Hi all,
I've posted a couple of topics about buying mills, but finally gave in and decided to build one to indulge my metal fab tendencies. I am a true cheap-o as well so I was having a hard time justifying buying a new mill.
Being a commercial GC, I was able to procure some 3"x5"x0.25" angle and 36' of 11ga 2"x2" tubing from a subcontractor who had extra stock laying out in the yard. I ordered some V-groove gate track rollers off Amazon for $10/ea and tractor supply supplied the 1/2" nuts and bolts for the feet. I'm currently at $62 invested, not including consumables. I do still plan on using the Linn Lumber kit. (https://www.linnlumber.com/basicsawframekit.html)
Here's where I got this weekend, hoped to do more but I threw my back out putting the welding gas bottle in the truck on Friday morning, of all things.
The base is only 11'6" long for now, which only gives me about 6' of sawing ability, so I'll definitely need to grab some more angle. It's 38" wide, track to track, which I hope will be fine considering the saw head has a 30" cutting width.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/IMG_4800.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1566220041)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/IMG_4801.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1566220041)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/IMG_4798.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1566220042)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/IMG_4790.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1566220042)
So, the plan is to loosely follow Crusarius' lead and mimic what he built. I need to buy some more metal for log dogs/clamps/etc. which won't be free, but I plan on coming in around $1500-$1800 to get up and running initially. (<--- Setting a budget is laughable in the car building world, I'd imagine it's the same here).
As always, I am interested in thoughts and concerns from the collective experience.
Thanks,
Collin
I set a budget and was able to stay pretty close to it. Unfortunately, as always its the little nickel and dime stuff that you do not think about always gets ya.
I am not a fan of the angle bed because it will have alot of potential twist in it. Are you going to mount that to a trailer any time?
Good start. Let me know if you need anything.
Quote from: Crusarius on August 19, 2019, 09:43:27 AM
I set a budget and was able to stay pretty close to it. Unfortunately, as always its the little nickel and dime stuff that you do not think about always gets ya.
I am not a fan of the angle bed because it will have alot of potential twist in it. Are you going to mount that to a trailer any time?
Good start. Let me know if you need anything.
Not planning on trailering it at the moment. It will be on a concrete pad. I have considered trailering it previously, but I'm not sure I have the time nor the interest in milling for others at this point, as my career and other interests keep me plenty busy!
Staying within budget requires patience I find that's what gets me 😬. Doing nothing while waiting on the deals that you know will eventually come up.
Quote from: Hoopty5.0 on August 19, 2019, 09:57:10 AMIt will be on a concrete pad.
I think the reason Crusarius is asking is that you already threw your back out. Leaning over the low bed will be a killer! You may end up building up some blocking to raise it up to a comfortable height. My log bed is about 24" up.
Its a trade off of being able to manually load logs and saving your back. I happen to have equipment to load logs.
Also, I tend to overbuild. My mill is 2x4x.25 box (upright) with 2x3x.25 angle on top. In your case, I would have put the angle with the large dimension going up and your really nice adjustable legs as close to the bunks as possible for the best support.
Actually the trailer idea was to stiffen the angle iron frame. But yes. I hate bending over :)
I have 2X4 rectangular tubing under mine Thomas mill. That thing is rigid!!!
I just posted on another thread,go long.I can cut a 20 foot log on mine mill. Never have,but it allows me to get the head of of the way. I have 4 feet to play with instead of inches when I saw 16 feet. Yes,it cost more but my convenience is worth something!!!
Mine is built using 2" X 4" X 3/16" tubing for the frame with 1" X 1" X 1/4" angle for the track and 1/4" X 4" flat bar for the log bunks. It's quite solid, but will only squeeze out a 13' log, really made for 12' logs. I plan to eventually make a fold up bed extension at some time, possibly 5'.
I agree with cfarm. since 2x6 comes in 24' lengths that is what I made my bed. unfortunately I made the legs on the mast 39" so I lost alot right there. My max cut length is 20'-4.5" That was truly a pain in the but to figure out. But the customer was happy with the outcome.
I have talked about putting a fold out extension on each end of the mill. just strong enough I can roll the head onto it. The log should never rest on the extensions I just need a place for the head to go. Then I will be able to cut a full 24' length. Not often will I need that, but its nice to be able to do it.
Thanks all for the input.
I will go longer when more material comes available. I really couldn't saw much more than 6' as it sits which is pretty much useless. Should have some more in a few weeks when he has another job wrap up in Houston and he can bring more material down.
There's also some 4x4" square tube on my job site being used as a temp support that I'm sure will get trashed when it's done. Just need to make sure it doesn't find it's way to the dumpster, haha. That would do well in supporting the angle.
As far as progress goes, I did order the Linn saw head yesterday, so that should be in the mail soon. I also stopped by the metal supermarket and rummaged through their remnant pile and left with 2x 5' pieces of 1 7/8" OD sch 40 pipe and 1x 16" piece of 2" ID sch 40 pipe to make the sliding rails for the saw head. I left there for $45 (still seems high for cutoffs, right??) so I'm all in for $1510.00 right now. The only "major" component left to buy is a motor. I've been keeping an eye on FB marketplace and there's a few 10-13 hp motors on there that need some clean up and tuning for $150ish. I'd imagine I could haggle them down more when I get ready to buy. I think my initial guess of having a running mill for $1800 is attainable, but will more than likely need modification once I figure out how to make it better.
Here's how I left it last night, only had an hour or so to work. I could really use a tubing notcher, using the angle grinder to cut out radii is for the birds.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/IMG_4803.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1566303773)
Poor photo quality, but you get the idea. Will keep on it tonight.
I got a lot done this past weekend. The Linn saw head came in and I have it 80% complete, I'll get some pictures up this week.
The kit is very high quality, the instructions are very low quality!
I definitely agree with that.
Alright, pictures finally! I had sinus surgery last week and it really put me out of commission for a while.
Here is the kit in unassembled form:
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/IMG_4905.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1568121850)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/IMG_4910.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1568121849)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/IMG_4906.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1568121849)
It came in 3 boxes, and was pretty much what I expected: A bunch of steel pieces with no apparent ryhme or reason. So I started looking through the literature that was sent, which consisted of 3 separate packets vaguely labeled and short on verbage - Picture 4 stacks of CAD drawings. There was a CD in there as well and it was quasi-helpful, but again, was not specific to the basic sawframe kit which I purchased. It's basically a video of them building an entire mill and you have to figure out what's relevant to what you are doing.
I'd go so far as to say that if you don't have any creativity or willingness to "make" something work, this kit is definitely not for you.
So anyway, I got to it as best I could on the unlevel floor of my garage with my $100 TIG welder.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/IMG_4907.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1568121849)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/IMG_4914.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1568121848)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/IMG_4917.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1568121848)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/IMG_4909.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1568121849)
Hindsight:
- I should have waited to build this until my shop was finished and I had a fab table to make sure everything was square, I had room to work, etc.
- I should have lined the pulleys up with string before marking and drilling the holes. that was a common sense error on my part!
- the fact that they tell you it is possible to tap a 1/2" coarse thread hole with a single tap is 110% BS. I spoke with a milwright buddy after 30 minutes of trying to get the tap started and he laughed and said good luck. Apparently it's a 3 step process and what I had was best suited for chasing threads that already existed. So, I ended up overdrilling the holes from 27/64" to 7/16" or something... Forgot exactly, but then overdrilled the top 1/4" of the hole to 7/16" as a "taper" so that the tap would start. It was an ordeal that took hours instead of minutes had I known I needed a different tool set.
- I'm sure there will be much more to add to the hindsight section soon, I just haven't had time to work on it much.
the carriage is still tacked together. I've had to cut it apart and adjust it several times, so I'm glad that I had the foresight to tack weld there. It's finally where it needs to be (I think?) so I will weld it up and add more bracing where the saw frame attaches to the carriage next. From there, I need to design the lifting/lowering mechanism. I have a hand winch, just need pulleys and some hardware to attache the cables to the saw frame.
This has been a great challenge and have found myself scratching my head a lot and re-doing a lot of work to get it right. This is good for me, as I'm pretty notorious for a "close enough" approach to getting things done. I'll keep the updates coming for anyone whose following along.
Thanks!
Collin
woh. dejavu....
Were the cut ends on your square? I had to true all of my ends up in the mill. they were quite a ways out of square.
Quote from: Crusarius on September 10, 2019, 10:17:01 AM
woh. dejavu....
Were the cut ends on your square? I had to true all of my ends up in the mill. they were quite a ways out of square.
They seemed to be square enough for me to not notice any deficiencies. But then again, my abilities are crude at best and very few of my parts are level/plumb/square. I feel like if I had a fab table and could really lay everything out and clamp it correctly before welding - as well as the use of a chop saw instead of a porta-band - it could alleviate a lot more of my troubles regarding fitment.
Good news is nothing in that setup is high precision. The sliding part has all the adjustments you need to true everything up. As long as you drilled and tapped all the holes they had in the plans.
Quote from: Crusarius on September 10, 2019, 10:44:28 AM
Good news is nothing in that setup is high precision. The sliding part has all the adjustments you need to true everything up. As long as you drilled and tapped all the holes they had in the plans.
Still working on that. I may invest in a real tap set to make it easier.
buy 3 or 4 good 3/8" taps. use a good tap handle and do your best to have some type of guide.
I did find that tapping the 3/16 wall tubing you could just put the tap in the drill and run it through if the jaw could hold the tap from spinning.
Most of my tapping was done by hand right after drilling the hole on the vertical mill. Took more time but that way I was sure the holes were perfect. I used a tap guide in the collet.
29/64 bit is what is needed to tap for a 1/2" hole. Using course for 3/16" metal doesnt give you many threads to engage, plus oversizing the hole wont help either. If you using a bottom tap, that will impact you getting the tap started. Im tapping 1/2"-1" thick using a 1/2"x20 starter tap and it does good. My tap handle is a bit on the small size and after 5 holes, it takes its toll on my hand palm, even wearing gloves. I just got done tapping 37 1/2" holes in 3/4" of metal. I would get a few threads started, back out and move on to the next hole. Once i had all holes started, i went back with a 3/8 dr long handle ratchet and finished the holes out.
For that thin of metal, i would highly recommend fine threads for all your hdwr. Even my 3/8" holes, i used a 3/8x24 in my 1/4" material. I wanna ensure i have plenty of grab. Iv also been plug welding 1/2" flat bar or plate in locations that will have a good bit of stress/tension on the metal.
I finally felt well enough to go into the garage and make an attempt at being productive last night. For anyone considering sinus surgery, it is the purest from of hell I have run across in my short 32 years.
Anyway, I didn't get a whole lot done. I spent a lot of time flipping between packets trying to figure out which one had the best description of how to build the blade guides:
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/IMG_4943.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1568377889)
After an hour, I think I got most of it figured out, less a couple of holes I still need to drill/tap.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/IMG_4947.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1568377889)
Still need to finish the bases for them that attach to the saw frame, I only got a few holes drilled for them before my juice ran out.
Cruisarius - I have a couple of questions for you that I can't figure out:
1) There's a bolt sticking up on the end adjustable blade guide above the wheel itself:
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/IMG_4944.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1568377888)
It's drilled and tapped into the square stock with a jamb nut, and for the life of me, I can't figure out what it does. Any ideas?
Also, is the kit supposed to come with 2 of these pieces? The instructions are kind of vague.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/IMG_4946.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1568377888)
I can make due without, but the adjustable hole for the blade guide seems pretty important, unless the fixed guide is adjustable that way?
Thanks for your help! The instructions are just about worthless.
Quote from: Hoopty5.0 on September 13, 2019, 08:45:02 AM1) There's a bolt sticking up on the end adjustable blade guide above the wheel itself: It's drilled and tapped into the square stock with a jamb nut, and for the life of me, I can't figure out what it does. Any ideas?
That is for height adjustment on the blade guide. Their is a small chunk of 1/2" square stock that will need to get drilled and tapped 1/2x13 goes on the bolt for the guide the small vertical bolt you are talking about pushes on it.
That piece of angle is only supposed to be on the adjustable side. the fixed side uses 3/4" holes drilled to make it adjustable. The adjust ability that is gained by using 3/4" holes works but is not what I would have done. It is a pain to adjust, but once adjusted it stays pretty good. I think the cam bolts help alot for that.
Blade guide bolt:
I think I am understanding what you are saying in theory. Turning that bolt somehow raises/lowers the blade guide in the slotted track. I just need to figure out how that works in the instructions.
And I understand on the fixed side.
Thank you for the quick reply! I'll see where I get this evening.
