Things have been winding down with the mill and it's been too wet to haul out back so I hired on with a local logging outfit til snow flies.They have a few excavators hired on with a highways contactor that is building a highway into the Callaghan Valley for the 2010 Winter Olympics and I'm running a Kobelco SK350 prepping and mucking out for the blasters.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10199/paul_excavator.jpg)
Stripping the rock.The guys in the backgroung are loading the holes for the blast,it took four of them 9 hours to load and prepare to blast last Saturday.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10199/paul_ex_truck_bob.jpg)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10199/paul_ex-blast.jpg)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10199/paul_ex-blaster.jpg)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10199/ph-ex-a.jpg)
I had Sunday off while Brian shoved the rock off of the road with the D10
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10199/ph-ex-e.jpg)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10199/ph-ex--b.jpg)
Early Monday morning I crawled up on the pile and threw the muck down to Bob and he shoved it of the road to the fill with the 966 Cat
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10199/ph-ex-d.jpg)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10199/ph-ex.jpg)
I'm having a great time working there and it's good to see how the big outfits go about it.The one thing that is hard to get used to is having to stop and let traffic through.but working with Bob and Brian has been good.They are both around 60 and have been in construction all their lives.Lots of laughs and good stories at lunch time :)
I'll post more tomorrow.
Great pics, Paul. 8) 8) Looks like you guys are really making your equipment earn its keep! :o
Thanks DanG.
They always put the hired machines on the rock pile,some things never change ;D
Cool stuff Paul, that kind of work is my dream job. 8)
That D-10 makes the payloader look like a toy, looking forward to more pics. :)
Whoo-hoo, big boy toys 8)
Looks like a fun an interesting job. I have always wondered hoe those roads were built without falling off the mountain.
Cool shots Paul 8). I always wanted to do work like that. Keep the pictures comming :)
Well,when I showed up this morning,there was only the drillers,surveyors,and another smaller excavator working and we only went until noon.It seems that there is no place to place the gravel and strippings until the bridge is in place so we're down for a bit.It has snowed on us last night and today so we might be down for the count soon.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10199/ph-ex-farkawa.jpg)
Driller running a Furakawa putting in holes for the shear line
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10199/ph-ex-f.jpg)
sending muck down to Brian who is loading it onto Bob's truck with the 245 Cat
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10199/ph-ex-bob.jpg)
Bob is a teamster and he's been trying to educate me on how important it is to stop for coffee at 9:30 and 3:00. I was only in the IWA for a total of two months in 1982 so I told him to be patient :D He's a good guy.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10199/ph-ex-i.jpg)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10199/ph-ex-g.jpg)
Finally climbing down off the ramp at 4:00 pm Thursday,4 days after climbing up of the road.The Kobelco has a custom fuel tank and gaurding package built by T-mar.The fuel tank holds at least four days fuel which was a good thing.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10199/paul_excavator.jpg)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10199/ph-ex-h.jpg)
A before and after pic taken from pretty close to the same spot.That's all the pics for now.I would have liked to get more of the crew but it didn't work out.
Scott,Norm and OWW
it is fun especially when working with a good crew that is willing to share their knowledge and experience and I look forward to getting back there if possible this year.Tomorrow I'm back on a logging road driving a Moxie,no coffee breaks ;)
Looks like a great time. I love big equipment and would have loved to bring a chair and watch even if I couldn't run any of it.
Did The warden let you out of the cage?
Quote from: Tom on November 04, 2005, 07:31:37 PM
Did The warden let you out of the cage?
At 9:30am,12:00 noon,3:00pm and 5:30 pm but I snuck out for a few pics ;)
How does God get those great big trees you guys got out there to grow in that rock?
Thanks for the additional pictures Paul. Now tell this flatlander what a Moxie is. ;)
Quote from: Jeff B on November 04, 2005, 08:35:59 PM
How does God get those great big trees you guys got out there to grow in that rock?
Them rocks are the fertilizer. :D ;D
Norm,
A Moxie is a 6 wheel drive articulating/occilating dump truck.It works well for steep muddy areas.I'll try to get some pics tomorrow.We were snowed on most of the day today and it's beginning to look a lot like Christmas,everywhere I go... :)
Here is a link to an auction that shows the same model and vintage
(1996 MT-30)
Moxie (http://www.dovebid.com/Auctions/Auction10103/alb/imagepagesH/image13.asp)
The door on the moxie I was driving has the door held shut with a bungee cord and whenever I hit a rough spot the door opens then shuts,all bloody day.Anyway,my brand new cell phone fell off my belt and some how slipped out the door this morning. My son had just set it all up and I was learning how to take digital pics with it but now it's a part of a logging road :-X
Thanks for the link Paul, guess I've not seen those around here. Sorry to hear about your new cellphone, sounds like you guys fix doors around there pretty much like we do here also. Well except we'd use baling twine. :D
Do not feel like the Lone Ranger
Took my camera to work again today but had it secured to the back of the seat so it wouldn't do the cell phone thing :-X
We moved the Moxy(i was spelling it wrong) excavators and tank drill out of the way last night so the Grapple Yarder and loader could pass us on the "Y".As he was turning to head up the road,the track on the Grapple yarder slipped off of the front idler and blocked the road and kept us busy for an hour.We ended up hooking the grapple to a log that was held securely by the EX400 excavator and when Dave tightened up on the log it lifted the track off the ground and helped the track back on.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10199/paul-gy.jpg)
passing on the "Y" about the time the track jumped
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10199/paul-gy-3.jpg)
it's back on and we're all happy about it
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10199/paul-gy-4.jpg)
Gary and Frank pumping grease back in to tighten up the track.Frank is smart cause he's just holding the coupler while Gary pumps the frozen grease(I'm smarter because I have the camera and everybody is on guard and hasn't noticed I didn't pump) ;)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10199/paul-frank.jpg)
My freind Frank.Good logger and he'll keep you laughing all day
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10199/paul-gy-hey.jpg)
Harry (Hey) doesn't like working Sundays but they won't let him quit :)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10199/paul-gy-5.jpg)
Ready to go again
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10199/paul-gy-6.jpg)
Pulling guylines,getting ready to yard
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10199/paul-moxy-twist.jpg)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10199/paul-moxy-dump.jpg)
A few pics to show how versitile the Moxy is.It can turn around in the same space a pickup truck takes and you can kick the back end over to dump off the side of the road.If done right you can back over your pile with the next load and dump
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10199/paul-moxyswivel.jpg)
This is the swivel joint that allows the Moxy to occillate.It has the large bearing and the center pins behind it that lets the truck turn sharp
Those Moxy's look darn handy Paul, how many yards can they haul? Looks like winter has moved into your area. Neat to see how you folks do things out there, sure different from my area.
