Long time reader first time posting. I have been wanting to get into milling for a while now and now I have a good excuse.
I have 5 big western hemlocks down, ranging from 36"-52"diameter and two big Ponderosa's down 36"-40" in diameter at the trunk (including bark). The Ponderosa's were blown down last winter and have been on the ground for a year. The Hemlocks were standing dead for about a year and have been on the ground for about 4 months. I would've took the Hemlocks down in an orderly fashion, milling each before bringing the next down, but the power company said they were a risk to the powerlines, and cut them all down for me... I'm a little irritated that they left such a mess, but thankful I don't have to pay to cut them down or risk cutting down compromised trees myself (especially since the neighbors house was in range of a few).
I have a Husqvarna 385, 372 x-torq, and 336 (and a non-running 345.. I kinda like chainsaws). I've got a 32" bar with 2-ripping chains and 2-crosscut chains, 28" bar with 2-crosscut chains, and a 24" bar with a 5-6 chains (I burn a lot of firewood and hate sharpening chains).
The Game Plan:
The power company fellas did a good job of laying the hemlocks all in a row down my steep hill. There isn't a good way to haul the logs out in sections without doing a lot of tree clearing (not wife approved). I intend to use the 385 and CSM I recently purchased to slab the logs and hand carry them out in pieces. It's about 50 yards on fairly steep, but manageable, side-hill terrain to get out of the woods into the clearing around my house. My 32" bar isn't big enough to mill the logs so I'm going to slab what I can and then rip the logs in half (lengthwise), and then slab the halves.
I think my biggest dilemma is what to do with the slabs. I don't have a flat piece of land on my property other than my front yard (storing slabs in front yard, also not wife approved). I've got a buddy about 15 minutes up the road who has a tractor and blade that might work for leveling a spot to put the slabs, but that seems like a lot of extra work. Is there a problem with stickering slabs on a slope if I build a frame for them to go on? Also, anyone have clever ideas where I can find cheap and or plentiful supply of stickers? I've got some leftover hickory flooring that I might be able to make some stickers out of, but probably not enough.
Ultimately, I'm looking to build a shed with the lumber. I've been watching youtube videos of people building cabins with freshly milled lumber, if I go that route I won't need to store the slabs for long. I've got a big cabinet table saw that I intend to use to cut the slabs down into lumber dimensions.
This weekend I'll be focused on cleaning up and burning limbs, but I'll see if I can grab a couple photos of the Hemlocks and maybe cut the logs into 12'3" sections. I'm aware, from reading on this forum, that standing dead trees means I need to be concerned with shake? But I don't really know what I'm looking for because I've never really looked for it or cared about it. I'm usually just cutting up logs for firewood. Is it pretty obvious when you see it?
Any major holes in my game plan? Any pointers for a guy brand new to CSM/Milling in general?
Welcome to the Forum!
I've seen people with uneven ground sink uprights, level and cut them off, then frame in with bracing to make drying racks. There are some pics on the forum, probably google 'drying racks'. Depending on how unlevel and the direction you have to load/unload from, this may or may not work.
I reread you post, said you are using a chainsaw to try this. I assume you have no loader or equipment. You might consider having a portable sawyer come to your place and mill the slabs. The cost will be justified by the better finish on the slabs. Also, the sawyer would cut stickers while there. I can't imagine cutting stickers with a chainsaw :).
What is your intended use of the slabs?
How old a fella are you? sounds like a big job. is the wood still good or has it began to rot. those are my concerns.
Welcome to the forum.
I have burned hemlock in a wood stove. Burns good!!! Even coals down some.
Now those pine......
When the wood is gone so is your fire. But could mix it in with something good.
Have plenty of sharp chains on hand.
Run the CSM downhill.
Consider a bar tip oiler.
If possible make a square/rectangular cant so you don't have to manually haul waste material out of the woods up the hill.
Do you have a tractor of ATV to attach a cable or rope to the slabs so you can skid them out?
It will be some of the hardest work fun you will ever have.
Welcome to the forum. I tried using a chainsaw mill several years ago. I don't know where you live, but for me it was too hot, to loud, and generally too much work for this old body. I'm in the process of building a bandsaw mill now. I expect it to be much more enjoyable. But hey, if the chainsaw fits your needs go for it. Keep us posted. I love reading other peoples experiences. Good luck and don't forget to post some photos of what you're cutting.
