My customer last week spoke highly of this drum sander. Thinking I might get one for personal woodworking.
Wondering if anyone has it and what your experience has been.
Does one just choose one grit or is there an option to interchange extra drums.
Any issues and how did Laguna handle them.
https://supermaxtools.com/products/wood/25-50-drum-sander-72550/ (https://supermaxtools.com/products/wood/25-50-drum-sander-72550/)
You won't be changing drums. You have to change the paper. Should take about 10 minutes to put the paper on. You have to cut it just right so that it rolls on. I don't have this machine, but a grizzly. I have 80 and 120 grit.
Dennis,
I have this same sander, the 25-50. I have to date mainly used it to sand wood cookies. My reason for getting it was to be able to sand wood cookies efficiently as I sell a good many of them and sanding makes a big difference in the value of a cookie. Sanding cookies with a hand sander like a random orbit sander is like chinese water torture because the end grain is almost impossible to sand smooth without long, torturous sanding time. This drum sander does it very well, and I am pleased with it for sanding end grain wood cookies.
That is about as far as my experience with it goes so far. However, I did try to sand a big heavy half kitchen island top (there were two 20" wide glued up pieces and I wanted to sand them each before I glued those two to get the single 40" wide top). The pieces were heavy at 1.5" thick and 80" long. That did not go well at all because I did not have any infeed and outfeed tables so it was impossible to feed and hold level, so the sanding drum gouged the piece in several places, sort of like snipe on a planer. I do not believe that this was the drum sander's fault. I realized that if I wanted to sand large heavy pieces that I would need to build dedicated infeed and outfeed tables that are dead level with the sander's infeed and outfeed beds, but I have not done that yet. I am sure that it would have handled the individual boards that made up the island top before glue-up much better than the big heavy half-top.
All that said, it does seem to perform like it is supposed to and I believe it will be a valuable asset in my shop.
Thanks.
I was thinking getting this machine would be the end-all for sanding, but maybe not so.
So what is the sanding strategy with a drum sander?
Usually one needs to sand through several grits, for example 80, 100, 150, 220..... depending.
Does one just use the drum sander for the coarsest grit as a "leveling" operation following the planer? Then random orbit for the other grits?
Or does one re-wrap the drum with successively finer grits for larger projects?
Or some other strategy?
Please dont get distracted by mention of grits. sketti_1
I have a jet 22-44 oscillating sander.
I like it, it does nice a nice job, I normally use it with 80 grit paper, then switch to the random orbit.
You can run it thru several times at the same height. With each pass it sands a little lighter and therefore cleans up some of the scratch marks. Not as good as changing grits, but it helps a little before you start with the ROS. I don't like to change grits and usually leave the 80 on there.
Here is a picture of a maple cookie that I cut on the sawmill and allowed to dry for about 8 months. It is 21" in diameter and 2" thick, so it could make a nice little side table.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/14370/IMG_3778.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1604975261)
Here is the same cookie sanded on the 25-50 Supermax drum sander.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/14370/IMG_3779.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1604975294)
It took 15 minutes at 36 grit to get it to this level. With a rnadom orbit sander, it would have took a minimum of an hour or two to get to the same point. This small step creates a huge lift in value from the original unsanded piece. That was my strategy for getting the drum sander, but I am sure that it will be a real positive addition to my workshop. It would also excel at sanding end grain cutting boards.
Nice information. And that really looks cool 👍
I was debating this tool when I was making live edge tables both small slab coffee or cookie slice coffee tables. I can second WDH comment on how long/effort it takes with hand sanders. If I get back into the business I will definitely get one.
PS: WDH that cookie slice looks awesome after sanding. I would love to see photo of the finished piece because it should be a stunner.
What is the best quality/economy sandpaper to buy for this machine.
Are the supermax outfeed tables the ones to buy for this machine or would it be better to use other roller stands or fab up longer supports if goal is to occasionally sand heavy long pieces?
The paper looks easy to change in online videos. Does it make sense to use the machine changing to successively finer grits or is there a downside to repeatedly taking off/putting back on papers? Looks like when the narrow tapered end tears, that would be the end of that piece of paper.
I don't see any downside to going through the grits by changing paper. Just takes a few minutes to change out a grit. The supermax infeed and outfeed tables seem too short to me to handle long heavy boards or glue-up.
l only have a 24 inch drum sander now and bought several x weight 4 inch x 50 yard rolls from supergrit years ago to just cut my own. It's pricey but less then pre cuts. It's easy to change and the tangs last a long time. Get a big rubber sandpaper cleaner stick. Only problem I have had is not removing excess glue before sanding can plug an area so I use a paint scraper first when leveling glue joints. I also plan on upgrading to the jet open one in the future. One other thing is get a good cyclone because they plug filters fast without one.
