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Homemade skidder

Started by DeerMeadowFarm, September 29, 2020, 08:50:34 AM

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DeerMeadowFarm

Quote from: Satamax on March 01, 2021, 09:55:55 AM
I'm curious. What type?  ;D
I bought a 0.97 hydraulic gear pump with keyed 5/8" shaft. I'm going to mount it to drive a short jackshaft that goes to a pulley where I will attempt to belt drive it from the crankshaft. If I get too much slippage I'll take Mike's advise and change over to sprocket and chain but since I have the pulleys already, I figured I'd continue with that route to start.
https://www.magisterhyd.com/product/0-97-cid-hydraulic-gear-pump-5-8inch-keyed-shaft-cw/

grabber green

You will be fine with 2 v belts . Mine works on my loader and steering . If mine had not have worked with the v belts I was going to repurpose timing belts and puleys from a overhead valve engine. The roller chain  seams like a good  idea at first motorcycles do great , but they vibrate ,stretch ,and wont hold up without alot of attentsion in an engine bay. plus they require precision alinement. And when the chain is thrown off alot of damage can occur . I wouldnt use a roller chain.

DeerMeadowFarm

Quote from: grabber green on March 01, 2021, 10:37:08 AMYou will be fine with 2 v belts


Unfortunately, I only have a single v-belt on the crankshaft...:(

mike_belben

A or B belt?  a B can take quite a flogging but A's not so much.  

whatever you do, don't backside tension around a tight radius, not even a little.  i shredded many double B belts on the power steering of my IH and it was the tensioner i designed.  made some changed and problem solved. 
Praise The Lord

mike_belben

the chains is definitely not ideal.. its a plan C.  but a single chain will carry a lot of power in a small space 
Praise The Lord

Satamax

Quote from: DeerMeadowFarm on March 01, 2021, 10:02:26 AM
Quote from: Satamax on March 01, 2021, 09:55:55 AM
I'm curious. What type?  ;D
I bought a 0.97 hydraulic gear pump with keyed 5/8" shaft. I'm going to mount it to drive a short jackshaft that goes to a pulley where I will attempt to belt drive it from the crankshaft. If I get too much slippage I'll take Mike's advise and change over to sprocket and chain but since I have the pulleys already, I figured I'd continue with that route to start.
https://www.magisterhyd.com/product/0-97-cid-hydraulic-gear-pump-5-8inch-keyed-shaft-cw/
I wonder if adding a bearing in the shaft's hole would be possible. 
French CD4 sawmill. Latil TL 73. Self moving hydraulic crane. Iveco daily 4x4 lwb dead as of 06/2020. Replaced by a Brimont TL80 CSA.

woodmaker

Just a caution; some pumps are not designed for side loading( running with a belt or chain with pump shaft and driving shafts parallel to each other), and must be driven directly from the end. If that is the case, a short shaft with a couple of pillow block bearings and a lovejoy style coupler may be required
franklin q80,builtrite 40,husky 372,sachs dolmar 123, dozers,excavators,loaders,tri-axle dump trucks ,autocar tractor with dump,flatbed and detachable trailers, and 8  f350 diesels

DeerMeadowFarm

Quote from: woodmaker on March 02, 2021, 03:02:46 AM
Just a caution; some pumps are not designed for side loading( running with a belt or chain with pump shaft and driving shafts parallel to each other), and must be driven directly from the end. If that is the case, a short shaft with a couple of pillow block bearings and a lovejoy style coupler may be required
That's exactly what I said I was going to do on the last page: "I'm going to mount it to drive a short jackshaft that goes to a pulley where I will attempt to belt drive it from the crankshaft."  ;D

DeerMeadowFarm

Quote from: Satamax on March 02, 2021, 02:31:59 AMI wonder if adding a bearing in the shaft's hole would be possible. 


You mean beyond the key in the mounting flange area? Maybe...? 

mike_belben

The jackshaft idea is fine.  A counterbore could probably be bored into the interior side of the faceplate to accept a thin bearing.. The faceplates are pretty thick.  The exterior side has the oil seal.  But i wouldnt bother until atleast one pump is worn out.  I bet it'll take years.