Great pictures, Paul. Thanks 8)
I want one of those Moxys ;D ;D
............ and about 10 acres of bank run gravel to fill it with ;D :D ;D
Really cool shots Paul. I'm in college right now to be a Industrial Mechanic but if that falls through I'm seriously thinking of heading out your way for awhile. the more pics you post the more I want to be out there :D. A lot of guys run those Kobelcos around here , supposedly theyre one of the smoothest machines around. I like the Tmar gaurding packages. theyre feul tanks are the only ones I've seen that extend the full width of the machine and the catwalks, all the other ones are only as wide as the machine. Anyways thanks for the pictures and keep up the good work. 8)
SB,
from the pics I've seen of your place,the Moxy would be a good fit but when they breakdown it can be costly.On a decent road you can travel along at 30 mph and the Moxy has signal lights too.
Norm,
I think the Moxy holds around 15-18 yards but I don't know for certain.The wheels are still cutting through the snow up there and I think tomorrow is my last day there on the Moxy but I wouldn't want to wander around on the hills if things freeze upI don't have any problem saying "no"
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10199/paul-concrete-mini-ex.jpg)
Here is a little excavator I rented in the Summertime and considered buying it off of the owner for $4000.It has a 12 hp diesel and does a surprisingly good job for it's size and there is a niche for it around here but in the end,decided to pass.
It was fun to run 8)
Scott,
Finish your schooling first and then come out.Unless we get a major earthquake,BC won't be going anywhere for a long while.If you ever decide to come out this way,I'll try to help you out the best I can.
Man I need to start taking a camera to work. Just today one of the crews was trying to jump a track back on a 071 Madill. You know Paul on the Sherman tank carrier. How we won the war I will never know. They were trying to lift one side with the guy lines and a dozer.
Current yarders working on my sales include;
071 Madill, TMY40 Thunderbird, TY40 T-bird, 6140 T-bird, 50' Washington Swing- this one can grapple yard, 60' Skagit truck mount drums date from the 40's with a 60's model tube powered by a 500 cadillac with a bad alternator. I will be getting a "Yoader" or two pretty quick.
The TY 40 was hung 3000' to the tail hold for a few settings. It was a 'bit" dicey but they managed to pull it off. They only had about six wraps on the skyline drum and the mainline was nearly tapped out reaching the back, almost 2000'.
Those little 071's had a M6 undercarriage I think.There are a couple still around the area here that work occasionally.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10199/paul-minitower.jpg)
I spent a couple of really cold days on this 071 in late November 2003.The yarder was on loan to a local farmer that was putting in a 8" waterline for irrigation and I kind of volunteered because Mark is a good guy and we have done some horse trading before.
The waterline was put in underneath the Lillooet river by a directional drilling contractor but the pipe didn't have any water in it when the flood came in Oct and the pipe floated right up to the top of the river.
We ended up pulling the line out of the river with the 071 and the remaining portion behind the machine was pulled out with a D7.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10199/paul-minitower-a.jpg)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10199/paul-minitower-b.jpg)
Our job with the 071 was to drag the 8" pipe back to the bluff in the picture above(around 800',can't remember) to the intake.Mark and his son Peter are heading across and have a long hike back up to the bluff.We used walkie talkies to communicate and I hugged the muffler for warmth while they hiked out there.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10199/paul-minitower-e.jpg)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10199/paul-minitower-d.jpg)
Here is a picture showing the butt rigging which would normally have chokers hung from the bullhooks.We used it to attach the pipe.
At night we had to hang ribbon on the lines that were suspended across the river so we wouldn't snag any aircraft :)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10199/paul-minitower-c.jpg)
The 3 guylines were anchored in the ground to "deadmen". This pic shows part of the tank undercarriage.
It was a fun couple of days and just after Christmas Mark and his wife took everyone who helped on the project out for a Prime Rib dinner and some good visiting.
Tillaway,
I hope you remember to take your camera out with you everyday.I would love to see some of what you are doing down there
Looks like that 071 was missing a vital piece... like the cab. :o
My wife controls the cameras, I would have to sneak the digital out.
Whatever those chassis are they sure throw tracks. I think they will go faster than I would want to ride too. Our roads can be pretty steep > 20% on some so moving one down hill through switch backs tends to take a while. That and the steering is a bit "iffy" at times. One contractor that had very little experience tipped one off the road last year while moving it. Something about a steering issue common to them.
That missing cab was why I was so ccold ;)
The brakes on the M6 originally had mechanical levers to apply them and the bands are in a oil bath.On the 071,they were modified with air pots and unless they are set just perfect they want to steer one way so you have to play a game of catch and release to compensate and it can get spooky because it swings the machine back and forth across the road.The undercarriage wasn't designed for that kind of weight either and sometimes the tracks want to snap,then you have no brakes ???