I traded my CSM attachment for 400 square feet of standing seam roofing. :o
Chain saw milling is tough work. At 12'3" long those slabs will be hard to manhandle up a slope. My stickers come from when I edge boards, I can't imagine doing that with a chain saw.
I started out a year or three ago exactly the same as you; logs I couldn't stand turning into firewood and wanted to cut into slabs. I already had 2 90cc Husky saws so I got a slabber attachment for the unported saw.
It's been an education.
First, the chainsaw mill is a TON of work. It produces a lot of noise, a lot of exhaust fumes, and a LOT of chips. Not much in the way of usable lumber. You'll find yourself cutting thick slabs because that's about all you can do with one.
After I got sick of that mess, I decided to buy a band mill. Unfortunately I was on a budget and got a cheap unit (lx25). Sad to say the chinese mills at the same price point are much better. It's kind of a(admin language edit) to be honest.
My advise is to think long and hard how deep you want to get in. You'll need a kiln, jointer, planer etc to do anything with the wood. You'll be in 20k for a barely functional setup in no time. Just like me.
Just burn it.
Edit: Sorry this isn't the answer you are looking for and I'm not answering your question. This is just my advice for anybody considering a chainsaw mill. If you are ever near KC you can come try mine out but you have to take the chips with you. :D FYI compared to the job you are signing up for, my logs were dropped right in front of my house for free on level ground. You're in for an education if you go forward with this idea.
Quote from: TroyC on March 24, 2023, 12:39:38 PM
Welcome to the Forum!
I've seen people with uneven ground sink uprights, level and cut them off, then frame in with bracing to make drying racks. There are some pics on the forum, probably google 'drying racks'. Depending on how unlevel and the direction you have to load/unload from, this may or may not work.
I reread you post, said you are using a chainsaw to try this. I assume you have no loader or equipment. You might consider having a portable sawyer come to your place and mill the slabs. The cost will be justified by the better finish on the slabs. Also, the sawyer would cut stickers while there. I can't imagine cutting stickers with a chainsaw :).
What is your intended use of the slabs?
If I had any equipment other than a truck with a winch and a quad it wouldn't matter. The hill is too steep and the trees too thick to get the logs where they could be milled. But the thought did cross my mind.
Quote from: SawyerTed on March 24, 2023, 06:11:53 PM
Have plenty of sharp chains on hand.
Run the CSM downhill.
Consider a bar tip oiler.
If possible make a square/rectangular cant so you don't have to manually haul waste material out of the woods up the hill.
Do you have a tractor of ATV to attach a cable or rope to the slabs so you can skid them out?
It will be some of the hardest work fun you will ever have.
It's a pretty steep hill and the logs are laying up/down the hill so I'll definitely mill them going down.
Quote from: Guido Salvage on March 24, 2023, 10:05:17 PM
Chain saw milling is tough work. At 12'3" long those slabs will be hard to manhandle up a slope. My stickers come from when I edge boards, I can't imagine doing that with a chain saw.
I have a nice big table saw I'll use to rip the slabs and that's a good idea for making som stickers.
Quote from: thecfarm on March 24, 2023, 05:41:38 PM
Welcome to the forum.
I have burned hemlock in a wood stove. Burns good!!! Even coals down some.
Now those pine......
When the wood is gone so is your fire. But could mix it in with something good.
I mostly burn red oak these days and mix in a little cedar and pine.
Quote from: doc henderson on March 24, 2023, 05:36:55 PM
How old a fella are you? sounds like a big job. is the wood still good or has it began to rot. those are my concerns.
37 year old military man. Not in the best shape, but not afraid of some physical labor. Been hiking hills and rollin logs through the woods for a while now. Up until now it's always just been for firewood.
Quote from: KcMatt on March 24, 2023, 10:20:11 PM
I started out a year or three ago exactly the same as you; logs I couldn't stand turning into firewood and wanted to cut into slabs. I already had 2 90cc Husky saws so I got a slabber attachment for the unported saw.
It's been an education.
First, the chainsaw mill is a TON of work. It produces a lot of noise, a lot of exhaust fumes, and a LOT of chips. Not much in the way of usable lumber. You'll find yourself cutting thick slabs because that's about all you can do with one.