Quote from: Crusarius on September 13, 2019, 09:09:26 AM
Quote from: Hoopty5.0 on September 13, 2019, 08:45:02 AM1) There's a bolt sticking up on the end adjustable blade guide above the wheel itself: It's drilled and tapped into the square stock with a jamb nut, and for the life of me, I can't figure out what it does. Any ideas?
That is for height adjustment on the blade guide. Their is a small chunk of 1/2" square stock that will need to get drilled and tapped 1/2x13 goes on the bolt for the guide the small vertical bolt you are talking about pushes on it.
That piece of angle is only supposed to be on the adjustable side. the fixed side uses 3/4" holes drilled to make it adjustable. The adjust ability that is gained by using 3/4" holes works but is not what I would have done. It is a pain to adjust, but once adjusted it stays pretty good. I think the cam bolts help alot for that.
I just went back and looked in your build thread and AHAAA!
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/adjuster~0.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1568381205)
I get it now.
Perfect. I was going to find that pic :)
Thanks again for your help.
I am anxious to get to milling. I have about a dozen pine logs to cut for fence runners and another dozen hardwoods to cut up and get drying for other projects.
I am looking forward to seeing it to.
the blade guides are just about done. Missing a couple of threaded holes.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/IMG_4974.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1568635948)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/IMG_4976.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1568635948)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/IMG_4975.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1568635948)
Next, I'll weld it to the carriage and start on the lifting mechanism.
Looking good. at least you didn't do what I did on mine. I built them with the rollers on the wrong side.
Didn't guide the blade very well at all. but looked kool :)
Quote from: Crusarius on September 16, 2019, 08:29:06 AM
Looking good. at least you didn't do what I did on mine. I built them with the rollers on the wrong side.
Didn't guide the blade very well at all. but looked kool :)
HA! whoops.
I have to brag on my little $100 TIG welder too. When I actually slow down and make an attempt at making pretty welds, the machine is more or less is capable! I know a lot of people have their opinions on Chinesium parts and tools, but if it weren't for them, I wouldn't be able to afford some of these tools and just wouldn't be able to work.
I think the important distinction to make is that I don't make a living with these tools and they get used infrequently. If the use was more of a daily grind, I'd be singing a different tune, for sure!
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/IMG_4969.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1568638744)
There's a really cheap plasma cutter on amazon for like $200 that I've got my eye on next.
Gotta start somewhere. When I started doing metal fab I had a $100 stick welder, a grinder, and a sawzall.
I do not miss those days. The assortment of "easy" tools I have now sure does make my work quite a bit easier. Probably nicer to.
You will get there one day.
Well, with all learning experiences, you learn what you did wrong after you did it. Going to have to cut the saw head off the carriage because I did not account for the slop in the tubes that slide over the posts, so there's about 5° of declination on the saw head as it's hanging here. I also think that there is some torsion in the cross bar because there is no other bracing supporting the saw head, it's just hanging off the side of the 2x2.
The plan for tonight will be to cut it off, simulate the load with ratchet straps, then re-weld the saw head. Here's where I got last night.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/DEBC3569-6338-49E1-BE92-3A1CD3738B84.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1568722144)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/CB2CCC4F-D8A6-490A-810B-450367758689.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1568722144)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/4EA59CC7-3AA0-4A4F-AC73-A4D708B89C13.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1568722145)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/E28C31EF-6569-4576-BB2F-1808803F43C6.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1568722145)
Other than that, I'm happy with the progress made so far. It's moving along pretty quick now.
If I was you, I think I would try to make the head adjustable. I did not, and after I painted everything and reassembled it The blade would not go far enough down with my cam stops in place. I had to remove the stops to get the 3/4" final cut height I was after.
It would not be hard to add a triangle from the bottom of your sleeves up to the sawframe and make it adjustable that way.
It's hard to tell in the pics, but the blade will go down past the cross members on the base frame. Really, I need to figure out a way to put some stops in to prevent going too far.
I took some 2" bar stock cut it into 1/4" slugs then drilled an offset hole in it drilled and tapped the mast then bolted it on. Rotate it to where the slide would hit it and stop perfectly at my last board cut.
Worked great till my sawframe angle changed and adjusted the blade location.
I just ordered a motor and a clutch. Got a 16hp motor off amazon for $263, LOL. Dang clutch was just about as much.
Well, it runs and cuts... kinda. Against my better judgement, I crudely clamped a small piece of walnut in place to make a test cut and it worked like a dream. I'm going to get material this week for some blade guards and start on a clamping system. I'll also be picking up more material to extend the bed out to 12' as well.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/IMG_5014.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1569241433)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/IMG_5013.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1569241432)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/IMG_5016.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1569241433)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/IMG_5015.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1569241433)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/IMG_5012.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1569241432)
Well, THAT has to feel good!? Congrats!
I did something very similar for my test cut. Except it was in the middle of winter in my garage with ghetto guards vice gripped in place just to redirect the dust. What a mistake that was. The mess is still in the shop a year later :)
That looks like your pushing your blade through the cut instead of pulling? You may want to reconsider that. On the smaller pieces it won't be an issue but you get into a big heavy or sticky log and you will have issues.
My Linn build has the engine on top of the sawframe running the other direction.
Quote from: Old Greenhorn on September 23, 2019, 08:30:50 AM
Well, THAT has to feel good!? Congrats!
Yes, but I'll feel better once it's done!
Quote from: Crusarius on September 23, 2019, 08:37:43 AM
That looks like your pushing your blade through the cut instead of pulling? You may want to reconsider that. On the smaller pieces it won't be an issue but you get into a big heavy or sticky log and you will have issues.
My Linn build has the engine on top of the sawframe running the other direction.
I struggled with this, and ultimately, my whole carriage is a design flaw. Because the saw head is in front of the forward rollers and hangs off the front of the carriage, I wanted the engine to be behind the forward casters as a counter weight. I'd basically have to start all over again to fix it, which I may do eventually, but for now, I'll see how far I can get with it.
Like you mentioned, a version 2.0 would be very different, haha!
Yea. I was looking at it and the only way you could truly flip it around is to flip the entire carriage and then swap the guides. Of course this means drilling and tapping all new holes for the guides.
I still think you would be smart to do it now. There are many other ppl on the forum that did the same thing and then ended up fixing it. It is easier to fix it now than it is to fix it later.
Still looking good though. I still wish I had thought to change the direction from the Linn plans mostly because I hate flipping blades. Ahhh the infamous V2.0 :)
Quote from: Crusarius on September 23, 2019, 09:34:26 AM
Yea. I was looking at it and the only way you could truly flip it around is to flip the entire carriage and then swap the guides. Of course this means drilling and tapping all new holes for the guides.
I still think you would be smart to do it now. There are many other ppl on the forum that did the same thing and then ended up fixing it. It is easier to fix it now than it is to fix it later.
Still looking good though. I still wish I had thought to change the direction from the Linn plans mostly because I hate flipping blades. Ahhh the infamous V2.0 :)
I'll have to rebuild the whole thing. I can't flip the motor around without moving the posts further back on the carriage in order to prevent it from flipping forward. Then I wouldn't be able to lower the cutting head lower than 6" off the top of the bed.
I'll need to think about this and draw a few scenarios and see what I can come up with. Bummer!
easiest way to fix it is to flip the sawframe end for end. then run a longer belt to get to the drive side. or shift the engine to the other side and use the same belt. You are correct, it is almost a full rebuild but I am 100% confident you will be happy you did it now and not later. Pushing the blade through the cut will create alot of issues. The worst one being wavy boards.
Hey that's a great idea! I can work with that.
...and thank you for the idea!
NP. Glad I could help.
Perhaps another thought is to extend the front roller feet out in front of the blade. You might need to add some low gussets, but it should help stabilize things, should it not?
Quote from: Old Greenhorn on September 23, 2019, 12:08:09 PM
Perhaps another thought is to extend the front roller feet out in front of the blade. You might need to add some low gussets, but it should help stabilize things, should it not?
That's a possibility as well, and something I may do even after swapping the pulleys around. It's still too front heavy for my liking.
Keep the legs as short as possible. The longer they are the shorter your cut length. Mine are 39" long. I have a 24' bed and only allows me a 20'-4.5" max cut.
Are the shafts the same diameter? You can't pull them from the blocks and swap the wheels entirely, then move the engine over a bit?
Quote from: JoshNZ on September 23, 2019, 06:09:06 PM
Are the shafts the same diameter? You can't pull them from the blocks and swap the wheels entirely, then move the engine over a bit?
They're the same, and that's what I plan on doing. Good idea!
If you do that the drive wheel will then be on the adjustable wheel side. so The engine will have to slide with the adjustable wheel.
I still say drill holes on the other side of the sawframe matching the ones you already have. Flip the sawframe 180 degrees move the drive pulley to the back side of the frame and your guides then your done.
Pay close attention to the mounting holes to the mast those will not be a direct mirror.
Quote from: Crusarius on September 24, 2019, 08:31:34 AM
If you do that the drive wheel will then be on the adjustable wheel side. so The engine will have to slide with the adjustable wheel.
I still say drill holes on the other side of the sawframe matching the ones you already have. Flip the sawframe 180 degrees move the drive pulley to the back side of the frame and your guides then your done.
Pay close attention to the mounting holes to the mast those will not be a direct mirror.
Not necessarily - I have a larger belt than I need with a tensioner. There is plenty of slack to accommodate the tensioning movements. Unless I am missing something else?
If your engine is on a fixed mount but the drive wheel is on a sliding mount you will need to have blade tension and belt tension match since the drivewheel will be directly connected to the drive pulley and to the blade.
I do see what your saying and it could work If you use a tensioner to take up the slack.
You know what. Now that I think about it. that may actually work pretty well. definitely be alot easier than flipping everything around. just make sure your belt tensioner has enough travel to take up the slack.
I would estimate my tensioner moves roughly 3"
Quote from: Crusarius on September 24, 2019, 09:12:45 AMI would estimate my tensioner moves roughly 3"
I have spare tire wheels for mine mill and the blade tensioner only moves about 3/4". For "hard" pulleys, I would guess even less.
Yours moves 3"?! Mine hardly moves at all. The blade barely fits on the pulleys when the tensioner is backed all the way off. From there, I spin the handle on the tensioner no more than 5x to get to the 2400psi or whatever it is.
moves at least 2. probably closer to 3 when at full extension. really makes putting the blade on and taking it off pretty easy. still have plenty of stroke in the cylinder. Plus I have less exposed threads on the pump.
Well crap. I must have messed up somewhere. It's almost toooo tight to get the blade on at no tension
Put the metal cross piece on the wrong side of the line?
Maybe so. I'll measure it. but if it works as-is, should I mess with it?
I wouldn't. I am sure that is full welded.
I may have put mine on the wrong side of the line. It works though.
My blade is taut when I put it on at minimum tension. It takes me 30 seconds, loop the blade over one wheel, place the top of the blade on the other wheel and holding it there with one hand, rotate the wheels half a turn until the band walks on. It stays put like that and it's not niggly or anything. At max tension the sleeve has probably travelled about 3/8 of an inch and I know because I've put marks on it trying to catch my jack creeping. Don't think theres anything wrong with this at all. Maybe we'll get more stretch when we actually start using our blades hoopty haha...
Bodes very well for this idea of flipping it. Your procedure would just be, back off the drive belt idler, fit the band, tension the band, then tension your idler. Each time you detension and tension the blade and belt would go together I don't see any prob with that..?
Quote from: JoshNZ on September 27, 2019, 04:11:16 AMBodes very well for this idea of flipping it. Your procedure would just be, back off the drive belt idler, fit the band, tension the band, then tension your idler. Each time you detension and tension the blade and belt would go together I don't see any prob with that..?
This is what I'm thinking.
I've got my log clamps about done and I brought back more angle to lengthen the base, so maybe this weekend we can actually mill some logs!
Trying to tension the blade and the belts at the same time may or may not work. But as long as you have a spring tensioner on the belt it will probably work ok.
You should try it and let us know if you like it. :)
No, I'd do the blade first, then the belt.
I will just have to wait for pics. I am sure your explaining it perfectly but I am not understanding it. I do look forward to seeing your results though.
Well, I got it all swapped over. And for some reason, the blade isn't tracking right on the pulleys so I need to align everything again, even though it was fine at some point yesterday.
I forgot to take pics too. Yesterday was a blur - my parents had my daughter for the weekend so I was non-stop working around the house LOL
I understand that completely. anytime I can get in the shop without one of the kids is a blessing.
It is understandable needing to change the alignment changing direction. At least that is easy to do.
Do you have a dummy blade or are you using a pointy one?
I don't have a dummy. For alignment, I pull the blade off use stretchy poly string taped across the front of both pulleys like this:
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/pulleysjpg.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1569848608)
Where the black lines are the pulleys and the red line is the string. It's worked well three times on the first shot, but something must have moved. Not too hard to fix.