I hope you can sneak the digital out of the house and get some pictures posted here again. :)
:o :o What?!!!! The boss has to keep the operator warm or he'll be whining for ever. :D :D :D :D No wonder the michine was all over the road with all that shivering and shaking from the cold. :D
Some of the boys were cutting hardwood on a high knoll here a couple years ago. That winter we had alot of cold NW wind, most every day. When your sittin up on a loader for 3 or 4 hours straight loading one truck after another it gets pretty frigid in -20 F plus windchill. They said it was the coldest place on earth. I never laughed so hard in my life when they told me about it. :D :D :D Some people mind the cold alot, heck I walk in the woods in winter with just a couple sweeters and wool pants and light gloves with holes. Grant you, walking is alot warmer than sitten. ;) :D
Cold Whimps, that's what they are. :D :D ;D
SwampDunkey,
Move your computer outside for the day the next time it's -20 F and report back to us. ;)
:D :D :D :D I have, my Panasonic WINCE computer. ;D
It's still funny. I had to cruise the same dang lot they was freeze'n on :D ;D
If the sight of a metal seat with ice on it doesn't make you think of PrepH then I'm going to have to insist that you move your computer outside. :P
What is a Panasonic WINCE?
Forum Link (https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?topic=6978.msg96540#msg96540)
;D
Things are slow here right now. I have been working now and then.The logging co I was working for is scrapping and auctioning off a lot of their older equipment.For the past few work days,my job has been to drain the lubricants and Diesel out of the machines to be scrapped.An average machine has 60-80 gals of oil in them not including the diesel.
I have worked on two old yarders on a M4A3 carrier(Sherman Tank) this week and it was making me kind of Blue because it is the end of an era here in BC's coast. Those old yarders were built in the 1960's and I worked with some great crews in the late 70's and 80 on those machines.
It really had me thinking back and I found myself thinking alot about my Dad so I called him when I got home.
Dad understands what I'm going through and we had a good talk about the old tank carriers and yarder winches and engines. It's what I did since before I turned 16 and working with small gypo operations meant that we got to do a bit of everything including monkey wrenching the old girls.
Funny how an old hunk of Iron can stir up so many memories and emotions
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10199/paul-woodfibre.jpg)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10199/paul-woodfibre-b.jpg)
The second pic has my brother Don (hooktender) on the right hand side with the green shirt and silver hat.I'm in the middle,standing on the log.I was just turning 18 and Don was 21.
We fought like cats and dogs :)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10199/paul-woodfibre-a.jpg)
Dino with his feet up at lunch time. The old tank carrier to the right in the pic is the same type that I have been preping for the scrap steel guys.
5 years after these pics were taken,my logging partner Kevin and I bought the yarder from my dad for $5500.We had a timber sale comimg up the following year as well as a yarding contract with Triple C in the Mamquam drainage.
As we were working on it in the Winter,fixing the tracks and bogies,a couple of older guys were hanging around one day heckling us and running the old machine down.We had enough after awhile and told them that we understood that their wives didn't want them hanging around home but we wanted them to go enlighten someone else because we were about done.
Old Vic laughed and admitted that he wanted to buy the yarder for a sale he had down the Sound.We told him that we weren't interested but he offered $15000.
We talked to my Dad later and he said"take the money and run " ;)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10199/paul-woodfibre-barge.jpg)
We sold it to Vic and he loaded it on to this barge and headed down Howe Sound.I took this picture because I honestly thought I'd never see it again.
When they finished down the Sound and loaded the yarder onto the barge again,it slid off wile loading and the yarder ended up in 20' of saltwater :-\
Vic collected the insurance and did eventually salvage the yarder and we bought the tracks back for our tank drill.
I guess I kind of got nostalgic this week.I can remember waving at my Dad and that old yarder in the pics above when I was 4 years old and it went by our house on the lowbed with a man up front and one out back slinging phone and power lines.
Thanks for the great pics and the story behind them. :)
Btw, don't most brothers horse around? I guess your older brother gave ya some good thumpin's eh? My younger brother always thought it was his job to sit and tell me what to do. I'de say, ok I'll be waiting for ya to help me. :D :D
Let me know if they look like they are goona toss da yarding whistle! ;D I got a bug to be a punk. ;D
SD,
yep,Don used to lay a whupping on me when we were younger but things evened out eventually.Scrapping at work was always taboo so sometimes we had to quit early. ;D
Jeff,
the cabs off of those yarders are long gone.The air chime was always mounted on the top of the cab but I'll have a look and see if there is still a relay on the machine that is left.The other 4 are already cut up and hauled away.
I'll keep my eyes peeled for an air chime.
Great pictures and stories Paul, please feel free to add more as time permits. It's good memories like those that keep us young at heart. :)
At the way scrap prices are now I can see why they are keeping you busy. One local family, who's place looks like a scrap yard, has ben cleaning up a bit lately. They hauled to old yarders to the scrap yard and got more money for one of them than they originally paid for it. :o
Anyway some loggers around here have been up in B.C. kicking tracks on the old yarders for sale up there. The ones down here are too beat up, bigger selection of better machines up there.
