Just the Facts, the Crown virus.

[Gary_C]

Yesterday I talked to a friend who still logs every day and he caught the Covid last September and was very sick for most of a month, lost taste and smell and did not recover fully till he was given that nasty prednisone. He has no clue as to how he got it. 

As I related previously my wife and I both tested positive one day after getting our second vaccine shot  and some 10 days after a family get together at our home. There were eight people there and we still have no clue as to who or where the bug came into our gathering. Only two of the attendees had strong symptoms and they are the two that practice extreme measures of protection against the virus. The rest of us had little to no symptoms and are normal today. 

Another old friend that I went to high school with got the virus and spent most of September in the hospital and is now recovered and he has no clue where he got the virus. Plus his wife escaped completely. 

So I too have a lot of questions for anyone that claims to know the how of this virus being transmitted. The only thing we know is this Sars-covid-2 virus is or has been designed to be extremely transmittable.  

[Ianab]

The only thing we know is this Sars-covid-2 virus is or has been designed to be extremely transmittable.  

We don't KNOW this. The Common Cold is extremely transmittable too, just not very dangerous, so we live with it. This virus isn't as contagious as the Common Cold, but is more dangerous. SARS and MERS were basically "warning shots" of what could happen. MERS was a VERY dangerous virus, but died out because it didn't transmit very well.  

NZ has had very few cases, and if there is an outbreak the person to person transmission can be traced. So it's pretty well understood what the risk factors are, and some very "unlikely" transmission links have been found. Like the only link between case 1 and 2 is #1 got coffee at a shop beside where #2 lives. Maybe #1 coughed as they passed on the street, or they touched the same door handle?  Others are more obvious, case 1 went to Church and infected case 2,3,4, and 5 there. (Closed space, extended contact, loud singing). Every case here is genetically tested to ensure it's in the same "cluster". If a different variant turns up, then it's a different source, alarm bells go off and they try and trace it. 

In the US no one is sure how they got infected as there are still too many cases to test and trace every one. 

The worry is that the next virus could be both more transmittable AND more dangerous!!!

Have we learnt anything from this pandemic? Because there will be more in the future. 

[Gary_C]

 This virus isn't as contagious as the Common Cold, 

I couldn't disagree more. If that were true then the Common Cold would not have all but disappeared this season under the strict mask, social distancing and hand washing guidelines while Covid-19 still persists. 

[Ianab]

No one tracks the common cold cases. People get a running nose / sneezing / sore throat etc all the time, and still have over the last year. Almost no one goes to the Dr for a cold, but having school age kids and a Kindy teacher wife, there is NO doubt that cold viruses are still in circulation. Possibly less because few new strains have been bought into the country, and better hygiene / distancing would slow it down. But that's only personal anecdotal evidence.  We have all had mild cold symptoms at various times over the last year, so at least some of those viruses are still in circulation. 

That's very different from Influenza. That's a different and specific disease, and positive cases DO get reported.  But the control measures for Covid has pretty much stamped out the spread of Influenza. Last year NZ recorded 5 cases of actual influenza. Vs ~2000 of Covid.  Same control measures in place, so that suggest that Covid is more infectious than Influenza?

Hence my thinking it's less infectious than the common cold, but more infectious (and dangerous) than the current strains of Influenza. 

[doc henderson]

we have seen hardly any rsv, and influenza.  hard to document the prevalence of colds as stated.  children are different in that they are born with a naïve immune system.  they have their moms premade antibodies and they last till about 5 months.  people tend to safeguard infants as well.  so not as much infection in the first 5 months.   but from 5 months to 5 years, kids get about 100 common viral bugs.  that is 20 a year and if they all lasted 5 days (they don't) they would be sick about 4 months out of a year.  we are seeing much less.  thank good ness since if we had in addition to covid, it would have been much worse.  Most pediatricians go through a few years of being re-infected as they are exposed all day every day with common viruses.  most viral infections are dependent on viral load, and if you are immune it may take a larger viral load to get a perceivable infection.  you immune system is stopping infection and in fact curing cancer everyday.  Most viruses like influenzae that change year to year, still have some common antigens so you are partly immune from prev. years.  that is why this covid virus (there are many other corona viruses)  hit everyone so hard.  I have wondered if kids get it less, cause they have had recent other corona viruses (colds).

[kantuckid]

More likely that they don't frequent crowded bars and restaurants etc?

If no one in your "circle" has the virus, then you wont catch it, and if you mostly keep your interactions within that group, it's low risk.