Just curious. I noticed that the saw frame is welded to a crossmember which is welded to your slides. Are you using your blade guides to align the blade to be horizontal with the track?
How else can you do it is that not the most sensible way?
Quote from: proptorudder on September 30, 2019, 10:42:58 PM
Just curious. I noticed that the saw frame is welded to a crossmember which is welded to your slides. Are you using your blade guides to align the blade to be horizontal with the track?
It's not an exact science but from what I've checked with level, it hangs pretty much level all the time. I have some ideas up my sleeve that I can try if I ever get to a point where I feel that it's not cutting flat enough.
You should expect it to need some leveling and design accordingly.
Is the height of your roller guides adjustable on each side?
I built my mill from Linn lumber plans and the design provides for the head to swing in a small arc to allow the blade to be moved to a horizontal position in relation to the track. If you were able to weld the mounts solid and get the horizontal blade/track alignment then you shouldn't have a problem. I on the other hand needed the adjustment. There are other ways to make adjustments with the use of shims. Once the horizontal alignment is complete, then the blade guides can be positioned. Make sure the blade is tracking true and relatively tight before doing the horizontal adjustments. I didn't like the Linn design for the blade guide mounts so I designed my own. They are capable of the "8" movements required for the proper adjustments.
Quote from: JoshNZ on October 01, 2019, 06:24:41 PM
Is the height of your roller guides adjustable on each side?
No, they arent.
Quote from: proptorudder on October 01, 2019, 07:27:10 PM
I built my mill from Linn lumber plans and the design provides for the head to swing in a small arc to allow the blade to be moved to a horizontal position in relation to the track. If you were able to weld the mounts solid and get the horizontal blade/track alignment then you shouldn't have a problem. I on the other hand needed the adjustment. There are other ways to make adjustments with the use of shims. Once the horizontal alignment is complete, then the blade guides can be positioned. Make sure the blade is tracking true and relatively tight before doing the horizontal adjustments. I didn't like the Linn design for the blade guide mounts so I designed my own. They are capable of the "8" movements required for the proper adjustments.
I think I follow what you're saying but not entirely sure. I did make everything as level as I could manage relative to the x and y axis so to speak before welding it on if that's what you mean?
---
I did get everything re-aligned last night and we're back in action again. I got very lucky (I couldn't have planned this) that the V belt was the perfect length so that when the blade has tension, it puts just the right amount of tension on the belt as well.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/saw2.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1570104288)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/saw1.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1570104288)
I still need to adjust the guides to make the blade flat as well as build the blade guards and finally, make the track extension.
In other news, I've been dreaming of building a shop for many years and it's finally becoming a reality. The foundation was poured yesterday!
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/saw3.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1570104288)
It's 30x60. There will be a 15' carport in the front (recessed area) and then a 30x30 shop for car stuff and a 15x30 area for woodworking. I'm really excited. I ran grounds for a bathroom and will try to fit a man cave in there as well.
Quote from: JoshNZ on October 01, 2019, 06:24:41 PM
Is the height of your roller guides adjustable on each side?
I just re-read your question now that I'm fully awake. YES, LOL. they're both adjustable and still need to be adjusted
Quote from: Hoopty5.0 on October 03, 2019, 08:08:07 AM
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/saw3.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1570104288)
Awesome!
What's the hp rating on your engine? I wonder if you should build it with room for double sheaves in case you go up in hp one day, seems like everyone wants to eventually. I discovered 1 belt (albeit through a little wrap) won't transmit 22hp
Quote from: JoshNZ on October 03, 2019, 04:42:11 PM
Awesome!
What's the hp rating on your engine? I wonder if you should build it with room for double sheaves in case you go up in hp one day, seems like everyone wants to eventually. I discovered 1 belt (albeit through a little wrap) won't transmit 22hp
13hp.
I'll sell this for a larger, pre-made unit before I alter this one drastically I think. IT was a good learning experience, but Id have to start over.
I started working on some blade guards last night. I have no idea where this is going or how they'll attach. Also, cutting 20ga by hand is not exactly efficient.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/sheet1.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1570191920)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/Sheet_2.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1570191942)
I'm doing this at the request of my lovely wife and friends, who after seeing a video of my "death machine", "torture device", and "I dont know what it does but it scares me" all demanded that I add some sheet metal to at least give the image of an effort towards a safety device. They're probably right.
Come on. We all test them early on with no guards. :)
But guards definitely make me more comfortable.
I agree. I definitely still tense up when I throttle up the saw. It's a combination of being unfamiliar with the device and the fact that I built something that has lots of teeth moving very quickly, hahaha!!!
haahaa, based on the reports here, the guards where one of the first items completed on my mill. I used wood covers to hopefully protect the blade when they fly. They work, but I still don't stand in front.
Quote from: Hoopty5.0 on October 03, 2019, 08:08:07 AMI did get everything re-aligned last night and we're back in action again. I got very lucky (I couldn't have planned this) that the V belt was the perfect length so that when the blade has tension, it puts just the right amount of tension on the belt as well.
Nice when things work out. But... the belt will stretch a little as it wears and will start to slip when you get into a tough cut. You
will need a secondary belt adjustment/tensioner. I used a roller tensioner from my truck's timing belt replacement. Nice wide, flat pulley to put pressure on the back side of the V-belt. If you don't have one, stop by your local repair shop and ask for one they normally toss out.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/30640/20180907_Tensioner.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1536353997)
Quote from: ljohnsaw on October 04, 2019, 09:50:57 AM
Quote from: Hoopty5.0 on October 03, 2019, 08:08:07 AMI did get everything re-aligned last night and we're back in action again. I got very lucky (I couldn't have planned this) that the V belt was the perfect length so that when the blade has tension, it puts just the right amount of tension on the belt as well.
Nice when things work out. But... the belt will stretch a little as it wears. You will need a secondary belt adjustment/tensioner. I used a roller tensioner from my truck's timing belt replacement. Nice wide, flat pulley to put pressure on the back side of the V-belt. If you don't have one, stop by your local repair shop and ask for one they normally toss out.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/30640/20180907_Tensioner.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1536353997)
Thanks for the tip. I had a tensioner installed before I reconfigured everything last week. I may weld it back on just so it's there. Good point on the stretch.
Guards aren't really my style either haha but if anything needs guards it is one of these machines.
Yeah, I got yelled at again this weekend. I'll try and finish them this week.
!!!BUT!!!
The reason I got yelled at is for making this beautiful lumber!
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/wal5.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1570452146)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/wal1.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1570452147)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/wal2.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1570452147)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/wal4.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1570452146)
I think this last picture is Tupelo. Can anyone confirm/deny? It was dying in the front yard so we cut it down a couple months ago.
Everything was cut 5/4 to make table tops and such with since they were such short logs. But I am really pleased.
I will finish the guards this week and I need to add a couple more things like a water tank/line and some bracing and a push handle.
When you yanks say 5/4 lol.. are you saying 5 quarters? 1-1/4"?
I've seen 8/8 used as a measurement too haha help us metric fellers out 🙃
Looks good! Never heard of the timber sorry
Quote from: JoshNZ on October 07, 2019, 08:50:20 PM
When you yanks say 5/4 lol.. are you saying 5 quarters? 1-1/4"?
I've seen 8/8 used as a measurement too haha help us metric fellers out 🙃
Looks good! Never heard of the timber sorry
Yep! The way I understand lumber here is it's measured in quarters of an inch. Not sure why, maybe someone else can chime in. I wish we would swap to metric, it's pretty easy once everyone realizes that it's all broken up into groups of 10.
---
I did make some more progress on the guards last night, except I welded one backwards. I still have no idea how they're going to mount although I have a couple of ideas. I need some more steel to make a frame for the sheet metal.
There's a community garage sale this weekend so I may take a step back and hack out some shelves and cutting boards on the quick to make a few bucks.
That's the whole reason for this sawmill venture, anyway! May even sell a few slabs that I've had drying.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/guards.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1570539415)
Long-standing convention here in Imperial land, @JoshNZ (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=37173) . Thickness of rough sawn lumber is referred to in quarters just like you surmised. 5/4 (five quarter) hardwood is a bit thicker than 5/4 softwood, just to make things a little more interesting. I'll see if I can find a thread or link that covers all that. It all makes sense when you've been around it for a while.
Quote from: btulloh on October 08, 2019, 09:02:11 AM
5/4 (five quarter) hardwood is a bit thicker than 5/4 softwood
Now my brain hurts.
A History of Yard Lumber Size Standards History (https://www.fpl.fs.fed.us/documnts/misc/miscpub_6409.pdf)
This may be a little too much info, but . . .
Nice build and awesomeness on the shop! I'm hoping to build a shop behind my house some day too!
I agree, I wish we'd all just switch to metric. It's all base 10, seems a simple sell to me but what do I know ::)
Brandon
Quote from: ManjiSann on October 08, 2019, 09:36:49 AMI wish we'd all just switch to metric
It would be awkward. "Give a guy 25.4 mm and he'll take 1.60934 kilometers". Just doesn't sound right.
All the socket and wrench manufacturers really like us being on a dual system. They'd lose half their business.
While I am generally interested, I'm not "59 page PDF document" interested haha. I know imperial pretty well I've done some building over there in North American but always glad to come back to metric. Some of the old timers here still don't know what a millimeter is. You can see their cogs turning when you tell them X mm trying to work it back to inches in their minds ruler.
Always laughed when I asked someone to mark the center of a board say 7ft, 5" and 3/8th long. If all you have is a pencil you need to split each unit and then compile them all back into a final measurement =/?
Not only the simplicity of tens but cross applications i.e. a 1000mm cube is 1000L and full of water, 1000kg, it's great.
I think it would be impossible for the US to change now though right? NZ is still littered with imperial tools because so much is imported, but nothing is designed in inches.
You make a good point, but the construction trades will be the last to change, if ever.
Just to make things more interesting, we use decimal inches for precision applications like machining, etc. Electronics manufacturing lives firmly in both worlds.
We're kind of trending towards metric, but it's a long trend. Military and scientific use the metric system. Some or most of the auto manufacturers have gone that way. I'm not even sure about cars anymore. We just all have dual sets of tools. Hard to say when it might be mostly metric here or when it could be an official thing.
All this raises the question: Is it Hoopty5.0 mm or Hoopty5.0 inches?
Quote from: btulloh on October 08, 2019, 05:00:21 PM
All this raises the question: Is it Hoopty5.0 mm or Hoopty5.0 inches?
I understand both but speak imperial. ;D
I have a science degree, so it's been a decade since I really applied metric in daily life.
Always laughed when I asked someone to mark the center of a board say 7ft, 5" and 3/8th long. If all you have is a pencil you need to split each unit and then compile them all back into a final measurement =/?
That's really quite easy and you don't even need a tape measure. Draw 2 diagonal lines from corner to corner. Where they intersect is the center.
Metric is so much easier. Base 10 vs. base 12, I mean really, base 12. What kinda dummy thought that was a good idea!
Well, standard also deals in factors of 10. My steel rule measures 1/32, 1/16, 1/10 and 1/100th.
How would i find center on a piece measuring 2.7mm x 1.9mm? I understand fractions/decimals a lot better than metric.
12 can easily be divided to 3/4, 1/2, 1/3, 1/4. Not so easy with 10. smiley_headscratch
Now what about a metric calendar. 100 seconds to a minute, 100 minutes to an hour, 10 hours to a day, 10 days to a week, 10 weeks to a month, and 10 months to a year. smiley_dizzy whiteflag_smiley
It's not going to change so I guess it's not so much to think about. no_no
Three countries not metric, Myanmar, Liberia, USA! No wonder we lag behind in engineering math etc. Student elsewhere think only in 10's big advantage anyone can just move decimal points etc. Also congrats on building the mill and not taking years to do it.
My old Cooks mill has plywood guards, so if the blade comes off, it just digs into the plywood. And as far as metrics go, when they start making plywood in metrics instead of 4x8 sheets, then construction will go metric. But as long as you have to frame a house to fit 4x8' sheets, construction will stay in feet and inches. Glad I am retired, I don't have a metric tape measure.
Lots of action this weekend, not a lot of pictures. I was able to salvage some lumber, although not much, from this walnut log:
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/wal-log.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1571056640)
I have a couple of questions:
1) How important is the water lube system with respect to blade life? That's the one part I haven't made yet.
B) Do you typically sharpen or just replace blades? How long do blades usually last assuming you're only working with hardwoods and no metal is hit?
Haha have a look at my thread I just asked the same question. Charles reckons 350-400bdft doing 1" boards.
A handful of decent trees. Definitely sharpen!