The old Axiom, "The grass is greener on the other side of the fence", must work on National borders too. :D
Quote from: Tom on December 09, 2005, 07:13:06 PM
The old Axiom, "The grass is greener on the other side of the fence", must work on National borders too. :D
Tom, I thought your map showed a big red line and a big white open space with a warning about ogres. ;D :D
It does...... and lions 'n tigres 'n swamps 'n all manner of pestulance. :D
But that's my map and some folks have never seen it. :D :D
I think that there is still a good selection of 009's sitting around up here.There was a guy named Dave Donn from Ontario that came through a few years ago and bought up quite a few to set up as draglines in peat bogs back East and he bought the two that we had.They were both in good operating condition,the one had fairly new tracks and both were equipped with Wichita brakes on the winch(main&haulback)
The three that were scrapped this past week were of the mid 1960's vintage and were equipped with band brakes on the winch and were powered by V12 Screaming Jimmy's. (lots of noise,no action) ;)
Tillaway,
are they still using the big tension skidders down your way?
As in the 009's and the like? The rock pits got allot of them, now we need them back.
Rare few new yarders around, in fact I have not seen one in years. The newest I have seen are some Diamonds that are maybe under 10 years old. Most everything I see dates from the 70's and 80's. I think one outfit has newer yarders but I would expect about a 98 model is the newest I have had working so far. All T-Birds before Madill bought them. I have a Skagit and a Washington working now so that should give you an idea.
Hey Tillaway, did you ever get a chance to snap a few pictures of any 527 skidders for me? ???
Paul, those pics are making me homesick. ;D I miss being in the bush.
What a differant way to yard logs!Don't see that around here in Maine.Really enjoy the pictures and the stories.
(https://forestryforum.com/images/03_21_04/skycrane.jpg)
Canadian Air sky crane
Paul's got some nice pictures on his website also.
http://www.halraylog.com/
You are going to hate me but I was driving past a 527 about once a week for the past 3 months. They just moved it. Now if I could sneak out the camera I could get some pictures of some really cool stuff.
I will have a helicopter side working in my area in about a month or two. The cutters are working now and hope to be done falling in about 2 months then the ship arrives. A Kaman K-Max pretty unique looking thing. I'm pretty sure there will lots of pictures of that.
Tillaway if you ever get a chance I'd like to see some shots of a 527 working some steep slopes.
What are the tong towers/ tong throwers you guys have out there? I've seen them on other sites on the net but they just look like a log loader turned into a small yarder to me. ??? The idea of logging tongs being thrown out into an area where guys are working seems pretty risky to me, I think I must be missing something.
No... thats what tong throwers do, out to about 300'. Longer if the slopes steep enough. Some guys throw tongs other throw old truck tires with a bunch of old line (cable) coiled inside for weight with some chokers attached just above. Some throw tongs with chokers as well. And yes, someone is out in the brush setting the tongs or chokers. Its much safer out there than at the landing. :o
You do not want to be anywhere near somebody learning to throw tongs. The will usually hit the front of the cab a few times, they replace allot of windows, launch them straight up in the air, behind them, and everywhere else in between. Once they get the knack they can hit within a few feet of the target with ease. You can tell if a tong thrower has been around tossing chokers cause they usually lose a few and you might find one up in the top of a tree. :o I guess they really go along way. There is a slight chance I may have one working on one of my sales in the near future.
We have at least two logging operators here that have 527's. Niether one on any of my sales. They used one a little on one of my sales last winter but I think it was just to pioneer a road. I didn't see it in the brush. Shovel logging is preferred and on any slope over 35% we require cable yarding. The only time I expect to see one is when skidding distances are real long and it seems I do not have flat spot bigger than 300' on any of my sales. I do have quit a bit of 70% to 90% ground. :o ;D
I haven't checked but Jewell manufacturing does the tong thrower packages and they do have a cool video. It might be available on the net.
Thanks for the info Tillaway. I checked out the jewel site but I'll have to look again for the video. These tong towers, do they also yard the logs back in? or are they just used to get the rigging out into the feild? When they train the guys to run these things are there still guys out in the field? I would think that if you ever got hit by one you'd be toast. Any pictures you can get of operations on your sales would be great, the west coast is great logging country, lots of cool equipment out there too. :)
Casts out and reels in just like you are fishing. They are a multipurpose machine, yard logs, load trucks, shovel log (hoe chuck for our Canadian friends), and they can do a fair job at road grading, and minor excavation. Take of the grapples and heel rack, put on a processor dangle head and do final harvest and process logs. Most of the operators here are putting drums, either tong throwers or yarder packages, on their new shovels. Those that have not are wishing they had. Far too versatile a machine and often the most profitable machine in the woods out here. The big land owners out here have either banned or have considered banning the use of traditional rubber tired skidders or dozers for yarding logs. You will see them used here to assist trucks or swing logs on swing roads. Swing roads are a road with too steep a grade for a truck to crawl out even with assistance. You can get equipment down them so the yarders are walked in and the logs are cable yarded to a landing and then swung up the road to another landing for processing and loading. There is a 527 being used right now to swing logs. The operator had it, a 70' T-Bird tower and another smaller hoe stuck down at the bottom of a swing road for the past 3 1/2 months. It has just now dried out enough to get the 527 moving again and they are swinging out the logs and have finished yarding with the tower. They are going to bring in a D-8 to rescue the yarder now that they are through with it.
Any chance of getting pics of the rescue operation ???. When you say they are going to ban rubber tired skidder and dozers...would 527s and those KMC skidders also fall into this category? By the sounds of things, shovel logging must have a very light footprint :) You mentioned all the jobs that excavators can do in the woods. Before excavators it was dozers and before that horses, makes me wonder what the next big thing will be.
On the west coast of BC they use grapple yarders and as long as you have good deflection to help locate the best place for your roads, it's a great system. If not it's what we term the 'side hill gouger' causing serious erosion and even land slides in the heavy rain season. We always had to assess every gully on a harvest block for the potential of a slide. Some blocks where all laid out and mapped and so on and had to be defered from logging after being reviewed by the ministry. That gets expensive after awhile.
