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What should be my first chainsaw?

Started by Mattytripps, October 07, 2018, 03:34:48 PM

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Mattytripps

I just bought 7 acres of wooded land that needs to be cleared out, and I plan on making firewood. I have never owned a chainsaw before and have never used one. I am the type of person that likes to buy the highest quality item that I can afford the first time, rather than buying a cheap product only to buy another one later. I noticed that chainsaws are broken down into professional and novice categories. I'm just wondering if there is any reason that a beginner should not get a professional one. Are professional saws more dangerous, or more difficult to use and maintain? If not, then I would rather my first saw be a professional one than a lower quality beginner saw. What do you all think??

Ianab

No reason you can't buy a MS261 or 361 as a first firewood saw. Most folks don't because of the cost, but the safety / ease of use is about the same. 

Difference is the more durable construction, slightly lighter weight and better power. It simply costs more money to build a better saw. If you use a saw every day to make a living, paying extra for the better built and performing pro saw is certainly worth it. 

The "semi-pro" saws like the MS 291 are popular for farmers and part time firewood cutters as they are cheaper, and "good enough" to get the job done reliably. 

Don't forget the safety gear, sharpening kit and little things like some falling wedges etc. Things can go wrong no matter what saw you are using, and they all get dull after a bit of cutting. 
Weekend warrior, Peterson JP test pilot, Dolmar 7900 and Stihl MS310 saws and  the usual collection of power tools :)

thecfarm

I myself would say dealer,a good one. You will need them. Don't want one too big,but not too small either.
And welcome to the forum.
Model 6020-20hp Manual Thomas bandsaw,TC40A 4wd 40 hp New Holland tractor, 450 Norse Winch, Heatmor 400 OWB,YCC 1978-79

lxskllr

A "professional" saw will many times come without a reduced kickback chain. I've used both kinds, and don't see a lot of difference in routine use. I'm not terribly experienced, and so far, my comparisons aren't exactly alike(3/8 vs 3/8 lopro), but I'll be able to test both styles later this year.

If I were doing a lot of limbing in tangled wood, I think I'd prefer the reduced kickback chain. It's a little extra insurance in case you stick the nose of the bar where it doesn't belong. Nothing's guaranteed though, and you can injure yourself on a saw that isn't even running, so don't take anything for granted.

So... I guess I'd recommend a pro saw with a reduced kickback chain(a "green" chain("yellow" is the pro) in Stihl's terminology), at least to start with. You won't be able to really bore cut with the green chain, but that's for sometime in the future anyway(maybe never).

btulloh

You should tell us what you intend to do with the saw so that better recommendations can be made. 

I think buying a better saw is the way to go if your budget can handle it.  Over the long haul a pro saw is a better value and you'll be using a better tool the whole time.  They're not necessarily more dangerous.  The most dangerous thing about any saw is the guy holding it.  

Everything said above so far is right on.  Especially the part about the dealer.  That may determine your choice of brand.  I think the stihl ms261 or ms362 sounds about right.  That's a 50cc (261) or 60cc (362) which are good mid size choices.  If your best dealer is a Husky dealer, then you should probably go with the Husky equivalent.

Safety gear, training, start easy and work your way up.  Don't trust self-proclaimed experts.  There are lot of good videos on techniques and safety.  Hopefully start out with someone experienced around to watch and help.  It's important to know what you don't know so you don't attempt something above your skill level.  The videos can help with that.

I agree that green chain is the way to go for now.  If you make a mistake with the nose, you'll be glad you're running anti-kickback chain.  A good dealer probably wouldn't sell you yellow chain anyway.

Good luck, stay safe, and fill out some more of your profile so we can give better help.

And welcome to the Forestry Forum!
HM126

YellowHammer

I agree, go out to the country, find a Mom and Pop chainsaw dealer and ask them.  I'm partial to Stihl's, as I've still got the first 028 I've ever bought, and it Stihl runs.  I've had a lot of others from the almost smallest to the almost biggest and the one thing I've found out is the best one I have is the the one that feels the most comfortable and the one I always seem to grab.  It's the one in the middle.  Don't get the one handed version, don't get the hoss version, but get one that feels good and with the proper bar, held by the handle, balances horizontally, not tip down.  Get the anti kickback chain, the green one, and a pair of chaps and safety glasses. 

There are list of valuable tips and techniques, but the number one, the absolute most important is to don't cut into yourself!  Think ahead and if you say "hmmm, if I do this I might cut myself" then don't.  Seems obvious but most of the stories and people I know of who have drawn blood or have broken bones start their story with "I knew better, but I did it anyway." 
YellowHammerisms:

Take steps to save steps.