I haven't got the water lube system done either but I don't think any of my logs so far have required it. With the new jackshaft it blasts through a log so quick I imagine each tooth has only been through the log a handful of times haha
I do not have a lube system. I have been tempted to add one for the spruce I am cutting but been to lazy and preoccupied. Someone else gave me an idea to just put a sponge on a stick and dip it in diesel fuel then run it on the blade when it starts to pitch up. I know many other ppl that do not use lube on anything they cut.
I've been using a spray bottle with diesel or soapy water depending on whats being cut.
Quote from: Crusarius on October 15, 2019, 09:22:05 AM
I do not have a lube system. I have been tempted to add one for the spruce I am cutting but been to lazy and preoccupied. Someone else gave me an idea to just put a sponge on a stick and dip it in diesel fuel then run it on the blade when it starts to pitch up. I know many other ppl that do not use lube on anything they cut.
Moving blades and a stick, probably not the best idea.
Eventually it will grab the stick and (depending on blade rotation) shove it at you or pull it from you, either way there is potential for injury and/or mill damage.
Quote from: Hilltop366 on October 16, 2019, 03:05:26 PM
Moving blades and a stick, probably not the best idea.
Eventually it will grab the stick and (depending on blade rotation) shove it at you or pull it from you, either way there is potential for injury and/or mill damage.
Not sure I know what you are referring to as the stick.
I believe he was referring to Crusarius's comment about a sponge on a stick dipped in diesel fuel and applying it to the blade if pitch built up on it
Brent
Yep, sorry, I should have quoted Crusarius.
I will edit.
Ahhh ok.
Well, I've officially hit capacity in my "drying shed". I'm going to have to start stacking lumber outside now. Is it ok to get rained on, or what's the preferred method for outdoor drying?
Some pics of my late-evening production of random pieces I milled:
Osage/Bois D'Ark - I learned here what is too small to mill.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/IMG_5167.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1571314122)
An elm piece I salvage about a year ago:
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/IMG_5163.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1571314122)
Some 3" walnut for table legs
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/RenderedImage.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1571314122)
And finally, my drying shed. The stacking is less than ideal, but that's the best I could manage late last night. I need to rearrange everything. I ran out of stickers too.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/IMG_5169.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1571314123)
Sticker outdoors, need to cover the tops with a layer of heavy tarp or plastic or tin above wood, want good air flow through stack. Ideal under tin shed, next project.
I think my blade has run it's course as far as sharpness is concerned. How does one sharpen a blade without the fancy/expensive sharpener tool?
I call up woodmizer and order more :)
Quote from: Crusarius on October 21, 2019, 11:30:47 AM
I call up woodmizer and order more :)
Hah! So you just put em in the trash? Not worth the effort of sharpening?
Mind sharing the WM part number?
Nope. I have a spot on the wall with blades needing sharpening. One day I will either send them in to get sharpened or sharpen them myself when I get the tools.
I have more profiles than I can remember, I cannot give you the part numbers.
Quote from: Hoopty5.0 on October 21, 2019, 11:39:56 AM
Quote from: Crusarius on October 21, 2019, 11:30:47 AM
I call up woodmizer and order more :)
Hah! So you just put em in the trash? Not worth the effort of sharpening?
Mind sharing the WM part number?
Go to the woodmizer site and take a gander at their blades. If they have a band of your length, order some more and sign up for the re-sharp program. When you get a batch of blades, you send them to wm for sharpening and they send them back.
Quote from: Hoopty5.0 on October 21, 2019, 11:24:06 AM
I think my blade has run it's course as far as sharpness is concerned. How does one sharpen a blade without the fancy/expensive sharpener tool?
There are/were a couple on here that just sharpened them on the mill with a Dremel tool. Do a search if you are so inclined. They would do that a few time and then toss the blades when they broke.
I've gotta tackle this problem shortly too my first blade is nearing on spent, sharp wise. I wonder if I'll be able to modify the table clamp under my chainsaw grinder to do bands. Won't be able to do the set with it that's all, but I figure 2-3 sharpens myself then back to the doctor.
You can Utube how to sharpen a band sawmill blade. I have sharpened by hand now use a modified chainsaw sharpener works good. I have a used single tooth setter that does a great job, got on ebay cheap. You can sharpen good with a diamond stone by hand.
Thanks everyone for the input. I ordered a couple new blades from WM last week. Should have them this week.
An inexpensive way to sharpen, especially if you already have a Radial arm saw, http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?topic=75621.0;all (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?topic=75621.0;all)
Got a lot of milling done this weekend.
Friday, got a black gum (tupelo?) log milled:
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/IMG_5230.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1572900489)
Saturday, milled a couple pines, a couple walnuts, and got it stacked temporarily until I can figure out a better way:
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/IMG_5237.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1572900489)
Saturday afternoon, my phone rang. "want some free cedar?"
Uhh YEAH! down side is it was an 11hr round trip to NE texas. The bonus is I got a few cherry logs along with the cedar. Only had room for 1. Have to go back for the other two, and will get my remaining walnut logs while up in DFW. I have more wood than I know what to do with currently. Need it to dry so I can sell some.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/A843BCE9-D179-4A8A-9AAD-8FDB146A7551.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1572900489)
That is exactly what happened to me when ppl found out I was building one. I had a pile of logs before it was even done.
My raise and lower setup quit working this weekend. That is now on the to fix list.
Quote from: Crusarius on November 04, 2019, 04:26:10 PM
That is exactly what happened to me when ppl found out I was building one. I had a pile of logs before it was even done.
My raise and lower setup quit working this weekend. That is now on the to fix list.
I've had more people asking about what I'm going to do with the milled wood, like they were genuinely curious...
"So, like... uhhh.. are you gonna
make something with that wood?"
LOL.
As far as raise/lower goes, my trailer winch is really crude, but it works pretty well. One day, I'll upgrade to a power winch I think.
yea. I regretted the decision to go with acme rods for a while. Hopefully I get a chance to fix that soon.
Quote from: Crusarius on November 04, 2019, 04:42:59 PM
yea. I regretted the decision to go with acme rods for a while. Hopefully I get a chance to fix that soon.
What is your regret for the acme rod?
x2 I meant to ask you that cruise when you mentioned it last. Not a fan? I've been really happy with mine, up button goes up, down button goes down. Something hidden around a corner?
I was the same too haha. Had maybe 6-7 ton of logs on the driveway a month out from finishing it. Got several days work more for it when I finally give it the green light.
I think I have a whole bunch of little issue that come together to create a large issue.
When going down and setting the cut height I love the threaded rod. Works smooth and perfect everytime.
Unfortunately, going up is another story. The wheelchair motor I am using is very slow and underpowered for what it is lifting.
My mill also sits outside and I have noticed some rust on the acme rod. it is out of the normal working range but still there. With my setup I use #40 roller chain to twist both of the threaded rods. I do wonder if this is an issue? If I could spin just the nuts with thrust bearings I bet it would work quite a bit smoother.
Right now my plan is to switch over to a forklift style chain setup in the horizontal plane. I may use a linear actuator or stick with just a single threaded rod. Probably the rod since I have it on hand already. All of my linear actuators are to short.
If you want to see what I am talking about here is a link to a video jump straight to 3:29
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oS4VuXM0SGc (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oS4VuXM0SGc)
Sorry to change the subject again, but I'm in a bit of a pinch. This shop that I am having built has become a financial black hole. I need to generate some income, and quickly. So, I have a few questions:
1) what online outlets do you use to generate sales for lumber?
2) how do you check your local markets to determine prices?
3) is there a market for hardwoods that aren't dry yet?
4) is there more of a market for dimensional hardwood lumber or just flat sawn slabs with live edges?
Thanks for any help you can offer. I need money to finish the shop, but I can't do much to make money until the shop is built. Quite the conundrum!
Facebook marketplace and craigslist are good starting point, get an idea by looking what already is listed.
Quote from: Woodpecker52 on November 05, 2019, 08:46:25 AM
Facebook marketplace and craigslist are good starting point, get an idea by looking what already is listed.
Thanks, I've kept and eye on marketplace for a while. The frustrating part is the same 3 people are the only ones selling wood it seems, and all of their ads show the same "prices starting at $___ and up".
I'm going to inventory what I can tonight and just start listing pieces for what I think is fair and go from there.
Have any local markets or other wood places you may be able to do a consignment thing? Could post an ad for a saturday looky loo and sell in person one saturday.
Quote from: Crusarius on November 05, 2019, 09:10:11 AM
Have any local markets or other wood places you may be able to do a consignment thing? Could post an ad for a saturday looky loo and sell in person one saturday.
that's an idea, I will look into that.
There's also a farmer's market locally on the 1st and Saturdays of the month. I could load the slabs in the trailer maybe and go sell. Might could get the mill loaded up too? would people buy green slabs?!
you are asking that motor, which is designed to run 24v to do the same work, on half the voltage. Cant really blame the rods for that. Its kinda like my co workers complaining our MAEDA crane is slow and sluggish at an idle, instead of running it at a higher rpm for more flow and ease of controlling.
As for rusting, stainless would have been a more exp option, with less chance of rust. A light coating of some type of cpc ( https://www.amazon.com/LPS-Premier-Rust-Inhibitor-Aerosol/dp/B000SKWQQS/ref=mp_s_a_1_5?adgrpid=58774473031&gclid=EAIaIQobChMImLGbyLPT5QIVDNbACh24iw-3EAAYAyAAEgJg4vD_BwE&hvadid=274688239821&hvdev=m&hvlocphy=9027401&hvnetw=g&hvpos=1t3&hvqmt=e&hvrand=12786776094473938589&hvtargid=kwd-308206235233&hydadcr=24484_9910959&keywords=lps+3+rust+inhibitor&qid=1572968317&sr=8-5 (https://www.amazon.com/LPS-Premier-Rust-Inhibitor-Aerosol/dp/B000SKWQQS/ref=mp_s_a_1_5?adgrpid=58774473031&gclid=EAIaIQobChMImLGbyLPT5QIVDNbACh24iw-3EAAYAyAAEgJg4vD_BwE&hvadid=274688239821&hvdev=m&hvlocphy=9027401&hvnetw=g&hvpos=1t3&hvqmt=e&hvrand=12786776094473938589&hvtargid=kwd-308206235233&hydadcr=24484_9910959&keywords=lps+3+rust+inhibitor&qid=1572968317&sr=8-5) ) would help. Only down side, if not cleaned off prior to use, saw dust will collect and cause an issue. A bellows tube would protect the rod from dust, yet still allowing for the cpc to stay.
The wheelchair motor I have is a 12 volt motor. I made sure of that before buying it. It did work fine when it was new and the rods were clean and dry. Unfortunately, with the tight tolerance of the acme rod and nut there is very little room for debris. And with flying sawdust that little room goes away fast.
This setup is no longer working for me so it is going to get changed.
People buy green slabs most definitely. Just make sure your telling them a rough moisture content. Depending on your area live edge stuff does pretty well around here. Buyers for me range from people that build furniture for a living and people that don't own a sander that are excited to make something. Facebook marketplace is good as well as craigslist as already mentioned. I make little serving/cutting boards that I sell at local shops on consignment they do pretty well. They are usually in the 1 bd/ft range and sell for $50ish. Everything you do to the wood makes it more valuable. ie drying, planing, sanding, finishing. But green wood has value just not as much as dry wood.
Maybe that's why my screws work so well, cause their tolerance.. is [Admin language edit] 8).
My motor is a 24v one running on 12v, I will get that anchor winch mounted on it soon I think that'll liven it up a lot but it still goes alright now. I wonder if you're creating drag somewhere else. Can you lift it by hand with the chain?
Grease the rods and out a boot/bellow over them like Charles said, that'd work. The forklift style lift not a bad idea either
Quote from: Crusarius on November 05, 2019, 10:58:53 AM
The wheelchair motor I have is a 12 volt motor. I made sure of that before buying it. It did work fine when it was new and the rods were clean and dry. Unfortunately, with the tight tolerance of the acme rod and nut there is very little room for debris. And with flying sawdust that little room goes away fast.
This setup is no longer working for me so it is going to get changed.
let me get my tanker bar to pry my foot out of my mouth. i would have bet my bank act (not much in it though) you had a 24 running on 12, but it is josh. i couldn't remember who all was running the wheelchair motors.
the tolerances on the rod and nut isn't very tight, which i thought would cause me agony, but maybe not.
when you get your set changed over, please do an update with pics. if on the off chance my set up won't work, i may change over to what you were describing and that vid showed.
I'm still not sure if I'm gonna go electrical or hydraulic (thinking 90% going hyd) and won't know till i get the engine mounted and figure out the lift tq required. a week out of foot surgery and i thought i would be able to move around better and be able to replace the radiator in my tractor, that rcvd a deadly hardwood injury and be able to start back on my mill. but it looks like another 1-2, maybe 3 wks before ill be able to put enough to weight on my foot to move without crutches.