Some operations i see pictures of the logs are completely suspended in the air while being yarded in. In other shots the logs look to just be drung up the hilll more or less. Is this because of differnt setup, size of equipment etc?
SD, what do you mean by deflection?
deflection: the maximum amount of line sage over a length of yarding cable so as a load can be carried clear of the ground.
gotcha 8)
Supersnorkel Handbook (http://www.worksafebc.com/publications/health_and_safety/by_topic/assets/pdf/grapple_yarder.pdf)
Thats right, 517's, 527's KMC's, dozers and all rubber tire skidders. I think Weyco has already started this and the other big boys are considering it. I personnally would like us to do the same. Virtually all the big problems I have to deal with are roads and damage done by skidders and dozers yarding logs. Once you see what a good shovel logger can do you would not let anything else ground yard. I would make exceptions for certain operators that have 527's and only if operated by certain individuals. Unfortunately I do not see us moving in that direction real soon.
The 8 was out today and I have Friday's off. I would have like to see it too.
SD, thanks for the great link, shed a lot of light on things.
Tillaway, I know what you mean about the skidder thing. Hopefully people will start to see things your way soon. Anyways, hopefully you can snap some pictures to put on the forum soon.
I thought I had some pictures of damage done by the sidehill gouger but I think they are only on negatives. I know one thing, on some of them old clearcuts on the coast it did alot of erosion damage and impacted the regen too. There was one eyesore above the logging camp that they had the replant 5 or 6 times, the hill kept sliding.
While I was waiting on sawmill parts to arrive,I got a call asking if I wanted to work for a few days.It is the same company that I was working for in this thread but now they are 25 miles South of me down Lillooet Lake in a area called Flood creek.
This whole area down the Lillooet and Harrison Lake has a rich history and was part of the Douglas trail that led miners to the Caribou during the Goldrush days (1860's)
My job was to pull loaded trucks up an adverse with an old D8H.Today was my last day for a while and I piloted two loads of poles in to town(two trips)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10199/paul-lake-poles.jpg)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10199/paul-lake-polesa.jpg)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10199/paul-lake-polesb.jpg)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10199/paul-lake-polese.jpg)
Geordie is bucking a short gang log off of the pole.We were 48' past the rear axle on the first load.We had to be really carefull when meeting a vehicle on a corner
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10199/paul-lake-poles-d.jpg)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10199/paul-lake-polecat.jpg)
I took this shaky pic while pulling the truck up the adverse
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10199/paul-lake-polesf.jpg)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10199/paul-lake-polesg.jpg)
The longest pole was at the breaking point while going past the trailer on the side of the road but thankfully made it in one piece.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10199/paul-lake-home.jpg)
Across the Tenas bridge just below Lillooet Lake heading back North toward Pemberton
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10199/paul-lake-gunsight.jpg)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10199/paul-lake-gunsight-close.jpg)
This is Gunsight Mt or as the Indians call it, Innshuck Mt and is right above the bridge
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10199/paul-lake-homea.jpg)
This is from the bottom end of the lake looking North toward home
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10199/paul-lake-homeb.jpg)
About halfway up the lake looking toward Pemberton
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10199/paul-lake-homec.jpg)
And finally the truck coming through the narrow rock cut at 1 Km at the North end of the lake just before the highway.
It was good to get out and work with those guys again and it's a real treat to not be waist deep in snow this time of year
Paul, are those fir?
Are these utility poles, where are they headed?
Kevin,
They are Western Red Cedar and they are for utility poles.There is a pole yard a half a mile away from my house that buys poles and peels them on an old Continental peeler.They ship all over North America and if I remember right,sell to Bell Pole too.They have a rail spur and ship most out by rail.
I was thinking today on the way home that I should ask Drew to call me the next time they peel.It's a really interesting operation he has going there and they design and build loghomes too.
Here is a link to his website Continental Pole (http://www.continentalloghomes.com/)
Once again great pictures. Someday I'm gonna see dat country. ;)
Great set of posts, Paul.
Thanks,it really is pretty down the Lake and tonight at the supper table we were wondering why we don't kick around down there more often.I worked down there a couple of years ago in early Spring and the buds broke down there almost two weeks before it did up our way and it would only be 35 miles away.
When we were crushing gravel to cap the road,the electro magnet picked up what we figure was a mule shoe from the Goldrush days.There are 3 Indian villages that are thriving in that area and more people are moving in but there is still a lot of freedom to move and live.
Paul are you trying to get me to change my travel plans with those photos? Whadya say Tom? TOo cold for us to go there for a side trip? ;)
BEAUTIFUL PICS BUDDY! :)
It's a trap. He took them in July. :D
Quote from: Paul_H on January 24, 2006, 09:27:48 PM
Geordie is bucking a short gang log off of the pole.We were 48' past the rear axle on the first load.We had to be really carefull when meeting a vehicle on a corner
Now that's what we used to call a sweeper and heaven forbid if ya meet one on a 90 deg turn. :o
Beautiful part of the world you live in Paul, in my corporate days I was based out of Seattle and can tell you one of the few places I've ever wanted to live but here is the Pacific Northwest. Running a d-8 even an old one wouldn't be too bad either, thanks for the pics. :)
Paul, I was going to say cedar because that's what's common here now as the pressure treated pine poles are a real hazard to climb .
They get hard with age and now the pole companies are injecting them with a polymer to improve the climability.
I wasn't sure if cedar grew on the hills, here the eastern white cedar prefers swamp land.
Here in New Brunswick if you have a soils map showing the calcarious (lime) bedrock that is where you find the most cedar. Just happens that alot of those areas are wet where alot of other species can't grow well. We do find them on ridges here, but usually not far from gullies or seepages.