If it won't roll, its not a log; it's still a tree.  Sawmills cut logs, not trees.

Kiln drying wood: When the cookies are burned, they're burned, and you can't fix them.

Sawing is fun for the first couple million boards.

Be smarter than the sawdust

Runningalucas

I've got a husky 455 rancher that's lasted 10 years, and probably 5 cords of firewood a season; with little done to it other than sharpening, and squeezing the rails back in.  I changed the tank filter, air filter, and spark plug once.
Life is short, tragedy is instant, it's what we do with our time in between that matters.  Always strive to do better, to be better.

Mattytripps

Wow! Replies sure do come quick in this forum. Thank you to everyone that chimed in. I do have the budget for a pro saw so it seems like that will be the way that I go. I never heard of a green chain till now. I assume that it is green for beginners? I will likely get a green chain. I will certainly invest in quality safety equipment. I am not just going to buy the cheapest safety gear from Amazon. My biggest concern now with getting a pro saw is learning how to maintain it so I do not ruin it.

Mattytripps

 How do you update the profile? I cannot find a settings tab 

lxskllr

Quote from: Mattytripps on October 07, 2018, 09:21:06 PM
How do you update the profile? I cannot find a settings tab
In the header above, you should see text that says "profile". Click that, and you'll be taken to your profile page. Now there'll be an orange button that says "profile" near the top. To the right of that is text that says "modify profile". Click that and you should be able to make changes.

edit:
and don't think of a green chain as being for beginners. That gives it a negative connotation, like it's training wheels or something to grow out of. Green chains are for everyone except the people using advanced cuts that would be difficult/impossible with a green chain. For routine felling and bucking, a green chain will work the same as any other, and add a margin of safety.

Ron Scott

Some good advice given, and yes to a pro saw if $$$ is not an issue. Seek out a professional chain saw dealer in your local area who is trusted and can give you some hands on guidance and become your go-to person when maintenance or repairs are needed.
~Ron

Woodpecker52

You Can never go wrong with a Stihl , I use a 291 with 18inch bar and use a chain with RS not the RMS code, RS has better bite.  Anyway I have used craftsman, poulan, Mac, and they never last over 3-4 years.   I also have a smaller 026 that just will not die had it 25 years or so.  Any how the ranch and farm model has been able to handle anything  I throw at it plus its easy on the back.  Do not waste your time on a cheap saw they just are not worth it.
Woodmizer LT-15, Ross Pony #1 planner, Ford 2600 tractor, Stihl chainsaws, Kubota rtv900 Kubota L3830F tractor

mike_belben

A pro saw is worth fixing when it breaks and the homeowner stuff really isnt.  If you take decent care of good equipment itll tend to have a longer service life than the throwaway big box junk too.  

Dont cut with the top half of the sprocket nose, wear your gear and dont forget to put oil in the mix jug or youll need another saw pretty soon.  More oil > less oil.  
Praise The Lord

Southside

No matter what saw you go with get into a basic safety and saw class.  See if your state has some sort of class through the university extension.  Here in Virginia we have the SHARP course, it's not perfect, but will give you a lot of information and some basic hands on.  The Game of Logging Course is broken into several evolutions and would be a great resource if you could get into that.  Others mentioned chaps - which are mandatory, but you also really need safety shoes - if you could get kevlar / cut resistant then all the better - and a cutting helmet.  Don't work without your gear, I had a 2" diameter, dead pine branch that I missed come down and strike me in the helmet (they are called widow makers for a reason)- collapsed the suspension, broke the helmet, and busted open my scalp.  Got a concussion that messed up my balance for a month - but without the helmet I would not be here to type this, and that was a whole 2" diameter, dead branch!!!  In reality a nothing burger. 

The biggest take away I can give you is that if you are not sure about a cut you are thinking of making - then don't make it.  Trees barber chair, they spin, roll, they bounce back in the direction of where the stump was, vines hold them up, they can snag on others and rain down debris, rotten / hollow trees can and will do what they want.  At the end of the day it does not take much wood fiber to outweigh a 250 lb man, keep that in mind when you are out there.  There are not a whole lot of things in the woods that will kill you - but given the chance a tree will do so without hesitation or remorse.   

And welcome to the Forum, it is a great place to be.  
Franklin buncher and skidder
JD Processor
Woodmizer LT Super 70 and LT35 sawmill, KD250 kiln, BMS 250 sharpener and setter
Riehl Edger
Woodmaster 725 and 4000 planner and moulder
Enough cows to ensure there is no spare time.
White Oak Meadows

Wudman

I'm not a professional, but I have cut quite a bit or wood through the years.  I run one of the mid-level non-professional saws.....a Husky 55 Rancher and its newer teammate a 455 Rancher.  They are decent quality, reasonable priced saws for consumer use.