So went and got it today at my nearest Woodcraft Supply store.
3 boxes sitting in my shop now need attention.
For years I've been saving little boards and cookies in my shop from sawing or that started out in my firewood pile or at the wood splitter. These will get some attention too.
@wdh Do your outfeed tables fold down easily, and are these worth getting? These were not in stock yesterday. If you like them do you have their part number?
I do find them useful. I will have to check and see if I have the part #.
Update. So far very pleased.
Got the sander put together. Only glitch was the mounting of the sander to the stand, I had to file out some holes in the top of the stand so the top head unit wasnt crooked on the stand. It was off by 1/8". Took an extra hour but that's how I am.
Went back and picked up the folding infeed/outfeed tables, agree these are worth it. I also got the Wixey depth gauge, which mounted easily on the sander in predrilled holes easily. What a time saver this gauge will be.
Setup and alignment of the sander and tables in retrospect pretty easy. Sanded some cookies and sent some dovetailed drawer parts through it very successfully. 120 grit out of the planer or even 150 would be a sufficient start to follow the planer. The "leveling" nature of this sander vs. random orbit sanding of planed parts is an excellent improvement. To have a part completely flat after sanding out tearout or snipe is great.
It is not hard to take off a lot of material. For example sanding the inside faces of dovetailed drawer parts one could easily do too much and get loose fitment. But how much is taken off is easily controlled, and quickly with the digital depth gauge feature.
One will want additional heavy duty infeed/outfeed stands to send heavy pieces through this machine. It is heavy duty with respect to sanding mid- to small size pieces but it is not built by itself to handle parts more than a few pounds that are more than a couple feet long. Heavy slabs will need to be fully supported almost entire length on either side of the tables to not have bad snipe or mess up the machine and its alignment.
I also sanded a dozen glued up quartersawn pine drawer bottoms about 13" by 25" , either 3/8" or 5/16" thick, going through the sander using the whole 25" drum width. Couldnt have done that with my planer because the grain length was in the 13" dimension. Also not to mention that these bottoms were glued up from narrower boards that not all having the same grain direction. Beautiful results.
Quote from: WDH on November 09, 2020, 09:32:44 PM
Here is a picture of a maple cookie that I cut on the sawmill and allowed to dry for about 8 months. It is 21" in diameter and 2" thick, so it could make a nice little side table.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/14370/IMG_3778.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1604975261)
Here is the same cookie sanded on the 25-50 Supermax drum sander.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/14370/IMG_3779.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1604975294)
It took 15 minutes at 36 grit to get it to this level. With a rnadom orbit sander, it would have took a minimum of an hour or two to get to the same point. This small step creates a huge lift in value from the original unsanded piece. That was my strategy for getting the drum sander, but I am sure that it will be a real positive addition to my workshop. It would also excel at sanding end grain cutting boards.
Danny, do you find that maple cookies don't crack bad? I've only cut cedar which do well about not cracking.
Have not cut many maple cookies, so this piece of maple is my only data point. I have also found ERC to make very good cookies with less cracking than other species.
Quote from: WDH on November 08, 2020, 07:30:13 PM
Dennis,
I have this same sander, the 25-50. I have to date mainly used it to sand wood cookies. My reason for getting it was to be able to sand wood cookies efficiently as I sell a good many of them and sanding makes a big difference in the value of a cookie. Sanding cookies with a hand sander like a random orbit sander is like chinese water torture because the end grain is almost impossible to sand smooth without long, torturous sanding time. This drum sander does it very well, and I am pleased with it for sanding end grain wood cookies.
That is about as far as my experience with it goes so far. However, I did try to sand a big heavy half kitchen island top (there were two 20" wide glued up pieces and I wanted to sand them each before I glued those two to get the single 40" wide top). The pieces were heavy at 1.5" thick and 80" long. That did not go well at all because I did not have any infeed and outfeed tables so it was impossible to feed and hold level, so the sanding drum gouged the piece in several places, sort of like snipe on a planer. I do not believe that this was the drum sander's fault. I realized that if I wanted to sand large heavy pieces that I would need to build dedicated infeed and outfeed tables that are dead level with the sander's infeed and outfeed beds, but I have not done that yet. I am sure that it would have handled the individual boards that made up the island top before glue-up much better than the big heavy half-top.
All that said, it does seem to perform like it is supposed to and I believe it will be a valuable asset in my shop.
Danny, do you think if you made your tables the sander would pull thru a live edge slab maybe 24" wide 8 ft long?
