As if there aren't enough projects around here that need attention, I drug this fruit press home yesterday. The plate in the middle reads "Cinncinatti B.S. Co. No. 2."
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/12750/pressopt2.jpg)
It appears to be complete with no cracks in the iron. The woodwork is another thing. A whole new stand needes to be built.
In the little bit of research I did online, it seems the apples will need to be ground up prior to pressing? After pricing these cast iron grinders :o, I believe a nice wooden one can be made in the shop just fine. ;)
Anyone with experience using these, please offer your advice on anything from stand design and features to recipes for apple cider and sauce. The new stand will have more triagulation than the old one for sure. Incorporating some wheels would be nice, too.
My hopes are to have this thing fully functional for our cub scout district camp out at the end of October. :D
fresh apple cider is the best stuff going!
I found a press a few years ago, my mother commandeered it, and it is at my parents place. the plan is to make apple cider in October again.
I made a grinder that pretty much turns the apples into pulp out of a wooden drum and a bunch of screws in it. it doesn't feed the apples on it's own, I use a board to push the apples into the grinder. I use a drill to power the grinder.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7CvuQh2k_SE
here's a video of the press in action:
take it from me, do it outside, unless you want a thumpin from your wife :)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rD6cH3L4Ra4
I made an apple grinder similar to that but used 2 rollers rotating to each other so it would pull the apples in. It works great. I will try to get pictures as soon as I can ( recovering from surgery and can't lift anything yet).
did you have a gear drive between the two rollers?
Yes. If I can get some help tomorrow I will try to get pictures.
Thanks, Guys.
The two roller idea sounds good. That will give another kid something to do. :)
The layout of this grinder and press looks efficient...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LwOuwiMGh0A
In your experience, how many apples does it take to make a gallon of cider? How far into the year are apples on a tree? Should I start to scrounge around for apples now or will a month off the tree be too long? What can be done with wheelbarrows full of squished apple guts? :D I thought handing out cups of "apple sauce" would be a good way to move some of the product. But would squeezing out so much juice leave me with a "dry" sauce?
Boy that's alot of questions. ::) I'm pretty much just brainstorming through the process.
My friend Don is getting ready for his annual squeezing on the 17th. His press takes about a bushel to fill, and I think you get about 2 gallons of cider. You grind the apples whole, so you aren't going to be making any apple sauce. I hope. :D
the pulp can be composted, or it could also be dumped out for deer, but I don't know if they'd eat it.
Also, it can be steeped in water for a second pressing, this is called "ciderkin". I've never tried this.
Here is a picture of what I hope to acheive with rebuilding the press.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/12750/presspicopt1.jpg)
Off to dig through the woodpile... 8) 8)
My dad bought a farm 50 years ago that had a small apple orchard. We made a lot of cider with a press that looked just like the one in metalspinner's picture. I have no idea what happened to that press. My brothers made some pear cider one year. That stuff started foaming after a couple days and and turned a pale green. It was still pretty good if you didn't drink too much. After several cups I didn't care how it tasted. ::)
I have an old press that needs rebuilding too. The frame looks like white oak but I'm not sure about the staves that hold the pulp. Anyone have any Ideas? That pear cider sounds good too. Stan
Does one pick out all the worms first or just put them in too? ::) ::) ::)
Without some worms cider just does't taste right. ;D
Dan , nice grinder, here is one like yours with a little extra pusher board on it .
http://woodgears.ca/cider/index.html (http://woodgears.ca/cider/index.html)
We use a 2x4 as a pusher.
First time o used it, I was using apples to push them in. Then it caught my finger. (that's why I'm wearing a glove in the video...).
A quick update...
The only dry beefy wood I have around here is this cherry. To make my decision even easier, it happened to be on top. ;)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/12750/applepressopt2.jpg)
As far as I got was the frame.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/12750/applepressopt3.jpg)
The tray will follow shortly then on to the apple grinder.
Still to do is sandblasting of the cast parts and a nice coat of paint. :) I still need to browse around the towns "junk" piles for a nice cast iron wheel.
I got a little work done today. After arguing with my dovetail jig for a couple of ours, I finally got the tray and upper bracket made...
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/12750/applepressopt4.jpg)
This is dry fitted together.
With the heavy woodwork done, it's on to the grinding mechanism. :-\
My dad's cider press has enough room in between the outside of the grinder and the inner part that does the damage that it self feeds the apples. The only time there is a problem is if the apples bridge and won't fall into the grinder.
I bought one similar to the one metalspinner has shown and working on. I bought it from a fella for $1.00 which is what he wanted. I said why not just give it to me. He said "give me a dollar and you can't bring it back." :D :D :D I cleaned it up painted it and duplicated the print of date and patent. I gave it to my mother one Mother's Day to display plant's on. If I ever get a chance, I'll take pics. It did have two pulp buckets. A wooden hoper was extended from the metal feed for the grinder.
