Do you know of any veneer buyers in the mid-west that you would recommend. We sold walnut veneer logs about 25 years ago and had all kinds of bidders. Now I can only find one in our area. We are getting ready to harvest several walnut and would like a little more competition for the veneer logs. We'll saw the other logs.
Noble
I've dealt extensively with Dave Elliot of Kretz Lumber in Antigo Wisconsin. Good scale and a good price. http://www.kretzlumber.com/ Dave works in the Eastern UP and Northern LP. By contacting them they should be able to set you up with a buyer for your area. If they go that far. I've also dealt with Columbia Veneer http://www.columbiaveneer.com/ and was very satisfied. I sold my high dollar slicers to Kretz and Columbia bought the lower grade rotary logs. Columbia may only deal in oak and maple but it's worth checking into. Hard maple logs and a few cherry were what I was selling.
Kretz Lumber is am member of my timberbuyers network website. My only Wisconsin member. I would much appreciate it if you contacted them through the form I set up for them. Here is the link:
http://www.timberbuyer.net/members/kretzlumber.htm#jump
Tell them you heard about them on the Forestry Forum!
Hi,
Regarding veneer buyers, how do you determine if your timber is a high enough quality to interest veneer buyers? And are veneer buyers willing to come and harvest one suitable tree, or are they usually looking for several trees to make it worth their while? I've heard rumors of veneer buyers buying logs for several thousands of dollars--in a way, this seems too good to be true, but if so, it's something I'd like to pursue myself. Corley, if you don't mind me asking, what kind of return can you typically expect when selling veneer? The land we have has a lot of maples as well as some ash, though I doubt ash is highly sought after.
Regarding finding more buyers, I remember finding a veneer supplier near Escanaba a few years ago when this thought first crossed my mind...I can't seem to recall their name, but if my memory serves it was similar to Northern Hardwoods, or something like that. I did a google search for that, but it didn't quite match. I think most libraries have the phone books for regions throughout their particular state--you might possibly have luck that way looking for companies that don't have websites yet. Just a thought...
Noble,
I just found a website which lists 17 different veneer buyers in the Great Lakes area. It's the website for the Lakes States Lumber Association. Hope it helps! Let us know what kind of luck you have.
http://www.lakestateslumber.com/veneer.html
Don't sell that ash short. For a long time, ash sold at some pretty good prices. We were getting upwards to about $3/bf for the better stuff. The trick is that it has to have a lot of white sapwood and there can't be any glass worm. Neither can be told to well from a standing tree. Ash markets have slipped in the past couple of years.
Other species we sell as veneer include tulip poplar, red oak, black oak, white oak, hickory, hard maple, black cherry and walnut. I'm not up on prices, but I believe the poplar is around .80/bf, red oak around $1.50/bf. I've seen hard maple in the $4-$6 area and black cherry as high as $8/bf.
Most buyers won't come out for one tree unless it is an exceptional tree. There once was a walnut sold in Indiana or Illinois for $35,000. The absolute exception, so don't expect that for any of your trees.
Rotarty veneer has to be free of defects. There can be no seams, limited sap on oak and cherry, maximum sap on white woods (at least 1/3), most need a minimum length of 8', but we sell a lot of 10', and a minimum diameter of 14" on the small end. Other factors include slow growth (a certain number of growth rings per inch) and a centered heart. And NO metal, shake, or mineral. Very limited spider heart.
Your state forestry department should have a list of veneer buyers. We are delivering some of our logs to Ohio. In the past, I have met buyers from Italy and Germany that were buying at local mills.
Thanks guys for the leads, I have contacted several. I will contact the state forestry dept. The local guys didn't know of as many buyers as I did.
In addition to the defectsRon listed, any humps or catfaces that indicate overgrown knots or injuries are defects. Birdpecks and spiral grain will eliminate the trees. Walnut buyers usually want the logs to be at least 16 in. Veneer buyers will buy logs with 3 faces clear but not at top price.
Our last veneer sale, we sold about 20 trees and got several bids including some out-of-state. We had three trees that scaled over 1000 bdft. each. The total bid figured out about $2.00/bdft for the entire sale and they did the cutting. That's a long way from $35,000 per tree but we were pleased. This time we will cut the logs. We'll start sawing the poorest quality logs and try to sell the veneer. So far $3.00/bdft for 4 clear faces is the best we've been offered. I won't cut the best trees If we don't get a better offer.