After I got sick of that mess, I decided to buy a band mill. Unfortunately I was on a budget and got a cheap unit (lx25). Sad to say the chinese mills at the same price point are much better. It's kind of a (admin edit) to be honest.
My advise is to think long and hard how deep you want to get in. You'll need a kiln, jointer, planer etc to do anything with the wood. You'll be in 20k for a barely functional setup in no time. Just like me.
Just burn it.
Edit: Sorry this isn't the answer you are looking for and I'm not answering your question. This is just my advice for anybody considering a chainsaw mill. If you are ever near KC you can come try mine out but you have to take the chips with you. :D FYI compared to the job you are signing up for, my logs were dropped right in front of my house for free on level ground. You're in for an education if you go forward with this idea.
Yeah, I've heard some people voice this sentiment and some people who just love CSM. I figured, like you, got the saw, got the wood, $130 for a Chinese CSM its worth a shot. If I hate it... then I just make a ton of firewood. If I love it then I make a bunch of lumber for building chicken coop, storage shed, wood shed, dog house, etc.
Already have a cabinet maker 220v table saw and 220v planer. Cause I like to make stuff.
It'll flat out smoke a pitsaw. If you enjoy putting down back roads without the need to do 70, it works pretty well. We spent the other day doing some low production, dusty work on a chamber of commerce day. My partner had returned from a vacation and realized we were having more fun. You'll either catch the bug or be cured :).
Quote from: Don P on March 25, 2023, 07:41:08 AM
It'll flat out smoke a pitsaw. If you enjoy putting down back roads without the need to do 70, it works pretty well. We spent the other day doing some low production, dusty work on a chamber of commerce day. My partner had returned from a vacation and realized we were having more fun. You'll either catch the bug or be cured :).
Had to look up what a pitsaw was... and ooof I can't even imagine having to cut wood like that!
I remember as a kid a pic in National Geographic of a line of men sitting side by side and across from each other as well, along a large log. Each pair of men across from each other was pulling a saw horizontally between them. The next pair was sawing on the next board down, and so on for each successive board. I guess they passed off saws and leapfrogged one another or everyone slid along as they worked. It was my first understanding of what a gang rip saw is in some places :).
Colonial Williamsburg has a pretty good demo of pit sawing at the carpenter shop.
I talked to the pit man who said it was work but if done right he didn't get "too much" sawdust on him.
The box man down below has the big hat on, the tiller man is the top dog, that is the name of the respective handles on the pit saw.
Someone tried a thinner kerfed tensioned frame saw and that worked so that was installed in a frame with water powering the "sash" up and down via a ... pitman arm, which put an end to human powered milling. Some of them had multiple saws spaced board width apart in the sash frame, another gang rip.
Mostly burned branches today but cut up one of the ponderosa pines. Looks fine to me.
Also talked to the neighbor and they are gonna let me use their side of the property to haul logs out. Which means I can use my log arch and truck winch. Should make things go a lot more smoothly
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I'd like to see how those open up when you saw them.
I was looking at handmade flooring and happened across this pitsawing video;
(2) The Craft of Pitsawing a Replica Historic Wood Floor - YouTube (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hMKsKuEwhIg)
On the flooring, the 4 sider replaced 25 men with hand planes, putting down the back road was busy :)
I've only cut eastern hemlock. Never with a chainsaw mill. But our Eastern hemlock is HEAVY. 16' 2"x8" takes everything I have to move around when it's wet. And I have hemlock logs that have been stacked for 3 years now. Still wet and heavy.
If you can get the logs out and it looks like you can hire a portable sawmill. You will not regret it! I promise you that.
You will have whack of lumber that you can start.building with right away.
That way you can build your sheds and do some projects while you wait for a band saw to be built and be ready to pick up. :) Just helping you spend some money...
I started with a "Beam Machine" chainsaw attachment. Now I'm on past that a little bit. ;)
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tried milling some red oak I dont plan on using for anything. I got two cuts in and then this happened. (https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/72834/20230327_200526.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1679976568)
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The oiler screw fell out and luckily I noticed right away. I'm starting to think I accidentally joined a horse forum. On account of all the nay sayers in here.