Fyi you cant charge the inlet side of these pumps.. Theyll puke the oil seal at about 8psi.  Tried it.  So anyone using one make sure you are drawing straught from a vented tank and not a tee on a return line or something.
Praise The Lord

DeerMeadowFarm

Quote from: mike_belben on March 02, 2021, 07:28:30 AMSo anyone using one make sure you are drawing straught from a vented tank and not a tee on a return line or something.
I'm thinking I may have used the wrong terminology because of Satamax's comment about a bearing and your comment about the pump wearing out. I am using a direct keyed shaft coupler that will drive a short shaft that is supported by two pillow block bearings. This short shaft will have the pulley on it. The pillow blocks and pump will be mounted to a plate that can be adjusted to provide tension on the belt. The pump should see no side load, unless I'm missing something...?

That's my plan.
Quote from: mike_belben on March 02, 2021, 07:28:30 AM
The jackshaft idea is fine.  A counterbore could probably be bored into the interior side of the faceplate to accept a thin bearing.. The faceplates are pretty thick.  The exterior side has the oil seal.  But i wouldnt bother until atleast one pump is worn out.  I bet it'll take years.


Fyi you cant charge the inlet side of these pumps.. Theyll puke the oil seal at about 8psi.  Tried it.  So anyone using one make sure you are drawing straught from a vented tank and not a tee on a return line or something.


mike_belben

Yeah youre gonna drive a double supported stubshaft off the crank.. Itll be great, the pump will think its being driven off a timing case gear and will live as long as any other part on the machine. We are on the same page. My first sentence was to you. Subsequent ones were to others. I shoulda separated that up with quotes.. Sorry.


I was just responding to the general idea that a bearing is needed inside the pump input face.  It isnt needed, but if it makes someone happy to tinker, have at it.
Praise The Lord

grabber green

Have you got your cylinders and control valve yet? Looking forward to seeing your blade design.  Have you thought about a 2 or three spool valve so you can add more stuff later like a rear blade or grapple or something?

Satamax

Quote from: DeerMeadowFarm on March 02, 2021, 07:36:54 AM

I'm thinking I may have used the wrong terminology because of Satamax's comment about a bearing and your comment about the pump wearing out. I am using a direct keyed shaft coupler that will drive a short shaft that is supported by two pillow block bearings. This short shaft will have the pulley on it. The pillow blocks and pump will be mounted to a plate that can be adjusted to provide tension on the belt. The pump should see no side load, unless I'm missing something...?

That's my plan.
I'd say that sounds purfect!
French CD4 sawmill. Latil TL 73. Self moving hydraulic crane. Iveco daily 4x4 lwb dead as of 06/2020. Replaced by a Brimont TL80 CSA.

DeerMeadowFarm

Quote from: grabber green on March 02, 2021, 08:02:56 AM
Have you got your cylinders and control valve yet? Looking forward to seeing your blade design.  Have you thought about a 2 or three spool valve so you can add more stuff later like a rear blade or grapple or something?
I thought about a multi spool valve but decided to go with a single for now. 
https://www.magisterhyd.com/product/1-spool-x-21-gpm-hydraulic-control-valve/
I can always add another one later. I have not selected cylinders yet. I have an idea of what I want but I just need to figure out the stroke once I start on the blade itself. I went to a local house lot that had been recently cleared and had a JD 640A skidder sitting there. I made sketches and took measurements of the blade which I plan to scale down to fit my machine.   ;D
I have a friend that welds for a living and he has tons of scrap and stock to make stuff from. My wife would die to see his yard, but it's always an exciting adventure for me! He is going to help with the blade build, but he's been buried lately. I need to get hydraulics set up first anyway... He has this ancient cutting torch machine that follows little sheet metal templates to cut any shape out. He cuts 6" stock regularly! Very cool machine. 

