I was just offered 2 American Elm logs. 24"x 12' from a local farmer. Grown in a tree line, but no fencing according to him. His family has lived there for 100 years.
This is in Ontario Canada.
What are they worth a bd ft? There is 300 bd ft. Doyle per log.
What would some of you pay delivered ? Picked up by yourself?
I am a hobby guy. I get tons for free. it is an interesting, beautiful wood in many projects. If you plan to saw and sell it, start with what you want to get from it, and add each stage of processing what you intend to make. It is under appreciated so who knows what folks will pay. I know a couple who almost paid 8 K for a table on one of the coasts and were told it was a domestic exotic hardwood. It was elm.
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:)
I did some beautifull furniture, just oil, super nice grain. It is difficult to put a price for a small mill like me. It is better to have a customer before getting the logs in the yard. I've got my best price from somebody use it as a floor for a bulldozer float.
There is not likely anywhere else to sell two elm logs to, they are worth what you'll pay him because otherwise they will get turned to firewood. It is very nice as the other guys said, and I would try to make the deal if you can. Here it dies before it gets anywhere near that large, I have a 16" to saw next week and won't see another for a while.
Quote from: Stephen1 on November 10, 2023, 09:08:51 AM
I was just offered 2 American Elm logs. 24"x 12' from a local farmer. Grown in a tree line, but no fencing according to him. His family has lived there for 100 years.
This is in Ontario Canada.
What are they worth a bd ft? There is 300 bd ft. Doyle per log.
What would some of you pay delivered ? Picked up by yourself?
No pics of the logs..??
Pay nothing, would be my suggestion. Get paid to haul them would be my other suggestion. Could be worth a lot, but unknown until after you saw them and open them up.
Why no pics?
Seems Beenthere is a highly visual kinda guy. 😁😉
I like his suggestion that the farmer pay you to remove his unwanted trees, or at least free, if you have the equipment to move them.
Elm isn't normally found in the usual lumber markets but it is a beautiful hardwood. It's a "lively" wood with interlocking grain. Tricky to get it dried and planed out straight but unique and expensive when processed properly.
Local prices will apply but don't sell your hard work for cheap.
Here those would be tie logs, with a few free feet tacked onto them. Too short for a switch tie and too long for a tie. Maybe $375 / MBF, but measured at 9' and not 12'.
I agree it's a pretty wood and sawn correctly can do a lot better, but the value of the log is just that, the value of the log, not what you can turn it into.
Many a living room wall in this region was dressed with elm paneling in the 70's. Has a beautiful grain, but makes a room a bit dark. As for lumber, that is challenging. Had some air dry, twisted like a piece of licorice twister candy. :D Don't over price the logs. You have a market for elm? Think it over well. ;)
There's a few ways of looking at this. Being a farmer, he could've just as easily pushed the logs into the burn pile, but he went through the trouble of saving them.
I've saved a ton of "highly valuable" burls over the years, guess how many people I've had show up and put money in my hand for them? Zero. I've gotten a few offers to take some for free. Guess how many burls I'll save in the future?
I'd pay him market rate, delivered if he's willing to haul them to you- if you have a use for them.
It's very seldom they get large enough to cut lumber from .I have gathered up the skinny dead ones and have a few stacked up for side loading logs .These will bend like a noodle before they break .IMO it's not the best of firewood and a chore to split even with a hydraulic splitter .
Fact in the 26 years I've lived here I've only cut one dead standing that was a foot in diameter .Most were 6-8 inch .
I've seen a few 40"+ wide at dbh up here. Some died, quite few were even cut down.
Elm was used up here on stable floors under horses. It stood up better to the treading action of horses in their stalls.
Not many up this way bother making firewood with it, too tough and stringy. Maple and yellow birch and at one time beech are the mainstay fire woods up this way. Most folks just let it rot, and it rots away quite quickly. My cousin about ruined a hydraulic wood splitter on a big old 40 incher. Darn thing was in the middle of the field, got tired of going around it. :D I had a 36" incher sawed. Lumber twisted every which way. :D
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45" measured above the burl. That woods was clear cut since.
I've only stalled the splitter on my firewood processor a handful of times. A couple were crotches that I tried to split top first. The others were elm. Not even that big, 12" or so from a nice straight log. On a four way wedge, the knives are properly staggered. It didn't even go through the first vertical knife. Just hit it and done, might as well have been a block of steel. Finally had to beat it off the wedge, and pitch the block. Tried cutting the next block off and splitting it (because I'm smart like that) and stalled it again. But this one got about 2" through the wedge before it stalled. I thought I was going to have to burn or chisel it off the wedge. 3rd block (I'm nothing if not stubborn😁) finally split.