Amish are outside a lot where aerosols rarely transmit.   The kids go to their own Amish schools where no other students attend.    Amish don't need to alter their life.

I se them often in walmart and other retail. I don't see the reality to them not being in contact outside their sect? They shop with their kids too. I have noticed some older Amish husbands who were apparently "staying tight with their wife" at medical appointments- maybe a modesty thing? I also see Amish & Mennonite ladies shopping w/o the men. Many of the females are very pale and sure don't look outdoorsy to me. of course they do ride their buggies and get outdoors more than some folks. 

[kantuckid]

Upon reflection let's talk about what they do that's generally different than our lifestyle. For instance, they are outside (unmasked) for hours each day. Hitching up the team, hanging laundry, working in the yard or garden. Field work with a team of horses without a cab over. No air conditioning and gas or wood heat. No electric and no sitting down until the end of the day. Children walk to school.

If vitamin D is a factor in fending off this virus, it sure would be interesting to test their blood levels against English levels.

They drink only raw milk and make their own butter and yogurt. Their diet is very vegetable oriented and they fill a sandwich with everything except the sink. They make their own bread and treats and can everything. Meat is local and they buy only from Amish raised hogs, chicken, turkeys and beef. They rely heavily on venison to feed their family. Most do their own butchering. Outside processed food is very limited. Their fruit is locally obtained too.

Y'all feel free to jump in if I've missed anything.

Has very little to do with what they eat.    It is all about aerosol transmission.   Wind and UV rays make it nearly impossible for that to happen outside.

The ones I've been around were not especially healthy eaters! If a 3/4" slab of baloney for a.m. break, noon break and aft break washed down with mtn Dew clone from DG is healthy, then I guess they are? At Walmart I observe there carts and see plenty of junk food, store bought crappy breads and such. I also see store bought milk, butter, etc.,  Amish and Mennonites both. 

[doc henderson]

most studies about physical exercise say it is good.  they deem that working in the yard and around the house does not count...except for the Amish.  they work hard enough and consistently enough, that they are the exception.  Weight is like balancing a check book.  I have known over weight Amish, but most are not.  the women tend to be "medium.  not skinny and not fat.  they have lower levels of heart disease ect.  they also do not get as excited if an elderly person is dying.  they take them home and take care of them.  they are not perfect, but get respect from me.  the younger ones are less traditional.  the Japanese had hardly any heart disease, so they had a higher rate of cancer.  you have to eventually die from something.  now in our country they have obesity and heart attacks.  livin the dream.     when burn 3 K calories a day, you can eat more.  fat and calories are bad if it pushes you over the output and has to be stored.  

[Chuck White]

Doc, your comments about the Amish holds true with my 2 neighboring Amish families!  

[Jeff]

Tammy and I had decided not to get a shot, but then we decided to have the pigroast, so, still being responsible adults, knew we would have to get it for that single reason and that is why. I let Tammy make the decision and said I would do what ever she did because we are to competitive to one go one way and one go the other.  ;)  We decided this last Friday. She made some calls and got us on the list. This morning I got a call saying there was a cancellation, would I want to come in early, I asked if they were going to take us both, she said we only have one shot for now, I asked Tammy if she wanted to get it or wait, she said she would take it. When we got to Mt. Pleasant about 1pm today I got another call saying they had a shot now for me. We were out of there by 1:30. we stopped for a couple errands and came home.

I'm currently feeling okay other than I spent the whole day doing nothing. NOTHING. That ain't me.  Tammy is in bed with a bad headache. Take this the way you want, but I was fine just social distancing like I do most of my life.

[doc henderson]

hope and pray you both are feelin great in day or two.

[ronwood]

Jeff,

What vaccine did you get. My wife and I got 1st moderna shot yesterday. I am doing fine my wife has a low grade fever.

Ron

[Roxie]

My niece broke through the ridiculous debacle that is the Pennsylvania system and we are scheduled for today to get the first dose of Moderna about 20 miles away. 

I am seriously considering only getting one dose because of the serious side effects people seem to have after dose two. My last flu vaccine was in October 2019, and I felt like death warmed over for 10 days afterwards. Thoughts?  

My 13 year old granddaughter was among 70 children exposed at school and we are waiting on her test results. Her parents were vaccinated in the first go round because her mom is a NICU nurse. 

[Gary_C]

 Thoughts?  

Yes, relax your arm and then wait to see if you get a serious reaction from the first shot. 