The first time we sold veneer, we got the farm forester to help us pick them and sell them. I would recommend that route to a first time seller.
Noble
Paschale,
If you've got some nice hard maple they can be worth a lot of $$$. Kretz was paying $8.00 a bdft for top grade slicer logs last year. Unfortunately I didn't have any of those. The best we did on a log was $1,500.00. It was a 14' one that scaled 200 bdft and had one defect at 12'. Normally I would have bucked it at the defect but the tree went into multiple tops at about the 15' mark so I left it 14' with plans to trim if Dave wanted. The defect didn't bother Dave on that log. Musta been special or something ;D ;D. Last spring I think we averaged around $3.00 bdft on our maple veneer logs. When you sell 5000 bdft it's worth while plus there are sawlogs to sell on top of that. Maple's profitable. It wasn't that many years ago when it was worth more cut into firewood than anything elso.
Good point about trimming. We usually let the veneer logs long. I've seen some come in as long as 24 ft. Then, the veneer buyer can mark where he wants them trimmed. You can end up with more footage.
We have a huge pile of ends that have been cut off. We go and split that for firewood. Some chunks you need to load onto the splitter with a loader.
I can also remember when red oak wasn't worth anything. When I first started in the woods, I was told not to buy any red oak, since there wasn't any market for it. My, how times change.
Corley,
Thanks for the post. I've thought that our maple could be potentially valuable as veneer. A lot of our trees are straight and can go as long as 30-40 ft or so before branching out which makes me think that would make them more appealing to veneer buyers. I'm curious how this sort of thing typically works. Do you bring the tree down first and then contact a veneer buyer after inspecting them, or do you leave the tree up so that they can decide how it's to be done? We have about 15 acres of hardwood on our land, and another 5 or so of cedar and other evergreens, so it's a rather small woodlot. I can't imagine us wanting to unload a couple trees at once, but maybe that's the only way one could approach this to interest a potential buyer. I'm certain we have valuable wood for veneering purposes--the question becomes how best to take advantage of that in light of the fact that we desire to really only do selective cutting. Any thoughts?
Dan M.
I e-mailed all of the buyers that youall suggested as well as others I found searching the net. Recieved answers from a few. Kretz doesn't buy walnut.
On responder asked me to call their head buyer who lives in Mo. I was very impressed with him on the phone and will probably sell to them. I will cut the trees and leave them in tree length. He will tell me how to buck them and tell me what he will pay for the pieces. Four face veneer over 18 in brings $5/bdft. He buys gunstock wood and high grade sawlogs too. He says he can pay more for those than I can saw out of it with FAS at $1.40. I'll be paid before the logs leave
Ron, you were right ----he buys veneer down to 14 in.
I'm anxious to get started on it. Need to finish out a loak of oak grade lumber and of ties and palletstock and do a little coustom job I couldn't say no to first. My hands will be walnut colored till Christmas.
Noble
Dan,
Give Kretz a call. Dave or one of their other foresters/veneer buyers will come out and do a walk through with you.
We sold our walnut veneer logs today. We ended up cutting aver 100 trees. Some because they were mature and showing signs of decline, some because they had some problem that would prevent them from increasing in value, and some because they were growing in pastureland that we are converting to hayland. The head buyer from American Walnut (which is headquartered in Kansas City Kan. with their plant being in St. Joseph Mo.) came this morning and we went through the logs. He was good to deal with and I felt like he treated us fairly. I was disapointed in some of our logs----after being cut to length, internal defects showed up on some of the best ones. We were paid up to $4/bdft but sold several for $1.20/bdft. The lower priced ones were logs I wouldn't have expected to be considered for veneer, so I was pleased with them. With FAS at $1.40 it would be hard for us to saw that out of them. We still have enough walnut sawlogs to last us all winter. I sure enjoy sawing them.
I'm going to send Jeff some pictures of 'beaver wood' I'll include some of walnut logs also so maybe he'll help me post them if Whitepe and One-with-wood don't get him mad at me.
You might want to look up www.americanwalnut.com. They tell a little about their veneer and gunstock business.
Noble
Sounds like it worked out well for you Noble. Many people don't realize a little marketing legwork can make a big difference in $$$$$$
8) It always pays to shop around for the best price. There are several different buyers around here and there is a remarkable difference in their grades and the prices they'll pay. Makes me wonder how some of them stay in the business. If everyone shopped around instead of selling to the first buyer they wouldn't stay in business