As others have said, safety is a main issue.  Wear the appropriate safety gear.  Quit working when you become tired.  I was trying to finish a job about a year ago and was pushing beyond my limits.  I went to take a step while limbing a big red oak and I set the saw across my leg about mid-thigh.  That took care of a nice pair of Stihl chaps.  It would have been a cut to the bone without them.  Hearing protection is another need.  I have diminished hearing from failing to do it when I was young and a constant ringing now a days.  Wish I knew what a set of earplugs were when I was a teen.  Take care and be careful. 

Wudman
"You may tear down statues and burn buildings but you can't kill the spirit of patriots and when they've had enough this madness will end."
Charlie Daniels
July 4, 2020 (2 days before his death)

John Mc

As others have also mentioned, I strongly recommend looking into getting some chainsaw safety training. One of the better programs out there is the Game of Logging. The franchise in Maine is handled by Maine Employer's Mutual Insurance Company (MEMIC). You can find their contact info (and other GOL training organizations) here.

There are probably other training organizations operating in Maine, but I'm not so familiar with your area. I've found the GOL classes to be well though out and well organized.

As far as YouTube videos go, there are good ones out there, and there are folks making them that you wonder how they are still alive. The trouble is, if you don;t already know a fair amount about the subject, it's hard to judge which authors know what they are talking about and which are candidates for a Darwin Award. One of the better series of videos I've found are the Husqvarna Chainsaw Usage and Safety Training it's no substitute for in-person training and experience.
If the only tool you have is a hammer, you tend to see every problem as a nail.   - Abraham Maslow

Southside

Didn't see you were a Maniac. Definately reach out to MEMIC, and if it's still offered try to get into the CLP (Certified Logging Professional) class. That was a very good one years back. 
Franklin buncher and skidder
JD Processor
Woodmizer LT Super 70 and LT35 sawmill, KD250 kiln, BMS 250 sharpener and setter
Riehl Edger
Woodmaster 725 and 4000 planner and moulder
Enough cows to ensure there is no spare time.
White Oak Meadows

Greyhound

Just about everyone on here has an opinion about chainsaws, especially when a newbie asks about what's the best one.  We all come out of the woodwork like bees to honey.  I basically agree  with most of what has been said, i.e. a 50 or 60 cc "pro" model saw is the natural starting point.  I'd probably go with the 50 cc model. Stihl MS261CM, Husq 550XP are two great choices, but there are other brands out there too.  This will be nice and light and easy to handle and do almost anything you want, but will be a little slower when you start cutting stuff over 20" diameter.  Once you get used to this size saw and start to consistently cut larger wood, you will add a 70-80 cc saw.  In contrast, a 60 cc class is a great compromise if you absolutely can only have one saw.  From your original post, I'll bet that you will wind up with more than one saw over time. 

Ron Scott

Yes, if you are going to do a lot of cutting daily in all size wood, its best to have two or more chain saws. When you look in the back of a loggers pick-up you will usually see two or more chainsaws. ;) 
~Ron

DelawhereJoe

For the price of a Stihl ms 362 60cc you can get 2 Echo chainsaws the cs 490 50cc and a cs 590 60cc chainsaw.  The Stihl being a pro saw the Echo's being farm/ranch saws but all of them with metal crank cases.
WD-40, DUCT TAPE, 024, 026, 362c-m, 041, homelite xl, JD 2510

Mad Professor

I'd get a "pro" saw but start out with safety chains.  Size would depend on the wood you'll be cutting and physical abilities.  Don't go too big with a first saw regardless.

Safety equipment: boots, chaps, gloves, helmet w/visor/hearing protection, gloves.

Tools to work on the saw, and to work on the trees with the saw.

If You can take a course that would be great.  If not get some guidance from someone experienced.

Lots of good videos out there and manuals.  Look/read those first off.

BC feller training standard is a great series but probably bigger trees than you'll be dealing with:

BC feller traing standard

Also some good manuals



RPF2509

I'd vote for the mid level saw instead of a pro level.  I had a Husky 50 Rancher for 20 years and cut 5 cords a year with it every year.  It rode with me in my truck and quad for those 20 years, cutting windfall across the road.  Replaced the bar once, many chains and a new spark plug every few years or so.  I finally retired it last year and went with a bigger saw (65cc) - again a Rancher version.  The new saw has more power but is heavier and not as portable.  It was almost $200 less than the equivalent horsepower pro version.  I used the money saved to buy extra chains and a new 22 rifle.  My sawing days will be over before it wears out I hope.  The big question for you is how big of wood will you cut? A more powerful saw with a shorter than recommended bar is the way to go.  My 50 had a 20" bar and I could cut 36" wood but it was not fun.  New saw came with a 28" bar and I swapped out a 24" bar on it and it rips through the wood.  Anything in the 50 -60 cu in range should be plenty.

taw6243

372 Husqvarna with a 24 inch power match bar and professional chain from Bailey's
4500 hours on my 2004 LT40HDG28, CBN sharpener and auto setter, 25" woodmaster planer with 9'auto leveling bed and trac vac chip handling system, 1998 L3010 kubota, 2010 L3200 kubota Festool TS75 rail saw with 42", 75" and 106" rails.

