Woodland Mills trailer build

SETexan · October 05, 2021, 08:37:02 PM

While waiting on the mill (HM130MAX) we're starting our trailer build. I know I could've got everything together but figure I may just upgrade later and didn't want too much invested in this one. Plus I have all the materials, equipment and hopefully the know how 👍🏼
I do have a few questions and maybe get my plan set in stone.

Here's my plan at the moment- Cut the trailer frame I have(35'L 3"x10"x3/16") down to 20' in length and 33-1/16" in width(mill rail width). Should make it easier to maneuver and lighter. Planned on mounting the mill directly to the frame and shim as needed. Once set I believe 8 jacks will be enough to level out the trailer/mill and eliminate any potential sag. I'll be narrowing one axle and make it quick release and adding some loading and offloading ramps and a winch setup.

First question is: Would a little wider deck be worth the loss of maneuverability? I wouldn't mind having a walking deck on one side but don't think climbing up and down will be any fun.

Second question is: Should I direct mount the mill to the trailer which should be more rigid or use the feet welded to the frame for easy adjustment if needed? I don't think I'll need to adjust it much after the initial setup but would hate to regret the direct mount should a larger log cause and issue later on.

Third question is: what height does everyone like for the mill deck? Not exact height just a general higher or lower setup. Which setup makes what easier or harder? Loading, off loading, rolling cants, maintenance, refilling lube tank and fuel any trade offs that make you lean one way or the other.

I'll be adding plenty of cross support and can weld and also a CWI so I'm good on that front. Sorry for the long post but hey I got some pics if that helps.

Thanks for any information, it is appreciated.

Roundhouse · October 06, 2021, 12:49:53 AM

Looks like you've got a nice start on it. My build was similar although I purposely bought a trailer to fit the mill (3 track sections). My trailer is a pontoon trailer adapted to carry my mill.

As for your questions.
Since you're narrowing the trailer my 2 cents is build it to fit the mill with little/no overage. Mine fits this way and it's great for clamping etc. without having to reach way over. I walk the head and even the tires don't really get in my way thanks to the narrowness.

I mounted my track directly and never used the adjustable feet. My trailer frame has been rigid enough that levelling the trailer has levelled the track right along with it. I don't mill any uber-large logs but have never had an issue with things going out of line. I did use a dense rubber mat between the rails and the trailer to absorb excess vibration (there is a detailed step by step in my build thread).

As you can see in the photo, I erred on the taller set-up. I've never regretted this height, there is no stooping as I mill. It is also easy to sight along a cut when I am on the lookout for wavy cuts. With a log deck now, the logs roll on at this height and turning, clamping, removing boards is all easily handled without a lot of bending over. The only thing that isn't easy at this height is filling the blade lube and the fuel. The cribbing makes an easy step in order to stand on the bunk for refills. With those needing attention once a day at most vs. all the trips I make walking the head down the track I'm happy with the trade off.

RAYAR · October 06, 2021, 01:02:53 AM

Hi SETexan

A comfortable log bunk working height would be in the 24" to 32"range, depending on your height. Leave yourself at least another 4 ft of trailer length than the longest log you want to be able to mill. The mill head will need around 3 ft itself +/-. It's nice to have it long enough, especially for the larger logs so you're not trying to have to adjust the log forward or back once it's loaded in order to be able to saw it the entire length.

A few things for thought.

VB-Milling · October 06, 2021, 11:48:41 AM

Welcome aboard SETexan!

I'll weigh in after having gone through the same evolution very recently.

My trailer is garbage compared to what you have, which is really the direction I wanted to go in, but it didn't work out.

To answer your width question, get the trailer width as close to the rail width as you can. I thought it would be a good idea to have space on either side of the rails. That's how I built my trailer and I regret it. There is a lot of leaning over to adjust the log stops. Its 54inches wide. Not recommended.

Definitely follow RAYAR's advice about making the trailer longer. Very good advice.

