Hey. I am about to build a small animal barn and a workshop. Both will be pole type construction. I wrote a few months back asking for opinions about using some of the hardwoods off my place for the poles, but was kind of scared off from that idea. So, now I am gonna buy pressure treated 5 x 5 for the poles. Since then, I've had a buddy offer me the unlimited use of his portable saw mill. Now I'm thinking about using some of my hard woods for framing components. I have post oak, pin oak, white oak, and blackjack available. Could you advise me on which is the best, how to use (dry or green), how to fasten, best dimension for purlins (24" o.c. roof trusses and 8' o.c. poles) for optimum structural integrity, etc. I would also like to know what to expect in the way of movement as it dries. I am originally from S. Mississippi, and I know the properties of syp but I am new to the idea of using hardwood for anything other than cabinets and trim and flooring. I'll welcome any advice that ya'll think would be helpful. Thanks.
I'll leave the answer for the experts, but I must say you picked a good name for yourself if you're gonna be framing with oak. ;) :D
Welcome to the Forum! :) :)
I have timberframed several buildings from oak and have built many barns and houses from green oak.
Post and white oak are good for places where they are going to get lots of weather. They make good post and beams if "boxed heart". The other oaks will make good rafters and siding if you have a good overhang and keep them from ground contact.
A 2x4 oak will hold what a 2x6 pine will. I have spanned 16 ft with 2x6 oak rafters with 3 ft spacing and 5/4 x 4 latts.
My first saw shed for my mill was from white oak that I sawed in the morning and put up in the afternoon. That was over 7 years ago and it just survived the big ice storm.
I use galvanized nails that have a slight twist in the shank or ringed pole barn nails.
Most buildings here more then 40 years old were made from green or air dried oak.
I sawed an order for an octagon shaped barn, 80' in diameter. The customer wanted all Oak for the barn. He drilled for every nail and lag screw he used.
My grandad built his barn over 40 years ago. He used creosote-treated poles and red oak for the rest of the framing. He nailed it all green and didn't have to predrill the holes. If you wait til it dries, you'll definitely have to pre-drill. Some of the boards twisted and warped a little as they dried, but the barns is still standing strong. As a matter of fact, we just sawed some more lumber in December for him to add on to it.
Best way to use oak is put the nails in it when it comes off the mill. :D :D
Some people even put them in before the tree is cut down. I'm not a fan of this method.
on post for ground contact saw the end of the oak post so you can laminate cca 2x6's on to sides (be sure to stagger joints by at least 18")& in center add a 2 &1/2" x 6" x 3' cca toung butted aganist oak toung & nail together with tempered ringshank polebarn nails
this adds 3' to your post length & only puts cca in ground but lets you use oak 6x6 post for the rest of the height
i will try to get a picture of this in a few days
Use a power nailer and you will not have any problem with green or dry wood.
Quote from: DanG on February 02, 2009, 11:48:25 AM
I'll leave the answer for the experts, but I must say you picked a good name for yourself if you're gonna be framing with oak. ;) :D
Welcome to the Forum! :) :)
When I saw the title of the post and the name of the poster I thought the same thing :D :D :D
ok pic didnt work dont understand but i got them in gallery so look there for cca splicing to oak post
Just one more little step...
In your post, place the cursor where you want the pic, go to your gallery and click the pic you want, then roll down the page a bit and click "paste this pic in post" or something to that effect. The pic will be in the post. In the blue box, data will show up. In the preview box the pic will show up.
ok i tryed again, i dont see what your talking about the pic is in gallery though
Here is your splice, looks good. I saw one simular, it was like a staircase on one side using cca 2x6's. A short, a medium length and the last was the longest length.
What about that short scab piece on the bottem, does it stay or is it there just to hold things together for a while?
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/16545/2160/cca_section.jpg)
just extra support
I've thought a lot about nailing green myself and have high hopes for nailbender's project. I've learned over the weekend that he has stumbled onto some fresh sawn 2X4 and 2X6 cottonwood that he couldn't refuse.
Since he won't be online this weekend, I'm asking in his behalf how to consider cottonwood as the building materal for framing instead of white oak. It is now stickered in a stack and it will be another month before he can start building. The concern is about warping and twisting as it dries out.
I am not familar with cottonwood from Kansas, but here in the southeast we can buy a little time, especially this time of year by spraying the stack with a water hose and keeping it moderately wet.
How does cottonwood do for framing and what can be expected in the next month? Thanks in advance.
Our Cottonwood out here is the weakest wood around other than Western Red Cedar and is considered unsuitable for load bearing applications. Snow load, wind load, seismic and dead load need to be considered in any design for a structure along with building code requirements. You should check with your local building official for requirements that need to be incorporated into the design.
Woodbowl, I've read about others on here who have used Populus spp. (which includes true poplars and cottonwoods) for framing buildings. You just need to scale up the size of the boards a bit. Maybe 2x6s for studs instead of 2x4s. Hopefully someone who has actually used cottonwood will chime in here with their advice.
Like it has been said , if you can live with twist and cups go for it . I have sawn many barns /shops/garages/sheds from poplar some of it stays straight ... some twist so bad you can make a drill with it . ;D ::)