Our Well has been gettign weaker and weaker over the summer. If we try to do tow things of anything, say like flush the toilet and run the washing machine, the pump loses prime. There is very littrle water pressure. The last few days just running a load of laundry has caused the well to lose prime. Today it happened again but I can't get the pump to stop running, even with the supply shut off to the house. When you turn the water on to the house now we get nasty brown rusty water coming in, but very little then it stops again and the pump loses prime. I now see that there is water coming out of the regulator. Its coming out the little vent hole. just seeping out. THis is a deep well pump, the well is about 87 feet. We hope to have money for a new well in about 35 days or som but need to try to find a band aid for this. Also, this well had a new pump, drop pipe and screen only about 5 years ago. The well is arounf 25 years old.
Any Ideas?
Needing a shower.... ;D
when you say loosing prime, you mean the water is running back down the pipe and it won't get started again?
Is your pressure tank full of air? that will cause a pump to overwork, also if your pressure switch isn't working (could be related to the pressure tank not having air)...
i've played with well pumps some but not too much...
THe pressure tank has pressure. When you go out there and remove the plug from the pump, there is no water in it. You have to have water to refill the pump, then put the plug back in. It will run a few seconds then you will here it catch and the pressure will start raising on the guage. The pressure switch is only 1 year old. It just seems like its pumping itself out, and now it only takes a few moments. I just got it going long enough for me to take a shower and it ran out of water just as I got done.
Jeff is it a submersible pump. It doesn't sound like it from your discription. If not you might want to pull it and look at the check valve, and make sure ther are no holes in you line going down the well. If you got iron water it can eat up a system in less that 5 yrs.
The pump is above ground two stage deep water pump. Its not submerged. Its in a well house. The Dang thing cost over 600 bucks 5 years ago thats not counting the 80 foot of drop pipe they charged me for plus the new screen. We really have almost perfect water. We used to have relatives come from all over to get it for thier Aquariums because of the balanced PH. If you put water in the pump and leave the plug out, the water does not go down. We have never had rust and crud come out of that well until the last 3 days or so
Jeff
I think you described some of the components of a jet pump and system. If so and the "regulator" is leaking that could cause the pump to lose prime. No part of the system should ever "leak". Often in warm-humid weather the pump base will "sweat" enough to appear leaking but this isn't the case. The regulator sets up the"loop" pressure between the pump and jet. When the system is first started up the regulator is set to near maximum pressure, pump and loop primed and pump started. The regulator is adjusted "out" or to a lower loop pressure until the loop guage begins to waver or pulse. Then the regulator pressure is increased until the gauge reads steady. When the loop is started, the pump circulates prime water down through the return loop to the jet and forces water through the jet causing a low pressure on the intake and foot valve. As water is drawn into to the loop, the pressure overcomes the regulator valve and vents off the excess pressure in the loop to the tank and user system. As the demand for water becomes steady, the loop discharge becomes constant and provides water from the loop as long as there is a demand. The pressure switch shuts down the pump and subsequently the rest of the system when the system pressure is satisfied.
Many aquifers in the country are diminishing severely. I hope this isn't the case with yours. What happens is that the "draw-down" level in the aquifer recedes and may possibly go below the screen. In this case the pump will draw air until it looses prime. Sometimes the solution is to drop the casing a few feet but if it is already at the bottom of the aquifer then the aquifer has gone"dry" or below the capacity to provide your system with water. Then the only solution is a new or deeper well.
I hope the regulator is your problem. That's an easy replacement or sometimes a diaphragm replacement is possible.
Good luck
Jeff, I have replaced my pump 4 times in 13 years.
2 of them were because of impellers.
1 was because my daughters ran over with a golf cart.
Check valve could have some blockage/particles holding it open.
Impeller might be bad (Rust Issue)
Is there a water filter plugged up?
There might be sediment that closed in on the screen.
Hows the piping from the well to the house underground. Any heavy trucks come by lately?
Sounds to me the well is not producing enough water. :( The easiest solution would be to draw straws on who gets to take a bath each day. You just have to hope that one of you is not unlucky and never gets to bathe. If that happens the house will get stinky. Around here we just go to the creek when the cistern goes dry. I did notice a lake not too far from your house. :P When it freezes over you will need to break the ice. ;)
Bob -trying to be helpful
I have ran systems such as Jeff has mentioned. There could be a few different problems at stake and they could also be combining to make this very large problem. Your local water table may be down thus causing your foot valve to be letting it suck air, or your well screen could simply be plugged with rust and crud. I have also seen jet pumps burn out seals in the pump when the pump has been run without enough water. The water is used to keep the seals cool and once ran hot a few times they finally just let go and cause problems. With a leaking regulator it could very well have caused the pump to kick in and run hot burning out the seals especially if the water supply is low. Check your well screen first thing in the morning if you're affraid of the dark that is. :D :D :D
Brad.