I am making provisions to be able to adjust my track using the supplied hardware minus the feet. Right now I have the track clamped in several places mimicking what would happen if it was rigidly attached and my trailer has just enough flex to make it impractical to permanently attach. There's some discussion about it over in my milling thread if you want to read more.

My height is about 21inches and I like it for me. The way the tire size and axle placement worked out, even with as little as a 2x2 ramp, the log would clear the tire. If you are making fenders, make them removable.

+1 on filling lube and fuel tank at height. It is a minor annoyance. What I really find annoying is pulling the starter rope when the mill head is anywhere above a few inches off the bunks. You have an HM130max, you'll have electric start, so the mill head height position won't be annoying.

8 trailer jacks is good. My overall trailer length is about 23ft and I wish I put 8 jacks instead of 6 for better distribution. I don't think its quite worth it for me to burn 4 off, relocate them and buy two additional, but if I was starting from scratch again, I would get 8.

Good luck with your build and please continue to ask questions.

olcowhand · October 06, 2021, 12:16:33 PM

Quote from: Roundhouse on October 06, 2021, 12:49:53 AM(there is a detailed step by step in my build thread).

@Roundhouse can you paste your Trailer Build thread in a reply here, so I can see how you built it? I just brought my mill home yesterday, and I'm seriously considering Fabbing a Trailer for it. Thanks.
Steve

Roundhouse · October 06, 2021, 01:06:39 PM

Quote from: olcowhand on October 06, 2021, 12:16:33 PM

@Roundhouse can you paste your Trailer Build thread in a reply here, so I can see how you built it? I just brought my mill home yesterday, and I'm seriously considering Fabbing a Trailer for it. Thanks.
Steve

Sure! Here is the link:
https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?topic=90425.0
I didn't fab myself so much as hack and adapt but have been very happy with how the dimensions etc. work with my mill.

SETexan · October 06, 2021, 05:47:56 PM

Seems like everyone agrees a narrow trailer is more convenient. And the length I mentioned is 6" longer than the mill rails and does not include the tongue. An extra 2' on the tail end would make a great fuel/water/tool box but I believe some angle and expanded metal up front would suffice.

What's everyone's thought on winch post height? I figure 30"-36" would be about what I need.

Iwawoodwork · October 06, 2021, 06:42:52 PM

My mighty mite band mill came on an axle and the frame/track rail is all in one but the trailer you have is great, don't change the height, put your mill right on top of the narrowed trailer frame rails, It looks to be about a good height now. The top of my saw rails are about 30" and that is just fine for me. as stated earlier it is easier to sight along the cut and pull boards off at that height. Suggest making your trailer long enough that you can cut up to 20' (Think pole bldng posts) I can only cut 16' if the log is loaded perfect, so really 14' . I would make the trailer rails 24 to 26 feet and then make a pin on/slide in removeable tongue . At the back of my frame rails I did build a 30" wide mesh platform between the rails where I have my tool box, grease guns, hammer, tape measure, squares and small saw. I built a winch post out of 4"x4" box tube and the top where the winch is mounted is about 8' about ground as I wanted lift to make moving/rolling the bigger logs easier. My winch post sits out from the frame about 6" wider than the tire as I wanted the saw to pass by without having to take it down every time I needed to move a log or Cant, I do have power feed, so if you have power feed or plan on adding later keep the winch mount in mind.

VB-Milling · October 06, 2021, 06:58:37 PM

Not sure how scientific this is, but here is how I figured out winch post height:

I extended a parallel line from the top of my ramps until it intersected the location of my winch post.

Then I added the diameter of the largest log my mill can handle. (26inches in my case)

This way, the winch cable stays parallel to the ramps which seemed important to me.

Hilltop366 · October 06, 2021, 07:13:33 PM

Quote from: VB-Milling on October 06, 2021, 11:48:41 AMWhat I really find annoying is pulling the starter rope when the mill head is anywhere above a few inches off the bunks

Usually you can un bolt the recoil starter and turn it if a different direction will work. (if there is nothing in the way)

SETexan · October 06, 2021, 09:34:32 PM

36" above the deck would always have a slight upward pull, not as much as 6' of course but will definitely be easier to remove as needed. I could always try both lengths and go from there.

