Many thanks to the FF and especially to J P Green for encouraging me to tackle this project.
The old Briggs on my WM LT40 had gotten TIRED. At over 6000 hrs it was time for a replacement.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/14000/meter.jpg)
I lucked up and came across this at a good price. It's new, liquid cooled kawasaki 22-27 hp, a take-off from a cub cadet tractor. Dealer swapped it out for a diesel.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/14000/dryrun2%7E0.jpg)
Just un-hook everything and lift off the old Briggs
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/14000/old_off.jpg)
Use a template to mark the new bolt holes.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/14000/template.jpg)
Set the new motor in place and bolt it down
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/14000/newmotor1.jpg)
An external electric fuel pump is required. Mounted it on the rail behind the water tank.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/14000/pump.jpg)
There's a bit of wiring to sort out, but I have the diagrams from the donor tractor, that helped.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/14000/wires.jpg)
I had to do SOMETHING original, since J P Green had already figured out most of the conversion. Note the fancy chrome exhaust stack...
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/14000/stack.jpg)
Here's a shot of the first log cut with the kawasaki
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/14000/firstcut%7E0.jpg)
This was almost a bolt-on conversion. I did replace the 3 inch drive pulley with a 3 1/2 to up the blade speed about 10%. It's smooth, it's quiet, and I'm tickled pink.
That motor has sawed some lumber. 8) Nice pictures.Glad it worked out for you.
Nice job. That radiator rubber mounted ?? I'm fixin to get a 4cylinder Diesel car engine and need to mount the radiator so it doesn't vibrate.
Nice job! Those are great engine's; I think that you'll be pleased with it. Considering that it's water cooled, with a pressure lubrication system and an oil filter, you should get some great longevity from it.
Scott
Fla_Deadheader Yeah, the radiator is mounted on 4 big rubber gromets. This thing is so smooth, I don't think it would make much difference. Car diesel sounds interesting. Keep us updated. I briefly considered a little 3 cylinder diesel out of a cub cadet tractor. It's made by dihatsu, also sold as a briggs and stratton. Big problem with car diesels is weight. This kawasaki only weighs about 100 lbs .
Lots of luminumum diesels down here. ::) ::) Been considerin exportin them to the US for Bio Diesel conversions. :)
Great job 8) 8)
Love the chrome stack ;D
That chrome stack looks a lot like part of a p-trap from a kitchen sink.
The chrome stack doesn't just LOOK like a p-trap, that's what it is... You use what works, and the price was right..
Bravo Piney!!!! ... 8) 8) 8)
Glad that I was able to help. The Kawa is truly an awesome machine for the LT40 hands down. Torqey, quiet, and gets darn good fuel mileage. It's a quality machine from top to bottom.
One thing though... I want one of those exhaust pipes!..;D I haven't had the time to fabricate something, and have a beer can smashed and sitting on the gas tank where exhaust hits.. :D
Also like your pulley change idea, and I've been kicking that one around myself. It does need a little more top end blade speed. Lord knows the engine can handle it. Sounds like the extra 1/2" is the ticket.
I've milled bout 10,000 b.f. with mine, and it is a pleasure to own and be able to run such a machine. I'm glad I went gas cause I get sick to my stomach working around a diesel, even though I love em'. I think walking with the LT40 and diesel fumes would not suit well with me.
Kawa-Mizers ROCK!! .................. ;D :) 8) 8) 8) ;D 8) 8) 8) :) ;D
Another great little engine for on a mill would be a little 3 cyl gas engine out of a Geo, Sprint, or Firefly. They get awesome mileage in the cars so why not on a mill. Heck they only weigh 93 lbs dry weight. You would have to mount O2 sensors and such too but it wouldn't take much. ;D ;D
Brad.
J P I had the advantage of knowing ahead of time that the kawasaki would fit ;D
I did have a couple of small glitches, pin hole in a fuel line and a non-functional oil pressure switch. I didn't have the alternator to contend with, my mill was a manual. It now has home made hydraulics, but the power is 110 ac so the 20 amp in the kaw is adequate. I didn't have to cut down the top belt guard as you did, mine cleared the muffler by 1/8 inch.