Minus the oiler screw mishap, I think my first two cuts in a hard wood went well. The pine and hemlock should be much easier milling.
Glad to see you're making some sawdust. Hope you can get that saw going again without too much trouble. Whenever things are going too good Murphy just has to show up. I hate that guy. :D
The breeze blows by, you have slabs :)
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Quote from: RetiredTech on March 28, 2023, 06:24:41 AM
Glad to see you're making some sawdust. Hope you can get that saw going again without too much trouble. Whenever things are going too good Murphy just has to show up. I hate that guy. :D
Yeah, I call this saw Lil' Pig because it eats up all my time and money. I love my other husky saws but seems like this one is always breaking. That's what I get for buying a used saw from a "reputable" saw builder. Paid a premium for it too :/
Quote from: Don P on March 28, 2023, 07:30:04 AM
The breeze blows by, you have slabs :)
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Wow, that's a lot of lumber! What husky you using? Looks like a 2 series saw?
That is my partners mill so I let him work the heavy end :D, it is a 3120 XP. We needed longer rafters than our other mills could do easily... and in the woods and steep fields where we could go to the large trees we needed instead of trying to get them out. We used my circle mill and his Lucas swing blade to make the rest of the lumber on that job. I saw, dry, then rip straight using a number of different saws depending on size of wood and where I am. The 26' 2x12's were planed and then straightlined with a chalkline and skillsaw.
Quote from: Dutch42 on March 28, 2023, 12:13:29 AM
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tried milling some red oak I dont plan on using for anything. I got two cuts in and then this happened. (https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/72834/20230327_200526.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1679976568)
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The oiler screw fell out and luckily I noticed right away. I'm starting to think I accidentally joined a horse forum. On account of all the nay sayers in here.
Minus the oiler screw mishap, I think my first two cuts in a hard wood went well. The pine and hemlock should be much easier milling.
Yes, dismiss the collective experience of people who have tread the path you are embarking upon and who are offering, unpaid, their experiences. Be sure to keep us updated. So far you have experienced a chainsaw failure which I was fortunate to avoid.
Waiting for your next update.
Whelp still waiting on parts for my milling saw... must be coming from china? So I borrowed a tractor from a good friend, dug some holes, and poured some mud in tubes for my shed build. Not really forestry or milling related but its what my milling efforts are for.. building stuff
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Had a family emergency that meant I was sitting around in the hospital for a few days waiting to see if someone was gonna be ok (they were ok). I decided I'd buy a cheap chinese saw for milling while I wait on parts for my Husqvarna 385xp. Idle hands... means I'm spending money lol. Naturally the saw arrived broken. Luckily it was just the dogs and i bought from a US re-seller who is sending new dogs.
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Im the first to admit when im wrong (just ask my wife lol)... and boy was I wrong about lugging these slabs on foot. I made it about 10 yards before i was like nope, gotta find a way with the quad and my log arch. Long story short, I got some slabs outta the woods and in my garage.
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I cut down the slabs with my circular saw and will cut them down further to their final sizes with my table saw. Sorry, got in a hurry and forgot to take pics in the woods or of me processing the slabs.
Is it hard work? Sure. Do I regret getting into CSM? Not yet. Will I hire a sawyer? Hell nah!
Cut a few more slabs yesterday and my first 4x6. I free handed the 90 degree cuts with my 372xp. I used a chalk line on the flat surface made by my CSM to follow. Its... not great. Might end up as firewood i think I will be getting one of those edge mills. I'll see if i can square it up on my table saw.
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It was a hot day and I was moving pretty slow. I was also really struggling with keep my milling saw chain tensioned appropriately. The stupid tension screw is on the front of the saw making it very difficult to tighten when in the CSM. I tried a ratcheting screw driver and on of those Z shaped screwdrivers, neither worked well, but I was able to get it tightened without taking the saw out of the cut and out of the mill.
I thought since I didn't have any pictures in the woods before I'd add some. Also, have to show off my little work horse of a quad all loaded up ready to head to the house. I've had this quad since I was 11. She got treated pretty poorly when I was a kid, but this little honda just keeps on keeping on!
Long time no update been slowly plugging away! Have had a few distractions and disruptions. Two work trips and three saw "break downs"
My wife insists these kidds are gonna keep the back yard tidy and safe from fire hazards. They have done pretty good work keeping the grasses down and ridding the woods of poison oak. Preparation of the fence temporary and permanent ate up about two weekends that I could've been milling. But as they say, Happy Wife; Happy Life.
