If you have a Remington Model 700, then this will be of major interest to you.
http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=548107&highlight=Remington+700
That is a possibility on any sear triggered firearm.
I have seen all brands do it when the trigger was adjusted wrong. Most times because someone incompetent worked on the weapon.
Calling it a safety is a misnomer, all it does is block the sear.
Bottom line is make sure the weapon is pointed in a safe direction before taking it off locked.
On the older model Remington 700's, the action couldn't be opened with the safety on! In the safe position.
On the newer model Remington 700's, the action can be operated with the safety on! In the safe position.
Well, maybe as many as 10 (and possibly more) years ago Remington announced a "Safety Recall" on all of the Early Model 700's and Remington would fix them so the action could be oppened "on safe"!
Most importantly, as pointed out by Reddog, pay attention as to where your rifle is pointed.
my 700 VLS .204 hasnt had trigger problems so far, but i have heard more than once of the 700s having trigger problems. i think there was a segment on the news about it.
My 7 mm mag in the 700 edition has never given me any problems...I will pass it on to one of my sons and he to his...it will out live us all.....I am proud I bought it and proud to own it...Tim
There was a recent special by MSNBC called Remington Under Fire that was very interesting to watch. Regardless of the media bias, they did have some retired Remington engineers that had some statements you Remington owners should definately hear.
I suspect that if the average gun owner could actually see and understand the sear engagement on a weapon, he would have a completely different appreciation for the warning---"keep the gun pointed in a SAFE DIRECTION at all times". There's precious little metal engaged to keep the firing pin from falling. Two things that, in a gun of this type, DO NOT EXIST!---a safety, and an unloaded gun! ALL guns are loaded!!!---at least that's what I've tried to teach my kids. I made my living working on stuff that was wearing out, worn out, or broke, and I believe anything mechanical can break or fail, including the sear engagement on a firearm---Remington, Ruger, Winchester or whatever. We cannot be too careful, I know from experience.
I personally like the 700's, but in the same breath have to admit to seeing this happen twice with 2 different guns which were owned by 2 different people. Both take very good care of their guns so it does bother me more than just a little, as stated before always know where that barrel is pointing before flicking the safey off, it does happen.
Only time the safety if off is when it's aimed at what I'm shooting at.
First high powered rifle I owned was a left hand Remington 700BDL in 30-06. Two things on my wish list for it is a moose and an elk hunt. Don't care if I get one just want to take it hunting for them.
Quote from: pappy19 on December 19, 2010, 10:42:54 PM
they did have some retired Remington engineers that had some statements you Remington owners should definately hear.
::) ::) Just like listening to retired auto engineers :-X
I have two friends who come here from oregon to hunt bear with me, Ted and Wes, a father and son. They are some of the most experienced hunters, and former guides, you could find. Ted is 70 and still takes hard hikes after hounds with the best of us, only he is a little slower than before.
About 7 or 8 years ago Wes had a .243 rem 700 go off and shoot Ted through the side of the leg. Luckiest thing I ever saw,in that it never hit a bone, and the bullet slipped right through. He was in the truck with us again two days later, bandaged and very sore. Wes swore he didn't know he touched the trigger and felt horrible guilt over it. As it turns out, on some of those bumping the bolt will set them off, and that's probably what happened to them.
So I would be careful if I was packing a 700. But there is more than that to remember, always watch where that gun is pointing. Also it can't go off if there is no bullet in the chamber. If all those things were paid mind to Ted would not have been shot.
In teaching hunter safety there are a couple or three rules we try to beat into young heads.
1) A safety is a mechanical device that can and will fail.
2) Never take a loaded firearm into a vehicle.
3) Always point muzzle in a safe direction, particularly when working the action.
3a) Rule 3 applies ALL times when handling a firearm.
Regardless of make model, etc.
Seems most of the anecdotes told here violate one or more of these rules.
