wouldn't start-I'd forgotten to latch the hood down and the safety switch wasn't closed.... :-[ : Had lots of company too- I need a gate at the end of the road.

Good read beenthere, thanks.
Ive done the jointing and backgrinding on my singlesurface planers, makes a big difference with maple.

The discussion about feed rate increase for more knives makes me think that the chip extractor may have a hard time keeping up- it seems marginal now.  I don't enjoy changing knives enough to want to do it more often or twice as many either. ;)

No pics yet- too busy, too cold, too dark and too lazy.

[fireman05]

Good luck and have fun with your PH260!  I do and I make decent money with it too!!!! 8)

Some things to watch:
1.  If you do custom planing or purchase your lumber to finish/re-sell, make sure it is consistently the same thickness.  I have a few other sawyers with bansaws who try and push their mill too fast with dull blades.  This results in thick/thin lumber especially at the knots!  The PH 260 isn't to kind to thick/thin lumber and you will have problems with your machine.

2.  Have some extra drive chain for feed rollers.  The drive chain is not very strong and lately I have been having problems with my drive chains coming apart.  I have milled probably 50,000 board foot of material though.

3.  For moulding and flooring, I resaw all material to ensure a very straight edge when going in to moulder.  If it's straight going in, it will be straight coming out!

[mur]

Hi Karl:

Get some "dial" magnetic knife setters.  It makes setting the top knives a breeze.  You'll soon be changing knives in under ten minutes with the dials. Just takes some practice. 
If you have the standard Logosol chip extractor like I do, I too found it minimal to remove the chips.  I put a seperate blower (7 1/2 HP) on the top head, #4. The chip extractor from Logosol is a good machine but.... minimal. 

I am also in the process of possibly getting another blower - 15 HP - 3 phase.  I think that will solve the problem too. 

[oakiemac]

Hey Beenthere-good link. Looks like some good info. Thanks for sharing.

[karl]

fireman05- thanks for the tips.
odd stock is the reason I set up edgers on the woodmaster- first pass goes thru there, then the logosol.
Those feed chains metric? I usually have a buch of 40 and 32 for my old planers- same problem.

mur- I'm keeping my eyes open for another blower. Good thinking on seperate one for the top head. I'm thinking Gehl 48" pto powered ;) -blow shavings right into Quebec, eh?

[fireman05]

Yes, the feed chains are metric as well as all of the other nuts/bolts etc!  In my area it is tough to get metric parts except the nuts/bolts locally.

[beenthere]

fireman05
Try lookin up what ya want in www.McMaster.com, as they seem to have a great selection for metric.
Probably others too, but McMaster-Carr is reasonable, quick,and good S/H costs too.

[fireman05]

Thanks!  I prefer to purchase whatever parts I can that are not OEM parts. They like to mark this sort of stuff up more than I can get for aftermarket stuff locally etc.  I don't like to part with my hard earned money for something that is exactly the same but cheaper through another vendor if you know what I mean. 8)

[karl]

Me too.
Thanks

[wiam]

Karl,  Reed supply in St Johnsbury can get metric chain.  They do not deal in cheap, but quality is good.

Will

[karl]

Wiam-
I use Reeds quite a bit, Nancy can find anything!
Had not thought of them for the chain, need my mind jumpstarted sometimes. Thanks!

Hey, we aren't worlds apart- we ought'a hook up for a cup of something onea these days.
That said, it takes a lot to pry me out of the NEKingdom sometimes : Usually a new toy-tool, or a woman on a mission. ;)

[jack]

Karl,  Sounds like a great setup.  What type of genset are you running that equipment with?  Im off grid, and am about to buy a 25-30kw generator threephase.  Wondering if im on the right track?>   ph260, blower, tablesaw, assorted wood butchering tools, etc....

thanks
Jack

[karl]

jack;
I'm not all that savvy on gensets- this one was originally purchased to run the Logosol, blower and an elec Woodmiser along with lighting and a sawdust conveyer. It's 25K, 3ph, JD powered an' thats 'bout all I know....
I'm real sure it would run my whole shop with no problem as long as I didn't have more than 4-5 machines running at a time. I normally work alone and may have blower, planer/edger, 4 sider operating at the same time and will soon be adding lighting and a second blower to that. I haven't added up the draw of each piece to see what the total is- but am confident I have ample amps :D
I'm sure there is someone on the forum with better answers than mine.....good luck with your setup.