BluenoseLogger

The way you phrased your post I assume you are not intending to sustainably manage those 7 acres (which if you did might generate roughly 2 cords a year, indefinitely), so you are talking a one time effort to cut most of those trees. I'm simply speculating on how you plan to fell, limb, buck and remove all this wood but I'm guessing cutting rate might be quite high, so if $$ no object I'd go with a "pro" saw.

My go-to saw for quite a few years now has been a Stihl MS270, mid-range (50cc) so not a "pro" and sometimes described as a "farm boss" saw. It's great for me because as a one-man operation I'll drop, buck and then cut-to-firewood-length maybe 4-5 cords a year. There are some 20-24" DBH trees in that mix but for the most part I'm handling 6-12" trees. Twenty 6" trees or about 4 trees in the foot-diameter range give you a full cord, so you can see that my annual cutting requirements are perhaps 40-50 trees, spread out over a number of months in cold weather a year or more prior to use. So a semi-pro saw is fine for me, and as you can see I did some calculations to make sure that it would be.

I mention my situation to give you a perspective. One technique you can use to estimate effort and expected firewood production is to pick out a spot that is representative of your woodlot, and measure out a circle of 37 foot radius (I didn't invent this, it's a published survey technique, see https://ucanr.edu/sites/placernevadasmallfarms/files/76320.pdf). This 74 foot diameter circle will be 1/10th of an acre. Record the DBH of each tree in this circle that you intend to fell and harvest. Use a table, e.g in my provided link, to get cords per tree. Once you're done multiply by 10 to get cords per acre.

A by-product of this kind of survey is that you have at the same time estimated the effort. If you like you can keep a side tally of how many trees you have got to cut in various DBH bands. Unless you are hiring pros to do this work it's you and maybe some helpers, probably with little clue as to how long it takes to do 7 acres. Once you and your assistants have felled, bucked, transported, cut-to-size and split a few trees each in various sizes, recording times against a stopwatch, you can refer to your other information and estimate total effort. And make further decisions accordingly.

Is this too much over-thinking and paperwork? Personally I don't think so. 7 acres is not a small amateur job and you'll be at it for quite a while, depending on what human and equipment resources you pull in to assist.

Were I in the same boat as you, and wished to keep it largely an amateur project, and I was content to get it done over several years (assuming I have other full time work), not only would I do a tree survey like I have outlined, but I'd survey the woodlot local topography, with a view to equipment and vehicle access for log short-distance transport either if you are cutting to size and splitting on site or transporting offsite for final work elsewhere. Even for 7 acres an access dirt road might make life a lot easier, depending on woodlot shape, and you'll want to consider the practical mechanics of moving logs 50 or 100 yards, or for that matter even 10 or 20 yards. There are plenty of good online wood weight calculators available, so for example you'll discover that an 8-foot 6" dia green log of red maple is about 90 pounds, and a 4-ft long chunk of 12" diameter green elm is about 160 pounds. Purchasing a good pro saw solves the smallest part of your problem, honestly. :-) You'll spend only a small fraction of your time on felling and bucking trees. For 7 acres, without going outlandish on equipment expenditures, I'd be looking for every possible way of getting mechanical and equipment assistance. There are good resources for this, for example this online brochure from Nova Scotia Deprt of Natural Resources, Small Scale Harvesting Equipment (https://novascotia.ca/natr/Education/woodlot/modules/module12/pdf/Module12.pdf).

Hope this all helps.

John Mc

Welcome to the Forestry Forum, @BluenoseLogger 

If you get a chance, fill in your profile so we know where you are from.

That link on the small-scale harvesting equipment looks like an interesting read. I'm looking forward to reviewing it: you never know where you'll find an interesting tip or two.

I noticed that it was part of a series of home-study course modules, The link in the PDF file to the full series of those modules was not working, but I was able to find it, in case anyone is interested: Woodlot Management Home Study Course.

BTW, the original poster was doing his chainsaw shopping 10 months ago, hopefully he's sorted that out by now.
If the only tool you have is a hammer, you tend to see every problem as a nail.   - Abraham Maslow

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