Hi all,
Currently I've got a heavy duty utility trailer that is a real pain in the ass for log loading. The list of things wrong with it for log loading/unloading is very long lol I'm looking to get a deck over trailer to parbuckle the logs on. I've got some 4"x4" tube steel that I was thinking of re-purposing into ramps.
Looking for perspective from other people, so I'll pose this question:
If you could start from scratch (with a modest budget of course!!), what type of trailer and log loading unloading technique would you use?
I've looked into the log arches and it seems like it would take longer to do it that way than to roll it up the side. With my current layout, I have a tree that I can chain the log to and pull the trailer off like that, but would like to rearrange my mill to be next to my garage, so I'm thinking long-run, the deckover parbuckle strategy would be the way to go so I can roll the logs off the side. Any logs that are too big for my mill, I'll either avoid, or use the alaskan mill on-site and load the slabs one by one.
Thanks for your insights!
This guy has it figured out.
Firewood Log Trailer - YouTube (https://youtu.be/Nli3C6sh5XA)
I haul sawlogs in a set of baby bunks on my gooseneck, because the mill always has a wheel loader or knuckle boom to take them off. But when i haul firewood logs to my house, i just lay them on the deck with no bunks, (using bobcat) then pound tapered hickory stakes into the rubrail and chain down. I pull the stakes at home and use a big forklift to tip the whole trailer and launch it all off the side for processing.
Its the irregular pieces that are terrible to unload with forklift. Log length isnt bad but chunks are terrible.
I know of one guy that use to park the trailer next to the mill and just roll the logs from the trailer to the mill.
Wow, that guy really does have it figured out. that would be so much better than manually loading logs on my 5x8 with sides.
Now you got me wanting to build a trailer :)
Russ if you want to get a deckover and set it up to parbuckle make sure you have a stationary winch with plenty of cable and power. then you can run snatchblocks to redirect the cable wherever you want to. I would also make pockets all around, both sides, and the back of the trailer so you can load and unload from any direction. The pockets would be so you can place the parbuckle ramps into them and not have them move on you. And don't forget winch hook loops all over the place. that way you can run the cable over the log and back to the trailer to make rolling it much easier.
One other thing I have thought of for my ramps I will be building for my mill are log stops every 24" or so. have them gravity loaded to stay in the lock position but as the log rolls over them they get pushed down, as soon as the log clears them they pop up and create a physical stop. This way if you need to reset your rigging or if a cable lets go the log will not takeoff and squish something important. Very similar to the spikey parking lot things that everyone hates driving over.
This concludes the random thoughts flowing out of my head :)
Thats a good idea Crusarius. Make your steel fingers with a 1" pivot hole. Slide them onto a 1" pipe or shaft and weld in place. Mount the shaft on some offset hangers to the mill, with a handle at the end so that you can rotate the whole assembly. [Picture tractor trailer door latch rod, oriented horizontal] use hay rake teeth that engage the mill frame as the spring mechanism to let the teeth roll down then pop back up.
So when you want this rig out of your way it just hangs over the side of the mill. When you need it, rotate the bar and the fingers come up to lay ontop. Theyll let a log roll over one way but stop it from rolling the other.
As for parbuckling, i recommend standard stake and rub rail all the way around, then just build your conventional car style ramps with hooks that engage a rub rail. Leave your stake pockets slightly below grade of your rub rail for infinite slideability. This way you only have to lift one end once you hook it at the back. Just slide on up to position. Mine are pretty heavy. Shorter is better in parbuckle ramps, the cable wont mind raising logs up a 1:1 grade but a long ramp weighs a ton and will bend, then not fit in the ramp pocket.
I like the idea mike my thought was 2"x8"x1/4" plate with hole drilled off center then bolted to side of 2x6 steel ramp. with the offset hole it will make it auto lock just with the weight of the tail pulling it down.
Well, thats probably even cheaper now that you mention it. No spring to break.
and no resistance when trying to roll the log up.
I really hope we didn't hijack this thread :)
Hijacks are the cost one must bare in order to get the info they seek for free.
A tax attorney wont hijack the conversation, but he charges by the hour to stay on topic.
How I load my flat bed trailer. Winch mounted on the tongue. Wireless remote is thirty bucks and a must. Saves many a step.
Put a log cross ways behind the trailer and larger than the height of the trailer. You can skip this. Pull my logs up to the trailer using a pair of tongs chained to a tractor boom pole. As I get close to the trailer cut sharply to one side or the other and start lifting the boom pole. Log will usually sling up on the trailer. Then pull the rest of the way up on trailer with winch. Longer logs on the bottom and can go two high. Takes about 13 minutes per log to load.