I really don't think that the machine has enough power to do that and be able to take off enough wood in a pass to make it practical. The passes would have to be light and the physical work to handle the slab back and forth for the number of passes required to get the slab smooth would not be worth it. It would likely take a big industrial machine to efficiently smooth such a long, heavy piece of wood.
I'm guessing you might need roller infeed and outfeed tables to have it pull through a 150 pound 24 x 8' x 2-1/4" thick slab because of the friction which would otherwise be on the tables.
This is with perfectly aligned tables and a work piece that isnt going to be rocking or torquing the sanding drum as it goes through.
It doesnt have any trouble sanding 24" wide, but the "intellisand" feature (light comes on and feedback from sanding motor slows down the bed feed rate) comes on pretty quick if you try to get too aggressive with it.
It's going to come down to having a setup that works and taking multiple light passes which I agree could quickly be unpractical for a commercial shop.
I went to a local woodworkers place yesterday to look at one. I can see where it would not work for that. I was mainly thinking about just one side so customers can see grain better. Another question on it. His head of the sander moves some without much pressure is this normal?
Looked at mine, head was about 1/2" from bed, put my fingers under open end, applied pressure up against the outer table on the back of my hand, yes I can make it flex a bit, but cant compare with what you saw. It doesnt strike me as excessive for as long as it is.
When sanding it will be under load, and the table surface is adjustable on the outside, so it can be adjusted to get the same thickness across a wide board you are sanding.
@WDH (https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=4370) Danny I traded my jointer which I don't use for a 25-50 yesterday. He had some paper 80 grit in a roll that I will have to cut. Where do you get your paper, do you buy it pre cut or ready to go?
I bought the paper when I bought the sander. I got the roll and cut the paper myself. The pre-cut rolls are good, just cost more.
I bought Supermax precut rolls in packs of 3 from woodcraft supply. They were on sale before Christmas. Klingspor on the back
You probably already know this, but a crepe rubber block for cleaning the sandpaper is a must-have.
Yep – $14 from woodcraft supply
Quote from: btulloh on January 20, 2021, 03:11:03 PM
You probably already know this, but a crepe rubber block for cleaning the sandpaper is a must-have.
Got one from Amazon on order, I cut a roll today for it off a large roll and put it on. I got the right length but I had at least 1/2-3/4" needed more to cover the whole drum. My rolls are 3" do I need wider rolls? Maybe 3 1/8"
I looked at several of my Supermax boxes and the size is not mentioned there just that it is for the 25" sander.
I measured several rolls width and got 3-1/32" for all of them. I think they are nominally 3".
If it's any help I dont think it matters if when you wrap it on there is a bit of gap between the adjacent wraps even 1/16" which might help you cover the width. The fit has to do with the angle and length you cut the leading and trailng edges and that the overall length is long enough. There is a template for this in the operator's manual. I didnt have to cut any.
Mine cover the width of the drum. But they tell you to leave a gap at the last wrap to allow the sander to pull things tight as the paper stretches.
It would be worth having one genuine Supermax roll just to use as a template if making them up off of a bulk roll.
Can't seem to find rolls of 36 grit, anyone have any ideas?
I got mine from Supergrit in 50 yard long rolls.
Supermax sells the individual rolls in packs of 3.
I didn't see bulk rolls anywhere that were any less expensive than the pre-cut Supermax rolls .
Laguna - Sandpaper Wraps for 25" Drum Sander, 36 Grit, 3-Pack (https://www.woodcraft.com/products/supermax-sandpaper-wraps-for-25-drum-sander-36-grit-3-pack#)
Here are pre-cut rolls of 36 grit.
Quote from: xlogger on January 22, 2021, 07:37:58 AM
Can't seem to find rolls of 36 grit, anyone have any ideas?
Here (https://www.industrialabrasives.com/6x50-ft-36-grit-polycotton-drum-sanding-rolls-01580-p-993.html?zenid=jlsfhn8i8ckja98d3sh9e4f4f4)
I ran a 24" double drum Grizzly a few years ago and got rolls from them. Call as they have more than whats on the website.
I cut a plywood template that I used to cut the angle on the belt. Worked well.
I skipped the drum sanders and went with a 15" Grizzly wide belt, open end sander. Works great on glued up panels. And easy to change grits, just push a lever, and slip on a different belt. Cool thing about the sander is if you sand both sides as you go, helps to flatten panels. You have to pre- try your wood, as the sander is not limber like the drum sanders, and you might jamb it up with a piece too thick for your setting. I put the end of the panel between the rollers to adjust it, start a little loose and tighten it up till it is sanding right. Lots faster than drum sanders.