With the amount of firearm experience he had , what the hell was he doing with a loaded rifle amoungst people... >:( ??? These are just the amo that some look for to take our guns ... Aint rocket science , keep the guns unchambered till you get to where you are hunting .. then keep the gun pointed away from anything ya dont want to hit, Sheesh , aint all that hard to do.
We were not in the vehicle. We were about 50 yards from a bear bayed on the ground, starting to sneak in. We had hiked at least a 1/2 mile, got close, Wes loaded his gun, and flicked on the safety. As brought out, the bolt couldn't be cycled with it on. BANG!! We were not aware of the problem some of these have until more recently, and it made more sense. Wes doesn't feel any better about it though, because the firearm was obviously pointed at Ted's leg briefly, but it was not a blatant carelessness, just normal hunting situation that almost everyone has had at times, whether you would admit it or not....
We let the bear go, needless to say, and I had to go find the dogs after we got Ted to a truck, and he was headed to the hospital.
I haven't had it happen to me, but my Dad had a round go off in his Sako 243 once as he was closing the bolt. We were target shooting in a club competition at the time, but because everyone was following the basic safety rules (with range officer to double check) the gun was pointing downrange in the general direction of the targets, so the slug hit the ground about 10 yards downrange.
But yeah, it was an eye opener to everyone there. Don't assume a gun wont go off just because you haven't touched the trigger.
Ian
Quote from: Ianab on December 20, 2010, 09:29:42 PM
Don't assume a gun wont go off just because you haven't touched the trigger.
I experienced such this fall with a Savage 12 guage automatic, Browning patent, while pheasant hunting.
I have a Remington 788 chambered in .243. Was in the cabinet for a while until last summer when we sighted in for the deer season. Had the gun on a shooting bench, closed the bolt, shouldered it and clicked the safety off and she fired without touching the trigger. So I cycled the action again empty and the same thing happened. Took it to our local gun shop. I don't know what they did but it seems to be ok now.
Not only does a person have to handle a firearm safely , but it has to be in proper working condition. And if on a gun a person is able to pull the trigger even with safety engaged and then gun fires when safety is disengaged, that is not a properly working firearm. On most bolt guns this is entirely a trigger issue , it has to be adjusted correctly. If your going to do it yourself make sure you know what you are doing :)
The remington 700s are generally considered to be a very good action, safe, accurate and dependable guns.
I have had a rifle go off as I was chambering a round one time. I try to always live by keep the gun pointed in a safe direction. The bullet shot into the ground without causing any harm except letting all of the deer know where I was hunting that evening.
I've got 8 Reminton 700 model rifles in different configuration like the BDL, Mountian rifle and so forth from back in the early 70's to the late 90's. Calibers from 243 to 300 winny mag. I've never had a lick of trouble with nary a one and have even adjusted the triggers my self following the rules on slam testing them before loading them with live ammo.I also have a model 7 which uses about the same trigger.
So if you have a 700 your afraid of then just send it my way, I'll take any free ones off ya'lls hands. Looking for another 243 so I can rebarrel it into a 22 Cheata, Also looking for a early light barrel 220 swift.
Many years ago NBC did ajoke of a test on the Jeep CJ model. That Jeep has morfed into very pouplar model called the Wrangler today.
Don't put much into those test the media does myself. The media has the belief that good news doesn't sell so only tell part of the story.
PM me for my address to ship those nasty 700 to me.
;D Al
I currently own 13 Model 700 Remingtons. Of the 22 I've had over the years, I've never had any mechanical issues.
I did a search of this topic before this post, thanks pappy19 for the initial post. I've not visited this set of threads very often over the years. However, I was just made aware of this problem today. I'll have had my rifle in 5.56 two years this Christmas and did not know about the recall until today.