Quote from: luvmexfood on August 28, 2018, 12:42:47 PM
How I load my flat bed trailer. Winch mounted on the tongue. Wireless remote is thirty bucks and a must. Saves many a step.
Put a log cross ways behind the trailer and larger than the height of the trailer. You can skip this. Pull my logs up to the trailer using a pair of tongs chained to a tractor boom pole. As I get close to the trailer cut sharply to one side or the other and start lifting the boom pole. Log will usually sling up on the trailer. Then pull the rest of the way up on trailer with winch. Longer logs on the bottom and can go two high. Takes about 13 minutes per log to load.
Sounds interesting. Got a video or picture sequence?
Quote from: mike_belben on August 27, 2018, 10:39:02 PM
This guy has it figured out.
Firewood Log Trailer - YouTube (https://youtu.be/Nli3C6sh5XA)
Thanks for posting that Mike. Lots of good ideas and food for thought in there.
gg
Quote from: John Mc on August 28, 2018, 01:26:25 PM
Quote from: luvmexfood on August 28, 2018, 12:42:47 PM
How I load my flat bed trailer. Winch mounted on the tongue. Wireless remote is thirty bucks and a must. Saves many a step.
Put a log cross ways behind the trailer and larger than the height of the trailer. You can skip this. Pull my logs up to the trailer using a pair of tongs chained to a tractor boom pole. As I get close to the trailer cut sharply to one side or the other and start lifting the boom pole. Log will usually sling up on the trailer. Then pull the rest of the way up on trailer with winch. Longer logs on the bottom and can go two high. Takes about 13 minutes per log to load.
Sounds interesting. Got a video or picture sequence?
Not anymore. Don't know when I will get back into the woods to get some. Doing some work out on the road right now. Saving my logs for when I don't have work.
Thanks for all the insights guys, these are all awesome ideas!! And don't worry about hijacking anything, it's good to let the ideas flow!
So the side he off load on. I would set it up like the hyd mills heavy enough to roll the log on then the left to bring them to the deck of the trailer.. he has it all set to go just add some cradles to the right side
That setup could act as a log deck for the sawmill to. Just roll it straight from the trailer onto the mill and cut away.
Shoot why not make the drop side out of upturned 3" C-channel with 2 strands of conveyor chain for a live log deck onto your mill bed? Rob the gearbox off a 2speed tractor trailer landing gear for a handpower, or use a starter motor with the nosecone cut off and a sprocket welded on for DC. Just toss the solenoid fork.
It would be handy at feeding slabwood or lumber back onto the trailer too.
Mike, I like the way you think. that would be a pretty slick setup.
I always find myself doing this, I start at level 1 and before I know it the project has evolved 10 times and become to expensive :)
But hey dreaming is fun :)
Good news is that won't be all that expensive to build. I am estimating with all new parts probably be about $3500 not including labor.
It dont cost me nothing to tell someone else how to build the junk ill never get around to ;D
Good call :)
I will build one eventually.needs to be small enough to tow with my jeep, the Kubota L2800. yet big enough to collect enough logs so I don't have to make 2 trips.
Be nice to have a standalone brake system on it for pulling through the woods behind the jeep or kubota. I really don't like being pushed down hills.
Quote from: Crusarius on August 31, 2018, 09:57:34 AMBe nice to have a standalone brake system on it for pulling through the woods behind the jeep or kubota. I really don't like being pushed down hills.
I've been debating adding an electric brake controller to my tractor and just using the manual "booster lever" on the controller to activate trailer brakes.
You could add surge brakes.
Quote from: btulloh on August 31, 2018, 04:57:36 PM
You could add surge brakes.
I much prefer electric for over-the-road towing. Electric is not necessarily an ideal in-the-woods solution, but I can deal with it.
I use a deck over trailer and a set of removable ramps from a dump trailer to parbuckle logs. My winch is portable with quick disconnects on the power cables so I can add a longer extension for when I put the winch on the sides. I use a receiver hitch to mount the winch on the front of the trailer normally. At the moment I chain the winch to the rub rail to parbuckle but I'm hopeing to make a moveable bracket soon. I second that the remote control is a must the best money I spent. For bunks I put oak stakes in after I'm done loading.
here are a few pics of my log arch. don't know exact weight of each log it loaded, but the last tree i hauled, scaled in at 12,300#. i loaded it in 2 sections.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/51365/pecan_loading1.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1535777251)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/51365/arch_lifting_system1.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1535777756)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/51365/arch_winching_system.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1535777762)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/51365/arch_winch_view1.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1535777751)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/51365/arch_hinge_system.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1535777735)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/51365/arch_hinge_system1.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1535777763)
first test lift. close to 3000# and it, arch and welds, and winch held over night with the load suspended.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/51365/arch_red_oak_test_load.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1535777744)
The first pic: It seems to me that this will be at the limit of the weight capacity which the smallish looking arch could handle.(https://forestryforum.com/board/Smileys/default/huh.gif)
Happy you went with the 12k winch? hows it work? does it stop as soon as you let go of the button or freewheel a bit first?
