iDRY Vacuum Kilns

Sponsors:

Anybody Else See it?

Started by firefighter ontheside, February 03, 2023, 06:07:36 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

firefighter ontheside

Woodmizer LT15
Kubota Grand L4200
Stihl 025, MS261 and MS362
2017 F350 Diesel 4WD
Kawasaki Mule 4010
1998 Dodge 3500 Flatbed

Ianab

I think the plan was to let it drift just off the coast, clear the local airspace, and bring it down safely in shallow water so it can be recovered easily. I bet it's on a navy barge already. 

Will we get more official info on what it was?  ???

I suspect it was a recon / communication system. I know the US is experimenting with them, and working on systems where they can hold position over an area by rising or dropping into different air streams. The idea is then you have an "eye in the sky" and radio relay over the operations area, out of reach of ground fire, There are also commercial companies working on the same thing, to act as cell "towers" or internet access. But control is limited because if it can't find some wind going in the right direction it can just get blown away (or has to be bought down). 

Not really practical over contested air space because any modern fighter would be able to at least get close enough to put some holes in it, as demonstrated. 

Not particularly useful for spying either, it's safe to assume the Chinese have recon satellites that watch the US already, so it's not like they would be learning anything new from a balloon. But they wouldn't admit they lost comms with it, and it just floated away...  ::)

Interesting piece of history. This is a 1960's vintage drone the US flew over China several times. Apparently the Chinese at the time never spotted them, although one malfunctioned, didn't turn around, and flew on into Russia. The Russian's found the wreckage, but couldn't figure out what the heck it was. 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lockheed_D-21
Weekend warrior, Peterson JP test pilot, Dolmar 7900 and Stihl MS310 saws and  the usual collection of power tools :)

mudfarmer

Quote from: Ianab on February 04, 2023, 10:36:57 PM
I suspect it was a recon / communication system. I know the US is experimenting with them, and working on systems where they can hold position over an area by rising or dropping into different air streams. The idea is then you have an "eye in the sky" and radio relay over the operations area, out of reach of ground fire, There are also commercial companies working on the same thing, to act as cell "towers" or internet access. B
Well I guess we forgot history and really ARE doomed to repeat it? :D :D :D Both the Union and Confederacy used hot air balloons in the Civil War for crying out loud

Ianab

Quote from: mudfarmer on February 05, 2023, 08:17:23 PMBoth the Union and Confederacy used hot air balloons in the Civil War for crying out loud


Being able to see what the other guys are doing, and relay messages to and from your own troops was a valuable asset then, just as it is now.  They have moved past a guy with a telescope and some semaphore flags, but the idea is still the same. 
Weekend warrior, Peterson JP test pilot, Dolmar 7900 and Stihl MS310 saws and  the usual collection of power tools :)

Walnut Beast

You better believe many people are furious including high rank! It should have been shot down over the islands before it got here! O it's just a air balloon and it can't do anything the satellites can't do! Are you that gullible!! They have all the information they needed after it went over strategic missile locations. Estimates of 600 to 800 billion in stealing secrets from private to government every year in US. But who cares when 1 in 4 are on TikTok. 

Tom King

I expect we learned a lot more than we lost.  Probably fed it a bunch of bad information and learned which satellites are used for what along with frequencies used.

hacknchop

Often wrong never indoubt

Jeff

Do not underestimate the enemy. Foreign or domestic. Dang right I'm paranoid. 
Just call me the midget doctor.
Forestry Forum Founder and Chief Cook and Bottle Washer.

Commercial circle sawmill sawyer in a past life for 25yrs.
Ezekiel 22:30

brianJ

Quote from: SawyerTed on February 03, 2023, 06:24:43 PM
Apparently it has some sort of heavy technology module they are afraid of hitting something or somebody on the ground if they shoot it down.  I suspect as soon as it is over US controlled ocean I will be ours.
Good Call.   Not only that there is a lot more intact technology after a splash down by Florida than a splat down on the empty plains or in a forest.

barbender

A friend said that his Dad told him, "the Japanese were buying up all of our scrap steel in the 30's. Then they sent it back to us." That man got to go fight them in the South Pacific, and he didn't talk about it.
Too many irons in the fire

21incher

Quote from: brianJ on February 06, 2023, 05:05:44 PM
Quote from: SawyerTed on February 03, 2023, 06:24:43 PM
Apparently it has some sort of heavy technology module they are afraid of hitting something or somebody on the ground if they shoot it down.  I suspect as soon as it is over US controlled ocean I will be ours.
Good Call.   Not only that there is a lot more intact technology after a splash down by Florida than a splat down on the empty plains or in a forest.



I was told if they wanted to recover technology they would not have used a missile with exploding warhead. Would just have punctured slow leaks in different chambers for a slow descent. At that altitude it's thought they had access to 4g networks and could verify tunnels to their equipment were still open.
Hudson HFE-21 on a custom trailer, Deere 4100, Kubota BX 2360, Echo CS590 & CS310, home built wood splitter, home built log arch, a logrite cant hook and a bread machine. And a Kubota Sidekick with a Defective Subaru motor.

newoodguy78

Didn't it cross the Pacific? Why wait for it to go all the way across the country to take it down in the Atlantic? 