When last we left him...
...the grinding head needed to be made.
Here, I routed a groove down the length of two pieces of maple and glued them together. Then I machined it down to a drum...
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/12750/applepressopt1.jpg)
Then, I layed out the spiral with tape...
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/12750/applepressopt2%7E0.jpg)
The holes have all been drilled and screwed with stainless bugle head screws. They are left proud of the surface to grind up the apples.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/12750/applepressopt3%7E0.jpg)
It's finally starting to look like something now! The hopper is in place, but not mounted, yet. What I thought would be the easiest thing to do - find a fly wheel - turned out to be quite difficult. I hit every antique store between here and there to find just what was on my mind.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/12750/applepressopt4%7E0.jpg)
And a view from the front...
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/12750/applepressopt5.jpg)
Still on the list is completing the bottom shelf and a tray for the juice to ride down. I might have time to make nice new basket, too.
QuoteMy dad's cider press has enough room in between the outside of the grinder and the inner part that does the damage that it self feeds the apples
ohsoloco,
What do you you think that gap is? I have some adjustability in the setup of the grinder and am wondering where to place it for good.
That's coming along quite nicely. As to the apples, it depends on variety. They pick apples into October up here. Some varieties are dropping from the trees in August, such as yellow transparent and New Brunswicker, which are quite juicy. Gravastene and Dudly are later and also lots of juice. Of course those names may not mean a lot down that way. Certain varieties flourish better in some areas/climates than another.
This is a great restoration project. Enjoying it. :)
That's gonna be a beautiful piece when you finish.
Holy smokes I've been swamped. The first run of apples through the machine were done at the big event this weekend. I had my fingers crossed that it would all some how come together. With a couple of quick alterations and tweaks (Duct tape is an incredible invention), we were finaly making cider!
I will follow up with some pics in a little bit, but here is a video of the operation...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NE3JtYX9Ig0
That is awesome :o :o :o
That's gonna be one nice squisher.
Good work ;D
I think we should Nominate Chris as Father of the Year!
I second that nomination. 8)
That press is a work of art. Be carefull not to overstress the power plant. Looks a little undersized ;D
that powerplant looks to be the high energy type :-)
:D :D
We had a couple of higher power deisel units come through to really get things moving. :D
QuoteI think we should Nominate Chris as Father of the Year
I think Largest Child of the Year would be more appropriate. :)
A couple of more clips of some details...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hcw1nwq0Pxk
Here is the ratcheting handle made by putting a bicycle freewheel in line on the handle.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D0gUAQr3neQ
You are the genius, Chris. 8)
Don
Looks like you were busy having fun while I was in Colorado having fun. :)
Congratulations on a superb job of building that squisher. Those kids (and grownups also) won't forget being able to take the squisher on it's maiden voyage.
Here are a few pics I mentioned earlier for those of you that cannot watch the video clips...
The finished rig...
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/12750/applepressopt6.jpg)
A veiw down the hopper. The handle that pushes the apples onto the grinder is made of elm. Hopefully, this will help to resist it from splitting.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/12750/applepressopt7.jpg)
The last thing the apples see.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/12750/applepressopt8.jpg)
I just finished the spout today. It's brazed onto the stainless pan.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/12750/applepressopt9.jpg)
If that was mine, when not in use, I'd be proud to have it sitting in my living room.
That sure is a dandy piece of mechanization. I like those older style implements. Everyone around here has broken or thrown stuff away over the years. :-X :-\ If my great grand father were still alive..... ;) They had an acre of apples here that dad's uncle planted when he was young. And that was a long time ago because he lived to be over 100. ;D
I bet the youngsters had a great time. 8)
I eat bushels full of apples this time of year in apple sauce. I don't know if I could drink much cider, apple juice from the can always caused some serious burn and churn in the stomach.
Great job MS!
Quote from: Jeff on November 04, 2010, 05:22:44 PMIf that was mine, when not in use, I'd be proud to have it sitting in my living room.
I agree. You should see the craftsmanship that is already in his living room, and kitchen, and writing room, and...... :)
I have to confess that I was sneaking looks at the lumber piles in the background while the video was playing :).