Quote from: JoshNZ on November 05, 2019, 04:44:33 PM
Maybe that's why my screws work so well, cause their tolerance.. is [Admin language edit] 8).
Quote from: JoshNZ on November 05, 2019, 04:44:33 PM
My motor is a 24v one running on 12v, I will get that anchor winch mounted on it soon I think that'll liven it up a lot but it still goes alright now. I wonder if you're creating drag somewhere else. Can you lift it by hand with the chain?
Grease the rods and out a boot/bellow over them like Charles said, that'd work. The forklift style lift not a bad idea either
i think after looking at prices of the bellows, ill just fab up some kind of brush setup top and bottom to brush the dust off. but i have yet to see much corrosion on my rods and nuts, even after forgetting them outside in the rain for 2 wks, it was just light dusty rust. as with the recommendations of WM operators, using a light coat of ATF fluid post operation and the brushes during operations, should help keep the corrosion to a minimum.
Quote from: JRWoodchuck on November 05, 2019, 11:53:38 AM
People buy green slabs most definitely. Just make sure your telling them a rough moisture content. Depending on your area live edge stuff does pretty well around here. Buyers for me range from people that build furniture for a living and people that don't own a sander that are excited to make something. Facebook marketplace is good as well as craigslist as already mentioned. I make little serving/cutting boards that I sell at local shops on consignment they do pretty well. They are usually in the 1 bd/ft range and sell for $50ish. Everything you do to the wood makes it more valuable. ie drying, planing, sanding, finishing. But green wood has value just not as much as dry wood.
i did a fire season summers in la grande, enterprise/joseph and john day. your area vs. hoopty's and my area are very similar, except for your harsher winters. but the temperate climate, especially during the summer months are fairly similar. maybe a little bit more humidity down here, but relatively similar.
What about something like this for ya Charles/Crusarius? I have no idea what they're called, they were covering my lathes lead screw. Just a big coiled telescoping plastic sleeve. They remove about 4" of travel from the lathe carriage which you can work around if you remember. I ran my carriage into it completely compressed one day and it didn't give, bent the rack in my aprons gearbox so that was the end of that. They're fired, if ya want them haha. Might not be tall enough for you.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/47173/IMG_20191106_152324.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1573012457)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/47173/IMG_20191106_152319.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1573012458)
Quote from: JoshNZ on November 05, 2019, 04:44:33 PMI wonder if you're creating drag somewhere else. Can you lift it by hand with the chain? Grease the rods and out a boot/bellow over them like Charles said, that'd work. The forklift style lift not a bad idea either
Definitely creating alot of drag with my chain setup. When I greased it it got better but soon as the sawdust found the grease it got worse. Just needs a redesign.
Those sleeves look pretty sweet. Probably not worth the shipping though :)
I will definitely add to my build thread whenever I change anything on my mill. I am half tempted to change the entire mast. Hopefully we will see this weekend when I start playing around with it. First step is to disassemble my CNC table I am building and clean the shop so I can get the mill back in.
Crusarius I have about the same set up as you with the acme threads and wc motor I find if I just spray the threads with transmission fluid it keeps the working free and not much drag. I do run 24 volts on my motor.
I tried fluid film. I may have to just try the ATF.
Well, I went through the inventory last night and got everything labeled and photographed. I tried to include as much info I could in the pics to ward off the usual 100x questions and no sale. I priced the walnut @ $5.50/bf hoping it might move a little faster. We shall see.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/walnut.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1573050227)
All my pecan lumber looks like bacon, despite being stickered and strapped for almost a year. Not expecting much return there and priced it accordingly. My theory is it was cut too thin, dried too fast, and the ends were not painted. the pieces that were cut later, cut thicker, and dried slower fared much better, IMO.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/74238102_10116289214944554_9171236051618889728_n.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1573050450)
I wish I had a better way to show the character in the wood better, but marketplace limits you to 10 pics/ad
YOu might want to wet that with water or mineral spirits to show the potential a little better
Quote from: btulloh on November 06, 2019, 09:35:50 AM
YOu might want to wet that with water or mineral spirits to show the potential a little better
My wife said the same thing, but I didn't want to wash the chalk off. having seen the pics online, I will go back and do that.
Hoopty, you and josh are making me wish i hadnt decided to have my surgery. Im 4-6 months behind on my build, ya'll started 6 months later and are already making product.
Could you sacrifice a piece of material, finish it out, coat it with some of the product on the market and use that as advertising?
Quote from: JoshNZ on November 05, 2019, 10:56:08 PM
What about something like this for ya Charles/Crusarius? I have no idea what they're called, they were covering my lathes lead screw. Just a big coiled telescoping plastic sleeve. They remove about 4" of travel from the lathe carriage which you can work around if you remember. I ran my carriage into it completely compressed one day and it didn't give, bent the rack in my aprons gearbox so that was the end of that. They're fired, if ya want them haha. Might not be tall enough for you.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/47173/IMG_20191106_152324.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1573012457)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/47173/IMG_20191106_152319.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1573012458)
this is what i was looking at doing, but at almost $600 for a set, i think i can buy a LOT of 3" brushes.
https://www.mcmaster.com/5287k131 (https://www.mcmaster.com/5287k131)
They're not bellows Charles, more like this.
Source Telescopic spring cover spiral bellow cover on m.alibaba.com (https://m.alibaba.com/product/60757840740/Telescopic-spring-cover-spiral-bellow-cover.html?s=p)
Quote from: charles mann on November 06, 2019, 12:04:59 PM
Hoopty, you and josh are making me wish i hadnt decided to have my surgery. Im 4-6 months behind on my build, ya'll started 6 months later and are already making product.
Could you sacrifice a piece of material, finish it out, coat it with some of the product on the market and use that as advertising?
Well, this is all stuff that I had sawn by others, so there's that.
I wonder if you could approach local wood shops hoopty. Not factory production stuff but bespoke custom furniture type outfits?
Charles that'll teach ya for making a band mill the size of the titanic!
Crusarius I've greased my lead screws once with plain old grease when I installed them and never touched them again. They're caked in sawdust and grease, balled up masses at the ends of the nuts travel length, it doesn't seem to worry it. I wonder if you should run a cutter through your nuts on the lathe? Do a .075mm pass on them. Mine were quite sloppy by the time I got done. Might be worth doing before you dispose the whole concept, seems a shame!
Josh thats a good thought. I have never done internal threading on a lathe let alone acme thread. Bet it would make a difference.
As for the bellows or covers for the threaded rod I have always been opposed to them mostly because they don't stop everything from getting in. But once stuff is in it usually does not come out. Its the same thing as shock boots. I never run them because the crap that will get stuck in there is worse than what the shafts are exposed to.
as for the concept. Not a big deal. it wasn't mine :) I will think of something out of the box and out of the ordinary cause I don't like to copy other ppl's ideas. This may be why stuff tends to take me so much longer.
Wish I knew about those spirals long time ago. that would have gone on right away.
Quote from: JoshNZ on November 06, 2019, 01:58:59 PM
Charles that'll teach ya for making a band mill the size of the titanic!
i wouldnt say the titanic. Remember, it failed. It was a big sinker. A big portion of being behind has to with only 3.5 days out of 18 to work on it.
Hopefully in another wk or 2, ill be able to work on it for a month straight.
Maybe it should be called "The Enterprise ". That seems more appropriate.
Quote from: btulloh on November 06, 2019, 03:53:35 PM
Maybe it should be called "The Enterprise ". That seems more appropriate.
I was thinking the exact same thing but not wanting to sound cocky or over confident, in the off chance this build goes teets up.
But i think if it runs like a well lubed machine, i'll name it the "texas"
That'll work.
If it goes down for reasons beyond your control you can call it The Arizona
Quote from: btulloh on November 06, 2019, 05:16:03 PM
That'll work.
If it goes down for reasons beyond your control you can call it The Arizona
My thoughts exactly.
If it works, it should wage a good war on big timber.
Iv got a line on a cedar, that if the guy knows how to actually measure properly, he says is 46" at dbh and if he and i can agree on a price, ill go get it this weekend.
@charles mann (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=41365) That's a big [Admin Edited] cedar!
Quote from: Hoopty5.0 on November 07, 2019, 10:21:42 AM
@charles mann (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=41365) That's a big [Admin Edited] cedar!
It is located in buffalo, so im gonna go take a look tomorrow, measure it, if its a minimum of 34" ill take it, if it actually is 46", it'll get loaded.
Im gonna crutch around the property and see the ease of getting my equip in, if my tractor will do the job or if iv gotta use the log arch.
Quote from: charles mann on November 07, 2019, 12:06:46 PM
Quote from: Hoopty5.0 on November 07, 2019, 10:21:42 AM
@charles mann (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=41365) That's a big [Admin Edited] cedar!
It is located in buffalo, so im gonna go take a look tomorrow, measure it, if its a minimum of 34" ill take it, if it actually is 46", it'll get loaded.
Im gonna crutch around the property and see the ease of getting my equip in, if my tractor will do the job or if iv gotta use the log arch.
I drive through Buffalo almost weekly. There's what appears to be a firewood operation on the side of 45 just south of town I've always though about stopping at to see what kind of timber they have.
Then again, I have more logs than I can handle right now, LOL
Also - nice admin edit. *rolls eyes*
Well, it wasnt 46", more like 34". But its very straight. Im gonna have to top it and take it down in sections. No climbing spurs, but iv got a climbing stand and iv climbed 50' in a tree to hunt, so i think i can top out of the stand too. Gonna have to find my safety harness and a short bar for my jonesred 2166. Its a bit of a big saw for topping, but its doable.
updates:
Sold a couple hundred in wood this week!
Also, framing should start on my shop this week as well. Had to move the saw out of the way for a bit so no real work going on of note. But money in as opposed to money out is a good thing for once!
More wood sold, more work on the shop.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/IMG_5304.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1573769414)
Hopefully by this time next week, the mill is in it's forever home and the shop has a roof over it, in some form of progress.
Thats going to be a nice shop! Where did you end up getting customers for for the wood you sold. I know you were going to try craigslist and facebook market place.
Quote from: jbjbuild on November 15, 2019, 07:02:06 AM
Thats going to be a nice shop! Where did you end up getting customers for for the wood you sold. I know you were going to try craigslist and facebook market place.
Marketplace. I never got around to CL. I also really think marking each piece with dimensions has really helped trim down the questions. I quit responding to the "is this available" ads and I got a lot more specific questions about what I was selling. Definitely a much better experience this time around.
I've almost sold out of my current stock and am waiting on the next stock to dry in the barn. I have a third stack air drying now too, so if I can keep a steady rotation going, I should always have material to sell and build with.
Quote from: Hoopty5.0 on November 15, 2019, 10:12:56 AM
Quote from: jbjbuild on November 15, 2019, 07:02:06 AM
Thats going to be a nice shop! Where did you end up getting customers for for the wood you sold. I know you were going to try craigslist and facebook market place.
Marketplace. I never got around to CL. I also really think marking each piece with dimensions has really helped trim down the questions. I quit responding to the "is this available" ads and I got a lot more specific questions about what I was selling. Definitely a much better experience this time around.
I've almost sold out of my current stock and am waiting on the next stock to dry in the barn. I have a third stack air drying now too, so if I can keep a steady rotation going, I should always have material to sell and build with.
Very good! Did you sell any green or was it all dry.
All dry wood. I mentioned to a few people I had more green wood and there was little to no interest.
The biggest news from last weekend - I've sold all but 1 piece of my dried stock. 16 pieces of various species netted ~$400. Every single person who came said the same thing - "You've got great product at great prices and we don't have to go all the way to Houston to get it."
I had the walnut priced at $5.50/ bf and the pecan at $3/bf. They weren't large or nice pieces, and the lumber I have drying now should net better prices.
So, that $400 will go towards the $2,000 I "borrowed" to build the mill to pay it off.
Sounds like I may be on to something. Not crazy volume or income, but it was never intended to be anything other than a hobby to make a little side money. I need to remember not to lose sight of that!
Also, the shop is coming along:
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/4FC6B93D-3864-4754-8B62-1ED8FACCBA3E.jpeg?easyrotate_cache=1574084703)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/670082BA-A1FC-4940-93E8-3B35564F7C0F.jpeg?easyrotate_cache=1574084695)
They're putting the trusses up now. and should have cornice and sheathing on this week also. WOOOO!
Got the shop all but finished up - A buddy and I decided to roof it ourselves and wow, what a workout that was. We hand loaded the shingles without a lift. I'm definitely not in my early 20s anymore but it was a good experience!