Daburner87 · October 06, 2021, 10:24:18 PM

That trailer looks overkill for the mill. I got the HM130 Max Woodlander XL package and its a nice combo, all in I believe its 1800lbs. That being said the bunk height is about 32" and the winch post is 36" but it does bend back about 3 inches or so and sits in the post slot about 6".

SETexan · October 06, 2021, 11:02:10 PM

Quote from: Daburner87 on October 06, 2021, 10:24:18 PM
That trailer looks overkill for the mill. I got the HM130 Max Woodlander XL package and its a nice combo, all in I believe its 1800lbs. That being said the bunk height is about 32" and the winch post is 36" but it does bend back about 3 inches or so and sits in the post slot about 6".

I hope it's a little overkill lol I like it and I have been holding onto it for a while so no loss there. Plus my boy needs some experience fabricating and I enjoy the work. I don't plan on keeping both axles though, one will be plenty and give me a spare for another project.

VB-Milling · October 07, 2021, 07:18:01 AM

Quote from: Hilltop366 on October 06, 2021, 07:13:33 PM
Quote from: VB-Milling on October 06, 2021, 11:48:41 AMWhat I really find annoying is pulling the starter rope when the mill head is anywhere above a few inches off the bunks

Usually you can un bolt the recoil starter and turn it if a different direction will work. (if there is nothing in the way)

I did reverse the recoil so its facing the operators side versus the exhaust side like it does from the factory. Maybe I should also rotate it so the pull rope is clocked at the 4/5 o'clock position rather than the 2 o'clock position.

I'll play with it. Good call

SETexan · October 11, 2021, 06:33:21 PM

Working nights and a 3hr. & 45min. round trip plus hunny do's really cuts into my craft time lol. Its slow but was able to get a little done the past few days. We got the axles off and the slide components along with the tongue and all remaining wire. Cut the frame to length. I offset my cuts on each cross brace to keep from having all cuts on one side of the trailer, I'll also use the cutouts to double up each brace. I'll space out the square tubing cutouts and weld them back in as well. I'll hopefully get it back together this week and get the outriggers all off then start working on the tongue next. No deep rust spots either so that's a blessing 👍🏼

I still need to decide on a good paint. Any recommendations? I'll definitely buff and wire brush it all first.

VB-Milling · October 11, 2021, 07:14:38 PM

Good progress!

As far as paint, I'm going with por15 because I can't return it.

@Gere Flewelling recommended SEM brand "Rust Trap" paint to me in another thread. Possibly available from Napa auto.

esteadle · October 11, 2021, 09:11:53 PM

> First question is: Would a little wider deck be worth the loss of maneuverability? I wouldn't mind having a walking deck on one side but don't think climbing up and down will be any fun.

I'm a contrarian, and when the right idea is so obvious, I have to think about the wrong idea for a while.

Here's where a little extra deck to one side might be useful: stacking boards for re-sawing. I am always throwing big slabs and quarters into my loading cradle on my Timber Harvester mill. It would be nice to throw some boards the other way once in a while. Stack them up out of the way, but not ground level. Now, you could probably do this with small, swing, pin-held set of steel bars attached to short protruding stubs from the frame. Wouldn't need trailer width if you didn't really need it.

Also, if you wanted to take a log or couple of cants home at the end of the day, a deck on the side might be nice. Note: not sure what your state law is, but in mine, the law says 1) if you carry cargo on it, it's a trailer, and trailers need to be tagged, and registered. 2) Saws are implements of husbandry and do not need such tagging. But if you carry a log on your sawmill, see rule 1. For me, a cant strapped to the mill is risking a stop, a ticket, and a fine. But in your case, it is a trailer, is it not? :-)

> Second question is: Should I direct mount the mill to the trailer which should be more rigid or use the feet welded to the frame for easy adjustment if needed? I don't think I'll need to adjust it much after the initial setup but would hate to regret the direct mount should a larger log cause and issue later on.