Elm of any size are rare here, and it usually ends up in loads of Ash. I'm always a bit apprehensive when I run into it.
I'm old enough to remember when there were some big ones .They died faster than the ash trees of late .They just like the ash are still sending up saplings but they never get any size to them .A long time ago the wood was valued for wagon tongues because it was just plain tough .You could back over it with a tractor and all it did was bend where oak would break .
I suppose like many things, Dutch Elm Disease got up here after most everywhere else. I can still remember huge hulking dead standing specimens 3'-4' diameter, around some of the local lakes back in the 80's and 90's.
In fact I kinda learned to run a saw cutting firewood at 18-19 years old on dead standing elm. It was good for learning to file a chain too. Also the right age to be trying to chip enough of that devilish wood away so I could fit it through the door of my boss's outdoor boiler.
I see a big old one near the only lake near here I'd call a lake. A lot of old elms have tops like that one, fully alive, but not the umbrella look of most elms. You look and look and ask yourself, 'Is that thing an elm?' Looks like Medusa's head of snakes. :D I have a lot of young elms growing in cedar ground. Young because it was all cut 30 years ago. There's an 80 foot tall one behind the house, growing in the old orchard. Must be 20" by now. That thing must send out a billion seeds every spring. :D
the yard trees were good for tree forts, so watch out for nails. had access to some standing dead elm, and I cut it for firewood using the crates and my track loader, and gooseneck.
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brought it home in crates, and dumped them out one at a time, split them, then back in the crates. burned fine that year, with a little more ash, but nice and warm.
Quote from: Stephen1 on November 10, 2023, 09:08:51 AM
I was just offered 2 American Elm logs. 24"x 12' from a local farmer. Grown in a tree line, but no fencing according to him. His family has lived there for 100 years.
This is in Ontario Canada.
What are they worth a bd ft? There is 300 bd ft. Doyle per log.
What would some of you pay delivered ? Picked up by yourself?
Nobody likes or wants tree line trees. No even the firewood guys. They are worth whatever you are willing to pay for it. Makes for nice overnight burning firewood logs that's hard to split.
Make it a habit to use a metal detector on all fence line trees despite what anybody assures you about their history.
I've been busy finishing up my sawing season. I will go and pick up the logs next week as I have a delivery down by him.
I will have a look at the logs and make a decision then. It is a rare and beautiful wood for N America for sure. I talked with the owner of the Breezewood stickers, a large sawmill that I have dealt with and he put a price of .50 cents a bd ft if they were nice a clear and showed up at his yard.
Years ago I was called by a sub-contractor in Vancouver, who did the maintenance on the Canadian Submarines. They were asking for blocks of Elm 24x24x36" long . They used them on the keel of the subs, it was the only wood that didn't break off when the sub hit the bottom .
Since you mentioned "keel blocks " what I've seen at NewPort News plus Electric Boat were big oak blocks .Held up anything from submarines to aircraft carriers in the dry docks .
If you want to see examples of heavy rigging take a tour of a ship yard if you can .
Quote from: Stephen1 on November 10, 2023, 09:08:51 AM
I was just offered 2 American Elm logs. 24"x 12' from a local farmer. Grown in a tree line, but no fencing according to him. His family has lived there for 100 years.
This is in Ontario Canada.
What are they worth a bd ft? There is 300 bd ft. Doyle per log.
What would some of you pay delivered ? Picked up by yourself?
The average value of American Elm logs for veneer is anywhere $2-$2.50 per board foot. But they are worth what you'll pay him. It could be less than the market price also.
Another example .Some time ago I went to a local hardwood mill and ordered two 12" by 4" by 8 feet white oak planks for loaders for a D 4 Cat,14,200 pounds .They worked fine .However the mill owner told me if he had known what my use was to be he'd have used elm but 3" thick .The elm would have gotten lighter as it dried .The oak would never loose weight .After twenty some years he was correct .I was a lot younger then and today they are about like moving rail road ties .
Depends on what state of drying they were in. Oak will loose a lot of water weight when dried to 12%, and won't be much heavier than hard maple. White oak is 45, hard maple 44 and red oak 43 pounds per cub. feet. Red oak is slightly heavier than white oak when green, and 8 lbs heavier than hard maple. Hop hornbeam is 5-6 lb heavier dried than all of them at 12%. That's according to the folks at the forest products lab in WI.