[thecfarm]

bruno, this is what I wear at work.

face shield

I wear glasses, so it can be worn with glasses. I work all day wearing it. I have lung problems and there is no way that I could wear a mask all day. Only problem I have it wearing it when I go outside with a customer when the wind is blowing. The wind will take it away!!!
But Doctor offices and hospitals don't like the shields. Yes, I could get a slip from my DR, but wearing a mask for an hour does not bother me too bad. Does get me huffing and puffing some, but I can manage it for that long.

[Jeff]

First shot moderna for us. Tammy's headache is gone this morning, I however feel like I've not slept in days.

[Old Greenhorn]

First shot moderna for us. Tammy's headache is gone this morning, I however feel like I've not slept in days.

I had some of that after the first shot, no aches or anything just a little weary so I took it easy that day and the next day all was good. We just got our second yesterday. only have some injection site soreness, wife is the same. Now that I think of it though, I am a little less energetic, but no big deal. I may not dig any ditches today. ;D

[kantuckid]

It was about 36 hours of misery for me after the 2nd Moderna. My neighbor/friend is my wifes age, 72 (she wasn't bothered much by either shot) and he was tired and achy for ~ a week. His own wife, my age is not a healthy person in many ways and she wasn't bothered much by either shot, in spite of her health issues.
That friends son who's also my nearest neighbor and a mid-40's KY state cop, refuses to get the shot to his Dad's dismay. I told his dad while sawing on Tuesday, I damned sure rather be alive than among the 568,000 dead folks in the USA alone, than quarrel about a shot for a few days?

[21incher]

Well pretty  much back to normal today. Headache is gone and the only thing  I am noticing is some of my joints are achy. Almost  feels like when I had lyme. My wife basically  had no side effects from the second  Pfizer shot. They say drinking plenty of water can help relieve the headache if you get it and mine is gone much quicker then the one from the first shot. They told me Staples will laminate the card you get for free and it's  a good idea to carry it with you for any kind of events or travel after the second shot was signed off. 

[kantuckid]

I saw where a fellow MC tourer/rider had his shot card laminated as he dreams about a return to the Alps. 
Seems pre-mature or illogical when there's the possibility that the bureaucrats may invent a covid passport thingie? 
I cannot visualize a handwritten card that's easily forged by anyone with a ballpoint pen, becoming a golden ticket? I just folded mine into my billfold.

[Magicman]

I am seriously considering only getting one dose because of the serious side effects people seem to have after dose two.

I would not be concerned about the second shot.  Get it.  I would suggest that the serious side effects are a very small percentage, and the non-side effect majority remains silent and goes on with their usual activities.

I think that some of the reactions that some folks have is them looking for a reaction.  Who is to say that they would not have had that headache, etc. anyway?

[kantuckid]

I never ever have headaches but the shot that can keep me out of a hospital or a morgue is worth the one I got after that 2nd shot! 
Get the shots folks.  8) 

[Jeff]

I am seriously considering only getting one dose because of the serious side effects people seem to have after dose two.

I would not be concerned about the second shot.  Get it.  I would suggest that the serious side effects are a very small percentage, and the non-side effect majority remains silent and goes on with their usual activities.

I think that some of the reactions that some folks have is them looking for a reaction.  Who is to say that they would not have had that headache, etc. anyway?

We have been fine all during this. We got a shot, now we are not.

[Don P]

It means your system is healthy, congratulations!

Still waiting here, apparently less essential than they told me I was  :D.

We had wrapped up mixing and pouring 70 some bags of concrete yesterday, kind of worse for the wear, loaded up the bobcat and I was pulling out of the museum when a car blocks my way turning in. I backed up, they pulled in and I went to see what was up. It was a family with 2 younger kids who had seen the website but neglected to notice that the museum wasn't opening till the middle of the month. I tried to tell them to come back when it was open, that I'm just a workman on site when the wife said "we're travelling and can't come back". I signalled to the other Don and began the tour of the critters while he was opening up buildings. The kids had obviously never been around animals but Lilly the cow and Gilbert, one of the oxen were happy to meet and greet and take some petting, even the new donkey was as good as he could be about it. As we were walking one of the kids said "this is the best day yet!" All my alarm bells and prejudices melted. I had to ask them to repeat themselves multiple times since we had different accents and they were carrying on in both chinese and english but we had a good time. The parents were so appreciative. It was a good reminder that we're all just God's children on this little ball.

[Jeff]

It means your system is healthy, congratulations

Was.