Western red cedar have both Coastal (up to 400 m ASL) and interier varieties. I've seen it in the plateau of the Prince George region.
Interesting, in our area there are a lot of cedar but I didn't think it is a lime bedrock. Some of the cedars around here must be several hundred years old, huge diameter trees that where obviously left when fields were first cleared as rock piles exist around them. Also there is hundreds of miles of cedar rail fence around here so it must have been a common species perhaps during the regrowth after the initial clearing of the hardwoods that dominated this area in the 1600's.
Incredibly beautiful country. There was a news article the other day about the villages in that valley. There is a major power transmission line running through it to supply the coast yet the villagers have no power. They depend on diesel generaters that cost $350.00/day to run but BC Hydro says a substation would be too costly. There are no schools so the children are bused to Pemberton when the road is not flooded or clogged with snow. It is not far from a heavily populated area yet is quite isolated.
Quote from: slowzuki on January 25, 2006, 08:20:49 AM
Interesting, in our area there are a lot of cedar but I didn't think it is a lime bedrock. Some of the cedars around here must be several hundred years old, huge diameter trees that where obviously left when fields were first cleared as rock piles exist around them. Also there is hundreds of miles of cedar rail fence around here so it must have been a common species perhaps during the regrowth after the initial clearing of the hardwoods that dominated this area in the 1600's.
Yup, the ridge down your way is moderately calcarious sediments, up my way it's moderate to high. To your east is silicon bonded sediments and alot less cedar. Up here we have large almost pure stands of cedar 50 acres or more in size. Of course there are smaller stands to. Out in Holmesville (behind Bath) Doug Lloyd has had an open lime pit for years. They cut the cedar off it and stripped off the humous and dredge the lime out, didn't even need to be crushed. He has a lime spreading buisness. Even around Napadogen there is cedar, but not large pure stands like up here. There are large cedar over there I know close to 300 years that they left in harvest blocks to fall down. ::) I've aged some 200 year old cedar on the farm that were only 14 inches in diameter, some alot less.
We had a small field under the hill that was left to grow up for years and a local contractor cut cedar from it as well as poplar and he harvested over 300 cords on 7 acres of ground. The Dutch that bought the farm had plans to clear it back again. But she's all up for sale now. ::)
http://www.riverrealty.nb.ca/listings/205_602.asp
I got looking on a couple MrSID maps of my area and most all the cedar stands have been cut off. Kinda hard to show cedar stands when they're growing back up in birch and poplar species. Well there are cedar coming back in the understory. ::) Down around Landsdowne there are/were some large cedar stands that were harvested with thick fir/spruce growing back. You can see it along route 2 above Hartland, it was thinned, but it's still way to thick. I thinned out 15 acres there a couple years ago, 80 % cedar.
I looked at that real estate ad and noted the price 1 million dollars... this seems to be the norm nowadays, the best wood is gone, if you tried to grow anything on the cleared land you would have to invest another load of money in equipment etc, even if there was some wood left it might pay the taxes every year...
Most farmers are just hanging on with loggers not far behind, who buys these places and what do they do with them????
Good woodland around here is 1000 per acre plus with the returns of the logging at toilet levels , its gone beyond me!!!!
Well in this case, your federal tax dollars went into buying it for Dutch immigrants. They farmed 3 years and started an immigration business, now looking to sell the farm. That acreage is only half what we sold them. Those parcels add up to (approx):
75.10 acres natural regrowth
43.12 acres established plantations
261.50 acres farm fields
I drew up the map and stratified the land.
There's another 365 acres (including 148 acres field) up beside my woodlot, not included. That price also includes a huge potato storage facility that cost close to $650,000 to build as well as a 4 year old bungalow, a barn and a conset building. Farmland sells for $2000 to $4000 acre in these parts. They're not asking much for the buildings.
Quote
if you tried to grow anything on the cleared land you would have to invest another load of money in equipment etc.
I certainly don't agree 100 %, all you need is a thinning saw. Hmm, maybe $1200 and time. If it's poplar, it's free future wood, no need to thin. When I reflect on the activites on my woodlot, I would have much rather thinned than planted. I have alot of natural softwood and hardwood. Herbicide was used to kill poplar and hardwood over topping softwood replanted, which I think is not always a good way to manage our forests. At the time I had no say in it and was 4000 miles away. So I gotta work with what I have. I'll have a nice crop of fir and poplar to harvest in 30 years, my hardwood and spruce will go beyond that. ;)
She's been hard on the woodlots the last 20 years. Now what we're running into is highgrading hardwood for sawlogs and veneer, pulp price is way down and most is moving state side until Burla wakes up. I'm seeing alot of 6 inch (small end) hardwood being bought now to, it took 50 years to get that big. :'(
These people in Fredericton who say cedar isn't regenerating on harvested sites have got to wake up. I've never seen a harvested cedar stand that isn't regenerating with cedar, plus many other species (spruce/fir/poplar/elm/ash/pine/maple). (baring beaver flooded ground) They were relating this to thinning post assessment data where nothing under a meter is counted and some crews will cut a cedar and leave a fir. If they were doing a proper assessment they would tally cedar as present and the fact the that cut cedar, to leave a fir, was poor crop tree selection. The only thing I would favor over cedar is a spruce and I might leave the cedar tight without snipping it off if it's not actually overtopping the spruce. I walked quite a few of them sites with landowners and loggers who wanted to reforest them untill I showed them how well stocked they are with spruce, cedar and poplar coming back. Some people just go in the woods with
$$ blinders on. No mature wood, no value, NFG. ::)
I we have a hard time finding bunk logs. ;) I know a guy that creased a car pretty good with a load of those.