By fluke, I was channel surfing and ran across on AT&T CNBCW which relayed a story on this recall. Seems there is plenty of documentation both outside and inside the company relating to the Walker trigger firing without a finger on the trigger. Sixty + years worth. This occurs when a the safety is switched off or the slide bolt is bumped. Obviously if a bullet is in the chamber the rifle will fire. There are a lot of dead and having been wounded to account for this fact. I found this: http://xmprecall.remington.com/#contact on their website. I entered my serial number which did return my rifle as being in the recall. I purchased this rifle approximately two weeks before Christmas two years ago in 2012. I register a lot of what I buy and sometimes on the internet. The recall notification identified my rifle as not being registered. I won't debate this though I did buy it new from a sporting goods box store. I will be sent box and labeling by Remington for shipping to a repair facility of their choosing. Without cost of shipping, return or repair to me. No telling how long this will take. I'll keep you informed as the story unfolds. I post this in hopes of preventing injury or death to folks I care about. Chris Burchfield
Yes, keep us posted on this safety issue with the 700.
Just to clarify, the current Remington recall concerns the X Mark Pro trigger only. This trigger has been produced since 2006 or so, and is NOT the old Walker trigger mechanism that is the subject of the TV show and all the criticism over the years. It was designed as a result of the problems with the Walker design. The reason for the XMP recall is stated as "excess bonding agent" which apparently can bind up the mechanism somehow. Yeah it's some kind of epoxy applied to lock the adjustment screws in place. Too much can probably seep into some place and bind things up. I've worked on maybe 2 dozen of these triggers and have never observed this, but it certainly could happen. Remington ' s remedy is to "specialty clean" the mechanism.... probably means to disassemble and if excess epoxy is found, to scrape, chisel, or otherwise remove it.
I just love these descriptions which infer that this is all beyond the scope of understanding of us mere mortals. Btw I've worked on probably hundreds of 700 ' s with the old Walker triggers over 40 years and have never seen one that malfunctioned IF kept properly adjusted and cleaned once in a while. If the insides get gummed up or if the owner or some Bubba Gunsmith decides he can adjust the trigger pull to 1/2 lb or so.... we'll that's where the problems happen.
I also have a Remington 700 which was subject to the XMP recall, I just checked the emails from Remington and they received my rifle May 20 and on June 6 I got the email that it had shipped back. It was a lil hassle though because we were on vacation when it came back and they had already returned it to Remington by the time we got home. I didn't have any luck trying to contact Remington but after a few weeks they sent it back again.
After an unexpected discharge when Elk hunting, with nothing hurt except my pride i put a Timney on my 300 WBY mag.
Pete, you made a good choice. Just about all the aftermarket triggers are safer than the Walker / Remington and can be safely adjusted to give a better trigger pull. I don't have figures at hand but it does seem that the 700 platform triggers are at least among the most popular and widely manufactured. And for good reason.
As to why Remington continued using their flawed design for so many decades, it seems beyond normal human understanding. Maybe it's because, in so many circumstances, you just can't seem to tell engineers anything..
Just as a point of interest I live a two hr drive from the Ilion plant.
in the old days the small repairs to their shotguns were free but no more, I dont know about rifles..
Plus I'm sure they will be history in NY in a couple of years thanks to our liberal progressive Governor
However my son has had a 700 30-06 for 30 yrs with no problems.
Killed quite a few Adirondack whitetails with it too.
I use my good old win pre 64 model 70 up there
Also killed a lot up there about 37 last count.
Quote from: petefrom bearswamp on October 13, 2014, 05:54:50 PM
Just as a point of interest I live a two hr drive from the Ilion plant.
in the old days the small repairs to their shotguns were free but no more, I dont know about rifles..
Plus I'm sure they will be history in NY in a couple of years thanks to our liberal progressive Governor
However my son has had a 700 30-06 for 30 yrs with no problems.
Killed quite a few Adirondack whitetails with it too.
I use my good old win pre 64 model 70 up there
Also killed a lot up there about 37 last count.
37 was that in one year :D :D :D :D :D
I sent mine out Sept. 21 just returned today Oct. 29 not a bad turn around, and not 12 weeks identified on their web site. Repair document in the return box identified Replace Fire Control with updated XMP Fire Control. I'm glad "My Baby is American Made."