Jeff is that a old enough system that it has a sand point on the casing
If it does the point may have plugged up and all you can do is to have it pulled and put back down good luck wells can be a dan g problem
Jeff,
This is my day job for almost 40 years now so maybe I can help. but I need to qualify a few of your statements. When you say it's a deep well system, that means it has 2 pipes going to the well, correct? When you say it loses prime, you do have to pour water in it to get it going again, correct? Well diameter? Is the top of well above ground?
It sounds like your pumping the water out faster than the well well can supply it, but that shouldn't just start.
sperry, I'm calling it a deep well pump because thats what the well guy called it when I had to buy the expensive pump. I only see one pipe going down the well. When I say its losing prime, when I put the plug on the pump, the pump is dry and when we fill the pump with water and replace the plug the water usually restarts. Mosttimes we have to pull the plug two or three or even four times, refilling before we get it going.
Jeff
I'm no expert, but it sounds like the foot valve (check valve) That would require pulling the pipe to replace.
NH
Pulling the pipe is beyond me. I dont know what is down there for sure, but I paid for 80 foot of drop pipe last time and its all steel. This is an old two inch well. Not even legal to put in here any longer.
Sounds like ya might have to pry open the wallet. I hope not though. Too many piggy roasts might be bearing down on the well. ???
Were goign to the bank Tomorrow. Didnt want to but hopefully they remember how much they have made off of me the last quarter century. I dont have a job and Tammy's job is very new and banks not being real personal any more its hard to say what they will say. We were hoping to be able to afford a well earlier in the year but it looks like we'll have to take out a short term loan. I HATE THAT. >:( I wrote an email to a near neighbor that does wells that was going to do mine when I called him. He wrote me right back.
Jeff,
Its not too late... Its actually never too late. It sounds like your
current well may be on its last leg (there is likely a hole in the
casing that the pump tries to keep filling with water). It would help
tremendously if you would pull a permit from the health department (and
request they actually come out to your house to make sure you are far
enough away from all septics).... Make sure to tell them that you are
having fits and your friendly well driller told you your existing well
is nearly dead...
Let us know when you are ready and we will get here as soon as possible.
Also, Jeff, you don't need anything to get started. We always square
up with you when we are done with the well...
Thanks!
Shane
On Nov 4, 2006, at 8:06 PM, Jeff Brokaw wrote:
> Hi Shane, We are still in the market of a well, just been waiting for
> some money to come through that has been delayed on us. Our well has
> been quitting on us bad the last few days. I guess we will try to go
> in monday and get a short term loan to get this done. I dont know
> whats with this well. Keeps losing prime and now the pump wont shut
> off. Let me know what we need to get this started if its not to late
> for this year.
>
> Jeff
Yeah probably never too late in the season to drill. New neighbors drilled in December and struck an artesian. The water was spewing from it all winter long like a fountain. The lawn was a little icy by winters end though. ;)
Sounds like the best thing to do Jeff. I assume you'll be getting a 4 or 5" well. It will be much easier to service when the time comes.
It's never a good time to have to spend the money, but the price will be higher if you wait.
Here is the quote I got this spring. I was wondering how this compares to around the country?
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/well_quote.jpg)
Jeff, my neighbor just had a well drilled for his new house. I caught the driller there and talked to him for a few minutes. I asked him about a quote for the well I will have drilled when I start my house. Since it is close to the well he was drilling, he quoted me 3200 for the whole set up: 160 feet depth (the neighbors depth), deep well pump, pressure tank, etc. Ready to run when he finishes. He also said it was $9 a foot for deeper.
Stew
What size well?
Jeff, with what kind of people do you associate with to get the "hood discount"? :D :D :D Seriously what is it?
Jeff,
We had our well drilled 4 years ago. aproxx $1900, but drilling and casing is all they did. I did the pump/wiring/ plumbing myself.
mh
Jeff, that is for a 4 inch well.
Stew
I have heard of you speak of the PVC for a well casing before.Differant around here.All that I am aware of is 8 inch by ¼ metal casing.This is what I have.We was very lucky with ours in the year 2000.They had to use casing the first 40 feet,than they hit ledge and drilled another 100 feet and hit 40 GPM.Came in at $3800.Everything done.This is on the low side.Most come in at $5-6000 is normal.
Well, I have a well permit. They said because we were out of water and they know us and the driller that they would not have to do an on-site inspection and that as soon as we could arrange the work to be done they could start.
Quote from: Dana on November 06, 2006, 05:53:01 AM
Jeff, with what kind of people do you associate with to get the "hood discount"? :D :D :D Seriously what is it?