I was sort of forced into the pulley change. The shaft on the briggs was 1 inch. The pulley that woodmizer used is a 2 piece unit that would be difficult to bore out to 1 1/8. SOOO, while I changing
, why not up the pulley size a bit.
I do have a parts manual with very good drawings, but the part numbers are cub cadet, probably not the same as kawasaki.
Just an update for anyone considering an engine swap... The top belt guard over the main drive belt is more than just a belt cover. It also serves as a guide for the belt when the belt is loosened to stop the blade. In my case (and JP Greens) the engine shaft sits about an inch lower than the original engine. This leave a 1 1/4 inch gap between the back of the belt and the cover. With that much clearance the belt flops and vibrates badly. I had to go back and lower the belt cover to correct the problem.
Otherwise, the swap to the water cooled kawasaki is just about ideal for the LT40.
Well you just taught me somethin' Piney.
I didn't know that belt guard does that. I never put mine on yet, and I went and cut the lower plate cover bout' and inch off of one end, and slid it over out of the way of the flap.
Oh well us hillbilly's will find a backwards way.. :D
J P if you haven't already done it, don't go cutting on the belt cover. there is an easier way.
If you wiggle it just right, the cover will go underneath the support it normally bolts to. Two pieces of pipe about an inch long for spacers and some longer bolts will lower the cover just about right. I'll get some pics tomorrow.
BTW hope you fix that exhaust stack. Don't take much to melt a plastic gas can, could ruin your day.
I got a beer can protector on the gas can.. :D
The guard mod sounds good. I haven't cut into it yet.. :)
Quote from: Fla._Deadheader on November 11, 2006, 09:55:12 PM
Lots of luminumum diesels down here. ::) ::) Been considerin exportin them to the US for Bio Diesel conversions. :)
Relating to this I have been searching casually for some small diesel engines. I make my own Bio-Diesel from Waste Veggie Oil. Do you have any more info on these engines? Info on the logistics of importing? I would love to further the discussions. Heck I'd love to convert one of my Honda cars over to an aluminum block 4 cyl diesel. Give me a PM if that is what you prefer.
MMMMMMMMM small diesels... one on my mill would be fantastic also. probably not worth the cost, however the novelty of it all, sawing on biodiesel.... I could sell it for 10X its real value here in granolaville (ithaca, ny) tree huggers just lap that stuff up like a cat on a bowl of milk.
It's difficult for me to get information here, due to my very limited Espanol. The biggest thing I find is, Governor operation. Some Diesels have better systems than others.
We found a whole stripped down pickup, being used to haul small logs for firewood. Think compact pickup. ::) Could buy the whole thing for $1000.00. Checked with a very knowledgable diesel mechanic, and he said not the best for sawmill engine.
Not sure if he understands that a 24HP aircooled is sufficient for sawmilling ?? I'm figuring the harder wood will need more HP to keep the blade at near max capability ??
Gotta go talk to him myself and try to get more info.
There are many places here with used motors for sale. I can ship on a pallet for $1.00/lb.
Have to look into it more. Don't know about any kind of warranty, sooo ??????
The reason they make a bad engine for a mill is the governer... The IP is setup much different for automotive function than for industrial/ag operation where you want the engine to maintain constant RPMs under load and without load. With an IP that is setup for street operation it will pull down really easy and not automatically adjust it self back like we are used to on a tractor or our sawmills.
If you are going to import, do it word of mouth and don't advertise cause the EPA has put the brakes on many of these smaller diesel imports with the new regulations. Even Listers imports. But those dealers are figuring out a way around it.
I bought a Yamnar chinese knock off from a guy selling them on fleabay. Mainly for parts, as I have a real japanese one, but I needed electric start, and the jap parts are REAL expensive. THe chinese fit and finish was not near as nice as the Yanmar, but the parts are all the same. The timing is was way off right out of the box... ::)
What type of oil are you using for your WVO?..... :)
No oil right now. Just got the Jip converted to Diesel engine. Doing research on Palm Oil. It's a big crop down here. Cooking oil is mostly Soy, from the Store. Got a lead on a collection outfit in San Jose, that gets LOTS of used oil. I am wanting to go Straight Oil, not converted.
Harold, don't know how far you are from the coast, but the little diesel's from small fishing boats, etc., are usually pretty plentiful (read "cheap").