This past weekend was our District Family Camp for our Cub Scouts. I had scouts cranking on that thing all day Saturday. We went through 10 bushels of apples. I don't know how much cider was cranked out because it was drank as fast as it was made. Well, at one point, we had 5 gallons of it sitting, but then another wave came through and away it went. :)
There are several large orchards about an hour from here near Gatlinburg. They sell smaller "cider" apples for $5 a bushel. 8) The mix that was recommended to me was half sweet and half sour apples. Winesap was the sour, but I cannot remember the sweet. The looks on people's face's when they tasted the cider was priceless. It went down sooo smooth. food6
Prior to finding the orchards, I combed the neighborhood for apple trees. I did find several with the owners more than willing to let us pick whatever we wanted. But I quickly found out that apple trees need careful attention to produce proper fruit. It was easily 2 to 1 bad to good apples on the trees that were not already over ripe. Not to mention the crick in my neck and shoulders from picking.
QuoteI'd be proud to have it sitting in my living room.
I'm considering sanding it up real nice and finishing it. But I need to make sure we are done with it for the year as the finish needs to cure really well prior to use.
The apple juice stained the maple drum a nice color. Maybe I've stumbled on the next big thing. An all natural, food safe stain. :D
QuoteI have to confess that I was sneaking looks at the lumber piles in the background while the video was playing .
WDH,
Let me know if you need a close up of anything. :D
Quote from: WDH on November 04, 2010, 06:56:36 PM
I have to confess that I was sneaking looks at the lumber piles in the background while the video was playing :).
Quote from: Magicman on November 04, 2010, 06:42:17 PM
Quote from: Jeff on November 04, 2010, 05:22:44 PMIf that was mine, when not in use, I'd be proud to have it sitting in my living room.
I agree. You should see the craftsmanship that is already in his living room, and kitchen, and writing room, and...... :)
First you have to bear in mind Chris lives in the burbs so that puts his lumber yard in perspective. He has lots of good stuff there!
No moss growing under his butt.
Nice work! 8)
I dug the cider press out a bit early this year and cleaned it up. I disassembled it and gave the parts a good sanding then finished them with a spar urethane. The only wooden parts of the press that cider will actually touch were left unfinished. That is the cutter head, inside of the shoot under the cutter, and the baskets.
I have made a couple of mods, too. Under the shoot is a nice funnel to direct the pulp into the basket. Also, I am working on a drive shaft that will connect to the cutterhead to make cranking a bit more efficient. Pics of that will be coming later in the week.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/12750/applesopt2.jpg)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/12750/applesopt3.jpg)
Today, we went to the orchard and picked up a few apples. ;D
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/12750/apllesopt1.jpg)
Next weekend we are having a halloween shin-dig and cider making will be part of the festivities. smiley_turkey_hide
Like to see you at it again with your squisher. 8)
Me too Donk, Chris you amaze me with your woodworking skills. :)
I like wooden mechanical contraptions. ;D Good grief the stuff that some of the relatives parked out in the elements to rot. ::)
Have you made a youtube of your processor in action?
Mother earth news has a similar device, a cider press, with plans. Your buckets look exactly the way they made theirs to. The press irons on yours are a lot beefier though. ;D
SD, I like the Mother earth news. Lots of fun stuff. Was this article in the latest issue?
Here are some pics of the latest mods of the press.
The drive train... If my math is correct, this gives the cranker a 2 1/2 times advantage.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/12750/ciderpressopt1.jpg)
The pretty cover.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/12750/ciderpressopt2.jpg)
Brad, here ya go... ;)
A video of all the action..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HEtM_TIoWS4
The stream of consciousness of 11 year old boys... :D
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CBE-a3kEdps
Looks like your spur gear set up will increase your RPM but you lose torque.
Austin
metalspinner, October '76 issue. I have seen others use the same article and make modifications. ;D
The little fellas are having a great time. :)
QuoteLooks like your spur gear set up will increase your RPM but you lose torque.
dablack,
Yes, the speed has been increased by 2.5x's. But you lost me on the torque. Maybe you can give me a quick lesson?
The extra speed really helped to get the flywheel moving and to keep the cutterhead moving as apple pressure was applied. One thing that needed to be understood by the kid applying the pressure was that he was actually a brake and very little effort was needed to push the apples on the cutter.
Is there a way to increase the speed and torque? Other than having a dad turn the crank. ;)
QuoteOctober '76 issue.
SD,
I was 5 in 1976. :D
It's online, and your old enough to read it now. :D
Force in x Distance in = Force out x Distance out. If you want to increase the force generated by your machine (this being the two gears in the photo) you will need to increase the force applied to the machine, or increase the distance the original force is applied to. If the big sprocket is 2.5 times the diameter of the little one, you will have 2.5 times the distance, but less force.
My favorite part is the cover 8).
That is Apple Squishing By Youth Committee :D.
Good for you, my favorite part was watching the good time those kids were having while learning/doing something very worthwhile. You made a lasting memory for them, I know because I was half their age when I helped relatives do the same thing and still remember the taste of the fresh cider, you earned a big pat on the back and I hope you're VERY proud!