Surge brakes was my thought but they have a tendency to be a big pain going down long steel hills.
My .02- I hate surge brakes!
Surge brakes have their place. I don't think offroad trailer is their place. especially if connected to 3 point hitch on a tractor.
Build a rugged fixed dropleg where the trailer jack normally goes. Weld some rebar or whatever to create a traction cleat underneath like a backhoe pad uses. Set the height so it keeps the hitch maybe 10" off the ground.
When it starts pushing you, dump the 3pt and let it drag until you get back in control.
Thats a good idea. never thought of something that simple. Still scary though thinking it could go sideways and get really crazy.
Just gotta know your limitations i guess.
Quote from: mike_belben on September 04, 2018, 10:24:13 AM
Build a rugged fixed dropleg where the trailer jack normally goes. Weld some rebar or whatever to create a traction cleat underneath like a backhoe pad uses. Set the height so it keeps the hitch maybe 10" off the ground.
When it starts pushing you, dump the 3pt and let it drag until you get back in control.
I'm not sure how reliably that will work. Most tractors do not have down pressure on their 3 Pt hitches. If you are being pushed, your 3 Pt hitch could just as well be pushed up, regardless of where you put your position control. Trailer tongue weight might help some, but can't be counted on to provide braking. (I've dragged a couple thousand pounds of oak logs that have pushed my logging winch and 3 Pt hitch up when I go over uneven terrain. At least in those cases, some of the log was still in contact with the ground, providing some drag.)
If we are talking about 18 wheeler loads behind a SCUT on rough terrain then darwin is gonna take the reins at some point.
Not to be rude john.. But if your trailer tongue doesnt hit the ground when not on a hitch, ya messed up the axle placement. BTDT.
Quote from: mike_belben on September 04, 2018, 11:15:57 AMNot to be rude john.. But if your trailer tongue doesnt hit the ground when not on a hitch, ya messed up the axle placement. BTDT.
Well, to be honest, my thinking had switched to dragging logs, even though I mentioned trailers... and when dragging logs, lifting the 3 Pt hitch is not that big a deal, since the logs are still on the ground, providing drag.
Quote from: Crusarius on September 04, 2018, 07:28:38 AM
Happy you went with the 12k winch? hows it work? does it stop as soon as you let go of the button or freewheel a bit first?
12k honestly wasnt enough. Brake didnt hold and would run away, but im thinking maybe the batteries were getting low. I uncoupled, jumper cabled from my diesel and the brake seemed to hold better than without jumpering them. At the end, my planetary box sounded like someone walking on bubble wrap. Going to throw my 18k on it for the time being and open up the 12k to see the damage and hopefully fix it.
Gotta redeck my trailer now though. The trunk of the last pecan did it in just over the axels. Gonna put in diamond plate over my wheels and axels, then replace the decking behind the axels. That'll at least get me road legal again.
Get you a whole box of gloves and like 3 rolls of paper towels plusna fresh trash bag before you even start. Winches have the craziest grease of anything i ever tore down.
Quote from: mike_belben on September 04, 2018, 11:12:58 PM
Get you a whole box of gloves and like 3 rolls of paper towels plusna fresh trash bag before you even start. Winches have the craziest grease of anything i ever tore down.
can't be worse than WTR we used in the army, and still use today, just referred to by its manufacturer's name of royco 22cf. even with rubber exam gloves, the odor permeates through the glove and makes the hands smell like digging in the south end of a north bound feral hog.
LOL.
You know they say when youre diggin yourself a hole in a feral hogs rear its time to put the shovel down right? I think thats the saying.
Quote from: mike_belben on September 05, 2018, 11:49:37 AM
LOL.
You know they say when youre diggin yourself a hole in a feral hogs rear its time to put the shovel down right? I think thats the saying.
Never heard that before. I just know wtr smells AWFULL, so gearbox grease, even if its thick and slimy, kinda like thix-o grease, would be a welcome over wtr.