If I told ya, I'd have ta have ya hit. :-X ;)
Actually, our area of Harrison is well known due to the fact that there was a whole group of us from our early twenties to the recent past, used to party quite heavily. Be it at town functions or in the Neighbor
hood. Were talking probably 20 or 30 couples and most of us (them) were affiliated with the school. Either teachers, coaches, administration, bus drivers, maintenance, were all grouped over here in what has become known as "The Hood". Many of my fellow hoodings also own business's and try to help other hood members. Hence, the Hood Discount. :) My partying days ended about ten years ago when I had two instances that scared me straight. One was an alcohol poisoning from drinking a fifth of Mc Masters whiskey in an hour and the other was coughing my fool head off at my Sisters house, So bad I sat back and blacked out in a chair and they said my lips and finger nails turned blue. That was the last cigarette I smoked and the last that I drank myself to a point beyond consciousness. :)
Will it be "Eating myself to a point beyond consciousness" next... ??? ??? :D :D :D :D
I'd say something but my mouth is full.
Jeff
We charge $14 ft. for 5" pvc; stainless steel screen $350; gout $350. A standard 1/2 hp submersible pump system is $1850. If we go to a 20 gpm system, we always use the constant pressure system. New technology in our field. The pump is converted to 3 phase some the hertz can be changed to make the motor run at variable speeds. I haven't quite figured this yet but you can hook this pump up to single phase 240 volt and use it w/ a pressure switch like any other pump, or and the little control panel and it runs variable speed. Really slick. We charge $2800 to 3000 for this system.
If you know someone with a blasting rig you could get a hole drilled for a few cases of barley pop. A hole big enough for 4 inch casing and a 300 dollar grundfos submersible pump and your in biusness.
Our home well on the farm is only 32 feet deep and it supplies 3 houses and 100 head of cattle. Never went dry....knock on wood
Jason
Jeff we put our well in 10 years ago and it was 3600 total that was 200 ft cased 80 with 1 h pump I talk with the pump installer 6 month ago about the price now and he said it would be over 400 more were are thing about putting another well in just for the barns so i don't have water run 1000 ft to them
Jeff,
The prices you are being quoted for a submersible pump seem to be on the high side. Grainger has 1/2 hp 10 gallon per minute submersible pumps with Franklin motors for under $300. The controller is about $50.
I would think that you should be able to get a pump installed of this size for about a $1000. I don't know what it would cost to get a well drilled. Out here it is in the range of $25 a ft for a 6 inch hole.
What most of you don't know is just how much a new well costs in MI.
My quotes for my Grandma's well are much higher then Jeff's.
What we ran into was a little bit of dirt the size of a nailhead clogged the foot valve. The pump would run and never have enough pressure. I think I'de look at that first before drilling a new well. The year that happened to us mother thought we'de never get it straightened out before winter. The same thing just happened this week to my uncle, a small piece of rust clogged it. It doesn't take much either. Just thought it would be worth checking before some one drumming up business runs you through the meat grinder.
It's possible the water line has a leek in it also.
Well, its new well day. 8)
We limped through the winter, and limped through frost laws waiting for the weight restrictions to lift so the well rig could get in here.
No more heavy trickle showers! 8)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/tammy_well.jpg)
8) 8) 8) 8) 8) 8)
I wouldn't blame you if you spent the day on the porch, watching that well rig. It's a fascinatin' rythm. ;D
and then spent the evening taking a looooong hot shower, just groovin' on water pressure :)
We will have a new well by the end of the day, but it wont be connected to the house until next week. :-\ They have to come back and dig up the water line and electrical.
This rig isn't as cool to watch. Its a rotary and just kinda turns. It drills an 8 inch hole. They are at 105 feet right now and into the water sand. All the other wells around here are at 110 to 115 ft. They are eating lunch so progress has slowed a bit. :)
And it won't be far to put water in Tom's cabin. ;D
Not far at all. :)
We got water! The well man says its a heck of a well. Its right at 108 foot and he can pump it at 100 gallon a minute. Says we will never out run our water. Harrison area is sitting on top of some tremendous aquifers.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/water_well.jpg)
Quote from: Jeff B on April 18, 2007, 01:28:47 PM
Harrison area is sitting on top of some tremendous aquifers.
I know it is, why ya think Nestle is pumping from Evart ???
I can remember years ago waking up to this bad vibe and pounding.
They showed up and got started on my parents well before I got up.
Man that'll drive ya nuts!
Ya can pick up the vibe from a good 1/4 mile away or better.
Well.......as my mom would say, 'It's about time you was up anyway'. I don't remember sleeping in that late, even as a kid. ::)
Just thought of something..........
What are the odds it'll be next Thursday before they get the new well hooked up ???
Guess Jeff will have to wait even longer for his "good shower". ;D
No Doubt. :D
Most motels is better then what we had so I'm good.
Should be easy to fill the log rolling pond out back this spring though eh?
If most motels are better then what you've got, you should a be a shriveled up old dude from lack of water. ;D
My pond's filling right now.