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/IMG_5413.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1575293219)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/IMG_5414.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1575293220)
The mill is in it's new home. Got to mill up a couple of pines yesterday for a fence project.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/IMG_5422.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1575293220)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/2FF61481-62E5-46F6-8C5B-6E104D06EF66.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1575293220)
The saw cuts really well, and I am very happy with everything - except the trailer winch. It binds and is sloppy. I'll be getting the $49 HF winch this week rated and 2,500lb. That will make like MUCH easier.
Need some input. One of my employees has asked me for 2 - 6x6x9' cedar posts. I have the material, so basically I need to get an idea of what to charge with the friends/family discount since I like the guy.
I got the cedar for free, so there's no overhead to account for.
That's 27bd-ft / pole. What's the going rate for cedar by you, $1/bd-ft? So that would be $54. Family discount at $40? Make sure you center the pith!
Quote from: ljohnsaw on December 06, 2019, 09:31:00 AM
That's 27bd-ft / pole. What's the going rate for cedar by you, $1/bd-ft? So that would be $54. Family discount at $40? Make sure you center the pith!
Yeah. I asked what he thought initially and he said $100. I thought that was a bit high, so I may tell him something between that and $50. Everyone wins then?
So if you were working for him what would you want him to charge you?
That's kinda how I was approaching it, what would I pay? Treated 2 - 6x6x10' from HD is $61. So I told him $80 and he was pleased and so am I. It's basically $1/bf + $25 labor on the mill, which I think is pretty fair.
Well, the first injury has occurred. While rolling a log on the bunks, I crushed my right index finger, first knuckle. 5 stitches and a fracture, looked like roadkill.
I was hurrying to finish a small job to go into town with the wife. Lesson learned - don't rush anything. Either take the time to finish correctly, or just stop altogether.
Ouch. Very very ouch.
I have started to leave logs on the mill half cut for that exact same reason. Good news is I have not damaged myself that bad yet.
Quote from: Crusarius on December 09, 2019, 10:49:33 AM
I have started to leave logs on the mill half cut for that exact same reason. Good news is I have not damaged myself that bad yet.
Lucky it was cedar and light. I was cutting a 6x6 post and was making the 4th cut to make the cant. I still dont understand how it happened, but I'm also very happy it wasn't a heavy hardwood.
OH!!! I almost forgot - I picked up a 2500# HF winch for $50. Going to replace the hand crank trailer winch, as soon as I have all 10 fingers back in operation.
OUCH!!! Rolling,by hand? Peavey? You was some lucky.
Quote from: thecfarm on December 13, 2019, 08:01:11 AM
OUCH!!! Rolling,by hand? Peavey? You was some lucky.
Yes, rolling by hand. It was only a 6x6 cedar post, so I figured it was fine. It's healing really well, looks like a finger again as of today. Back to milling in no time!
Quote from: Hoopty5.0 on December 09, 2019, 11:20:40 AMI picked up a 2500# HF winch for $50
I had one of those, too. Just don't run it too hard. The windings get crispy and it don't pull so well. :-\ So now I have a nice roll of thin cable for some other project.
Quote from: ljohnsaw on December 13, 2019, 10:11:34 AM
Quote from: Hoopty5.0 on December 09, 2019, 11:20:40 AMI picked up a 2500# HF winch for $50
I had one of those, too. Just don't run it too hard. The windings get crispy and it don't pull so well. :-\ So now I have a nice roll of thin cable for some other project.
Thanks for the info. Were you using it as a winch as intended, or for raise/lower on the mill as I plan to? Seems like a lighter duty, or so I hope!
I used it to winch a log to my trailer. It was a hot day and ran it just a bit too hard. I don't recall if it had thermal protection. If it did, it didn't work. I have a cheap non-HF winch on my ATV that I've abused way more than the HF and it still keeps on pulling.
I have that same 50$ wireless winch on my UTV. I rarely use it to winch but it raises and lowers the plow alot. the cable breaks alot to. I did ditch the wireless part cause it was annoying.
The duty cycle on them is about 30% if I remember right. I think that means use it for 3 minutes straight let it sit for 10. I may be way off on this but I know it has a very low duty cycle. Not great for a winch that will be used for winching but great for everything else.
I think that winch should work fine for you. I have a 3500# on my Mule and I am always surprised at what it pulls. SO far I have had to change the cable every year because the log skidding and the snow plowing just toast it up. This year I switched to synthetic and will be very interested to see how it holds up. I have only pulled a couple of logs out of the swamp and done about a days plowing, but so far so good. I do think it has some strecth in it though.
I was thinking about getting a 2500# for par buckling logs up on the mill bed. Curious to see how you make out.
Quote from: Old Greenhorn on December 13, 2019, 12:38:32 PMI was thinking about getting a 2500# for par buckling logs up on the mill bed.
That's how I burned mine up. Just need to go a little more... a little more... (smoke) :-[
I am real interested to know how the synthetic holds up to plowing. that is where I always break the cable. One day I will build a pulley to redirect the pull but till then I just keep making the cable shorter.
Quote from: Old Greenhorn on December 13, 2019, 12:38:32 PM
I think that winch should work fine for you. I have a 3500# on my Mule and I am always surprised at what it pulls. SO far I have had to change the cable every year because the log skidding and the snow plowing just toast it up. This year I switched to synthetic and will be very interested to see how it holds up. I have only pulled a couple of logs out of the swamp and done about a days plowing, but so far so good. I do think it has some strecth in it though.
I was thinking about getting a 2500# for par buckling logs up on the mill bed. Curious to see how you make out.
I'll get it installed and report back, but may be a bit. trying to finish the shop, get moved in, and make the wife's x-mas/anniversary gift this weekend, and with 9 functional fingers. *facepalm*
Quote from: Crusarius on December 13, 2019, 01:59:52 PM
I am real interested to know how the synthetic holds up to plowing. that is where I always break the cable. One day I will build a pulley to redirect the pull but till then I just keep making the cable shorter.
I Z rigged the cable on my plow with 2 pulleys and the cable just did not like the small turn radius on the pulleys One is 2" the other is 4". Last year I just put a short piece of cable in the Z-rig and let the winch pull on that. Not sure where that cable went. But yeah, it always failed in the last 3 feet on the cable and I would shorten it. I would also get damage from yanking the logs out of the swamp to where I could hook them up. broken or frayed strands. So between the two, a new cable about each year.
The synth seems to not mind the bend around the sheaves but seems spongy. Time will tell, but so far so good. When I got the stuff and looked at it, I thought it looked like cheap plastic clothesline and had zero confidence, but so far, it is working fine. Hope to be pulling more logs tomorrow.
Quote from: ljohnsaw on December 13, 2019, 01:55:44 PM
Quote from: Old Greenhorn on December 13, 2019, 12:38:32 PMI was thinking about getting a 2500# for par buckling logs up on the mill bed.
That's how I burned mine up. Just need to go a little more... a little more... (smoke) :-[
Were you wrapping the cable around the log and anchoring it so that the log rolls, or were you dragging the log up the ramp. Seems like rolling it should not be much of a load, but I don't know how big your log is either. I would say my average log is about 1,000-1,500# and my ramp is 10°. Seems like that would be workable because I can do it with a peavy. Problem for me is working alone, I can't hold the log halfway up the ramp to reset the peavy. What were the circumstances of your blown winch? Maybe I should re-think.
We were loading these logs:
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/30640/20170609_19x11-4N25x12-6.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1497062425)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/30640/20170613_1.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1497414725)
Two years ago. Used the ramp in the background. About a 20° angle? A couple were just about flat as the trailer was next to a berm with the log on top. We resorted to the orange winch thing you see on the trailer. To load the logs, we ran a chain from the trailer, under the logs, up over the top back towards the trailer with a snatch block at the end. Then a cable from the orange winch, through the snatch block back to the winch. When using the 2500# winch, we just went straight to the chain (no snatch block). Typical parbuckling It was not working hard at all, just too long.
I had a 3500# travelers winch from tsc. I was parbuckling some 2500# red oak logs and had the winch snatched and i did the run for a few min and let cool for a few. After loading 3 logs, the winch was toast.
My next winch will be another HF 12k plus a new motor for my 18k warn, which will turn it into a 16.5k.
If i dont a mil 5tn wrecker/crane tck, ill build a log arch for my mill to help load the logs.
Man it took me forever to find which thread this winch discussion was in, but I wanted to follow up a little. I went to HF on Saturday and looked at their winches, no way would I buy that 2500# version for anything more than very light work. As for the other sizes I would just go over sized for any application. A co-worker bought their 12,000# unit 6 months ago, I am still waiting for him to mount it and try it and let me know how it works.
Well, I'm mostly back in action, although probably doing too much to let my hand heal right. We loaded the biggest log I had this weekend and literally maxed out the mill. It was wider than the guides at points, but with a couple well placed chainsaw cuts and some finagling, we got 'er slabbed out.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/IMG_5500.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1576502897)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/IMG_5496.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1576502972)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/IMG_5497.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1576502898)
I went through these last two blades way faster than I had expected, especially since it was mostly pine and cedar cut. I need to quit saying I'm going to build a lube system and actually DO it.
Double post.
ERC will dull my blades faster than any other species that I regularly saw. :-X
Quote from: Magicman on December 16, 2019, 09:09:25 AM
ERC will dull my blades faster than any other species that I regularly saw. :-X
Mind = blown
Is there a particular reason?
Quote from: Old Greenhorn on December 16, 2019, 08:32:19 AM
Man it took me forever to find which thread this winch discussion was in, but I wanted to follow up a little. I went to HF on Saturday and looked at their winches, no way would I buy that 2500# version for anything more than very light work. As for the other sizes I would just go over sized for any application. A co-worker bought their 12,000# unit 6 months ago, I am still waiting for him to mount it and try it and let me know how it works.
Those 12k winches are good enough for the price that im gonna buy another 1. I messed up when the cable rat nested and i ran the winch in reverse, which prematurely burned out the holding brake while picking up a 6000# pecan in 1 lift.
I had it and used used it a couple yrs before mounting on my trailer, where is shined and did its job.
Aint much id recommend buying from HF, but that winch is worth the price. If the 18k was ever on sale, id buy it too.
Quote from: Magicman on December 16, 2019, 09:09:25 AM
ERC will dull my blades faster than any other species that I regularly saw. :-X
Thoughts as to why cedar dulls blades faster? I did notice when using my csm, i had to sharpen more often while cutting cedar. I thought i left more dirt in the bark after pressure washing and trying pre strip the thready bark.
What I notice when I mill it is the knots they are usually dry and very hard the fewer the knots the longer my blade last.
Last night was a cool realization. I finally got the shop set up enough to start making stuff again, so I embarked on a walnut entry table for my 5th anniversary present to my wife.
So, I started collecting wood and laying out cuts - that's when it hit me. I made all of this lumber and I was finally getting to reap the rewards by making something!
Here's the rough pile:
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/IMG_5487.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1576594353)
I laid out my cuts and broke it all down into the frame for the table:
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/IMG_5502.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1576594353)
I'm on the hunt for a jointer now to flatten everything out. But, I was just a grinning fool to know that I was on the final step of the way from taking it from the tree to the finished piece, after about an 18 month journey.
end sappy story, back to milling.
Looks great! Can't wait to see the progress on the table.
Are you going to put it in the house so it can acclimate before you start to build?
Quote from: Crusarius on December 17, 2019, 12:46:51 PM
Are you going to put it in the house so it can acclimate before you start to build?
No, and I've gone back and forth on this for a while. Ultimately, the shop will be conditioned and it wont be a problem. Unfortunately, it's not now.
So, my solution is to assemble this with pocket hole screws. I'll take it inside and let it acclimate after a dry fit and adjust from there. It's going to suck majorly but I don't know how else to do it. Any ideas?
If you can make the shop match the house that is the best of both worlds.
Isn't your "shop" just your basement? If so, just plug in a dehumidifier, maybe a little ceramic heater and a small fan to circulate around your wood stash.
Quote from: ljohnsaw on December 17, 2019, 05:09:06 PM
Isn't your "shop" just your basement? If so, just plug in a dehumidifier, maybe a little ceramic heater and a small fan to circulate around your wood stash.
No, it's a separate building, and I don't have a garage door yet, so it's not even closed off from the elements.
I may take all the wood in the house and let it acclimate and then bring it into the shop when i work on it. I only work a little at night any way.
Sounds like you need to build a door first :)
Quote from: Crusarius on December 18, 2019, 08:18:12 AM
Sounds like you need to build a door first :)
It's on order. 10x16 insulated garage door! Wont be here until January though. Lame.
if you have a planer, just use a planing sled. Its a little extra work but you can get a flat surface on a board as wide as your planer. Im building an oak cabinet from a log off our property. It is quite satisfying going from tree to furniture.