In the Fredericton area browsing by deer pretty much does the cedar in, I hardly have any on my property. On the other side of the road by the river it isn't so bad as it is open and the deer don't like being over there. There is a handful of little cedars growing.
Certainly a valuable wood at the moment, many contractors trying to get their hands on it. I had a fellow approach me to buy the 4 acres of cedar at the front of my place. It had good road access I guess and it is quite large diameter so it could have been profitable for them. Too bad I like it myself!
Quote from: SwampDonkey on January 25, 2006, 05:54:31 PM
These people in Fredericton who say cedar isn't regenerating on harvested sites have got to wake up. I've never seen
NFG. ::)
White cedar regen doesn't survive deer browsing around here either. Once it's above the snow pack it's done for ::)
Yup deer are a problem in some areas. I'm just lucky we have very few deer in my area. I saw one deer track today the first I seen in 3 months. I also seen 4 sets of coyote tracks since yesterday's hike. The deer keep eating the trees on my father's lawn in Woodstock, they come at night. Most deer are docturnal around here.
Quote from: SwampDonkey on January 26, 2006, 09:44:35 AM
Most deer are docturnal around here.
smiley_confused Not sure if your deer are working on their Phd or if they are preoccupied with doctrine. ;)
;D Piggy boy ;D
What's up Doc?
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10030/Donk.JPG)
;D 8) 8) :D
Another nice string of pictures Paul I think you guys might be having a bit too much fun out there :D.
It's amazing how much goes on on this forum in the run of a couple of weeks. I've been away from home working in a Michelin tire plant in Pictou Nova Scotia as a college work term. I try to get home whenever i can but its a 4 hour drive so its usually only every other weekend. I don't have a computer down there so i ahve to try to catch up on the forum when i come home.
Hi Scott,
good to see you back 8)
When I took the pic of the D8H,I was thinking you'd appreciate it because I know you like the old machinery.
What are you doing at the Michelin tire plant ?
Yeah I really like to see the big dozers at work. I see a lot of those big old D8s for sale on the Finning site and other equipment dealers out there, they must be a popular machine. Are many guys buying new dozers or are they just replacing them all with excavators? What models of newer dozers seem to be popular out there?
I'm working as a student industrial mechanic. Mostly I do belt changes, pump rebuilds, pneumatic cylinder rebuilds, light welding, stuff like that. I also respond to general maintainance calls if something goes down on the production line. I work in the part of the plant where we make the rubber, its pretty interesting to see the stuff that goes into the mix.
Its a super dirty place. the wrost part is what they call carbon black, its what they put in the tires to make them black. Basically its just jet black dust and its all over the place, nasty stuff. i look like a coal miner by the end of the day. The compnay actually supplies ALL your clothes right from coveralls and boots to socks and undies. At the end of the day you throw them in a bin to be washed and go hit the showers. Taking a shower befor you go home is actually a job requirement. I guess the chemicals in there can be really bad if they stay on you.
All and all its a pretty good spot though. Great bunch of guys to work with and the plant has a really nice cafeteria :)
I this area here there are mostly D7's and D8's or their equivalent like a Terex 8230,8240.Most of the bulldozers are oldtimers held over from the time when they were the main piece of roadbuilding equipment( late eighties,early 1990's) They work well with the excavators for spreading and light grading as well as pulling and snubbing equipment on hills and plowing snow.
It sounds like you have an interesting job at the tire plant.Mainteneance work puts you in different places all through the plant and not stuck in one place.I'd love to tour through that place and see how tires are made
That carbon Black sounds like nasty stuff,I hope you have a mask or type of respirator.
A cafeteria at work would be top notch 8)
I've been working on the road crew with the same outfit down Lillooet Lake and it's been pretty good because I get to do a little of this and a little of that which I like better than a steady dose of any one thing.
They have been heli logging the steeper areas and one of my jobs this past week was to clean out under the helicopter with the frontend loader(Cat 966D) til the Kobelco hydraulic loader had finished loading out of the bottom landing.
That was a long busy shift because they can really pump the wood in.I didn't have my camera for those two days but after the Kobelco got to the new landing,I went back down to where the Kobelco came from and loaded out the short chunks,8' and longer on the hayrack.
I was enjoying loading out the chunks and the chopper would still drop turns in on me at the end of every cycle on their way down to the service area.
They called me one morning to pull a fuel tanker up the steep winding driveway from their service area on Art Frank's homestead.
These next pics are at the service site and you can see old fruit trees and the remains of one of the old hay fields.This place is 10 miles from the nearest neighbours but the nearest town is Pemberton which is an hour and a half away.
The Maroon tanker is behind the Yellow truck
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10199/work%20001-opt.jpg)
The chopper coming in for fuel
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As I was waiting to pull the tanker I took this pic of the neat old house.It is a near vertical slope from the back of the house up to the logging mainline above.
The branch over the motorhome is pointing the way towards the mainline
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10199/work%20008-opt.jpg)
Back up at the bottom landing,Jason turns the hayrack around for a load.A fine load too if I say so myself ;)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10199/work%20009-opt.jpg)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10199/work%20011-opt.jpg)
Jason hams it up a bit.He's originally from Nova Scotia so he doesn't speak so good although he figures it's us guys in BC that have trouble speaking right :)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10199/work%20012-opt.jpg)
These last shots are of turns dropping in
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10199/work%20014-opt.jpg)
This was the last turn of the day coming in.It was rough trying to get decent pics in the morning because the chopper was in line with the Sun but afternoon was much better.