Covers will be off both of them within a week. :)
About 50F today and suppose to be near 70 F by Sunday. That'll take most of this wet sloppy slush away. It don't even feel like there is frost in the ground under my feet when walking on bare patches of ground and it ain't goohey. Marked about 43 acres out the last two days, for thinning. I'm on a 240 acre farm right now. Another 35 - 45 acres to go on this farm hopefully. 8) 8) Hoot hoot!
Oh, good luck with the water well. You don't know how precious it is until you miss it a few days. ;)
Jeff,
How lucky you are to get water at 108 ft. My well is near 600 ft. with the pump at 400ft. Had to pull the pump about a month ago. I think I used the same company that Bibbyman does.
Ron
My well didn't hit until 787' feet. Do I win something? We are surrounded by saltwater and we went 500' below sea level. go figure. Joe
That saved you some money at only 108'.And 100 gallons a minute,start selling water.That is great and than some.No more water problems for you.That will keep the pool full or is that the log pond?
Furby thinks its the log rolling pond. :D
Get this.........
Da dog can play in da pool....... da Furby can't. :-\
This reminds me of a story I read somewhere(maybe on the Forum) about a group of women discussing which kitchen convienience they would miss the most if it was removed.
One said the fridge one said the dishwasher, another the stove but when asked, the grandmother said she would miss the running water the most. It's amazing what we take for granted until something happens to it. Imagine the woods toys we would have if we didn't have to spend so much money on the house and vehicles!! :)
Its not the Furby, its da logs. NO ONE LIKES LOGS IN DA POOL! :D
treetech, Yep, if it were not for the well, I could have bought me a new ATV. :-\
Quote from: Furby on April 18, 2007, 09:49:58 PM
Get this.........
Da dog can play in da pool....... da Furby can't. :-\
Yes. I remember that edict coming out in a post a long time ago. I think it was about the first piggy roast. The boss said 'No Furby's in da pool!'
:D :D :o :D
Yeah Boss, don't make me pull those posts up!
The rule was NO FURBIES IN DA POOL!
Nothing to do with logs at dat time, something bout furballs though.
To get the facts straight, I'm the one that asked about the Log Rolling ::)
Your success with 100 gpm reminds me of a furnace customer I had several years ago. It seems he was getting an in ground pool installed and as the workers left for lunch he asked them if it was ok for him to fill the pool yet. They said he could but that it was going to take a long time to fill it because the pool held over 30,000 gal and they chuckled as they left. They went to town, had lunch and picked up something they were missing for the job. When they returned the pool was over 3/4 full and filling fast. It seems the guy had a well that was only 20 feet deep and he was on an underground river. He had an irrigation pump with something over 300 gpm hooked up and filling the pool. He claimed the water was good, soft and tested real good. The pool guys were impressed to say the least.
As I suspected and correctly recalled, the no Furbys in da pool rule is a direct result of wanting to ROLL LOGS IN DA POOL!
https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?topic=3962.msg93915#msg93915
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Re: Planning a forum get together for summer of 20
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Pregunta, Gonna be any logs in that pool Roll Eyes Grin Uhhhhhhhh, knowin Kevin, I probably shouldn't have axed that. Roll Eyes
Well, (Ha, Well!) Well, our water quit completely tonight. Cant get it going again. The new well is in but not hooked into the house yet. Tammy came in to call the well guy and he answered the phone and laughed and said did you check your email? So we checked our email and there was a note from him saying they would be here in the morning to tie the new well in. I guess we can get along until morning. Thank goodness the thing held out this long. :)
All's well that ends well.
Man thats deep.
Well, you must be thinking there is something funny going on in your house. First you dream about how to fix the picture thingy and it works, then your old well turns off when an email arrives and you don't even see the email. How did you do it? ???
We got water! Here Jeremy is testing the line and shutoff valve he requested be put in so he can put a sprinkler system in for his Mom. Looks like plenty of pressure there eh? :D
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/water.jpg)
Looks like a good stream ta me.
Dat da mill shed back der in white?
Ya all packed?
Either u have a crack in one of the lines, trash in foot valve holding it open or a loose clamp.
Or... I put a new well in. 13 years ago by the looks of the topic date. :)
@Jeff (https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=1) I got a chuckle this morning when one of the topics dug up in "suggested topics" was one on "IP ban testing". [That might be how this thread got pulled to the top.] Anyhow, the point of it relates/pertains to the recent topic on DNA testing. The old 2001 "IP ban testing" topic came up. I was thinking, for about 10 seconds, that you need a button where you can get a rap sheet from all the bad actors over the years based on IP address that is linked to DNA test. :D :D
Don't be surprised if all these DNA tests don't morph into something in 10 years, that you then wish you hadn't done one. :D
It's early, and sometimes the little things get a chuckle out of me. ;)