Quote from: ktm250rider on December 18, 2019, 09:41:09 AM
if you have a planer, just use a planing sled. Its a little extra work but you can get a flat surface on a board as wide as your planer. Im building an oak cabinet from a log off our property. It is quite satisfying going from tree to furniture.
I made a run at the sled last night. It worked ok, but not close enough that I'd call it a win. I sold a bunch of walnut this week, so I've got enough money to go buy a decent used jointer. There's a couple of Rigid around for $400 and a jet 2.5hr away for $425.
Here's some pics:
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/IMG_5527.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1576850114)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/IMG_5528.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1576850114)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/IMG_5530.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1576850175)
Definitely useable, but there is a lot of room for improvement. plus, it took forever.
Did you shim under the rough stock to take any movement out of the board? If not, its just going to shift as its passed through the router. Also, make sure there is no flex in your sled. I tried the single piece of melamine approach and ended up going to a plywood box. Its cumbersome but results are excellent.
Nice looking lumber though.
Quote from: ktm250rider on December 20, 2019, 02:47:24 PM
Did you shim under the rough stock to take any movement out of the board? If not, its just going to shift as its passed through the router. Also, make sure there is no flex in your sled. I tried the single piece of melamine approach and ended up going to a plywood box. Its cumbersome but results are excellent.
Nice looking lumber though.
Late to the party here, I have been REALLY sick with some viral garbage. I think the issue was the sled flexing. At any rate, I picked up a Rigid 6" jointer for $400 and have been pretty happy with it.
I ordered some new blades for the mill, but haven't had the time to even think about cutting more wood lately. I've got a few projects lining up, so I'm sure there's going to be time made soon!
I got a lot of work done on the walnut table last night. I got the top flat enough after several nights with the hand plane to call it good and got it sanded down. I got the frame assembled, less a couple of small things I need to fix, but it's ready to be sanded.
Next up is filling the notch on the top with (black) epoxy, attaching it to the frame, then finish sanding and apply the finish coating. I'm going to use Tung oil. I did some shelves a while back and really like the finish.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/IMG_5586.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1578065633)
What is everyone's usual wait time from blades from Woodmizer? I ordered some blades on 12/30 and have yet to get a shipping confirmation. It's not a huge deal, but I do have a few orders waiting.
If you ordered the variety pack very long lead time. if it was just a box then should be pretty short.
Quote from: Crusarius on January 07, 2020, 12:34:34 PM
If you ordered the variety pack very long lead time. if it was just a box then should be pretty short.
Nope, just 3 of the 747 blades. I emailed them just to get a shipping ETA and haven't heard back on that either, haha.
hmmm. strange.
Maybe there has been a UFO landing and an abduction?
Not like them not to respond.
Odd indeed.
Anywho, I finished up my table.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/IMG_5607.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1578502276)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/IMG_5606.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1578502275)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/IMG_5604.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1578502274)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/IMG_5605.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1578502274)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/IMG_5598.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1578502274)
Beautiful project
Flipn cool alright!
How did you flatten the slab?
Quote from: JoshNZ on January 08, 2020, 04:29:15 PM
Flipn cool alright!
How did you flatten the slab?
Hand plane. I need to work on a more suitable set up for my router sled, I ruined a part of a slab the other day working on another one because I was too lazy to set it up correctly.
Luckily, this slab wasn't too bad and didn't take too much time to get right. It's not perfect, but it'll do.
Router sled...
http://www.cncrouterparts.com/pro60120-5-x-10-cnc-router-kit-p-374.html (http://www.cncrouterparts.com/pro60120-5-x-10-cnc-router-kit-p-374.html)
:)
That is flippn expensive haha, I can tell you now my flattening sled won't cost more than a 10th of that ;D.
Cool though, looks pretty good for hand flattened!
Quote from: Crusarius on January 09, 2020, 04:32:54 PM
Router sled...
http://www.cncrouterparts.com/pro60120-5-x-10-cnc-router-kit-p-374.html (http://www.cncrouterparts.com/pro60120-5-x-10-cnc-router-kit-p-374.html)
:)
DANGGGG!!!!!, that is high dollar. Iv seen router sleds built for less $100, excluding the router and bit/s.
I think ill build onto my mill bed rails and get me 3hp router. Steel, router, rods and time, even at $100/hr wouldnt equal to the cost of that fancy thing.
Yes it is spendy but how many tools do you own that make money for you while your making money doing other things?
Quote from: JRWoodchuck on January 09, 2020, 11:46:03 PM
Yes it is spendy but how many tools do you own that make money for you while your making money doing other things?
Own, as in bought and paid for, or assigned and have at my disposal?
If a man's sole living or plans to be the only source of income, and determining the amount of items produced and sold that would pay for that tool and THEN start making money.
As a hobbyist, doing it in spare time, not in a hurry to get a product out the door, or just something for oneself, budgeting to get things built or to buy things. How many have that much money to lay down for hobbying around?
I make darn good money and only work 50% of the year, can budget my builds without worrying about if this bill, or that bill gets paid, and i myself, wouldnt hand over that much, when something 1/10 the cost will do the same.
@Hoopty5.0 (https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=46558)
Collin, nice work. Looks exceptional.
Have you knarfed into that pecan you picked up a few months back? Kinda curious what it looked like on the inside, considering how punky it was on the outside.
Quote from: charles mann on January 10, 2020, 12:21:41 AM
@Hoopty5.0 (https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=46558)
Collin, nice work. Looks exceptional.
Have you knarfed into that pecan you picked up a few months back? Kinda curious what it looked like on the inside, considering how punky it was on the outside.
I haven't yet, but intend to soon. I have a couple of small jobs ahead of them that I need to get on, but I STILL don't have any blades. I will be calling Woodmizer today to see what's up. This is ridiculous.
Quote from: Hoopty5.0 on January 10, 2020, 08:55:11 AM
Quote from: charles mann on January 10, 2020, 12:21:41 AM
@Hoopty5.0 (https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=46558)
Collin, nice work. Looks exceptional.
Have you knarfed into that pecan you picked up a few months back? Kinda curious what it looked like on the inside, considering how punky it was on the outside.
I STILL don't have any blades. I will be calling Woodmizer today to see what's up. This is ridiculous.
I would agree. Hopefully a polite, yet if need be, stern conversation, followed by email will get ball rolling
I am in the process of building one of those cnc's :) Just because :)
Wont cost that much though. least I hope not. My last router sled cost $83 for the linear bearings.
Quote from: Crusarius on January 10, 2020, 09:23:03 AM
I am in the process of building one of those cnc's :) Just because :)
Wont cost that much though. least I hope not. My last router sled cost $83 for the linear bearings.
Build thread??
well, kind of a build thread start? More of an informational thread. But you can get the idea of what I am working on there.
https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?topic=109062.msg1703907#msg1703907 (https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?topic=109062.msg1703907#msg1703907)
Really need to find some investors. These projects I keep embarking on are getting more expensive every time.
Blade order date: 12/30/19
Blade delivery date: 1/15/20
So, 17 days. Overall, not unreasonable I don't guess. I think what threw me off was that the confirmation email said the expected ship date was 12/31. Gotta figure the holidays put them behind a bit. Oh well, but I'm ready to get milling again!
Second issue - In my drying shed, I've got 2 halogen work lights, a dehumidifier, and a 20 fan running 24/7. Would that account for a $100 increase in my electricity bill? I'm thinking so but was curious on your thoughts as well.
Each device will say it's watts or its current draw which you can figure out watts from. And your bill will say what you pay per kW/hr, easy enough to work out. A 1200watt toaster running 24/7 will use 28.8kW/hrs per day and you'll be paying something like 30c/kW/hr (actually I have no idea what you'll be paying.. in NZ you would be) it'd cost you about $8.64/day for that. Youll prob have two rates, off peak as well so you could do the calculation twice.
Long over complicated answer aside... Sounds about right :D
That is probably as close to the correct answer as your gonna get. Now the real question is with all that running will your wood be drier sooner? or will it not be worth the extra cost to get it a month sooner?
Good responses. The halogen lights are both 500w bulbs, which combined with the fan (not even counting the dehumidifier) equals Josh's analogy. At $.075 /kWh, is $64/mo.
Whoops. My wife was not pleased.
@charles mann (https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=41365) - I finally cut up one of the logs! It was a B____ moving the logs without the tractor (my dad has it) so I had to modify my 3 pt crane by welding a trailer hitch on and supporting with a heavy strap (NOT a good idea). To lift, I used a chain hoist, but again, my dad has the 2 Ton hoist and I was left with the 1k pound hoist (REALLY NOT a good idea), so the only thing I really had going my way was the log tongs.
After much tense maneuvering, I was able to get the smaller of the two loaded on the mill and was rewarded with some of the prettiest pecan I've ever seen! I got 8 - 8/4 slabs and a couple 6/4.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/IMG_5922.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1582550247)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/IMG_5923.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1582550246)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/IMG_5926.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1582550246)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/IMG_5928.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1582550246)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/IMG_5924.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1582550245)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/IMG_5930.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1582550246)
So on to the need for version 2.0:
- The hand crank lift winch is toast. I have an electric one on the shelf that needs to go on.
- after the pecan log, I tried milling some pine 2x lumber but the blade got gummed up with sap and ruined half the log and left me with a roller coaster.
I need to make a lube system. Again, I have all the stuff, I just need to force myself to do it.
- I need to add ballast to the rear of the carriage as it's really front heavy.
- the cheesy little feet I put on the bed to level it are way undersized. Need to find a better solution there.
Now that my shop has permanent power and doors, etc., I can drag the whole setup inside and fix it all. Now to find the time...
Ahh the rabbit hole of next versions :)
I now hoave a version 2.0 design and 2.5 design working.
Hah! I don't think I have the need or desire to make another. This size suits me just right, just needs some fine tuning.
And considering what little exposure to mills I had previously, I'm really pleased with how this came out.
Another question I had - is it possible to do a direct drive? I'd just pull out the clutch and put a pulley on. My clutch is the weak link and wont let me power through the cuts. I probably wont do it, but it's just an idea Ive had rolling around.
Quote from: Hoopty5.0 on February 24, 2020, 09:16:30 AMis it possible to do a direct drive?
You can eliminate the clutch and have one of two other options. WM has an "over center" setup with tipping the motor. When the motor is down in the level running position, the belt is tight. Tipped up just a bit, there is slack and the belt won't engage. You have to have some metal guides very near the pulleys to keep the belt from falling off and helps it have slack around the pulley so it will stop going around. Search on here for gww, Kwill or Kebitz's mill builds. The other is to have an idle pulley that does the same sort of over-center thing to tighten the belt.
Quote from: ljohnsaw on February 24, 2020, 09:24:43 AM
Quote from: Hoopty5.0 on February 24, 2020, 09:16:30 AMis it possible to do a direct drive?
You can eliminate the clutch and have one of two other options. WM has an "over center" setup with tipping the motor. When the motor is down in the level running position, the belt is tight. Tipped up just a bit, there is slack and the belt won't engage. You have to have some metal guides very near the pulleys to keep the belt from falling off and helps it have slack around the pulley so it will stop going around. Search on here for gww, Kwill or Kebitz's mill builds. The other is to have an idle pulley that does the same sort of over-center thing to tighten the belt.
Good deal. I forgot I bough a tensioner pulley a while back before I revised the whole setup. I need to come up with a way to work it back in!
Can always setup an electric clutch instead.
I like my centrifugal clutch. I will not change that.
Quote from: Crusarius on February 24, 2020, 10:26:36 AM
Can always setup an electric clutch instead.
I like my centrifugal clutch. I will not change that.
Can you link to what you have? I had a lot of trouble finding one that was rated for my HP. This one is rated for 8 I think and have 16 haha. The one Linn sells is $200!!!
That is the one I bought. I have 22hp and after I got the clutch broken in it has been great.
It is pricey but its kinda important part of the build. Or you go find a lawnmower on the side of the road with an electric clutch and scarf it.
Hopefully some of the other pieces i kept turns out with that character, along with the burned out logs. Im hoping they have worm holes in the wood.
Quote from: Crusarius on February 24, 2020, 11:58:19 AM
That is the one I bought. I have 22hp and after I got the clutch broken in it has been great.
It is pricey but its kinda important part of the build. Or you go find a lawnmower on the side of the road with an electric clutch and scarf it.
Pricey is an understatement for some.
The 1 i was looking at was around $1800. Hind sight, yet still a possibility, i should have went ahead and got it.
I used a centrifugal clutch rated for 25hp on my 22hp engine and it's great. Double sheave and 1" shaft with 1/4" key. I'm using both sheaves and nothing slips, first to groan is the engine.
I got it here, from a local auction site $90USD.I could pick one up and ship it if you don't find something similar elsewhere.
I don't know if we're allowed links or not admin can edit if necessary.