I milled and dried some american elm and some red elm. They were both very pretty. I was not able to sell any of it, so I used most of it for my bedroom floor project. I think it's just something that people can't get anywhere and so it's not even on their radar to use. I also built a door for my master bath with the american elm. I love the door. I didn't stain it, but the american elm looks great with a dark stain.
I rarely use stain on a project anymore, unless I am trying to match something. I did some on an oak bench and regretted it. did not care for the look.
Same here. I don't use stain unless its for a customer who really wants it. I didn't stain the elm myself. I have a friend who used to have a sawmill and made lots of rustic furniture in South Dakota. He had great luck staining the american elm and it looked really good.
I've ran some really nice 8' elm logs through the firewood processor. It seems no one really knows what to do with it anymore, so it ends up in loads of mixed firewood logs I get. I wanted to saw them, but I knew I would saw them, sticker them, and there they would sit in the yard🤷
I know a guy who confused some for red oak. Nope, not me. But this guy shoulda known. ::) It was my elm, so maybe he thought I didn't know what elm was, maybe that was the game. He never got any more wood from me, to saw. :D
I haven't made it down to gt the logs yet as we got walloped with 20+ inches of snow and winter is here. I hope to make it down to get the logs next week.
Life changes once the snow comes, shovel, plow, feed the fire, shovel, plow , maybe find the wood to feed the kiln , then feed the fire again, and keep doing that ...until spring.
I've grown to hate snow, at least how it affects all of my day to day activities. We currently have NONE and I'm loving it!
We only have enough snow to show a cat track. Going to be 40's tomorrow.
Quote from: barbender on November 30, 2023, 12:18:47 PM
I've grown to hate snow, at least how it affects all of my day to day activities. We currently have NONE and I'm loving it!
I hear ya!
Quote from: Stephen1 on November 10, 2023, 09:08:51 AM
I was just offered 2 American Elm logs. 24"x 12' from a local farmer. Grown in a tree line, but no fencing according to him. His family has lived there for 100 years.
This is in Ontario Canada.
What are they worth a bd ft? There is 300 bd ft. Doyle per log.
What would some of you pay delivered ? Picked up by yourself?
The first tree I retrieved after opening my business was a Siberian Elm planted in the late 1800s here on Whidbey Island (the one behind me in my profile pic). It's been an amazing tree for many projects. We recently milled the last of it. As for price p/bf, the large slabs have been fetching ~$16/bf dried. The smaller stuff is around $10/bf dried. Most of the elm went into table, shelf, and mantle commissions. In one case we made a staircase. Most pics of that soon..
Here's a video of the recent milling. https://www.instagram.com/p/C1AU1NvPW63/ (https://www.instagram.com/p/C1AU1NvPW63/)
I have no use for elm - literally and figuratively. :wink_2:
Neighbour has a live American elm on the front of his lawn, probably 30" through, about 90' tall. There's another one down the road from there out in a field and another over on the next road east of here, standing tall in the middle of a field. All alive and big. About the only tree I've seen that can grow in the open and have all it's big limbs way up high. Can get a nice straight 40' log off most if you wanted to. Maples will have big limbs within 6 feet of the ground in the open. ffcheesy
We just cut down 40 elms on the verge between a farmyard and their access road. 15 went into their burn pile .The biggest were 18" , hard to get 9 straight feet .On the other hand Their is very little for hardwood where I live in west central Saskatchewan. We are under provincial Dutch Elm regs so .I have to get a permit to transport ,keep and sell . All loads to be tarped to transport , all to be debarked and milled bye Apr15. all bark to be burried or burned by that date . That includes the slash pile. and of course the lumber needs to be heat treated and kilned to prevent tiny chewing sounds and the spread of the disease. So We don't pay anything for elm.
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I will figure out how to post pics later
Welcome to the Forestry Forum. Look forward to seeing your pics.
Photo help on the home/forum page, scroll to near the bottom.
https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?topic=100194.0
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elm shoe rack custom made to fit under window in closet with live edge top.
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elm tommy hawk target. lots of uses.
I love that shoe shelf unit. elm is such a beautiful wood.
Left finger that is a lot of restrictions. I never looked into that here in Ontario. All my elm is KD with a sterilization cycle included.