mike_belben

A flame table with a tracer.  Cool machine
Praise The Lord

Satamax

Oī, what is dis? A metalworking machine that I don't know?  ;D

That just gave me an idea. A big pantograph for my plasma! With templates! 
French CD4 sawmill. Latil TL 73. Self moving hydraulic crane. Iveco daily 4x4 lwb dead as of 06/2020. Replaced by a Brimont TL80 CSA.

mike_belben

Yeah basically.  But a 3axis gecko kit is so cheap you may as well just go CNC at this point. 
Praise The Lord

DeerMeadowFarm

Quote from: Satamax on March 02, 2021, 10:44:15 AMA big pantograph for my plasma! With templates! 
Yes, that's it. He has templates for cylinder mounts, quick attach bucket mounts for all the major manufacturers (CAT, Deere, Volvo, etc.), all sorts of stuff. Once he sees my skidder and my sketch of the blade he'll probably have half a dozen ideas that are all better than mine...

Satamax

Quote from: mike_belben on March 02, 2021, 11:03:35 AM
Yeah basically.  But a 3axis gecko kit is so cheap you may as well just go CNC at this point.
I'd rather buy something like this. 
PrimeWeld Cut 60 & Chinese Portable CNC Machine - YouTube
;D
French CD4 sawmill. Latil TL 73. Self moving hydraulic crane. Iveco daily 4x4 lwb dead as of 06/2020. Replaced by a Brimont TL80 CSA.

DeerMeadowFarm

Well, my valve and pump came in. Now, I just need time to mess with it. Out to eat tonight for a friend's birthday, tomorrow is my rifle league....looks like Thursday is the soonest.  :(

Satamax

Quote from: DeerMeadowFarm on March 02, 2021, 02:06:44 PM
Well, my valve and pump came in. Now, I just need time to mess with it. Out to eat tonight for a friend's birthday, tomorrow is my rifle league....looks like Thursday is the soonest.  :(
So, long time no news. Any good ones to share? I guess i'm not the only one being curious.  ;D
French CD4 sawmill. Latil TL 73. Self moving hydraulic crane. Iveco daily 4x4 lwb dead as of 06/2020. Replaced by a Brimont TL80 CSA.

thecfarm

Yea, many Thursdays have passed.  :D
Model 6020-20hp Manual Thomas bandsaw,TC40A 4wd 40 hp New Holland tractor, 450 Norse Winch, Heatmor 400 OWB,YCC 1978-79

DeerMeadowFarm

A lot has happened since my last post but not a ton of it skidder related. We had a busy maple season and we made just over 50 gallons of syrup. I had surgery on my shoulder to remove some skin cancer, had to replace the ring gear on my 1-ton because it was eating starters (and replaced the clutch while I was in there),  worked on a pole trailer, been digging drainage to try to dry up some wet areas on the property etc., etc.

I have fabricated a chain bucket to hold my chokers. I replaced the ropes to actuate the winch and brake. I added LED work lights. I used the skidder last weekend to rescue my younger brother-in-law's small Kubota backhoe that he flipped over on a job and killed the motor.

Since then, I had to re-mount the steering box because apparently the last of three bolts that hold it broke. One of the three, if the condition of the threads were any indication, had not had a bolt in it for a Loooong time. I repaired that, but I have some other steering issue going on now and it looks like the rod from the box to the driver's side wheel is bent...?

Also, the winch clutch has been slipping. When I bought it, the guy selling it pulled one log across a dirt driveway for a demo. I think that was all it could pull. I had a hard time dragging my BIL's Kubota out of the muddy location he flipped it in and I am out of adjustment on the clutch.

Other than buying the parts for the hydraulics, and mocking up/sketching up some ideas, I haven't done anything with that aspect since. I did chase some threaded holes in the engine block for potential mounting purposes...

I have got to finish rebuilding my Wood-Eze wood processor next on my list. I started to rebuild it last year right before my FIL passed away and everything went on hold after that. I've got that in the barn now and we have several rainy days coming this week so my plan is to work on that. 

So...too much to do and not enough time to do it. I still need to finish cleaning all the maple equipment and haying season is right around the corner.

mike_belben

Good to hear from you DMF  smiley_thumbsup
Praise The Lord

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