25HP Centrifugal V Belt Pulley Clutch A or B Belt | Trade Me (https://www.trademe.co.nz/2544746196)
Quote from: JoshNZ on February 24, 2020, 09:21:15 PM
I used a centrifugal clutch rated for 25hp on my 22hp engine and it's great. Double sheave and 1" shaft with 1/4" key. I'm using both sheaves and nothing slips, first to groan is the engine.
I got it here, from a local auction site $90USD.I could pick one up and ship it if you don't find something similar elsewhere.
I don't know if we're allowed links or not admin can edit if necessary.
25HP Centrifugal V Belt Pulley Clutch A or B Belt | Trade Me (https://www.trademe.co.nz/2544746196)
That's great and I appreciate the offer! I need to fix a few other things higher on the priority list first, but I may end up taking you up on it in the near future if its still there.
Sometimes, I am my own worst enemy, and I have to just stop and shake my head.
I've been meaning to make a lube system, but have been putting it off because I couldn't dig up the motivation to piece it together. Yesterday, I had some down time and within 10 minutes, I had an operational lube system. I could have smacked myself! 10gal poly fuel cell from an old race car project, a -6 AN to barb fitting, and some rubber hose and it was done. I just ratchet strapped the cell to the top of the carriage. I was using vise grips to regulate flow, but will stop for a ball valve on the way home today.
Didnt get any pics, but I did cut up a small piece of pecan because I was bored. Looks like a alien cockroach overlord, no?
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/IMG_6017.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1583167603)
Or some kind of moth.
No idea how much lube you need. I have 2 valves on my manual sawmill. One to adjust the flow and one to shut the flow off. That way when I get the flow just right, I can shut it off when I am putting another log on and than turn the valve and it's just the way it was when I stopped sawing.
@Hoopty5.0 (https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=46558)
Get you a small 1/4 turn valve and a small gate valve. Put the 1/4 turn at your blade and As thecfarm said, open them both, adjust the flow, then, you can use the 1/4 turn to stop the flow during log change/flipping and fully open again and you are at the exact same flow you were at.
Maybe even put another, but larger, 1/4 turn valve on your water tank so you can close to take it down to fill it, IF you plan on dismounting it to refill.
Quote from: charles mann on March 04, 2020, 10:11:11 AM
@Hoopty5.0 (https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=46558)
Get you a small 1/4 turn valve and a small gate valve. Put the 1/4 turn at your blade and As thecfarm said, open them both, adjust the flow, then, you can use the 1/4 turn to stop the flow during log change/flipping and fully open again and you are at the exact same flow you were at.
Maybe even put another, but larger, 1/4 turn valve on your water tank so you can close to take it down to fill it, IF you plan on dismounting it to refill.
Quote from: thecfarm on March 04, 2020, 07:29:58 AM
No idea how much lube you need. I have 2 valves on my manual sawmill. One to adjust the flow and one to shut the flow off. That way when I get the flow just right, I can shut it off when I am putting another log on and than turn the valve and it's just the way it was when I stopped sawing.
Thanks, those are good ideas. I did by a 1/4 turn valve, will add the gate valve too.
Had a heart procedure last week and am on limited activity. Might be a month before I get any more done. I keep trying to work and my wife keeps yelling at me!
If you have 12 volts on your machine I use a solenoid valve with a flip switch just turn it on or off that way don't have to do any reaching.
Quote from: bwstout on March 09, 2020, 09:53:49 AM
If you have 12 volts on your machine I use a solenoid valve with a flip switch just turn it on or off that way don't have to do any reaching.
LOL now that is fancy there. Might be too fancy for my rickety hunk-o-junk!
Naw my mill is a redneck build I call it a shade tree mill set under a tree at least you have a shed ;D
Good: Lube system works great
Good: added a yard stick and a pointer to accurately measure cuts
Good: I cut up 2 big walnut logs, a cherry log, some pecan, and a cedar log this weekend
Bad: hand winch finally gave out. Time for the electric one to go on.
So I have 32 slabs in the shed to dry right now. I just kinda tossed them in to get them out of the way. I need to pull all of the pine out and break the stacks down more. But I cut the slabs thicker this time and painted the ends to reduce checking. Look at those beautiful straight cherry planks on top!!!
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/IMG_6135.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1584461312)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/IMG_6136.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1584461312)
Oh, out of curiosity...
I set a bug bomb off as I closed up last night. The pecan had termites, so I was hoping that would get 'em. Does that actually work?
Termites enter from the ground so I would be providing the proper ground separation and even a termite shield.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/20011/IMG_7228.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1584466734)
Also spraying the ground with something such as this will kill/eliminate termites.
Quote from: Magicman on March 17, 2020, 01:41:20 PM
Termites enter from the ground so I would be providing the proper ground separation and even a termite shield.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/20011/IMG_7228.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1584466734)
Also spraying the ground with something such as this will kill/eliminate termites.
so could they have just been ants in the wood, not termintes? There were hundreds of ant-like critters in the pecan slabs, some with wings. Didnt get pics.
Google searched for north american termite. https://www.google.com/search?q=north+american+termites&client=safari&prmd=isnv&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwje3rfLg6PoAhUBP60KHVveCbYQ_AUoAXoECBQQAQ&biw=320&bih=454#imgrc=CInRX5ZYIrZsOM (https://www.google.com/search?q=north+american+termites&client=safari&prmd=isnv&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwje3rfLg6PoAhUBP60KHVveCbYQ_AUoAXoECBQQAQ&biw=320&bih=454#imgrc=CInRX5ZYIrZsOM)
Hmm yeah that looks like them. I set a second bomb off last night just for good measure.
Also, the steady stream of water coming from the dehumidifier is impressive. Lots of wet wood in there, so I guess that's how it's going to go for a bit.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/milldesk.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1584981198)
My new "office" has a pretty cool view of a sawmill.
Side note - I added the electric winch to lift/lower the sawframe and I'm kicking myself for not doing it sooner. So, we have a lube system, measuring system, and a remote controlled lifting system. Eat yer heart out Woodmizer!! hahaha
I've got 2 projects in various stages of completion that I'm kinda excited to show off.
Project 1: lumber rack - I needed a way to organize the dry slabs in the wood shop to better use the space. I made it from pine off the property, so I essentially have $0 in it, until I go pick up a bunch of lag screws today to finish bracing. It's 8' tall, but the pics don't convey scale well:
Before:
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/IMG_6275.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1585573184)
After:
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/IMG_6288.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1585573185)
Proud papa!
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/IMG_6282.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1585573194)
Like I said, need to add another couple lbs of lag screw and a few more braces.
Project #2: Jib Crane
Due to the location of my mill, it's hard to load logs on and moving it somewhere else isnt an option. The crane will sit outside, but next to the bed of the mill and will swing logs on. Here is a pic that I am mimicing:
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/jibcrane.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1585573492)
I have all of the material and have started welding, but am waiting on my neighbor to cut the tabs for the hinges on his plasma table. Hope to have more progress this week so I can show more pics for critique.
The swinging hoist jib pictured. What is its rated capacity? Are building exact, or beefier?
Quote from: charles mann on March 30, 2020, 01:14:40 PM
The swinging hoist jib pictured. What is its rated capacity? Are building exact, or beefier?
my jib is 4" x 8" by 1/4" I beam - but you gotta remember the logs I cut are twigs compared to what's in your yard :D
Quote from: Hoopty5.0 on March 30, 2020, 01:35:39 PM
Quote from: charles mann on March 30, 2020, 01:14:40 PM
The swinging hoist jib pictured. What is its rated capacity? Are building exact, or beefier?
my jib is 4" x 8" by 1/4" I beam - but you gotta remember the logs I cut are twigs compared to what's in your yard :D
True, BUT, what is the rating of an 8" i beam, 1/4" wall per ft?
In that application it won't be the beam that fails it will be the connection and or the hinge.
Yeah, that's been the concern of a few people that I've talked it over with is the hinges. I also have some steel cable that will work as a guy wire and an angle to the top to support the beam. Think tower crane.
beef up the hinges, bigger diameter and thicker support pillar and a support cable that'll take the weight. we have a shining crane rated for 2 tons, with a 12" i beam about 3/8"-1/2" thick. has a 1" diameter support cable that hinges, looks like about 2-3" diameter wings and the support column is about 48" across ( don't know, didn't measure it for exactness). looks to be WAY over engineered, but those type of cranes, for their size, have a much lower wll for some reason.
With a design like that bigger is not always better. If you put a w6x20 wide flange (I) beam that is a roughly 6" wide 20 pounds per foot. you have to support that 20 pounds per foot along with the load you want to lift. If you use a w6x5 now your only supporting 5 pounds per foot and it gives you more lifting capacity. With any type of structural engineering it is always tradeoffs. the bigger you go the heavier it all needs to be. but then you need to also be able to support it and not have it fall off of the wall or whatever it is attached to.
Now if you intend on using it as a drag line and not a lifting line that changes everything. Especially the load direction which will change all your beam sizing.
Thanks for the comments. This will strictly be lifting logs next to the mill. Swinging 180°, and then lowering. I think the other thing I should have mentioned is that the jib is 6' long and I'll only ever be using 3-4' or so.
@charles mann (https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=41365) I do still have one of those two pecan logs I got from you to mill. What do you figure they weighed? That will likely be the biggest load it ever picks.
(https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/shopping?q=tbn:ANd9GcQBcMO-_0lUX5Wwj6-nhEMq8bhuqPZyQA8bTNEHdi2NhYh_Etvkh_ghf0clhDLu5DjTZVNl08iIAA&usqp=CAc) How about building something like this?
Quote from: Ed_K on March 31, 2020, 10:18:14 AM
(https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/shopping?q=tbn:ANd9GcQBcMO-_0lUX5Wwj6-nhEMq8bhuqPZyQA8bTNEHdi2NhYh_Etvkh_ghf0clhDLu5DjTZVNl08iIAA&usqp=CAc) How about building something like this?
That's how I originally started out but changed designs so that the leverage on the mast would be spread out more.
Quote from: Hoopty5.0 on March 31, 2020, 08:31:15 AM
Thanks for the comments. This will strictly be lifting logs next to the mill. Swinging 180°, and then lowering. I think the other thing I should have mentioned is that the jib is 6' long and I'll only ever be using 3-4' or so.
@charles mann (https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=41365) I do still have one of those two pecan logs I got from you to mill. What do you figure they weighed? That will likely be the biggest load it ever picks.
Id say no less than 1000 lbs, no more than 1500 lbs. but i could be wrong on the high or low side, leaning more to the high side of wrong, just by watching how much my tires squatted in the front. It may be closer to 2000 lbs.
did you use equip to off load it, or armstrong and leverage?
I offloaded with the tractor and my "crane" attachment I made for the 3 pt hitch.
Been off the mill for a bit, but cut up some nice mesquite today. This stuff is way waaay heavier than it should be. Sheesh!
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/100477535_10117986726537714_8660077244804235264_n.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1590521318)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/98291142_10117986726462864_7928444877489045504_n.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1590521318)
I cut it 8/4. It warps and twists pretty bad so it's going to be strapped like crazy. Beautiful stuff though.
Waiting on some blades from Woodmizer again. I thought I'd learn to order far enough in advance, but their lead time is nuts regardless.
definitely some nice stuff. Some ppl will think I am crazy but I just sanded down a couple walnut slabs I cut a while ago today. They are going to be benches either for the deck or the playground.
C'mon Big C, you know if no pictures it didn't happen...
WOW! 3 mos since my last post. I got tied up in a large furniture project for a customer, then a large project for my wife, and work has been nuts in between all of that.
Speaking of work, I am starting a new project soon that has a lot of trees on it that I want, mostly black jack oak and a large osage tree. Going up tomorrow to compare what's out there vs what I've been seeing in the tree survey. Hope to be back into milling soon!
A while back, @charles mann (https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=41365) gifted me a couple pecan logs that I milled and had kiln dried. Finally got something to show for it, hoping to sell them for a pretty penny! thanks again for the beautiful wood.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/tables1.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1606948239)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/tables2.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1606948240)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/tables4.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1606948240)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/tables5.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1606948241)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/tables6.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1606948242)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/tables8.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1606948242)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/top2.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1606948243)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/56558/top3.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1606948243)
Been doing a little milling lately. Just been so busy with my real job I can't seem to find time for much else.
@Hoopty5.0 (https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=46558)
Those look good. Im glad i could pass on something that turned out in favor for you. It could have easily went the other way too. I just got a 30' trailer load of pecan out of a vacuum kiln in waco and had very little warping/cupping, but pre dried by lightening, cutting them 3" thick and 2 months under a black tarp with good air flow, im hoping helped in lessening the warpage. If posting pics was difficult, esp off the phone, id post some before/after pics.