Quote from: LeftFinger on March 22, 2025, 10:49:39 AMWe just cut down 40 elms on the verge between a farmyard and their access road. 15 went into their burn pile .The biggest were 18" , hard to get 9 straight feet .On the other hand Their is very little for hardwood where I live in west central Saskatchewan. We are under provincial Dutch Elm regs so .I have to get a permit to transport ,keep and sell . All loads to be tarped to transport , all to be debarked and milled bye Apr15. all bark to be burried or burned by that date . That includes the slash pile. and of course the lumber needs to be heat treated and kilned to prevent tiny chewing sounds and the spread of the disease. So We don't pay anything for elm.
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I don't think we are suppose to move elm firewood outside our local area. I know there is a Federal 'Plant Protection Act' up here. Ash firewood for sure isn't suppose to be moved. Sometimes it don't make much sense if saw logs and pulp logs can be moved, sometimes 100 miles. It's always the little guys' fault. :wacky:
here they were planted and lined every quarter mile farm driveway. Prob. like a government subsidized plan. after the dirt bowl they came up will kinds of stuff. hedge rows were a result of the dust bowl and why we have so much Osage orange here in rows. I could prob. get all the elm I could ever saw within 5 miles of my house. They did it with Catalpa to made RR ties and planted in groves to make them tall and straight.
History is soon forgotten.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OoqiKA7kPWg
I watched that What in the world do they want cottonwood for ? It's awful soft and weak
LF do you like any kind of wood? ffcheesy ffcheesy
Ok cottonwood is the state tree of Kansas. It is a softer hardwood. It burns at 18 million BTUs per cord compared to oak at 25 and hedge at 32 million. It is used for pallets, and coffins (light weight and can be painted pretty) and for trailer decking (the fibers crush and re-expand) without breaking and cracking. It does well "laser" engraving. be sure and do the air quotes at home folks.
Throw Me a Frickin' Bone Here Scene - Austin Powers: International Man of Mystery Movie (1997) - HD (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E-PIidaqCyU)
Amish are sawing pallet wood out of it, apparently. I suppose any wood will work for those. I've got some pallets made from spruce or fir that I pile firewood on. They lay on top of drainage stone so they are not in mud and they stay relatively dry under the porch.
In the 1970s when I worked as a log truck driver, the mill I worked for did not want Cottonwood. There was, however a market for big, long, straight Cottonwood logs that would be sawn for the side rails on wooden ladders. I sometimes hauled lumber and they once had me take a load of elm lumber to the sea container terminal in Montreal, Quebec. They put on the paperwork that you show at the border that it was "brown ash." I hope the statute of limitations has passed.
That 'Plant Protection Act' wasn't in affect back then. Not until 1990. Too much mis-labelled ash. ffcheesy
I used some Elm for Urns The first one his wife said he wanted a Viking funeral so I made them this one. The shields are his family
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It's about 18 in long
A matched pair of segmented Elm urns
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Stuff I just cut I love the grain and color
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Next Elm victim Ugly 16" Butt with branch and fork
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It did make ugly slabs due to the bark inclusions/rotten streaks I will cut them all thick and use for bowls
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could stabilize with penetrating epoxy if you had a need for that slab.
If it was more uniform in width I might consider using it for a slab. But then I would have to peel the bark off by hand .Using it for bowl blanks is a more cost effective use of my time
They did trim up okay 2 1/2 " thick but they don't look it
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Bowl Blank 4" x 10"
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Could be a Mantle 4 1/2" x 10" x 6'
Any market in Mantles
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I believe there is always a market for FP mantles, but people want them Finished.
I have a few mantle blanks, but since covid is over and people are not being paid to sit at home. very few DIY show up to buy.
I thought about how long I might have to keep it and made 10 " boards
My elm slabs have been kiln dried for 2 years now. I planed and sanded 1 as a showcase.
Lots of interest but no cash.
All of a sudden I sold 3 yesterday to 2 different people. I sold a crotch which is going be made into a river table and the other 2 will be a table.
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Quote from: doc henderson on March 23, 2025, 09:58:26 AMThey did it with Catalpa to made RR ties and planted in groves to make them tall and straight.
Here in the big corn fields catalpa's were planted in groves for fence posts likewise were osage orange .Both are resistant to rot but eventually they would but it took a long time .
Oak was what ties were made of .Fact the little village I grew up in ,on a rail head was because of the old mill that sawed the ties .
I'd just like to know how in the world did they even move those 4 feet in diameter logs to the mill in 1880 or so .The head saw they say was a double bladed deal,one up one down with a big steam engine .Days BA--before Al