David beat me to it. Torque is in the units of Foot-Lbs. So that means Distance x Force. For easy numbers lets say the handle on the crank is 2' long and your are pushing with 3 lbs of force. That means you are producing 6 ft-lbs of torque. That torque is being transmitted via shaft to your large sprocket (spur gear). For easy math we will say that your big spur gear is 8" across. So from that shaft to the edge of the gear is 4" (1/3'). So with 6 ft-lbs going to a chain 1/3' away, we are getting 18 lbs of force in the chain ( 6 ft-lbs divided by 1/3 ft....see the ft are on top and bottom so they cancel out, leaving us with lbs aka force). Now we are going to your little spur via the chain. For easy math lets say it is 4" across, so that would mean we have 18 lbs of force (in the chain) 2" away from your second shaft. 18 lbs x 1/6 ft = 3 ft-lbs. So, you produced 6ft-lbs with your work. Since the handle is farther away from the shaft than the big spur, we multiplied your force. You pushed with 3 lbs, but we got 18 lbs in the chain (but it is still 6 ft-lbs in that first shaft). Then we got 3 ft-lbs there. So, with an input of 6ft-lbs, we got 3 ft-lbs out. That makes sense in this example because your big gear is twice the size of your little gear. Also, in this example, if we turned the input crank at 30 rev/min (one turn every two seconds), we would get a output rpm of 60 rev/min. So, like I said, you gained RPM but lost torque........I design huge multi stage gear boxes for a living...plus, I love physics. Sounds like from what you have said, you have plenty of torque. Nice job.
Austin
Surprisingly, I may have followed that! (After reading it several times. ;)) Thanks for following up. :)
If I wanted to continue developing this drive system should I look for ways to enlarge the arcs of the handle and/or the sprockets? If I increase the diameter of the little sprocket, I will not lose so much torque from the drive sprocket, but I will sacrifice speed? If my assumption is wrong please correct me.
An important rule in making cider is the finer the crushed pulp, the more juice can be extracted. The cell walls needs to be crushed to allow the juice to escape. To me that means speed at the cutter head.
If I increased the handle length in your example to 3' long, then I will start the formula with 9ft-lbs of torque. Should this keep my RPM the same at the cutterhead , but transfer more torque?
ugh. ::)
Everything you said is correct.
The real question is, what do you need to rip those apples apart. From watching the videos, it doesn't look like the grinder slowed down much when the apples were pressed into the machine. Seeing that makes me think that your torque is fine. That big flywheel really helps maintain both RPM and Torque.
So, if you think you have a problem, do you think you need to speed through the problem or power through the problem? Would more speed help or would more power help. You can't have both.
Remember, if you increase the length of the hand crank, you are having to put in 3lbs of force over a longer distance. The circumference of a 4' circle (2' crank) is much smaller than the circumference of a 6' circle (3' crank).
So, back to the main question. What makes the machine work better, when you turn the handle faster or put more force into the handle?
QuoteWould more speed help or would more power help. You can't have both.
I think the speed is most important. ;)
The boys on top need to limit their excitement when pressing down on the apples. That will solve the slowing down issue.
I toyed with the idea of putting a full bicycle gear changing apparatus on the thing. Would this have been able to give me the flexibity to increase the speed and keep up the torque?
I'm thinking next years adaptations just might be the electrical kind, anyway. :D
No, the bike parts won't increase torque with RPM. There is always a trade off. It is just like your car. With a manual tranmission, you start off in 1st gear to get moving. That gear has the most gear multiplication (torque multiplication) and it helps get the car moving. The bad part of first gear is your engine has to use lots of RPM to get few RPM from your tires. See, in first gear you got torque but lost RPMs. 2nd gear gives up some torque multiplication for a little more RPM and if you drive a classic (or an 80s truck) it tops out with 4th gear (which is usually 1:1). That means, the engine and driveshaft are turning the same RPM. Their is neither torque mutlipication nor an RPM loss. In newer cars you have overdrive. Basically there, you give up more torque for an increase in RPM after the transmission. The driveshaft is turning faster than the engine.
Knowing this, you understand why you don't take off in 5th gear from a stand still.
Now, if RPMs are the most important thing, I would either make your big gear bigger or your little gear smaller (or both).
Crystal clear!
Thanks, dablack :)
make the pulverizer with sawblades spaced about 1/16" apart and spin that with adrill or electric motor . Now you will be getting maximum juice.
Excellent thread. MetalSpinner you are a parenting role model. God bless you sir. Im gonna plant fruit trees and pray i meet grandkids who will wanna pick em.
I have heard of people using a newly purchased garbage disposal to grind apples.