Lumber needs to be straight. To cut it straight, you need a straight set of rails. Over 20' of length, steel will deflect. You need supports along the length to keep it from doing that. Over my 27' of portable trailer, I have 4 posts at the outer edges, I have 2 "wing" jacks that lift the mill and take the wheels off the ground at 2/3 length, and 1 more centered jack that keeps the rails straight at about 1/3 length. That's support every 7' or so on a box tube 3"x6" frameing. While sawing, I prefer the wheels to be off the ground, which would otherwise give me fits and audible swearing when lumber comes off and is of varying thicknesses.

> Third question is: what height does everyone like for the mill deck? Not exact height just a general higher or lower setup. Which setup makes what easier or harder? Loading, off loading, rolling cants, maintenance, refilling lube tank and fuel any trade offs that make you lean one way or the other.

Hip height. You can lift and flip and turn flitches and boards much more easily at hip height and below. The higher above your hip, the harder it gets. I cannot turn a 12" flitch that is above shoulder height. I must get over top of it somehow.

Get your fuel tank low enough not to spill fuel all over the front of your shirt when you are filling. Napa 12v fuel pumps are cheap and reliable.

If you are taking your saw to the logs, be prepared for hills, and get good 5k bottle jacks, and weld the stand-ons in the strategic spots where you will need leverage to get even. Leveling and stability are big parts of successful on-site sawing. Steel is strong but not quite perfect, so you need to set the feet and get good at leveling it out to keep the lumber coming off the mill accurate.

Best of luck.

maple flats · October 12, 2021, 08:49:15 PM

Maybe I missed it, but the track width on the HM130MAX is 37" outside to outside. In your original post you said the track width is 33 1/16, I think that was either the 126 or the old 130, not the 130MAX.
I just finished assembling the Woodlander trailer for the HM130MAX with 1 extension. The trailer frame is bolted directly to the track, so it maybe adds 5/8" or so in overall width, plus the axles/tires and fenders. I might suggest 40" as max width for the frame.

VB-Milling · October 13, 2021, 08:09:21 AM

According to the drawings, it looks like the discrepancy between the two measurements is the center to center width of the leveling feet verses the outside to outside rail width.

SETexan · October 13, 2021, 07:50:42 PM

Correct on the outside width being 37" but the center of the mill rail engineered support location (33-1/16") will be center of the frame rails/beams. If I went wider and had the mill between the frame I would need to beef up all of my cross braces to support the weight of the mill and logs. I was just figuring up my axle length/width as well, I'll mock it up and try to keep it to out of my walk path as well. I am also planning on making the axle easily removed so I may just go wider for stability.

I did receive my email Yesterday from Woodland Mills 8) so hopefully it's just a few weeks out now. I gotta get a move on considering I just got the frame halves squared and leveled up today and only have a few of the cross braces welded.

SETexan · October 19, 2021, 05:01:24 PM

Making a little headway. Have the frame about 90% welded out and the tongue 75%. Hopefully get that finished tomorrow and start on the axle. Looking at painting this weekend since it should be a little warmer and dry.

VB-Milling · October 19, 2021, 05:02:44 PM

Looking wonderfully beefy!

SETexan · October 19, 2021, 07:25:23 PM

Quote from: VB-Milling on October 19, 2021, 05:02:44 PM
Looking wonderfully beefy!

With supports 2' in from each end I couldn't detect any sag with the eye so hopefully with the jacks it'll be nice and sturdy.

SETexan · October 30, 2021, 04:36:41 AM

It made it! A month before the stated ship date so I can't complain. Hopefully get the axle on this weekend and then start on the mill.

VB-Milling · October 30, 2021, 07:34:11 AM

Quote from: SETexan on October 30, 2021, 04:36:41 AM

It made it! A month before the stated ship date so I can't complain. Hopefully get the axle on this weekend and then start on the mill.

Looks like you got a few accessories and a smiling delivery driver...that's a winning combination. Don't be in a rush to make sawdust. Do it right the first time 8)
Ask me how I know... :D