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Rookie mistake here. I should've used 2x8's for the horizontal beams and just notched the vertical 4x6 beams. Instead I notched both and according to my neighbor who builds decks means that the 4x6 horizontal beams are actually only as strong as a 2x6 because I notched them. He still thinks it will be fine though. I think it will be fine too. I'm pretty happy with how level it came out.
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Floor joists are probably overkill at 12" on center. They required a good bit of hand planing to get somewhat flat... so much for that nice level floor. I decided to add a deck off the downhill side of the shed so I can access the roof from that side a bit more easily and so my wife and I have a spot to chill and watch the goats eat.
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I put the floorboards on the joists green. Yes, I know they will shrink! I put screws in just the center of the floor boards at each joist so they can shrink and not split. I did this in early November so its a bit cooler out and so far no spliting, but the shrinkage is visible and the gaps range from 1/16" to 1/8." the boards are 11/4" inch thick and vary in width from 3.5" to 10.5" wide. I cut them longer than the base of the shed so if the ends split I can cut them off. It's rainy season in Northern CA so I have been putting a tarp to try to help keep the boards dry.
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The blue beast is a slabbing machine! As previously mentioned it has had a couple break downs though. I replace the pull cord with some good rope and had to repair the little metal piece that connects to the spark plug. My Husqvarna 385XP has been... not so reliable. I bought it used from a "reputable" saw builder in the local area. He "repaired" it once when it was overheating, and when milling it continued to overheat. I think the crank seal may be leaking allowing air in and causing the saw to run too lean. No time to fuss with it when the blue beast is getting the job done!
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I decided that dragging slabs accross the ground was a lot harder than draging them accross cleverly arange bits of wood and logs to an area I can easily get in/out with my quad and log arch. I only have one more "easily" accessed log left to mill and will have to figure out how to move the other logs into an area when I can get in/out with my quad.
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I moved this monster log with a series of ropes, pullies, and chains from the road with my pickup. I moved the log about 20 yards before getting it stuck in a small ravine. Its in a marginally better spot but still too difficult to get to with my quad. I will probably have to cut it down in size a bit (its about 10' long and about 55" in diameter).
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I've got a few more boards ready to go than in the photo. I'd say I have about half to two thirds the boards I need to build the shed walls/roof trusses. I was thinking I would mill the "sheathing" for the roof but I think I will just use ply wood to cover the shed so I can get it shingled as quickly as possible. I think I am going to do a gambrel roof, because my wife likes the look of the "barn" shaped sheds.
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When its too dark to mill I have been teaching myself freeCad. It's how I am able to guesstimate how many boards I'll need and sizes. It's also kinda fun... my wife says my definition of fun is broken.
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I'm hoping to have the walls and roof done by late December and most if not all of the siding milled by the end of January, but who knows what life will throw in my way between now an then that will slow me down!
Looks interesting.
Dutch42
Do us a favor and click on your user name, where you can update your profile with location at least. Thank you.
Glad it's working out for you and you are enjoying the CSM. Even if your "fun is broken." :D
Looks good.
We had goats, we finished off bottle feeding them. They would kinda follow us like dogs. But would head for the flowers on a trot. I would say,out,out,out sharply and they would leave them alone. One was in the garage once and there was a piece of paper under some stuff. The goat saw it and started to chew on it, I said out,out,out and it went out with the piece of paper and whatever was on top of the paper was on the floor. :o
Careful Goats and chainsaws are a slippery slope...Can lead to bandsaw ownership. Kiln builds, tractors, skid steers and all sorts of attachments for said objects...
...and chickens 🐓 :D
Quote from: Nebraska on December 01, 2023, 08:51:47 PM
Careful Goats and chainsaws are a slippery slope...Can lead to bandsaw ownership. Kiln builds, tractors, skid steers and all sorts of attachments for said objects...
Yeah, the buddy that lent me his tractor is trying to sell it to me. If I had a flat spot large enough to park a tractor and a BSM I'd probably have both by now. Although, with a tractor I could make some flat spots 🤔. I think once my shed is done I might build a mobile BSM.