Lots of noise,dust and wind kicked up when they drop.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10199/work%20015-opt.jpg)
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(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10199/work%20017-opt.jpg)
The log in the grapple here is the same log that was just flown in last pics
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10199/work%20018-opt.jpg)
That looks like great fun and, very rewarding too. Sometimes the one doesn't necessarily follow the other but you seem to be in a great place right now . . . geographically too. ;)
I used to be a fling-winger. Aircrewman. Spent alot of time over the GOM - it never crossed my mind to be hauling logs out with one. Those things must be maxxed out on lifting capacity on some of those logs because our max cabled payload (not counting wet and cargo weights) was only 4 tons. Of course we had alot of lifeaving stuff we had to carry around and those HH-3F Pelicans were at the end of their lifespans.
What kind of max weights are they doing and what kind of helos are those? It looks like an H3 variant. And who figures the weights on the logs etc? It is *critical* that a heliopter not take on excessive weight as I am sure you know well.
i am sure they have it simplified but is there some guy on the ground who has a chart with a table with the diameters and species who tells the pilot what his weight is gonna be etc?
Are you using the Forestry Froum calculator on your laptop and calling up the weight ??? ;D
Kevin,
I am a highlead logger and haven't been around the heli logging much but I could hear the pilots calling their weights on the radio before they headed over to the landing.They have scales on board but the riggers on the ground know their weights pretty well and so do the fallers.That's why there are so many short fat chunks(beer cans)
The hook on the end of the line has colour coded slots and the pilots can release one choker at a time or the whole works.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10199/work%20010-opti.jpg)
Sawguy21 has worked with the heli outfits and would be able to add a lot more,and I hope he does(or anyone else for that matter)
Near as I can remember it's 10 tons capacity on the heli-cranes used on the Charlottes. They are all motor.
(https://forestryforum.com/images/03_21_04/skycrane.jpg)
(https://forestryforum.com/images/03_21_04/SkycraneE.jpg)
From this forum thread (https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?topic=13313.msg96324#msg96324)
Nice job when the weather is nice Paul. ;D 8) Nice old homestead to btw. Most have been torn down and cleared back to fields in my area. Some set ablaze and busted up by local mischief makers.
Cool stuff Paul, thanks for the pictures. :)
Quote from: Kevin on January 26, 2006, 05:30:32 PM
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10030/Donk.JPG)
Now thats the avatar you should be using Donk... :)
Could be, but member DonK might, quick like, tell you that it's the wrong flag. :D
Surprised you missed that Jeff a while back. Come on, ya got to keep up. :D :D :D
Get rid of the antlers,perk up the ears, change the flag and hat and it might make a passable DonK. :D :D
Donk not Don K Tom. I save typing 7 letters and the shift key by using donk. Besides, Swampdonkey likes it when I call him donk. :D Its like BONK only with a D. ;D
I still think we have an Alabamian Donkey ;D :D
Tom, I think you may be right...I've been to his place. ;D ;D ;D Ohhh, yall know our Alabama Donkey is another year older today...right?
Stew
:D :D :D :D :D Paul, those pics brought a smile to my face. You are right, the riggers don't need no stinkin' scale, they are pretty DanG good at judging the weight of those turns. They have to be, too light does not pay and too heavy means an aborted load. The multiple drop hook is something new since I left.
Got to thinking later. Were they using a carousel with 6 or 8 hooks under a small helicopter to haul the chokers up the hill?
Great pictures!
I've just got to get to BC someday. Some years ago I had a load of straw delivered from Canada and the young driver had spent one season signed on to drive those log trucks down off the mountains in BC. He said they were in a very remote area and had to stay for the whole season. Told me it was a great experience and made good money, but one he did not want to repeat. With no weight limits and steep roads, any mechanical failure like brakes or drive train problems and it could be the end for the unlucky driver.
Keep the pictures coming.
We had a helicopter show last year, I was not able to get pictures though. We had a K-Max thinning about 600 acres. It took the cutters about 1 1/2 hours to hike in and about 2 to come back out. It was a long way in and out on some steep ground.
Nice pictures Paul, it's good to see your having some fun. Are you working for Hayes or are they just doing the heli work?
The helicopters that Hayes use are rated for 8 tons with a full tank of feul and closer to 10 tons when theyre getting lower on feul :o
The helicopter in Paul's pics is the S-61, that is the type I worked with. It has a maximum lift of 10,000 lb.Swamp Donkey's shot shows it's big brother the S-64 Skycrane that can lift 20,000 lb. The twin rotor Chinooks and Vertols are also used here on the coast along with a few Russian built K-max.
I was around one of those monster S-64'S in 1988 in northern California while chasing a 61 with a single axle fuel truck. We were fighting a fire at Shelter Bay near Garborville. Their water bucket was huge, 8000 litres. It would hold the same amount as the truck I was driving. :o They re fuelled from an A train. I quickly learned to stand waaay back when it was taking off. :D
Your right Sawguy, my mistake :-[
I don't think the K-max is russian.
QuoteThe K-MAX K-1200 light-lift multi-purpose helicopter is manufactured by Kaman Aerospace Company at the company's production facilities at Bloomfield, Connecticut.
OOPS, my mistake this time. The Kamov KA32 is Ruskie built. Vancouver Island Helicopters had quite a time getting them approved for operations in Canada but they are working well..
Swamp, the heli crane in your post, are they the Erickson company, if so, we used them in Borneo, 10 tons was max if the atmoshere was on their side, all motor as use suggested
Richard
Canadian Air-Crane: Erickson S-64E and S-64F Aircranes (http://www.air-crane.com/index.shtml)
I have wondered how they hooked onto the standing stems. That is tricky, the ground crew need to notch the tree to allow it to snap off but it needs to be stable while being grappled. The Skycrane's rotor down wash is tremendous.