Two big advantages I see going this route would be they are about 30hp generally, so a good candidate, not so much over-kill, and because they are meant to be keel cooled, they have a wide tolerance for operating temperatures. Most diesels don't like to run too cool. They will run on just about anything short of Da Boss' diet colas. ::)
Murf, no where near either coast, and, these guys wear stuff completely out and then keep patching. I figure a wrecked vehicle would give a better chance of a decent mileage engine. Being as how they should be 30+ HP, I think it would be fine without a governor to just keep the blade speed up. The blade can only use so much power before being stressed, anyway.
There ARE some vehicle Diesels that have governors down here, for pulling hills and such, so I'm told. ::)
Harold, I hadn't thought of the "baling wire" syndrome, but completely understand it. ::)
Even the wimpiest 4 cyl. diesel in an import is more likely to be 60+ hp.
I was thinking more of the weight than anything else. A buddy of mine had me weld up a skid-mount for one he was making a genset out of. I know from the grunt in my Kubota that it was plenty weighty.
You can put a mechanical governor on any engine that uses a throttle, gas or diesel. If you can't find one, they're stooopid simple to make. The little spinning ball type is an afternoon project. Any wreckers down there with old farm equipment? An old farm machine will have one, especially a tractor.
I have a mechanical governor in Fl. Brand new. slightly used on the Porsche engine we started with. ;D ;D
Are we talking retrofit to an existing sawmill or building the entire mill?? Replacing a gas engine with a diesel would be a big can of worms. Big problem is weight. Even aluminum diesels are heavy. The head lift mechanism would have to be beefed up considerably, plus the motor mount. In my case I opted for the gas-burner kawasaki mainly because it weighs within a pound or 2 of the old briggs, and it physically fits nicely. (Getting it at a good price had a lot to do with my choice also)
Lack of a governor is not much of a problem. Just about any older gas-burner tractor wil have an external, belt-driven governor. Easily adaptable to a diesel. Another option would be aftermarket cruise controls. Works off a magnet attached to any rotating part. The cheap ones use a vacuum actuator, there is no vacuum available on a diesel. Get one with an electric actuator.
Bio fuel might be a problem also. The injector nozzles on small diesels are tiny tiny. Doesn't take much to plug them up. There are all manner of stories about people running left-over un-refined cooking oil in diesel engines. The ones that doing it successfully are almost always running large truck and tractor engines. Pumps and injectors not near so picky as the small engines.
None of these problems are insumountable, sounds like a real interesting project. Please keep us informed ..
I've been fooling around with WVO (waste vegetable oil) and diesels, and the thing is if you run pure WVO you have to start on diesel fuel, switch over to WARM fluid oil, then switch back to diesel on shut down to clean your injectors. You guys prolly already know this.
The thing i've found is most peopled don't know when they fool around with this stuff is the WVO has to be completely de-watered. No water whatsoever should be in that oil, as that tears up injection pumps in the long run.
Another thing that is detrimental to running WVO is hyrdogenated oils. This stuff is nasty beyond belief. It leaves a hard- varnish like gum (term called "waxing") on steel, lines, tanks, and components. This is one reason I have abandoned running WVO as every restaurant in the county uses this crap. It is also a major cause of American's heart disease IMO, and should be avoided in foods at all costs, but it is everywhere.. ::)
Pure oils like soy and peanut and canola, etc., are clear, don't turn white and hard, and burn beautifully in a diesel.
I've seen serious damage done to some expensive rigs using hyrdogenated oils, that have not been properly de-watered.. ;)
YUP smiley_heh_heh smiley_smug01 smiley_smug01
With all the hassles (read: down time) in doing the swap, I almost think it would be easier to use the big honkin' (relatively speaking) diesel to power a genset, which just might real handy to have anyways, and then replace the gas-burner with an electric motor.
Big 407 or 575 volt 3 phase motors can usually be had pretty cheap, and generator heads meant to run off a farm tractor PTO are the same, pretty plentiful and not too spendy. ::)
I did consider going electric, especially since there is a 3 phase power line across one end of my sawshed. When I added up all the extra stuff I would need besides the motor(new electric service, meter base, breaker box, breakers, motor starter, electrical cable, etc), it was just as cheap to use the kawasaki. Down time??? I was sawing the next day, it really is a very easy swap.