Tom King

Better to study it while we own the airspace it's in.  Pretty cool that we're still flying the U-2's.

https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zone/u-2-spy-planes-snooped-on-chinese-surveillance-balloon

We probably intercepted what it was receiving, and had it broadcasting old Three Stoges TV shows.

Don P

I think it crossed at the Aleutians, thru Canada and into MT. The 3 that crossed in and out of our airspace previously were detected after the fact. We didn't/ don't have our balloon goggles on.

Tom King

I doubt they missed anything before.   He didn't say they didn't see the balloons.  He said they didn't see the threats, and it gets political past that. It was a clever sidestep.  I've heard some first hand stories of what they were able to see up in orbit, and it was a Lot smaller than a balloon, and Many times farther out.  My friend asked them to call him back if they found it.  The person on the phone said he didn't need to call him back because he was looking at it, and their theory of what went wrong was correct.  I won't go into details, but I sleep good at night with what we have looking out for us.  It's a good thing we have people a lot smarter than the politicians and newscasters in important jobs.

Ianab

There is probably a lot more balloons up there than we realise. 


Google launched dozens of them a while back experimenting with a communications network. Turned out not to be very practical, so they have shelved the idea. But here's a list of where some of them came down. Their kit had an aircraft ADS-B transmitter, so they showed up on civilian radar, but they ended up all over the place. The NZ launched ones landed in Sth America / Africa and Australia. But there was no mystery about what they were, and you could track them on public aircraft tracking web pages.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loon_LLC#Incidents


And the US Govt testing them for border / drug surveillance. They just didn't loose one and have it drift away over China....
Pentagon testing mass surveillance balloons across the US | US military | The Guardian 


I'm not even sure regular military radar would track them? Something slow moving like that would probably be filtered out by the system as background noise. Same as weather and flocks of birds. 


This one got the headlines because it was big / visible, and a mystery. Until it's confirmed otherwise I'm assuming it was an experimental surveillance / comms balloon system, that escaped. Sending it over the USA on purpose would have been a dumb idea, as the US authorities can now have a look at a somewhat beat up version of the Chinese tech. The Chinese saying it's a "research balloon", probably isn't technically a lie, they just aren't saying exactly what it's "researching". I assume something similar to the Pentagon research linked above? 


Also interesting was using a sidewinder missile to take it down. They did that so the balloon burst completely and came down quick, where they wanted it, for easy recovery. But traditional sidewinders are infra red homing, and go for the hot exhaust of the target. They wouldn't lock onto a balloon any more than they wold lock onto a cloud. There are now radar guided versions, so I assume that's what they used. Even then the fire control could have problems with a practically stationary target. I would guess the first passes the jets made were to confirm they could actually get a weapons lock, and maybe take some closer pics of it undamaged?
Weekend warrior, Peterson JP test pilot, Dolmar 7900 and Stihl MS310 saws and  the usual collection of power tools :)

Walnut Beast


Walnut Beast

Doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out the travel path. A few years back.  Do you remember the Chinese company that provided the computer systems and tower electronics for US cellular companies. Yes they were shut down when several towers were being installed by missile locations in various states

Walnut Beast

Fact!! The Pentagon says there was sensitive information transmitted to China until they were aware of it. And you don't think they had serious surveillance equipment on a balloon that was the size of a 20 story building and payload capacity of a jet. Just a ballon? That's the reason they used it. Slow moving to evade  radar 

Southside

It's amazing how much of an idiot Lloyd Austin really is. Shutting off sensitive systems, and telling the world you did so, is just as bad as having them being intercepted. 

When gathering intelligence it's not what you see and hear, even if you can't understand it, that counts, it's what you suddenly don't see and hear that you pay attention to. "Oh, look they know we are listening and that box over there suddenly went dark", guess what gets focused on from then on.

Hide in plain sight, pretend to be dumb, and the other side will spoon feed you. 
Franklin buncher and skidder
JD Processor
Woodmizer LT Super 70 and LT35 sawmill, KD250 kiln, BMS 250 sharpener and setter
Riehl Edger
Woodmaster 725 and 4000 planner and moulder
Enough cows to ensure there is no spare time.
White Oak Meadows

Walnut Beast

They said it was to dangerous to pick the debris up in Alaska waters, way to easy to pick up in Montana and wanted it to be somewhat difficult back out in the ocean and real difficult to get the bigger stuff off the ocean floor. What a 🤡 

JJ

I just see that US has shot down another one off Alaska, reason given for shooting the new one down was it was at 40,000' in commercial airliner traveling space..

air_plane

Havent released any pictures.

Walnut Beast

President Joe wants to make a splash this time 😂

Southside

Before this week when was the last time something was shot down in US airspace? Technically Hawaii was only a territory on Dec 7, 1941. 
Franklin buncher and skidder
JD Processor
Woodmizer LT Super 70 and LT35 sawmill, KD250 kiln, BMS 250 sharpener and setter
Riehl Edger
Woodmaster 725 and 4000 planner and moulder
Enough cows to ensure there is no spare time.
White Oak Meadows

B.C.C. Lapp

Quote from: Southside on February 10, 2023, 09:55:25 AM


Hide in plain sight, pretend to be dumb, .
Well, that shouldn't be to tough for biden and his crew.
Listen, or your tongue will make you deaf.

Thank You Sponsors!