Tree of Heaven

[doc henderson]

anyone ever mill this stuff.  My cardiology buddy mike whos tables you have seen, has one to take down.  I hear it can be brittle and smells bad.  lives about 50 years and is an ornamental, related to some nut trees and maple.  it would be for wood projects, and if white, I may see how it does for engraving.  log would be about 12 inches diam. at the large end, and 10 feet long.  @WDH  @GeneWengert-WoodDoc     @YellowHammer  @Southside 

[Southside]

I have not. Any I have ever seen were not big enough to even saw. 

[WV Sawmiller]

   I've got some about that size. We always called them Stink Trees and they do have a foul odor. I have not sawed them but the ones I have cut up with my chainsaw remind me of the Pawlonia I sawed. Mine tend to be hollow by the time they get the size you mention. If it turns out to be pretty wood let me know and I will buck and saw the one currently across my creek.

[Nebraska]

   I'll wait for the picture show. I've heard of it but wouldn't  know one if I saw it.

[doc henderson]

 

 

[Don P]

I sawed a small grove of moderate sized trees. Finally called in an excavator and bulldozer to snuff them out... but that's another story :D

VA Tech did a study with Ailanthus, they passed lumber they made and dried around to woodworkers in the area. It has strength properties similar to red oak when it dries. High stress sawing and losses but what survives is good wood. I had a stack about 8 ft tall ratchet strapped with fans and checking them daily for a good while. The smell until completely dry is pretty horrible, then once dry its ok. The homeowner used what I sawed to panel the upstairs of the barn/outbuilding, looked good. I think I saw a couple of boards from that leaning up the other day, I'll look in the morn.

[lazyflee]

I've heard of some cottonwoods smelling like wet dog, what is this smell similar to?

[doc henderson]

some say nuts like cashews or rotten cashews.  some relation to Hickory.

[Don P]

All I can say is it is foul, breathtakingly so... with every log. I should have stickered it on a far knoll :D

So of course I had to taste the bark, which I found out later can be a dumb move, but it is probably one of the bitterest substances I've tasted. Another name for it is copal tree. Copal-resin, it produces a clear resin if the young bark is scored, I know nothing more there. It is allelopathic , it exudes ailanthone from its roots to suppress competition, much like walnut. When I say high stress, a few logs peeled off boards that could reach around and scratch your back.

The ambrosia beetles. That smell drew them like crazy. I used the borate dip tank and a good soaking.

The seed is winged like a single maple wing but it is a spiral that helps it corkscrew through the air further. There was a friend that was a forester that studied that seed.

[Cedarman]

It is an invasive tree and should be eliminated from your woods.  It produces prolific amounts of seed. Cut the tree and root sprouts will come up.  The sap if you get it on your hands can affect your heart.  Garlon is very good as a basal spray to kill it.

[WDH]

Strongly resembles ash to me, but unlike ash, the medullary rays are visible to the naked eye.  Prominently ring porous, coarse grain from ealywood like chinaberry.  While light, the wood is hard.  I have never dealt with any.  Grows very fast so usually has wide growth rings.  Another Asian menace.

ailanthus

[YellowHammer]

I've no experience with it, but from what the responses are, time to take it out.

[farmfromkansas]

Be nice to see what the leaves look like.  Don't think I can identify it from Doc's post.

[WV Sawmiller]

  This vid has some good pics of the leaves. The trees/shrubs are often confused with sumac. Mine grow pretty tall and cost me a section of backyard fence a few years back. I cut several more while it was down and have girdled several others since.

allanthus - Bing video

[Ron Wenrich]

Around here, it is often called sumac.  That's what I thought it was until I took dendro.  They are favored by the lantern fly (another invasive species).  Lantern flies aren't widespread yet, but they will be.  

A number of years ago, we had a few of them come into the mill.  I checked with the tie buyer if they would buy them as a misc species.  He said since it wasn't on their do not buy list, it was okay.  We sent them.  They came back and said don't send anymore.   :D

I cut one up for firewood this year.  Split pretty easy.  We'll see how it burns after it dries.

[Don P]

It is an invasive tree and should be eliminated from your woods.  It produces prolific amounts of seed. Cut the tree and root sprouts will come up.  The sap if you get it on your hands can affect your heart.  Garlon is very good as a basal spray to kill it.

I was cleaning up beside a house we were building. That area had been pasture and there was one huge mama tree, hollow but 3' across and then a thicket of generations of its offspring. Not knowing better I just went through with the chainsaw, pulling the "sawlogs" out and dropping everything, it had pushed out all but a very few other trees. I wasn't bright enough to hack and squirt, when I turned around the sprouts were about 4' tall, hence "tree of heaven", they rocket for the sky. We prevailed through the application of iron, brute force and ignorance, leaving it seeded and mowable and that is what is finally doing them in. However the property owner upwind likes them so it will be constant :. They are one to remove whenever you see one.
I found the flier from that study I mentioned above;
http://www.dof.virginia.gov/infopubs/Control-and-Utilization-of-Tree-of-Heaven-2019-03_pub.pdf

Leafwise it gets mistaken for walnut pretty often but the bark is a dead giveaway.

If dried under shelter it burns ok, it's one that can turn punky pretty fast.

[moodnacreek]

You have to be desperate to saw tree of Bronx.

[Don P]

Here's a pic of the wood, these were about 10" wide and 8' long so there are good boards to be had. Left is unplanned right is one I planed years ago. Sorry for the pic quality it is dark and raining so the flash took it.



 

[doc henderson]

thanks Don and all.  I think we will mill it for the experience, and Mike can enjoy making something from his tree.  I will have to post some more pics of his stuff, and he swears he will join soon.  He is making a desk and table for his daughter for going off to college.  the base from mulberry, and the top from a slab of walnut that I had.  remember in Ks we "can" see the forest for the trees!  (not that many trees).

[doc henderson]

Mike is a great interventional cardiologist, and I have known him for 25 years.  I was his kids pediatrician back in Hays (Fort Hays) Ks.  I normally post his stuff under "another happy customer"  here is his recent stuff.  



 

 



 



 

[taylorsmissbeehaven]

Thats nice looking wood Doc. I dont know much about it but I do know my honey bees are all over it. Brian

[John357]

Hi Doc,

I am currently in a multi-year effort to rid my hills of this tree.  I cut a 14" tree about 6 feet long and milled it to about 4" by 6", expecting some movement.   It was a light colored, fairly heavy wood, which milled easily.   The bark was very thin.  Leaves and wood do not have the odor that the other have mentioned.  The 4x6 twisted a little, and cracked at both ends after only about 3 weeks drying, uncovered.   It burned pretty easily about 6 months later.  I won't be milling it.

The branches are very brittle, so when I fell a whole tree, the mess is amazing.  Most branches shatter into small (2-3 ft) pieces.   Can confirm shoots from the stumps, and many small trees from underground shoots and from seeds.  The small one year trees can be pulled up easily be hand, but I could not pull out a 4 inch stump with the truck.  I even tried girdling a tree last year, about 1 inch into the bark, but she still lives!!

Now I know what to look for, I see it everywhere.  Especially along the highways in SW VA.

John